Iran admits it shot down airliner by mistake

[midnight rambler]

https://apnews.com/21f4a92a2dfbc38581719664bdf6f38e

[midnight rambler]

At least they 'fessed up, something that Uncle would never do unless caught red-handed, and even then Uncle would usually still deny it (especially when operating in the interests of Israhell).

[Amanda]

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with this, but I found some comments over at zerohedge just now that I thought were interesting:


Money Circus -The Ukraine airline began flights to Iran shortly after the US takeover of Ukraine.
Wiki, Flight 752 :
"Between 06:14:20 and 06:14:45 the plane turned right 24º (from the take-off heading of 289º to 313º), according to flight data."
A sudden turn towards a sensitive site - air defense reacts instantly?
Boeing Uninterruptible Autopilot is a system designed to take control of a commercial aircraft away from the pilot or flight crew in the event of a hijacking.

Me - Interesting--anytime there's a crash, it always brings to mind how they have the power to take control of these planes.


boeingboy- total bullshit the flight path was entirely predictable throughout. They are still lying,

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jan/09/iran-plane-crash-visual-guide

(other posts from this boeing guy show him to be hasbara rat)



BigPunny- Except it doesn't explain the location of the crash, other than that it had turned around.

It's traveling West, gets to around 6k feet, contact is lost, yet the plane crashes EAST of where it had lost signal (the opposite direction).

I think Moneycircus may be onto something here.



Anon- The crash site doesn't make sense based on the flight path. It was heading to Kyiv, which is North, Northwest of Tehran. The plane took off at an airport on the outskirts of Tehran, flew several miles North, Northwest, then clearly begins to head towards a more Eastern heading, then crashes nearly halfway BACK the way it had just come, back towards Tehran.

This would explain why Iran initially assumed it was some mechanical issue because the plane was turning back around, heading in the opposite direction, but had ALREADY lost contact with everyone, yet crashed halfway back to the airport.

Very suspicious, and wouldn't surprise me in the least if Boeing re-routed that plane after shutting down its transponders.



BigPunny

Okay, all. Something isn't QUITE right here and most of what I'm about to say is speculation, but it's speculation based on some inaccuracies in what happened.

The plane left an airport on the outskirts of Tehran, bound for Kyiv, Ukraine. Kyiv is North, Northwest of Tehran. The initial flight path looks normal and heading almost directly towards Kyiv.

But when it "lost signal," it began tracking more easterly. It was pretty subtle, but that's also a big plane and would take a while for it to make a U-turn.

But if you look at the pictures of its previous flight path, then look at where it crashed, you can CLEARLY tell that the plane began traveling in the opposite direction, BACK to the airport from whence it came.

Quite literally, the plane crashed about halfway back towards Tehran.

Someone else had suggested that some entity took over the plane and began turning the plane around. Or, it's even possible the flight was hijacked. Its crash location does not match up with its intended flight path.


Rictavious-- You're in denial.

BigPunny- In denial of what exactly? Iran shot down a plane they thought was a military plane. Media reports from inside the US claimed the US had been flying B-52s into Iran, then a massive airplane begins to run off course, towards military outposts in Iran, and you think I'm in denial? Sorry, Rictavious, but none of what you just said makes any sense.

Jeff- you want to take over planes in flight with no possible intervention by those onboard, you need to talk to dov zakheim the israeli rabbi, rumsfeld's pentagon comptroller, in charge of finding the missing trillions (never found), who ran an israeli company that sold "anti-hijacking" devices to the 9-11 airlines/planes that didn't seem to prevent the 9-11 attacks (because they were the 9-11 attacks). https://duckduckgo.com/?q=zakheim+sold+anti+hijacking+devices+to+9-11+airplanes&t=osx&ia=videos

(https://duckduckgo.com/?q=zakheim+sold+anti+hijacking+devices+to+9-11+airplanes&t=osx&ia=videos)Greendragon- Was it human error or were the weapon codes hacked? It is known that Western intelligence obtained weapons specs and weapon codes after the fall of USSR. In air defense these codes are uses to identify friendly and enemy. Key to investigation would be what the Boeing craft was transmitting and how the air defense processed it. Do not rule out HACKED defense system or Boeing craft!



Anyway, I'm just posting those b/c I thought they were interesting. My initial thought was that the Israelis had something to do with it, as a way of escalating things b/c we all know they would love a big war.

[Amanda]

At least they 'fessed up, something that Uncle would never do unless caught red-handed, and even then Uncle would usually still deny it (especially when operating in the interests of Israhell).


Yes, if they did it, then I'm sure it was an accident and they admitted it.

Of course, Uncle Schlomo has no honor and just lies about such things, like TWA800--they still like about that one,

And when the US shot down that Iranian airliner they never apologized and gave the guys medals!!! (showing how psychopathic the US govt is)

[Amanda]

More comments, just b/c I think they are interesting. I truly have no clue...


Money Circus -If the plane had been taken down by a bomb put onboard at Tehran airport, or by a MANPAD, wouldn't Iran prefer to "fess" up than admit a security breach?

Posted by: Tsar Nicholas | Jan 11 2020 5:40 utc | 21
My tinfoil thought is: what if taking the blame for this is spin on what really happened? The US said it was a missile awfully fast. There is an information war going on, and it isn't just the west playing.
IDK, but my gut says there is more to this that we aren't being told.
Trolls are on this like white on rice. Sure seems Hasbara, MEK, and DoD have nothing better to do.
Posted by: Sorghum | Jan 11 2020 5:43 utc | 22
https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/01/iranian-armed-forces-say-they-inadvertently-shot-down-the-ukrainian-plane.html#more

Whopper Goldberg (fyi- This guy is a retired pilot)

My tin foil hat says, after the generals were murdered they needed misdirection.

USA called up Mossad agents in Kiev to put bomb on aircraft to Tehran, detonated upon return to Kiev.

Not that hard to do



And I will say the zios are all over this story at zero--pushing the idea that Iran did this on purpose. And I always get HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS when I see threads over there full of JIDF--it always makes me wonder if they had a hand in it.

[Amanda]

And this crap always gets me suspicious--reminds me of 9/11 with those guys on ground, conveniently placed so they could get the film of the plane going in, with completely steady camera, spinning around to the precise location, like they knew in advance.


Money Circus -

That lucky guy with the cameraphone.. positioned himelf directly opposite Parand military base, from which the missile was fired.
He waits for the plane to fly in front of the base and boom... he doesn't react... says nothing, doesn't shake.
He doesn't wave the phone around like normal people do... looking for where the missile might have come from... Just stays on the subject like a pro.
Then the video appears 36 hours later on NATO-funded Bellingcat.
https://112.international/video/ps752-tragedy-ukraines-passenger-aircraft-likely-hit-by-surface-to-air-missile-bellingact-1363-1363.html


Bellingcat's video shows someone knew of the missile in advance.
Bellingcat's sourcing of the video makes clear it is propaganda.
Bellingcat is financed by the Atlantic Council which is the propaganda arm of NATO.
https://t.me/PS752/42
So whether the Iranians are saving face or otherwise trying to swallow their pride...
The attack on the plane was premeditated...
And served up for Western/Israeli purposes



This is from Jim Stone--I don't always buy his take on things, but I like to see how he sees things. Not sure I buy this either, but if you buy the idea that it was actually Israel or the US, then the part about nuclear scientists being on board has a ring of truth to it-- kind of fits the pattern of the Israelis assassinating Iranian scientists (its been going on for years)


This from JS may be the most plausible explanation why Iran is falling on the sword. Per JS request no link provided but the reader know the site.

NEW INFO: PLANE LIKELY DOWNED BY ISRAEL OR U.S. AFTER ALL, WITH STEALTH LAUNCHED AIR TO AIR MISSILE
That's why the fake missile pieces got posted, someone wanted to point the finger at Iran!
The plane had six nuclear scientists on board who flew to Iran to help them with their nuclear program. Someone shot that plane down while they were being evacuated before a war broke out, and I seriously doubt it was Iran.
The following is from this awesome Twitter account: (https://twitter.com/Kerryactivism/status/1215413680281718785?s=09)
I didn't take this far enough. Let's connect some more dots.
CANADA was involved in Uranium One.
-Canadians brokered/staged the Uranium 1 deal.
-Uranium=Nukes
-Iran wanted nukes & science.
-Canada staged deal, provided home-base for dual citizens & Nuke scientists.
MY COMMENT: That twitter account is going to get VAPORIZED.
And this pretty much confirms that Iran did not shoot that plane down.
Iran has likely been told to bury this, OR ELSE.

[Jewboo]

More comments, just b/c I think they are interesting. I truly have no clue...And I will say the zios are all over this story at zero--pushing the idea that Iran did this on purpose.

On it's face Iran appears to me to be lazy and stupid. Their population is something like ten times that of Israel....have a gazillion barrels of oil...yet have a puny military and economy. They could have bought leading-edge weapons from Russia. If Israel can have nukes obviously so can Iran...etc. Also curious that no jews in the USA or Europe are seldom ever targeted by the now-millions of Muslim Refugees...

:(??

[Amanda]

Thought these were interesting too--people seem to be suggesting that this might have contributed to what happened:



MoneyCircus

The Israelis also used a Russian intelligence plane as a mask off the coast of Syria back in September, with fatal results for the crew after Syrian air defenses responded to the attack. Israel, of course, claimed innocence, insisting that it was the Syrians who shot down the Russian aircraft while the Israeli jets were legitimately targeting a Syrian army facility “from which weapons-manufacturing systems were supposed to be transferred to Iran and Hezbollah.”

https://www.mintpressnews.com/analysts-confirm-israel-used-civilian-airliners-to-cover-syria-airstrikes/253520/


31 minutes ago

A commenter below makes a damn good point and this is going to be a really big safety problem in the region.
___
Analysts have confirmed that the Israelis carried out the strikes in Syria by deliberately using scheduled airline departures and arrivals as cover to foil the improved and upgraded Syrian air defenses.
by Philip M. Giraldi (https://www.mintpressnews.com/author/philip-giraldi/)
https://www.mintpressnews.com/analysts-confirm-israel-used-civilian-airliners-to-cover-syria-airstrikes/253520/



Which means the Iranians might've thought the same thing was going on here. That means that Israel is at least partially responsible for those deaths.

[Amanda]

Found this in the comments over at zerohedge (IMO it fits the MO by the usual suspects--treacherous, ruthless monsters):

https://www.jpost.com/Defense/WikiLeaks-Russia-gave-Israel-Iranian-codes

WikiLeaks: Russia Gave Israel Codes to Iranian (https://www.jpost.com/Defense/WikiLeaks-Russia-gave-Israel-Iranian-codes) TOR-1M Air-Defense System" Why is this important?

Because the Jews were responsible for overriding the Iranian TOR-1M Air-Defense System that shot down the Ukraine Jet.

***
fwiw- Robert David Steele ( I think he's a "trust the plan guy")
https://phibetaiota.net/2020/01/robert-steele-ukrainian-aircraft-shot-down-by-mi-6-cia-mossad-collaborative-effort-to-undermine-iranian-regime/

Robert Steele: Ukrainian Aircraft Shot Down by MI-6, CIA, Mossad Collaborative Effort to Undermine Iranian Regime

Peace Intelligence (https://phibetaiota.net/category/journal/collaboration/peaceintel/)

It is my judgment, augmented by conversations with others, that the Ukrainian aircraft, which was TAKING OFF and CLIMBING at SLOW SPEED and AWAY from the airport, was BOMBED or shot down by remote hijacking of an Iranian surface to air missile as part of a regime change effort. There is NO WAY that an alert crew would confuse the above signature with an INCOMING, DESCENDING, HIGH SPEED cruise missile.
This was a set up. BOTH President Trump AND the Supreme Leader are being schlonged by an out of control secret intelligence mafia in a state of treason.



I definitely DO NOT AGREE with the last sentence suggesting Zion Don the Con, the latest NeoCon puppet was somehow played--give me a freaking break, Trump is totally controlled, working with the dark side.

***

Exclusive: PS752 Shot Down In Regime Change Attempt
By
Ian Greenhalgh (https://www.veteranstoday.com/author/iangreenhalgh/)
https://www.veteranstoday.com/2020/01/12/ps752-shot-down-in-regime-change-attempt/


Whether the missile was fired due to the actions of a human traitor within the IRGC or due to remote hacking into the missile’s control systems is unknown; however, the outcome is the same – nearly 200 dead civilians whose deaths can be blamed on the IRGC.

U.S. Secret Program to Sabotage Iranian Missiles (https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/13/us/politics/iran-missile-launch-failures.html)
“The New York Times reported that the Trump White House has accelerated a secret American program to sabotage Iran’s missiles and rockets, according to current and former administration officials.”

The idea behind the shootdown appears to be to undermine the current Iranian leadership by discrediting its main supporter – the IRGC. The current explanations offered by the IRGC for the ‘accidental’ missile launch leave much to be desired.
Communication jammed, Iran missile operator fired (https://www.asiatimes.com/2020/01/article/communication-jammed-iran-missile-operator-fired/)
“Guards’ explanation comes as the world demands full account following Iran’s admission it downed the jet
The Iranian missile operator who shot down a Ukrainian passenger jet opened fire independently because of communications “jamming”, a Revolutionary Guards commander said on Saturday.

The operator had mistaken the Boeing 737 for a “cruise missile” and only had ten seconds to decide whether or not to open fire, Brigadier General Amirali Hajizadeh, the Guards’ aerospace commander, said in televised remarks.”

[Amanda]

from comment at zero


1 hour ago

(Edited)

Over at Sott.net (http://sott.net) they ask pertinent questions that shouldn't be forgotten:
"But what remains to be answered is how an air-defense system operator mistook a Boeing 737 for a cruise missile.

Unless it was fiddled with in some way [my italics], the Ukrainian Airlines jet's transponder should have told the operator of the TOR-1M system that the object he was seeing on his radar screen is a Boeing 737.

Additionally, the plane's appearance on his screen should have in no way surprised him - it was the TENTH flight out of Tehran's Khomeini Airport that night. Prior to Flight 752, the last flight movement there was the departure - from the same runway and in the same direction - of QR8408 at 05:39 local time (https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/ukrainian-flight-ps752-crashes-shortly-after-take-off-from-tehran/).
https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/ukrainian-flight-ps752-crashes-shortly-after-take-off-from-tehran/
Why then was the air-defense operator surprised by this flight?"

[Amanda]

Okay, this is just a question b/c I have no clue

So NeoCon puppet, Zion Don the Con Trump is out there working hard at regime change in Iran


https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/you-killed-our-geniuses-regime-crackdown-intensifies-iranians-flood-streets-third-day

Trump tweeted at them to "turn on your internet" and yesterday it was "don't shoot the protestors" (kind of like hey Trump, don't beat your wife)

Here's Zion Don the Con Trump's tweet (he;s such an obedient NeoCon puppet)


To the leaders of Iran - DO NOT KILL YOUR PROTESTERS. Thousands have already been killed or imprisoned by you, and the World is watching. More importantly, the USA is watching. Turn your internet back on and let reporters roam free! Stop the killing of your great Iranian people!

someone made this interesting comment:


If the internet isn't working in Iran, how did Rouhani send that tweet ? How did the video of the missile and the plane get on the internet ?

How do the videos of the protests get on the internet ?







So is it possible for that Iranian Rouhani guy to tweet something out and supposedly accept responsibility for the crash if the internet is down??

[ziero0]

The universe of Logic and Universe of Politics have never been introduced.

[Dachsie]

Yes, I heard the nuclear scientists on board arguments, and a few other similarly convincing arguments about Iran admitting mistake on Fetzer Raw Deal show yesterday evening.

It was kind of an interesting show because, especially the callers in to the show from the listeners, and one guy was making a point I often try to make - 'we just don't know.' Dr. Fetzer countered that argument that the claimant was just going too strong on that argument in this case, as some were saying Dr. Fetzer's conclusions on this case was 'jumping to conclusions."

I do try to consider all hypotheses or "theories" and indeed some of those in this case look very fertile to me.

But one thing that is very different about this assassination case is that many of the top players are all fessing up to something, openly admitting in one way or another that they "did it." Even something about that does not smell right to me, but I have to say "ok, let me go with that and see how the story plays out." If Trump is claiming "I did it and I personally take full responsibility" and I check how well that comports with truth and justice, then Dr. Fetzer's conclusions still make Trump look to have done some very bad act that will work against Trump's political future at the least.

In 9-11-01 event all the top players in the event were going by the same scripted official story -- 19 Islamic terrorist hijackers ..yadda yadda. That outright stunk from Day 1 and what set me off on my personal study of the event.

Even though I am well aware that we just don't know much about this Iran assassination and am a bit repelled by some of the conclusions Dr. Fetzer appears to have jumped to, especially his suggestions about who we all should vote for next presidential election, (Voting and elections are total nonstarters at this point),

the WHOLE THING LOOKS LIKE A VERY CLEVER CASS SUNSTEIN TYPE MANIPULATION. Usually we the people lose no matter how this plays out.

[Amanda]

Yes, since 9/11 and all the other suspicious plane crashes and what we know they can do with remote electronic control and hacking things, I'm just suspicious.

[Amanda]

Was Iranian Missile Operator Tricked Into Shooting Down The Ukrainian Airlines Plane Over Tehran? (https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran#) https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran


The Iranian confession that their military shot down the Ukraine International Airlines plane near Tehran is the end of the matter as far as international diplomacy and the media is concerned. The official story then about what happened is this:

It's 2am on January 8th 2020 and our guy is sitting in a Tor-M1 air-defense missile system about 10kms north-west of Imam Khomeini international airport, west of Tehran.

General Soleimani had been buried the day before, and in the last half-hour or so a couple dozen Iranian ballistic missiles had been fired from western Iran at two US bases in Iraq.

The entire Iranian military is on alert and stress levels are particularly high. There's been a lot of chatter about a likely US response to the Iranian missiles and our guy is one of several teams positioned around Tehran tasked with shooting down anything on his radar screen that fits the profile. But as the hours pass without incident, he starts to doubt he'll see any action - at least, not tonight.

By 6am the only thing he can report having seen on his radar screen are each of the 9 scheduled flights that departed the nearby airport that night (https://www.flightradar24.com/blog/ukrainian-flight-ps752-crashes-shortly-after-take-off-from-tehran/). He watched them take normal flight paths off the northwest runway, climb into the clear night sky and then veer north or northeast. Since the Tor-M1 system he is operating is fitted with IFF (Identification Friend or Foe) functionality, he could even see their call signs. The second-to-last one was Qatar Airways Flight QR8408 heading for Hong Kong.
https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552767/large/IKA_DEP_up_to_PS752.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552767/full/IKA_DEP_up_to_PS752.jpg)© flightradar24.com
Click to enlarge - Flight paths of the 10 flights that left Khomeini Airport that night (before, during and after the Iranian airstrikes)

https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552769/large/IKA_dep_8_jan_vertical_path.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552769/full/IKA_dep_8_jan_vertical_path.jpg)© flightradar24.com
Click to enlarge - Flight paths of the 10 flights that left Khomeini Airport that night (before, during and after the Iranian airstrikes)


The last flight that night would be Ukraine International Airlines Flight PS752 heading for Kiev. It departed one hour late at 6.12am, but followed the exact same initial flight path as the previous flights. As it climbed and reached 4,600ft above ground level, the plane's transponder suddenly stopped working at about 6.14am, 2 minutes or so after take off. The plane then made a sharp right turn heading east and turning back around towards Tehran city, traveling another 15-20kms over 4 minutes before crashing into an area near a football field and exploding on impact.

For some as yet unknown reason, our guy had suddenly become convinced that the Boeing 737 was an 'enemy target'. As per protocol, he had requested authorization to launch, but his superiors could not be reached because of 'some problem with the communication network (https://www.sott.net/article/427258-We-accept-full-responsibility-Watch-IRGC-press-conference-confessing-accidental-downing-of-Ukrainian-plane)'. Again according to protocol, he had a 10-second window in which to decide whether to launch or not. Still convinced the 737 was a cruise missile or enemy aircraft, he launched the two missiles that sealed the fate of the 178 people on board.

The Iranian government and military has taken full responsibility for the shooting down of Flight 752, but no one has yet explained why a presumably well-trained missile system operator, having watched 9 commercial airliners fly past him that night, was so convinced that the 10th one was an enemy target that he made a decision - by himself - to shoot it down.

Iran purchased 29 Tor-M1 air-defense systems from Russia in late 2005. In 2012, Wikileaks revealed (https://www.sott.net/article/427268-WikiLeaks-Russia-Gave-Israel-Codes-to-Iranian-TOR-1M-Air-Defense-Systems) that they may have quickly become compromised:
https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552766/large/JPost_TOR.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552766/full/JPost_TOR.jpg)
Unluckily for Iran, two years after their large purchase of M1s, the Russians rolled out Tor-M2E (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tor_missile_system) which, significantly upgraded, included "protection against spoofing." As it relates to general internet usage, spoofing means (https://www.veracode.com/security/what-is-spoofing):
"when a hacker or malicious individual impersonates another user or device on a network, duping users or systems into believing they are communicating or interacting with a different person or website." In military terms however, spoofing usually refers to radar-spoofing and involves capturing enemy radar signals and sending them back in an altered format in order to confuse the radar operator about what he is seeing.

A few years ago, US weapons manufacturers began rolling out these EW units (https://www.militaryaerospace.com/computers/article/16726118/navy-continues-buying-radarspoofing-electronic-warfare-ew-equipment-from-mercury-systems) for operational use by the US Navy and Air Force:
https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552773/large/Navy_EW.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552773/full/Navy_EW.jpg)
Note specifically what this technology is for:
"U.S. Navy airborne electronic warfare (EW) experts are continuing their support of radar-spoofing electronic warfare (EW) technology from Mercury Systems Inc. that can fool enemy radar systems with false and deceptively moving targets." That the anti-spoofing upgrade was added to the later version exposes a vulnerability in the Tor-M1 system that shot down the Ukrainian plane - a vulnerability which allowed an enemy to potentially "impersonate another [target] on a network, duping [operators] into believing they are communicating or interacting with a different [aircraft]."

Another way that the Tor-M1 system (and operator) could have been 'spoofed' that night is through alteration of the identifying signals sent by the transponder on the Ukrainian airliner. The newer ADS-B transponder systems that are today on most airliners a (https://www.computerworld.com/article/2472455/curious-hackers-inject-ghost-airplanes-into-radar--track-celebrities--flights.html)re known to be vulnerable to hacking (https://www.computerworld.com/article/2472455/curious-hackers-inject-ghost-airplanes-into-radar--track-celebrities--flights.html). Of most concern to transport authorities is the potential for hackers to inject 'ghost aircraft' into the ATC system, but it is equally possible for a hacker to inject data directly into the aircraft's ADS-B so that it transmits false data about its identity, location, speed and direction.

In 2012, researchers from the Air Force Institute of Technology showed (http://users.ece.utexas.edu/~bevans/students/phd/kyle_wesson/phd.pdf) that a variety of "false injection" attacks can be readily coded on a commercial software-defined radio platform and launched from the ground or air with a cheap antenna. Attacks could cause aircraft to believe a collision is imminent, flood the airspace with hundreds of false transmissions, or prevent reception of legitimate messages.

Rich Kids of Tehran

Another curious part of the official story of the shoot-down of the Ukrainian plane involves a clique of Iranians who were responsible for documenting and distributing video footage of the missile launch and its impact with the plane, the crash, and photographs of what are allegedly the remains of the Tor-M1 missile.

On January 9th, an Instagram account called 'Rich Kids of Tehran (https://www.instagram.com/therichkidsoftehran/?hl=en)' - described as "a popular social media account showcasing Iran's young and wealthy as they flaunt their wealth and jet around the world" - posted a video showing what was apparently a mid-air explosion. That same day, the New York Times contacted the administrator of the 'Rich Kids of Tehran' account and received the video in high resolution, and later confirmed its authenticity.


Additional footage subsequently released by unknown sources included CCTV camera footage from the vicinity of the crash site and which captured the moment of impact. A day later someone released alleged images of the missile that struck the plane.

https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552830/large/TOR_missile1.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552830/full/TOR_missile1.jpg)

https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552831/large/Tor_missile2.jpg (https://www.sott.net/image/s27/552831/full/Tor_missile2.jpg)

Bellingcat analyzed the video footage (https://www.bellingcat.com/news/mena/2020/01/09/video-apparently-showing-flight-ps572-missile-strike-geolocated-to-iranian-suburb/) and concluded that both videos were taken from a residential area in Parand, a suburb to the west of Imam Khomeini International Airport. Parand is a 'planned city' development outside Tehran that was built to house low-income families. Bellingcat also claims that the images of the missile are likely from the same Parand area.

Why one or more people associated with the 'Rich Kids of Tehran' - whose claim to fame in Iran is to be seen (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5247263/Are-Rich-Kids-Tehran-blame-Irans-riots.html) "brazenly driving Porsches and Maseratis through Tehran before the eyes of the poor" - happened to be in a low-income housing estate on the city's outskirts at 6am on the morning of January 8th with cameras pointed at the right part of the sky in time to capture a missile hitting a Ukrainian passenger plane, is anyone's guess. Although it is rather suspicious.

Who Would Induce Iran To Do This?

To have any chance of correctly understanding the shoot-down of the Ukrainian civilian airliner, it must be seen as a political rather than a military incident. A few days beforehand, the US had killed General Soleimani, an egregious attack on Iranian national pride. When Iran responded with pin-point accurate missile strikes on two US bases in Iraq, the score was - more or less - equal, as far as both parties were concerned.

You could argue, in fact, that Iran came out of the affair looking stronger and with more respect than when it entered. But all of that was undone with the shoot-down of the Ukrainian plane. Iran now appeared militarily inept, was forced to apologize to the world and protests groups in the country (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7876363/Iranian-protesters-Tehran-turn-against-regime-military-admits-shooting-plane.html) have used the tragedy to increase their calls for 'regime change'.

The bottom line is that the claim that "panic and poor training" led the operator of the missile system to fire on a civilian airliner is not reasonable, particularly when a more reasonable explanation exists. The problem, however, is that the methods which were likely used to fool the operator left no trace or evidence that could be presented after the fact. Over the course of perhaps a couple of minutes, temporary and convincing data was presented to the operator and he acted on it.

So while Iran shot down the Ukrainian plane, it was not responsible for doing so. If you're looking for those responsible, it would make sense to look to those who have been most vocal about the Iranian threat over a long period of time, have the most to gain from making Iran 'look bad', and who have a track record - a motto even - of waging war, or achieving their geopolitical goals, by deception.

Or we could look back 19 years at a report (https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2001/sep/10/20010910-025319-6906r/) produced by the School for Advanced Military Studies at Fort Leavenworth that details a plan for enforcing a major Israeli-Palestinian peace accord which would require about 20,000 well-armed troops stationed throughout Israel and a newly-created Palestinian state.

[Dachsie]

Here is an excerpt from referenced September 10, 2001 Washington Times article.

"The SAMS paper attempts to predict events in the first year of a peace-enforcement operation, and sees possible dangers for U.S. troops from both sides.
It calls Israel's armed forces a "500-pound gorilla in Israel. Well armed and trained. Operates in both Gaza . Known to disregard international law to accomplish mission. Very unlikely to fire on American forces. Fratricide a concern especially in air space management."
Of the Mossad, the Israeli intelligence service, the SAMS officers say: "Wildcard. Ruthless and cunning. Has capability to target U.S. forces and make it look like a Palestinian/Arab act."
On the Palestinian side, the paper describes their youth as "loose cannons; under no control, sometimes violent." The study lists five Arab terrorist groups that could target American troops for assassination and hostage-taking.
The study recommends "neutrality in word and deed" as one way to protect U.S. soldiers from any attack."

Note the coinkydinky date of release of this SAMS study nine days after 9-11-01. Just as the execution of 9-11 was long in the planning, so also was this study and its "timely" release.

[Amanda]

Things that make you go hmm...

Iran Jet Disaster Setup

by Soraya Sepahpour-Ulrich (https://sputniknews.com/authors/sepahpour-ulrich_soraya/), Finian Cunningham (https://sputniknews.com/authors/finian_cunningham/)


https://sputniknews.com/columnists/202001131078026961-iran-jet-disaster-setup/


The anonymous videographer is the person who caught the 19-second clip which shows a missile striking Flight PS752 shortly after take-off from Tehran’s Imam Khomenei airport at around 6.15 am. This person, who remains silent during the filming while smoking a cigarette (the smoke briefly wafts over the screen), is standing in the suburb of Parand looking northwest. His location was verified by the NY Times using satellite data. The rapid way the newspaper’s technical resources were marshaled raises a curious question about how a seemingly random video submission was afforded such punctilious attention.

But the big question (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2wJ4fu3Qdw) which many people on social media are asking is: why was this “videographer” standing in a derelict industrial area outside Tehran at around six o’clock in the morning with a mobile phone camera training on a fixed angle to the darkened sky? The airliner is barely visible, yet the sky-watching person has the camera pointed and ready to film a most dramatic event, seconds before it happened. That strongly suggests, foreknowledge.

Given that something awful has just been witnessed it is all the more strange that the person holding the camera remains calm and unshaken. There is no audible expression of shock or even the slightest disquiet



This whole thing reminds me of those Dancing Israeli's who were there to film the event...

Here's the rest:


Turns out that Nariman Gharib, the guy who received the video and credited by the NY Times for submitting it, is a vociferous anti-Iranian government dissident who does not live in Iran. He ardently promotes regime change in his social media posts.

Christiaan Triebert, the NY Times’ video expert, who collaborated closely with Gharib to get the story out within hours of the incident, previously worked as a senior investigator at Bellingcat (https://www.bellingcat.com/author/trbrt/). Bellingcat calls itself an independent online investigative journalism project, but numerous critics accuse (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18149144) it of being a media adjunct to Western military intelligence. Bellingcat has been a big proponent of media narratives smearing the Russian and Syrian governments over the MH17 shoot-down in Ukraine in 2014 and chemical weapons attacks.

In the latest shoot-down of the airliner above Tehran, the tight liaison between a suspiciously placed anonymous videographer on the ground and an expatriate Iranian dissident who then gets the prompt and generous technical attention of the NY Times suggests a level of orchestration, not, as we are led to believe, a random happenstance submission. More sinisterly, the fateful incident was a setup.

It seems reasonable to speculate that in the early hours of January 8 a calamitous incident was contrived to happen. The shoot-down occurred only four hours after Iran attacked two US military bases in Iraq. Those attacks were in revenge for the American drone assassination on January 3 of Iran’s top military commander, Maj. General Qassem Soleimani.

Subsequently, Iranian air-defense systems were on high alert for a possible counter-strike by US forces. Several reports indicate that the Iranian defense radars were detecting warnings of incoming enemy warplanes and cruise missiles on the morning of 8 January. It does seem odd why the Iranian authorities did not cancel all commercial flights out of Tehran during that period. Perhaps because civilian airliners can normally be differentiated by radar and other signals from military objects.
However, with the electronic warfare (EW) technology that the United States has developed in recent years it is entirely feasible for enemy military radars to be “spoofed” by phantom objects. One such EW developed by the Pentagon is Miniature Air-Launched Decoy (MALD) which can create deceptive signals on enemy radar systems of incoming warheads.
https://cdn3.img.sputniknews.com/images/107800/83/1078008309.jpg

What we contend therefore is this: the Americans exploited a brink-of-war scenario in which they anticipated Iranian air-defense systems to be on a hair-trigger. Add to this tension an assault by electronic warfare on Iranian military radars in which it would be technically feasible to distort a civilian airliner’s data as an offensive target. The Iranian military has claimed this was the nature of the shoot-down error. It seems plausible given the existing electronic warfare used by the Pentagon.

It’s a fair, albeit nefarious, bet that the flight paths out of Tehran were deliberately put in an extremely dangerous position by the malicious assault from American electronic warfare. A guy placed on the ground scoping the outward flight paths – times known by publicly available schedules – would be thus on hand to catch the provoked errant missile shot.

The shoot-down setup would explain why Western intelligence were so quick to confidently assert what happened, contradicting Iran’s initial claims of a technical onboard plane failure.

The disaster has gravely undermined the Iranian government, both at home and around the world. Protests have erupted in Iran denouncing the authorities and the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corp for “lying” about the crash. Most of the 176 victims were Iranian nationals. The anger on the streets is being fueled by the public comments of Western leaders like Donald Trump, who no doubt see the clamor and recriminations as an opportunity to push harder for regime change in Iran.




It is a fact the IRGC Integrated Air Defenses had information of cruise missile launches, they were expecting and the target and weakest link (Tor) had to react real quick. That means only one thing, the Americans had faked cruise missile launches. And why would they do that? Why not launch instead a real cruise missile? Only 1 reason that is to provoke the Iranians into making a mistake.

[Amanda]

Credit to poster in Moon of Alabama. IT SAYS IT ALL.....US cyberattack and murder of innocents. (Nothing new under the sun...)

https://www.moonofalabama.org/2020/01/the-long-planned-us-assassinations-in-iraq-will-increase-the-political-chaos/comments/page/2/#comments




New Dimensions of Ukrainian Airplane Incident in Tehran; US Footprint Brighter than Ever.

According to available information, few after Iran’s missile attacks on US terrorist forces in Iraq, the US reconnaissance aircraft “Rivet Joint”, started the simulation of cruise missiles firing to some targets in center of Iran.

The aircraft is the same aircraft that after downing of US MQ-4C UAV above the Hormoz strait by Iran’s defence system, flew above the Iranian islands Abu Musa and Siri the night before the July 4th (US Independence Day) and with changing its flight ID to an Iranian aircraft, provoked the Iranian air defense to attack and create widespread tension in the region. Anyway…

In fact, the Americans have acted against Iran’s defense system to mislead it; but it’s not the all of story!

What indicates the depth of disaster and US evil, is the changing the identification of a passenger aircraft to a cruise missile!

Perhaps, it’s a question for many people that why and how this cameraman was exactly in the right place and right time, and has set his camera exactly on that part of sky where the air defence missile hit the plane! And his unusual calmness with zero stress…

But in the next studies, that will be published with more scientific evidences, it will be shown how US Rivet Joint changes the Ukrainian aircraft ID, to a cruise missile, and provides the base for happening this great disaster.
On the other hand, it is increasing this probability that there is someone as a cameraman, that the intended location has been given to him, that be ready in the right time, in the intended place, and focus his camera on Ukrainian plane for filming. Because with doing this evil action and changing the plane’s ID, the possibility of its targetting by air defence systems located in the region, is so high.

And unfortunately this issue is done, due to the inherent duty of the defense systems. And the film of this event published in the anti-Iran government media short after the incident.

It is interesting to note that the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has also issued a warning about an hour and a half before the incident, calling for US commercial and non-commercial aircraft to not fly over Tehran “due to the potential for miscalculation of mis-identification”!

The Qatari Emir’s trip to Iran and rumors about his staggering financial aids to Iran for compensation, are interpretable in this regard. Because Qatar has a major indirect role in this event too and the US has abused of them for advancing its goals.

It is important to be noted that scrutiny of the events such Ukrainian plane crash, and announcing its conclusions in all over the world, usually takes weeks or months. But the commander of IRGC aerospace forces, that couldn’t say clearly many of issues to people because of security affairs, but with honesty and in the lowest possible time, and even before completing the investigations about the case, appears in front of the cameras and announces the targetting the plane by country’s air defence system. Then, this action may be a relief on survivors wound and show that Iran’s military forces are honest to their people.

[Dachsie]

Great article by Professor "Vivian Lee" long time poster of James Fetzer venues.

https://jamesfetzer.org/2020/01/vivian-lee-the-strange-crash-of-ukrainian-flight-752-in-iran/


Vivian Lee, The Strange Crash of Ukrainian Flight #752 in Iran
January 14, 2020 James Fetzerblog
Vivian Lee

"On the morning of January 8, 2020, a Boeing 737 crashed and left debris scattered over a wide area just minutes after takeoff from the Imam Khomeini International Airport in Tehran. The Ukrainian International Airlines jet was en route to Kyiv, scheduled to land at Boryspil International Airport at 8 am local time. “Amateur” videos posted on social media led to the suspicion that the plane had been brought down by a missile over the city of Parand. " SNIP

embedded videos

here are the last three paragraphs of the article...

"Although Netanyahu has distanced himself from the assassination of Soleimani, calling it “an American event,” Israeli sources are reporting that “the Jewish state was involved in the January 3 operation, handing the Americans key intelligence details.” The Times reports that Mike Pompeo briefed Netanyahu in advance about the plan to kill Soleimani, and that he was the only non-U.S. leader who knew about it beforehand. Some have speculated that the assassination was carried out by the CIA and Mossad. Did Trump really give the order?

This brings us back to the crash of flight #752. If this was a staged event and not a real plane crash, which is all but certain, who was capable of carrying out such a huge operation – and who benefits? According to the media, we are now very close to a war with Iran. General Hossein Salami, commander-in-chief of the Iranian Revolutionary Guards, apologized for the downing of the jet but added, “We are at war with the United States. We do not consider the conflict over.” The U.S. does not benefit from a war with Iran – nor does Trump, as this would only alienate his supporters and add to his current problems. His defeat in 2020 is already being predicted by the media, due to the situation in Iran.

But one country does benefit from the assassination of Soleimani and the staged plane crash, and that is Israel. While one might think that the crash of a Boeing 737 and the deaths of 176 passengers would be impossible to fake, one should remember the attacks of 9/11. Four passenger planes were said to have crashed into WTC 1 and 2, the Pentagon, and the ground at Shanksville, killing the crews and passengers – although none of this actually happened. The false-flag attacks of 9/11 were engineered by Israel and its accomplices, including many traitors in the U.S. government. Like those attacks, the crash of flight #752 was an orchestrated event on a grand scale, involving an airplane and killing no passengers – calculated to keep America fighting for the Zionist Project.
So what induced the Iranians to take responsibility for downing the Ukrainian jet, when they knew the crash was “scientifically impossible”? As the media saying goes, the situation is still developing.

Vivian Lee is the nom-de-plume of a tenured professor at an east coast university. "

[Amanda]

Dachsie- Thanks for posting this--I've always loved Vivian's work. This is all very interesting, but definitely hard to wrap my head around.

As I think I've said somewhere in this thread, the tip-off/tell to me is when I see an infestation of JIDF in the comments at zerohedge--whenever I see tons of them, I just know they had a hand in it.

[Amanda]

Looks like more BS trying to push the evil Iranians narrative--(((NYT))) trying to push the BS that Iran hit the plane on purpose. Give me a freaking break-the Iranians are angry with the US for the assassination of Soleimani, so they decided "hey lets shoot down a plane load of our own citizens"...Never-ending BS

https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/new-video-shows-2-iranian-missiles-striking-doomed-passenger-jet


The NYT also debunked another one of the Iranian government's claims: That the strike was due to 'human error', as one missile operator mistook the plane for a cruise missile. This doesn't jive with the plane's flight path: Since it had just taken off, it would have still been ascending, not descending toward a target on the ground, like missiles do.



But this seems especially strange/suspicious:


The new video was uploaded to YouTube by an unnamed Iranian user at around 2 am on Tuesday. It's unclear how the times verified the video, but the four bylines attached to the story would suggest that it took some serious legwork. Oddly, the date visible on the footage is "2019-10-17" - years before the day the plane was downed on Jan. 8.



I think zero obviously made a mistake with the word "years," but you get the point, the date on the video doesn't match the date of the event.

[Dachsie]

Dachsie- Thanks for posting this--I've always loved Vivian's work. This is all very interesting, but definitely hard to wrap my head around.

As I think I've said somewhere in this thread, the tip-off/tell to me is when I see an infestation of JIDF in the comments at zerohedge--whenever I see tons of them, I just know they had a hand in it.

I have a handy internet slang translater on my desktop but I knew I would not find JIDF because I know what the J stands for but could you please supply the rest.

I was unclear on your point here. Do you think Vivian Lee's article may be being viewed on some site ? where JIDF infestation is shown?

Still, VL does high quality work and it would be interesting to follow her developing work on this. Not sure I can do that anymore. I have been away from plane crash "researc h" since 9-11-01 but I read enough about that and the no planes theory NPT to understand that this is quite possible. So this may be the "false flag" event we were expecting to be part of this whole event. It occurs to me if the plane shoot-down is fake, that increases the likelihood that the assassination of Soleimani was fake too or at least did not happen as we were told but was still killed in some way. The perpetrator of this event is very skilled at staging false flag events, even multi-stage ones as this one may play out as.

[Amanda]

Dachsie--

JIDF= Jewish Internet Defense Force (hasbara)--I just meant that when I see a whole bunch of Israelis in the comments section on a particular story it makes me HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS--I just assume they had a hand in it. sorry for the confusion!!

I really can't comment on Vivian's work on this one--it kind of makes my head spin, there's so much to take in
another thing that bothers me, is that Trump tweeted out to Iran "turn on your internet," and I'm totally not technologically savvy, but it makes me wonder how Rouhani could even have tweeted out that Iran took responsibility if their internet was down

I'll have to take a look at those photos in Vivian's article tomorrow-- honestly, it's hard for me to wrap my head around.

[Amanda]

just found this in comments at zerohedge:

https://twitter.com/khoosh_/status/1216782662968455168?s=20


University of Tehran Cyperspace Research Lab: On the matter of the Ukrainian plane accident in Iran, the role of human error has been ruled out [as it has been discovered that] deception operations were carried out on the air control & command system. -

No doubt, the usual suspects, either (((US))) or Israeli, take your pick--I think on the twitter thread, people are saying US

read more at the link

Also, I know I'm making a big deal of nothing, but if you notice that tweet is in English, but we also see the Farsi along with it. One thing I thought was strange about the Rouhani tweet taking responsibility for the plane crash was that it was in English and there was no Farsi along with it--my first thought was that it was the CIA with a spoof account. I'm sure I'm wrong, but it's just whenever I've seen tweets from that part of the world, I've usually seen English along with the native language- just like the tweet from the U Tehran cyberspace lab

[Dachsie]

"No doubt, the usual suspects, either (((US))) or Israeli, take you pick-"

I did not go read the whole tweet but the above quote sounds a little strange. Almost a leading question to set up a popular vote contest, then have US win, most people pick overwhelmingly.


If the US is to be painted as doing it all alone, that is just not gonna fly. Too many people suspect Israel had something to do with 9-11 as well as with other false events since then. People are not going to believe the "US alone" did it if that is what this either / or comment is supposed to lead public opinion to. But even the fact that people are not going to buy a US alone story is something Cass Sunstein and company have woven into the what they intend for the public's reaction to accomplish.

These turn of events are fertile for layers upon layers of perp infiltrators inserting one new theory after another so that people will be terminally confused.

I just read the whole article by Vivian Lee but did not watch the videos. She is just gathering a list of anomalies the same kind of which were "used" in 9-11. The article contained no deep sophisticated analysis.

I see Trump kind of being a captive to those "advisors" surrounding him. I do not see Trump really wanting to play any role at all in this but rather being forced to. Certainly he took no part in the sophisticated planning and management now of the after story and investigations and "people asking questions and starting to engage in the battle of the theories."

[Amanda]

Maybe the above tweet sounds strange because it's a translation to English from Farsi--sometimes such translations sound awkward.

No, there was no popular vote on the tweet or those that followed.

This: "No doubt, the usual suspects, either (((US))) or Israeli, take your pick--I think on the twitter thread, people are saying US" was just what my thought was. People were just commenting thoughts related to what happened, some people thought it was the US.

Sorry this was apparently so complicated.

[Amanda]

Found this at zerohedge
http://www.citna.ir/ict/240451


(Google Translate - pretty poor translation in the first half. Second is better)


"This information is being investigated by our intelligence system," said the deputy chief of staff of the Armed Forces General Staff, regarding the possibility of an infiltration over the crash of the Ukrainian plane.

Coordinator Admiral Ali Abdullahi said Tuesday in a special interview on the Sima news program about the crash of the Ukrainian passenger plane: Air defense is one of the most complex parts of the defensive sector. Involved in it and are very complex and sensitive. This field is both instrument-oriented and requires very high decision-making speed....


Asked why the country sky was not closed at that time, he said: "Alert was 100 percent at the time and everyone should be present at the time, but that certainly does not mean conflict. has it. The compatriots remember that during the war, when the planes were moving to the country, the sound of the red siren was heard and people were taking refuge. At that time our systems were on fire, but on that night, the fire was not limited but limited.

"To close the country, we must first see the target, declare red, and then close the sky," Abdullahi said.


In response to a question about whether the plane's radar cross-section is not different from the cruise missile, he said: "When the radar catches the plane, its altitude is about 5 to 5 meters." On the other hand, the aircraft was flying at zero radar, meaning it had the lowest radar cross section. The operator of the system was in a situation where his communication was interrupted or interrupted while this is being investigated and here an individual error occurs and the missile fires.


** Possibility of penetration is under consideration

"The possibility is being investigated by our intelligence system," said the Deputy Coordinator of the Armed Forces General Staff regarding the possibility of infiltration.


** The Electronic Warfare Team is investigating the possibility of a radar disturbance

Commenting on the likelihood of US electronic disruptions to aircraft or defense systems, he said: "Americans have such experience in the region, and have a history of creating virtual targets in the sky by electronic systems." But our investigation shows that it is hard to say if this is the case with the aircraft and the relevant system. We have also set up a cyber-investigation team and an electronic warfare to do this.


** Released movie is not technically cited

Responding to a question about the film released from the moment the missile hit the plane, Sardar Abdullahi said: "This issue has an intelligence dimension that should be pursued by intelligence agencies, but in the technical review, many films and cyberspace issues cannot be documented for us because movies can be faked.


The Deputy Coordinator of the General Staff of the Armed Forces on the Continuation of Investigations and Investigation of Other Scenarios stated that the disconnection of the investigative system must be continued to see if there is a technical problem or disturbance. Why the operator is firing is followed, some in the armed forces and some in the judiciary.


"There is also work to be done in terms of electronic and cyber-related disruptions; the aircraft's black box should also be read and opened, and anything else that can be identified by comprehensive scrutiny."

What has been revealed so far is that the plane has crashed due to a foreign object, Commander Abdullahi said."

[Dachsie]

"Now all of a sudden we have the US conducting a sophisitcated operation all by itself and Israel is playing role of having nothing to do with any of these recent events."

Oh, thanks for clarification. I tend to be over-analytical, but still this is starting to look like a "multi-phase" operation but still one operation - the "assassination" and the "plane crash" are one operation and I feel I need to start putting everything in quotes. That could be part of the fake too.

May throw in my two cents as Vivian Lee provides more information.

[Dachsie]

Found this at zerohedge
http://www.citna.ir/ict/240451

Thank you.

I see what you mean about there possibly could be problems with the translation from Farsi. Many questions I have, but guess I will not go off to races just yet in saying what looks odd about "the deputy chief of staff of the Armed Forces General Staff" said.

A few observations I would make at this early stage...

Iran is a very sophisticated country. It is intelligently measured in its response to hits on it and does not just fly off the handle and fire back and thereby fall for traps and in fact I think there is clear history of their standing down in the past. You can't have the neighbor it does and not be well aware of its games.

I know Iran has a reputation of being a "theocracy" and kind of a dictatorship but at the same time it has the reputation of an advanced almost Western style democracy where the people have the right to assemble and redress their grievances on the streets publicly and not be mowed down by the military. At least that is the impression I have. Also, I do not rule out that Iran may be just as infiltrated as the USA with Mossad-type spies at the highest levels and if that is the case, analyzing what may come out in Vivian Lee's research will be a big hodge podge like what played out in the immediate aftermath in research 9-11. In 9-11 there were fake "truther groups" asking questions from the very beginning and some truly ridiculous theories being thrown out there.

[Amanda]

Oh, thanks for clarification.

No problem- next time when I add commentary, I'll say "my comment on this is:" (or something like that)

[Amanda]

Dachsie-

I went back to look at Vivian's post and just noticed this (don't know how I missed it last night--I guess I was tired and just did a fast skim) and I find it a bit ominous/strange (are they trying to signal something? --then again maybe I'm making too much of it). Vivian seems to think it's "amusing" but I kind of find it a bit suspicious:


In a two-page spread on Sunday, January 12, The Times published a story claiming that he was indeed at fault: “Seven Days in January (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/11/us/politics/iran-trump.html): How Trump Pushed U.S. and Iran to the Brink of War.” This is an amusing title, referring to “Seven Days in May (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Days_in_May),” a 1964 film (based on a 1962 book) about a planned takeover of the U.S. government by a military/political cabal displeased with the fictional President’s disarmament treaty with the U.S.S.R. – that is, with the President’s wish to avoid war and commit to disarmament instead. That is pretty much what is happening now, with Trump wanting to end the endless wars, and the neocons and their sponsors – Israel chief among them – hoping to keep the wars going and finish up by attacking Iran. The list of authors of “Seven Days in January” reads like a Who’s Who of CIA journalists:
https://vivianleeposts.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/VL-Strange-Crash-Fig-11.jpg

Are they hinting that a military coup has taken place and that they are in control?? It kind of looks like a coup has taken place behind the scenes--he's a full NeoCon now

[Dachsie]

"That is pretty much what is happening now, with Trump wanting to end the endless wars, and the neocons and their sponsors – Israel chief among them – hoping to keep the wars going and finish up by attacking Iran. The list of authors of “Seven Days in January” reads like a Who’s Who of CIA journalists:
https://vivianleeposts.com/wp-conten...ash-Fig-11.jpg"

"Are they hinting that a military coup has taken place and that they are in control?? It kind of looks like a coup has taken place behind the scenes--he's a full NeoCon now"

First of all, I just discovered Vivian Lee's website where her article first appeared.

https://vivianleeposts.com/2020/01/14/the-strange-crash-of-ukrainian-flight-752-in-iran/

No one has replied but comments were invited.

I am thinking I might ask her there if she knows of any website where there is real discussion of the airliner crash and the whole Soleimani matter.

I think one place that keeps all input/comments nicely organized and archived in a strong firewall is valuable.

I think if we get more info on the airliner crash from Vivian Lee and we begin to get a more clear picture of the official narrative being false, we should start to look at the events leading up to the "assassination" of Soleimani and the plane crash and aftermath as ALL ONE OPERATION, not separate events. ALL ONE OPERATION means ALL ONE AND SAME PERPETRATOR.

We only know what the MSM deigns to tell us so I am not going to reach any final conclusions about Trump. His being in the presidency so far has kept us out of war so I am willing to try to hold on to that as long as I see we are not at war.

The neocons/Mossad/CIA are really the same team that is destroying every aspect of the USA and are relentlessly following their plan for a one world death and slavery system for all. First they need to stifle any truth bombs that may come from those of us who want to look more deeply at each event and expose and disseminate truth bombs as our very strong and best, and really only weapon.

Truth is mighty and so is the Almighty. We need to put some out there for Him to work with.

[Amanda]

here's the latest from Phil Giraldi on the plane:

Who Targeted Ukraine Airlines Flight 752? Iran Shot It Down But There May be More to the Story

https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/who-targeted-ukraine-airlines-flight-752-iran-shot-it-down-but-there-may-be-more-to-the-story/ (https://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/who-targeted-ukraine-airlines-flight-752-iran-shot-it-down-but-there-may-be-more-to-the-story/)


The claim that Major General Qassem Soleimani was a “terrorist” on a mission to carry out an “imminent” attack that would kill hundreds of Americans turned out to be a lie, so why should one believe anything else relating to recent developments in Iran and Iraq? ...but there just might be considerably more to the story involving cyberwarfare carried out by the U.S. and possibly Israeli governments.



What seems to have been a case of bad judgments and human error does, however, include some elements that have yet to be explained. The Iranian missile operator reportedly experienced considerable “jamming” and the planes transponder switched off (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/09/video/iran-plane-missile.html?searchResultPosition=1) and stopped transmitting several minutes before (https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran) the missiles were launched (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/11/world/middleeast/plane-crash.html). There were also problems with the communication network (https://www.sott.net/article/427258-We-accept-full-responsibility-Watch-IRGC-press-conference-confessing-accidental-downing-of-Ukrainian-plane) of the air defense command, which may have been related.


The electronic jamming coming from an unknown source meant that the air defense system was placed on manual operation, relying on human intervention to launch. The human role meant that an operator had to make a quick judgment in a pressure situation in which he had only moments to react. The shutdown of the transponder, which would have automatically signaled to the operator and Tor electronics that the plane was civilian, instead automatically indicated that it was hostile. The operator, having been particularly briefed on the possibility of incoming American cruise missiles, then fired. [...] Given what happened on that morning in Tehran, it is plausible to assume that something or someone deliberately interfered with both the Iranian air defenses and with the transponder on the airplane, possibly as part of an attempt to create an aviation accident that would be attributed to the Iranian government.



The SA-15 Tor defense system used by Iran has one major vulnerability. It can be hacked or “spoofed,” (https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran) permitting an intruder to impersonate a legitimate user and take control. The United States Navy and Air Force reportedly have developed technologies “that can fool enemy radar systems with false and deceptively moving targets.” Fooling the system also means fooling the operator...

The same technology can, of course, be used to alter or even mask the transponder on a civilian airliner in such a fashion as to send false information about identity and location. The United States has the cyber and electronic warfare capability to both jam and alter signals relating to both airliner transponders and to the Iranian air defenses. Israel presumably has the same ability. Joe Quinn at Sott.net also notes (https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran) an interested back story to those photos and video footage (https://ahtribune.com/world/north-africa-south-west-asia/iran/3809-jet-disaster-setup.html) that have appeared in the New York Times and elsewhere showing the Iranian missile launch, the impact with the plane and the remains after the crash, to include the missile remains. They appeared on January 9th, in an Instagram account called ‘Rich Kids of Tehran (https://www.instagram.com/therichkidsoftehran/?hl=en)‘. Quinn asks how the Rich Kids happened to be in “a low-income housing estate on the city’s outskirts [near the airport] at 6 a.m. on the morning of January 8th with cameras pointed at the right part of the sky in time to capture a missile hitting a Ukrainian passenger plane…?”

Put together the Rich Kids and the possibility of electronic warfare and it all suggests a premeditated and carefully planned event of which the Soleimani assassination (https://ahtribune.com/world/north-africa-south-west-asia/iran/3782-end-of-america-imperial-ambitions.html) was only a part. There have been riots in Iran subsequent to the shooting down of the plane, blaming the government for its ineptitude. Some of the people in the street are clearly calling for the goal long sought by the United States and Israel, i.e. “regime change.” If nothing else, Iran, which was widely seen as the victim in the killing of Soleimani, is being depicted in much of the international media as little more than another unprincipled actor with blood on its hands. There is much still to explain about the downing of Ukrainian International Airlines Flight 752.

[Dachsie]

" Some of the people in the street are clearly calling for the goal long sought by the United States and Israel, i.e. “regime change.”"

I wonder who and how many make up "Some of the people in the street."

If there is a large number of Iranians really wanting "regime change" I would like to know what their reasons are and more about exactly how large a number.

As for the US and Israel, what Israel wants is automatically what the USA wants and Israel does NOT want regime change for good sincere reasons. They want maybe a temporary weaker Iranian government that they can then deal with. It goes without saying that the USA is just tagging along for whatever Israel's ride involves. Sad but increasingly shown as true.

[midnight rambler]

At this time Iran is the biggest obstacle in the way of creating Greater Israhell.

[Dachsie]

From Amanda’s 1-16-20 post
“….but there just might be considerably more to the story involving cyberwarfare carried out by the U.S. and possibly Israeli governments….”


Put together the Rich Kids and the possibility of electronic warfare and it all suggests a premeditated and carefully planned event of which the Soleimani assassination was only a part.

______________

From Dachsie’s 1-16-20 post

I think if we get more info on the airliner crash from Vivian Lee and we begin to get a more clear picture of the official narrative being false, we should start to look at the events leading up to the "assassination" of Soleimani and the plane crash and aftermath as ALL ONE OPERATION, not separate events. ALL ONE OPERATION means ALL ONE AND SAME PERPETRATOR.

_______________

Aside from reasoning from the idea that it is all one multi-phase operation by one perpetrator, subsequent phases of this operation possible yet to come, I want to share what I have from my studies regarding electronic takedown on a plane.

Back in 2007, I did a transcript of a radio show Dr. James Fetzer did regarding his study of the plane crash Senator Paul Wellstone in Eveleth, Minnesota, in 2002 (Paul Wellstone, his wife Sheila and daughter Marcia died Friday in a small plane crash near Eveleth, Minnesota, that also killed three staff members and two pilots)

The reason I share this is that this show transcript not only demostrates Dr. Fetzer's methodical study of the event as well as the most logical conclusion of what took the plane down. That technology used in 2002 in the USA appears to be the same technology that was used in the "crash" airliner that is the subject of this thread, but remember, this is good information to support only the hypothesis that there actually was a plane crash. And this information brought forth by Vivian Lee focuses on the idea that there may not have been a plane crash at all. Maybe the perpetrators want now to put out misleading information about the existent electronic interference technology to steer us away from the No Plane Crash theory.

Deja vu all over again!

Transcript: The Dynamic Duo radio show of May 17, 2007, Genesis Communications Network

excerpts from the show transcript

"I experienced this up close and personal when I did research into the death of Senator Paul Wellstone, whose plane crashed on 25 October, 2002. It was just about ten days before the election. He had been climbing out of a 7 or 8 point lead after giving a speech denouncing the Bush administration with regard to the war on Iraq, and as I got deeper and deeper into doing research on this subject, I discovered that the NTSB’s own investigation was a charade because it turns out that unless the attorney general declares a crash scene to be a crime scene that it can’t be investigated as a crime scene, and which meant that you’ve got a perfect mechanism here for getting your political enemies – bring them down in a plane crash and then have a complicit or compliant attorney general declare it not to be a crime scene. And then you’re constrained to investigate only accident-compatible alternatives, which is exactly what the NTSB did.

So I considered the possibility that the crash was brought down by the plane, some mechanical problem, or the weather causing difficulties in flight, or by the pilot from lack of competence. However, the more research I did, the more implausible it became that either the plane, the pilots, or the weather were responsible.

...

"But if you were forced to choose between the plane, the pilot and the weather, and the situation is that the plane is terrific and the weather wasn’t bad, you’re going to gravitate toward the pilots -- for inexplicable reasons. And that’s basically what the NTSB did. They said for inexplicable reasons, basically, that the pilots got confused or whatever and they allowed the plane to crash. "

"I mean if you don’t consider the full range of alternative possible explanations, since much of science proceeds by process of elimination, how can you be sure if you’ve eliminated alternatives that the one you’re left with in the end must be the truth? This is the principle that Sherlock Holmes enunciated, Arthur Conan Doyle, when you’ve eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth. Well if you simply sweep out all of the non-accident-compatible alternatives as the NTSB did, because the attorney general didn’t declare it to be crime scene or even a potential crime scene, then of course you’re going to be guaranteed you’re going to have an accident-compatible alternative. "

...

"And I conducted investigation on this with other scholars and experts including a Native American scholar from Northern Arizona University with both a Ph.D. and an Ed.D. We published a book together called An American Assassination – The Strange Death of Senator Paul Wellstone. And we lay out the evidence we turned up there that indicated to us that what had actually happened here was that the plane was brought down by use of a high-tech weapon that imparted a surge of energy to the plane that overwhelmed the electrical system and caused these switches, these solenoids, and the props to turn on to idle. "



_______________

[Dachsie]

Amazing Polly does outstanding coverage of Canadian connections to this plane "crash."

https://www.bitchute.com/video/GJV0bd_DfnQ/

IRANADA - Iran International Swamp Part 2



Amazing Polly
99FreeMind
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Who were the people on the downed Ukrainian Airlines flight out of Tehran, Iran? Most passengers were bound for C-a-n-a-d-a.. why? Is this a re-run of the CIA's Project AERODYNAMIC? What clues are there that the True North is infiltrated by operatives from that middle eastern country?
Also I give some updates & developments on my last video.

______

Dr. Fetzer states the plane was actually shot down.

Will says:
January 17, 2020 at 2:31 pm

Flatter myself? What the heck are you talking about? it was a legitimate question because the answer is in the link you provide. They took responsibility because it was their error. It’s what honorable nations do…not like the US, INC. Now, who knows the technical reason they shot it down….could be the transponders were turned off remotely, could be the back up systems did not function properly..who knows as yet. The most recent report is they are blaming a US cyber attack. …which actually means an israeli cyber attack…it’s what they do better than anyone.
No one I know is questioning they shot it down…..including Iran….the question is why. And as far as I can tell, nothing else makes sense except a cyber hacking to make it look like a missile.
SO, here is the exact quote from the article to which you link as to WHY I legitimately asked if it was a rhetorical question:

((By Iran’s acceptance of responsibility, it shuts off the propaganda narrative before it gets started. Whether they actually did it or not, by taking responsibility, it becomes moot and the subject is closed. A smart move.))
James Fetzer says:
January 17, 2020 at 2:35 pm

Agreed. I suspect that the Israelis took remote control of the Ukrainian plane, shut off its transponder and lights to make it look (on radar) as though it were a cruise missile. Keep up the great posts! You are spot on.

https://jamesfetzer.org/2020/01/vivian-lee-the-strange-crash-of-ukrainian-flight-752-in-iran/
___________________

I stated in my previous post here today...

"this information brought forth by Vivian Lee focuses on the idea that there may not have been a plane crash at all."

I think that statement is true. But Vivian Lee is commenting only on a certain set of photographs and certain pieces of information.

I personally do not know as it is way too early to come to the kind of conclusions I see others making. I do not know what basis we have to conclude that an actual plane crash happened and I understand most of us give much more credence to whatever the government of Iran puts out than what the U S government and president put out.

Are we going to take some photographic and videographic data as real in some interpretations and suspicious by others' interpretations of the same data?

[Amanda]

connecting dots...

Okay, so I was over here:
Was Iranian Missile Operator Tricked Into Shooting Down The Ukrainian Airlines Plane Over Tehran? (https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran#)

https://www.sott.net/article/427303-Was-Iranian-Missile-Operator-Tricked-Into-Shooting-Down-The-Ukrainian-Airlines-Plane-Over-Tehran#comment290966

And found this in the comment section:


The Tor-M1 that mistakenly shot down the Ukraine Airlines plane was located at Shahid Moddares missile base, near the village of Bidkaneh, west of Tehran.

This happened there in 2011:https://www.sott.net/article/427547-Wikileaks-Stratfor-email-Israel-behind-blast-that-killed-36-IRGC-troops-at-Iranian-missile-base-in-2011

The Israelis appear to have fired cruise missiles at it, killing 36 IRGC troops, including an IRGC general overseeing their surface-to-surface missile program.

Then too the Iranians covered it up, describing it as 'an accident'.

Looks like Sott.net has re-posted that article as a "flashback"- trying to connect that story from 2011 to what just happened:

Wikileaks Stratfor email: Israel behind blast that killed 36 IRGC troops at Iranian missile base in 2011 (https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-agents-behind-2011-blast-in-iranian-military-base-intelligence-insider/)

https://www.sott.net/article/427547-Wikileaks-Stratfor-email-Israel-behind-blast-that-killed-36-IRGC-troops-at-Iranian-missile-base-in-2011

Sott.net Comment: This interests us today because it's the same location from which missiles were fired at Ukraine Airlines Flight 752 last week. Then too, the Iranians insisted the incident was 'an accident'...


Israeli agents were responsible for a devastating blast last November that damaged an important Iranian military facility, according to an email written by the head of a leading private American intelligence company that was revealed Wednesday on Wikileaks.

Claiming to have spoken to multiple "good" Israeli sources, the CEO and founder of Texas-based intelligence company Stratfor, George Friedman, told his colleagues that he believes Israeli operatives were behind the explosion (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/30/world/middleeast/satellite-images-suggest-blast-obliterated-iran-military-base.html) at a base of Revolutionary Guards on November 12. The blast killed more than 15 soldiers, among them at least one general (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/14/world/middleeast/iran-blast-kills-revolutionary-guards-commander-at-base.html).


"Everything I'm hearing from Israel is that they did it," Friedman wrote in an e-mail (http://wikileaks.org/gifiles/docs/1037604_re-alpha-cryptic-note-from-an-israeli-diplomat-on-iran.html) on November 15. While it isn't clear whether the explosion, which took place about 40 kilometers from Tehran, was caused by a special military operation or submarine-launched cruise missile, his Israeli contacts claim they were responsible for it, Friedman wrote.

"The claims go too wide to be simply orchestrated. They are really gloating and my gut tells me its true this time. They are near dancing. Could be just crap but I am taking it seriously. The sources are good on this."

While Tehran initially said an accident caused the blast at the Bidganeh missile testing site and denied any Mossad involvement, many in Iran blamed foreign intelligence services for the incident. A former director of an Iranian state-run organization close to the government, for instance, told the Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/nov/14/iran-missile-death-mossad-mission) that the incident "was part of the covert war against Iran, led by Israel."

"They (the Israelis) want it to be known that they did it in order to intimidate the Iranians," Friedman wrote in a second email, after his colleagues questioned his sources' motives for divulging such information. "That's why they authorize diplomats to talk. The question is whether they did it or are taking credit for the accident. My judgment based on conversations is that they did do it. They are making that very public but unofficial. The mystery is how they did it."

Wikileaks recently published (https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-destroyed-irans-nuclear-program-already-last-year-leaked-intelligence-claims/) more than five million emails that Stratfor analysts exchanged between July 2004 and December 2011. Stratfor, which calls itself a "provider of geopolitical analysis," is believed to provide intelligence to corporations and government agencies, such as the US Department of Homeland Security and the US Defense Intelligence Agency.

After the leaked emails were first published, Stratfor released a statement (http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/stratfor-statement-on-wikileaks-140524033.html) calling the leaks "a deplorable, unfortunate — and illegal — breach of privacy." The statement further said that while some of the emails might be accurate others could be forged. "We will not validate either. Nor will we explain the thinking that went into them."

Netanyahu vowed to use every means to thwart Iran

In another email published on Wikileaks, Stratfor's vice president for intelligence, Fred Burton, wrote that Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told a US Congressman in a one-on-one conversation that he would not allow Iran to reach nuclear capabilities, "and he intends to use every means at his disposal to see that doesn't happen — 'Mossad, bunker-busting bombs, whatever it takes,' if need be."

Burton, who according to Wikileaks is a former special agent with the US State Department's Diplomatic Security Service and was the deputy chief of its counterterrorism division, also quotes Netanyahu as saying that US President Barack Obama doesn't understand the Iranian threat — "'rose-colored glasses' was the exact phrase used," Burton wrote in May 2010.

[Amanda]

Ukraine: Black boxes confirm interference with jet downed in Iran The flight recorders from a Ukrainian plane shot down by Iran confirm illegal interference, Ukraine says.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/07/ukraine-black-boxes-confirm-interference-jet-downed-iran-200724084336974.html