father in hospital, I think they are going to kill him

[Amanda]

I can't believe this is happening!

My father has had swollen legs for a couple of weeks. Last week, he went to the doctor and she said it was an infection and she gave him antibiotics and lasix.

Apparently, last night, he got dizzy (probably side effect of lasix) and sort of slid to the floor from a chair. My mother said that at first he was a bit out of it (confused), so my mother panicked (worried about a stroke) and called 911.
By the time EMTs arrived, she says he was totally normal (chatting like himself and nothing wrong), but he still somehow agreed/wanted to go to the hospital.

Last night they tested him for Covid and it was negative.

Now today, they wanted to test him again (probably because they wanted to get a positive result), but he and my mother said no, just treat his infected leg. Then they said he had a spot on his lung and it could be covid, so more pressure to take 2nd covid test. Since my parents said no, they put him in isolation, which apparently caused him to get anxious (he told my mother he was all by himself, nobody was checking on him, and he could die and nobody would know).

He wanted to come home today, and my mother was going to bring his clothes to get him out of there, but the doctor and nurse pressured him to stay.

Then late tonight 11pm, nurse calls and says my father is having a nervous breakdown, they did another covid test anyway, and that he has low oxygen, so now they have him on oxygen and are basically acting as though he's at deaths door. Apparently they also said he was coughing and that was a symptom of covid. He says the antibiotic made him throw up and irritated his throat, which caused the cough. He also sounds like he needs to drink some water.

So, I see where this is going. They are probably not going to let him out tomorrow because he needs to be on oxygen, and then they will tell my mother that the test came back positive for covid. My mother has told him that no matter what, he must say NO to a ventilator.

Also, prior to going to the hospital, he had NO respiratory problems at all. Nothing but his swollen leg, and a broken shoulder from a few weeks ago, that was apparently still in place and healing.

[midnight rambler]

Prayers sent.

Suggest if you're in a position to go there with your mother and extract him you do so. Stand firm.

[Amanda]

Prayers sent.

Suggest if you're in a position to go there with your mother and extract him you do so. Stand firm.


Thanks. Yes, we have a busy day ahead of us.

[mamboni]

What a disgrace how they push this COVID fraud to make money from the death of the elders. These people will face judgement one day.

On a more productive note, if I were in your position I would spend as much time at the hospital with your dad to prevent any shenanigans and work to discharge him ASAP. You should give him colloidal silver to sip - it will greatly potentiate the antibiotic and promote healing. Frankly he has nothing to lose because based off your observations he will not get out of the hospital alive. If nurse asks, tell her the colloidal silver is apple juice. Once you get him over the hump and home, post again and we can together design a plan to restore his health. It would appear that he has underlying edema secondary to either heart or kidney failure, Both of these are responsive to aggressive nutritional supplementation and a proper diet.

[Tumbleweed]

Amanda, below is a link to a David Knight video of an interview of Ammon Bundy on the group PeoplesRights.org. It's a group that''s organized in quite a few states that will flood hospitals with phone calls and people in the area will show up at that hospital to help families put pressure on them to release patients if they want to be released and are being held against their will.

I don't know if there is a group in your area but I'll link to it too it and you can check in to it. People from other states will also make calls when some one needs help.

I didn't listen to the whole interview but what I did listen to sounded like they have had success standing up for those who've asked for help.


The interview
https://ugetube.com/watch/interview-ammon-bundy-on-his-network-to-stand-with-others-for-individual-liberty_kRkuWHZvhZ5ANTy.html



If a hospital kidnaps your child or the COVID cops threaten to close your business — a tool to get a crowd of witnesses and bring public pressure to bear in a peaceful way. PeoplesRights.org - a grassroots network to help us stand together collectively for individual rights

https://www.peoplesrights.org

[Amanda]

Mamboni and Tumbleweed-

Thank you bot for your posts.

He survived the night. My mother is talking with him. He wants to get out of there. I'll post more when I have more info.

***

My mother talked with a doctor or nurse, and they are saying that his oxygen is low and that he will die if he goes home. And my mother and father are saying that if it's his time to die, he doesn't want to die in the hospital by himself with a bunch of strangers. He wants to be at home with his wife and family nearby.

[Neuro]

I had a patient yesterday who told me her 89 year old father died of covid 3 weeks ago. He had a urinary tract infection, and went to a hospital. Where they said he should stay 4 days for observation, while there he contracted covid (and they guaranteed that they didn’t have covid at the hospital). He got sick but recovered, but two months later his lungs gave up and he died.

Had he just been given some antibiotics for his UTI he most likely would be alive today.

Moral of the story don’t fucking go to a hospital.

[woodman]

Had he just been given some antibiotics for his UTI he most likely would be alive today.

Moral of the story don’t fucking go to a hospital.
I am convinced that seeing a veterinarian would be a far safer play. This plandemic has been shamefully used as a way to kill off older people because the PTPB don't want to foot the bill for their maintenance. They are literally carrying out a euthanasia campaign in the guise of a killer disease.

It's from the Onion, but I find more truth in The Onion than I do in mainstream media:
Scientists: ‘Look, One-Third Of The Human Race Has To Die For Civilization To Be Sustainable, So How Do We Want To Do This?’ (theonion.com) (https://www.theonion.com/scientists-look-one-third-of-the-human-race-has-to-di-1819573235)

[ziero0]

"I am convinced that seeing a veterinarian would be a far safer play"

Re: Seinfeld episode where Kramer finds a dog with a cough like his and takes it to a veteranarian so he could take medication prescribed for dog.

Veterinarian:. "We haven't been drinking out of the toilet have we?"

[JDRock]

Not to be crass here, but ​of course they want to kill him! Its what they do.

[Cebu_4_2]

He survived the night. My mother is talking with him. He wants to get out of there. I'll post more when I have more info.

Amanda, Last time I was in the hospital with 7 broken ribs (Do it right or don't do it at all) One nurse came to tell me she wanted to put an IV in me. I asked I would rather not, do I have to? She replied that I can refuse anything I want to and those are my rights. I replied "really" and she said Oh yeah, you can refuse anything. Then asked again if she could insert an IV which I denied. She smiled and said okay.

Point being if your dad wants out he can get out. Don't let them tell you anything else. They may pressure you or dad but they can't hold him for ANY reason. If they say he needs oxygen then ask for a prescription to take it home with you.

Docs and nurses for the most part are indoctrinated fools. They are told daily changes in protocol which is unheard of.

Good luck with Dad.

[Amanda]

Amanda, Last time I was in the hospital with 7 broken ribs (Do it right or don't do it at all) One nurse came to tell me she wanted to put an IV in me. I asked I would rather not, do I have to? She replied that I can refuse anything I want to and those are my rights. I replied "really" and she said Oh yeah, you can refuse anything. Then asked again if she could insert an IV which I denied. She smiled and said okay.

Point being if your dad wants out he can get out. Don't let them tell you anything else. They may pressure you or dad but they can't hold him for ANY reason. If they say he needs oxygen then ask for a prescription to take it home with you.

Docs and nurses for the most part are indoctrinated fools. They are told daily changes in protocol which is unheard of.

Good luck with Dad.




Cebu-Thanks for this!!

Okay, he's still alive and we are still working at this. Yesterday, my mother had 2 doctors on her side (pulmonologist and cardiologist), who are both in agreement that he does NOT have covid and that his symptoms are related to his heart. But they apparently could not override the crazy doctor who was insisting that he was a “suspected covid case” and keeping him in isolation (which made everything worse--he was all alone, mother could not visit, and nobody was checking on him)

My mother tried to get him home yesterday and they (not sure which doctors/nurses) were telling my her that he needed oxygen and couldn't go home and that it would kill him (we did not know that he could get a prescription for oxygen).


Today, my father is adamant that he wants to come home. He's speaking up for himself, saying NO more tests, he wants to go home. He just called my mother and said that he told the nurse he wants a prescription for oxygen, and that they told him NO because he was too weak to go home. (not sure what they meant by "weak"--they apparently haven't walked him around or anything)

Yesterday, my mother was in contact with the social worker who handles discharging of patients (she contacted my mom, so my mom thought that was a good sign). This morning my mother called her and said my father wants to get out of there today and that she wants to coordinate things with her, since he will need oxygen. Social worker just called my mother and said she cannot help until the doctor discharges him/agrees for him to go.


Also, last night, he was extremely anxious and distressed because he was having a bizarre symptom, where he felt disoriented in space and had a sensation that the wall was the floor and that he was spatially disoriented by 90 degrees. He intellectually knew that the floor was not the wall and that something was wrong. He was calling out for help and nobody was helping him (apparently, they moved the button to push for the nurse of reach, so all he could do was call out). I was on the phone with him and heard him calling out "help me, help me, please" to anyone who walked by. Nobody responded. He wanted somebody to help him sit up and put his feet on the floor to help him get reoriented. I was on the phone with him for about 1 1/2 hours to calm him down and figure this out. I talked to the nurse, said he's never been like this, something is wrong, maybe side effect of a drug they were giving him. She said no and that this is just what happens with some older patients--they get into a state of delirium. So, I kept talking with him, realized he sounded dehydrated, asked if he had any water, said NO only 1 cup of coffee in am and little bit of coffee in pm. and this is while he's on lasix. So, my father started calling for help--please help me, I need some water. Nobody came. Had to have my mother call the nurses station to get him water. Finally, somebody gave him water, and after one glass, the symptom went away.


Back to today, my father is having my mother call his primary care doctor to see if she will write a prescription for oxygen.
So, that’s where we are. Absolute nightmare. Also, 2nd covid test came back negative (so all of that distress-inducing isolation was for nothing, as we knew it was).

Now they want him to have a heart procedure and not leave. My father is saying that he just wants to go home and think about what he wants to do, risks of having the procedure, etc. I think at this point, my father would rather come home and die with my mother at his side, rather than spend another day there.

[osoab]

Amanda, I hope your family's nightmare with the M(edical)IC ends quickly in your favor.

I don't think I would be handling this as well as you.

[woodman]

Get him the hell out of there Amanda. The hospitals are not objective; they are on a mission and it ain't a good one. You can purchase all sorts of oxygen machines used from people who no longer need them. You can even get battery powered carry along units. They aren't real cheap but they aren't all that expensive either.

[Amanda]

We have a call into his primary care to see if she could give us a prescription for oxygen. So far, we haven't heard back from her yet.

Mother was just on phone with nurse practitioner with Cardiology, and apparently they are saying that they do not want him to leave, so he would be leaving against medical orders, but if he leaves against medical orders, then he cannot get a prescription for oxygen. So, we're sort of caught. Mother called local place to get oxygen, he said he needed a prescription.

Only positive so far, is that they finally have him out of the covid BS isolation, so now my mother can go visit him.

Apparently, yesterday she spoke with pulmonologist, who was on our side about covid being BS. He said that my father had fluid in his lungs, which was causing the need for oxygen and that they were giving him lasix to get rid of the fluid, and that once that was taken care of, the oxygen problem should improve.

Again, prior to going to the hospital, he had no breathing issues whatsoever. No anxiety issues. About 4-5 weeks ago, he lost his balance picking up a package and fell and broke his shoulder (but bone was still in place), so he wasn't able to get around like normal, but was still pretty much doing things for himself. His main complaint was his worry about the infection in his legs.


We will keep working on the oxygen issue.

Woodman- thanks for your ideas on the oxygen machines. I'm sure the expense will not be a problem. I'll keep researching it.

[osoab]

Get him the hell out of there Amanda. The hospitals are not objective; they are on a mission and it ain't a good one. You can purchase all sorts of oxygen machines used from people who no longer need them. You can even get battery powered carry along units. They aren't real cheap but they aren't all that expensive either.

Do those have the same "requirements" as a CPAP?

I have read that since CPAP machines are "prescribed" they technically cannot be resold.

[woodman]

Do those have the same "requirements" as a CPAP?

I have read that since CPAP machines are "prescribed" they technically cannot be resold.
No, these machines are available from both users and companies who specialize in revamped pre-owned medical devices. I was checking into them last year and the units were freely available then for around $450. Can't remember now, but I think the battery powered ones may have been more expensive. In any case it is legal, moral and smart to purchase a used one.

[Tumbleweed]

I use a cpap machine and I don't think that would help Amanda's dad if he's building up fluid in his lungs. The cpap machines just keep constant air pressure in your airway and lungs and her dad needs oxygen.

I had some swelling in my legs and feet last fall and I was given Furosemide as a diarrhetic. I also wore compression socks and that got rid of most of the swelling. I had to cut back on salt too.

I also had injured my metatarsal joints and they gave me meloxicam for inflammation. I've quit taking both those drugs and take pharmaceutical grade DMSO for inflammation and swelling in my legs and it works better than the drugs I was given. The DMSO seemed to clear my lungs up too.

[mamboni]

I use a cpap machine and I don't think that would help Amanda's dad if he's building up fluid in his lungs. The cpap machines just keep constant air pressure in your airway and lungs and her dad needs oxygen.

I had some swelling in my legs and feet last fall and I was given Furosemide as a diarrhetic. I also wore compression socks and that got rid of most of the swelling. I had to cut back on salt too.

I also had injured my metatarsal joints and they gave me meloxicam for inflammation. I've quit taking both those drugs and take pharmaceutical grade DMSO for inflammation and swelling in my legs and it works better than the drugs I was given. The DMSO seemed to clear my lungs up too.I'm biting my tongue.

[Bigjon]

To bad Large Sarge went off and left us, as he had a business of selling oxygen concentrators (https://duckduckgo.com/?q=oxygen+concentrator&t=opera&ia=web&iai=r1-0&page=1&sexp=%7B"cdrexp"%3A"b"%2C"prodexp"%3A"b"%2C"prdsde xp"%3A"c"%2C"biaexp"%3A"b"%2C"msvrtexp"%3A"b"%7D ). I think anyone can buy these, without a prescription, however if you want your insurance to pay for it, they probably want a doctors prescription.

Here is my doctor: http://www.doctoryourself.com/

Going to an actual doctor is my last resort. Look for osteopath instead of allopath.

[Tumbleweed]

I'm biting my tongue.

Why are you biting your tongue doc? I have sleep apnea and I use a cpap machine to try and avoid congestive heart failure. So far so good. Last summer when they checked my heart the ejection fraction on my left ventricle was 71%.

After I had the bypasses done on my heart they gave me oxygen for awhile and then switched to a cpap machine at my request but I couldn't stand that damn thing and went back to the oxygen. Later on I started using one but it took awhile to get used to it.

I'm the only one I can practice medicine on with out a license so I do what I want and not always what I'm told to do. :) I'm not afraid of dying, I'm more afraid of living to long.

A cpap might help Amanda's dad and I'd give it a try if I was in her dads position. He should probably already be using one since he has heart problems. Seems like it would be something they could try pretty quick and easy while he's there in the hospital.

[ziero0]

Don't forget the benefits of bipap as opposed to cpap.

[Amanda]

okay...

prior to hospital - NO signs of weakness, he was making his breakfast and lunch, walking around the house, helping with dishes, despite having a broken shoulder; no breathing problems, just upset about swollen infected legs.


Thurs-

We kept trying to get oxygen to get him out of there, since that was his wish yesterday. He wanted to leave.
We believe he is weaker and condition has deteriorated because of being in the hospital and letting him get dehydrated, giving him crappy cold food (so not eating as much), nobody get him up for 3 days to walk around, etc. (also for food, he needs position in bed adjusted so he can reach the tray, but nobody does this for him, they come in an hour later and food is then cold and he doesn't feel like eating it).


So, mom visited him yesterday, since now out of isolation for fake covid BS; gave him more water and brought him bananas.

Last night, I visited and brought him some nutrients for his heart: 400 mg magnesium, D-Ribose, 2 Hawthorn berry, 400 mg CoQ10, Vit K2. I got him to drink more water. Talked with him about how his health has deteriorated from being in the hospital (never needed oxygen before, wasn't weak before, etc.) and that they were now using it against him as a reason for why he could NOT leave the hospital. We talked about the strategy of my mother continuing to try to get prescription for oxygen from primary care doctor and get a wheelchair since they would not give him one if he left against medical orders. Also talked about how we have to work on building up his strength and health by giving him nutrients to get him back to where he was before he arrived at the hospital. He seemed on board with all of this. Told him we would be back 2 times on Fri to keep giving him the supplements. Also told him they said he had afib on Wed night (never had before, could this be due to him getting so dehydrated that electrolytes were off?), but we checked with Dr. Sherry Rogers' book "Is Your Cardiologist Killing You?" and she said you can cure Afib with magnesium (I think she said 600 mg 2x/day)--I told him all about Dr. Rogers and what she said.

also when I arrived, food sitting there since 6:10 but father not able to eat it because nobody came to adjust his position in the bed so he could reach the tray. I arrived at 7pm, then the bitchy white nurses came in and adjusted his bed. My father said, they only came in because they saw you were here and wanted to make it look good. Finally, at end of visit, we got a nice black tech, very friendly, so I told him everything that was going on. How they didn't give him any water for 2 days and he got dehydrated, was feeling spatially disoriented on Wed night b/c of dehydration, which went away with a drink of water. Asked him to please make sure nobody takes water away and keep it within his reach on the tray. also told him How father was here for 3 days , nobody walked him around, so he's getting weaker, and they are saying now he's too weak to leave (using weakness against him). Said at home, he was not bed ridden and was up and about despite broken shoulder. Marquis (the guy) totally got it, said he would get him up and help him walk and take him to toilet (nobody even took him to the freaking toilet for 3 days!!). later, got call from nurse Lisa Kruger, who worked with Marquis to get him up, standing and on toilet. She said he was unsteady and that they got him in a chair so he could sit for an hour. So finally thought we were making progress (nurse also said she would put in order for physical therapy). Also noticed when I was there, "heparin" on the screen, and I was to self - WTF is that about? (prior to hospital, he was only on thyroid meds and gabapentin at first for neuropathy, which went away, so then only for sleep) So when I left, I thought we were on the right track. (again, as of yesterday, he wanted to get out of there, and was telling us to get prescription for oxygen).

Friday morning-

Mom just talked with him, now all of the sudden he is telling us they have time to "squeeze him in" for a procedure (I guess having to do with the valve), which makes no sense to have this now when his condition has deteriorated for 3 days of being there (he would have a better chance of surviving if it was done when he was in the condition he was in prior to the hospitalization).

Now, my father is seemingly resigned to fate (yet, yesterday, Wed, Tues, he wanted OUT--yesterday, Thurs morning he told me he told them "no more f'ing tests, I want to go home, I'm done with this crap, I'm not having any tests so get me my breakfast." He just told my mother (fri am) he realizes he's weaker now than few years ago (he did not feel that way prior to hospital), he's going to take his chances with the procedure (aware he might not make it,willing to take chances), so he can spend his last years helping his family (IMO- sounds like they were manipulating him, working this angle, "hey if you have this procedure, you will be healthier and can help your wife, etc." -- meanwhile, all last year, he was healthy enough to manage the renovation of an inherited house in CT, and have a friend drive him up there almost every weekend, so he could work on it--at 83 he was actually doing work on a house). Our worry is that they are going to kill him, especially since he's in dramatically worse shape than he was in prior to going to the hospital.

My mother is extremely upset that he has made this decision on his own without talking with her. agreement prior to hospital was that they would NEVER make any major decision without first consulting each other. My mother was upset that nobody (doctor) called to inform her of any of this. This feels like they browbeat an old man into doing what they want.

Also now worried about my mother--stress of this is killing her (82 y. o) her BP was through the roof last night.

Also, we went through all of this in 2019--they wanted to do procedure for valve. Had him at hospital in PHilly. After 4 days of being there (tons of tests to make $$$$ and rack up the bill) my father got sick of it and wanted to come home. He was going to do Linus pauling protocol, diet, high dose K2 based on info I got online and here. Then for first few weeks when home, he was into it. But later started not doing protocol, lost motivation because he felt fine. My mother had to constantly nag and it caused fights. I also nagged and got into fights.

So that's that. I was feeling hopeful last night that we could get him out of this, if we continued to get nutrients into him and get him back to pre-hospitalization status and then if we could get him home and get him to finally follow nutrient and diet protocols. Now not feeling so hopeful and thinking they are going to kill him today while making some $$$$ for themselves.


Also, there are no words for the horrible "care" he's gotten-- you could probably get better care in a 3rd world country.

[osoab]

Wow. I am so sorry/disappointed in the experience for your whole family.

I hope your father gets out of their asap.

Does your father have great insurance? Just wondering if they want to milk "the cow" dry.

[Amanda]

Wow. I am so sorry/disappointed in the experience for your whole family.

I hope your father gets out of their asap.

Does your father have great insurance? Just wondering if they want to milk "the cow" dry.


Yes- milking the cow dry for sure. I think they even did (or tried to do) an x-ray of my father's foot and my father said "What the hell are you doing? I didn't break my foot, I have swollen legs from an infection" (also I think the infection was cellulitis, which I think he had before-- last time he had it, I told him he needed to take extra "killers" like monolaurin or something , since he's vulnerable to getting it again--of course he didn't listen).

Also, what really made things do downhill fast was the covid BS and putting him in isolation as a "suspected covid case" despite negative test, which meant that we could NOT visit him and monitor him, get good nutrients/food to him and be there when doctors/nurses tried to bully him. This applies to Tues, when he wanted to come home and told the nurse (I was ear witness on phone to this). But when was off the phone, nurse and doctor "browbeat" him into staying, which would NOT have happened, if my mother was able to be there with him.


Also, on a sort of shallow note, it would be extra horrible if he did not make it today (if they still go through with the procedure) because the closing for the house in CT is on Mon and he's spent many many years working on it and it would just be extra sad if he couldn't even get his money for all of his hard work before he died.

Just talked with the wheelchair rental place (I still have to work at all of this, in case we have a chance of getting him out of there) and she was SHOCKED when I told her about the situation that 83 y.o. father is at hospital and how if he leaves against medical wishes they will not give him a wheelchair to wheel him out to the car (she totally gasped in shock that they would do that--and I told her that b/c of covid procedures, everyone has to go through one entrance even though your room is far away on other side of building, which it it--I was there last night and it's a serious haul of a walk to get from entrance to his room.

[mamboni]

okay...

prior to hospital - NO signs of weakness, he was making his breakfast and lunch, walking around the house, helping with dishes, despite having a broken shoulder; no breathing problems, just upset about swollen infected legs.


Thurs-

We kept trying to get oxygen to get him out of there, since that was his wish yesterday. He wanted to leave.
We believe he is weaker and condition has deteriorated because of being in the hospital and letting him get dehydrated, giving him crappy cold food (so not eating as much), nobody get him up for 3 days to walk around, etc. (also for food, he needs position in bed adjusted so he can reach the tray, but nobody does this for him, they come in an hour later and food is then cold and he doesn't feel like eating it).


So, mom visited him yesterday, since now out of isolation for fake covid BS; gave him more water and brought him bananas.

Last night, I visited and brought him some nutrients for his heart: 400 mg magnesium, D-Ribose, 2 Hawthorn berry, 400 mg CoQ10, Vit K2. I got him to drink more water. Talked with him about how his health has deteriorated from being in the hospital (never needed oxygen before, wasn't weak before, etc.) and that they were now using it against him as a reason for why he could NOT leave the hospital. We talked about the strategy of my mother continuing to try to get prescription for oxygen from primary care doctor and get a wheelchair since they would not give him one if he left against medical orders. Also talked about how we have to work on building up his strength and health by giving him nutrients to get him back to where he was before he arrived at the hospital. He seemed on board with all of this. Told him we would be back 2 times on Fri to keep giving him the supplements. Also told him they said he had afib on Wed night (never had before, could this be due to him getting so dehydrated that electrolytes were off?), but we checked with Dr. Sherry Rogers' book "Is Your Cardiologist Killing You?" and she said you can cure Afib with magnesium (I think she said 600 mg 2x/day)--I told him all about Dr. Rogers and what she said.

also when I arrived, food sitting there since 6:10 but father not able to eat it because nobody came to adjust his position in the bed so he could reach the tray. I arrived at 7pm, then the bitchy white nurses came in and adjusted his bed. My father said, they only came in because they saw you were here and wanted to make it look good. Finally, at end of visit, we got a nice black tech, very friendly, so I told him everything that was going on. How they didn't give him any water for 2 days and he got dehydrated, was feeling spatially disoriented on Wed night b/c of dehydration, which went away with a drink of water. Asked him to please make sure nobody takes water away and keep it within his reach on the tray. also told him How father was here for 3 days , nobody walked him around, so he's getting weaker, and they are saying now he's too weak to leave (using weakness against him). Said at home, he was not bed ridden and was up and about despite broken shoulder. Marquis (the guy) totally got it, said he would get him up and help him walk and take him to toilet (nobody even took him to the freaking toilet for 3 days!!). later, got call from nurse Lisa Kruger, who worked with Marquis to get him up, standing and on toilet. She said he was unsteady and that they got him in a chair so he could sit for an hour. So finally thought we were making progress (nurse also said she would put in order for physical therapy). Also noticed when I was there, "heparin" on the screen, and I was to self - WTF is that about? (prior to hospital, he was only on thyroid meds and gabapentin at first for neuropathy, which went away, so then only for sleep) So when I left, I thought we were on the right track. (again, as of yesterday, he wanted to get out of there, and was telling us to get prescription for oxygen).

Friday morning-

Mom just talked with him, now all of the sudden he is telling us they have time to "squeeze him in" for a procedure (I guess having to do with the valve), which makes no sense to have this now when his condition has deteriorated for 3 days of being there (he would have a better chance of surviving if it was done when he was in the condition he was in prior to the hospitalization).

Now, my father is seemingly resigned to fate (yet, yesterday, Wed, Tues, he wanted OUT--yesterday, Thurs morning he told me he told them "no more f'ing tests, I want to go home, I'm done with this crap, I'm not having any tests so get me my breakfast." He just told my mother (fri am) he realizes he's weaker now than few years ago (he did not feel that way prior to hospital), he's going to take his chances with the procedure (aware he might not make it,willing to take chances), so he can spend his last years helping his family (IMO- sounds like they were manipulating him, working this angle, "hey if you have this procedure, you will be healthier and can help your wife, etc." -- meanwhile, all last year, he was healthy enough to manage the renovation of an inherited house in CT, and have a friend drive him up there almost every weekend, so he could work on it--at 83 he was actually doing work on a house). Our worry is that they are going to kill him, especially since he's in dramatically worse shape than he was in prior to going to the hospital.

My mother is extremely upset that he has made this decision on his own without talking with her. agreement prior to hospital was that they would NEVER make any major decision without first consulting each other. My mother was upset that nobody (doctor) called to inform her of any of this. This feels like they browbeat an old man into doing what they want.

Also now worried about my mother--stress of this is killing her (82 y. o) her BP was through the roof last night.

Also, we went through all of this in 2019--they wanted to do procedure for valve. Had him at hospital in PHilly. After 4 days of being there (tons of tests to make $$$$ and rack up the bill) my father got sick of it and wanted to come home. He was going to do Linus pauling protocol, diet, high dose K2 based on info I got online and here. Then for first few weeks when home, he was into it. But later started not doing protocol, lost motivation because he felt fine. My mother had to constantly nag and it caused fights. I also nagged and got into fights.

So that's that. I was feeling hopeful last night that we could get him out of this, if we continued to get nutrients into him and get him back to pre-hospitalization status and then if we could get him home and get him to finally follow nutrient and diet protocols. Now not feeling so hopeful and thinking they are going to kill him today while making some $$$$ for themselves.


Also, there are no words for the horrible "care" he's gotten-- you could probably get better care in a 3rd world country.
I’m getting flashbacks reading your tale of woe. His poor treatment and exploitation are typical. Your supplements will help but are incomplete. He needs comprehensive nutrition. He will deteriorate as long as he is in the hospital environment.

Just me thinking out loud: if that was my dad I would check him out of the hospital AMA. I can do more for him at home:
Youngevity Brain and Heart pack
lots of fresh eggs and vegetable smoothies supplemented with minerals
lots of conversation and mental stimulation
He’d be a new man in a few weeks
83 is young
It would be lots of work at first but you will save his life
BTW heparin is the Afib. Vitamin E plus garlic will thin the blood and are much safer (and cheaper) than heparin.

[Amanda]

I’m getting flashbacks reading your tale of woe. His poor treatment and exploitation are typical. Your supplements will help but are incomplete. He needs comprehensive nutrition. He will deteriorate as long as he is in the hospital environment.

Just me thinking out loud: if that was my dad I would check him out of the hospital AMA. I can do more for him at home:
Youngevity Brain and Heart pack
lots of fresh eggs and vegetable smoothies supplemented with minerals
lots of conversation and mental stimulation
He’d be a new man in a few weeks
83 is young
It would be lots of work at first but you will save his life
BTW heparin is the Afib. Vitamin E plus garlic will thin the blood and are much safer (and cheaper) than heparin.


Thanks so much for all of this. Will give this info to my mother. My mother has E (Carlson tocomin Suprabio and Carlson Gamma E Gems) so maybe we can get to him in meantime--oh crap, my mother says sometimes one of those Es (maybe E gamma Gems) she does not take b/c gives her nosebleed. So maybe we should not give him E while on heparin rat poison.

Just got call from father, says cardiologist will try to set up meeting with my mother (and maybe my father). Perhaps we can delay what they are pushing for to give time to get him home and build him back up.


Mother called hospital earlier and nurse said he was not scheduled to go anywhere.

Just now, mother talked with father, he said no breakfast or lunch. Mother called nurse about food situation, and now nurse says he's scheduled for procedure at other hospital and there's no talk of meeting with cardiologist, that my father just mentioned. Mother said she has NOT agreed to this, believes my father is being bullied and does not understand what is going on, since he is expecting his food. Mother said please do not take him yet. Nurse hung up on her.

We are still working on this and fighting. Planning to go to hospital, give more supplements, healthy food. Will give my father your info too.

[Cebu_4_2]

What a nightmare.

[Amanda]

What a nightmare.

Yup. We'd totally bust him out of there except for the oxygen problem.

We were ready to go get him on Tues (no word of oxygen problem at that point), but then he got bullied into staying.

[midnight rambler]

Yup. We'd totally bust him out of there except for the oxygen problem.

We were ready to go get him on Tues (no word of oxygen problem at that point), but then he got bullied into staying.

The love of money is the root of all evil.

[osoab]

Amanda, you or your mother need medical power of attorney now.

Get an attorney and start throwing paperwork at them asap.

I hope your father and mother make it through this terrible ordeal.

[Bigjon]

For myself when I'm feeling run down with low energy and in need of oxygen a dose of about 150,000 IU's of D3, coupled with about 500 micrograms of K2, will be instant relief. Takes about half an hour and I feel back to normal.

https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/

One study on vitamin D used as high as 540,000 units (https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/cc10120) for severe lung disease.[1] (https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/#_edn1)

High dose vitamin D administration in ventilated intensive care unit patients has also been studied using 50,000 IU vitamin D3 or 100,000 IU vitamin D3 daily for 5 consecutive days (total vitamin D3 dose = 250,000 IU or 500,000 IU, respectively) without an cause for alarm (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/).[2] (https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/#_edn2)

One company in the USA makes tablets that are 50,000 (http://www.amazon.com/Bio-Tech-D3-50-000-100-caps/dp/B000A0F2B2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1397584725&sr=8-1&keywords=bio-tech+d3-50+50000+iu+100+caps) and recommended as high as four a day (200,000 units for four days) for at risk patients. Now because of the FDA oppression they will not make such recommendations.

Again from the Mayo Clinic: Vitamin D toxicity, characterized by hypercalcemia, hyperphosphatemia, and suppression of parathyroid hormone, is usually observed when intakes are excessively high, in the range of more than 50,000 to 1 million IU of vitamin D per day (https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(18)30313-6/fulltext) and are maintained long-term for several months to years. Meaning a cancer patient, who is desperately trying to reverse their spreading cancer, could safely take 500,000 units a day for first week, 400,000 units for second week, 300,000 units for third week and 50,000 units a day from there after without even touching the toxicity of any form of chemotherapy.

When using a full protocol the need for ultra high dosages of Vitamin D for long extended periods of time would be reduced because other substances with similarly low toxicities would also be used at very high dosages. Thus one can easily imagine safe intakes of 100,000 to 200,000 units a day for two to three weeks without need for reduction.

Taking one 50,000 IU capsule of Vitamin D3 every two weeks will result in 80% of adults bringing their blood levels to above 40 nanograms/ millliliter, an optimal level for good health. A 50,000 IU capsule is the equivalent of amount of vitamin D from sunbathing for 3 days in a sunny climate. The skin produces approximately 10,000 IU vitamin D in response to 20–30 minutes of full body summer sun exposure—50 times more than the US government’s recommendation of 200 IU per day.


https://riordanclinic.org/2013/10/vitamins-d3-and-k2-the-dynamic-duo/ (https://riordanclinic.org/2013/10/vitamins-d3-and-k2-the-dynamic-duo/)


D3:K2—The Birth of a Superhero Combo

Speaking of teamwork, vitamin D3’s natural partner is vitamin K2. The genius of this combo begins with proper respect for D3’s function of powerfully enhancing calcium absorption. Recent research has shown that excessive calcium intake alone can be harmful to the body. The additional calcium must be correctly utilized or it can show up in the wrong places and cause disease.

This is how very high doses of cholecalciferol kills rodents: excessive calcium uptake, deposition, and interference with normal cardiac and renal function. By conscientiously using vitamin K2 in conjunction with D3, this issue of “metastatic calcium” is thoroughly avoided.

These are excerpts, there is more detail

As we explore the healing power of higher doses of vitamin D3 at the Riordan Clinic, we have found it prudent to partner the safety and effectiveness of this dynamic duo. For every 5,000–10,000 units of D3 being recommended and tested for, we are recommending 100 mcg of K2 mk7 to be sure and prevent the inappropriate calcification that higher doses of D3 alone could cause.

[Cebu_4_2]

Wow forgot about K2. Thanks man.

[Amanda]

Amanda, you or your mother need medical power of attorney now.

Get an attorney and start throwing paperwork at them asap.

I hope your father and mother make it through this terrible ordeal.


Thanks. I believe my mother has power of attorney, but I don't know if she has invoked that (not sure how that works)--I'll remind her of that.

Yes, I'll talk with her about an attorney.

Tonight my father said to me "this place makes death look attractive"--And I promise you, he was NOT in anyway thinking about death prior to getting to that hell-hole death factory.

So, we have a lot of work to do. We are stuck because of this oxygen issue. Our primary care doctor has not returned the call (when this is pretty much an urgent situation). She never got back to us, so we are assuming that she talked with the doctors at the hospital and they are probably telling her he's in dire straits and will die if he leaves the hospital (again, he was NOT like this prior to going there). Before he broke his shoulder, he was totally able-bodied, out and about, doing his errands, helping my mother with grocery shopping. He always parked far away because he didn't want people to dent his car, so he had no issues with walking or getting short of breath- he just had a cane for balance.

[Amanda]

For myself when I'm feeling run down with low energy and in need of oxygen a dose of about 150,000 IU's of D3, coupled with about 500 micrograms of K2, will be instant relief. Takes about half an hour and I feel back to normal.

https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/

One study on vitamin D used as high as 540,000 units (https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/cc10120) for severe lung disease.[1] (https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/#_edn1)

High dose vitamin D administration in ventilated intensive care unit patients has also been studied using 50,000 IU vitamin D3 or 100,000 IU vitamin D3 daily for 5 consecutive days (total vitamin D3 dose = 250,000 IU or 500,000 IU, respectively) without an cause for alarm (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4939707/).[2] (https://drsircus.com/cancer/vitamin-d-deficiency-as-a-cause-of-diseases-safe-high-dose-vitamin-d-treatments/#_edn2)

One company in the USA makes tablets that are 50,000 (http://www.amazon.com/Bio-Tech-D3-50-000-100-caps/dp/B000A0F2B2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1397584725&sr=8-1&keywords=bio-tech+d3-50+50000+iu+100+caps) and recommended as high as four a day (200,000 units for four days) for at risk patients. Now because of the FDA oppression they will not make such recommendations.

Again from the Mayo Clinic: Vitamin D toxicity, characterized by hypercalcemia, hyperphosphatemia, and suppression of parathyroid hormone, is usually observed when intakes are excessively high, in the range of more than 50,000 to 1 million IU of vitamin D per day (https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(18)30313-6/fulltext) and are maintained long-term for several months to years. Meaning a cancer patient, who is desperately trying to reverse their spreading cancer, could safely take 500,000 units a day for first week, 400,000 units for second week, 300,000 units for third week and 50,000 units a day from there after without even touching the toxicity of any form of chemotherapy.

When using a full protocol the need for ultra high dosages of Vitamin D for long extended periods of time would be reduced because other substances with similarly low toxicities would also be used at very high dosages. Thus one can easily imagine safe intakes of 100,000 to 200,000 units a day for two to three weeks without need for reduction.

Taking one 50,000 IU capsule of Vitamin D3 every two weeks will result in 80% of adults bringing their blood levels to above 40 nanograms/ millliliter, an optimal level for good health. A 50,000 IU capsule is the equivalent of amount of vitamin D from sunbathing for 3 days in a sunny climate. The skin produces approximately 10,000 IU vitamin D in response to 20–30 minutes of full body summer sun exposure—50 times more than the US government’s recommendation of 200 IU per day.


https://riordanclinic.org/2013/10/vitamins-d3-and-k2-the-dynamic-duo/ (https://riordanclinic.org/2013/10/vitamins-d3-and-k2-the-dynamic-duo/)


D3:K2—The Birth of a Superhero Combo

Speaking of teamwork, vitamin D3’s natural partner is vitamin K2. The genius of this combo begins with proper respect for D3’s function of powerfully enhancing calcium absorption. Recent research has shown that excessive calcium intake alone can be harmful to the body. The additional calcium must be correctly utilized or it can show up in the wrong places and cause disease.

This is how very high doses of cholecalciferol kills rodents: excessive calcium uptake, deposition, and interference with normal cardiac and renal function. By conscientiously using vitamin K2 in conjunction with D3, this issue of “metastatic calcium” is thoroughly avoided.

These are excerpts, there is more detail

As we explore the healing power of higher doses of vitamin D3 at the Riordan Clinic, we have found it prudent to partner the safety and effectiveness of this dynamic duo. For every 5,000–10,000 units of D3 being recommended and tested for, we are recommending 100 mcg of K2 mk7 to be sure and prevent the inappropriate calcification that higher doses of D3 alone could cause.




Thanks for this - very interesting!

[osoab]

Thanks. I believe my mother has power of attorney, but I don't know if she has invoked that (not sure how that works)--I'll remind her of that.

Yes, I'll talk with her about an attorney.

Tonight my father said to me "this place makes death look attractive"--And I promise you, he was NOT in anyway thinking about death prior to getting to that hell-hole death factory.

So, we have a lot of work to do. We are stuck because of this oxygen issue. Our primary care doctor has not returned the call (when this is pretty much an urgent situation). She never got back to us, so we are assuming that she talked with the doctors at the hospital and they are probably telling her he's in dire straits and will die if he leaves the hospital (again, he was NOT like this prior to going there). Before he broke his shoulder, he was totally able-bodied, out and about, doing his errands, helping my mother with grocery shopping. He always parked far away because he didn't want people to dent his car, so he had no issues with walking or getting short of breath- he just had a cane for balance.

You need to act fast. I would expect them to use the psych excuse if he is talking death.

[Amanda]

forgot to add-

was there tonight, and all over that hospital are signs "Heroes work here" - so apparently they believe their own BS

I've never seen such horrible care. He pushes the nurse button, and nobody comes, so he has to call me or my mom and then we call the nurses station.
When they bring his food, he needs them to readjust him in the bed, so he's up and can reach the tray. Yet each time, they never do this, so the food just sits there. And by the time they get around to doing this one minute task, the food is cold and he doesn't want to eat it. So he hasn't been eating much, which is probably contributing to him getting weaker. So far we've been bringing bananas, grapes and blueberries, just to get some nutrition in there. We also have those Naked Juices, which seem to have lots of calories. Maybe we'll get those Boost drinks, which also have calories.

Tomorrow, there is supposed to be a patient advocate/social worker on site, so my mother is going to try to talk with her.

Not sure where we go from here. My father is so tired of fighting these people that it at times seems like he's giving in to their will (tonight he said "this place makes death look attractive"). And we feel trapped, like we are being held hostage, since nobody will give him a prescription for oxygen and they are telling us that he will die without it (which scares my mother). But we don't even know if we can trust them because they lied about the dehydration issue on Wed night (when he was so dehydrated because nobody gave him any water for 2 days and started getting a weird sensation of his body being disoriented in space). The nurse lied and said that it was because he took off his oxygen. But that's simply NOT true, I was on the phone with him as this was happening and was an ear witness to him saying "wow, one glass of water and now everything is oriented right again." It was dehydration, but these lying nurses take no responsibility for their negligence.

And we don't even get what caused him to suddenly need oxygen. He was fine until he got there, so what did they do to him?

And nobody even explained the risks and possible complications of this procedure to him and my mother. I think that if he gets it done he might need to be on rat poison Heparin for the rest of his life, which my father doesn't know about. IMO, they are steam-rolling over him and taking advantage of an elderly person.

If it wasn't for the oxygen, we would just get him out of there. We got my mother out of the hospital AMA when they wanted to take her gallbladder and she's fine now (5 years ago), yet they tried to scare her, make her think she was going to die if she didn't get her inflamed gall bladder removed.

Maybe my father just has to say that he wants to go home and die with his wife and family nearby.

Maybe we need to probe this need for oxygen further and test it out. I think my father might have said to me tonight that when he pulls the oxygen out, he feels fine. I didn't pursue it because I was busy getting all the supplements in. But maybe we need to have him take out the oxygen for a half hour and see what happens. Maybe they are exaggerating about how he will die without it. I honestly don't know anything about oxygen levels.

[midnight rambler]

I honestly don't know anything about oxygen levels.

Run down to your local pharmacy and get these two items -

https://www.cvs.com/shop/cvs-health-pulse-oximeter-prodid-814854

https://abbottnutrition.com/ensure-plus-nutrition-shake

Ensure Plus comes in a few flavors and will definitely get him some nutrition.

A pulse oximeter can be used by a 6 y.o., nothing to it, it simply lightly clamps on any finger (I'm sure they already have one on him if they're claiming low O2, that's typically how they measure someone's O2 level). It measures pulse rate and blood oxygen saturation level. If your dad is above 90 on his blood oxygen saturation level when off O2 I suggest you confront whomever is blocking his discharge with that info. Below 90 they can claim they are treating him, above 90 he's fine and doesn't need O2. Of course all the consumer grade pulse oximeters are made in China so there can be defective units among any brand/vendor while other units work just fine. Suggest you check it for consistency on you and your mom. I have 3-4 different ones I ordered via feebay, at least one of those is not consistent with the others.


What is a pulse oximeter?

A pulse oximeter is a handheld, clip-like electronic device designed to measure the oxygen level of your blood, and your heart rate. Although sometimes considered a heart rate monitor (https://www.cvs.com/shop/home-health-care/monitors/heart-rate-monitors), it is somewhat different.



How does a pulse oximeter work?

A pulse oximeter works by shining small beams of light into the skin and measuring the amount that passes through the blood. The sensor calculates the level of oxygen available since oxygenated and deoxygenated blood absorbs light to different degrees. The process is non-invasive and get you results quickly.



What does a pulse oximeter measure?

One of the many essential functions of blood is absorbing oxygen from the air breathed in through the lungs, and carrying it to cells via the blood vessels. A pulse oximeter measures the oxygen saturation levels in your blood. It is a way to check how well the heart is pumping oxygen throughout your body. It also measures your heart rate.



How to read a pulse oximeter?

To get the most accurate reading, follow the directions on the package closely. There are two numbers on the screen: The oxygen saturation percentage is above, and the heart rate shown below as beats-per-minute. A saturation level of 95-100% is considered normal for typical healthy individuals.



Are pulse oximeters accurate?


Oxygen level readings by a pulse oximeter are typically with a margin of 2% over or under what the number would be when measured by arterial gas saturation testing method. For example, if the reading is 93% on the pulse oximeter, the actual oxygen level might be somewhere between 91 to 95%. Keep your hands still during the measurement. Body motion or temperature can impact accuracy. Readings may be less accurate if a person is wearing nail polish or artificial nails, and places the sensor over the nail. Accuracy can also be affected by cold hands or poor circulation.

[Amanda]

Run down to your local pharmacy and get these two items -

https://abbottnutrition.com/ensure-plus-nutrition-shake

https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/walgreens-fingertip-pulse-oximeter/ID=prod6089451-product

Ensure Plus comes in a few flavors and will definitely get him some nutrition.

A pulse oximeter can be used by a 6 y.o., nothing to it, it simply lightly clamps on any finger (I'm sure they already have one on him if they're claiming low O2, that's how they're measuring his O2 level. If your dad is above 90 on the pulse oximeter when off O2 I suggest you confront whomever is blocking his discharge with that info. Below 90 they can claim they are treating him, above 90 he's fine and doesn't necessarily need O2.


Thank you so much!!! This is VERY HELPFUL! Will do this tomorrow.

[midnight rambler]

Thank you so much!!! This is VERY HELPFUL! Will do this tomorrow.

Check my edited post, changed the recommendation from Walgreens to a pulse oximeter at CVS plus added some info. Bad reviews for the Walgreens pulse oximeter.

I CANNOT believe they won't adjust his bed for him so he can eat.

[PatColo]

Wow forgot about K2. Thanks man.

apparently the vegie KALE has alot of vit K -- easy to remember eh? K for KALE

may have to go to whole foods or similar boutique supermarket for kale; safeway & similar don't seem to carry the more exotic vegies.

[Amanda]

Check my edited post, changed the recommendation from Walgreens to a pulse oximeter at CVS plus added some info.

I CANNOT believe they won't adjust his bed for him so he can eat.

Yes, on the first night I visited him at 7pm, he said food was there by 6:10 and person quickly drops it and leaves. Yet, within minutes of my arrival, those lazy bitchy nurses came in and adjusted him. My father said, they only did that because you were here. And they KNOW this is an issue he needs taken care of every single time he gets a meal. And I was there when they did it and it literally took ONE freaking minute.


I think all of this abusive treatment has demoralized him- they are disrespecting his dignity. There was apparently some issue with pee (not sure of the details, he told my mother), but he needed someone to help clean something up and he had to wait and wait. He had to call my mother, who then called them. Yet the nurses station is right there outside his door. And I think once yesterday he called for water and the nurse hung up on him. (I'm documenting all of this).

***
Again, prior to the hospital, he NEVER showed any signs of needing oxygen. He never got winded or short of breath. My mother said only once, when he was going back and forth from house to car loading it up with stuff, maybe 6-7 trips did he get a bit winded and needed to sit down. But that might be typical for anyone who is in their 80s. Now, suddenly, after just 2 days at the hospital, he suddenly needs oxygen forever? It makes no sense IMO.

[Amanda]

I suggested to my mother to call the insurance company and let them know what's going on. Not sure if they can help, but they are getting ripped off by all of this, so maybe they will be interested.

I think maybe he has good coverage, because my mother said last time he went through this valve drama was in 2019 at a Philadelphia hospital. Apparently, my parents didn't have to pay anything for that--insurance covered the whole thing. So perhaps that's what some of this is about??

****

late tonight, now my mom is worried that they already got him so weak, that he cannot be managed at home, as in too weak to stand up and get to the bathroom. She is wondering about getting him to rehab to get stronger from this hospital visit. She thinks now he would need 24 hour nurse care.

I think I also read in Dr. Rogers "Is Your Cardiologist Killing You?" that being low/deficient in potassium will cause weakness.

I honestly don't know how they could have destroyed his health in just 4 days. He was not weak before he left--he was up and about making his meals and getting stuff for himself. He had the elderly problem of having trouble getting up from the sofa and normally needed to use both arms to push off, but once he broke shoulder, then he needed assistance, But once he was up, he was fine walking around.

[Bigjon]

apparently the vegie KALE has alot of vit K -- easy to remember eh? K for KALE

may have to go to whole foods or similar boutique supermarket for kale; safeway & similar don't seem to carry the more exotic vegies.

vit K is a different animal from K2, K is more in the blood coagulation line while K2 keeps calcium out of the soft tissues and sends it to the bones.
Vit K is from leafy vegies like Kale, while K2 is a fermentation of soy tofu called natto and I believe fermented cheese.

[Tumbleweed]

I think I also read in Dr. Rogers "Is Your Cardiologist Killing You?" that being low/deficient in potassium will cause weakness.



Have they checked his potassium Level? When I was in the hospital after my heart operation they were checking my potassium level often and it got low. I was feeling pretty weak too. They gave me some juice that tasted terrible too bring the level up. I've read if it's too low or to high it can cause weakness.

When my dad passed my niece who's a registered nurse said his potassium level was low and she thought if it had been supplemented he may have been able to get up and going again. She works in hospice now. She wasn't a nurse though at the time my dad passed.

When my dad got weak he was moved in to the hospice program and we moved hm to my sisters home. I didn't know it at the time but my sister knew his potassium was low but was afraid of supplementing him with potassium. I suppose because of not know knowing how much to supplement and not do harm.

You've mentioned supplementing your dad with magnesium and I think that's a good thing. I have arrhythmias when I don't supplement magnesium. I don't seem to absorb it very well through my stomach with pills or powder but I do absorb it very well through my skin. I use magnesium oil and when I start having arrhythmias the magnesium oil rubbed in to my skin stops them right away.

[Amanda]

Have they checked his potassium Level? When I was in the hospital after my heart operation they were checking my potassium level often and it got low. I was feeling pretty weak too. They gave me some juice that tasted terrible too bring the level up. I've read if it's too low or to high it can cause weakness.

When my dad passed my niece who's a registered nurse said his potassium level was low and she thought if it had been supplemented he may have been able to get up and going again. She works in hospice now. She wasn't a nurse though at the time my dad passed.

When my dad got weak he was moved in to the hospice program and we moved hm to my sisters home. I didn't know it at the time but my sister knew his potassium was low but was afraid of supplementing him with potassium. I suppose because of not know knowing how much to supplement and not do harm.

You've mentioned supplementing your dad with magnesium and I think that's a good thing. I have arrhythmias when I don't supplement magnesium. I don't seem to absorb it very well through my stomach with pills or powder but I do absorb it very well through my skin. I use magnesium oil and when I start having arrhythmias the magnesium oil rubbed in to my skin stops them right away.


Thanks for this. Nope, they definitely have NOT checked his potassium level or magnesium level. We will ask about getting this done. I will look into getting a potassium supplement today. We have been bringing him bananas everyday. I have magnesium spray and will bring that over there today.

Is Afib the same as arrhythmia?

This is such a freaking nightmare. We're totally exhausted. I've only gotten a few hours of sleep each night b/c I'm so wired and worried. I don't want to take anything for sleep b/c I'm afraid I will miss a call or something.
We have been working at this all week. When we are not there, then we are on the phone with him. My mother spends so much time calling the nurses station to get them to do their job.

***

Just found that I have potassium chloride powder, so I guess I can give that to him in water (1/8 tsp =365 mg)

[Tumbleweed]

Is Afib the same as arrhythmia?



Magnesium is used in the treatment of both.

[Tumbleweed]

Is Afib the same as arrhythmia?



Magnesium is used in the treatment of both.

I'll leave a link to a search that may help you with more information.

Magnesium treatment for arryhthmias and afib (https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=Magnesium+treatment+for+arryhthmias+and+afib&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)

a quote from the search and link.


Because of its unique and diverse electrophysiological actions, intravenous magnesiumhas been reported to be useful in preventing atrial fibrillation and ventricular arrhythmias after cardiac and thoracic surgery; in reducing the ventricular response in acute onset atrial fibrillation, including for patients with ...

I just stopped by my house and need to get back to work. Hope this helps. You're doing a good job taking care of your father and he needs you and your mother to be advocates for him. My family did that for both of my parents when they were in the hospital. We tried to have a family member with them around the clock to watch out for them.

[Amanda]

Magnesium is used in the treatment of both.

I'll leave a link to a search that may help you with more information.

Magnesium treatment for arryhthmias and afib (https://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=Magnesium+treatment+for+arryhthmias+and+afib&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8)

a quote from the search and link.



I just stopped by my house and need to get back to work. Hope this helps. You're doing a good job taking care of your father and he needs you and your mother to be advocates for him. My family did that for both of my parents when they were in the hospital. We tried to have family member with them around the clock to watch out for them.


Thanks so much for all of this!

Just heard from my father 11am, he talked with someone who told him the name of the doctor who would be discharging him (so, I guess that's a good sign, though we don't know when). He talked with another doctor from the local cardiology group (I guess they work with the hospital) who told him that he would be discharged with oxygen. So, this is good news, but why were we told all last week that he would NOT get oxygen??? Was that part of the medical kidnapping/blackmail?

I think my mother is going to have to get a hospital bed and set it up in their living room.

[JDRock]

Wow, its as if the entire medical establishment is one giant cult! Kudos for getting him the h@ll outta there, hes lucky to have you watching out for him.

[Amanda]

Wow, its as if the entire medical establishment is one giant cult! Kudos for getting him the h@ll outta there, hes lucky to have you watching out for him.

Yes, for sure- medical establishment = medical mafia, brainwashed death cult. Yes, anyone who goes to the hospital must have someone looking out for them--and that's where things went wrong for us. Because they called him a "suspected covid case" despite the NEGATIVE covid test, they put him in isolation, so we could not visit or monitor what was happening. My mother is really small and frail but she did a great job standing up to them.

He's not out of there yet. So far we only have a verbal agreement to discharge, giving him oxygen, and wheelchair out...I'll feel relief when he's really out of there.

***

Overall update-

Fri night- he seemed weaker than Thurs night, more hopeless feeling, like he'd never get out of there. Gave him same supplements as before (mag, coq10, d-ribose, plus added Acetyl L Carnitine 100mg)

Sat am-- he woke up with a lot of energy (so maybe Carnitine helped?), was totally taking charge, making calls, contacting doctor to get him out, a social worker with "patient experience" contacted him and he blasted her about the crappy, negligent care

- later he gets told that certain doctor will discharge him (not know when) and they will give oxygen and wheel-chair. Not sure of why sudden turn-around (was it b/c he blasted them?). But by dragging it out to Sat, they get 2 more billable days of him being in the hospital--we couldn't get him out today b/c we still did NOT have the prescription for oxygen.

- later another doctor McDowell (nice lady) tries to help my mother with planning, and tells her his oxygen saturation has improved and they they were reducing how much he needed (again, we still have NO explanation for why he suddenly needed oxygen when he was never even short of breath).

- my mom visited him in afternoon, helped him shave, she said it took a while and he was glad when he could get the oxygen back

- I visited in pm to give more supplements and he had the oxygen off the whole time and was totally fine

****

just thinking out loud here-

So, I'm still trying to figure out why he suddenly needed oxygen by Tues night when he's NEVER had any problems with breathing and I'm seriously starting to wonder if it was triggered by him getting severely dehydrated from the Lasix and NOT drinking any water. He went to the hospital on Mon night 9pm b/c he got dizzy and sort of slid off a chair to the floor and was out of it for a bit, but then he was totally fine, but still wanted to go to the hospital b/c of the swollen legs and infection. (so maybe he was already a little dehydrated at home)

Mon night at Hosp- they gave him IV antibiotics, but was on empty stomach (he did not have dinner yet) and ended up throwing up (so maybe that added to dehydration?)

Tues- (we are assuming that he had no water on Tues b/c nobody gave him water on Wed and b/c of what happened later that night)- Tues night, we got call from nurse asking if he had problems with anxiety (something like that), and I said that I knew he was anxious about being in the covid isolation b/c he felt nobody was checking on him and he could die and nobody would know. She said, "no, I'm talking about full-blown nervous breakdown" (!?!?!?!?!) I was shocked and asked to talk with him, but didn't really get a sense from him of what was going on. And Tues night was when we were told he needed oxygen (we were shocked). Also earlier Tues afternoon, his mouth sounded dry based on how he was talking, but I didn't pursue b/c I was focused on trying to get him out.

wed- he had coffee in am and nothing else until small amt of tea in evening (our primary care receptionist said he needed to have at least 5 glasses of water a day while on Lasix). Wed night, he had horrible sensation of his body being 90 degrees off (wall ahead felt like floor and ceiling felt like wall), intellectually he knew something was very wrong and he was freaking out about it. After the nurse was of no help (she didn't try to figure it out and just wrote it off as "he's an older patient and lots of them get into a state of delirium from being in the hospital"), we found out he didn't have any water all day and got him water (my father was calling out "help me, help me, please I need some water" they ignored him and my mother had to call the nurses station to get him water. As soon as he finished the glass of water, the 90degree spatial disorientation symptom went away. So, we're convinced that that symptom was b/c he was severely dehydrated because nobody was making sure he was drinking water.

So, he needed oxygen by Tues night, and we were also told his BP was very low. He's never had a problem w/his BP -it's ALWAYS been in normal range, but on lower side.

I'm seriously starting to wonder if the severe dehydration triggered his need for oxygen.

I did a search and found this:

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/dehydration/symptoms-causes/syc-20354086


Complications

Dehydration can lead to serious complications, including:



Low blood volume shock (hypovolemic shock). This is one of the most serious, and sometimes life-threatening, complications of dehydration. It occurs when low blood volume causes a drop in blood pressure and a drop in the amount of oxygen in your body.



So, not sure if I'm reading that right, but sounds like if you get severely dehydrated, you could end up with low blood volume (we don't know if that happened) you could end up with a drop in BP (which is what happened) and a drop in amt of oxygen (which is also what happened).

Also, Wed night is when he had that afib, which has never happened before, and I also wonder if it had something to do with the dehydration.

So, right now, we're just constantly trying to get him to drink tons of water.

[ImaCannin]

Are the hospitals still getting paid 30,000.00 for each Covid death.?

[midnight rambler]

Are the hospitals still getting paid 30,000.00 for each Covid death.?

IIRC the schedule was/is $13k if put on a vent and $39k if they attribute a death to CONjob1984, which would be $52k each if they killed 'em with a vent.

[monty]

Are the hospitals still getting paid 30,000.00 for each Covid death.?

I was just wondering that myself. That would explain the reluctance to discharge. What a nightmare to subjected to.

[PatColo]

IIRC the schedule was/is $13k if put on a vent and $39k if they attribute a death to CONjob1984, which would be $52k each if they killed 'em with a vent.

I recall the same $13K / $39K numbers, but believe it (was?) one or the other, not a combined $52K.

sick & wrong any way you cut it, based on the outcome of the "94% false-positive" PCR test...^^^

[Amanda]

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't stand these people!!!!

I'm so freaking tired of this nightmare.

My mother and I are pretty much convinced that the sudden need for oxygen and the low BP is because of the dehydration (not getting enough water while on lasix).

His entire life, his BP was ALWAYS:

110-120
__________

70-80


Now suddenly, by the 2nd night in hospital hell hole, he has low BP (97/51 <---that was latest reading tonight, but apparently was lower than that earlier in the week when everything suddenly went wrong)

And he NEVER had breathing problems, no huffing/puffing, always parked far from stores and walked in, no shortness of breath and no need for oxygen.

But by 2nd night with them (they gave him NO water while on Lasix; plus he admits at home he was not drinking as much b/c of swollen legs and thought it was counter-intuitive to drink water), he suddenly has very low blood pressure and needs oxygen.

****

So, I was there tonight and he was basically choking on his tea b/c of his position in the bed (on-going problem-- he needs them to lower the bed, pull the sheet and his body, so head is closer to top of bed, then pop the bed back up, so he is seated more upright). I told the nurse, nobody came, so I couldn't really do all my supplements b/c I didn't want him choking on the pills I was sneaking in,


Then, nurse comes in and orients another nurse to my father's condition. There is NO acknowledgement that he NEVER had breathing problems/needed oxygen or had low BP until he got there. They are now saying he is in "respiratory failure" (I guess b/c of need for oxygen) (again, I'm convinced it's b/c of the dehydration w/Lasix and we are struggling to get him to drink more). He also now has "congestive heart failure" label and are telling him that if he doesn't have the procedure (valve, not sure name of actual procedure) he will need palliative care, which makes no sense--he didn't look like he was freaking dying until he got under their care. Also now as the Afib label (never had that before he got there, probably magnesium depleted from lasix and dehydration). He was maybe going to have the valve done in 2019 but the hospital dragged it out (tests, tests, tests to extend the stay and rack up the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$) and after 4 days, my father was sick of it and wanted to go home. He never rescheduled because he felt FINE (no chest pain, nothing). The only procedure he wanted to get done was his eyes for cataracts.

Also, no mention of dehydration on his chart or that he had those 2 episodes of psychological distress (tues and Wed night), with Wed night's bizarre symptom being alleviated by drinking a glass of water. (also, ever since he got out of the BS isolation for the "suspected covid case" BS, we have been pushing the water and he's had calm nights (no psychologist distress) ever since.

Then the nurse says "he's been eating well"--Well that's total BS!!! He hasn't been eating b/c they wait about an hour before they adjust his bed so he's upright, so his food is then cold and he doesn't eat. So, I corrected the nurse (she did NOT like that) and said we've been bringing in Boosts and fruit/bananas b/c he's not eating his food.

Also, the nurse said she wants him to use his own muscles to shimmy himself up in the bed, but the problem is that he has a broken left shoulder which is still not fully healed, so only one good arm to push off with.

Nurse was pushing the procedure "why don't you want to have it done now?" These people truly do NOT get that he was fine until he got there (other than, yeah, there's a valve issue, and artery clogging, for which he was supposed to be doing high dose K2 and Linus Pauling protocol). He was NOT weak and bed-ridden with low BP and needing oxygen until he got under their "care"'

SO, that's that- a never ending hell show.

Now supposedly, he's going to get out tomorrow (I'll believe it when it happens--I don't trust these people, they are a bunch of liars)


On positive note, my mother talked with a doctor who is the patient advocate, and she seemed to understand when my mother said that they wanted to get him home and get his strength back before he had any kind of procedure.

Also, my mother is thinking about setting up a consult with Dr. Rogers ("Is Your Cardiologist Killing You" book), to see if she can help them get out of this mess.

[EE_]

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't stand these people!!!!

I'm so freaking tired of this nightmare.

My mother and I are pretty much convinced that the sudden need for oxygen and the low BP is because of the dehydration (not getting enough water while on lasix).

His entire life, his BP was ALWAY:

110-120
__________

70-80


Now suddenly, by the 2nd night in hospital hell hole, he has low BP (97/51 <---that was latest reading tonight, but apparently was lower than that earlier in the week when everything suddenly went wrong)

And he NEVER had breathing problems, no huffing/puffing, always parked far from stores and walked in, no shortness of breath and no need for oxygen.

But by 2nd night with them (they gave him NO water while on Lasix; plus he admits at home he was not drinking as much b/c of swollen legs and thought it was counter-intuitive to drink water), he suddenly has very low blood pressure and needs oxygen.

****

So, I was there tonight and he was basically choking on his tea b/c of his position in the bed (on-going problem-- he needs them to lower the bed, pull the sheet and his body, so head is closer to top of bed, then pop the bed back up, so he is seated more upright). I told the nurse, nobody came, so I couldn't really do all my supplements b/c I didn't want him choking on the pills I was sneaking in,


Then, nurse comes in and orients another nurse to my father's condition. There is NO acknowledgement that he NEVER had breathing problems/needed oxygen or had low BP until he got there. They are now saying he is in "respiratory failure" (I guess b/c of need for oxygen) (again, I'm convinced it's b/c of the dehydration w/Lasix and we are struggling to get him to drink more). He also now has "congestive heart failure" label and are telling him that if he doesn't have the procedure (valve, not sure name of actual procedure) he will need palliative care, which makes no sense--he didn't look like he was freaking dying until he got under their care. Also now as the Afib label (never had that before he got there, probably magnesium depleted from lasix and dehydration). He was maybe going to have the valve done in 2019 but the hospital dragged it out (tests, tests, tests to extend the stay and rack up the $$$$$$$$$$$$$$) and after 4 days, my father was sick of it and wanted to go home. He never rescheduled because he felt FINE (no chest pain, nothing). The only procedure he wanted to get done was his eyes for cataracts.

Also, no mention of dehydration on his chart or that he had those 2 episodes of psychological distress (tues and Wed night), with Wed night's bizarre symptom being alleviated by drinking a glass of water. (also, ever since he got out of the BS isolation for the "suspected covid case" BS, we have been pushing the water and he's had calm nights (no psychologist distress) ever since.

Then the nurse says "he's been eating well"--Well that's total BS!!! He hasn't been eating b/c they wait about an hour before they adjust his bed so he's upright, so his food is then cold and he doesn't eat. So, I corrected the nurse (she did NOT like that) and said we've been bringing in Boosts and fruit/bananas b/c he's not eating his food.

Also, the nurse said she wants him to use his own muscles to shimmy himself up in the bed, but the problem is that he has a broken left shoulder which is still not fully healed, so only one good arm to push off with.

Nurse was pushing the procedure "why don't you want to have it done now?" These people truly do NOT get that he was fine until he got there (other than, yeah, there's a valve issue, and artery clogging, for which he was supposed to be doing high dose K2 and Linus Pauling protocol). He was NOT weak and bed-ridden with low BP and needing oxygen until he got under their "care"'

SO, that's that- a never ending hell show.

Now supposedly, he's going to get out tomorrow (I'll believe it when it happens--I don't trust these people, they are a bunch of liars)


On positive note, my mother talked with a doctor who is the patient advocate, and she seemed to understand when my mother said that they wanted to get him home and get his strength back before he had any kind of procedure.

Also, my mother is thinking about setting up a consult with Dr. Rogers ("Is Your Cardiologist Killing You" book), to see if she can help them get out of this mess.

Dad is lucky to have you and mom looking after him. Wishing for the best.

[Tumbleweed]

Amanda did they do any blood tests on your dad? When I had a checkup last summer they checked my blood for a lot of things and there was one where if someone has congestive heart failure it shows up in the blood. I don't remember what that was but further tests also showed no congestive heart failure even though I had swelling in my lower legs and feet.

[Amanda]

Amanda did they do any blood tests on your dad? When I had a checkup last summer they checked my blood for a lot of things and there was one where if someone has congestive heart failure it shows up in the blood. I don't remember what that was but further tests also showed no congestive heart failure even though I had swelling in my lower legs and feet.

I honestly don't know at this point. I'll have my mother ask about that. She's going to have to get all of these records if she ends up setting up a consult with Dr. Rogers.

In Dr. Rogers "Is your Cardiologist Killing you book?" she mentions lots of factors that play a role in the "congestive heart failure" and one thing she mentioned as a piece of the problem was a hidden thiamine deficiency which could lead to fluid retention. She says this is often the case with someone who has candida in the gut from a high sugar diet (definitely my father- sugar addict), so we are wondering if that might be a piece of the problem. And with the swelling of the legs, it happened once before (maybe 4 years ago) and back then they said it was from an infection (turned out to be cellulitis). Apparently, once you get cellulitis once, you are vulnerable to getting it again. I told him this and that he needed to take extra anti-microbials (daily, like colloidal silver or something) so it wouldn't come back (of course, he did not listen). So, we're also confused by the swelling legs issue b/c they seem to be saying it's due to CHF, but the primary care doc said it was because of infection.(and they got rid of the swelling by kiling the infection. (he's never had swollen legs without also having infection). I know my paternal grandmother had leg swelling in her elderly years, but she never had an infection, so it was for the other reason.

honestly, until this recent hell show at the hospital, we thought he was doing pretty well for a 83 y.o, especially all last year, going up to work every weekend on house in CT with his friend. That was a lot of work and he was totally fine, constantly up and down stairs there, basement to attic and never had any issues.

***
was just over at amazon and there are a bunch of books by people who have healed themselves from CFS and Afib, so it's obviously possible. Not going to buy those books at this point, will just stick w/Dr. Rogers's book

[Amanda]

. I didn't know it at the time but my sister knew his potassium was low but was afraid of supplementing him with potassium. I suppose because of not know knowing how much to supplement and not do harm.



Yeah, there seems to be something weird about supplementing with potassium. I remember watching some Gerson protocol videos (cancer treatment) and apparently potassium is something in their protocol, and I recall her telling people that they don't have to be afraid of supplementing with potassium (like people seemed to have the idea that it could cause a heart attack).

We want to get this checked before he leaves the hospital, but I don't think that's going to happen. They probably wouldn't agree to it, so something we would need to do on our own. I think Dr. Berg (chiropractor who pushing intermittent and keto) says almost everyone is deficient in potassium and he recommends 9 or so cups of green vegetables. So maybe my mother could just do that, plus bananas and sweet potatoes to get potassium up.

[Tumbleweed]

Yeah, there seems to be something weird about supplementing with potassium. I remember watching some Gerson protocol videos (cancer treatment) and apparently potassium is something in their protocol, and I recall her telling people that they don't have to be afraid of supplementing with potassium (like people seemed to have the idea that it could cause a heart attack).

We want to get this checked before he leaves the hospital, but I don't think that's going to happen. They probably wouldn't agree to it, so something we would need to do on our own. I think Dr. Berg (chiropractor who pushing intermittent and keto) says almost everyone is deficient in potassium and he recommends 9 or so cups of green vegetables. So maybe my mother could just do that, plus bananas and sweet potatoes to get potassium up.

There are home heath test kits for potassium levels but I don't know anything about them. In the summer time when I"m working and sweating a lot I supplement potassium along with using magnesium oil. Getting muscle cramps is one way of knowing I may be getting low on those two minerals.

I should probably look in to getting a home test for potassium myself. Fatigue and muscle weakness are signs of low potassium along with muscle cramps. When I supplement potassium it's usually with pills I've gotten from Sam's club.

Hard boiled eggs are a source of both protein and potassium. When I was trying to build my strength back after my heart operation I ate a lot of them. I ate cantaloupe along with the eggs and that's another source of potassium your dad might enjoy eating.

[Amanda]

There are home heath test kits for potassium levels but I don't know anything about them. In the summer time when I"m working and sweating a lot I supplement potassium along with using magnesium oil. Getting muscle cramps is one way of knowing I may be getting low on those two minerals.

I should probably look in to getting a home test for potassium myself. Fatigue and muscle weakness are signs of low potassium along with muscle cramps. When I supplement potassium it's usually with pills I've gotten from Sam's club.

Hard boiled eggs are a source of both protein and potassium. When I was trying to build my strength back after my heart operation I ate a lot of them. I ate cantaloupe along with the eggs and that's another source of potassium your dad might enjoy eating.


Getting a home testing kit would actually make things a lot easier-- I'll look for one. I have magnesium spray I can give him. Thanks for suggestions on hard boiled eggs and canteloupe--he likes both, so I'll have my mother add those.

[PatColo]

Oranges (incl OJ), strawberries both rich in potassium too. Maybe the whole berry family? would need to check on that.

look at an OJ carton, nutrition info (incl "serving size"), check the amount of potassium.

[Amanda]

So, last night he was still low BP 97/51, so I brought him carrot/celery sticks and salted them with Himalayan salt and now today, his BP is almost back to where it used to be 119/67.

Also, suddenly, today he no longer needs oxygen. apparently, he's at 97% with no oxygen walking around. Yet, last night, the nurse said he was in respiratory failure.


Outside the hospital there is a huge banner saying "Top ranked in quality and safety" for the people who didn't give an elderly man on Lasix water for 2 days and almost killed him.
Should be going home today

[mamboni]

So, last night he was still low BP 97/51, so I brought him carrot/celery sticks and salted them with Himalayan salt and now today, his BP is almost back to where it used to be 119/67.

Also, suddenly, today he no longer needs oxygen. apparently, he's at 97% with no oxygen walking around. Yet, last night, the nurse said he was in respiratory failure.


Outside the hospital there is a huge banner saying "Top ranked in quality and safety" for the people who didn't give an elderly man on Lasix water for 2 days and almost killed him.
Should be going home todayYour father might show some improvement with small dietary measures you are implementing. But this is fritting around the edges of health. Only a comprehensive change in diet with complete supplementation can achieve true and durable restoration of health and vigor. I say this because I notice that the elderly I have tried to help were consistently reluctant to make dramatic changes in their lifestyles. It seemed that they had lost a true desire to continue living. Or they were too convinced that some magic pill existed that could fix all of their problems and short of that other changes were not worth the effort. This is the tragic product of years of conditioning by big pharma and doctors in white coats. today's modern witch doctors who have bred all common sense knowledge of natural health and healthy living out of the last three generations. This is why I am reluctant to outline a plan to restore your father's health: I don't believe he would follow it.

My best friend's daughter has diabetes and her insulin requirements are sapping all of her finances and she is constantly fatigued and irritable. My friend is a believer in natural health and follows my advice but his daughter is thoroughly indoctrinated into the big pharma/witch doctor-in-white-coat paradigm. I suggested supplementing her diet with a few pennies worth of chromium and vanadium but she would rather spend hundreds of dollars on insulin.

His father suffers from several chronic diseases and is now on death's door. I outlined a plan for his health rehabilitation and my friend provided these supplements for his father. His father is too lazy or stubborn to use the supplements and would rather enjoy the attention of his exhausted wife and all of the sundry doctors who are more than happy to dispense pills and charge his insurance all whilst he slowly dies.

I am tired of dragging horses to water. My observation is that most of us have lost the basic instinct of self preservation and have bought into the lie that the health system and its minions have all the answers and will save us from ourselves.

[ziero0]

"
I am tired of dragging horses to water. My observation is that most of us have lost the basic instinct of self preservation and have bought into the lie that the health system and its minions have all the answers and will save us from ourselves."

'Being' is the ability to change. Conversely those with no being are locked into habits both good and bad. Whatever got Amanda's dad where he is sounds like a change is in order. My diagnosis would be to change ... food, lifestyle, medication, meditation, exercise, yoga, ...

[Amanda]

Your father might show some improvement with small dietary measures you are implementing. But this is fritting around the edges of health. Only a comprehensive change in diet with complete supplementation can achieve true and durable restoration of health and vigor. I say this because I notice that the elderly I have tried to help were consistently reluctant to make dramatic changes in their lifestyles. It seemed that they had lost a true desire to continue living. Or they were too convinced that some magic pill existed that could fix all of their problems and short of that other changes were not worth the effort. This is the tragic product of years of conditioning by big pharma and doctors in white coats. today's modern witch doctors who have bred all common sense knowledge of natural health and healthy living out of the last three generations. This is why I am reluctant to outline a plan to restore your father's health: I don't believe he would follow it.

My best friend's daughter has diabetes and her insulin requirements are sapping all of her finances and she is constantly fatigued and irritable. My friend is a believer in natural health and follows my advice but his daughter is thoroughly indoctrinated into the big pharma/witch doctor-in-white-coat paradigm. I suggested supplementing her diet with a few pennies worth of chromium and vanadium but she would rather spend hundreds of dollars on insulin.

His father suffers from several chronic diseases and is now on death's door. I outlined a plan for his health rehabilitation and my friend provided these supplements for his father. His father is too lazy or stubborn to use the supplements and would rather enjoy the attention of his exhausted wife and all of the sundry doctors who are more than happy to dispense pills and charge his insurance all whilst he slowly dies.

I am tired of dragging horses to water. My observation is that most of us have lost the basic instinct of self preservation and have bought into the lie that the health system and its minions have all the answers and will save us from ourselves.


Oh, yeah, you're not the only one who is tired dragging horses to water. We have a sense of what we need to do. We'll just have to see if he's finally willing to cooperate with my mother and me. He might be willing because this was such a horror show experience for him. He's out of there, so we'll just have to see how things go.

And in an earlier post, you recommended Youngevity Heart and Brain, so I'll pass that on to my parents.

we'll have him take the colloidal silver to make sure that infection doesn't come back
I think he's off the lasix now, but they have him on the rat poison Heparin for the Afib (never had until he got there) and onto Vit E (my mother has E Gems Elite and Tocomin Suprabio)and Garlic . We have Dr. Rogers book Is Your Cardiologist Killing You book and she says 600 mg Magnesium 2x/day should take care of the Afib. My mother is going to look into getting a consult with her, so she can get him off the rat poison.

[mamboni]

Oh, yeah, you're not the only one who is tired dragging horses to water. We have a sense of what we need to do. We'll just have to see if he's finally willing to cooperate with my mother and me. He might be willing because this was such a horror show experience for him. He's out of there, so we'll just have to see how things go.

And in an earlier post, you recommended Youngevity Heart and Brain, so I'll pass that on to my parents.

we'll have him to the colloidal silver to make sure that infection doesn't come back
I think he's off the lasix now, but they have him on the rat poison Heparin for the Afib (never had until he got there) and onto Vit E (my mother has E Gems Elite and Tocomin Suprabio)and Garlic . We have Dr. Rogers book Is Your Cardiologist Killing You book and she says 600 mg Magnesium 2x/day should take care of the Afib. My mother is going to look into getting a consult with her, so she can get him off the rat poison.Be advised that taking an anticoagulant plus vit E/garlic could result in bleeding. If you get him on a gluten free diet plus the Healthy Brain and Heart pack (which includes magnesium) the A fib might abate and you could then discontinue heparin. Unfortunately, elder patient guts can take months to heal from years exposure to gluten, sugar and processed carbs. Restoring health after decades of neglect requires a firm life long commitment to change the diet and take supplements. Most folk don’t have the patience and fortitude to stick with it.

[woodman]

Oh, yeah, you're not the only one who is tired dragging horses to water. We have a sense of what we need to do. We'll just have to see if he's finally willing to cooperate with my mother and me. He might be willing because this was such a horror show experience for him. He's out of there, so we'll just have to see how things go.

And in an earlier post, you recommended Youngevity Heart and Brain, so I'll pass that on to my parents.

we'll have him to the colloidal silver to make sure that infection doesn't come back
I think he's off the lasix now, but they have him on the rat poison Heparin for the Afib (never had until he got there) and onto Vit E (my mother has E Gems Elite and Tocomin Suprabio)and Garlic . We have Dr. Rogers book Is Your Cardiologist Killing You book and she says 600 mg Magnesium 2x/day should take care of the Afib. My mother is going to look into getting a consult with her, so she can get him off the rat poison.
Amanda, I am supposed to take blood thinners because of A-fib but for reasons I won't go into, I do not take them. I did at one time take coumadin also known as warfarin and used as rat poison. I have recently been looking into the various blood thinners and I now have a different take on warfarin/coumadin. In reading, I came across mention that it was originally derived from improperly stored clover hay that was fed to cattle and spontaneous bleeding and death was reported. It seems that a certain mold is responsible for the chemical. I don't know if it is still naturally derived but I would trust it over the newer blood thinners that can acclimate the body to the thinning effect and therefor when/if they are stopped suddenly, can lead to deadly clots because the body is used to the effects.

[Amanda]

Be advised that taking an anticoagulant plus vit E/garlic could result in bleeding. If you get him on a gluten free diet plus the Healthy Brain and Heart pack (which includes magnesium) the A fib might abate and you could then discontinue heparin. Unfortunately, elder patient guts can take months to heal from years exposure to gluten, sugar and processed carbs. Restoring health after decades of neglect requires a firm life long commitment to change the diet and take supplements. Most folk don’t have the patience and fortitude to stick with it.

Right, that's why we don't want to take the Vit E/garlic now until he's off the other. So we want to find a doctor (Maybe consult with Dr. Sherri Rogers, see if she can work with them) who can work with us on doing that.

Yes, the question is whether he is willing to stick with a new diet program and supplements. Time will tell.

[osoab]

How's your father doing Amanda?

[Amanda]

How's your father doing Amanda?

He's a lot better than he was in the hospital. My mother got him home Mon night--he was so desperate to get out of that hell hole that he was willing to sleep in his reclining chair (they did not get a hospital bed until Wed am). I think it was on Sun (before he left) that the BP and oxygen were back to normal, and they have stayed that way.

also, swollen infected legs, which got him into this mess are better. Legs look like normal shape. But still look like a bit of a mess from the cellulitis. He's taking colloidal silver and we ordered him some kind of colloidal silver cream. He's also taking monolaurin. I'm hoping the nurse can be helpful with that.

They got a visiting nurse yesterday that they really like--she's really invested in working with him and helping him get better (he still has to get his strength back from the hospital visit--he's still too weak to walk around the house; prior to hospital, he was walking around like normal, just with broken shoulder). Apparently, he's getting more services too, like physical therapy to get him stronger.

He's cooperating with the supplements and we're adding more.

he came home with a cough, so we are adding Mullein.

***
So, I just checked the reviews of the hospital he went to, and google reviews only gave them 2 1/2 stars. My parents never thought to check. There were a lot of reviews that matched the horror show we endured. We will have to write our own review.

[Amanda]

Okay, so here's my update...

First, a couple of months ago, there was some announcement in the paper that the nurses at the hospital got an award (the same lazy, nasty nurses who almost killed my father by not giving him any water while he, an 83 y.o, was on Lasix). So, everything is fake. You can treat people like crap, and the fake newspapers cover for you, and you get awards.

Also, just a reminder, in January, my father was completely asymptomatic--no weakness, no fatigue, no breathing problem, able to run errands by himself, walk unassisted, he would park far away (because he didn't want his car to get scratched) and walked into the grocery store, Home Depot, and Lowes without any problem.

So, when we got him back here his BP and oxygen were totally fine (back to normal once we rehydrated him, oxygen at 99%), but he was extremely weak, couldn't walk or stand on his own, had to be wheeled into the house. My parents got him a nurse and physical therapy, maybe for the first 4 weeks or so. He slowly got his stronger and was able to get around the first floor, but with a walker. Then he was strong enough to stand in the bathroom and get washed up/shave, etc. But it plateaued and he never got beyond that point. So, whatever happened in that hospital destroyed him and did permanent damage. He went from able-bodied, out and about running errands, walking around to confined to walker on the first floor of his home.

As I think I said somewhere on this thread, our best guess is that is had to do with the severe dehydration and low blood volume shock (which must have stressed his heart). Within 2 days at that hospital hell hole, he went from someone who never had a breathing problem a day in his life, to being in Acute Respiratory Failure--how could that happen unless they did something??

Here's what the mayoclinic says on complications from severe deydration:

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/dehydration/symptoms-causes/syc-20354086

Risk factors

Anyone can become dehydrated, but certain people are at greater risk:

Older adults. As you age, your body's fluid reserve becomes smaller, your ability to conserve water is reduced and your thirst sense becomes less acute. These problems are compounded by chronic illnesses such as diabetes and dementia, and by the use of certain medications. Older adults also may have mobility problems that limit their ability to obtain water for themselves.

ComplicationsDehydration can lead to serious complications, including:



Low blood volume shock (hypovolemic shock). This is one of the most serious, and sometimes life-threatening, complications of dehydration. It occurs when low blood volume causes a drop in blood pressure and a drop in the amount of oxygen in your body.



So, as I said, he plateaued and never got stronger. So he went from being able to walk around the world, wander around Home Depot, to being confined to a walker and the first floor of his home.

Then about 4 weeks ago, we started seeing him slowly get worse. He started to get more fatigued upon exertion, he started having swelling of legs from the heart condition (never had this before--the only 2 times he had swollen calves was because of Celllulitis infection--as soon as the infection was killed, legs were normal again). And apparently, as the body starts to hold water, it puts more stress on the heart. He also started having breathing issues (kind of like a soft panting). To my mother and I, it looked like he was slowly dying, so last week, he ended up going to the hospital, but NOT that hellhole one. He went to a hospital that specializes in the heart. Apparently, he had fluid in his lungs, so they got that out. And the cardiologist said he needed stents and if that worked, then he could have the valve procedure. So, last week, they put in 3 stents, and the plan was to send him to rehab to get stronger, and then have the valve procedure. But now, there is fluid back in his lungs, and they are not sure what this means.

Anyway, I wanted to post this here as a warning to others to be EXTREMELY CAREFUL when going to the hospital. He went for treatment of his cellulitis-infected legs, and left there with his health destroyed, confined to a walker in the first floor of his home unable to leave the house.

At this point, we are kind of thinking it's going to take a miracle. All we can say is that at least we got him out of the hellhole hospital before they outright killed him and he was able to have a few months of peace in his own home and got to spend time with my mother and wasn't alone. He also got to celebrate his 84th birthday.

Also, forgot to add, covid played a role in this too. Even though he tested negative for their BS fake virus on Monday night when they got him, Tues am, they said he was a "suspected covid case" and put him in isolation. So there was NO WAY for us to monitor him and make sure he was drinking water. And it was Tues and Wed, when he was in isolation, that the damage occurred.

[mamboni]

Okay, so here's my update...

First, a couple of months ago, there was some announcement in the paper that the nurses at the hospital got an award (the same lazy, nasty nurses who almost killed my father by not giving him any water while he, an 83 y.o, was on Lasix). So, everything is fake. You can treat people like crap, and the fake newspapers cover for you, and you get awards.

Also, just a reminder, in January, my father was completely asymptomatic--no weakness, no fatigue, no breathing problem, able to run errands by himself, walk unassisted, he would park far away (because he didn't want his car to get scratched) and walked into the grocery store, Home Depot, and Lowes without any problem.

So, when we got him back here his BP and oxygen were totally fine (back to normal once we rehydrated him, oxygen at 99%), but he was extremely weak, couldn't walk or stand on his own, had to be wheeled into the house. My parents got him a nurse and physical therapy, maybe for the first 4 weeks or so. He slowly got his stronger and was able to get around the first floor, but with a walker. Then he was strong enough to stand in the bathroom and get washed up/shave, etc. But it plateaued and he never got beyond that point. So, whatever happened in that hospital destroyed him and did permanent damage. He went from able-bodied, out and about running errands, walking around to confined to walker on the first floor of his home.

As I think I said somewhere on this thread, our best guess is that is had to do with the severe dehydration and low blood volume shock (which must have stressed his heart). Within 2 days at that hospital hell hole, he went from someone who never had a breathing problem a day in his life, to being in Acute Respiratory Failure--how could that happen unless they did something??

Here's what the mayoclinic says on complications from severe deydration:

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/dehydration/symptoms-causes/syc-20354086


So, as I said, he plateaued and never got stronger. So he went from being able to walk around the world, wander around Home Depot, to being confined to a walker and the first floor of his home.

Then about 4 weeks ago, we started seeing him slowly get worse. He started to get more fatigued upon exertion, he started having swelling of legs from the heart condition (never had this before--the only 2 times he had swollen calves was because of Celllulitis infection--as soon as the infection was killed, legs were normal again). And apparently, as the body starts to hold water, it puts more stress on the heart. He also started having breathing issues (kind of like a soft panting). To my mother and I, it looked like he was slowly dying, so last week, he ended up going to the hospital, but NOT that hellhole one. He went to a hospital that specializes in the heart. Apparently, he had fluid in his lungs, so they got that out. And the cardiologist said he needed stents and if that worked, then he could have the valve procedure. So, last week, they put in 3 stents, and the plan was to send him to rehab to get stronger, and then have the valve procedure. But now, there is fluid back in his lungs, and they are not sure what this means.

Anyway, I wanted to post this here as a warning to others to be EXTREMELY CAREFUL when going to the hospital. He went for treatment of his cellulitis-infected legs, and left there with his health destroyed, confined to a walker in the first floor of his home unable to leave the house.

At this point, we are kind of thinking it's going to take a miracle. All we can say is that at least we got him out of the hellhole hospital before they outright killed him and he was able to have a few months of peace in his own home and got to spend time with my mother and wasn't alone. He also got to celebrate his 84th birthday.

Also, forgot to add, covid played a role in this too. Even though he tested negative for their BS fake virus on Monday night when they got him, Tues am, they said he was a "suspected covid case" and put him in isolation. So there was NO WAY for us to monitor him and make sure he was drinking water. And it was Tues and Wed, when he was in isolation, that the damage occurred.
Give me your father for 6 months and I’ll have him playing golf and going for long walks.

[Amanda]

Give me your father for 6 months and I’ll have him playing golf and going for long walks.

Wow, Mamboni! Thanks for this. It gives me hope knowing that you think there's still hope. I'll pass this info along to my parents.

My father is still in shock over all that's happened because he knows how he was functioning back in January. And back then, if you asked any us, we would have said that he was doing pretty well for an 83 y.o.

[Amanda]

Father is back in the hospital. Was fine until a couple of days ago, my mother thought it was the flu (started Fri am), he was basically sleeping all day, eating/drinking almost nothing. Late Sat night started getting a bit confused/not making sense (we are now thinking because he got dehydrated), too weak to even stand up. She called EMTs Sunday late am.

By the time I saw him at the hospital late yesterday (4 pm) he was much worse--as in WTF did they do to him? Back on needing oxygen, yet when EMTs took him, his oxygen was fine.

I guess yesterday in the ER, they thought he had an infection/UTI, but now today, they are saying they don't know where the infection is, he has sepsis.,

So, my mother, who subscribes to a couple of doctor newsletters, including one by Dr. Sherry Rogers, tells them that IV Vit C helps save people with sepsis, and they told her nope, not true.

So, I did a quick google search, and saw titles that seemed to validate what the doctors told my mother, but it was strange because I just remember hearing lots of stories about IV vitamin C saving people from death from severe infections.

Anyway, went to doctoryourself.com (thanks to Bigjon I know about that site), and found this:

http://www.doctoryourself.com/Marik_C_Sepsis_2020.pdf

Hydrocortisone, Ascorbic Acid and Thiamine for
the Treatment of Severe Sepsis & Septic Shock by Dr. Paul Marik

Thought these quotes from that quick and easy to read presentation were notable:

“After introducing HAT therapy to the equation, sepsis is no longer a
concern of mine. If they are not «already dead» at arrival,
the patients survive. And they survive with their health intact"

and


“I spent 15 years gaining expertise in deploying ICU therapeutics with the
farcical goal of keeping ascorbic acid depleted patients alive and well–without giving them ascorbic acid!?"-

I had to rush and print it out and race it over to the hospital, because apparently timing is critical. I'm not sure what's happening now.

I'm posting this here in case on anyone here has family who end up in this situation.

****

Update from last year, he ended up getting 2 or 3 stents put in and a TAVR valve about a year ago. Too scared to do otherwise, seemed a death's door. Had to go to rehab which was a NIGHTMARE.


Doctors had been saying his heart was fine, but ever since the procedure, he's basically been severely disabled, and unable to walk more than 4 ft of so (so confined to 4 x 4 ft area in his home). Needs medical transportation to go to doctors appointments. He never complained about the issue of basically being disabled. But what he did complain about was severe pain in his joints/knees, hips, especially, which is why he couldn't walk. We were under the impression he was on anti-coagulants (first Eliquis, along with Plavix, then off those and on Pradaxa) due to the stents and TAVR, but it's not completely clear, some suggested those were for Afib, but it wasn't clear that he ever had that

Anyway, the pain definitely lowered his quality of life. I did some searches on these anti-coagulants (Eliquis and others) and found lots of people reporting the same problem. So my father tried to tell his cardiologist that Eliquis was causing the pain (he even took a 11 day break from Eliquis, while still on Plavix) and he started getting stronger and the pain was noticeably less and he had an easier time walking. He apparently told the doctor this but the cardiologist did not listen, said no to Warfarin, and put him on Pradaxxa, which brought the pain back.

So, that's that. Mainly posting here, so people can learn from our experience.

We were thinking of switching to Vit E for blood thinking and nattokinase to prevent clotting, but were really apprehensive about doing so.


*****

I just did a search on this Marick protocol and there's lot of info:

https://swisscows.com/web?query=marik+protocol+sepsis

https://wholefoodsmagazine.com/columns/vitamin-connection/the-marik-protocol-for-deadly-sepsis-is-already-saving-many-lives-the-roles-of-vitamins-c-and-b1-thiamine/


https://www.faim.org/interview-with-dr-paul-marik-on-vitamin-c-protocol-for-sepsis

As reported by Dr. Thomas Levy in his article Vitamin C and Sepsis: The Genie Is Now out of the Bottle (https://www.faim.org/thomas-e-levy), Dr. Paul Marik from the Eastern Virginia Medical School in Norfolk, Virginia has developed and tested a new protocol in his intensive care unit (ICU) for patients diagnosed with advanced sepsis and septic shock. Sepsis is a body-wide infection that rapidly evolves to a state of low blood pressure (shock) and multi-organ failure due to both the infection itself and the poor blood flow secondary to the low blood pressure.
After the first life-saving success, his vitamin C / hydrocortisone / thiamine protocol was used to treat 47 consecutive septic patients over seven months in 2016. He compared the results he achieved with these patients in a retrospective manner with a control group of septic patients treated without his new protocol during the prior seven months, simply looking at the outcome of survival.
Dr. Marik's results were stunning. Only 4 of the 47 patients treated with the protocol did not survive (8.5%), while 19 of the 47 control patients (who did not receive this protocol) died (40.4%). None of the treated patients developed any organ failure, and all of the treated patients were able to be weaned off of vasopressors (blood pressure-supporting drugs) within roughly 24 hours of starting the protocol.
Dr. Marik also noted that all four of the treated patients who died did not die of sepsis-related shock, but from their underlying conditions.
Following this study, Dr. Marik increased the number of treated patients with severe sepsis and septic shock to 150, and only person one from that group died from the sepsis itself. Moving from a 30-50 percent mortality utilizing standard treatment protocols for sepsis to achieving a sepsis-related mortality of less than 1% using IV vitamin C / hydrocortosone / thiamine therapy in this small treatment group is nothing short of miraculous. His protocol has since been lab-tested and proven to work. It is now used regularly at Eastern Virginia Medical School to treat sepsis.
Dr. Marik describes his work and experience in this video.


****

My mother gave the info to the nurse, who said she would give it to the doctor. My mother said timing was critical. No word if they are trying it

***

update- 6:30 pm, my mother spoke with his doctor and this guy was totally DISMISSIVE of the Merrick protocol and REFUSES to do it. (I'm thinking they probably don't even have any nutrients in that hospital--only drugs are probably allowed)

***

I just looked this Dr. Paul Marick up (he's the one who has the IV Vit C, Thiamine, Hydrocortisone protocol) and looks like he was working with Dr. Pierre Kory (the ivermectin guy from operation covid hoax):

https://totalityofevidence.com/dr-paul-marik/

Dr Paul E Marik is a Pulmonary and Critical Care Specialist, founding member and Chairman of the Frontline COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance (FLCCC (https://covid19criticalcare.com/about/the-flccc-physicians/)) and developer of the highly effective treatment protocol for hospitalisation of COVID-19 called MATH+ and I-MASK+. Curriculum vitae (https://covid19criticalcare.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/FLCCC-Alliance-Member-CV-Marik.pdf).
I first discovered Dr Marik in early 2020 when I was researching high-dose intravenous vitamin C (IV Vit C) and came across this 2017 video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfXVce34A78). Dr Marik’s ICU sepsis treatment was based on the phase 1 paper referred to here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXs5Xzr6qCI) by Dr Fowler in a 2018 presentation, a paper which led Dr Fowler to conduct clinical trials for sepsis using high dose IV Vit C. Fowler’s phase 3 clinical trial results where very positive for reducing mortality but when he went to publish listen here (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXs5Xzr6qCI&t=3875s) to what the medical journal JAMA required him to do!!! Now go to the TGA website and check out the Fowler paper referenced (https://www.tga.gov.au/alert/no-evidence-support-intravenous-high-dose-vitamin-c-management-covid-19) as the justification for NOT recommending IV Vit C for the management of COVID-19! But lets top this all off with a 60 Minutes (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l772sEfYnRg) report from 2012.

(so basically, the MEDICAL MAFIA doesn't want doctors using IV Vit C/Dr. Marik's protocol to cure people, better to let them die....TOTAL DEATH CULT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


You be the judge as to what is going on here! Does the “medical establishment” really want to help? HINT (https://totalityofevidence.com/timeline/the-flexner-report/)
Dr Marik works closely with Dr Pierre Kory (https://totalityofevidence.com/dr-pierre-kory/).
FLCCC Webinars and Videos HERE (https://covid19criticalcare.com/webinars-lectures/), Odysee Channel HERE (https://odysee.com/@FrontlineCovid19CriticalCareAlliance:c), YouTube HERE


(https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCz9Pvn15m4Rv1uY-aBYRVuw/videos)

[Bigjon]

Another protocol that I've heard of is where they irradiate your blood with ultra-violet light. Takes about two hours. Supposedly works wonders with all kinds of infections.

[Amanda]

Another protocol that I've heard of is where they irradiate your blood with ultra-violet light. Takes about two hours. Supposedly works wonders with all kinds of infections.


Thanks.

This whole ordeal is beyond sickening. There are cures but they (medical mafia doctors) refuse to do them.

So, despite all the research and reading of books and health/doctor newsletters, you basically hit a wall because there aren't any doctors who will do the curative protocols (especially those that involve nutrients)


No matter what happens, and it doesn't look good for my father, going forward, I'm going to have to do research into finding alternative doctors somewhere in this state. Or I will have to move.


From my above post, I listened to the Dr. Fowler who also had a IV Vit C protocol that was saving lives of people with Sepsis and he said that the cost of treating a patient in the ICU with antibiotics for sepsis is about $20,000 per day. So, compare that with the cost of IV Vit C, Thiamine/Vit B1 and hydrocortisone and it's got to be a lot less.

The whole system is pure EVIL.

[Bigjon]

Most doctors won't admit that they are high priced slaves to big farma. They are not in control of the system.
You have to find a clinic which has a track record of being off the track.
Like the Riordan Clinic (https://riordanclinic.org/) in Kansas.

I also subscribe to the Orthomolecular News.
http://orthomolecular.org/subscribe.html (https://orthomolecular.acemlna.com/lt.php?i=247A246A1A11810)

Find a DoctorTo locate an orthomolecular physician near you: http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n09.shtml (https://orthomolecular.acemlna.com/lt.php?notrack=1&i=247A246A1A11855)

The peer-reviewed Orthomolecular Medicine News Service is a non-profit and non-commercial informational resource.

[Amanda]

Most doctors won't admit that they are high priced slaves to big farma. They are not in control of the system.
You have to find a clinic which has a track record of being off the track.
Like the Riordan Clinic (https://riordanclinic.org/) in Kansas.

I also subscribe to the Orthomolecular News.
http://orthomolecular.org/subscribe.html (https://orthomolecular.acemlna.com/lt.php?i=247A246A1A11810)

Find a Doctor

To locate an orthomolecular physician near you: http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v06n09.shtml (https://orthomolecular.acemlna.com/lt.php?notrack=1&i=247A246A1A11855)

The peer-reviewed Orthomolecular Medicine News Service is a non-profit and non-commercial informational resource.

Thanks for the info.

I subscribed at Orthomolecular News
and will use the other link to see if there are any orthomolecular physicians in our state.

Bottom line, this was a lesson for us. No matter how much research we do on our own (subscribing to health/doctor news letters, reading alternative health books), we're going to end up getting nowhere if we don't have a open-minded (ethical) doctor who is willing to work with us.

Yes, I've heard of Riordan Clinic before. Also, when my sister was dealing with severe Lyme, I heard about another last-resort hospital out in the mid-west (maybe even Kansas) that had a good track record of curing patients with non-big-pharma poisons.

[steel_ag]

"Niacin attenuates lung inflammation and improves survival during sepsis by downregulating the nuclear factor-κB pathway"
Source: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20975550/
www.hom3ostasis.com
https://t.me/Studieslog