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View Full Version : The real intent of the show-me-your-papers law



MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 11:14 AM
Don't be fooled. The way the media plays the story, it was a wave of racist, anti-immigrant hysteria that moved Arizona Republicans to pass a sick little law, signed last week, requiring every person in the state to carry papers proving they are US citizens.

I don't buy it. Anti-Hispanic hysteria has always been as much a part of Arizona as the Saguaro cactus and excessive air-conditioning.

What's new here is not the politicians' fear of a xenophobic "Teabag" uprising.

What moved GOP Governor Jan Brewer to sign the Soviet-style show-me-your-papers law is the exploding number of legal Hispanics, US citizens all, who are daring to vote -- and daring to vote Democratic by more than two-to-one. Unless this demographic locomotive is halted, Arizona Republicans know their party will soon be electoral toast. Or, if you like, tortillas.

In 2008, working for Rolling Stone with civil rights attorney Bobby Kennedy, our team flew to Arizona to investigate what smelled like an electoral pogrom against Chicano voters ... directed by one Jan Brewer.

Brewer, then Secretary of State, had organized a racially loaded purge of the voter rolls that would have made Katherine Harris blush. Beginning after the 2004 election, under Brewer's command, no less than 100,000 voters, overwhelming Hispanics, were blocked from registering to vote. In 2005, the first year of the Great Brown-Out, one in three Phoenix residents found their registration applications rejected.

That statistic caught my attention. Voting or registering to vote if you're not a citizen is a felony, a big-time jail-time crime. And arresting such criminal voters is easy: after all, they give their names and addresses.

So I asked Brewer's office, had she busted a single one of these thousands of allegedly illegal voters? Did she turn over even one name to the feds for prosecution?

No, not one.

Which raises the question: were these disenfranchised voters the criminal, non-citizens Brewer tagged them, or just not-quite-white voters given the José Crow treatment, entrapped in document-chase trickery?

The answer was provided by a federal prosecutor who was sent on a crazy hunt all over the Western mesas looking for these illegal voters. "We took over 100 complaints, we investigated for almost 2 years, I didn’t find one prosecutable voter fraud case."

This prosecutor, David Iglesias, is a prosecutor no more. When he refused to fabricate charges of illegal voting among immigrants, his firing was personally ordered by the President of the United States, George W. Bush, under orders from his boss, Karl Rove.

Iglesias' jurisdiction was next door, in New Mexico, but he told me that Rove and the Republican chieftains were working nationwide to whip up anti-immigrant hysteria with public busts of illegal voters, even though there were none.

"They wanted some splashy pre-election indictments," Iglesias told me. The former prosecutor, himself a Republican, paid the price when he stood up to this vicious attack on citizenship.

But Secretary of State Brewer followed the Rove plan to a T. The weapon she used to slice the Arizona voter rolls was a 2004 law, known as "Prop 200," which required proof of citizenship to register. It is important to see the Republicans' latest legislative horror show, sanctioning cops to stop residents and prove citizenship, as just one more step in the party's desperate plan to impede Mexican-Americans from marching to the ballot box.

[By the way, no one elected Brewer. Weirdly, Barack Obama placed her in office last year when, for reasons known only to the Devil and Rahm Emanuel, the President appointed Arizona's Democratic Governor Janet Napolitano to his cabinet, which automatically moved Republican Brewer into the Governor's office.]

State Senator Russell Pearce, the Republican sponsor of the latest ID law, gave away his real intent, blocking the vote, when he said, "There is a massive effort under way to register illegal aliens in this country."

How many? Pearce's PR flak told me, five million. All Democrats, too. Again, I asked Pearce's office to give me their the names and addresses from their phony registration forms. I'd happily make a citizens arrest of each one, on camera. Pearce didn't have five million names. He didn't have five. He didn't have one.

The horde of five million voters who swam the Rio Grande just to vote for Obama was calculated on a Republican website extrapolating from the number of Mexicans in a border town who refused jury service because they were not citizens. Not one, in fact, had registered to vote: they had registered to drive. They had obtained licenses as required by the law.

The illegal voters, "wetback" welfare moms, and alien job thieves are just GOP website wet-dreams, but their mythic PR power helps the party's electoral hacks chop away at voter rolls and civil rights with little more than a whimper from the Democrats.

Indeed, one reason, I discovered, that some Democrats are silent is that they are in on the game themselves. In New Mexico, Democratic Party bosses tossed away ballots of Pueblo Indians to cut native influence in party primaries.

But what’s wrong with requiring folks to prove they’re American if the want to vote and live in America? The answer: because the vast majority of perfectly legal voters and residents who lack ID sufficient for Ms. Brewer and Mr. Pearce are citizens of color, citizens of poverty.

According to a study by prof. Matt Barreto, of Washington State University, minority citizens are half as likely as whites to have the government ID. The numbers are dreadfully worse when income is factored in.

Just outside Phoenix, without Brewer's or Pearce's help, I did locate one of these evil un-American voters, that is, someone who could not prove her citizenship: 100-year-old Shirley Preiss. Her US birth certificate was nowhere to be found as it never existed.

In Phoenix, I stopped in at the Maricopa County prison where Sheriff Joe Arpaio houses the captives of his campaign to stop illegal immigration. Arpaio, who under the new Arizona law, will be empowered to choose his targets for citizenship testing, is already facing federal indictment for his racially-charged and legally suspect methods.

I admit, I was a little nervous, passing through the iron doors with a big sign, "NOTICE: ILLEGAL ALIENS ARE PROHIBITED FROM VISITING ANYONE IN THIS JAIL." I mean, Grandma Palast snuck into the USA via Windsor, Canada. We Palasts are illegal as they come, but Arpaio's sophisticated deportee-sniffer didn't stop this white boy from entering his sanctum.

But that's the point, isn't it? Not to stop non-citizens from entering Arizona -- after all, who else would care for the country club lawn? -- but to harass folks of the wrong color: Democratic blue.

http://www.gregpalast.com/behind-the-arizona-immigration-lawgop-game-to-swipe-the-november-election/

Grand Master Melon
26th April 2010, 11:20 AM
First of all Arizona has a long history of supporting plenty of democrats and secondly it isn't the mexicans that are changing the political spectrum in arizona it's the freakin dirtbag dems from other states like cali and new york that didn't like where they lived but thought it would be a great idea to move here and push the same agenda.

I don't think this is some sort of great way to purge the voter rolls of dems, just a plan to get rid of illegals.

Book
26th April 2010, 11:21 AM
What moved GOP Governor Jan Brewer to sign the Soviet-style show-me-your-papers law is the exploding number of legal Hispanics, US citizens all, who are daring to vote -- and daring to vote Democratic by more than two-to-one. Unless this demographic locomotive is halted, Arizona Republicans know their party will soon be electoral toast. Or, if you like, tortillas.


Had nothing to do with crime and bankrupting Mexican welfare freeloading.

Get real MN...lol.

:D

philo beddoe
26th April 2010, 11:28 AM
So what is the real intent of marketneutral?

cigarlover
26th April 2010, 11:29 AM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?

Grand Master Melon
26th April 2010, 11:30 AM
So what is the real intent of marketneutral?


I saw you were at 87 smites, I thought I'd smite you to 88. It seemed appropriate, I hope you appreciate it.

kregener
26th April 2010, 11:32 AM
This is CLASSIC leftist pablum coming from a guy who claimed to have uncovered evidence that Florida Governor Jeb Bush, Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris, and Florida Elections Unit Chief Clay Roberts, along with the ChoicePoint corporation, rigged the ballots during the US Presidential Election of 2000 and again in 2004 when, he argued, the problems and machinations from 2000 continued, and that challenger John Kerry actually would have won if not for disproportional "spoilage" of Democratic votes.

I mean CLASSIC...

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 11:40 AM
Intent is provide more then one point of view to stir up "thoughtful debate".

I believe the intent of the show me your papers law is to oust McCain in the November elections.

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 11:42 AM
Note: We really need a "I Love Hitler" subforum so certain members can troll around in there. :oo-->

Grand Master Melon
26th April 2010, 11:43 AM
Intent is provide more then one point of view to stir up "thoughtful debate".

I believe the intent of the show me your papers law is to oust McCain in the November elections.


McCain won't be ousted come November because he has too much support here for some reason. If you follow az politics you'd know that.

Ponce
26th April 2010, 11:43 AM
Ponce <----------not a word, he might get deported to Mexico by mistake.

Ifyouseekay
26th April 2010, 11:44 AM
-

Book
26th April 2010, 11:45 AM
I believe the intent of the show me your papers law is to oust McCain in the November elections.


Voter intent. Had nothing to do with crime and bankrupting Mexican welfare freeloading?

Get real MN...lol.

Book
26th April 2010, 11:47 AM
Note: We really need a "I Love Hitler" subforum so certain members can troll around in there. :oo-->


How did that work out at GIM?

:D

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 11:49 AM
Intent is provide more then one point of view to stir up "thoughtful debate".

I believe the intent of the show me your papers law is to oust McCain in the November elections.


McCain won't be ousted come November because he has too much support here for some reason. If you follow az politics you'd know that.


If you follow politics voters express their anger by voting for the other guy, no matter who the other guy is - Bush/Obama/Scott Brown - get the drift. McCain campaigned and won elections for over a decade on a platform of getting immigration reform passed. Who will the voters that don't like "show me your papers" take their anger out on?

JohnQPublic
26th April 2010, 11:55 AM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 11:57 AM
And those that like "show me your papers" will not vote for McCain either - because he campaigns for immigration reform.

McGramps be screwed.

Ponce
26th April 2010, 12:00 PM
Mr. Public.........don't worry about those few who wants to make it hard for us many.

Market Neutral is doing more for this site in one day than what they can do in a month.

GO MARKET NEUTRAL GO GO GO ;D

sunshine05
26th April 2010, 12:17 PM
The thing about "show me your papers" is that legal immigrants are already required to carry documentation with them to prove they are allowed to to reside here. So why is everyone so bent out of shape about this?! When you travel to a foreign country don't you typically carry your passport with you at all times? I do.

The article mentions how it is wrong to expect people to show ID to vote because many of them are poor or "brown". WTF? Do you think you could go to Mexico and vote in their elections? You *should* be required to show proof of citizenship to vote here! What a ridiculous article.

wildcard
26th April 2010, 12:24 PM
What are the odds this is just a feel good move to keep her office and will wind up another unenforced law on the books? I'm going with 97% or higher.

Book
26th April 2010, 12:32 PM
If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it.


http://danielj09.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/group_hug1_jpg.jpg

You ask too much of us Sir.

:D


In the Crossfire: Questioning Bush's motives on Iraq

Common to journalism.

:oo-->

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:33 PM
What a ridiculous article.


And if a U.S. citizen "Mexican" looking person gets stopped 3 times a month so they can present their papers - who are they going to vote for?

wildcard
26th April 2010, 12:35 PM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.


If you'll read the Jan Brewer thread you'll see that MN also uses this technique. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.

Ifyouseekay
26th April 2010, 12:35 PM
-

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:39 PM
Mr. Public.........don't worry about those few who wants to make it hard for us many.

Market Neutral is doing more for this site in one day than what they can do in a month.

GO MARKET NEUTRAL GO GO GO ;D



I'm not saying MN shouldn't post.... a lot of the info is really good. It's when others make threads and they get knocked off the front page so fast that they receive little notice/response. Just now, there are over 20 threads on the first page of GD that were started by MN.


That is because a lot of them have replies and they get bumped back up again.

Horn
26th April 2010, 12:40 PM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?


Yes, anyone in Arizona without papers will be deported.

Latinos to the otherside of the Mexican border, Caucasians will be dropped into the Grand Canyon. 8)

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:47 PM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.


If you'll read the Jan Brewer thread you'll see that MN also uses this technique. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.


What technique? My take was if you fine and jail those that hire them, provide housing or sale them a vehicle would solve the problem instead of creating probale cause for the 92.5% of the population that are legal. Not to mention, this tramples the Constitution with right of freedom of movement within your State. You never address that - you reply with one or two word personal attacks. Normally Commie or Fuking Lib. Punish the enables.

sunshine05
26th April 2010, 12:48 PM
What are the odds this is just a feel good move to keep her office and will wind up another unenforced law on the books? I'm going with 97% or higher.


I think it will work. The tough immigration laws are working in Oklahoma.

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:50 PM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?


Yes, anyone in Arizona without papers will be deported.

Latinos to the otherside of the Mexican border, Caucasians will be dropped into the Grand Canyon. 8)


Don't got your papers it is a free trip to jail and a $2500 get out of jail fine. Don't worry. You will see some deer in the headlight white faces since Arizona has a illegal Eastern European and Russian problem too.

sunshine05
26th April 2010, 12:53 PM
What are the odds this is just a feel good move to keep her office and will wind up another unenforced law on the books? I'm going with 97% or higher.


I think it will work. The tough immigration laws are working in Oklahoma.


You keep saying this but how exactly would that work? I can't call ICE just because I suspect workers are illegal. Who exactly is going to enforce this? And would this apply to all employers? Really, are the police supposed to go to every employer in their area and demand proof of citizenship of all their employees? who pays for that? There is already E-Verify and many companies use that now because they don't want to hire illegals.

sunshine05
26th April 2010, 12:55 PM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?


Yes, anyone in Arizona without papers will be deported.

Latinos to the otherside of the Mexican border, Caucasians will be dropped into the Grand Canyon. 8)


Don't got your papers it is a free trip to jail and a $2500 get out of jail fine. Don't worry. You will see some deer in the headlight white faces since Arizona has a illegal Eastern European and Russian problem too.


Good! Illegal is illegal. Deport them.

wildcard
26th April 2010, 12:56 PM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.


If you'll read the Jan Brewer thread you'll see that MN also uses this technique. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.


What technique? My take was if you fine and jail those that hire them, provide housing or sale them a vehicle would solve the problem instead of creating probale cause for the 92.5% of the population that are legal. Not to mention, this tramples the Constitution with right of freedom of movement within your State. You never address that - you reply with one or two word personal attacks. Normally Commie or Fuking Lib. Punish the enables.


You were the one to call me police state shill and neo-con first. Liar.

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:58 PM
You know, they are going to have to ask a lot of white people for their papers.

I been watching a lot of Arizona news coverage and the chant is "we are not going to racially profile". So they are going to have to come up with some stats that show they they carded Caucasians.

When the stats come back 100% hispanic looking. Then that will invalidate the "we are not going to racially profile" chant.

Just saying. :)

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 12:59 PM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.


If you'll read the Jan Brewer thread you'll see that MN also uses this technique. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.


What technique? My take was if you fine and jail those that hire them, provide housing or sale them a vehicle would solve the problem instead of creating probale cause for the 92.5% of the population that are legal. Not to mention, this tramples the Constitution with right of freedom of movement within your State. You never address that - you reply with one or two word personal attacks. Normally Commie or Fuking Lib. Punish the enables.


You were the one to call me police state shill and neo-con first. Liar.


That was after you called me a pucking lib. I just pointed out a police state controls your freedome of movement by asking for papers would fall into that category.

If the shoes fits, bro.

Horn
26th April 2010, 01:01 PM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?


Yes, anyone in Arizona without papers will be deported.

Latinos to the otherside of the Mexican border, Caucasians will be dropped into the Grand Canyon. 8)


Don't got your papers it is a free trip to jail and a $2500 get out of jail fine. Don't worry. You will see some deer in the headlight white faces since Arizona has a illegal Eastern European and Russian problem too.


Remind me to reroute any flight layovers away from there.

Wouldn't want to get caught at the bar with my britches down. :yuk

Book
26th April 2010, 01:05 PM
You know, they are going to have to ask a lot of white people for their papers.


How many White people strolled over the Mexican border today?

:oo-->

Horn
26th April 2010, 01:05 PM
So if I refuse to show them my papers will I be deported?


Yes, anyone in Arizona without papers will be deported.

Latinos to the otherside of the Mexican border, Caucasians will be dropped into the Grand Canyon. 8)


Don't got your papers it is a free trip to jail and a $2500 get out of jail fine. Don't worry. You will see some deer in the headlight white faces since Arizona has a illegal Eastern European and Russian problem too.


Good! Illegal is illegal. Deport them.


We could always get some British passports. That'll cover our asses.

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 01:14 PM
You know, they are going to have to ask a lot of white people for their papers.


How many White people strolled over the Mexican border today?

:oo-->




How can you say you are not racially profiling and only as one race for their papers?

wildcard
26th April 2010, 01:14 PM
Come on people. I thought you wanted free speech here. If you don't like the post, then refute it or don't read it. Attacking MarketNeutral's "real intent" sounds very leftish to me.


If you'll read the Jan Brewer thread you'll see that MN also uses this technique. What is good for the goose is good for the gander.




What technique? My take was if you fine and jail those that hire them, provide housing or sale them a vehicle would solve the problem instead of creating probale cause for the 92.5% of the population that are legal. Not to mention, this tramples the Constitution with right of freedom of movement within your State. You never address that - you reply with one or two word personal attacks. Normally Commie or Fuking Lib. Punish the enables.


You were the one to call me police state shill and neo-con first. Liar.


That was after you called me a pucking lib. I just pointed out a police state controls your freedome of movement by asking for papers would fall into that category.

If the shoes fits, bro.


You mean the post after you called me a shill? Liar.

http://gold-silver.us/forum/index.php?topic=2891.msg26483#msg26483

If the hippie sandal fits...

Horn
26th April 2010, 01:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IONyLZn0pLI

MarketNeutral
26th April 2010, 01:25 PM
Brewer: New law won't lead to racial profiling
http://azdailysun.com/news/local/state-and-regional/article_b52a128a-4f35-11df-bb7c-001cc4c002e0.html

Because will only ask hispanic looking people for their papers? :oo-->

I betcha the first 3 months they ask more whites for their papers then hispanics....just to shut up the protestors.

"We asked over 50% of none hispanics for their papers". See we don't racially profile.

PatColo
26th April 2010, 01:30 PM
As long as the shadow gummit's FAKE VOTING BLACKBOXES (http://blackboxvoting.org/) are employed, any "news/op-ed/etc" pieces which hang their case on "politicians worried about the voice of the voters", are moot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NF5Kdm4Eu6w

cedarchopper
26th April 2010, 01:42 PM
The modern illegal alien invasion started after a Federal Court ruled that schools could not asked any information about immigration status. After that Federal Court ruling, the dynamic of the Mexican worker crossing the border to make Dollars changed completely...they started bringing their entire families because the children could now go to school for free. What a deal, how could any peasant pass up the gringo's invitation to get a 1st world education?

The check your papers law may have an effect on Arizona's illegal population, but do you really want to give the police more power?

More effective laws would be to require legal immigration status to go to school and a legal immigration status to acquire US citizenship from being born here.

That would be all it takes... but my guess is the PTB would prefer a more totalitarian type crack ground, like how they do with airline safety.

Get ready for a bigger and badder police man.