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Ponce
27th April 2010, 10:31 AM
Mass Inflation Ahead -- Save Your Nickels!
By James Wesley, Rawles -- Editor of www.SurvivalBlog.com
Updated, February, 2010


I've often mused about how fun it would be to have a time machine and travel back to the early 1960s, and go on a pre-inflation shopping spree.
In that era, most used cars were less than $800, and a new-in-the box Colt .45 Automatic sold for $60. In particular, it would be great to go back and get a huge pile of rolls of then-circulating US silver dimes, quarters, and half dollars at face value. (With silver presently around $15.50 per ounce, the US 90% silver (1964 and earlier) coinage is selling wholesale at 11 times face value--that is $11,000 for a $1,000 face value bag.)

The disappearance of 90% silver coins from circulation in the US in the mid-1960s beautifully illustrated Gresham's Law: "Bad Money Drives Out Good." People quickly realized that the debased copper sandwich coins were bogus, so anyone with half a brain saved every pre-'65 (90% silver) coin that they could find. (This resulted in a coin shortage from 1965 to 1967, while the mint frantically played catch up, producing millions of cupronickel "clad" coins. This production was so hurried that they even skipped putting mint marks on coins from 1965 to 1967.)

Alas, there are no time machines. But what if I were to tell you that there is a similar,albeit smaller-scale opportunity? Consider the lowly US five cent piece--the "nickel."

Unlike US dimes and quarters, which stopped being made of 90% silver after 1964, the composition of a nickel has essentially been unchanged since the end of World War II. It is still a 5 gram coin that is an alloy of 75% copper and 25% nickel. (An aside: Some 1942 to 1945 five cent coins were made with 35% silver, because nickel was badly-needed for wartime industrial use. Those "War Nickels" have long since been culled from circulation, by collectors.)

According to www.Coinflation.com, the 1946-2008 Nickel (with a 5 cent face value) had a base metal value of $0.0677413 in 2008. That was 135.48% of its face value. (In recent months, with the recession, and a decline in industrial demand for copper, the base metal value of a nickel dropped below face value. But even at today's commodities prices, you will start out at "break even" by amassing a stockpile of nickels.) I predict that as inflation resumes--most likely beginning in 2011--the base metal value of nickels will rise substantially.

The Root of the Problem

It is inevitable that any country that issues a continually-inflated fiat paper currency will run into the problem of their coinage eventually having its base metal value exceed its face value. When this happens, it is one of those embarrassing "emperor's new clothes" moments. Unless a government takes the drastic step of lopping off a zero or two from their currency, this coinage problem is inevitable. In essence, we were robbed by our own government when silver coins were replaced with copper sandwich coins in the 1960s. I predict that essentially the same thing will soon to happen with nickels.

Helicopter Ben Bernanke will inflate his way out of the current liquidity crisis. through artificial lowering of interest rates, massive injections of liquidity, and monetization of the Federal debt. That can only spell one thing: inflation, and plenty of it. Mass inflation will mean much higher commodities prices (at least from the perspective of the US currency.)

I predict that until perhaps early 2011, the US Mint will continue to produce nickels with the current metals composition. In February, 2010 it was announced that the Obama administration had endorsed a change in the metal composition of pennies and nickels. Once this change is implemented, you will have to manually sort the "old" from the "new" debased nickels! But for now, there is still an open window of opportunity, during which time SurvivalBlog readers can salt away countless rolls and bags of nickels.

Within just a few years, the base metal value of a nickel is likely to exceed two times ("2X") its face value. (10 cents each.) The nickel will then begin to disappear from circulation. (Gresham's law is unavoidable.) Unlike the mid-1960s experience, the missing nickels will not cause a crisis, since pennies will suffice for making small change, and most vending machines now use dimes as their smallest purchase increment. Meanwhile, most bridge tolls and toll roads have inflated so that tolls are in 25 cent increments. The demise of the nickel will hardly cause a ripple in the news.

Unless the Treasury decides to drop the issuance of nickels entirely, the US Mint will within the next three years be forced to introduce a "new" nickel with a debased composition. It will possibly be zinc (flashed with silver) or possibly even aluminum.

Why Not Pennies?

You may ask, why not accumulate 95% copper (pre-1983 mint date) pennies? They already seen a spike in their base metal value to 2.2 cents each. But unfortunately, pennies have two problems: confusion and bulk. They are confusing, because 95% copper pennies are now circulating side-by-side with 97.5% zinc pennies. They are also about four times as bulky (per dollar of face value) as nickels.

With nickels you won't have to spend time sorting out pre-1983 varieties. At present, visually date sorting pennies simply isn't worth your time. Although I suppose that if someone were to invent an automated density-measuring penny sorting machine, he could make a fortune. As background: The pre-1983 pennies recently had a base metal value of about $0.0226 each.) Starting in 1983, the mint switched to 97.5% zinc pennies that are just flashed with copper. Those presently have a base metal value of only about $0.0071 each.

Pennies are absurdly bulky and heavy to store. Nickels are also quite bulky, but are at least more manageable than pennies for a small investor's storage. (Storing pennies would take a tremendous amount of space and constitute a huge weight per dollar invested.)

The biggest advantage of nickels over pennies is that there is no date/composition confusion. At least for now, a nickel is a nickel. Even the newly-minted "large portrait" nickels have the same 75/25 cupronickel composition. But that is likely to change within just a couple of years. The US Mint cannot go on minting nickels at a loss much longer. My advice: start filling military surplus ammo cans with $2 (40 coin) rolls of nickels.

The .30 caliber size can is the perfect width for rolls of nickels. Each can will hold 11 bank rolls of nickels per layer, and the can will hold eight layers. On the top layer there is room for one more roll. Thus, they'll hold a total of 89 rolls per ammo can, or $178. Any larger containers would be difficult to move easily. (Avoid back strain!) Cardboard boxes are fragile, and lack a carry handle. But ammo cans are very sturdy, have an integral handle, and they are relatively cheap and plentiful. They are available at military surplus stores and gun shows. The current difference between a nickel's base metal value and its face value is fairly small, but trust me, it will grow! Someday, when nickels are worth 4X to 8X their face value, your children will thank you for it. Consider it an investment in your children's future.

In December of 2006, the US congress passed a law making it illegal to bulk export or melt down pennies and nickels. But once the old composition pennies and nickels have been driven out of circulation, that is likely to change. In fact, a bill now before congress would remove pre-1983 pennies from the melting ban. In any case, once the base metal value exceeds face value by about 3X, an investor's market will develop, regardless of whether or not melting is re-legalized. Count on it.

What if Uncle Sam Decides to Drop a Zero?

As previously noted in SurvivalBlog, inflation of the US dollar has been chronic, cumulative, and insidious. So much so that turns of phrase from old movies like "penny candy" and "its your nickel" (to describe the cost of a call on a pay phone) now seem quaint and outdated. When inflation goes on long enough, the number of digits required to express a price grows too large. (As has been seen with the Italian lira, the Zimbabwean dollar, and countless other currencies. One whitewash solution to chronic inflation that several other nations have chosen is dropping one, two, or even three zeros from their currency, in an overnight revaluation, with a mandatory paper currency exchange. The history of the past century has shown that when doing so, most governments re-issue only new paper currency, but leave the old coinage in circulation, at the same face value. This is because the sheer logistics of a coinage swap would be daunting. Typically, this leaves the holders of coinage as the unexpected beneficiaries of a 10X, 100X.or even 1,000X gain of the value of their coins. Governments just assume that most citizens just have a couple of pocketfuls of coins at any given time. So if a currency swap were to happen while you are sitting on a big pile of nickels, you would make a handsome profit. To "cash in", you could merely spend your saved nickels in the new currency regime.

How To Build Your Pile of Nickels

How can you amass a big pile-o-nickels? Obviously just saving the few that you normally receive as pocket change is insufficient. Here are some possibilities:

1.) If you live in a state with nickel slot machine gambling (such as Nevada or New Jersey), or near an Indian tribal casino with nickel slots, go to a casino frequently and buy $50 in nickels at a time. Do your best to look like a gambler when doing so, by carrying a plastic change bucket with a few nickels in the bottom.

2.) Obtain nickels in rolls from your friendly local bank teller. Most "retail" banks are already accustomed to handing over rolls of coins to private depositors because of collector demand for statehood commemorative quarters and the new presidential dollar coins. Ask for $20 or $30 of nickels in rolls each time that you visit to do your normal banking deposits or withdrawals. It is best to ask for new "wrapped" (fresh Federal Reserve Bank issue) rolls. This way, you might have the chance of getting rolls with valuable minting errors--such as "double die" strikes. These are usually noticed and publicized a few months after the fact, and can be quite valuable. You will also be assured that you are getting full 40 coin rolls. (Getting shorted with 38 or 39 coin rolls is possible with hand-rolled coins.) If the tellers ask why you want so many, you can honestly tell them: "I'm working on a collection for my children." (You need not tell them how large a collection it is!)

3.) If you live in or near an urban area and you operate a business, you can effectively "buy" rolled coinage from your commercial bank. (They generally will not do any business with anyone unless they have an account.) It might be worth your while to on paper start a side business with "Vending Service" in its name, and have business cards and stationary printed up in that name. Have that "DBA" business entity name added to your commercial bank account. At a high-volume commercial bank you could conceivably buy hundreds or even thousands of dollars worth of nickels on the pretense of stocking change for a vending business. Depending on your relationship with the bank, they may waive any fees if you ask for a few rolls of coins. Be advised, however, that if you ask for any significant quantity at one time, they will probably charge you a premium. (Down in the small print of your account contract, there is probably wording something like this: "Coin Issued - Per Roll: .03 Currency Issued - Per $ 100: .08" Before you cry "foul", be aware that the Federal Reserve actually charges your bank a small premium when they obtain wrapped rolls of coins. (Most folks have held to the convenient fiction that a paper dollar was the same as a dollar in change. Obviously, it isn't.) In effect, your commercial banker will just be passing along this cost to you. Unless they charge you a heavy fee, don't worry about it. Ten years from now, when a $2 roll of nickel is worth $16, you'll be laughing about how you obtained $4,000 face value in nickels at just a small fraction over their face value.

4.) If you know someone that has a machine vending business, offer to buy all of their excess nickels once every month or two, by offering a small premium.

5.) If you operate a "mom and pop" retail business with a walk-in clientele, put up a small sign next to your cash register that reads: "WANTED: Rolls of nickels for my collection. I pay $2.25 per 40 coin ($2) roll, regardless of year!" Once the nickel shortage develops (as it inevitably will), you should raise you premium gradually, to keep a steady stream of coin rolls coming in.

After this is posted, I'm sure that I'm going to get plenty of ridicule, accusing me of "hoarding." So be it. Let me preemptively state that I realize that money tied up in coins will not benefit from the interest that a bank deposit would earn. But foregoing interest is not a major concern. Why? Because I think that it is a fairly safe bet that commodity price inflation will outstrip the prevailing interest rates for at least the next five years. In five years, the circulating nickel as we now know it, will be history, and it will be treated with nearly the same reverence that we now give to pre-'65 silver coinage.

We saw what happened when clad copper dimes, quarters and half dollars were introduced in 1965. We should learn from history. Something comparable will very likely soon to happen with nickels. You, as a SurvivalBlog.com reader, are now armed with that knowledge. You can and should benefit from it, before Uncle Sugar performs his next sleight of hand trick and starts passing off silver-plated zinc tokens as "nickels". - James Wesley, Rawles -- Editor of www.SurvivalBlog.com

Permission to forward, repost

Ifyouseekay
27th April 2010, 10:34 AM
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StackerKen
27th April 2010, 10:38 AM
According to coinflation $100 face nickles have a melt value of $125.91.

Not too shabby

I am me, I am free
27th April 2010, 10:51 AM
Bad info on the year the mint went to copper flashed zinc pennies. The switch was made in MID 1982, therefore one has to use a file or some other tool to cut into the penny to determine whether it is solid copper or only copper flashed zinc on the 1982 pennies.

Ponce
27th April 2010, 11:06 AM
What I found interesting about the article is the fact that EVERYTHNG that he said I have been saying for a couple of years at different sites.......specially...... "When
the paper fiat looses its value the coins will retain its original value".

He only forgot to write......"Coins are made by the US Treasury and will be back up by the same.....but.......paper fiat is made by the Feds who won't be around"

I am glad to see that I am not the only "crazy" guy around........even if they are not Cubans hahahahahaahhaa.

madfranks
27th April 2010, 11:08 AM
I understand the reasoning and logic behind this, but it's a totally different game than in 1965 when they took the silver out. Back then a silver dime had real purchasing power, it could get you a couple cans of food. Today a nickel has hardly any purchasing power whatsoever and can't get you anything of worth by itself. If time comes to barter or sell the metal, I bet people would rather have a couple silver dimes/quarters than a hand full of rolled nickels. Instead of hoarding nickels, just buy junk silver. The reasons to hold each are the same but the convenience and recognizability of silver is much better.


Unless the Treasury decides to drop the issuance of nickels entirely, the US Mint will within the next three years be forced to introduce a "new" nickel with a debased composition. It will possibly be zinc (flashed with silver) or possibly even aluminum.

If he seriously thinks they're going to make a silver clad zinc nickel, he's insane. Maybe he mis-spoke and means "silver colored"...?


It is best to ask for new "wrapped" (fresh Federal Reserve Bank issue) rolls. This way, you might have the chance of getting rolls with valuable minting errors--such as "double die" strikes. These are usually noticed and publicized a few months after the fact, and can be quite valuable.

Again, bad advice. The chances of you finding numismatic coins is MUCH higher in hand rolled rolls because you have a much higher chance of getting old war nickels or buffalo nickels. I used to average more than one war nickel per box for a while when I was sorting them. The chances of finding major mint errors in new rolled coins is an infinitesimally small possibility.


4.) If you know someone that has a machine vending business, offer to buy all of their excess nickels once every month or two, by offering a small premium.

5.) If you operate a "mom and pop" retail business with a walk-in clientele, put up a small sign next to your cash register that reads: "WANTED: Rolls of nickels for my collection. I pay $2.25 per 40 coin ($2) roll, regardless of year!" Once the nickel shortage develops (as it inevitably will), you should raise you premium gradually, to keep a steady stream of coin rolls coming in.

WTF! Why would you pay a premium to get nickels when you can get them for face at the bank! How crazy can you be?

chad
27th April 2010, 11:14 AM
i bought 10 boxes of nickels at my bank just because everyone else at gim was doing it. but frankly, deep down inside, i feel retarded everytime i see them in the basement. ::)

madfranks
27th April 2010, 11:33 AM
5.) If you operate a "mom and pop" retail business with a walk-in clientele, put up a small sign next to your cash register that reads: "WANTED: Rolls of nickels for my collection. I pay $2.25 per 40 coin ($2) roll, regardless of year!" Once the nickel shortage develops (as it inevitably will), you should raise you premium gradually, to keep a steady stream of coin rolls coming in.

If I saw someone with that sign next to their register, I'd go to the bank, buy a box of nickels for $100 and sell it to him for $112.50. If he's dumb enough to pay it, I'd go back to the bank and keep repeating it until he realized how dumb he was.


i bought 10 boxes of nickels at my bank just because everyone else at gim was doing it. but frankly, deep down inside, i feel retarded everytime i see them in the basement.

Don't feel retarded, but $1000 worth of silver will do the same thing for you and it looks nicer, is easier to move and is more recognizable for it's metal content.

Low Pan
27th April 2010, 11:35 AM
how do I tag this? lol

good info/idea!

Corinthian Bronze
27th April 2010, 11:42 AM
The switch was made in MID 1982, there one has to use a file or some other tool to cut thru the copper to determine whether it is solid copper or only copper flashed zinc on the 1982 pennies.


A lot easier way of determining the composition of an 1982 penny is to weigh it. A copper one will weigh 3.1 grams or 1/10 of a troy oz and the zinc penny weighs 2.5 grams.

I am me, I am free
27th April 2010, 11:44 AM
The switch was made in MID 1982, there one has to use a file or some other tool to cut thru the copper to determine whether it is solid copper or only copper flashed zinc on the 1982 pennies.


A lot easier way of determining the composition of an 1982 penny is to weigh it. A copper one will weigh 3.1 grams or 1/10 of a troy oz and the zinc penny weighs 2.5 grams.


A file is faster. One stroke and you know.

Ponce
27th April 2010, 11:48 AM
Chad? if that makes you "retarded" then what does my 120 bricks makes me? :oo-->

You did very very good and when tomorrow gets here you will be very pleased with yourself.

chad
27th April 2010, 12:08 PM
120? holy smokes, i am a small time player! ;)

Ponce
27th April 2010, 12:13 PM
Small hell, you (we) are in the .002% of the population.....once more.......congrat.

1970 Silver Art
27th April 2010, 12:19 PM
I need to get back to starting to save nickels. I used to do it briefly last year but I "fell off the wagon" and spent them all. Next month I will "get back on the wagon" and start to save nickels again.

I plan to restart saving nickels each time that I get change back from making a cash purchase.

cigarlover
27th April 2010, 12:21 PM
Nickels are a better investment because pennies are to heavy? Ok maybe the only thing I agree with but how many rolls of nickles to have any serious investment? Not to insult anyone here but unless your flat ass broke why not just buy silver instead? at 18.00 an oz buying 1 oz of silver is like buying 360 nickels. There is also way more of a shortage in silver and way more uses for it so I dont ever see the potential for nickles being a better investment. As for your kids thanking you? Probably not. Instead of going to the store and trading an ox of silver for whatever they now have to take 360 nickels or 18 rolls of them. I'll take the OZ of silver anyday.

chad
27th April 2010, 12:25 PM
I need to get back to starting to save nickels. I used to do it briefly last year but I "fell off the wagon" and spent them all. Next month I will "get back on the wagon" and start to save nickels again.

I plan to restart saving nickels each time that I get change back from making a cash purchase.



that's a hard way to do it, because pricing w/tax mostly negates the nickel being priced in. you'll almost always get dimes or pennies instead.

1970 Silver Art
27th April 2010, 12:30 PM
I need to get back to starting to save nickels. I used to do it briefly last year but I "fell off the wagon" and spent them all. Next month I will "get back on the wagon" and start to save nickels again.

I plan to restart saving nickels each time that I get change back from making a cash purchase.



that's a hard way to do it, because pricing w/tax mostly negates the nickel being priced in. you'll almost always get dimes or pennies instead.


I agree with you on that but I do get some nickels back in my change. Not everytime but a few times. For me, it is an easy way for me to save nickels. I am not in too much of a rush to get $100 worth of nickels from the bank. Besides, I usually concentrate most of my extra FRNs on buying silver art bars. I am not really a nickel hoarder but it is an effortless way for me to save nickels.

Ponce
27th April 2010, 12:45 PM
Mr. Lover.........I don't know about others but by having so much loose change and bricks of nickels I am only following my "plan behind the plan" deal.

In what is to come try to buy a dozen of eggs with one oz of silver and see what that will get you back in change.......a couple of nickels will do just fine.

"Be ready for all and afraid of none"... Ponce

PS: Besides, you can always change to nickels back to paper fiat.....really now?

Ash_Williams
27th April 2010, 01:15 PM
I understand the reason but to take the 60's as an example, if you had spent that silver dollar back then on something non-perishable, or even a stock or bond, there's a good chance you'd be ahead today. And that's today. If we go back 7 years, it was a piss-poor investment. $1 became $5 and took 40 years to do it. You'd have to ask yourself if you'd rather have $5 now or $1 forty years ago. You're looking at about 4% a year return by waiting until 2003, while at today's prices it's about 6%. You'd have to be holding on to this dollar at times when interest rates were much higher.

The buy and hold and hold and hold strategy, for pure profit, hasn't performed well at all. Had you put the $1 into something else back in '63 and realized 7% return until 2003 or so and then converted to silver, you'd have 3x as much silver now to take you on the ride up.

I do keep Canadian nickels (.999 nickel instead of .250) but I have no plans of keeping them for 50 years. I hope to see a good price well before then. The profit is now. In the future you may find that a roll of 40 nickels has gone up so far in value that it has the purchasing power that 20 nickels had back in 2010!

Also the potential of nickel is limited by it's weight as related to it's value. When things are cheap enough to be priced per pound, it becomes very hard to keep enough to keep as part of an investment strategy. Even $100 in nickels is sizable and has weight to it, you start talking about thousands of dollars or tens of thousands and you need a cargo van to be doing any business (some friends of mine actually rented a uhaul truck to handle a crapload of nickels they were taking to get melted). Compare this to $100 in silver which is basically a 5oz bar you could have in your back pocket without it bothering you, or $100 in gold that is just a small ring on your finger.

Just my opinion. Holding and holding doesn't work very well. Things might go up but to make it worthwhile you gotta be taking the initiative. If you were to take profit from you nickels, and go buy more nickels, then you're getting somewhere. It's like having 5 old rusty vehicles on your backyard and opposed to buying 5 each month and selling the cat converters and then the bodies for scrap. The gain requires some amount of being proactive.

TheNocturnalEgyptian
27th April 2010, 01:58 PM
Another way to tell a mid1982 penny, whether it is copper or zinc, is to flip it. The ringing sound is easy for me to distinguish, although not for everybody.

Copper rings kinda like silver, zinc is flat with no ring.

gunDriller
27th April 2010, 02:07 PM
i bought 10 boxes of nickels at my bank just because everyone else at gim was doing it. but frankly, deep down inside, i feel retarded everytime i see them in the basement. ::)


worse that could happen would be if you return them to the bank or trade them to a GIM'er or something.

i haven't researched it a lot. i did one websearch and did not find obvious big uses of cupronickel besides coinage.

what is the killer use for cupro-nickel ?

i've put them on railroad tracks and gotten flat nickels which are pretty cool. especially if you overlap them with a dime or a penny or something. 8)

Ponce
27th April 2010, 02:16 PM
Where many of you are talking about investing and making more money I am talking about retaining what I had and have.

Sure, I bought all my new load between 1982-2002 for an average of $5.16 and maybe I could had done a lot better investing in something else........but......what I have has gone up three time and I HOLD IT.

How many of you here have invested in stocks bonds, or whatever, and lost your money?.......maybe I am an idiot for holding to so much for so long but...... I am a very happy idiot.

Percival
27th April 2010, 02:53 PM
What I found interesting about the article is the fact that EVERYTHNG that he said I have been saying for a couple of years at different sites.......specially...... "When
the paper fiat looses its value the coins will retain its original value".

He only forgot to write......"Coins are made by the US Treasury and will be back up by the same.....but.......paper fiat is made by the Feds who won't be around"

I am glad to see that I am not the only "crazy" guy around........even if they are not Cubans hahahahahaahhaa.


This is basic common sense though, Ponce, its not like you invented the wheel or anything bro. I think most people understand that when paper loses its value coins will increase in value. That doesnt mean they actually heed such advice and save their coins, but I have found that most people understand this concept since it really is a no brainer and doesnt take much to figure out.

zusn
27th April 2010, 03:44 PM
These guys were ahead of their time. Then they got caught. 3.6 million nickels, now that's a stash!

http://findarticles.com/p/news-articles/palm-beach-post/mi_8163/is_20051004/sentences-nickel-heist-saga-driver/ai_n51896323/

I save all of my nickels that I get in change. I don't plan on going to the bank any time soon, although it is tempting!

Ponce
27th April 2010, 03:57 PM
Mr. Persival........."To know about something and do (or say) nothing about it is like knowing nothing"... Ponce

I added the (or say) for your benefit.......how many people did you hear two or three years ago say anything about saving their nickels?......very few.

I am please to write that many PM's has been sent to me thanking me for saying anything about the nickel in different forums.

I didn't "invented" the wheel but simple made it square......... :oo-->

Mill Man
27th April 2010, 07:24 PM
Another way to tell a mid1982 penny, whether it is copper or zinc, is to flip it. The ringing sound is easy for me to distinguish, although not for everybody.

Copper rings kinda like silver, zinc is flat with no ring.


Yep, was gonna post the same thing. I only sort the pennies i get in change.

jedemdasseine
27th April 2010, 08:11 PM
Where many of you are talking about investing and making more money I am talking about retaining what I had and have.




I'm loath to compliment you, Ponce, and further inflate your ego, ;D but I must give credit where credit it due. You are correct. Once again you are ahead of your time: for all intents and purposes, INVESTING IS DEAD, and maintaining what one already has is the best game in town. ;)

Caveat: Hoarding vast quantities of nickels isn't for everyone, nor should it be, but the general principle of actually taking action to preserve purchasing power is vital.

sirgonzo420
27th April 2010, 08:24 PM
I save my nickels received as change, but I haven't brought home any boxes from the bank yet; although the thought has crossed my mind.

But when I hold a nickel in my hand, it is nice to know that I hold some common change that is worth at least face value.

Ponce
27th April 2010, 10:27 PM
Jeden? more more more more MOREEEEEEEE, my ego still has room to grow hahaahaahahahah.

Sirgonzo? Like I said before..........."Hold a brick of nickels in your right hand, if you can, and a $100.00 bill in your left hand, which one feel more like REAL MONEY?.

1970 Silver Art
28th April 2010, 04:06 AM
Jeden? more more more more MOREEEEEEEE, my ego still has room to grow hahaahaahahahah.

Sirgonzo? Like I said before..........."Hold a brick of nickels in your right hand, if you can, and a $100.00 bill in your left hand, which one feel more like REAL MONEY?.


Yeah that $100.00 bill does feels more like REAL MONEY than that brick of nickels. :sarc: :sarc: :sarc: :sarc: :sarc: :sarc:

sirgonzo420
28th April 2010, 05:18 AM
Jeden? more more more more MOREEEEEEEE, my ego still has room to grow hahaahaahahahah.

Sirgonzo? Like I said before..........."Hold a brick of nickels in your right hand, if you can, and a $100.00 bill in your left hand, which one feel more like REAL MONEY?.


I know Ponce... You're right.

I've been lazy, but I have been meaning to pick up a box every few trips to the bank.

MNeagle
28th April 2010, 05:56 AM
I really don't understand the saving nickels concept (or pennies for that matter). Isn't it illegal to melt coins?

Is your goal to use the nickels to purchase things? If so, just save all your loose change.

Seriously, I just don't get it.

chad
28th April 2010, 06:07 AM
it's like most things GSUS or GIM. i don't get most of it. i just do it because everybody else is doing it, and then 3 years later, it turns out i was really smart, and i didn't even know it.

Celtic Rogue
28th April 2010, 06:07 AM
its also ilegal to smoke marijuana... but... ::) ::) ::)

sirgonzo420
28th April 2010, 06:20 AM
I really don't understand the saving nickels concept (or pennies for that matter). Isn't it illegal to melt coins?

Is your goal to use the nickels to purchase things? If so, just save all your loose change.

Seriously, I just don't get it.


The point is that a nickel is worth 5cents.... and sadly the same can't be said for a FRN.

When I get a nickel in change, I know that the metal value is more than or equal to face value.

When I get a FRN in change, I know that the note is "worth" about 2-3 cents... and I have to con someone into trading me something of tangible value for it (due to widespread brainwashing/indoctrination/propaganda, it is not too difficult to "con someone" into accepting a FRN as value).

sirgonzo420
28th April 2010, 06:21 AM
it's like most things GSUS or GIM. i don't get most of it. i just do it because everybody else is doing it, and then 3 years later, it turns out i was really smart, and i didn't even know it.


Chad, honestly, I wasn't sure about you when you first showed up on the original GIM, but I'll be damned if you haven't grown on me.

hahaha

Ponce
28th April 2010, 06:23 AM
I really don't understand the saving nickels concept (or pennies for that matter). Isn't it illegal to melt coins?

Is your goal to use the nickels to purchase things? If so, just save all your loose change.

Seriously, I just don't get it.


Well, I have been saving all my change for the past 33 years but the bricks of nickels is on top of all that.

I really don't know the reason of what I do when I do it but only know that I have to do it............up till now I have been right all the time.......and when I don't do it? I am sorry later.

The past is a very good indicator of what the future will be like......pay attention to it.

chad
28th April 2010, 06:47 AM
it's like most things GSUS or GIM. i don't get most of it. i just do it because everybody else is doing it, and then 3 years later, it turns out i was really smart, and i didn't even know it.


Chad, honestly, I wasn't sure about you when you first showed up on the original GIM, but I'll be damned if you haven't grown on me.

hahaha







you'd be surprised how many people thought i was government agent when i first joined GIM because i didn't join in on everything. turns out i wasn't a dis-info agent, i was just too stupid to understand what everyone was talking about. ;D

madfranks
28th April 2010, 06:48 AM
I think most people understand that when paper loses its value coins will increase in value. That doesnt mean they actually heed such advice and save their coins, but I have found that most people understand this concept since it really is a no brainer and doesnt take much to figure out.


I think you're wrong on this. 99.9% have no understanding of the concept "paper loses it's value" when it comes to paper money. A dollar is a dollar is a dollar, it always is, it always will be. Discussing things like purchasing power and the loss of it through inflation is not something that most people understand. Hence, most people will not expect, nor understand, when the metal value of coins increases due to a weaker dollar.

Ponce
28th April 2010, 07:18 AM
You got it Mr. Franks..........to many the prices go up because they have to go up and not because the dollar has gone down.

That's what I like about loose change, and specially nickels, they are what they are and they loose value only if you do it in your mind because the value is the same as in the day that they were minted......not many understand this.

Coins are not paper fiat.

agnut
28th April 2010, 10:45 AM
Hi all, great thread. Because of Ponce I have been collecting nickels for some time. I have a bit over 7 bricks so far and intend to get more as soon as I can get my sorry ass to the bank.

I think you should understand that Ponce’s over 100 bricks of nickels is in proportion to his total worth AND the weight he attributes to holding nickels for the future.

If Ponce were worth a million bucks, holding 100 bricks at a total of $10,000 cost would only be 1% of his net worth. And we all know that historically, the wise have held 10 to 20 percent of their wealth in precious metals as a hedge against calamity.

So say your total net worth was $100,000. Would it kill you to have 10 bricks of nickels stashed away ? That’s only 1% of your total worth, the same proportion as above.

And what if your total net worth was $10,000 ? What’s that, one measly brick of nickels ?

Actually if my net worth were $10,000 I would have 10 bricks or more. That’s 10% of my net worth. Why so many you ask ? Simply because it would be so easy to turn them in if it became absolutely necessary. And other than holding more silver and gold, the nickels could be used in commerce without having to go to a coin store to sell precious metals.

Actually I see holding nickels as having several positive factors :

1. Getting nickels now at face value is a buying opportunity that may not last too much longer. I have known Ponce for years and what he says can be taken to the bank (or better taken FROM the bank in this case). Ponce is a dyed in the wool futurist and sees events long before they occur. I cannot emphasize enough that you listen to him and think long and hard in an unbiased manner as to how and if his writings will fit into your own future. I have been fortunate to have listened to Ponce and made many changes for the better in my preparations for the future. This nickel thread is but one of hundreds of Ponce’s suggestions for being as diversified as possible in our preps.

2.. In the case of nickels, the potential for gain in purchasing power is only a matter of time as the dollar loses value. What’s the cost of manufacturing a paper $100 dollar bill ? About a nickel ? HaHa

3. It is important to know that coins are minted and issued by the U.S. Treasury while all the paper currency is Federal Reserve Notes, a private corporation. Also keep in mind that most federal reserve currency is only computer entries and there is not paper dollars to back it up. Yikes !

4. Think of nickels as commodities; 25% nickel and 75% copper. As silver has been called poor man’s gold, perhaps it would be wise to think of the nickel (and copper penny) as poor man’s silver. After all, if silver prices go through the roof, what will act as change for transactions ? Maybe the coins. Who knows ?

5. Having bricks of nickels is safe from the standpoint that it can be directly used as necessary. No middleman as with gold and silver. This may change in time but I have my reservations.

6. Next year the nickel may be minted in base metals. Like in the 1964-5, 90% silver coin changeover to base metals, the result will be the same. People will begin to hoard the earlier nickels. They have been doing it with the copper pennies for some time. After all, it is just human nature as stated by Gresham’s law. Bad money drives good money out of circulation (and into hiding).

7.Holding bricks of nickels is wise psychologically. A person holding paper currency spends it without the thought necessary to turn in bricks of nickels. Sort of a way to enforce savings. As with holding physical gold and silver, holding bricks of nickels make the possessor reluctant to part with them.

Let’s see, we had the gold coin confiscation in 1934, the 90% silver coins end in 1964, the copper penny in 1982. And every time the earlier coins were hoarded and rose in value ! What part of history do you not understand ?

I think the nickel is next and waiting for the other shoe to drop will be too late.

This thread and my post will be read by only a few (and only some of the few will actually ACT on this information). When a nickel shortage is reported on the mainstream media, THAT will be the day the door forever slams shut on acquiring quantities of nickels at face value. Otherwise I would be hesitant to contribute. After all, I’m not done getting my greedy paws on more bricks of nickels.

Can’t you hear the hinges creaking ? Can’t you feel the winds of “change” ?

Best wishes and JMHO,

Agnut

“There is need and then there is greed….be greedy. Get more nickels”
Ponce

Ponce
28th April 2010, 11:52 AM
Heyyyyyyyy Agnut, thanks for your kind words but as you know Ponce is only Ponce, no biggie.

BUT.......keep them coming (PLEASEEEEEEEEE) my ego (as per Ms K) is still to small and every little bit helps hahahahahahaahha.

I never see what they write but rather what was the reason to write it......if everything was OK then there would be no reason to write anything about it.... in part I have to thank my EST training for showing me this....Sept B 1977.

Ponce
28th April 2010, 01:37 PM
Hey Agnut............where are you?

agnut
28th April 2010, 07:16 PM
Hey Agnut............where are you?


Hey Ponce. I was out with my younger son making a trash run and taking care of some loose ends. Took the afternoon off to spend some time with him. Took him out to lunch. We went to the animal rescue and looked at the dogs and cats. My volunteers with their organization and wants to be a veterinaran's assistant. Went to thrift store looking for vinyl records; too much old Montovani and Polka music out there. Who the Hell bought all this stuff anyway ? I think I am going to have to wait until folks are selling their collections before I find much desirable material. Patience, my friend, patience.

Went to local Albertsons and got 6 packs of Sara Lee bagels for $2 each. Just sent my other son out to pick up 10 more packs for the freezer. They're probably better for me than the cookies I have with morning coffee. And cheaper too. By the way, the cashier gave me a slip that says I get 5 Red Box movie rentals for free AND a $5 off coupon for the next time I shop there. Heck, all I buy there are bargains anyway.

Came home and picked out gear ratios for the next tranny rebuild. Will be done tomorrow.

Now I'm at the keyboard eating wafer cookies and artichoke hearts.

Now aren't you sorry you asked ?

Best wishes,

agnut

Ponce
28th April 2010, 07:23 PM
Tell me about it.......your burping on my ear while talking to me in the morning while eating your cookies makes me SICKKKKKKKKK......I can only hope that changing your diet will help that..........yukkkkkkkkk disgusting.

Hahahahahahahahaha see you tomorrow.