Methane

[uranian]

From what I've been able to make of all that's going on, it's not so much the oil that's the potential problem as the methane. So this I found interesting:


The Science of the Oil Spill Gulf Cruise Raises Questions on Methane, But Much Data Still to Analyze (http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2010/06/gulf-cruise-raises-questions-on-.html)


June 23, 2010 2:21 PM

Preliminary results from a research cruise measuring methane in deep water near the gushing BP well point to large concentrations of the gas, but what that means for the environment is far from clear.

A crew led by John Kessler, a chemical oceanographer at Texas A&M University, College Station, returned late on Monday from a 10-day cruise on the R/V Cape Hatteras. His team sampled methane in 35 places at depths from 1200 to 1700 meters and at distances from the well head ranging from 7 miles to as close as 500 meters.

Although the crew's water samples have yet to be analyzed, shipboard measurements showed that "concentrations of methane and some of the other components of natural gas, namely, ethane and propane, in the deep waters of the Gulf of Mexico are astonishingly high," Kessler announced at a press conference yesterday afternoon.

Methane concentrations ranged from 10,000 to nearly 1 million times higher in some spots than the normal concentration, which is about 20 nanomoles per liter, Kessler said. These measurements agree with those from a 2-week cruise on the Walton Smith that returned 6 June.

Scientists worry that methane-eating microbes could deplete oxygen in these waters. Kessler said the crew measured oxygen reductions of about 30% at some deep sites but saw no oxygen depletion in others. "It's certainly something where we need to go through our data with a more fine-toothed comb and determine why that is," he said.

The cruise had another purpose-to better quantify how much oil has gushed out of BP's blown well. About 40% of the material flowing out is methane gas, according to measurements by BP engineers, and Kessler's colleague David Valentine, an oceanographer at the University of California, Santa Barbara, proposed measuring methane as a way of quantifying the spilled oil. Kessler said he and Valentine hope to make preliminary estimates in the next week.

[TPTB]

Methane concentrations ranged from 10,000 to nearly 1 million times higher in some spots than the normal concentration,

Ok, so what might the normal concentration of methane actually be out on the Gulf? None? So they measured a million times more than zero?

Maybe they took a measurement over a school of dead fish. :oo-->

[Heimdhal]

Methane concentrations ranged from 10,000 to nearly 1 million times higher in some spots than the normal concentration,

Ok, so what might the normal concentration of methane actually be out on the Gulf? None? So they measured a million times more than zero?

Maybe they took a measurement over a school of dead fish. :oo-->




There is methane in seawater all over the planet. Its a natural occurence, since there is methane in the earth and methane is solluable in water. To suggest that they are saying its a "million times more than zero" is pure hyperbole.

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?

[StackerKen]

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?


Good question.....

I don't wanna miss the answer.

[k-os]

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?


Good question.....

I don't wanna miss the answer.


Me either. :)

Edit: OMG, what if TPTB is TPTB!?!

[gunDriller]

From what I've been able to make of all that's going on, it's not so much the oil that's the potential problem as the methane.

not to put to fine a point on it, but each of us generates a few CC of methane every day. well, for a lot of people, maybe more than a few CC. 8)

having methane inside our digestive tract, erupting from our rectal pore at various times throughout the day ... well, it might smell but it doesn't hurt us.

of course, i did pass up that class in organic chemistry.

is human flatulence, AKA farts, methane, or do I have my carbon-based-molecules mixed up ?

for sure i wouldn't want a few CC of crude oil going through my digestive tract. that sounds like poison.

so i'm not saying the methane is without repercussions, but i'm thinking the oil and the dispersants and the idiots putting all this sh*t in the Gulf are the real problems.

[Half Sense]

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?


Good question.....

I don't wanna miss the answer.


Me either. :)

Edit: OMG, what if TPTB is TPTB!?!


Then he's not worried about his Naples condo since he just got a cut-rate price on a Greek island.

[Heimdhal]

From what I've been able to make of all that's going on, it's not so much the oil that's the potential problem as the methane.

not to put to fine a point on it, but each of us generates a few CC of methane every day. well, for a lot of people, maybe more than a few CC. 8)

having methane inside our digestive tract, erupting from our rectal pore at various times throughout the day ... well, it might smell but it doesn't hurt us.

of course, i did pass up that class in organic chemistry.

is human flatulence, AKA farts, methane, or do I have my carbon-based-molecules mixed up ?

for sure i wouldn't want a few CC of crude oil going through my digestive tract. that sounds like poison.

so i'm not saying the methane is without repercussions, but i'm thinking the oil and the dispersants and the idiots putting all this sh*t in the Gulf are the real problems.


While its true that methane is constnatly around us, constnatly being produced and constantly being absorbed into our bodies, its not the element itself, its the concetrations of it. The old saying "too much of a good thing". Not sure if its a "good thing" to begin with, but you get the general idea.

[StackerKen]

Here in the central valley of Ca, we have a lot of dairy cows farting....and it does lower the air quality.

[Heimdhal]

Here in the central valley of Ca, we have a lot of dairy cows farting....and it does lower the air quality.



You just have to eat them faster. (The cows, not the farts).

[gunDriller]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV8boXLV0ik


classic !

let's get this guy to the White House.

he can perform at the state dinner on July 6 when Netanyahu is visiting from Israel.

it'll raise the level of the conversation.

[Heimdhal]

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?


Good question.....

I don't wanna miss the answer.


Me either. :)

Edit: OMG, what if TPTB is TPTB!?!


What if TPTB is Mr. Methane ?
He seems to be an expert when it comes to methane...

http://strider01.files.wordpress.com/2009/05/album_cover_crap_173_flickr.jpg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uV8boXLV0ik


He seems to be avoiding this thread......????? ???

[SLV^GLD]

FWIW, the stench of flatulence is largely due to hydrogen sulfide. Methane itself is odorless and colorless. Methane is largely inert as well (except for being flammable) and death by asphyxiation is just that, lack of sufficient oxygen.

[TPTB]

Methane concentrations ranged from 10,000 to nearly 1 million times higher in some spots than the normal concentration,

Ok, so what might the normal concentration of methane actually be out on the Gulf? None? So they measured a million times more than zero?

Maybe they took a measurement over a school of dead fish. :oo-->




There is methane in seawater all over the planet. Its a natural occurence, since there is methane in the earth and methane is solluable in water. To suggest that they are saying its a "million times more than zero" is pure hyperbole.

Why is it you seem to be the only informed Floridian in this entire state that isnt very worried about the oil spill?


Heimdhl, come on... you say I seem to be the ONLY informed Floridian in the ENTIRE state that isn't very worried about the oil spill, and you accuse me of hyperbole? Please. :D

What can I say? One hyperbole deserves another. ^-^ Although my point was meant to suggest that any individual measurement would only reflect a very specific location from whence the measurement was taken and that measurement could then be used to create as dire a picture as desired.

Have you ever been to the coastal region along Texas and Louisiana? It stinks like ass there and it has for decades. Lots of nasty chemicals as well as methane. I can hardly believe anything has been able to survive that industrial pollution at all, but they have. People survive disgusting conditions.

Look Heimdahl, I've always appreciated your generally light hearted, humorous and often thoughtful posts so it surprises me that you seem so annoyed by my skepticism. What, you think I'm a BP shill or something? Don't bust on me dude... I can't help that I was born into the Guelph family bloodline, and even though I'm TPTB, I have feelings too, gosh darn it. :'(

Anyway, to answer your question, I never said I wasn't worried about the oil spill. It's an awful environmental catastrophe. My issues here though are with the dissemination of false information, especially on the Internet, and how it may affect people. You know there are good reasons not to shout "Fire" in a crowded theater.

Did you not watch that video about the Ixtoc oil spill in 79 which was nearly identical to the one occurring now? It's been posted nearly a half dozen times by StackerKen and myself. The Gulf didn't die in 1979 and based on that fact alone, I'm pretty sure the Gulf isn't going to die this time either. Not to mention real natural phenomena called oil volcanoes that spew up oil and other crap quite often, and that the ocean floor is coated in thick layers of oily crud...naturally.

Sure, I'm worried about the environment. I've been bitching and grumbling for years.

But if somehow all these reports coming from anonymous sources that there is a gigantic pocket of super pressurized methane 20,000 feet underneath the ocean floor that's about to burst up like a gigantic fart in a bathtub and float over Florida killing everyone in it's path, well, so be it. Or if it creates a giant Tsunami, too bad for me, I'm just not worried about it. I have yet to witness any oil rain and I'm not worried about planet Nibiru either. I've already decided I'm not going anywhere anyway, but that's just my personal decision. My single largest specific personal environmental issue so far is that my Tomato plants have blossom drop from excessive heat and humidity. Damnit.

You, on the other hand, being closer to the water, being young, and having a young family? Seriously, if you're really so worried, then you aught to be packing a cooler and moving your family to wherever your perception tells you is a safe location. Nobody can answer that question for you, though. Who knows which way the wind will be blowing if the event actually occurs.

Oh, and sorry about not responding sooner. I had no reason to think my little post would rile anyone enough to cause me to need to respond to it so I basically just forgot about the thread.

And the funny thing is that while you accuse me of being the only informed Floridian that isn't worried about the spill, I have family in Tampa that accuses me of being excessively worried about the spill. :-[

Can't win for losing.

So, in someone Else's immortal words, " Don't smite me bro." 8)

[StackerKen]

Great post TPTB. (thats why I wanted you to post the answer)

I think you know..(and I can't speak for him) But I don't think Heim was Dising you in anyway.
I think like a lot of us he was curious about your thoughts....

[Heimdhal]

Well, i wrote a long response, and the my laptop crapped out and I lost it.

At any rate: First, thanks for the reply. Im sorry if my post seemed to be short or annoyed. It wasnt. I know it can be hard to decipher the written word on the internet and the intent behind it at times. It was, what I thought at the time, a legitimate question based on my perception on how YOU were perceving the unfolding events. ;)

Im just a simple man trying to make sense of a complicated world and as such I am liable to succumb to the foibles and follies of mans nature. I appologize for that.

Personaly, I share your opinion that we must temper our more extreme emotions with reason and logic. I dont bend to every end of the world article that gets posted, but some do seem slightly more credible than others. The methan bubble and oilvolcano tsunami of doom are not at the front of my "dear god save us all" list, but I do keep an eye on em.

The Itox spill is a good measure for this one, but at the same time, it was only 150 million gallons (sad that we can say "only" for something like that now) where as even conservative reports are putting this current spill at over 350-400 million, with no end in sight.

Floridas economy is tanking along with the rest of the world. We've expereinced it first hand as we get ready to close our construction based family business of 15 years here in a few months. I cant imagine this spill is going to be good for the florida, or the gulf in general. I guess only time will tell.

Anyways, those who know me know I meant no hard feelings with my post and I appologize if there were.

[TPTB]

Thanks Heimdahl. I feel better after an hour or so of sobbing in my pillow, and now I'm ready to kiss and make up. :-*

Hey, seriously, It's cool. You still rank among my favorite posters. :) I've just decided to accept what ever fate is thrown this way, since I can't really control it anyway, and I'm not moving, so...

I remember when Mt. St. Helens blew. There was an old guy who lived there on the side of the volcano. He was warned, but he decided he was staying, come hell or high water.

That's me. ;D

[Heimdhal]

Thanks Heimdahl. I feel better after an hour or so of sobbing in my pillow, and now I'm ready to kiss and make up. :-*

Hey, seriously, It's cool. You still rank among my favorite posters. :) I've just decided to accept what ever fate is thrown this way, since I can't really control it anyway, and I'm not moving, so...

I remember when Mt. St. Helens blew. There was an old guy who lived there on the side of the volcano. He was warned, but he decided he was staying, come hell or high water.

That's me. ;D







If it was just me, I'd be the same as that old guy. As it is, I dont feel like I have the luxury to risk it, ya know.

Its all good dude, leaving doesnt mean well live any longer than any one else. ;)

[TPTB]

Man, just as I was thinking the Gulf isn't going to die from this catastrophe, GypsyBiker posted a thread that suggest Big Oil and the Admin wants the Gulf to die. On purpose. To grow algae. :conf: