bad economy has finally affected me

[chad]

so, we moved out to the homestead we bought about 5 weeks ago. still hadn't heard from my old landlord (a builder) about my $900 deposit on the place.

calls went unreturned, so i popped by his place last night.

he was really upset, eventually admitted they didn't have the $900, had spent it on their mortgage, but will probably be losing their house anyway. i know the bank has already taken away 4 of his rentals. he's down to the one i was living in and his house.

not going to pursue it i guess, i'll probably never see it anyway.

[SLV^GLD]

A project a few states over that required me and coworkers to live there just wrapped up and we are all in the process of collecting our deposits. I got mine and so did one other but the other three are having exactly the same issue. We all found our own separate places to rent.

[SLV^GLD]

By the way, my suggestion would be to politely, but firmly state that if and when another renter moves in and makes deposit that the deposit money should be in check form written to you instead of the landlord. You said you were not going to pursue and that is admirable but you may consider the above approach as I find it rather diplomatic.

[chad]

that's a good, idea actually.

he offered to come out to my new place and work it off, he is a good builder, so i might take him up on that angle.

it just made me wonder how many landlords actually have all of this deposit money versus how many of them are just spending it to get by.

[Libertytree]

so, we moved out to the homestead we bought about 5 weeks ago. still hadn't heard from my old landlord (a builder) about my $900 deposit on the place.

calls went unreturned, so i popped by his place last night.

he was really upset, eventually admitted they didn't have the $900, had spent it on their mortgage, but will probably be losing their house anyway. i know the bank has already taken away 4 of his rentals. he's down to the one i was living in and his house.

not going to pursue it i guess, i'll probably never see it anyway.


Put a lien on it, the bank will have to pay you back "I think" before they can sell it again.

[madfranks]

Sorry to hear you're out $900, that would ruin anybody's day. Your story is a fitting metaphor to the entire banking system. You gave him $900 as a deposit, money that was not supposed to be spent, but rather held in trust until the terms of your contract were up and the money was to be returned. Instead he spent it, counting on future returns to be able to cover his liabilities. Now it is due to you and he doesn't have it. It's kind of like a mini bank run between you and the landlord and unfortunately you lost. While there is legal recourse for you to fight to get the money, it may not be worth it because there's no guarantee you'll ever see it.

[cedarchopper]

If he is a builder, he has tools and materials. Since you have a homestead, all that kind of stuff will come in handy. I would tell him that you would prefer to settle this in a way that is workable for both of you (imply that small claims court and a judgment are not your preferred recourse). I wouldn't let him off the hook just because his gambling didn't work out. $900 is a substantial deposit and he would have held you to the fire if you would have not performed your end of the deal...as evidenced by the fact that he made you put up a deposit in the first place.

[MNeagle]

Agreed. Don't let the sob story lose your $900. Think of it as a business deal, not personal. After all, that's what's he's already done! Fight for the money that's already yours.

You deserve/paid for it already. Now get it back.

Don't roll over.

[chad]

i'm probably going to go the work it off route. i need a new deck, i'll buy the materials and have him to the job. i also need some clay brought out to be sloped against the foundation for runoff. he has a skidster that's up for sale, so i could have him do that as well. siding repair, some electrical work, new door on the barn, i have a billion little projects he can do until we're even.

made me think though, how many of these multiplex apartment places actually have all of that money?

[Book]

http://rlv.zcache.com/mr_nice_guy_tshirt-p235065825367743586trlf_400.jpg

Most here agree that he owes you your $900 DEPOSIT. Convince him that he still does.

:taunt:

[chad]

i'm not going to get the deposit. he's had 4 places taken back from the bank, he's declared bankruptcy, and he's in foreclosure on his residence. 2 lumber yards also have judgments against him. i'm probably like guy #437 in line to be paid back.

i have 3 judgments from other people who owe me money going back 7 years from my business, never been paid on any of them. all it ever turns in to is a lawyer/court game which ends up costing even more time + money.

call me a sap (which i probably am). i'm going to take work in kind in lieu of the cash, at least i'll get something at the end of the day other than endless trips to the courthouse.

[Twisted Titan]

that's a good, idea actually.

he offered to come out to my new place and work it off, he is a good builder, so i might take him up on that angle.

it just made me wonder how many landlords actually have all of this deposit money versus how many of them are just spending it to get by.



[b]I have landlorded for over 13 years and I can tell you flat out I spend security almost immediately on updates to the place or related stuff

I felt awkward at first but after a few tenants stiffing you on the last month rent you wise up to game pretty quick

This sucker is on a postive feedback loop

Any background check/credit on current tenants is null and void after 4-6 months because the most "secure" job can be vaporized just that fast

The name of the game is get what you can get while people are still willing to trade and accept dollars.

Cause one day soon they wont.

T

[cedarchopper]

Good luck. If he actually does $900 worth of work for you, you will be the only one getting anything out of him...don't hold your breath. I would take tools and material and be done with it if that is at all possible.

[Twisted Titan]

Good luck. If he actually does $900 worth of work for you, you will be the only one getting anything out of him...don't hold your breath. I would take tools and material and be done with it if that is at all possible.


This is sound advice

He is bad situation that is getting worse by the day

He wont be in any type of mindset to "work off his debt"

Take the tangibles and runn

T

[Grand Master Melon]

Not that I condone his action but I learned long ago to never count on getting any of your deposit back at all.

It would be nice if he worked off the money though. In some ways that may actually be better.

[cedarchopper]

He is bad situation that is getting worse by the day

He wont be in any type of mindset to "work off his debt"

Take the tangibles and runn

T[/b][/i]


Exactly! He is in a crisis and making promises right and left. To do hard physical labor for "no pay check at the end of the day" requires a person to be in a strong position. It sounds good "working off his debt", but I find it improbable...not impossible, but time will tell.

[horseshoe3]

If he's already in bankruptcy, he can't give you tools to settle the debt. The court has already locked them up (legally speaking). The only thing he has left that he truly owns and can trade on is his labor. I think you should get what you can from him in labor, but don't expect too much as noted above. And don't let him know how much you own or leave things lying around. Desperate men do things they wouldn't normally do.

[Book]

he was really upset, eventually admitted they didn't have the $900...



http://canuckjihad.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/crybaby.png?w=300&h=425

:oo-->

[chad]

he was really upset, eventually admitted they didn't have the $900...



http://canuckjihad.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/crybaby.png?w=300&h=425

:oo-->




yeah, i know you're right. :-\

well, i'll report back as to what happens.

[7th trump]

If hes an honest man he will honor paying you back in what ever form or way he can under the circumstances and you should accept what he can do. You can always negotiate Chad. Dont take his recourse away from him.
If hes not an honorable person and has the means to pay, and doesnt, then by all means do what it takes to get your property back.

[ximmy]

If he's already in bankruptcy, he can't give you tools to settle the debt. The court has already locked them up (legally speaking). The only thing he has left that he truly owns and can trade on is his labor. I think you should get what you can from him in labor, but don't expect too much as noted above. And don't let him know how much you own or leave things lying around. Desperate men do things they wouldn't normally do.


This is one of the most wicked things I've heard someone say... right, let's take away the man's ability to make a livelihood... he's got a good winter coat too... see if you can get that.

[Skirnir]

I would advise delegating the matter to a collection agency. Also, contact the state's attorney general (AG). Finally, if you cannot afford a lawyer, contact a legal aid office.

[cedarchopper]

If he's already in bankruptcy, he can't give you tools to settle the debt. The court has already locked them up (legally speaking). The only thing he has left that he truly owns and can trade on is his labor. I think you should get what you can from him in labor, but don't expect too much as noted above. And don't let him know how much you own or leave things lying around. Desperate men do things they wouldn't normally do.


This is one of the most wicked things I've heard someone say... right, let's take away the man's ability to make a livelihood... he's got a good winter coat too... see if you can get that.


I'm the one that said try to get tools and materials ;]

It sounds like his old gig has played out.

[ximmy]

If he's already in bankruptcy, he can't give you tools to settle the debt. The court has already locked them up (legally speaking). The only thing he has left that he truly owns and can trade on is his labor. I think you should get what you can from him in labor, but don't expect too much as noted above. And don't let him know how much you own or leave things lying around. Desperate men do things they wouldn't normally do.


This is one of the most wicked things I've heard someone say... right, let's take away the man's ability to make a livelihood... he's got a good winter coat too... see if you can get that.


I'm the one that said try to get tools and materials ;]

It sounds like his old gig has played out.


First reading that got to me for a sec.. I am over it now... :) Peace :oo-->

[Book]

yeah, i know you're right. :-\

well, i'll report back as to what happens.



All his other victims understood that they were extending him credit. Your security deposit is something else.

:)

[Spectrism]

I would advise delegating the matter to a collection agency. Also, contact the state's attorney general (AG). Finally, if you cannot afford a lawyer, contact a legal aid office.


That is some bad advice.

A collection agency for $900 will probably give you $300.

If he really is broke, there is nothing to gain. If you can get any value- as in labor, that is better than a complete loss and you do not kick a guy that is down.

[Sock Puppy]

I don't know what state you are in (I mean which state like Arkansas, Texas, California, etc.), but in WA the landlord must put deposits in a trust account until the lease/rental is terminated.

He may not fear that you might get a judgement against him as it sounds like everyone has a judgement against him right now, but the possibility of going to jail for fraud might make him see differently.

It sounds like you have a pretty good relationship with this criminal fellow, so you might want to cut him some slack, but if you don't, you may have options to at least get back at him.

I had something like this happen to me recently to the tune of $1200. Eventually I was able to figure out that the guy was planning to cheat me right from the start.

At that point, I had to figure out how much I wanted revenge, and how much I just wanted to get something for what I had lost.

Then, I had to assess what the odds of getting something back from various avenues. I decided (like it appears you have) that it wasn't worth my time and effort.

My guy offered to work it off, too, but I've been that route before and it NEVER works.......NEVER. If you want to see some slipshod, cut-corners, half-assed work, just have someone who owes money to you "work it off".

I just took the loss and wrote it off as the cost of doing business.

--SP

[BabushkaLady]

Yes Chad this is a trend! I almost got screwed out of my last deposit. The next one I bartered to clean up the place in lieu of a deposit.

Your situation does sound somewhat more promising if the guy does do work for you. I'd plan and book the pay-back time ASAP though.

Court and any other recourse really is a no-win, time and money losing proposition.

Good Luck!

[Book]

I don't know what state you are in (I mean which state like Arkansas, Texas, California, etc.), but in WA the landlord must put deposits in a trust account until the lease/rental is terminated.

He may not fear that you might get a judgment against him as it sounds like everyone has a judgment against him right now, but the possibility of going to jail for fraud might make him see differently.



http://www.solarnavigator.net/media/media_images/bbc_the_verdict_jury.jpg

He knowingly and willfully STOLE that security deposit. That's theft.

[cedarchopper]

Wanting your security deposit back is not kicking a guy when he is down. It is not like giving somebody credit and them not paying you...everybody knows the risk of credit. A deposit is like putting money in a saving account or escrow account.

[Phoenix]

so, we moved out to the homestead we bought about 5 weeks ago. still hadn't heard from my old landlord (a builder) about my $900 deposit on the place.

calls went unreturned, so i popped by his place last night.

he was really upset, eventually admitted they didn't have the $900, had spent it on their mortgage, but will probably be losing their house anyway. i know the bank has already taken away 4 of his rentals. he's down to the one i was living in and his house.

not going to pursue it i guess, i'll probably never see it anyway.


Does he have anything else to take? If he paid it to banksters, I wouldn't let it go. If he used it for genuine personal needs, I'd feel otherwise. File a small claims suit, and I'm sure the money will materialize quickly.

[Phoenix]

he's declared bankruptcy


Unlike most bankster debt, IIRC, yours is a "secured debt" in bankruptcy. Like I say, IIRC - check around to verify this. Make sure the bankruptcy trustee knows about the $900 due.

[Phoenix]

yeah, i know you're right. :-\

well, i'll report back as to what happens.



All his other victims understood that they were extending him credit. Your security deposit is something else.

:)


A security deposit is COLLATERAL.

The $900 is supposed to be placed into a separate account, and due back to the tenant, minus actual damages, with interest at the end of tenancy.

[Skirnir]

I would advise delegating the matter to a collection agency. Also, contact the state's attorney general (AG). Finally, if you cannot afford a lawyer, contact a legal aid office.


That is some bad advice.

A collection agency for $900 will probably give you $300.

If he really is broke, there is nothing to gain. If you can get any value- as in labor, that is better than a complete loss and you do not kick a guy that is down.


After legal fees and given the uncertainty surrounding the matter, $300 is better than $0. As for kicking the guy while he was down, he should have thought about that before misappropriating a security deposit.

[TheNocturnalEgyptian]

Honestly a contract is a contract. I would let him know that just because he can't pay doesn't mean the contract doesn't stand. He still owes you that money until he pays you and finishes the contract, or you willingly dissolve it. If he's actually going into bankruptcy, I wouldn't really want to take the shirt off his back, but the odds are good that he's just pissed about all his other investments going underwater and can't stand the idea of "losing more money" (it was never his, he was only a trustee) because his last tenant moved out.

I wouldn't want to pursue legal action, I'd do like chad and settle it man to man unless the situation made it impossible, but seriously, a contract is a contract.

[chad]

well, i told you i would keep you posted, so...

i went back over there tonight, had a beer, he came up with $200 cash, and we counted following as worth $150. i needed these items anyway, so i figured $150 was a good deal for them:

a) in the box wildthing chainsaw (18", but is should be good for brush)
b) in the box electric weed trimmer
c) mccoulgh chainsaw that runs great and had just been serviced (has the tag on from may at the service place)

http://i27.tinypic.com/2qvxzer.jpg

we're working on the rest of the deal, but i'm $350 there.

[Trinity]

Great going chad. Other tools you might consider are a portable table saw, a wet saw, a miter box,other saws or drills plus good hand tools. Good luck!

[cedarchopper]

You did good! $150 for the 2 chain saws is fair...the Walmart weedeater, I don't know about that ;]

Did you talk about other tools? How about scrap gold? :]

[chad]

yeah, the weedeater is...but my wife gave me a mandate to get one because she is terrified of the gas powered efco with a 9" steel blade on it.

he's supposed to be digging out a big extension ladder i'm going to take, and he also says he has a new in the box power washer as his brother's he's going to bring home.

i'll keep you posted ;)

p.s. i think the scap gold was all sold off long ago. :-[

[Trinity]

Grab the extension ladder. Hopefully it is a good one if not scrap it.

[banjo]

It does seem as if his intentions are honorable. He might just be a guy who got caught up in a bad situation and made a bad move and does intend to make things right.

[Book]

Yep. This thread is ending way better than it started...lol.

:)

[StackerKen]

It does seem as if his intentions are honorable. He might just be a guy who got caught up in a bad situation and made a bad move and does intend to make things right.


Yep.

Ya did good Chad :)

[7th trump]

well, i told you i would keep you posted, so...

i went back over there tonight, had a beer, he came up with $200 cash, and we counted following as worth $150. i needed these items anyway, so i figured $150 was a good deal for them:

a) in the box wildthing chainsaw (18", but is should be good for brush)
b) in the box electric weed trimmer
c) mccoulgh chainsaw that runs great and had just been serviced (has the tag on from may at the service place)

http://i27.tinypic.com/2qvxzer.jpg

we're working on the rest of the deal, but i'm $350 there.



i still have my wildthing chain saw and two models up from that going on 7 years now. Some say they are junk but most STIHL owners never really clean their chain saw and just put it away and base their reliability on year after year of never really cleaning the chain saw. To be honest my dad has a STIHL and he just went and had to put 250.00 into it on a chain saw that cost him 500.00. It will be his last time he puts any money into it because they do not make parts for that model and what he did get fixed was parts from a guy who had them laying around. STIHL are good if you use them all the time for the money, but if you dont its a waste of money and they are not getting cheaper by the day. I think my next chain saw is going to be a Husky as I'm hearing good things about them as they are compareable to the STIHL in performance of power and steel construction for the price of a top of the line POULAN.
Both good chain saws if you keep them in working order. After a good season of chain sawing break down the chain saw and clean the hell out of it....................they will last as long as any STIHL amd are not as expensive to repair as a STIHL

[chad]

what do you mean by "clean?" take the chain off and oil it? i', new to chainsaw cleaning. i'm the guy who just blows it off and puts it away.:conf:

for the record, i think he's going to make good on this. he's hugely embarrassed about it. tonight is more tools night ;D

[7th trump]

what do you mean by "clean?" take the chain off and oil it? i', new to chainsaw cleaning. i'm the guy who just blows it off and puts it away.:conf:

for the record, i think he's going to make good on this. he's hugely embarrassed about it. tonight is more tools night ;D

Clean as in take the chain and bar off and clean out the clutch and brake assembly, take off the carb cover and spray down the card with a carb cleaner(with the air filter still on) to get all the wood and dirt chips from the card. Take off the filter and clean it with gasoline and air hose. Basically hit everything with an airhose first to dislodge any dirt and wood chips in and around the outside of the card and spray with carb cleaner or gas afterwards and then air hose after that.
Just a good cleaning really.

He seems to be a guy of honor and I'm glad you didnt take the advice of others and not give him any recourse to settle and just pursue him in court.
We have a bunch of capitalistic vultures in this forum who like to see debt get paid with a pound of blood and flesh which is beyond any real reasoning besides being purely vendictive.

[chad]

i'm probably a sap, but as i approach age 40, i don't have much piss and vinegar left in me anymore. i'm approaching a calm state about life where i take things as they come.

i have a great wife, awesome home, 2 healthy kids, no problems really of any kind. i can't bother myself much to get worked up over small things in life any longer.

i know people will argue other angles, but that's just kind of the way i am at this point.

[horseshoe3]

Husqvarna WAS on par with Stihl. About 3 years ago, they made the conscious decision to lower their quality to compete with the box store brands. But like you say, if you don't use it that hard, it should last quite a while.

I cut around 30 cords per year of hard wood (Oak, walnut, mulberry) and really hard wood (Osage orange). I used to have a fleet of Homelites that I would take out to the pasture and hope to get a pickup load cut before they all needed repair. Now I have one Stihl that never breaks down (in the last 12 years anyway.)

The hard use saws are now Stihl and Dol-Mar. Husky intentionally took themselves out of the market.

[SLV^GLD]

i'm probably a sap, but as i approach age 40, i don't have much piss and vinegar left in me anymore. i'm approaching a calm state about life where i take things as they come.

i have a great wife, awesome home, 2 healthy kids, no problems really of any kind. i can't bother myself much to get worked up over small things in life any longer.

i know people will argue other angles, but that's just kind of the way i am at this point.
I'm really starting to mellow with age, too. I like it.
I'm only 32 and we are just now considering kids.
I've gotten a lot out of my system and have figured out what is actually important to me.
I only wish I'd figured these things out when I was 22 but I have no regrets.
I can be irritated but it takes a whole lot to get me irate anymore.
Money is one of those things I can make more of and when it leaves my hands I have no expectations of it coming back, even under contract.
I'm glad to hear that your counterparty is trying to make some restitution.

[cedarchopper]

Husqvarna WAS on par with Stihl. About 3 years ago, they made the conscious decision to lower their quality to compete with the box store brands. But like you say, if you don't use it that hard, it should last quite a while.

I cut around 30 cords per year of hard wood (Oak, walnut, mulberry) and really hard wood (Osage orange). I used to have a fleet of Homelites that I would take out to the pasture and hope to get a pickup load cut before they all needed repair. Now I have one Stihl that never breaks down (in the last 12 years anyway.)

The hard use saws are now Stihl and Dol-Mar. Husky intentionally took themselves out of the market.


What do you do with the Bois de Arc (Osage Orange)? That is some hard wood...many a chainsaw have died trying to cut a big bodark. I've got a Stihl MS-290 (Farm Boss) that has never given me any trouble in the 7 years I've had it. Fires right up and gets after it.

Chad's 2 chainsaws will cut wood...if one breaks down he has the other for backup. Between the 2, he should be able to put up enough firewood for his homestead to last years. At a $100 a cord (value), the payback will be substantial.

[horseshoe3]

I cut most of it for firewood and if there is a piece long and straight enough, I'll save it for a fencepost. It lasts forever in the ground. Most of it I burn or give to my parents to burn. I stockpile some and sell some. It's an awesome wood. People who are not from the high plains don't know what they are missing. Burns extremely hot and clean. Keeps 40+ years in an uncovered woodpile and a decent fencepost will last over 100 years. But with all that good comes the bad. It's hell to cut and weighs a lot more than any other commonly used wood. BTW, we call it hedge around here, but that word means something completely different in the rest of the world.

[cedarchopper]

I cut most of it for firewood and if there is a piece long and straight enough, I'll save it for a fencepost. It lasts forever in the ground. Most of it I burn or give to my parents to burn. I stockpile some and sell some. It's an awesome wood. People who are not from the high plains don't know what they are missing. Burns extremely hot and clean. Keeps 40+ years in an uncovered woodpile and a decent fencepost will last over 100 years. But with all that good comes the bad. It's hell to cut and weighs a lot more than any other commonly used wood. BTW, we call it hedge around here, but that word means something completely different in the rest of the world.


Bodark is also a fine furniture wood...not many people work with it but it is very stable and finishes extremely smooth. The drawback is it is hard to work. It is also good turning wood...it is a favored wood for batons and mallets. I've been using a bodark mallet for years.

In my area they planted bodarks for hedges before barb-wire (1800's). The big trees around now are remnants from the hedges...most of them get cut down because of the horse apples dropping on cars, or roofs. I sold a property with 3 big bodarks out front (all males...no apples dropping) and the guy cut down the trees...I was pissed. These were heritage trees...just wasted them.

[horseshoe3]

If you don't mind my asking, what's your general location? I'm in central KS. Same thing here on using hedge for fencing. No cow would try to walk through that. I've got a few that measure over 40" diameter. I won't be cutting those down, but the one's that come up in the pastures get cleared out. It's amazing how fast they grow for such a dense wood. I cleared a pasture that had most of the trees 12" or less. The 12" trees had 28 growth rings. I expected them to be older.

Yes, it makes a beautiful wood. I've never done any woodworking with it because it is so hard and usually twisted. But I imagine if you had the skill and patience you could make some pretty nice pieces.

[cedarchopper]

Central Texas. Bodarks were more common in E. Texas but they spread wide and far because of there usefulness. They were also the inspiration for the invention of barbwire. Below is a link about long bows from bodarks, but if you scroll down there is a good article about the history of the tree.

http://www.osageorange.com/Roughing_out_T.html