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MNeagle
10th August 2010, 10:51 AM
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/48631000/jpg/_48631347_heads304x171.jpg
Use of the $1 coin instead of a note could save the US $700m per year, but Americans won't carry it

Why the US keeps minting coins people hate and won't use
By Daniel Nasaw
BBC News, Washington

In hidden vaults across the country, the US government is building a stockpile of $1 coins. The hoard has topped $1.1bn - imagine a stack of coins reaching almost seven times higher than the International Space Station - and the piles have grown so large the US Federal Reserve is running out of storage space.

Americans won't use the coins, preferring $1 notes. But the US keeps minting them anyway, and the Fed estimates it already has enough $1 coins to last the next 10 years.

And at the current rate, the inventory will grow to $2bn (£1.3bn) by 2016, the Fed estimates.

The coins began to pile up in 2007 when a law went into effect creating a new series of $1 coins commemorating dead US presidents.

Already stamped into millions of pieces of eight-gram, manganese-brass alloy are presidents no-one even remembers anymore, like Franklin Pierce, and ineffectual executives like James Buchanan, whose incompetence historians say helped lead the US to civil war.


'Public resistance'

Congress passed the law creating the coins despite evidence that Americans never liked the $1 coin in the past.

In a 2002 report, for instance, the investigative arm of Congress described "public resistance to begin using the dollar coin" despite a three-year, $67m (£42m) effort to promote the previous series.

Since the presidential coin programme began, the US government has spent an additional $30m to promote them but they still have not taken hold.

"We have tried every major idea that we can come up with, with limited success," US Mint Director Edmund Moy told a congressional panel last month.

US officials say a peculiar set of factors have hindered public acceptance of the $1 coin.

"Americans are creatures of habit," Mr Moy told Congress. "They are very used to using the bill. They're not used to using coins in regular retail transactions."

The US Mint has also identified an economic "awkward moment" in retail transactions involving the $1 coin. The buyer is afraid the cashier will reject the coin and cashiers are afraid buyers won't accept them in change, so both are disinclined to try.

Mint and Fed officials have also identified a vicious cycle.

Retailers will not stock the coins because they do not see consumers using them, while consumers will not use the coins because retailers do not stock them.

Storage costs

Armoured car carriers and banks will not stock the coins until they are in greater use; banks still see the coins as collectors' items, not money that consumers will use.

Continue reading the main story “Start QuoteWe shouldn't continue to push a coin that isn't going anywhere”

End Quote Melvin Watt Congressman
And even some coin collectors dislike them.

"We've had any number of people over the years complain about receiving a dollar coin," says Tom DeLorey, a Chicago coin dealer.

Yet the piles have continued to grow because the law requires the US Mint to issue four new presidential coins each year even if most of the previous year's coins remain in government vaults.

In addition to the millions spent to promote the coins, shipping, storing and guarding the excess inventory costs money, though how much is unclear.

Congressman Melvin Watt, a North Carolina Democrat who chairs a subcommittee with jurisdiction on the issue, said Mint and Fed officials had yet to respond to his requests for a detailed accounting.

The US Mint declined to make officials available for an interview.

The Fed has warned Congress of rising storage costs but declined to provide detailed figures to the BBC.

Replacing paper money

US officials and coin experts note that Australia, Britain, Canada and Japan have successfully introduced coins in similar denominations, but only after phasing out paper notes.

The US is the only country in the G8 that circulates note in its base unit of currency.

Because a coin can last four decades while a note lasts only a few years, replacing the dollar bill with the coin could save the US $500m to $700m per year in printing and paper costs.

Only an act of Congress could slow or halt the coins' pile-up, either by phasing out the $1 note or halting the minting of the coins. Neither is likely to happen soon in today's polarised, bitterly partisan political environment, though some in Congress are clearly frustrated.

"We shouldn't continue to push a coin that isn't going anywhere," Mr Watt tells the BBC.

No legislation has been introduced to remedy the problem, though Mr Watt says he anticipates taking action next year.

At least one congressman has called for legislation to phase out the $1 note, noting the declining purchasing power of a single dollar.

"I don't see why we need to have the federal government go through the expense of making and replacing paper money for an amount of value that has traditionally in this country been represented by a coin," Congressman Brad Sherman, a California Democrat, said last month.

Until the US phases out the $1 note or stops minting the coins, they will keep piling up in the vaults.

"People will grumble and [the coins] will be unpopular for a few months but then they'll get used to it," says David Lange, director of research for the Numismatic Guaranty Corporation, a service for coin collectors.

"It's that simple."

Or, in the bureaucratic language of Congress' investigative arm: "The most substantial barrier is the current widespread use of the dollar bill in everyday transactions."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-10783019

undgrd
10th August 2010, 11:02 AM
First...why does everyone outside the US insist the US do things the same as them? Really tired of that.
Second...I would rather carry a single FRN than carry something of equal "value" that weighs 8 times as much!

mightymanx
10th August 2010, 11:12 AM
If nobody wants them I'll take them.

madfranks
10th August 2010, 01:00 PM
Of course, back when a dollar was silver, there was no problem. The government has done a good job of killing the coinage of the US. They killed the dollar coin with the Susan B Anthony dollar, which was the same size and color of a quarter. After a decade of confusion, people just stopped using them. They also killed the half dollar in a similar manner; when they went to clad coins except the 40% silver half dollar, people hoarded them instead of spending them. After 5 years with no circulating half dollars, retailers, banks and individuals got out of the habit of holding and using them. It's just another example of the general incompetence of government agencies. If any private mint made coins or medallions based on the US Mint model, they'd be out of business.

AndreaGail
10th August 2010, 04:13 PM
from a hobby perspective,

I'm sick of them making varieties of each coin

the state quarters thing was cool i'll give them that but everything else is just overkill

I'm sick of getting variations on dollars, nickels, pennies, etc

It's get annoying trying to figure out where it needs to be slotted into your whitman folder lol
It's actually made me lose interest in sorting through my change trying to find all the variations

Oversaturation of a novelty / gimmick always kills it...trading cards, comics, etc

Heimdhal
10th August 2010, 06:24 PM
it does seem that mint is trying to do everything it can to get people back into coins. Like Andrea Gail said, they ahve so many variations of each type of coin, and they peddle it to the home collector or numistmatic hobbiest, its un canny.

I think part of the reason is that coins last longer than paper notes, so in the long run it is cheaper for them to keep a coin in circulation than it is to keep reprinting the notes (i know, its almost confusing, since all they do is print print print! lol).

thats just speculation on my part though.

I rarley use coins unless im at the arcade lol. ALl the change I get in the course of the day, and my wife included, we put into a change jar and then count it up every couple months or so and go and do something fun with the kid, or go to the movies or just use it pay a stray bill. Usualy is never more than 40-50 bucks.

Heimdhal
10th August 2010, 06:25 PM
sorry double post.

the riot act
10th August 2010, 06:39 PM
ALl the change I get in the course of the day, and my wife included, we put into a change jar

The wife and I haven't spent any change in 20 years. We have two 5 gallon water jugs full and starting on a third.

Coins are issued by the Tres/mint. So that means that they are still the only valid currency.

FRN's as we all know are issued by a private corp.

1970 silver art
10th August 2010, 06:50 PM
Collecting the coins such as Morgan Dollars, Peace Dollars, and $20 St Gaudens gold coins are the real coins to collect if someone wants to get into numismatics in my opinion.

Saul Mine
10th August 2010, 06:57 PM
I got my first silver dollar when I was four. It was huge. It was heavy. It had such majesty that I was afraid to try to spend it. When I get one of these dollar coins now I feel like I should wash the hand that touched it.

The federal government has such a lousy reputation with money that they should not be allowed to make it at all.

Bluegill
11th August 2010, 05:00 PM
Economically it makes absolute perfect sense to get rid of the $1 note and use 1$ coins. It's a no brainer. The stupid sheeple can adapt. Personally I prefer the large dollar coins... ;D

I think there is something more going on here than meets the eye.

The Dollar, like the Peso, Yen, Franc and Lira is no longer going to be sub-divided. Because of massive debasement, it too will become the smallest denomination. Like the aforementioned foreign coins, the dollar coin will be the new penny. Worthless with basically no buying power. Nobody will be bothered to pick one up off the ground worthless.

The mint is getting prepared for circulation...

Like the Centavos, Sens & Rins, Centimes and Centesimis, the Cent coins will become demonetized. Also expect to see $2, $5, $10 and $50 coins too. With paper notes with large quantities of zeros.

Just my half baked theory... ;D

gunDriller
13th August 2010, 06:19 PM
Economically it makes absolute perfect sense to get rid of the $1 note and use 1$ coins. It's a no brainer. The stupid sheeple can adapt. Personally I prefer the large dollar coins... ;D

I think there is something more going on here than meets the eye.

The Dollar, like the Peso, Yen, Franc and Lira is no longer going to be sub-divided. Because of massive debasement, it too will become the smallest denomination. Like the aforementioned foreign coins, the dollar coin will be the new penny. Worthless with basically no buying power. Nobody will be bothered to pick one up off the ground worthless.

The mint is getting prepared for circulation...

Like the Centavos, Sens & Rins, Centimes and Centesimis, the Cent coins will become demonetized. Also expect to see $2, $5, $10 and $50 coins too. With paper notes with large quantities of zeros.

Just my half baked theory... ;D


i don't know about the exact details, but i think the general trend you mention is happening.

a Silver Eagle would make a decent $50 piece.

a quarter ounce gold Eagle would make a decent $500 piece.

Joe King
31st August 2010, 12:46 AM
it does seem that mint is trying to do everything it can to get people back into coins. Like Andrea Gail said, they ahve so many variations of each type of coin, and they peddle it to the home collector or numistmatic hobbiest, its un canny.
That's exactly what it is. They're trying to create "collectables" from the get-go in order to drive demand for their "product".

cthulu
23rd October 2010, 04:19 PM
A lot of people talk about ending the fed. Well, diminish the fed and use presidential coins. I use them. Now I still have to use checks and private corp money for larger transactions, but that's the mint's fault for not issuing larger denominated coins. The fed pays cost for fiat but face value for coins. If tshtf, coins would be worth more than fiat. Look at zimbabwe. There are options out there. We don't have to be such slaves to the fed, but imho, I think most people want to a> only complain and b> want someone to do all the work for them so that if something happens than can go back to a>

Horn
23rd October 2010, 04:22 PM
Old fella at the register gave me two of those things mistaking them for quarters.

Who was I to point out the details of his error?

Poseiden
24th October 2010, 05:55 PM
Economically it makes absolute perfect sense to get rid of the $1 note and use 1$ coins. It's a no brainer. The stupid sheeple can adapt. Personally I prefer the large dollar coins... ;D

I think there is something more going on here than meets the eye.

The Dollar, like the Peso, Yen, Franc and Lira is no longer going to be sub-divided. Because of massive debasement, it too will become the smallest denomination. Like the aforementioned foreign coins, the dollar coin will be the new penny. Worthless with basically no buying power. Nobody will be bothered to pick one up off the ground worthless.

The mint is getting prepared for circulation...

Like the Centavos, Sens & Rins, Centimes and Centesimis, the Cent coins will become demonetized. Also expect to see $2, $5, $10 and $50 coins too. With paper notes with large quantities of zeros.

Just my half baked theory... ;D


i don't know about the exact details, but i think the general trend you mention is happening.

a Silver Eagle would make a decent $50 piece.

a quarter ounce gold Eagle would make a decent $500 piece.


gd, are you suggesting minting new Ag & Au coins? What would happen to the current $1 SAE or the $10 GAE?

bg, me thinks your theory needs a little more baking.