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Santa
13th February 2011, 01:12 PM
I didn't write this piece. It came from the mises.org site, but I think it makes a few cogent and rather unusual points and thus worth reading and perhaps commenting on.


http://mises.org/Community/forums/p/8834/226949.aspx


Many people talk of how communism is a "noble concept" but that it can't work. We are told how people have suffered under communism - the intellectuals and artists who were allegedly targeted and killed in mao's cultural revolution for example, the tens of millions of ukrainians murdered by stalin, the aggressive expansionism, gulags, the ridiculous notions of lysenkoism and the idea of making everyone work for equal and very low wages, the extent of state control over everyone's lives. But communism, despite all this, is still a "noble concept" and that is because there is a nugget of pure gold at the centre of this ideology -and that is socialism - an ideal of treating people fairly.

Many of the positive things about communism as it has been practiced and realised in actuality are not known to the general public. For example, that a policy of full employment was accompanied by free housing. The poorest people in russia had a happier and more secure existence under soviet rule than they do today when they can find themselves homeless, counting themselves lucky to work unreasonable hours for little pay for capitalists, and in a society where there is a lot of corruption, crime and sleaze, and the mafia is strong. If communism "did not work" it is nevertheless true that what it was replaced with is little better, and in a number of ways worse.

Communism does work as practiced today in various nations around the world. these now are all non-white nations, non-western nations. Because they reject the western capitalist way of life they are demonised. But the people living in these countries do benefit from communism - and the communism is special there in that it is no longer internationalist and has taken on a nationalist flavour. Even Soviet Russia had to resort to rousing feelings of nationalistic pride in ww2. So these communist regimes are nationalistic and also socialistic, and yet they are undoubtedly fascist as well in that the state requires that the people obey its laws and serve the state's existence.

The communism practiced in various countries now is different in each one. To some extent capitalism has been allowed, including allowing western capitalists to relocate factories to China, for example, and exploit the Chinese people. not good. but the variant of communism they have in china still has benefits to the Chinese people in that it controls criminal activities far more effectively than would otherwise be the case and takes a strong stance against such things as drug dealing, prostitution and pornography.

These communist countries have to be heavily ruled by a totalitarian state (and are thus basically fascist ) because the people living in them lack the altruism that would be necessary for the state to ease off and allow a natural socialistic consensus to emerge. China is a vast and over populated nation, but there is a fairly high level of homogeneity, especially in localised areas. true socialism could work if the separate areas would work as autonomous regions.

National socialism as practiced in Germany in the 3rd reich worked like a charm because there was a high level of homogeneity, a strong sense of nationhood, and simply because the northern European/Germanic temperament is ideally suited to socialist society. Even today's anti-nazi documentaries with emotive titles about "the rise of evil" and so on admit that national socialist Germany was a paradise - as long as you were not one of those being hauled away to a concentration camp.

National socialism is like communism with all the failings removed. It is strange indeed that it is thought of in any way as being the opposite of communism but that mistake can be explained by the fact that Germany fought a war against soviet Russia, and the soviets needed to give the impression that national socialism was nothing like their own variant of socialism. it was the soviets who first decided to label the nazis as "fascists" in order to avoid the use of the term "socialism" to describe their enemy. Although Hitler allied with Mussolini and the Italian fascist regime, national socialist thinkers in the third reich have always made it clear that national socialism is a rejection of fascism. National socialism is about putting the folk before the state while fascism is the opposite. Fascism in no way implies any kind of racial loyalty and in fact would only exploit racial or patriotic loyalty as far as it benefited the state to do so - always at times of war. At present the west is ruled by a fascism in which the ruling capitalists exploit the people and seek to prevent true socialism by bringing in millions of immigrants of various races, especially third worlders. This provides them with cheap labour, causes racial conflict to replace the class conflict that capitalists fear, and prevents the folk of a nation from maintaining their territory and identity.

Yes true communism, true socialism, depends upon human nature being altruistic, and looking around us at the world it seems that such a society would be impossible. But it is not. Altruism has been scientifically proven to be a genetic trait that is lost unless it is practiced very discriminatingly. Animals have evolved to be altruistic - but only towards others who are closely related to them. William Hamilton's equation demonstrates the mathematical formula for this kin selection. Altruism and socialism are almost homonyms. Socialism requires altruism and this is why, when you bear in mind the facts regarding the necessity of close relation, the most potential for a socialist society exists amongst people who are of one ethnicity and one nation. The biggest mistake of communists is to forget this rule. there cannot be a global village that is socialist - in which every ethnicity and creed cooperates in a spirit of harmony and love. We can imagine such a world perhaps, but the reality is that it can never happen and that attempts to make this happen not only fail but in fact ruin the only real chance of socialism, which is ethnic based.

Those who favour capitalism like to point to the failings of communism and say that human nature is egoistic and selfish and that people never really work for the common good. Since the most successful capitalists and politicians today are clinically psychopaths, it is not possible for these people to empathise with altruistic urges anyway. These people could never feel loyalty to blood, only to their own bank accounts. It is horrific that such people have so much power over all our lives.

Capitalists suggest that people live only for shallow material reward and they have no conscience about exploiting workers. Proudhon's famous phrase "property is theft" is most accurate when referring to the ill-gotten gains of capitalists. Capitalists point to the Darwinist fact that animals are genetically programmed to desire to prosper, reproduce and expand. They ignore the fact that this is achieved as a group - and thus socialistically - even if the animal is not gregarious. Success in nature is about spreading ones genes and these genes succeeding within a gene pool. The capitalists abuse and twist Darwinism and that is how the abomination which is called "social Darwinism" came into the language. To capitalists, "survival of the fittest", is about selfish exploitation by an individual and about the individual getting as good a material existence for himself, even without having any offspring at all in many cases, as possible. When we have these people in our midst it is only bad for our gene pool and the anti-nature world view that capitalists spread is killing us and raping the planet. It is a big factor behind the plummeting birth rate in the west.

The capitalists have not only twisted Darwinism but they have twisted socialism too. Many associate socialism now with a policy of supporting the least deserving and most useless people in our society. Many associate socialism with being pro immigrant - when as i have explained immigration wrecks the basis of socialism and merely strengthens the position of capitalists. Not only those who dislike socialism have these misconceptions, but the multi-racialists who claim to be socialist or communist also have these ideas. Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, Stalin - none have ever advocated that third worlders should immigrate to the west and mix with whites. Trotsky made clear that he advocated black nationalism/separatism in the united states, even while the ku klux klan at the time did not, preferring the capitalist/masonic stance that blacks be kept as slaves. (thankfully today's kkk does appreciate the principle of ethno nationalism and has an ironically similar view to that of trotsky in this regard).

Socialism is about contributing to society, while capitalism is about taking out of society - it is about making a private profit. when capitalists point to ways they feel they do contribute to society, from the "trickle down effect" to donations they make to third worlders, or creating jobs or adding to the economy, it is all cynical spiel with no grounds to justify it as being positive. All of these things result in pollution, unsustainable use of natural resources and surging populations in parts of the world where it is most harmful.

Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

Communism in the soviet states had a strange relationship with the western capitalists and that is why they did not see it as the same threat that national socialist Germany posed. as the Russian anarchist mikhyl bakunin pointed out :"i am sure that, on the one hand, the Rothschild’s appreciate the merits of Marx, and that on the other hand, Marx feels an instinctive inclination and a great respect for the Rothschild’s. this may seem strange. what could there be in common between communism and high finance? ho ho! the communism of Marx seeks a strong state centralization, and where this exists there must inevitably exist a state central bank, and where this exists, there the parasitic Jewish nation, which speculates upon the labor of the people, will always find the means for its existence..."

When it comes to a debate over which is the better, communism or capitalism, the argument always fails to realise the true biological basis for socialism and how it really could work to bring a utopia, if only the capitalist exploiters of the labour of the people would be stopped, and ethnic cohesion taken as the foundation for harmony and cooperation.

General of Darkness
13th February 2011, 01:26 PM
National Socialism died with the onslaught of jewish communism, and jewish multiculturalism.

It's impossible to have TRUE socialism in a multicultural society, and especially with jews around. IT'S NEVER EVER GOING TO HAPPEN.

Damn, I REALLY wish I could translate my thoughts to easy reading. >:(

Ponce
13th February 2011, 03:01 PM
As long as we know who is creating all the problems of today and do nothing about it then all that we are doing is helping them realise "their" dreams, which is to put us all in hell.

Santa
13th February 2011, 03:08 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

vacuum
13th February 2011, 03:10 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.



Lets not confuse the economic system with the monetary system.

Santa
13th February 2011, 04:31 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.



Lets not confuse the economic system with the monetary system.


Can you explain the difference?

Is there a meaningful distinction? I mean, doesn't one depend upon the other to create the overarching system?
I suppose a crude analogy would be the distinction between a camera and the film or card inside it. Sure, they're different things, but both are necessary to make the photo.

I guess what I'm asking is why do you care to make the distinction in the case above? Why is it pertinent?

vacuum
13th February 2011, 05:57 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.



Lets not confuse the economic system with the monetary system.


Can you explain the difference?

Is there a meaningful distinction? I mean, doesn't one depend upon the other to create the overarching system?
I suppose a crude analogy would be the distinction between a camera and the film or card inside it. Sure, they're different things, but both are necessary to make the photo.

I guess what I'm asking is why do you care to make the distinction in the case above? Why is it pertinent?

Well, in cases of war, the monetary system is really the only enabling factor. In order to go to war one must create money to finance it. A world war would be impossible without the ability to create large amounts of money at will.

If the government had to raise taxes to cover the spending for things like the Iraq war, it would never happen. It is only the federal government's ability to go into debt, and therefore get free money to do as it pleases, that allows and has allowed these wars to continue.

Book
13th February 2011, 06:56 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.



Capitalists Jews have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

:oo-->

General of Darkness
13th February 2011, 07:02 PM
But what of this paragraph?


Capitalists have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.



Capitalists Jews have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

:oo-->


Capitalists Jews Oven Dodgers have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

;D

Santa
13th February 2011, 09:11 PM
Capitalists Jews Oven Dodgers have been behind all wars, including the last two world wars and the present "war on terror". Selling arms is very lucrative, as is rebuilding destroyed infrastructure and of course war would have had to be declared on a national socialist state that had promised to hang bankers and capitalists and was printing its own currency.

Grin

No way! It's the Mooslems. :D


Well, in cases of war, the monetary system is really the only enabling factor. In order to go to war one must create money to finance it. A world war would be impossible without the ability to create large amounts of money at will.

If the government had to raise taxes to cover the spending for things like the Iraq war, it would never happen. It is only the federal government's ability to go into debt, and therefore get free money to do as it pleases, that allows and has allowed these wars to continue.

I agree, but here's where I choke on the concept of capitalism. Through our acceptance of the philosophical basis of capitalism, by legally and morally allowing any entity anywhere the right to acquire and use any amount of private property for its own benefit, in effect gives tacit permission for an individual or a small group to buy up and legally own the entire world.

And that's exactly what's happening. The world all around us is being bought up and delivered into fewer and fewer private hands. And one day soon, perhaps it's already the case, the majority of the world is going to be legally owned by just one small familial group. Probably Rothschild, although I'm not sure it matters much who owns it.

And when the entire world is owned by someone else, it'll be ourmoral imperative, as small "c" capitalists to do as the owner demands, since we will all be visitors or trespassers in the owners domain, after all.

Would someone please remind me how wonderful capitalism is? ;D

vacuum
13th February 2011, 10:10 PM
I agree. I'm leaning towards Georgism myself as an optimal model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism

Its never been tried. I wonder why?

nunaem
13th February 2011, 10:58 PM
I agree. I'm leaning towards Georgism myself as an optimal model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism

Its never been tried. I wonder why?


A single tax on land would indeed be the optimal way to organize a Capitalist economy. It hasn't been tried in Capitalist countries because parasitism is too lucrative and the masses are too stupid. And a certain group of parasites who control the banks make quite a lot of money off of inflated land values and land speculation. Banks are the biggest property owners in the country... they would be big losers if land became value-less after the confiscation of economic rent. But everyone else who doesn't speculate in property would win.

Horn
14th February 2011, 12:24 AM
Would someone please remind me how wonderful capitalism is? ;D

Same game, less rules.

Santa
14th February 2011, 08:25 AM
I agree. I'm leaning towards Georgism myself as an optimal model.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgism

Its never been tried. I wonder why?


Interesting. I never heard of Georgism before. Here's another twist on the concept.


Geolibertarianism is a political movement that strives to reconcile libertarianism and Georgism (or geoism).[1][2] Geolibertarians are advocates of geoism, which is the position that all land is a common asset to which all individuals have an equal right to access, and therefore if individuals claim the land as their property they must pay rent to the community for doing so. Rent need not be paid for the mere use of land, but only for the right to exclude others from that land, and for the protection of one's title by government.They simultaneously agree with the libertarian position that each individual has an exclusive right to the fruits of his or her labor as their private property, as opposed to this product being owned collectively by society or the community, and that "one's labor, wages, and the products of labor" should not be taxed. Also, with traditional libertarians they advocate "full civil liberties, with no crimes unless there are victims who have been invaded."[1] Geolibertarians generally advocate distributing the land rent to the community via a land value tax, as proposed by Henry George and others before him. For this reason, they are often called "single taxers". Fred E. Foldvary coined the word "geo-libertarianism" in an article so titled in Land and Liberty.[3][verification needed] In the case of geoanarchism, the voluntary form of geolibertarianism as described by Foldvary, rent would be collected by private associations with the opportunity to secede from a geocommunity (and not receive the geocommunity's services) if desired.[4]

Geolibertarians are generally influenced by Georgism, but the ideas behind it pre-date Henry George, and can be found in different forms in the writings of John Locke, the French Physiocrats, Thomas Jefferson, Adam Smith, Thomas Paine, James Mill (John Stuart Mill's father), David Ricardo, John Stuart Mill, Herbert Spencer and Thomas Spence. Perhaps the best summary of geolibertarianism is Thomas Paine's assertion that "Men did not make the earth. It is the value of the improvements only, and not the earth itself, that is individual property. Every proprietor owes to the community a ground rent for the land which he holds." On the other hand, Locke wrote that private land ownership should be praised, as long as its product was not left to spoil and there was "enough, and as good left in common for others"; when this Lockean proviso is violated, the land earns rental value. Some would argue that "as good" is unlikely to be achieved in an urban setting because location is paramount, and that therefore Locke's proviso in an urban setting requires the collection and equal distribution of ground rent.

Nobel Prize-winning Austrian School economist Friedrich Hayek expressed an appreciation for the special role of land in an urban setting, in The Constitution of Liberty (1960).[5]