Working mens Guilds

[goldleaf]

Let me begin this by saying that I am 100% behind Gov. Walker here in Wisconsin.Acting though,
as devils advocate, what if it is about busting all unions. The perfect place to start is with the state unions because they affect everybody. Now I'm not a union guy but with the high unemployment rates
it would make sense that TPTB would have an easy time getting the public to back them in destroying
all unions therefore opening the door to lower wages and more illegal alien workers. I have read a little
on the workingmen guilds of old and it looks like that could work again. It sounds to me like it provides
what is needed for a good relationship between employer and employee.

I hope someone here, maybe Awoke, could expand on this topic somewhat as I am just a slow two
fingered typer. ;D

[Book]

destroying all unions therefore opening the door to lower wages and more illegal alien workers.



Fat and happy Union Members don't actually tip the minimum-wage Starbucks workers and they themselves hire illegals to mow their own lawns. They don't give a shit about the working poor.

Back in the 1970's aerial photos of employee parking lots at Ford and GM and Chrysler Auto Plants revealed that Union Members themselves were driving imported Toyotas and Hondas and Mazdas.

:D

[goldleaf]

I agree, Book,but am interested in others opinions on guilds.Seems that they might be the answer for all
workers and employers. It seems obvious to me that the push towards a one world government will require that our wages/income will have to be reduced to 3rd world levels.

Getting rid of unions could just be the beginning. Workers and employers are going to have to start
working together.

[Cebu_4_2]

In the US of israel they are taking out all higher paid people, thus the Nix of the unions. They are not taking hostages either as the banksters higher paid personnel are getting taken out (guns for banksters). If I was in another country as I planned but have not this is unfolding exactly as I said and funny as an outsider looking in. I am on the inside and not so funny as I thought, this is totally fukt, the only thing I see as perplexing is the slow demise of the dollar.

If they drop the dollar overnight then many people might not watch their nightly jewspapers or the show who is the fucking idle here, or whatever it's called

I have to be close here man give me a break, all my friends that don't get it still just don't get it. I don't want to reach them anymore but there are a lot that could use some helping.

[Cobalt]

destroying all unions therefore opening the door to lower wages and more illegal alien workers.



Fat and happy Union Members don't actually tip the minimum-wage Starbucks workers and they themselves hire illegals to mow their own lawns. They don't give a shit about the working poor.

Back in the 1970's aerial photos of employee parking lots at Ford and GM and Chrysler Auto Plants revealed that Union Members themselves were driving imported Toyotas and Hondas and Mazdas.

:D


Bullshit, I have met many of my union brothers at the Starbucks across the street from the hall and we all tip way more then 25% and for the record Starbucks employees make more them minimum wage. (I dated one)

Illegals mowing our lawns?
Any illegal who steps on my my lawn will be used for fertilizer!

As far as the big 3 union members driving competition vehicles, that is easy too explain, the big 3 were designing and building crap cars that the public didn't want, the big 3 were raking in big bucks selling pieces of shit and the union members made a purchase based on what they wanted and felt would last more then the disposable junk being built in the plant they watched going down the line.

Would you take your paycheck and buy what your employer made knowing that it was going to fall apart because it was a piece of shit design from the word get go?

[Book]

As far as the big 3 union members driving competition vehicles, that is easy too explain, the big 3 were designing and building crap cars that the public didn't want, the big 3 were raking in big bucks selling pieces of shit and the union members made a purchase based on what they wanted and felt would last more then the disposable junk being built in the plant they watched going down the line.



The UNION Auto Workers were building the autos so shitty that even they wouldn't buy one. Back in the 1970's it was common knowledge many of the UNION Auto Workers were stoned or drunk on the job. Still happening today:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWi6IlmSO_o

Detroit TV Station Uncovers Chrysler Autoworkers Drinking on the Job (http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2010/09/detroit-tv-station-uncovers-chrysler-autoworkers-drinking-on-the-job.html)

:oo-->

[mrnhtbr2232]

The ideas of collective bargaining for a living wage and benefits in exchange for skilled trade labor are sound principles. Unfortunately the largess and political corruption of the 20th century made sure unions have become a financial pariah to the detriment of their membership. Businesses wanting to offload the rising costs of union demands responded by giving us outsourcing. I don't see guilds being any better, since they are more exclusive by definition in controlling goods and services, vs. unions being more representative for worker's rights. Either way there is today a headwind for any kind of effort to maintain standards of living and job security, and while Wisconsin may be reacting as a fiscal pressure valve, it is setting a dangerous precedent in an already competitive trades marketplace for labor dominated by low wage immigrants.

If unions are busted in the United States, it will serve more bad than good. While I am not a union member, I work with union electricians and their skill set is valuable - that kind of craftsmanship and safety is well worth paying for. Certainly higher than a Mexican that does shoddy work for twelve bucks an hour and can't isolate a neutral in a sub panel. Sadly, that level of work is what society is accepting as the norm, and by extension makes unions look exclusive and unnecessary. Plus, there are different unions serving different levels of corruption. The trades (plumbing, electrical, construction) are generally more legitimate than say a sidewalk full of SEIU thugs demanding $40/hr. and lifetime retirement for cleaning toilets. It's that kind of provocation that smears the legitimate and worthy union implementations.

[Awoke]

destroying all unions therefore opening the door to lower wages and more illegal alien workers.



Fat and happy Union Members don't actually tip the minimum-wage Starbucks workers and they themselves hire illegals to mow their own lawns. They don't give a shit about the working poor.

Back in the 1970's aerial photos of employee parking lots at Ford and GM and Chrysler Auto Plants revealed that Union Members themselves were driving imported Toyotas and Hondas and Mazdas.

:D


Man, Book, that is totally a paintbrush statement. You can't do that.
I am Union, and I always remember how good I have it in comparison with other people who are not fortunate enough to have the kind of job I have.
I always tip large too, just fyi.


Goldleaf, there is not much to say, other than Unions provide a better living and a safer conditions for workers that are both unionized and non-unionized.

The destruction of Unions will lead to a lower standard of living for all people.

[woodman]

I have been in 3 different unions in my work life. UAW, MESA, Carpenter's. Unions can be very good in ways...They educate their members through apprenticeship programs and ensure safe working measures and environment. It is good to have someone on your side when working for an entity that feels nothing but animosity toward those who are on the front line.

They also protect those who don't want to work hard and are very often corrupt organizations.

[Book]

...Unions provide a better living and a safer conditions for workers that are both unionized and non-unionized.



I dunno Awoke. When times are tough UNIONS agree to two-tier memberships wherein all new UNION workers get paid less and receive fewer benefits than the fat and happy older workers with "seniority".

:D

[Awoke]

Say what you will, but the fact is, Unions are what is keeping non-union wages where they are now.

The day Unions are abolished is the day you start working for a burrito per day.

[Book]

The day Unions are abolished is the day you start working for a burrito per day.



The day Unions are abolished is the day that the now fat and happy Union Members With Seniority will join their other junior members and every other worker in America.

:)

[iOWNme]

Fuck Government created Monopolies! (Thesis)

Fuck Unions! (Antithesis)

Fuck Collective Bargaining! (Synthesis)



The Hegelian Dialectic in a nutshell.


There is only ONE WAY for the individual to win in this Problem, Reaction, Solution chess game.....

The Competitive Free Market.

[goldleaf]

I do suspect that unions have done much to increase the standard of living that we enjoy.These days though, there is too much of an us vs. them mentality.I read somewhere that only about 7% of our workforce is union, so I don't think that they decide the local wages as much as the availability of help.

So many things today have to be taken into consideration,NAFTA, OSHA, EPA, unemployment and workmans comp. taxes etal. This has done nothing but put up a wall between worker and employer.
Many workers don't realize how much money goes for these things to be in compliance. thats money
right off the top that has to be figured into either wage concessions or price increases for products/ services.

There is a certain amount of anti-Catholic sentiment here, and I can live with that, but in our Faith
it teaches us that there are, SINS THAT CRY OUT TO GOD FOR VENGEANCE. and one of these is defrauding a worker of just wages. We are taught though, that this works both ways. You don't steal
from your employer either, whether your sittin' on your ass when you should be doing something or
taking stuff home with you. My grampa used to say that the jews would always hire a Catholic over one of their own,big surprise!

[Santa]

fuck Government created Monopolies! (Thesis)

fuck Unions! (Antithesis)

fuck Collective Bargaining! (Synthesis)



The Hegelian Dialectic in a nutshell.


There is only ONE WAY for the individual to win in this Problem, Reaction, Solution chess game.....

The Competitive Free Market.




What competitive Free Market?

[iOWNme]

fuck Government created Monopolies! (Thesis)

fuck Unions! (Antithesis)

fuck Collective Bargaining! (Synthesis)



The Hegelian Dialectic in a nutshell.


There is only ONE WAY for the individual to win in this Problem, Reaction, Solution chess game.....

The Competitive Free Market.




What competitive Free Market?


The one that the Globalist killed 100 years ago....

The one that PROTECTS Private Property.....

The one that uses honest REAL money.....

The one that built this great country from the ground up.....

The one that created a VAST amount of wealth for the individual RAPIDLY....

Shall i go on?

[Ash_Williams]

Unions are fine, it's just the labor law that prevents striking workers from being replaced.

Imagine if you hired a taxi and halfway to your destination he said "I'm going to need double the rate I'm charging right now. If you don't like it then I won't drive anymore and you legally won't be allowed to hire anyone else to drive you."

That's stupid.

Without the labor law, it would be more like the cab driver stops and asks for more money, and you either work out a price that you both agree to, or you let him on his way and take another cab.

I don't see anyone actually busting unions anyway... seems like the govt spent billions to keep them alive. Maybe 'cause the unions donated 50+ million to the Obama campaign...

[Book]

The one that built this great country from the ground up...



http://www.freewebs.com/black-legacy/Blk-slavery-collage.bmp

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ZhayDPXOy1Y/Syhja5jTu3I/AAAAAAAAAFY/vRszv5WsPHg/s320/0605caric_big.jpg

UNION MEMBERS WITH SENIORITY are the fat and happy house niggers who don't give a shit about the field niggers.

:)

[Book]

http://assets2.eekarchitects.com/system/gallery_image/data/original/449.jpg
S.E.I.U Union Executive Office Building

http://monoblogue.us/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Teamsters-building-mb-637x480.jpg
Teamsters Union Executive Office Building


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/76/National_Education_Association_headquarters.JPG/800px-National_Education_Association_headquarters.JPG
NEA Union Executive Office Building

:D keeping it real

[horseshoe3]

Unions are fine, it's just the labor law that prevents striking workers from being replaced.

Imagine if you hired a taxi and halfway to your destination he said "I'm going to need double the rate I'm charging right now. If you don't like it then I won't drive anymore and you legally won't be allowed to hire anyone else to drive you."

That's stupid.

Without the labor law, it would be more like the cab driver stops and asks for more money, and you either work out a price that you both agree to, or you let him on his way and take another cab.


Excellent analogy. It's not about collective bargaining. It's about government sponsored blackmail.

[Awoke]

Whatever book. Unions aren't perfect but you can thank them for the wages you made, whether you worked union or non-union.