How I survived a suprise 21 firearm audit by the BATF

[Twisted Titan]

they just left a few hours ago so I will write quickly
yesterday I had two agents appear at my front door wanting speak with me........ I t got off to a very bad start because I would not come to the front door n I insited speaking through my window ........that pissed them off and they actually threatened me with a SWAT visit. I tried to politely as possible explain the ason why I am so stand offish is because the last agent several months ago was extremely nasty threw out the allegation that my firearms were possibly used in some sort of illicit actvity and he gave no follow up and now you guys show cant provide with any name as to who that person was


it was really sacry but i made the choice to speak with them on my porch i will skip all the filler basically they wanted to see if. i was in possesion of what i purchased I declined to say where they were other than a " secure location" they weren't to pleased about that and showed me my old NICS from where I said these are being purchased for myself .......in hindsight I think he was trying to see if I got nervous reading that when I didn't he said the same bull that what if I told you one of your arms was used?

I said you would have to show me a report stating that and showing me the serial number of 1 of my firearms that was used........ he quickly backed of and said I don't have to show you anything........ I' dont have to show you anything


They definately tried to play me for a fool saying they didnt "know "much of anything but before the interview over they knew exactly how many I owned and what calibers (cops lie espcially federal)

The long and short of it they would not be appeased without a audit I told them to give me 72 hours to produce my collection..... they were "okay "with that but not before they said AGAIN they all need to be counted for.

About 6 hours later I called him back telling him to please come on by ........suprised to say the least he said tommarrow 11am and he would call in route

fine sir

the next day I met the outside my house and escorted them to my porch and told them to make it easier for me I will bring them out three at a time once they have been authenticated I will bring out the next set....they agreed I told them everything is in a box with a lock and will not handel anything until instructed.

I did as I said and then the question comes up ......how did u pay for all of it? when u are a glock enthusiatist with hopes of being a armorer you find a way......he chuckeld....

at the conclsion of the audit he told me. this is the first time in his career that he was able to conduct a audit without incident 99 percent of the time it is a traficking operation he was truly impressed all I could do was " apoligize" for my enthusiam

with that they left......... I will tell you flat out when you have manners it goes a long way to smooth over a volatile situation....... this could have ended real badly for me today.......





please take my situation and apply accordinly

please excuse the errorss I'm on my android

[ShortJohnSilver]

TT is this you or someone else?

[Gaillo]

Something unclear... is that YOU, Twisted? Or are you posting someone else's story from another site?


EDIT: ShortJohnSilver beat me to it by 3 sec.! ;D

[mamboni]

Click click TT!!!!

Is this autobiographical? I half expected you to Rambo their asses. :ROFL:

[Twisted Titan]

Me.......

[Twisted Titan]

I can laugh now but honestly that was serious shit.......

when the heat is on all you can think about is protect your family from the goons ...

the best way to protect was compliance at that point

[DMac]

How did you become a "red flag" for them in the first place?

[Twisted Titan]

I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it

[Gaillo]

I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it


Are you going to spread your purchases out in the future to avoid further hassles?

[silver solution]

Me.......
"12 Glocks in triplicate form" What do you mean here?

[osoab]

I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it


What model in case I ever have to join your clan? :D

[madfranks]

A very valuable lesson here is that even though we don't have "gun registration" in the USA, they still have all your NICS forms when you buy anything and can show up on your door demanding to know where your "unregistered" guns are, so what's the difference.

I'm glad you got out of that OK, those goons have the power to destroy your life if they don't like you. Don't think for a second that they wouldn't have sent in a SWAT team to raid your home and possibly kill your whole family in their attempt to subdue you.

Jesus Christ, thank the Lord you're ok. My blood is boiling after reading this.

[Twisted Titan]

you rarely tangle with these people don't have a problem........ a lottttt. agents at the office lost money because they were probly betting on my ass.

[chad]

so what would have happened if say, you decided to you needed to sell a few to pay the rent and you could only produce 10 of said glocks. you go to jail because you sold 2 of them? wtf?

[madfranks]

I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it


Are you going to spread your purchases out in the future to avoid further hassles?


Better yet start buying from private classified ads or private parties at local gun shows.

[Twisted Titan]

I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it



3 g 26

3 g 19

3 g 17

3 g 21



the pattern is indicative of trafficker I would suppose.


the rest I had were rifles and shotguns

What model in case I ever have to join your clan? :D

[NOOB]

Damn good job twisted. I remember when you didn't own a single gun. A nice collection sir, keep up the good work. Are you still in New York?

[Twisted Titan]

so what would have happened if say, you decided to you needed to sell a few to pay the rent and you could only produce 10 of said glocks. you go to jail because you sold 2 of them? wtf?





they were hoping for something like that to happen to keep the investigation going.......the who what when were or why is endless......I really hope this the
end of it.......

I wont lie I did pleanty of ass kissing and ego stroking to make them feel larger then life I even " aplogized" that may enthusiam resulted in them wasting there valuable time

whatever it took to get them away from my family .....I swallowed my pride quick and fast

[madfranks]

3 g 26

3 g 19

3 g 17

3 g 21



the pattern is indicative of trafficker I would suppose.


Indicative of a trafficker?!? F*** that! Just buying them does not constitute evidence of criminal intent! They had no evidence whatsoever, yet threatened you with falsified stories of "your gun was used in a crime" and threatened you with a SWAT visit upon you, your wife and young child?!? If I were you I'd consider suing the agency for harassment, slander, emotional distress, pain and suffering, take your pick!

[osoab]

Were these BATFE agents or a NY state thing?

[Twisted Titan]

Damn good job twisted. I remember when you didn't own a single gun. A nice collection sir, keep up the good work. Are you still in New York?




don't care to talk for my actuall locale I justed wanted to share what the experince was and what type of guns that might put a bullseye on your back


I will add that they agent was also looking to see if I did any modification all I could think of was two words

RANDY WEAVER

[Twisted Titan]

Were these BATFE agents or a NY state thing?



ATF.........


these were The Feds

[osoab]

Were these BATFE agents or a NY state thing?



ATF.........


these were The Feds

Should have looked at the title closer, I only went back through the OP.

Did this seem more like a "Hey let's check up on this guy for whatever reason we can think up." sort of thing or a "This dude has bought way too many guns in a short amount of time, we need to investigate" thing.

[silver solution]

Were these BATFE agents or a NY state thing?



ATF.........


these were The Feds
Did you buy these guns real fast?

[Twisted Titan]

I really don't think so because those purchases happened over a span of several years ....... not all at once...

that is why I have a so adament the agent produce a possible crime report to me din reegards to my firearm because I knew better

also I would not have been coming to talk to me they just would have arrested my ass

[silver solution]

I really don't think so because those purchases happened over a span of several years ....... not all at once...
WOW that is crazy!! Never heard of any thing like this it being over years.

[silver solution]

Did they have team of cops following you around in the 72 hours?

I would guess they did?

[osoab]

What would have occurred if you were not present when they showed up for their visit? Were they going to keep coming back until someone was home?

TT, you seemed to have handled the experience well. I could only hope that I could perform as well as you did.

[mick silver]

all this over hand guns . dam i thought they only did this with full auto weapons . do you have a permit to carry

[Twisted Titan]

if they did my ass would have been toast because all they would had to do was wait till i loaded up and stop my car


I think the only reason why that didn't happene was because I kissed there ass really hard and I came across as straight person

[Spectrism]

The bastards can harass the non-violent and "easy" targets, but they can't keep the traitors out of our government. Nor can they keep the drug dealers and thugs off the streets.

It really is amazing to me. They got your name & number when they decide to disarm you. The first ones will get no warning, so I expect when it happens, they will have multiple squads work through the night. Every gun owner will be listed as a terror suspect and the local cops will be used for the volume.

[Ponce]

Buy your guns at the gun shows with no paper work (while you can) and don't keep it at home.........that is to say if I WERE to have any guns (which I don't) I would not keep them anywhere around my property and would have to walk for half a mile to get to any of them.......but of course I don't own any.

[Gaillo]

Buy your guns at the gun shows with no paper work (while you can) and don't keep it at home.........that is to say if I WERE to have any guns (which I don't) I would not keep them anywhere around my property and would have to walk for half a mile to get to any of them.......but of course I don't own any.


What good is a gun you don't have immediate access to when you need it? :conf:

[Book]

I think the only reason why that didn't happen was because I kissed there ass really hard and I came across as straight person



:) just being sane and realistic

[sirgonzo420]

Buy your guns at the gun shows with no paper work (while you can) and don't keep it at home.........that is to say if I WERE to have any guns (which I don't) I would not keep them anywhere around my property and would have to walk for half a mile to get to any of them.......but of course I don't own any.


What good is a gun you don't have immediate access to when you need it? :conf:


Hear, hear!

If it's time to start burying guns, then it's time to start digging them up.

[Twisted Titan]

The bastards can harass the non-violent and "easy" targets, but they can't keep the traitors out of our government. Nor can they keep the drug d#ealers and thugs off the streets.

It really is amazing to me. They got your name & number when they decide to disarm you. The first ones will get no warning, so I expect when it happens, they will have multiple squads work through the night. Every gun owner will be listed as a terror suspect and the local cops will be used for the volume.






at the conculsion he did offer me a piece of " advice" that I get them registered at the state level.


I thanked.him for his concern.

if you beielve I am going to volunteer that information to then next set of goons you are crazy

[mick silver]

a old timer i know just left this country . he told me befor he left the ones with carry permits are the first ones that the feds will come for . i am starting to think he maybe right

[Twisted Titan]

Buy your guns at the gun shows with no paper work (while you can) and don't keep it at home.........that is to say if I WERE to have any guns (which I don't) I would not keep them anywhere around my property and would have to walk for half a mile to get to any of them.......but of course I don't own any.


What good is a gun you don't have immediate access to when you need it? :conf:


Hear, hear!

If it's time to start burying guns, then it's time to start digging them up.




and I can tell you if I did that day I would not be able to share with you this experience I would be in a spider hole right now with edgar steele

just keepin it real

[osoab]

T.T.,

You may want to contact your sheriff. That is if the guy isn't in complete cahoots with the BATFE.

He may not take kindly to someone stepping on this turf without prior notice, if there was none given.

[Dogman]

A very valuable lesson here is that even though we don't have "gun registration" in the USA, they still have all your NICS forms when you buy anything and can show up on your door demanding to know where your "unregistered" guns are, so what's the difference.

I'm glad you got out of that OK, those goons have the power to destroy your life if they don't like you. Don't think for a second that they wouldn't have sent in a SWAT team to raid your home and possibly kill your whole family in their attempt to subdue you.

Jesus Christ, thank the Lord you're ok. My blood is boiling after reading this.






I guess 12 Glocks in triplicate form will certainly do it


Are you going to spread your purchases out in the future to avoid further hassles?


Better yet start buying from private classified ads or private parties at local gun shows.


The bastards can harass the non-violent and "easy" targets, but they can't keep the traitors out of our government. Nor can they keep the drug dealers and thugs off the streets.

It really is amazing to me. They got your name & number when they decide to disarm you. The first ones will get no warning, so I expect when it happens, they will have multiple squads work through the night. Every gun owner will be listed as a terror suspect and the local cops will be used for the volume.


As others have said, when you buy from dealers you have to fill the paperwork , and that info will go into your file that the government keeps on everyone. Maybe not all of your info in one file, but spread through out the databases they have. And that info can be pulled together into one file if needed with a few keystrokes.

Buying from private people = no paperwork, but you can still be tracked from the original owner if the gov wanted to, if the seller can remember any info you gave them.

What bothers me, twisted is the why did they give you a visit? Something flagged you it seems, unless they randomly check out people. Twelve glocks 4 sets of three bought over time, I just can not see it. You could have had family you were buying them as gifts. And if you gifted them , be sure they would have checked to see that you did what you said.

We all know that Internet forums most if all use screen names and I am fairly certain but not totally that the government can get the ip address of the users of those forums and real names and addresses. Plus Internet providers again not totally sure, but I think they keep records of every keystroke you send and receive on the net.

It is freaky and disturbing and am happy that you survived their goon and BIG BROTHER tactics. Lying to you like they did just to see if they could shake your tree, and then with the threat of a swat team! Bunch of ass licking, pole lovers.

[willie pete]

T.T.,

You may want to contact your sheriff. That is if the guy isn't in complete cahoots with the BATFE.

He may not take kindly to someone stepping on this turf without prior notice, if there was none given.



I'm not sure the sheriff could do anything about it, IF the sheriff came out and pitched a bitch, all the G-man would have to say is the sheriff is "obstructing" a federal investigation, and he'd be arrested (the sheriff)...and too...when you tell the sheriff the nature of the "contact" it may put YOU on his radar ::) the best way as mentioned is a private sale through a show, just be sure to get the sellers info......'cause I'd hate to buy a gun that's stolen OR has a bad history ;) ..I've sold & bought several firearms in private deals, I always get & give a "Notorized" BOS with description to CMA

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

Indicative of a trafficker?!? F*** that! Just buying them does not constitute evidence of criminal intent! They had no evidence whatsoever, yet threatened you with falsified stories of "your gun was used in a crime" and threatened you with a SWAT visit upon you, your wife and young child?!? If I were you I'd consider suing the agency for harassment, slander, emotional distress, pain and suffering, take your pick!



THIS!!

X100

WTF WTF WTF!

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?

I'm so pissed... I'll have to respond later.

Glad you (and the family) survived that TA.

[iOWNme]

T.T.,

You may want to contact your sheriff. That is if the guy isn't in complete cahoots with the BATFE.

He may not take kindly to someone stepping on this turf without prior notice, if there was none given.


EXACTLY. I would let my Sheriff know that armed Federal Fanatics are running around his State unabated. ANd if he was aware, why didnt he contact you?

TT: Under what authority did they seize your Liberty?

Surely you asked them? I mean, buying legal guns and paying legal taxes on them, doesnt warrant a visit from the Feds, does it?

:sarc:

PUKE.

[Ponce]

Gaillo? as you know the rules to the game changes all the time and it you have them they can take them away at any time and for any reason.......there is a time to be brave and a time to be chicken and till that time that TSHTF I'd rather play it safe and be a chicken.....why do you think that I am still alive after everything that I have done?...............besides, who says that you need a gun to defend yourself in your own home?

[madfranks]

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?


TT was in a hard position because if he did not "give them the time of day", they very well could have served him a warrant via SWAT team into his home! For God's sakes they threatened him with it, told him straight to his face that unless he does what they say he'll find himself woken up at 4:00 am by a team of armored thugs with machine guns blasting his home apart. By shutting the door on them, you know what would have happened? They would have "enriched" the details of the story making it look like he was hiding something, and since this is the BATF, a federal agency, a New York judge would have issued a warrant in a New York minute! I think TT recognized that his life and the lives of his wife and child were in mortal danger unless he accommodated these assholes to get them out of his hair!

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?


TT was in a hard position because if he did not "give them the time of day", they very well could have served him a warrant via SWAT team into his home! For God's sakes they threatened him with it, told him straight to his face that unless he does what they say he'll find himself woken up at 4:00 am by a team of armored thugs with machine guns blasting his home apart. By shutting the door on them, you know what would have happened? They would have "enriched" the details of the story making it look like he was hiding something, and since this is the BATF, a federal agency, a New York judge would have issued a warrant in a New York minute! I think TT recognized that his life and the lives of his wife and child were in mortal danger unless he accommodated these assholes to get them out of his hair!


I realize that.. and I did not mean to sound judgmental towards TT. I was more in agony of the fact that he had been so violated.

I just find it hard to concede that he had no other recourse in defense of his liberty...

If this is what we've come to then this whole thread is a very bad idea.

ETA:

Sui Juris said civilly what I should have:





T.T.,

You may want to contact your sheriff. That is if the guy isn't in complete cahoots with the BATFE.

He may not take kindly to someone stepping on this turf without prior notice, if there was none given.


EXACTLY. I would let my Sheriff know that armed Federal Fanatics are running around his State unabated. ANd if he was aware, why didnt he contact you?

TT: Under what authority did they seize your Liberty?

Surely you asked them? I mean, buying legal guns and paying legal taxes on them, doesnt warrant a visit from the Feds, does it?

:sarc:

PUKE.

[chad]

google u.n. small arms treaty. this all makes sense.

[ximmy]

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?


TT was in a hard position because if he did not "give them the time of day", they very well could have served him a warrant via SWAT team into his home! For God's sakes they threatened him with it, told him straight to his face that unless he does what they say he'll find himself woken up at 4:00 am by a team of armored thugs with machine guns blasting his home apart. By shutting the door on them, you know what would have happened? They would have "enriched" the details of the story making it look like he was hiding something, and since this is the BATF, a federal agency, a New York judge would have issued a warrant in a New York minute! I think TT recognized that his life and the lives of his wife and child were in mortal danger unless he accommodated these assholes to get them out of his hair!


I realize that.. and I did not mean to sound judgmental towards TT. I was more in agony of the fact that he had been so violated.

I just find it hard to concede that he had no other recourse in defense of his liberty...

If this is what we've come to then this whole thread is a very bad idea.

ETA:

Sui Juris said civilly what I should have:





T.T.,

You may want to contact your sheriff. That is if the guy isn't in complete cahoots with the BATFE.

He may not take kindly to someone stepping on this turf without prior notice, if there was none given.


EXACTLY. I would let my Sheriff know that armed Federal Fanatics are running around his State unabated. ANd if he was aware, why didnt he contact you?

TT: Under what authority did they seize your Liberty?

Surely you asked them? I mean, buying legal guns and paying legal taxes on them, doesnt warrant a visit from the Feds, does it?

:sarc:

PUKE.




there is no liberty.. there is no freedom... I'm so glad I went with C&R weapons... out of the system... >:(

[Dogman]

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?


TT was in a hard position because if he did not "give them the time of day", they very well could have served him a warrant via SWAT team into his home! For God's sakes they threatened him with it, told him straight to his face that unless he does what they say he'll find himself woken up at 4:00 am by a team of armored thugs with machine guns blasting his home apart. By shutting the door on them, you know what would have happened? They would have "enriched" the details of the story making it look like he was hiding something, and since this is the BATF, a federal agency, a New York judge would have issued a warrant in a New York minute! I think TT recognized that his life and the lives of his wife and child were in mortal danger unless he accommodated these assholes to get them out of his hair!


I realize that.. and I did not mean to sound judgmental towards TT. I was more in agony of the fact that he had been so violated.

I just find it hard to concede that he had no other recourse in defense of his liberty...

If this is what we've come to then this whole thread is a very bad idea.


TT had no recourse at all! Those people do not follow the wish list of liberty's that are discussed here on this and other forums. These Ass holes HAVE the power to totally fuck up your life or take it and sleep very well at night!

TT did right with them at the time, Yes sir, No sir, etc, etc, etc. Any other responses from him would have just amped up the situation and not in TT's favor.

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

TT had no recourse at all! Those people do not follow the wish list of liberty's that are discussed here on this and other forums. These Ass holes HAVE the power to totally fuck up your life or take it and sleep very well at night!


That is a problem.




TT did right with them at the time, Yes sir, No sir, etc, etc, etc. Any other responses from him would have just amped up situation and not in TT's favor.


Yeah your right.. guess we're just slaves :dunno

[willie pete]

I cant freekin believe this! Did they even have a warrant? What the hell even compelled you to give them the time of day if they did not?


TT was in a hard position because if he did not "give them the time of day", they very well could have served him a warrant via SWAT team into his home! For God's sakes they threatened him with it, told him straight to his face that unless he does what they say he'll find himself woken up at 4:00 am by a team of armored thugs with machine guns blasting his home apart. By shutting the door on them, you know what would have happened? They would have "enriched" the details of the story making it look like he was hiding something, and since this is the BATF, a federal agency, a New York judge would have issued a warrant in a New York minute! I think TT recognized that his life and the lives of his wife and child were in mortal danger unless he accommodated these assholes to get them out of his hair!


I realize that.. and I did not mean to sound judgmental towards TT. I was more in agony of the fact that he had been so violated.

I just find it hard to concede that he had no other recourse in defense of his liberty...

If this is what we've come to then this whole thread is a very bad idea.


TT had no recourse at all! Those people do not follow the wish list of liberty's that are discussed here on this and other forums. These Ass holes HAVE the power to totally fuck up your life or take it and sleep very well at night!

TT did right with them at the time, Yes sir, No sir, etc, etc, etc. Any other responses from him would have just amped up the situation and not in TT's favor.


I think you played it smart TA...what's the recourse? like the fed said; call in a swat team? ...it seems to me that whenver a swat team is called 95% of the time someone ALWAYS gets shot and killed ...it wasn't worth risking the life of you OR your family OR new baby

[chad]

tt just had a daughter. things change when you have small daughters. sometimes you have to do things to make sure you are around to guide them until they transition out of the small phase and into woman phase.

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

I dunno guys..... I get that. I really do.


Feeling kinda dejected right now.

Hey TT - you did what you thought was best. You kept your family safe. That is always the right thing to do.

All the ranting I did wasn't to find fault in the fact that you didn't volunteer to be a martyr.
I'm just incredulous that this is happening in my country.

[Twisted Titan]

there is no liberty.. there is no freedom... I'm so glad I went with C&R weapons... out of the system...


I had 3 mosin nagats and he was just as interested in them as the Glocks.

Alll of it was on the radar.

[Twisted Titan]

I dunno guys..... I get that. I really do.


Feeling kinda dejected right now.

Hey TT - you did what you thought was best. You kept your family safe. That is always the right thing to do.

All the ranting I did wasn't to find fault in the fact that you didn't volunteer to be a martyr.
I'm just incredulous that this is happening in my country.





Brother I dont fault you for none if it ........ it was a bitter pill that I had to swallow today but it just proves a point I made a long time ago.

I know the reason I was flagged.

When a man is armed the oppressors are mindful of them. He can no longer be forced any thing he says carrier the fire of potential action behind it

And when you have what I had .......that is a force multipler that brought me into there view.

The Opressors didnt get to where they were being stupid....... they got there by watching .

And the man who can resits .......is one that certainley needs to be.

[willie pete]

I dunno guys..... I get that. I really do.


Feeling kinda dejected right now.

Hey TT - you did what you thought was best. You kept your family safe. That is always the right thing to do.

All the ranting I did wasn't to find fault in the fact that you didn't volunteer to be a martyr.
I'm just incredulous that this is happening in my country.





Brother I dont fault you for none if it ........ it was a bitter pill that I had to swallow today but it just proves a point I made a long time ago.

I know the reason I was flagged.

When a man is armed the oppressors are mindful of them. He can no longer be forced any thing he says carrier the fire of potential action behind it

And when you have what I had .......that is a force multipler that brought me into there view.

The Opressors didnt get to where they were being stupid....... they got there by watching .

And the man who can resits .......is one that certainley needs to be.





TA...you DID the SAFE THING for you and your Family....from here on out, just try and do as much as possible "off the radar"

[iOWNme]

tt just had a daughter. things change when you have small daughters. sometimes you have to do things to make sure you are around to guide them until they transition out of the small phase and into woman phase.


You mean like teaching her the difference between right and wrong? Teaching her the Law, to respect it, and why? Teaching her to stand up for Liberty?

Im not bashing TT, but using fear to succumb to evil is the road to TYRANNY.


PEACE and RESPECT to Twisted Titan, he did what he thought was right. I only speak for myself, but if you want to protect your children, you teach them at an early age WHO their real enemy is in life. (I know Twisted's daughter is only months old, this was just an example)

[silver solution]

I had a buddy that was selling lots of hand guns. He was buying them from dealer shooting them and selling them in local ads.

This was not NY:-) He was making money because so many people wanted guns not in their names. Dealer was giving him nice prices.

Well he got a visit and he told them that he was having fun with the guns and selling them. They told him to stop it so he did.

Dealer hinted for me to do it just not so many:-) I did not take him up on it.

[madfranks]

I dunno guys..... I get that. I really do.


Feeling kinda dejected right now.

Hey TT - you did what you thought was best. You kept your family safe. That is always the right thing to do.

All the ranting I did wasn't to find fault in the fact that you didn't volunteer to be a martyr.
I'm just incredulous that this is happening in my country.




I hear you, but today the maxim of "innocent until proven guilty" isn't how they work. If one of them thinks something bad about you, that's all they need to do an investigation backed up with threats of violence and death. It's you against them, and they have legal authority and protection to kill you if they want to. We no longer have equal protection under the law.

[midnight rambler]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.

[ShortJohnSilver]

TT you obviously handled it very well ... since you are not in jail.

A guy I know was an armorer, had an FFL ... which he gave up because the ATF would show up at his house (his place of business) and park prominently in front of his house and stay there all day going over his paperwork. Now he only works on pre-1904 stuff like high quality reproduction Civil War guns for re-enactors and collectors.

[madfranks]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.

[General of Darkness]

I've been watching this thread since TT posted what happened. First things first it's nice to see everyone supporting him. Personally I think TT did absolutely the right thing. BUT and this is a BIG BUTT, ;D, I venture to guess that the vast majority of gsuers are in the top 5% percentile of humans and that's why we're here. So with that being said, to quote Celente, "When people lose everything, they lose it". And the majority of us here aren't there yet. I will say this, I'm not a violent person, but under the right circumstances, a agent with a big mouth, you just never know what could happen. My recommendation to them, leave me the fuck alone, it doesn't matter I don't have anything to hide. LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE, I've got money to make and that translates to tax $$$$$ you rape me for. ;)

[osoab]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


Thanks, madfranks. Couldn't have said it better.

midnightrambler, you obviously have some knowledge to pass along. Instead of throwing grief out to a guy who was more than likely scared out of his wits at the time, why not give some points of reference to those of us that might be on the next list for door knocks. We all haven't had a clue for as long of a period of time as you.

Beating the collective over the head, isn't getting us anywhere.

Give us a bone, man. :D

[Twisted Titan]

quoted for truth MF

those jackboots lied to my face at least seven times I can recall

they could give a rat ass about words and terms they thought my ass was big time gunner and if I didn't produce they were going to take me down with all the bells and whistles

[Twisted Titan]

. general if I had the financial resources the situation would've been much different...... instead I had to play up the limited that I had....... and that was to fien submission......... but there will come a day when I can speak and act as I please...... just not today

[General of Darkness]

. general if I had the financial resources the situation would've been much different...... instead I had to play up the limited that I had....... and that was to fien submission......... but there will come a day when I can speak and act as I please...... just not today


TT, I think if you had fiat bucks to get an attorney on your property in 30 minutes, who knows what could have happened. What do you think those pricks would have said if you said, "Sit tight bitches, my attorney is on his way."?

[Twisted Titan]

they probably would have backed up and left as soon as I laywered up........ but when they came back it would've been jack boot city.


besides I'm not trying to go the lawyer rout either as they are all about billable hours. that has the potential to leave me pretty much destitute

[Gaillo]

besides I'm not trying to go the lawyer rout either as they are all about billable hours. that has the potential to leave me pretty much destitute


Q: What's the definition of a lawyer?

A: Someone who thinks there are 72 (billable) hours in a day! ;D

[hoarder]

How much did it cost Twisted to kiss ass?
How much would it have cost him if he didn't kiss ass?

Oh, sure. We shouldn't have to.

We all know cops have that peculiar personality trait.

Kiss ass and live to fight another day, because not having to kiss ass is not high on the list of things we need to fight for at this point.

You done well, TT!

edit: You really should add to that puny collection, though.

[Tumbleweed]

I don't think it's any of the ATF's business what you've done with guns you've legaly bought and paid for. If they threaten you with a swat team call the sherriff and have them arested for threatening you then call a lawyer. f***em >:(

[madfranks]

I venture to guess that the vast majority of gsuers are in the top 5% percentile of humans and that's why we're here. So with that being said, to quote Celente, "When people lose everything, they lose it". And the majority of us here aren't there yet.


Here's the reason we're not there yet. This only happens to a couple people, one here, one there, but not enough to garner enough protest from the masses. If this was happening to all of our neighbors, our county, our city, we'd do something about it and have dozens of neighbors out there with us. But it only happens to an unlucky few. TT had a bit of bad luck, but this could have easily been any one of us, and what would any one of us had done? He rightly ascertained that his life and the lives of his family were in danger and the best bet to get out of it was to be accommodating to the thug's demands so they'd leave him alone.

And I would have done the same thing. I mean, think about it, his life was in danger, if he played his cards wrong in front of these evil people his life would have been over. He could have been dead, and I'm not joking, these people have the authority of the government on their side, anything they would have said post attack/raid on his home would have been swallowed whole with not a single question. Someone here would have posted the news story about a guy whose home was raided by a SWAT team but they didn't find anything but the resident looked at them threateningly or walked towards them in a menacing way and they were justified in killing him. This has happened to others who have had the misfortune of crossing paths with these folks. If you run into them, do whatever it takes to make them leave, that's your best chance at survival.

[silver solution]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


You can kill them just as easy as they can kill you. You can be set up and just waiting and have overwhelming fire power to the idiots daring to show up at your door. Sure you can assume they will get you but no one lives forever. Ever go to nursing home and see the old people? Might as well fight back at some point as to die that way. Old age is over rated.

[Mouse]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


You can kill them just as easy as they can kill you. You can be set up and just waiting and have overwhelming fire power to the idiots daring to show up at your door. Sure you can assume they will get you but no one lives forever. Ever go to nursing home and see the old people? Might as well fight back at some point as to die that way. Old age is over rated.


Are freaking serious? In order for you to have a set-up that could even contemplate marginally resisting against a bunch of feds with fully automatic weapons, door busters, flashbangs, helicopter and swat backup and probably thermal imaging and nightvision, not to mention body armor.......you would have to break so many laws that you would draw them to your house in the first place. You can't win the war until the people declare it.

[D sciple]

I wonder how many times people have had posts all lined up and ready to send in this thread, then thought, meh better not.

[silver solution]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


You can kill them just as easy as they can kill you. You can be set up and just waiting and have overwhelming fire power to the idiots daring to show up at your door. Sure you can assume they will get you but no one lives forever. Ever go to nursing home and see the old people? Might as well fight back at some point as to die that way. Old age is over rated.


Are freaking serious? In order for you to have a set-up that could even contemplate marginally resisting against a bunch of feds with fully automatic weapons, door busters, flashbangs, helicopter and swat backup and probably thermal imaging and nightvision, not to mention body armor.......you would have to break so many laws that you would draw them to your house in the first place. You can't win the war until the people declare it.
You sure can get the ones knocking on your door. So they get you who the hell wants to die in a nursing home anyway?

[silver solution]

I wonder how many times people have had posts all lined up and ready to send in this thread, then thought, meh better not.
They can only kill you one time in this life.

[D sciple]

I wonder how many times people have had posts all lined up and ready to send in this thread, then thought, meh better not.
They can only kill you one time in this life.


I hear ya, just not sure I'm ready yet. I'd like to at least get a 40 day fast in before I go.

[Mouse]

You sure can get the ones knocking on your door. So they get you who the hell wants to die in a nursing home anyway?


Make sure you know your enemy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-opUoB0jI0

[Silvestor]

Twisted, did you buy more than one handgun over a five day period? There is a rule that the dealer must notify the ATF if you purchase multiple handguns.

[Twisted Titan]

good morning to all.......... I made it through the watchess of the night without getting raided maybe this is behind me .......maybe

[Twisted Titan]

Twisted, did you buy more than one handgun over a five day period? There is a rule that the dealer must notify the ATF if you purchase multiple handguns.


now that my head has gotten a little bit clearer I did some talking with my wife as to when these spooks frist called me

as best I can recall it was over 15 months ago from the last agent scared the bejesus out of me sayin "guns like mines are used in a lot of crimes" (why the hell would I know?)

my last purchase was at least 6 month prior to that so we. are talking almost 2 years ago for my final purchase which was the 3 g 21


that's why I was stunned by any contact from any agency at all


I mean think about it took the gubbemint 2 years plus to finally close the book on a wild goose chase ......but since it is our money that funded this they can care less

[7th trump]

I venture to guess that the vast majority of gsuers are in the top 5% percentile of humans and that's why we're here. So with that being said, to quote Celente, "When people lose everything, they lose it". And the majority of us here aren't there yet.


Here's the reason we're not there yet. This only happens to a couple people, one here, one there, but not enough to garner enough protest from the masses. If this was happening to all of our neighbors, our county, our city, we'd do something about it and have dozens of neighbors out there with us. But it only happens to an unlucky few. TT had a bit of bad luck, but this could have easily been any one of us, and what would any one of us had done? He rightly ascertained that his life and the lives of his family were in danger and the best bet to get out of it was to be accommodating to the thug's demands so they'd leave him alone.

And I would have done the same thing. I mean, think about it, his life was in danger, if he played his cards wrong in front of these evil people his life would have been over. He could have been dead, and I'm not joking, these people have the authority of the government on their side, anything they would have said post attack/raid on his home would have been swallowed whole with not a single question. Someone here would have posted the news story about a guy whose home was raided by a SWAT team but they didn't find anything but the resident looked at them threateningly or walked towards them in a menacing way and they were justified in killing him. This has happened to others who have had the misfortune of crossing paths with these folks. If you run into them, do whatever it takes to make them leave, that's your best chance at survival.

This is just repeat and rinse.
When is "enough is enough already"?
When is TT going get a lawyer and start asking questions?

If anybody on this forum should know it would be TT himself. He was I beleive married to a cop.
I have a sister in law whos a sargent for a police department and she has told me theres times she just feels like quiting the police dept altogether because of lawsuits.
The police there anyway are always being bombarded by their superiors to be careful of stepping on rights. Watch what you do at all times.
I'd say the biggest fear these agencies have is a lawsuit for stepping on individual rights.
I could be wrong but thats my observation from my sister in law.
Only goes to make sense when you hear all these dept saying the police officer did nothing wrong.
If I were you TT i'd find out what red flagged you to see if it was something you did to yourself to cause a knock on the door or something they did.
Sounds like you know the commanding officer as you have his number now. Keep tabs on the guy by calling him up and asking if theres anything you could do to so not to cause another misunderstanding. You want a good relationship with him but also at the same time stand on your rights.
Let him know you are looking out legally for yourself by researching the laws. It sends a statement to them you do not like being hassled like that with a child in hand.
You were married to a cop so TT you know what needs to be said.

[Twisted Titan]

i have zero faith in the court system....... and not too long ago I lost a lawsuit were I was 100 percent in the right because of an insurance technicality

I am not going back to court for any reason at all.... it is a giant joke were you validate your oppressors

[7th trump]

i have zero faith in the court system....... and not too long ago I lost a lawsuit were I was 100 percent in the right because of an insurance technicality

I am not going back to court for any reason at all.... it is a giant joke were you validate your oppressors

To each his own!

[JDRock]

a old timer i know just left this country . he told me befor he left the ones with carry permits are the first ones that the feds will come for . i am starting to think he maybe right


come to wyoming, mick...no permit needed to carry open OR concealed...hell i can walk down main street with an ak 47 if i want.

B.A.T.F. = Bureau +After+Twisteds+Firearms :redfc

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


You can kill them just as easy as they can kill you. You can be set up and just waiting and have overwhelming fire power to the idiots daring to show up at your door. Sure you can assume they will get you but no one lives forever. Ever go to nursing home and see the old people? Might as well fight back at some point as to die that way. Old age is over rated.


That does NOT work. That is keyboard commando macho fantasy land BULLSHIT.

http://www.federaljack.com/?p=22950


As the SWAT team forced its way into his home, Guerena, a former Marine who served two tours of duty in Iraq, armed himself with his AR-15 rifle and told his wife and son to hide in a closet. As the officers entered, Guerena confronted them from the far end of a long, dark hallway. The police opened fire, releasing more than 70 rounds in about 7 seconds, at least 60 of which struck Guerena. He was pronounced dead a little over an hour later.

Fact- The example above is but one of many that shows there is no advantage to the one man stand approach.

Fact – as has been stated, the public support for any defensive action has not reached a point where neighbors can be rallied to the defense of another’s liberty.

Fact – The Feds can’t be beaten in Federal Court. It’s their turf.

It seems to me that the only way to legitimate and sustainable resistance to this tyranny is through the local Sherriff’s Office. The problem with that is there is little support for any type of alliance with LEO’s.

It becomes a function of geography and culture. It’s probably a lost cause in urban areas. In my county, I have confidence that this could actually work. However, this is not the case for the greater majority of GSUS’ers.

And before you start calling me a pig lover or anything – just look at it this way: You can burn some bridges – but I think there is more of a future in building the right bridges. It takes effort. Relationships must be built. The “us vs. them” mentality has to be overcome. Small community Sheriffs and mayors that hire police chiefs that are willing to take federal funds need to be removed at any cost. It takes time; time that we may not have but if we don’t try then we are out of options. Our wives and children will die anyway without us having tried anything.



I expect to get pissed on for that but I’m all ears for any other ideas that aren’t made in story land.
To keep doing nothing isn't getting us anywhere.

That’s all I have time for right now.

[Son-of-Liberty]

Your first mistake was admitting you had even one 'firearm'.

Frankly, according to their own fucking code I doubt you had a single firearm, 'cause if you did you'd have a tax stamp for it and the BATFags wouldn't be asking, they'd be demanding to see whatever 'firearm' you had.

I wish gunowners would get a fucking clue about exactly what a 'firearm' is according to their code.


It doesn't matter what the gun owner thinks, it's what the government agents think. They're the ones knocking on your door with threats of aggression and violence. You could call your hand gun a fucking door knob and they'd still kill you if you didn't do what they say.


You can kill them just as easy as they can kill you. You can be set up and just waiting and have overwhelming fire power to the idiots daring to show up at your door. Sure you can assume they will get you but no one lives forever. Ever go to nursing home and see the old people? Might as well fight back at some point as to die that way. Old age is over rated.


That does NOT work. That is keyboard commando macho fantasy land BULLSHIT.

http://www.federaljack.com/?p=22950


As the SWAT team forced its way into his home, Guerena, a former Marine who served two tours of duty in Iraq, armed himself with his AR-15 rifle and told his wife and son to hide in a closet. As the officers entered, Guerena confronted them from the far end of a long, dark hallway. The police opened fire, releasing more than 70 rounds in about 7 seconds, at least 60 of which struck Guerena. He was pronounced dead a little over an hour later.

Fact- The example above is but one of many that shows there is no advantage to the one man stand approach.

Fact – as has been stated, the public support for any defensive action has not reached a point where neighbors can be rallied to the defense of another’s liberty.

Fact – The Feds can’t be beaten in Federal Court. It’s their turf.

It seems to me that the only way to legitimate and sustainable resistance to this tyranny is through the local Sherriff’s Office. The problem with that is there is little support for any type of alliance with LEO’s.

It becomes a function of geography and culture. It’s probably a lost cause in urban areas. In my county, I have confidence that this could actually work. However, this is not the case for the greater majority of GSUS’ers.

And before you start calling me a pig lover or anything – just look at it this way: You can burn some bridges – but I think there is more of a future in building the right bridges. It takes effort. Relationships must be built. The “us vs. them” mentality has to be overcome. Small community Sheriffs and mayors that hire police chiefs that are willing to take federal funds need to be removed at any cost. It takes time; time that we may not have but if we don’t try then we are out of options. Our wives and children will die anyway without us having tried anything.



I expect to get pissed on for that but I’m all ears for any other ideas that aren’t made in story land.
To keep doing nothing isn't getting us anywhere.

That’s all I have time for right now.




I agree mostly with your post. Unfortunately here in Canada we don't have local sheriffs. However I think out in the country where there are less police for a given area and you can get to know a few of them that communicating with them before any incident what your intentions are is a good idea. If they know you are for freedom and liberty but not a nut case and that you know the law, your rights and are for peaceful solutions they are much less likely to assume you are dangerous and use violence as a first option.

As for SWAT the biggest advantage they have is the element of surprise. If you first realize that you are being raided by SWAT at 3 am as they bust in your door then your best bet is to just stay in bed with you hands in the air and hope nobody is so nervous they pull the trigger. Once again living rurally is a big advantage. A long driveway, barking dogs, a locked gate and some surveillance cameras could save your ass.

The fact that SWAT is so common is proof of the tyranny we are under. If the police were really interested in keeping the peace and not using excessive force as an intimidation tactic then they would start any confrontation with a polite knock on the door and only escalate their use of force as necessary.

[Twisted Titan]

law enforcement is not interested in keeping the peace they are interested in keeping a paycheck and their God complex in tact.

all else is cream for them

[Ponce]

I have been thinking about all this and came up with......who the hell says that he showed all his guns to the ATF?.......he probably has ten times that ammount put away at X spot.......many time the best way to be off the radar is to be in the radar......"Give them what they want, but don't tell them what you have".

[bellevuebully]

Good job TT (under the circumstances).

I know many gun owners in Canada, with both long rifles and handguns and have never heard anything like this happening. I've been pulled over with a 7mm rem mag (not loaded of course, but with a full mag on the elbow rest) barrel down on the floor next to the accelerator and butt up between the seat and elbow rest and no problem.

And you say you have no firearm registry in the US. All I can really say is....... (sorry, couldn't resist.....all in jest. Really, it sucks big time)

[bellevuebully]

Btw TT....you are right on the fact that a little politeness goes a long way in getting out a a lousy situation. And a cops biggest vulnerability is his ego.

[Half Sense]

My thoughts:

How did the BATF know what you had? The NICS background check does not involve serial numbers or model numbers, and the Feds are required to destroy all purchaser identifying information on allowed transactions within 24 hours of the FFL being notified of the transactions proceed status. If we are naive enough to think there is no central database, then the only way they would have that info is if they went to your dealer(s) and examined each 4473 form. If that's the case, then they must have flagged you for the large number of NICS checks or for some other pattern.

"First they came for the Glock collectors but I did not speak out, for I had no Glocks."

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein

Looks like the American Revolution 2.0 will be fought with air rifles and bolt-action .22s

[Dogman]

My thoughts:

How did the BATF know what you had? The NICS background check does not involve serial numbers or model numbers, and the Feds are required to destroy all purchaser identifying information on allowed transactions within 24 hours of the FFL being notified of the transactions proceed status. If we are naive enough to think there is no central database, then the only way they would have that info is if they went to your dealer(s) and examined each 4473 form. If that's the case, then they must have flagged you for the large number of NICS checks or for some other pattern.

"First they came for the Glock collectors but I did not speak out, for I had no Glocks."

"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones." - Albert Einstein

Looks like the American Revolution 2.0 will be fought with air rifles and bolt-action .22s


Yea right! Believing the government will willingly destroy any information that they get their hands on is like believing the statement "We are from the government and we are here to help you!" :sarc:

Databases are bureaucrats purpose and very reason for existence , all info they get their hands on gets collected , collimated and filed forever! And never never ever deleted , it will be rat holed forever.

Here I have noticed even the police are building databases , lately while monitoring their radio traffic when they get called to homes for disturbance calls or such. Dispatch will inform the patrols if the house has guns in them! They are starting to keep records of which homes have guns. Not good!

[Twisted Titan]

When they came they had a big fat folder on me....... knew my current place of work etc ect.

I asked to see it but of course. they wouldnt share it with me. it what's copies of my yellow forms that I filled out at the store. I do remember seeing all of my serial numbers and the times that I purchased. the last time being in early 2009.

it was funny they had me read out line item 13 out loud for them. that is the 1 where you are saying that you a purchasing these for your own use.

looking back in hindsight I guess they wanted to see if I was going to have a negative reaction to it. when I didn't they were kinda perplexed but that didn't stop them from throwing out threats of. all the guns better be here or we will be having a much different conversation if not.

[Buddha]

not in the same situation, but I have owned 2 handguns, gave one to my step dad. i really don't like him but he needs protection for my mother, I can't be everywhere at once. Now what if they came to the door, and said " you nigger faggot, you own two guns, and can only show one'? "well I GAVE the other to my step dad" would they go over there and take a look? what if he didn't show it for fear of being in trouble, also i mentioned that we dont like one another.

[Dogman]

not in the same situation, but I have owned 2 handguns, gave one to my step dad. i really don't like him but he needs protection for my mother, I can't be everywhere at once. Now what if they came to the door, and said " you nigger faggot, you own two guns, and can only show one'? "well I GAVE the other to my step dad" would they go over there and take a look? what if he didn't show it for fear of being in trouble, also i mentioned that we dont like one another.


You could bet your booty they would check! Count on it.

[Twisted Titan]

they would have just died for a situation like that to happen with me........ it would be lots to investigate....... hopin and prayin that someone somewhere violated a federal law.....

the biggest strenght that I had was that I was totally responsible for everything. if anyone other than myself was involed I would've been in big trouble because multiple people tell multiple stories and cracks soon appear

[Buddha]

Shit, and guess what, he was a fed, air force captian.

[mamboni]

not in the same situation, but I have owned 2 handguns, gave one to my step dad. i really don't like him but he needs protection for my mother, I can't be everywhere at once. Now what if they came to the door, and said " you nigger faggot, you own two guns, and can only show one'? "well I GAVE the other to my step dad" would they go over there and take a look? what if he didn't show it for fear of being in trouble, also i mentioned that we dont like one another.


Buddha, you're a negro homosexual? :conf:

[Buddha]

not in the same situation, but I have owned 2 handguns, gave one to my step dad. i really don't like him but he needs protection for my mother, I can't be everywhere at once. Now what if they came to the door, and said " you nigger faggot, you own two guns, and can only show one'? "well I GAVE the other to my step dad" would they go over there and take a look? what if he didn't show it for fear of being in trouble, also i mentioned that we dont like one another.


Buddha, you're a negro homosexual? :conf:


just a straight white guy, but I would think the cops might call me something like that to piss me off, never been on 4chan huh?

[mamboni]

not in the same situation, but I have owned 2 handguns, gave one to my step dad. i really don't like him but he needs protection for my mother, I can't be everywhere at once. Now what if they came to the door, and said " you nigger faggot, you own two guns, and can only show one'? "well I GAVE the other to my step dad" would they go over there and take a look? what if he didn't show it for fear of being in trouble, also i mentioned that we dont like one another.


Buddha, you're a negro homosexual? :conf:


just a straight white guy, but I would think the cops might call me something like that to piss me off, never been on 4chan huh?


4chan? No speka the lingo bro. ???

[Twisted Titan]

I bought my arms over a period of several years with multiple dealers......... all were legitimate freestanding stores.

this was a fishing expedition over two a half years in the making pure and simple


government waste at its finest

[osoab]

Bob Chapman on Discount Gold and Silver's Friday's program says the BATF is checking up on all multiple sales (2 or more at one time) at the homes of the buyers. Especially if they are of an "assult weapon" type. He says it just before the 30 minute break.

MP3 to last fridays show. http://libertyarchives.com/farlive/FS2_FRI.MP3

Anyone else heard other interview from Bob that go into more indepth

[keehah]

Exclusive? I heard it here first!


Exclusive: ATF Intimidates Gun Owners With Home Visits (http://www.infowars.com/exclusive-atf-intimidates-gun-owners-with-home-visits/)

Federal agency attempts to make firearms retailers spy on their customers under new illegal directive

Infowars.com Friday, July 29, 2011

Even as it finds itself embroiled in a scandal that saw weapons being deliberately sent to criminal gangs in Mexico, the ATF has issued a letter ordering firearms dealers in border states to report sales of two or more semi-automatic rifles, and is following it up by harassing gun owners with intimidating home visits as well as threatening gun dealers to spy on their customers.

As the Justice Department announced earlier this month, “All gun shops in four Southwest border states (Texas, California, Arizona and New Mexico) will be required to alert the federal government to frequent buyers of high-powered rifles.”

The ATF letter also orders gun dealers to report to the feds sales of “two or more pistols or revolvers, or any combination of pistols or revolvers totaling two or more.”...

According to several gun dealers in Austin as well as one of our own staff members, the ATF is visiting people’s homes, demanding to be allowed inside without a warrant, and implying that gun owners could be terrorists for purchasing two or more firearms at a time.

Illustrating how lawless this is, a central Texas gun dealer who provided Alex Jones with the ATF letter, contacted Daniel Jones, the head of the ATF in Austin two weeks before receiving the letter to ask about news reports that President Obama was going to order the investigation of citizens that bought two or more rifles. Agent Jones told him “no that law is not going to pass, and we can’t enforce something that isn’t law so don’t worry about it.” Of course, the law didn’t pass but the ATF later enforced it anyway.

This is all based on a directive from the federal government that is completely outside of the law and unconstitutional. The law that would have required gun dealers in border states to report sales of two or more semi-automatic rifles to the ATF was “stripped entirely from the text of the regulation” when it came up for a vote in Congress on April 15, but as part of the Obama administration’s dictatorial zeal to accomplish its agenda outside of the law, the program is going ahead anyway.

The federal government is enforcing a law that was never passed....

[osoab]

Exclusive? I heard it here first!



AJ at around 6:08 in the first segment tiouches on the topic while Bob Chapman is on. This is from last Friday's show. I have yet to listen to the full Chapman interview.

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAlexJonesChannel?blend=1&ob=5#p/u/16/zn9cGdDY8eI


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zn9cGdDY8eI&feature=player_profilepage

[osoab]

In the third segment AJ goes over the ATF document about multiple sales.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4F9n4myA7w&feature=related


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s4F9n4myA7w&feature=related

[freespirit]

Thanks, madfranks. Couldn't have said it better.

midnightrambler, you obviously have some knowledge to pass along. Instead of throwing grief out to a guy who was more than likely scared out of his wits at the time, why not give some points of reference to those of us that might be on the next list for door knocks. We all haven't had a clue for as long of a period of time as you.

Beating the collective over the head, isn't getting us anywhere.

Give us a bone, man. :D

...good luck with that one...if he tells you what he knows, you'll know it too and then he won't be able pretend like he's superior to us all anymore.

[Awoke]

The ATF letter also orders gun dealers to report to the feds sales of “two or more pistols or revolvers, or any combination of pistols or revolvers totaling two or more.”...

According to several gun dealers in Austin as well as one of our own staff members, the ATF is visiting people’s homes, demanding to be allowed inside without a warrant, and implying that gun owners could be terrorists for purchasing two or more firearms at a time.


No wouldn't it be awesome if we could convice every single person we know to go out and buy 2 pistols?
I mean everyone.

That would be a great day. TPTB would shit in their pants.




...good luck with that one...if he tells you what he knows, you'll know it too and then he won't be able pretend like he's superior to us all anymore.


HAHAHAHAHA! That was funny. Just sayin, it was funny.

[mick silver]

your telling me if i wanted gun i would come to the usa for them . why not just go and buy them in a country thats got full blow auto , plus i am sure without records for buying them there ................... just more shit in a pot to try and take firearms from the people of this once great country