3D printer

[Cebu_4_2]

mankind has to start over, this is too far...

http://youtu.be/ZboxMsSz5Aw

[Dogman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZboxMsSz5Aw&feature=youtu.be

[Canadian-guerilla]

i'm sorry, i'm not gonna buy into this


3D printing is a form of additive manufacturing technology
where a three dimensional object is created by laying down successive layers of material

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_printing

so this 3D printer makes the cogs/gears as it adds each layer

i'll believe it when i see a " working adjustable wrench " made in front of me

[Dogman]

i'm sorry, i'm not gonna buy into this



so this 3D printer makes the cogs/gears as it adds each layer

i'll believe it when i see a " working adjustable wrench " made in front of me

Your eyes will pop out and your brain will explode! :o

When you see it happen, and yes it does work. ;D

The down side in the process is the strength of the item's produced, that maybe solved in time.

[Canadian-guerilla]

Your eyes will pop out and your brain will explode! :o

When you see it happen, and yes it does work. ;D

The down side in the process is the strength of the item's produced, that maybe solved in time.

i couldn't hear the video, was the machine using metal, plastic, ?

[Dogman]

i couldn't hear the video, was the machine using metal, plastic, ?

They never said, more likely a plastic, but some process's use a fine metal powder laser sistering process.

[beefsteak]

It's a polymer that is heated basically by layers. Many many YouTubes on this. There are service bureaus set up around the country where you can export your CAD-CAM file, and for $75 plus material cost, you can get anything you like cranked out. There are even websites set up with already created CAD designs for "borrowing" copyright free,
just to save time and money.

The intricacies of this technology ARE mind blowing. I've seen it. Back in 1986, Boeing had one of the first units leased out for testing. They are now available or about $1300 brand new, ready to go, and desktop size...about as big as an HP Laser Printer you can find at your local Staples, Office Depot type stores.

Totally cool. What always amazes me is how you can get the unit to literally "print out" intricate items within items, such as a working sprocket freely rotatable on a shaft already embedded into a universal joint for example. It comes out as a fully working model.
Only about 6 colors currently available for the desktop model polymers. I expect that to change.

This is AWESOME price point breakdown.

Take it from me. It exists. It works, and I'm toying with buying one of the desktop ones for myself.

[palani]

A new ear might be in your future with these devices as well:


http://news.discovery.com/tech/inkjet-inspired-skin-tech-110220.html

Ink-jet printing technology has inspired scientists to look for ways to build sheets of skin that could one day be used for grafts in burn victims, experts said Sunday.

One technique involves a portable bioprinter that could be carried to wounded soldiers on the battlefield where it would scan the injury, take cells from the patient and print a section of compatible skin.

Another uses a three-dimensional printer combining donor cells, biofriendly gel and other materials to build cartilage.

The 3-D printer was shown at work, building a prototype of an ear during a half-hour demonstration at a Washington science conference.

[Heimdhal]

Beef, that isnt a typo, they only cost 1,300 for a desktop size one?

I may seriously, serisously consider getting one, I have many ideas................

[osoab]

And this is the tech that is in the public view.

[Santa]

One of the members here owns one and earns money printing and selling the outcome online.
I can't remember his handle at the moment. Maybe he'll post.

I remember now. techrunner, that's the guy... I think!

[solid]

I don't believe it.

Besides, a damn EMP is going to come along and take care of this so-called technology 'problem' we seem to be dealing with.

[Joe King]

i'm sorry, i'm not gonna buy into this



so this 3D printer makes the cogs/gears as it adds each layer

i'll believe it when i see a " working adjustable wrench " made in front of me

If you think making a working wrench is unbelieveable, you should check out the video right after the one Dogman posted where they make a functional roller bearing. Timken would be impressed.
...and if they're only $1300, everybody needs to get one. Unless of course the powder they use is crazy expensive.

[osoab]

I don't believe it.

Besides, a damn EMP is going to come along and take care of this so-called technology 'problem' we seem to be dealing with.

Buy two and keep one in storage.

[Gaillo]

Besides, a damn EMP is going to come along and take care of this so-called technology 'problem' we seem to be dealing with.

We don't have a "technology problem"... we have a "too many ASSHOLES using technology against decent people" problem.

[BillBoard]

Can a 3D printer print me a 3D printer?

[keehah]

It inefficiently makes weaker products. But it is novel in the short term.

[Cebu_4_2]

It inefficiently makes weaker products. But it is novel in the short term.

China has been using them for many years.

[Korbin Dallas]

A buddy of mine owns a dental lab, he's been using this technology for over three years to make gold copings and crowns. It is inferior to CAD-CAM for most applications, though, as the materials that can be milled are stronger, it takes less time and so far, CAD is much more precise. 3D printing is a fad that has been around for years, and is still looking for a use.

[solid]

We don't have a "technology problem"... we have a "too many ASSHOLES using technology against decent people" problem.

Gaillo, that to me still defines a technology problem. Get rid of the technology the assholes use against us...and poof, the assholes disappear.

Get rid of the technology, get rid of the assholes (hammerheads I prefer to call them) and yeah...a better world for the good folks like us. I'd happily sacrifice a few tech creature comforts to rid the world of those fiat sucking vampires.

[Joe King]

Gaillo, that to me still defines a technology problem. Get rid of the technology the assholes use against us...and poof, the assholes disappear.

I can see where technology makes it easier for the assholes to do their asshole stuff, but do you really think that it's the technology that makes them that to begin with?

I agree with Gaillos sig line. Technology or not, the assholes are the ones not wanting to leave others alone to live their lives in peace.

[solid]

I can see where technology makes it easier for the assholes to do their asshole stuff, but do you really think that it's the technology that makes them that to begin with?

I agree with Gaillos sig line. Technology or not, the assholes are the ones not wanting to leave others alone to live their lives in peace.

The technology is an enabler, it allows them to function and encourages their devious behavior.

Technology encourages them to NOT leave us in peace, that's the bottom line. The more tech, the more oppression and tyranny.

Yes, they were assholes to begin with, now they are assholes with some pretty damn big weapons...

[Joe King]

Exactly. It makes it easier for them.

You say encourage, I say easier. You know, just like the tomato tomatoe, potato potatoe thing. lol

[solid]

Exactly. It makes it easier for them.

You say encourage, I say easier. You know, just like the tomato tomatoe, potato potatoe thing. lol

So...what are we arguing about, Joe?;D

We all agree, we have a technology "problem". Technology is a buffer, to keep our focus off of what's really going on...on top of that, the assholes use it against us.

We enjoy our tech comforts, but sell our souls at the same time. Why? Because we KNOW..it is being used against us.

We can't cry freedom from tyranny when we WILLING sign up for it!!!

We're all a bunch of damn hypocrites, bottom line.

[Joe King]

Why should we have to give up technology that makes life easier just because some people choose to mis-use it in bad ways?

Can all technology not be used for both good and bad purposes?

As example, a car is technology that can take your hurt friend to the hospital quick enough to save his life, or it can be used to just take someones life.


BTW, I'm not arguing, but rather just throwin' ideas around with ya. Just don't bring my mom into it, ok? :wink: lol

[beefsteak]

A fad? Hardly. One of the most exciting "uses" for this 3D printer technology is in the prosthesis industry, and artificial hips and other joints. CAT scans translated into CAD translated into non-rejected artificial hips for patients is helping not just senior population, but also returning, injured war veterans. Instead of the surgeon only having small medium and large to select from in the "titanium category"...3-D printing is making the custom original "positive" from which a titanium custom replacements can be created.

I find this very exciting vista for those needing joint replacements, which includes custom spinal discs, etc. Just think. If one is severely injured in a Cheney hunting accident, and one has their facial structure "on File" for just such an occasion, then one can custom order their own facial parts, nose, jaw, chin, etc., and cut down on the horrid amount of plastic surgeries required after such disfigurement.


beefsteak

[beefsteak]

Beef, that isnt a typo, they only cost 1,300 for a desktop size one?

I may seriously, serisously consider getting one, I have many ideas................


No typo, Heimdahl. If you want to work in the 8x10x10 cubic arena for example (or however far the elevator travels vertically to 3D print your product), the price point last I checked was $1300 set up and ready to go for the desktop size/Laser Printer size 3D printers.

One of the most intriguing demonstrations I saw of one of the early units was back in 1987. The seminar was demonstrating creation of custom packaging of perfume for ladies, and a external car mirror + cowling for the guys who are car buffs. The car part wasn't so interesting as the perfume bottle 3D printing demo was to me. I'll admit I was surprised that the "mirror" part did swivel in the cowling which was designed to be attached to the vehicle.

The bottle was built one layer at a time, including the removable stopper in place when the build-out was completed. The elevator with this feminine shaped perfume bottle lifted the bottle out of the polymer which drained through the perforated platform of the elevator. And then the seminar leader reached in, twisted the stopper off the top of the bottle and POURED OUT NON-SOLIDIFIED POLYMER beads which were not visible there on the inside from the 3D printing process. That blew me away, because I never counted on a hollow package being custom built, let alone which already had "contents."

The point of the seminar was engineers could conceive in the morning, print it out before lunch, check it over, and present to the committee after lunch. And the engineer could print multiples with this commercial unit for the rest of the staff to examine individually instead of having to "take turns" critiquing it one at a time.


beefsteak

[Gaillo]

Solid,
Technology is like any other human tool... it can be used to improve the human condition, or for evil purposes like enslavement and police-state surveillance. To place the blame for our very REAL political/economic problems on technology is simple-minded and avoids the REAL issues - all of which are societal/philosophical in nature. Would you happily give up your boat (a form of technology) and all that it means to you just because some fuckheads load other boats up with armed men and invade other countries with them? Would you give up this community of people and what we talk about in cyberspace just because bankers and governments use the same technology to track us and move "money" around?
Ultimately, technology does more good than bad for humanity... imagine a world without clothes, fire, tools of any kind, weapons to hunt and defend ourselves with, or any way of writing down our experiences for communication with others. THAT is what kind of world people are asking for by blaming technology (instead of political philosophy, where the blame TRULY belongs...) for mankind's problems.

[keehah]

Would you happily give up your boat (a form of technology) and all that it means to you just because some fuckheads load other boats up with armed men and invade other countries with them?

Sailboats as an example of technology out of control? Does this come before or after your strawman abandons agriculture? ;)

I'd give up the ability to own a boat with a cloaking device, torpedos, nuclear bombs and electroshock kill anything in the water around him technology. But I don't have to. I can't afford it and the government would prevent me from using it.

Technology that creates excess entropy is evil. Thus Gailo if the goal is to invade other country's by boat, this is less evil than by plane, and even less evil if done by the leasing of existing sailboats. Rowboats could be just as good if the men needed the exercise.

And this thread discussion seems related to Jevons Paradox.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jevons_paradox

In economics, the Jevons paradox (sometimes Jevons effect) is the proposition that technological progress that increases the efficiency with which a resource is used tends to increase (rather than decrease) the rate of consumption of that resource.
We need more progress in truth and orientation of our activities. Otherwise more technology does more of the same faster and to a greater degree.

[gunDriller]

i couldn't hear the video, was the machine using metal, plastic, ?

some of the 3D printers use plastic, some use acrylic, and some use finely rolled paper.

some might use metal, i don't make it a point to stay "up" on the technology.

normally, these printers make "show & tell" models (something that you take to R&D meetings). they are also useful for making patterns that can be used as mold 'masters' - an object from which working molds can be taken.

[Santa]

Solid,
Technology is like any other human tool... it can be used to improve the human condition, or for evil purposes like enslavement and police-state surveillance. To place the blame for our very REAL political/economic problems on technology is simple-minded and avoids the REAL issues - all of which are societal/philosophical in nature. Would you happily give up your boat (a form of technology) and all that it means to you just because some fuckheads load other boats up with armed men and invade other countries with them? Would you give up this community of people and what we talk about in cyberspace just because bankers and governments use the same technology to track us and move "money" around?
Ultimately, technology does more good than bad for humanity... imagine a world without clothes, fire, tools of any kind, weapons to hunt and defend ourselves with, or any way of writing down our experiences for communication with others. THAT is what kind of world people are asking for by blaming technology (instead of political philosophy, where the blame TRULY belongs...) for mankind's problems.

Philosophically, pragmatically and ethically the modern state of technology is a huge topic. Possibly the most important topic of all.

Technology isn't merely a tool, it's the sum total of all tools throughout history. In many ways it represents human civilization itself.

Technology represents both salvation and destruction for humanity...
metaphorically speaking, technology has become a modern day god.

Today, world politics and economics are defined by the creation and control of technology.
AI
Biotech
Gentech
Nanotech

The problem is like the story of Pandora's Box.

The question is, who gets to control the direction and advancement of those areas of technology listed above when every one of them might conceivably be used to implement world destroying weapons of mass destruction? And that's putting it mildly. While none of those technologies are evil in and of themselves, each contain a seed of destruction at least as powerful as nuclear technology which has never existed in the world before, or in which no precedent exists for knowledge to lead to wise decisions.

It's the question of the new millennium and most probably (hopefully) the underlying motive behind one world government.

So arguing for individual rights while simultaneously arguing for unrestricted advancements in technology becomes a very uncomfortable contradiction.

[horseshoe3]

It's definitly not a fad and is used extensively in industry for rapid prototyping.

It lets you test fit and function of complex machinery without having to machine expensive steel parts. It's not durable and you can't load it, but it does let you know how things will fit together.

You can also prototype plastic parts before you spend money on tooling. It costs more than production parts, but it's a lot cheaper than building a mold and finding out it's not what you wanted.

[joboo]

The technology is an enabler, it allows them to function and encourages their devious behavior.

Technology encourages them to NOT leave us in peace, that's the bottom line. The more tech, the more oppression and tyranny.

Yes, they were assholes to begin with, now they are assholes with some pretty damn big weapons...

Huge gun control advocate by any chance? Blame the gun?

[Santa]

Huge gun control advocate by any chance? Blame the gun?

What if everyone were able to carry a nuclear bomb?

"Freeze motherf**ker... or I'm gonna blow the shit out of Southern California." ;D

I don't have a pat answer, but it's an interesting question. Where does the line get drawn and who draws it?

[solid]

Huge gun control advocate by any chance? Blame the gun?

I blame technology for making guns obsolete in the future. We may all be chipped in the future, all they may need to do is push a button and your heart stops dead. How long before they start putting RFID chips in guns, to track their movement and ours?

My point is that technology keeps getting used, not for good reasons to better our world, but always seems to take a turn and get used against us. To control us.

[Joe King]

I blame technology for making guns obsolete in the future. We may all be chipped in the future, all they may need to do is push a button and your heart stops dead. How long before they start putting RFID chips in guns, to track their movement and ours?

My point is that technology keeps getting used, not for good reasons to better our world, but always seems to take a turn and get used against us. To control us.As much as most people hate it, all the tracking abilities can also be used for good purpose as well as for bad. Perhaps by showing the suspect was in fact at the location the child was abducted from. etc etc.

It still comes down to how the technology is used. The gov doesnt have to track and spy on people without probable cause, but if they choose to, well, you know what kind of people it makes those who make up the gov.

That's not to say I want an RFID chip in me though. And if that day ever comes, I will simply decline the offer.

[Santa]

That's not to say I want an RFID chip in me though. And if that day ever comes, I will simply decline the offer. Good luck with that. Nanotech is advancing so fast it won't be long at all before RFID chips are so small and cheap that they might be inhaled like dust.

[Joe King]

It still won't be done without your consent. They would still have to know which ones are in which people. It would do them no good to release the stuff randomly, to be inhaled by anyone, or even animals.

Now, will they try to create an enviroment where people merely think they have no other option than to consent? Perhaps. After all, that's how they got most people to consent to everything so far.
I don't see why personal RFID chips would be any different.

[gunDriller]

I blame technology for making guns obsolete in the future. We may all be chipped in the future, all they may need to do is push a button and your heart stops dead. How long before they start putting RFID chips in guns, to track their movement and ours?

My point is that technology keeps getting used, not for good reasons to better our world, but always seems to take a turn and get used against us. To control us.

true.

i think the "Madrassa" approach to education that is financed by wealthy Saudi's may be a way of lobotimizing Muslims so they can't fight back against an Israel with modern technology & American funding.

i would like to see Muslims de-prioritize the Koran in their education, and put more emphasis on Industrial Arts, math science physics chemistry engineering.

i was speaking to a Palestinian woman friend about this last weekend, also about the emphasis in some Muslim cultures on keeping the women sequestered & un-educated. she said that is more a cultural or regional thing than a Muslim thing.


another example is - Iran, a country with 70 million people, has no oil refineries. 100 billion barrels of oil & no refineries ! i don't know all the reasons, and for sure Israel is interfering in their affairs, killing off their nuclear scientists.

personally i'm a big believer in Industrial Arts education. stereo-lithography (that's the UV-curable plastic acrylic 3D printing method) is just one example.

[horseshoe3]

As much as most people hate it, all the tracking abilities can also be used for good purpose as well as for bad. Perhaps by showing the suspect was in fact at the location the child was abducted from. etc etc.

It still comes down to how the technology is used. The gov doesnt have to track and spy on people without probable cause, but if they choose to, well, you know what kind of people it makes those who make up the gov.

That's not to say I want an RFID chip in me though. And if that day ever comes, I will simply decline the offer.

Those who have first and most access to technological advances are also those with the most predisposition to use it for evil instead of good.

[solid]

I don't see why personal RFID chips would be any different.

Perhaps, but eventually the technology will get so smart, everything you own will be RFID chipped. The imagination can run wild with possibilities, like Santa suggested..

Imagine this..year 2016, Joe King wakes up one Saturday morning, and thinks what a great day, I'll go out for coffee....

Some DHS goon, bored at work, randomly selects a name. "Hum, Joe King. I wonder what he's up to. One click of a mouse. Oh there he is, he's walking into a Starbucks. He's wearing blue jeans and a flannel shirt. He has 87$ cash on him, and oh look at this...a shiny new 2016 silver eagle. He probably doesn't realize the new silver eagles have chips in them...haha. Oh..Oh, I got something! One of the $20 bills in his pocket is linked to a robbery 10 days ago, 15 miles from his home...let's go have a talk with Mr. Joe King"

As Joe King leaves Starbucks with his coffee, lights and sirens descend upon him. Joe King's day isn't quite as beautiful anymore.;D

[Joe King]

If they could ID a specific bill in my wallet, they would already know that I got it in change at WalMart and wouldn't bother with me, but rather the person who used it at WalMart.

Besides, the imagination can run wild with anything. Both good and bad.

[solid]

If they could ID a specific bill in my wallet, they would already know that I got it in change at WalMart and wouldn't bother with me, but rather the person who used it at WalMart.

Besides, the imagination can run wild with anything. Both good and bad.

What if you got the $20 from selling your old lawn mower on Craigslist? That's right...my bad, with RFID technology any sort of barter economy would be destroyed. We won't have to worry about that in the future.

[keehah]

What if the book value on that lawn mower was $100? You could owe $30 in taxes solid, regardless of the fact you accepted $20 for it.

"Its unacceptable for the market to set the price because it interferes with tax collection."

[Joe King]

Solid, it wouldn't be destroyed. It would give gov the ability to have taxes levied upon that barter. Which would also show from whom the $20 bill in question came from.

Here. Read this. It's about a guy that was glad to have been able to have his movements tracked. It also supports your view on women. lol
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-accused-20110626,0,7042051.story?page=1&obref=obinsite

[solid]

Here. Read this. It's about a guy that was glad to have been able to have his movements tracked. It also supports your view on women. lol
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-accused-20110626,0,7042051.story?page=1&obref=obinsite

Gee...thanks Joe, for that painful story to read about. It baffles me how much damage a woman's lies can do to a man, completely ruin his life because she has an emotional moment. I actually have a date lined up this weekend that I was excited about it. I'm not so excited anymore, maybe I'll cancel it.

[Joe King]

You're very welcome Solid. I kinda thought you'd "enjoy" that. lol ;D

So can you see how being able to track and place a person at a particular spot and time can be used for good purposes too?

As far as your date goes, don't cancel it. Just remember that women are people too and just like all types of people, they come in both good and bad varieties. Remember our discussion the other night about judging groups of people based upon the actions of individuals within that group? It's the same thing.

Besides, IMHO one of the best things any guy can experience in life is the true love of a good woman. It doesn't get much better than that.
...and if you ever get that, just try not to screw it up.

So don't let stories of the bad ones scare you away from finding a good one.
Just learn a lesson from the guy in the article and don't get them pregnant until you're sure which side they fall on. lol

[solid]

As far as your date goes, don't cancel it. Just remember that women are people too and just like all types of people, they come in both good and bad varieties. Remember our discussion the other night about judging groups of people based upon the actions of individuals within that group? It's the same thing.


You are right..it is the same thing. Exactly the same thing. I think though for different reasons. Men are at a disadvantage and the weak ones will get taken. I don't believe any racial ethnicity is near the disadvantage of men, regards to culture and law. They may experience bias and judgement, but not our very laws stacked against them...like the laws stacked against men.

Anyway, I'll not cancel that date. She's a blonde, and tends to have her "blonde moments" :) I don't think she's smart enough to calculate a scheme to get me. She's fun to be around. That is what matters.

[Joe King]

You are right..it is the same thing. Exactly the same thing. I think though for different reasons. Men are at a disadvantage and the weak ones will get taken. I don't believe any racial ethnicity is near the disadvantage of men, regards to culture and law. They may experience bias and judgement, but not our very laws stacked against them...like the laws stacked against men.



Anyway, I'll not cancel that date. She's a blonde, and tends to have her "blonde moments" :) I don't think she's smart enough to calculate a scheme to get me. She's fun to be around. That is what matters.Yep. At this stage, that's all that matters. Sounds like a good time. :D
As long as you don't let your lower brain start doing all the thinking for you, you should be fine. lol

[beefsteak]

Hope it's not too late to add this URL to the discussion of 3-D printers. Ben Heck built one from scratch using his CNC machine (and a buddy's MakerBot for some important couplings.) Interesting as well, as heck of course. :D

About 20min duration. Good sound. Good Video.

http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-36297/l/episode-19-watch-ben-heck-builds-a-portable-3d-printer