Pit Bull mauls 32 y.o. pregnant owner to death

[midnight rambler]

Couple had Pit Bull since it was a puppy...next door neighbor asserts dog had always been well behaved and "responded very well" to his owner that he mauled to death.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2025207/Darla-Napora-Pregnant-woman-dies-mauled-pet-dog-living-room.html

[sirgonzo420]

*waits for Sui Juris to post*

[Spectrism]

She wasn't the owner. Her husband was. He was the alpha..... and she clearly was a threat to the dog in the pecking order. They did not make it clear to the dog that it would always be UNDER her as well as him.

If my dog gives a hint of such behavior... and it has.... I beat it out of her immediately. If I do not get a good response, I will shoot the dog. An animal will test and fight for its pack position.

[Ares]

She wasn't the owner. Her husband was. He was the alpha..... and she clearly was a threat to the dog in the pecking order. They did not make it clear to the dog that it would always be UNDER her as well as him.

If my dog gives a hint of such behavior... and it has.... I beat it out of her immediately. If I do not get a good response, I will shoot the dog. An animal will test and fight for its pack position.

I grew up with pit bulls and a very broad range of different breeds of dogs over the years. That's true, you have to assert that you are the "pack leader" and are the master. Like any other dog, the pit bull would of showed signs of disapproval of the pecking order with the woman long before this happened. This woman's death is the result of the "pack leader" not recognizing the signs and addressing them accordingly.

[Awoke]

Alpha or not, the f'ing dog shouldn't attack a co-habitant. (Nevermind ANYONE ELSE, other than a burglar)

[freespirit]

...from the comments section...


Bad breeding is the cause here. I had the sweetest pitbull on the planet and then she grew up. At a year old her whole demeanor changed, she became very dangerous and had to be euthanized. It was very sad.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2025207/Darla-Napora-Pregnant-woman-dies-mauled-pet-dog-living-room.html#ixzz1UphhnPzE


this is not the first i have heard of this...i think there is some merit to the "bad breeding" theory, where some (less than reputable) breeders will take one of the male pups and breed it back to the mother. this would screw up the bloodlines the same as it would with humans, causing the animal to go crazy...

[midnight rambler]

She wasn't the owner. Her husband was. He was the alpha..... and she clearly was a threat to the dog in the pecking order. They did not make it clear to the dog that it would always be UNDER her as well as him.

If my dog gives a hint of such behavior... and it has.... I beat it out of her immediately. If I do not get a good response, I will shoot the dog. An animal will test and fight for its pack position.

Clearly you don't 'get' dogs and their behavior. If you read the article you'd have noted how the next door neighbor asserted how that dog responded well to her when she called it off when it's drives were loaded.

What you don't get is a characteristic often found in some working dogs called 'hardness', in fact it is highly desired by some breeders of serious working dogs. One of my male Dobermanns would completely fuck me up if I kept pushing him with force/compulsion or attempted to "beat it out of" him. This particular male is out of a SchH 2 male who put his original owner in intensive care because he tried to 'beat it out of him' while training him for Schutzhund. Hardness* is what you WANT in a working dog because the dog won't back back down from a fight, and once in a fight it will fight to the death. With hardness a working dog is subject to getting pissed off at you when you give it a correction with the prong collar. Beligian Malinois are especially noted for this, and for this reason they are highly regarded as police K-9s.

*Hardness is not to be confused with being a psycho-dog - it's a very rare exception that a well-bred dog turns out to be psycho, as that's more often than not due to handling by a psycho human. It could be that this particular Pit Bull had 'matured' (at 3+ years old) to the point that his hardness surfaced, the woman somehow escalated the aggression level by mishandling him because she didn't know what she was doing and as a result he went off on her.

ETA: of course as mentioned, it could also be a result of poor breeding.

[Santa]

Wow! Maybe the pup just loved his mommy to death in playful exuberance?

My brother once had a shepherd-ish mutt mix that popped one afternoon while sitting next to him on the couch with friends over.
He reached over to the dog telling it to get down so a friend could sit down, but the dog who's name was Chewy instead bit my brother's arm like it was corn on the cob. Fast as lightning, he was bleeding all over the couch from something like 15 massive puncture wounds. The dog weighed close to 100lbs.

Talk about SHTF... yikes, my bro lit into the dog. The dog ran out the back door while MY dog, an Aussie/Border Collie mix half his weight chased Chewy out nipping at his heals, but Chewy turned, grabbed my dog by the neck and proceeded to rip his neck off, or try to, wherein I intervened.

As he was shaking my dog by the neck like a rag doll, I grabbed his fucking jaws and in the grip of adrenalin strength, pried his bloody mouth so far open that I could feel tendons popping until he collapsed in a whimpering heap in the dirt.

It was totally sick...

That poor dog got put out of his misery.
My dog was fine with a couple crusty scabs and my brother had a very stiff swollen arm for weeks.

We never did figure out what happened in Chewy's mind that made him go insane like that.
For all I know it could have been caused from parasites.

[midnight rambler]

Wow! Maybe the pup just loved his mommy to death in playful exuberance?

My brother once had a shepherd-ish mutt mix that popped one afternoon while sitting next to him on the couch with friends over.
He reached over to the dog telling it to get down so a friend could sit down, but the dog who's name was Chewy instead bit my brother's arm like it was corn on the cob. Fast as lightning, he was bleeding all over the couch from something like 15 massive puncture wounds. The dog weighed close to 100lbs.

Talk about SHTF... yikes, my bro lit into the dog. The dog ran out the back door while MY dog, an Aussie/Border Collie mix half his weight chased Chewy out nipping at his heals, but Chewy turned, grabbed my dog by the neck and proceeded to rip his neck off, or try to, wherein I intervened.

As he was shaking my dog by the neck like a rag doll, I grabbed his fucking jaws and in the grip of adrenalin strength, pried his bloody mouth so far open that I could feel tendons popping until he collapsed in a whimpering heap in the dirt.

It was totally sick...

That poor dog got put out of his misery.
My dog was fine with a couple crusty scabs and my brother had a very stiff swollen arm for weeks.

We never did figure out what happened in Chewy's mind that made him go insane like that.
For all I know it could have been caused from parasites.

You were very fortunate that your hands didn't get caught up in that dog's mouth when you directly intervened. I learned my lesson over 25 years ago - NEVER try to break up a dog fight by sticking your hands into where the action is. One of the dogs is subject to re-biting and in the process your hand may get STUCK in its grip. One of the sweetest, most benign and loving female Dobermans I ever had bit the crap out of my hand when I tried to break up a fight between her and her adult female offspring (it was a matter of jealousy which Dobermans are subject to having). My hand was STUCK in my dog's grip and I had to 'go with the flow' of the fight for what seemed to be a very long time until my hand was ripped free.

The only way I know of to break up a serious dog fight is to grab the hind legs of one of the dogs and pull - of course it helps to have someone else grab the other dog the same way.

[freespirit]

i know another way...

use a tranquilizer gun!

;D

[midnight rambler]

It's worth noting that one of the top German breeders of working Dobermanns, Manfred Lerner (von Bayern) had a very serious working Dobermann with extreme hardness in his breeding program which he campaigned very successfully in Schutzhund* that he literally found as an adult in someone's junkyard as their 'junkyard dog' - true story.

*In Schutzhund, one does not progress into the working phases (including the bitework) of the trial sport unless and until the dog passes a temperament test known as the BH to show that the dog has the stability to do the work (so unsuitable dogs are not titled and bred).

[Spectrism]

MR- if you are keeping a dog with that kind of "hardness", you had better keep it penned all the time. That is more dangerous than a wild animal. It is not a family pet.

I will not tolerate that kind of reaction or initiation from my animals. In a mad-max world, that might be slightly different. But to have a dog so hard it won't obey, is just asking to be ruined. All it takes is one event by your dog and you lose your house, your savings, your life style.

AS for your concerns about "beating it out" of the animal.... I have plenty of experience with "work" dogs and their innate desire to maul poultry. I use a stick and carrot. Dogs are good friends- praised and loved when they do well and are just being dogs. They are treated with unquestionable discipline when they go over the line.

[midnight rambler]

MR- if you are keeping a dog with that kind of "hardness", you had better keep it penned all the time. That is more dangerous than a wild animal. It is not a family pet.There are a great many police K-9s, both GSDs and Malinois, which go directly from work to their handler's family home as their family pet, no problemo. It's all about how the dog is handled. My dogs are very 'clear-headed' (meaning they can make the distinction between good and bad human behavior and respond accordingly) and are absolutely NO threat to ANYONE, except to human varmints. My dogs are VERY stable due to the way they are bred and raised. The ONLY time I had a problem with one is about 25 years ago when I didn't understand how to handle a hard dog and I tried to 'beat it out of him'. In hindsight if I had handled him more appropriately he wouldn't have tried to kill me - he was an AWESOME dog, VERY smart, very affectionate, and eager to please.

Your 'experience' with "working dogs" doesn't amount to diddley-squat IMO, as your statements clearly show. You'd never be able to live with one of my dogs, it'd kill you - it'd be like letting a 12 y.o. child get behind the wheel of a F1 car or giving a 4 y.o. child a loaded sub-gun with the bolt cocked and the safety off.

[Santa]

You were very fortunate that your hands didn't get caught up in that dog's mouth when you directly intervened. I learned my lesson over 25 years ago - NEVER try to break up a dog fight by sticking your hands into where the action is. One of the dogs is subject to re-biting and in the process your hand may get STUCK in its grip. One of the sweetest, most benign and loving female Dobermans I ever had bit the crap out of my hand when I tried to break up a fight between her and her adult female offspring (it was a matter of jealousy which Dobermans are subject to having). My hand was STUCK in my dog's grip and I had to 'go with the flow' of the fight for what seemed to be a very long time until my hand was ripped free.

The only way I know of to break up a serious dog fight is to grab the hind legs of one of the dogs and pull - of course it helps to have someone else grab the other dog the same way.

Lol, yeah, I know. That was a total fluke. Sheer luck that I got a good grip on his jaws like that. Plus I was pumped on adrenalin believing my dog was being killed before my eyes.
Funny,...but much later I did the same thing you did and tried to pry the jaws of a Pit mix off another pits' ear that was getting torn up.
That time didn't work out so well. My thumb got caught between the dogs molars and she wasn't about to let go. Whoa! Lol... that was a hell of a ride...that lasted for quite a while.

Anyway, I mentioned parasites. They can do things to an animals biology that are not well studied... Worms can get into the brain.
Tics can cause mouth foaming, epileptic episodes and paralysis. It's really not possible to tell what lit that dogs fuse.

A terrible tragedy though. God, I'd hate to be the husband who came home and found his pretty pregnant wife dead like that.

I'm not particularly fond of Pitties though. I've known too many immature retarded assholes and who own and negligently breed fighting dogs,
including some in my own family...

[midnight rambler]

There's not a SINGLE professional dog trainer ANYWHERE who will agree that "beating it out of a dog" is an appropriate course of action - EVER.

[ximmy]

There's not a SINGLE professional dog trainer ANYWHERE who will agree that "beating it out of a dog" is an appropriate course of action - EVER.

What about red-headed step children... could you beat it out of them?

[horseshoe3]

MR, I think I'm getting the idea of hardness. Could it be stated as devotion to duty? Staying on the job until it's done without getting distracted or intimidated?

[Santa]

There's not a SINGLE professional dog trainer ANYWHERE who will agree that "beating it out of a dog" is an appropriate course of action - EVER.

I agree. beating isn't training. It's acting out of a loss of control, not of maintaining or encouraging it.

I kicked a hunting dog of mine one time. She was eating a deer carcass, long dead and rotting and wouldn't come when I called.
So I got it in my head to run up on her as she was absorbed and engaged in her meal... and as I ran up I thought to startle her
with a light kick... to scare the sense back into her. It did scare her, and probably hurt some too,... but she never got over it.
That dog was scared of me for ever after. She would piss herself if I raised my voice.
Totally sad and I'm ashamed of myself for that.

I was too hard on my dogs when I was young, in general.

[Spectrism]

Your 'experience' with "working dogs" doesn't amount to diddley-squat IMO, as your statements clearly show. You'd never be able to live with one of my dogs, it'd kill you - it'd be like letting a 12 y.o. child get behind the wheel of a F1 car or giving a 4 y.o. child a loaded sub-gun with the bolt cocked and the safety off.

LOL... you have no idea what I can do. One dog... even two.... they could not take me out. Three or more.... then they have a chance unless I can pick up a hard object.

I have been reading animals for a long time. I have to wonder what you think "beat it out of them" means.

[midnight rambler]

I have to wonder what you think "beat it out of them" means. It's real clear what you mean - you mean use force on them until they submit or are otherwise subdued. Definitely NOT the way to build mutual trust and respect.

I get along fine with my dogs because they *know* I will never hurt them intentionally, and because they *know* this I can judiciously use the prong collar for correction without getting one of them to go off on me.


One dog... even two.... they could not take me out.I can believe that if you have a knife, bludgeon or gun handy. If you think you can take out a well trained protection dog with your bare hands you're clueless. The dog is going to be a lot faster than you, plus a well trained dog knows how to fight humans and is not intimidated by humans. Enzo (the puppy I placed with GoD) BREAKS bite sleeves with his deep, full mouth bite and he's only 19 months old at this time (and that deep bite is what you cannot steel yourself against).

[midnight rambler]

MR, I think I'm getting the idea of hardness. Could it be stated as devotion to duty? Staying on the job until it's done without getting distracted or intimidated?

It's more than simply a devotion to duty, and really less at the same time.

Hardness is the willingness/eagerness to join the fight and fight to the death no matter what else is going on around them. Pain and the threat of death mean nothing when they're in the fight.

My geriatric female is the absolute hardest dog I've ever had, incredibly irrepressible. Once her drives come up, look out. Using force or compulsion on her only pisses her off more. The other day she stuck her nose up under a piece of equipment and found a yellow jacket's nest. When they swarmed and stung her it only pissed her off all the more - she stood her ground biting at them as them swarmed around her and I had to yank her out of there, she wouldn't have retreated on her own. I've always had to be very careful with her, not because she's a threat to humans, but because she throws herself into a fight so immediately and intensely without ANY hesitation whatsoever that obvious danger leading to sure death is no deterrent at all.

[Spectrism]

It's real clear what you mean - you mean use force on them until they submit or are otherwise subdued. Definitely NOT the way to build mutual trust and respect.

I get along fine with my dogs because they *know* I will never hurt them intentionally, and because they *know* this I can judiciously use the prong collar for correction without getting one of them to go off on me.

I can believe that if you have a knife, bludgeon or gun handy. If you think you can take out a well trained protection dog with your bare hands you're clueless. The dog is going to be a lot faster than you, plus a well trained dog knows how to fight humans and is not intimidated by humans. Enzo (the puppy I placed with GoD) BREAKS bite sleeves with his deep, full mouth bite and he's only 19 months old at this time (and that deep bite is what you cannot steel yourself against).

Over an internet forum it is easy to exchange barbs. A dog has one lethal weapon. I have 11. And that is barehanded.

When it comes to livestock or the safety of others, there is no time to use "mutual respect". I snuff unacceptable aggressive behavior fast. The respect and understanding is there. I do not have a shock collar.

[Awoke]

i know another way...

use a tranquilizer gun!

;D

Or another way:


http://standupforamerica.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/pimped-out-1422-barrel.gif

[midnight rambler]

I'm absolutely certain that what YOU regard as "unacceptable aggressive behavior" is regarded as (an) especially desirable and highly valued trait(s) by professional trainers, decoys, handlers, and breeders of working dogs uniformly, worldwide. lol

If one feels compelled to 'beat it out of' their dog, many professional trainers would recommend that the dog in question be euthanized. What a sad state of affairs.

[Awoke]

Sorry Rambler. Killing your owner definitely fits into the "unacceptable aggressive behavior" catagory.

[midnight rambler]

Sorry Rambler. Killing your owner definitely fits into the "unacceptable aggressive behavior" catagory.

I was never defending the dog in the OP, nor the owner, not having any knowledge of any of the particulars. For all I know it could have been a Pit Bull that was created by a series of moronic backyard breeders which resulted in a very unstable dog. The for real *working* dogs and breeders I'm familiar with don't engage in such stupid practices and therefore such instability is something I only see from a distance with no personal first hand experience. For the record, I'm no fan of Pit Bulls, but I have no problem with well-bred and well trained dogs of any breed.

Haven't you stated in the past that you're deathly frightened by dogs to admittedly a possible irrational degree??

[sirgonzo420]

A buddy of mine has a couple pits bulls, one of which he plays with quite roughly.

"If he'll attack me, he'll attack anybody!" <--- His logic regarding guard dogs.

[midnight rambler]

A buddy of mine has a couple pits bulls, one of which he plays with quite roughly.

"If he'll attack me, he'll attack anybody!" <--- His logic regarding guard dogs.

Your buddy is clueless.

[Awoke]

Haven't you stated in the past that you're deathly frightened by dogs to admittedly a possible irrational degree??

There are particular breeds. Dobes, Sheppards, Rotties, Pitties, etc. I don't trust them at all.
I have been getting over my fear of dogs slowly over the last few years, but once a dog barks or growls at me, the fear comes back right away.
They need to be friendly and tail-wagging at all times for me to be comfortable around them.

[midnight rambler]

There are particular breeds. Dobes, Sheppards, Rotties, Pitties, etc. I don't trust them at all.
I have been getting over my fear of dogs slowly over the last few years, but once a dog barks or growls at me, the fear comes back right away.
They need to be friendly and tail-wagging at all times for me to be comfortable around them.

I think I've mentioned to you before that dogs can sense your feeling of fear, and that exacerbates the situation.

I would suggest you carry a good folder if you don't already, and get a sense of confidence knowing that you can easily take out a dog with your knife. This will displace the fear feeling you're experiencing.

[Awoke]

I never go anywhere without at least one knife, but thanks.

There are more dynamics to my thought process than that anyways. For example, I know a dog can sense my fear, so for someone to say "just pretend you're not scared of it" is silly, agree?
Anyways, let's say I am guest and the hosts have dogs. They are family pets who never bother anyone ever, but with me, they sense I fear them, and they don't like me.

As much as I know I could kill one quickly, if I did that it would cause a huge upset with the family I was visiting.

So yeah, I could, and yeah I would, if I felt I was under a serious and threatening attack, but I would still spend an entire weekend in fear, for example, because just getting nipped at doesn't justify slitting it's throat, but it still puts me just as on-edge as if I was being ferociously attacked.

To further clarify my feelings on canines: I hunt, and I walk in and out of the bush in the pitch black with no lights on. I do not fear anything in the bush, because I keep a 9" bowie knife on my chest strap, and if I get attacked by a pack of coyotes, I know I an going to F them up.
I know that I will walk out, and they will not.
Of course, at that point I am not worried about politics: It's a wild animal, not a pet. So I have nothing to fear, because my mindset is "If I see dogs and they attack, I will kill them".

I can't have that mindset on a weekend trip to a friends resort, etc, so my mindset is "Gee, I hope none of these dogs decide to bite me, becuase if it does, I can't really kill it without causing a bunch of dramatic grief".

[Spectrism]

I have an aggressive shepherd from good working lines. She will scare the wits out of anybody who is the least fearful. But she does not attack.... and I have never engaged her in such a scenario. She is like an arrow on a flexed bow and ready to strike... but she does not. Her teeth are sharp and she shows them when she gets her dander up.

An animal that strikes anything, especially its owner or cohabitant, is a dangerous animal.673

[Spectrism]

Awoke- you reminded me of the time I was living in Germany. Some friends had me over for a christmas party. They had ferrets for hunting. The son let a ferret go running around the house. It checked out all the people. It jumped up on the furniture and ran everywhere. When it came to me, it stopped. Looked at me close up for 5 seconds and then lunged at me as if I was a rabbit. It but into my chin and would not let go. The shock of the unexpected caught me. The friend couldn't believe it either.

I could have crushed its head but I did not want to hurt their animal.

I could have yanked it off and a piece of my chin.

I tried to pry it, putting my fingers between its jaws. It held on like a pit bull. Finally the boy got it to release leaving me with some needle-fine holes oozing blood. The poor folks were so embarassed... but I let them know that it was no big deal.

[Santa]

Lol... Love the stories...

[midnight rambler]

I never go anywhere without at least one knife, but thanks.

There are more dynamics to my thought process than that anyways. For example, I know a dog can sense my fear, so for someone to say "just pretend you're not scared of it" is silly, agree?
Anyways, let's say I am guest and the hosts have dogs. They are family pets who never bother anyone ever, but with me, they sense I fear them, and they don't like me.

As much as I know I could kill one quickly, if I did that it would cause a huge upset with the family I was visiting.

So yeah, I could, and yeah I would, if I felt I was under a serious and threatening attack, but I would still spend an entire weekend in fear, for example, because just getting nipped at doesn't justify slitting it's throat, but it still puts me just as on-edge as if I was being ferociously attacked.

To further clarify my feelings on canines: I hunt, and I walk in and out of the bush in the pitch black with no lights on. I do not fear anything in the bush, because I keep a 9" bowie knife on my chest strap, and if I get attacked by a pack of coyotes, I know I an going to F them up.
I know that I will walk out, and they will not.
Of course, at that point I am not worried about politics: It's a wild animal, not a pet. So I have nothing to fear, because my mindset is "If I see dogs and they attack, I will kill them".

I can't have that mindset on a weekend trip to a friends resort, etc, so my mindset is "Gee, I hope none of these dogs decide to bite me, becuase if it does, I can't really kill it without causing a bunch of dramatic grief".

I suggest you work on your 'feeling(s)' as I *know* from personal experience one can transition out of those 'fear' feelings.

[mrnhtbr2232]

I've lived with dogs my whole life and want to offer my two cents. The most important thing to remember with any dog, no matter what breed, is to respect them. I think that's the nuance Midnight Rambler is eluding to - they remember adjustments, but dogs are very intelligent and won't like being on the receiving end of gratuitous or dominant violence from their masters. Plus, most people never give them enough exercise or mental stimulation - both go a long way in preventing accidents. But firm and immediate discipline should not be assumed to equal abusing them for just being dogs. We bring them into our lives, not the other way around. That includes a responsibility to understand their behavior and appreciate their breeding instincts.The chick here in Pacifica likely forgot that or never practiced it and the results speak for themselves.

[midnight rambler]

Awoke- you reminded me of the time I was living in Germany. Some friends had me over for a christmas party. They had ferrets for hunting. The son let a ferret go running around the house. It checked out all the people. It jumped up on the furniture and ran everywhere. When it came to me, it stopped. Looked at me close up for 5 seconds and then lunged at me as if I was a rabbit. It but into my chin and would not let go. The shock of the unexpected caught me. The friend couldn't believe it either.

I could have crushed its head but I did not want to hurt their animal.

I could have yanked it off and a piece of my chin.

I tried to pry it, putting my fingers between its jaws. It held on like a pit bull. Finally the boy got it to release leaving me with some needle-fine holes oozing blood. The poor folks were so embarassed... but I let them know that it was no big deal.

Perhaps that ferret perceived something about you that distinguished you from the others to the extent that it felt compelled to attack you on your face.

I've never been a big cat fan, but cats are just drawn to me. I was in a customer's house making a presentation on a contract into a good 5 figure amount, and I was higher than the competition. While sitting at their dining room table their cat comes up to me and starts weaving in and out of my legs, purring. The couple both commented, "She NEVER approaches strangers, in fact she hides when strangers come into our house." Shortly after they made those comments they signed the contract. In another case at my gf's place her 18 y.o. male cat would come and lay directly on top of me in bed. My gf commented that not even her mother (who lived right next door and saw the cat every day) could approach her 18 y.o. cat her mother had been around nearly its entire life yet it warmed right up to me straightaway like we were old pals. Funny how that works, huh?

[palani]

Funny how that works, huh?

They could just be tellin' you to change your underware more often.

[midnight rambler]

They could just be tellin' you to change your underware more often.

I wouldn't know. Have you experience in these matters?

[palani]

I wouldn't know. Have you experience in these matters?

Cats rub to leave scent. Pee on the lawn and the dog will be there within minutes to cover the scent. Stands to reason.

[midnight rambler]

My gf's cat was not rubbing at all, he'd just hop up on the bed and lay right on top of me perfectly still, and the other cat was a female. I was advised by both owners that their cats would NOT EVER approach ANYONE other than their owners like that. Besides that, I always showered before going to bed so your theory is without merit. Are you suggesting one should change one's underwear more than once a day?? Do you?

[willie pete]

I've been attacked by a dog, I was probably 12-13, and yep, it was our fault...a friend and myself were taunting the dog through a chain link fence that ddin't have support posts in place, so the fence bowed down and over came the dog, this looked to be a Chow mix of some kind, it was a medium-sized dog I'd say maybe 50(?)lbs, it was winter so my jacket and sweater I had on underneath saved my arm, the dog charged me, instinctively I threw up my arm and it grabbed hold and locked on, I could feel it biting down, although it didn't bite through the clothing, I slung it off me, it turned and charged me again, this time my friend had picked up a medium sized stick, bought the size of an axe handle and cracked it in it's chest/front legs area, it immediately starting yelping and ran off......NOW IF, that same or similiar scenerio were to happen today, things WOULD be different, I'm older, bigger, stronger and have much more experience, I would've done the same thing in "feeding" my weak arm to the dog, and when it takes hold, I'd pull out my Kershaw with speed assist and cut the dogs throat REALLY fast...I STILL remember the day of the attack, IF I knew what I know now & had my carry knife? I could cut it's throat REALLY easy...typically dogs will NOT let go.....THAT CAN work against them, IF you have a knife, it's a wide-open target, you either stab them OR stab; then make a transverse across their throat, the action WILL be Over in a matter of moments....OR you go a different route, like in this story of a Pitbull attacking a man....
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/4514422.html



Funny Story (I think) ...went to a barber, and on his mirror was a photo of a doberman snarling with all his teeth on display, I asked the barber if that was his dog, he said yea. "and it was really mean, no one comes in the yard at all" ...he went on to say that it'd even Kill a lion, it'd grab the throat and wouldn't let go, he said besides "All cats ARE scared of dogs".....well I don't know about that.....you think a Trained to Attack Doberman could hold it's own with a Cat?
↓ ↓ ↓

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFknacYQaUE

[palani]

My gf's cat was not rubbing at all, he'd just hop up on the bed and lay right on top of me perfectly still, and the other cat was a female. I was advised by both owners that their cats would NOT EVER approach ANYONE other than their owners like that.
http://www.xmission.com/~emailbox/whycat.htm
Why does your cat rub up against you?
Cats have scent glands along the tail, on each side of their head, on their lips, base of their tail, chin, near their sex organs, and between their front paws. They use these glands to scent mark their territory. When the cat rubs you, he is marking you with his scent, claiming you as "his." Too, he is picking up your scent. Cats rub up against furniture or doorways for the same reason - to mark the item as "his". (Urine spraying is also a territorial marking, by the way.)




Are you suggesting one should change one's underwear more than once a day?? Do you?
I have never advised anyone to wear underwear.

[Spectrism]

Perhaps that ferret perceived something about you that distinguished you from the others to the extent that it felt compelled to attack you on your face.


Yeah smartass.... it smelled living meat.

I was the only one sitting on the couch when it jumped up on the back and came close to my face. These ferrets were let out on the hunting field to go down rabbit holes and scare rabbits out. Periodically the rabbits would stay in the hole and the ferrets would bite. That's when you hear a rabbit screaming in the hole.

I should have known by the prance and search all over the rooms that the ferret was on the hunt. I was the only American- with a different diet in the room. I am sure I smelled different. Also, I was not in hunt mode (as a predator) myself. I was in rabbit mode learning the language and customs of a different people. In foreign territory, I am quiet and learning. The little critter needed to find a target, and I was the closest to what it wanted.

[Spectrism]

http://www.xmission.com/~emailbox/whycat.htm
Why does your cat rub up against you?
Cats have scent glands along the tail, on each side of their head, on their lips, base of their tail, chin, near their sex organs, and between their front paws. They use these glands to scent mark their territory. When the cat rubs you, he is marking you with his scent, claiming you as "his." Too, he is picking up your scent. Cats rub up against furniture or doorways for the same reason - to mark the item as "his". (Urine spraying is also a territorial marking, by the way.)


So it means the cat wants to make you his bitch? Meowwwwch.

[iOWNme]

*waits for Sui Juris to post*

Without further adieu....

You guys come on man, of course there are going to be legitimate times when there is a PitBull attack. Just like their are real Terrorist. And the percentages of the De Jure forms of both are infinitely small.

AGAIN, we know nothing yet. If you go by the facts and witness, they all said the dogs seemed fine. With all of the evidence seeming out of the norm, even the article states:


'Eventually we're going to find out if there's anything physically or medically wrong with the dog that may have caused this attack,' Bertini said.But of course this story WONT EVEN BE COVERED AGAIN once they do all of the investigating, and you know it.

Look at the picture they chose to use, BLATANT fear mongering on the human psyche.

I always find it interesting when people claim to be 'awake' and 'open minded' about all kinds of stuff from aliens to world government. But then that very same person will cling to some belief that is based in prejudice and bigotry, or even childhood delusions. Instead of applying the same rational they do when it comes to every other subject.


I have to ask: Are PitBills the new Al Qaeda?
;D

[palani]

Are PitBills the new Al Qaeda?
In Korea they would just be "food".

[Santa]

Lol...This thread is great.
Palani is correct pertaining to cats. Another thing to consider with cats, and many other critters such as ferrets, is that soap is made of fat and animals are very good at detecting protein in fat.
So, it may be that certain types of soap attract animals. Ever notice how a cat is especially affectionate right after you get out of the shower?
Or how the dog likes to lick your honey buns calf after she get out of the bubble bath? Soap!

Although, there was one time I visited a friend with a big black dog, and right at the front door the dog stuffed his nose deep into my crotch and growled. I honestly don't know if I had fresh underwear on when that happened, only that I needed to change my underwear afterward.... :)

[Santa]

I read somewhere that historically both Chows in China and Chihuahuas in Mexico originated as food dogs. Bred as livestock.

No wonder they have questionable dispositions.

[midnight rambler]

I read somewhere that historically both Chows in China and Chihuahuas in Mexico originated as food dogs. Bred as livestock.

No wonder they have questionable dispositions.

I don't think you're gonna get more than a one or two tacos worth of meat out of the Taco Bell dog, I'd think that a larger breed would be called for.

[woodman]

A dog that attacks a person should be killed. It is interesting though, that dogs sense the presence of a baby inside a woman and it freaks them out enough to send them into attack mode sometimes. This is no isolated occurance. A dog with a stable mind will behave fine, but a dog on the edge of sanity will go off. Pitbulls have been inbred to enhance certain psycotic tendencies. I have seen very good and stable pits, but I'd never trust one around my children.

Perhaps the fact that this woman had another person inside her had something to do with the attack.

[Dogman]

A dog that attacks a person should be killed. It is interesting though, that dogs sense the presence of a baby inside a woman and it freaks them out enough to send them into attack mode sometimes. This is no isolated occurance. A dog with a stable mind will behave fine, but a dog on the edge of sanity will go off. Pitbulls have been inbred to enhance certain psycotic tendencies. I have seen very good and stable pits, but I'd never trust one around my children.

Perhaps the fact that this woman had another person inside her had something to do with the attack.

That is what is done here, if the dog attacks a person and that person is badly hurt the dog is a dead dog.

[Osiris]

An animal that strikes anything, especially its owner or cohabitant, is a dangerous animal.673

Exactly! A dog that will bite a human unprovoked, let alone it's owner, is an unstable dog that should be put down! Regardless of breed! I wouldn't say "anything" but a human for sure. Some breeds, including the "pit bull" is one with an incredibly high prey drive! If you don't know what the breed you have is meant for you shouldn't own it!

I don't understand how this thread turned into a discussion about protection dogs... "Pit bulls" are not a guardian breed and should not be used for such! THIS IS A FACT!!!

The article states "Locals had strong reactions to Mrs Napora's death and many said they didn't know the couple had dogs as they hadn’t seen them outside."

If people in the neighborhood don't even know they have dogs there is an issue! How can anyone say how great the dog was if no one but the immediate neighbors know of the dogs? Obviously the dogs weren't well taken care of if no one knows of them. There is so much involved in this story that there is no way one article can prove anything about a breed or the specific dog/family!

In this case a woman was mauled by a supposed "pit bull", however, the majority of the time there is so much bias against "pit bulls" it is ridiculous


1. August 18, 2007—A Labrador mix attacked a 70-year-old man, sending him to the hospital in critical condition. Police officers arrived at the scene and the dog was shot after charging the officers. This incident was reported in one article in the local paper.

2. August 19, 2007—A 16-month-old child received fatal head and neck injuries after being attacked by a mixed-breed dog. This attack was reported on twice by the local paper.

3. August 20, 2007—A six-year-old boy was hospitalized after having his ear torn off and receiving a severe bite to the head by a medium-sized, mixed-breed dog. This incident was reported in one article in the local paper.

4. August 21, 2007—A 59-year-old woman was attacked in her home by two pit bulls and was hospitalized with severe, but not fatal, injuries. This attack was reported in over 230 articles in national and international newspapers, as well as major television news networks including CNN, MSNBC and FOX.

Along with over-reporting, false reporting is a major contributor to the public relations nightmare currently facing pit bulls. There is an emerging tendency for all short-haired, stocky dogs to be called pit bulls—and when a dangerous dog’s breed is unknown, the media is not above assuming that the dog involved must have been a pit bull. The National Canine Resource Council terms this phenomenon “Everything is a pit bull, whether it is or not.” In the rush to publish, the pit bull label is often inaccurately applied—and even if a correction is later made, the damage is done. Not all media bias is necessarily intentional, but it forms an impression on the public and on legislators nonetheless.

Read more here..... http://www.aspca.org/fight-animal-cruelty/advocacy-center/animal-laws-about-the-issues/pit-bull-bias-in-the-media.aspx

The reason I keep quoting "pit bull" is because there is no such breed. The words "pit bull" actually encompasses several breeds of dogs including the American Pit Bull Terrier, the American Staffordshire Terrier, and the Staffordshire Bull Terrier. However, any dog that is a "pit bull type" dog is included in the words "pit bull" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit_bull

Let alone that a ton of other breeds that are grouped in with "pit bulls". A perfect example is the picture in the OP article that is not a "pit bull", looks more like an Amercian Bulldog.....

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=american+bulldog&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=12166l15606l2l16445l16l6l0l3l3l1l1102l2385l 0.2.7-2l4l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&biw=1257&bih=808&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

If people are really interested in what "pit bulls" are really like they should do some research. A good start would be www.pitbull-chat.com. If you don't care to do some research but continue to spew BS then you are just ignorant.

[Santa]

I don't think you're gonna get more than a one or two tacos worth of meat out of the Taco Bell dog, I'd think that a larger breed would be called for.Perhaps the Chihuahua is the Cornish hen of Canine cuisine. :)

[Awoke]

Quite the first post, Osiris, with no introductions. Who were you?
You're certainly not new here.

[Tumbleweed]

A dogs owner needs to keep it or them under control at all times. If a dog attacks someone their owner is responsible for it. If you are attacked or threatened you have the right to defend yourself anyway you see fit and don't ever think otherwise.

I took care of a couple of "working dogs" who's owner wasn't keeping them under control. They were dangerous and up to no good. That caused a hell of a rukus. A 30/30 works well but you need to keep your eye on the owner if you do something like that. Be prepared.

Dogs are generaly friendly and very curious about me. It's probably because I usually have some cow or horse shit stuck to my boots. They are very interested in them and especially so if they are city dogs. I've been stalked in the middle of the night by a dog/ wolfdog cross? It helps to know behavior of animals to keep yourself safe.

Stay away from people who have mean dogs or don't control them. If you have to be around them arm yourself and don't put up with any bullshit. :)

[Osiris]

Quite the first post, Osiris, with no introductions. Who were you?
You're certainly not new here.

Sorry! I was, and still am, Sarah. ;) I joined to learn and have been lurking for a while. I am very passionate about this subject and have a lot of knowledge about it. Therefore, I had to chime in on this one. I don't want to add my 2 cents about a subject unless I have a lot of knowledge of it, in this case I do.

I may be a stranger here to all of you but I am no stranger to the propaganda that surrounds this wonderful breed! "pit bulls" were once known as the nanny dog and were a very popular family dog. They still are, however, what the media and irresponsible owners have done to the breed is infuriating to me!