Speed-of-light experiments give baffling result at CernComments.

[Ponce]

Thinking that the speed of light is the fastest thing in the universe is like thinking that the Earth is flat..we create our own walls that later we have to knock down............if you leave your mind open that anything is possible then the impossible will becomes reality sooner.........is not a matter of "is it" or "is not" but simply a question of "where is it at".
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Speed-of-light experiments give baffling result at CernComments.

By Jason Palmer

Science and technology reporter, BBC News


Puzzling results from Cern, home of the Large Hadron Collider, have confounded physicists because subatomic particles seem to have beaten the speed of light.

Neutrinos sent through the ground from Cern toward the Gran Sasso laboratory 732km away in Italy seemed to show up a tiny fraction of a second early.

The results - which threaten to upend a century of physics - were put online for scrutiny by other scientists.

In the meantime, the group says it is being very cautious about its claims.

They will be discussing the result in detail in a conference at Cern on Friday afternoon, which can be viewed online.

"We tried to find all possible explanations for this," said report author Antonio Ereditato of the Opera collaboration.

"We wanted to find a mistake - trivial mistakes, more complicated mistakes, or nasty effects - and we didn't," he told BBC News.

"When you don't find anything, then you say 'Well, now I'm forced to go out and ask the community to scrutinise this.'"


The speed of light is the Universe's ultimate speed limit, and much of modern physics - as laid out in part by Albert Einstein in his theory of special relativity - depends on the idea that nothing can exceed it.


Light speed: Flying into fantasy
Thousands of experiments have been undertaken to measure it ever more precisely, and no result has ever spotted a particle breaking the limit.

But Dr Ereditato and his colleagues have been carrying out an experiment for the last three years that seems to suggest neutrinos have done just that.

Neutrinos come in a number of types, and have recently been seen to switch spontaneously from one type to another.

The team prepares a beam of just one type, muon neutrinos, sending them from Cern to an underground laboratory at Gran Sasso in Italy to see how many show up as a different type, tau neutrinos.

In the course of doing the experiments, the researchers noticed that the particles showed up 60 billionths of a second sooner than light would over the same distance.

This is a tiny fractional change, but one that occurs consistently.

The team measured the travel times of neutrino bunches some 15,000 times, and have reached a level of statistical significance that in scientific circles would count as a formal discovery.

But the group understands that what are known as "systematic errors" could easily make an erroneous result look like a breaking of the ultimate speed limit.

That has motivated them to publish their measurements.

"My dream would be that another, independent experiment finds the same thing - then I would be relieved," Dr Ereditato said.

But for now, he explained, "we are not claiming things, we want just to be helped by the community in understanding our crazy result - because it is crazy".

"And of course the consequences can be very serious."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-15017484

[undgrd]

Maybe there is a new sub atomic particle presenting itself. Something that is required prior to lights arrival?

[SWRichmond]

This is the best possible news. Did they really think their new experiment was going to answer more questions than it posed?

This is what is so awesome about science. You peel back another layer of the onion and MORE QUESTIONS. IMO the search for knowledge is what humans are for, it's the thing that drives us.

[SLV^GLD]

Last time I posited that science was about attempting to disprove rather than prove I was labeled an NWO pig who was satan worshiping and child molesting when I wasn't reading science articles.

[Santa]

Last time I posited that science was about attempting to disprove rather than prove I was labeled an NWO pig who was satan worshiping and child molesting when I wasn't reading science articles.

And have you disproved the label? :)

[Neuro]

And have you disproved the label? :)

You should know that is IMPOSSIBLE! ;)

[wrs]

The only reason it's a crazy result is because science is a religion and one of the first commandments is thou shalt not exceed the speed of light along with the foolish conservation of energy nonsense and second law of thermodynamics. Gravity operates faster than the speed of light, they know that but won't accept it for what it means. Lot's of things are probably faster than the speed of light but again, whenever it's found to be true, it's pushed down and whomever says it is ridiculed mercilessly.

Suppression of Inconvenient Facts in Physics (http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_supr.htm)

[Dogman]

Look up at the skys at night. and be humbled.

There are two places to look, one is the Andromeda galaxy and the other is my personal favorite that ones can see any winter night.. Orions belt.

2.some million light years ..think about that..what you see looking at Andromeda happened 2. some years ago..


Orions belt, Is a tad closer and amazing if you have a scope or light bucket large enough to truley see it...


We on this mud ball called earth..

are shit. and not worth my time posting this..

[Santa]

The only reason it's a crazy result is because science is a religion and one of the first commandments is thou shalt not exceed the speed of light along with the foolish conservation of energy nonsense and second law of thermodynamics. Gravity operates faster than the speed of light, they know that but won't accept it for what it means. Lot's of things are probably faster than the speed of light but again, whenever it's found to be true, it's pushed down and whomever says it is ridiculed mercilessly.

Suppression of Inconvenient Facts in Physics (http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_supr.htm)

Saying an object can travel faster than light
is like saying there's a shorter route than a straight line from one point in time to another. This seriously fucks with established convention.

The speed of light is the benchmark for the measure of Time.

If Time doesn't necessarily travel in a straight line through history, then what exactly does it do?

[wrs]

Saying an object can travel faster than light
is like saying there's a shorter route than a straight line from one point in time to another. This seriously fucks with established convention.

The speed of light is the benchmark for the measure of Time.

If Time doesn't necessarily travel in a straight line through history, then what exactly does it do?

What makes you think time should be linear? If you remember an event what does that tell you about time? You can google D. L. Hotson for an interesting take on Dirac's equation and negative energy. I think it might be referenced in that link I provided.

You do know that gravity propagates faster than the speed of light do you not? Orbital mechanics is based on zero propagation delay for the effect of gravity. Doesn't work without that assumption.

Do you know what Ampere's Circuit Law states? Consider what it means in the context of a bar magnet.

[Ponce]

The laws that are made are only for the things that are known.......and as soon as something new comes up that does not match that law they then have to come up with a new law......I for one, the more that I know the lmore that I know that I don't know..........to me that's fun.

[Serpo]

Silver has proved it can travel faster than the speed of light when going down......

[Santa]

Silver has proved it can travel faster than the speed of light when going down......

Ag-terminal velocity?

[Santa]

What makes you think time should be linear?

I can't really envision the form. Rather than a straight line, maybe it's more like a question mark. :) I really don't know.

[midnight rambler]

Time is an illusion which keeps everything from happening all at once.

Of course there's such a thing as super-luminal velocity - the religionists of science just don't like their belief system being fucked with.

[Neuro]

The only reason it's a crazy result is because science is a religion and one of the first commandments is thou shalt not exceed the speed of light along with the foolish conservation of energy nonsense and second law of thermodynamics. Gravity operates faster than the speed of light, they know that but won't accept it for what it means. Lot's of things are probably faster than the speed of light but again, whenever it's found to be true, it's pushed down and whomever says it is ridiculed mercilessly.
Suppression of Inconvenient Facts in Physics (http://www.world-mysteries.com/sci_supr.htm)
Excellent reading, highly recommended! thanks!

[keehah]

Osoab is speedier than Ponce.

http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?54394-Roll-over-Einstein-Law-of-physics-challenged

[Neuro]

I can't really envision the form. Rather than a straight line, maybe it's more like a question mark. :) I really don't know.

Yes, difficult to envision the form is it. Allegedly time bends space so if you set out in one direction at a speed of light you will eventually come back to where you started, maybe time-space also is bent by another dimension, and if that is the case you may be able to take short cuts through that dimension...

[Neuro]

Ag-terminal velocity?

Ridiculous speed! ;D

[TheNocturnalEgyptian]

http://i.imgur.com/Pq0f4.jpg

[Santa]

Time is an illusion which keeps everything from happening all at once.

Of course there's such a thing as super-luminal velocity - the religionists of science just don't like their belief system being fucked with.

Consider that the time clock is the central element in every classroom and in every place of employment.

It's what we focus our attention on first thing in the morning till we crack the last proverbial beer at night. We are fixated on perceiving a linear and consistent movement of time through space.

The assumption is that a clock is merely a handy symbol to measure our days and nights. To help us remain organized. Lol... But isn't that utterly absurd, given that we have light and dark, day and night, the movement of the sun and the moon to do that already?

I mean seriously, clocks are completely redundant and are useless for anything but a sort of fascist regimentation and enslavement of free peoples free time.

I wonder if how we "perceive" our passage through time is dictated more by hard unyielding pedagogy or indoctrination than by laws of nature.

Because of the clock we perceive and therefore experience time as points on a rule from one moment to the next, whereas when we relied on the celestial bodies to inform us of time, we experienced it in great sweeping three dimensional cycles.

The thought that we may not be confined so rigidly to the linearity of fascist clock time is a sort of heresy. Treason. Intolerable to upper management.

You don't suppose the first clock was invented by a Khazar, do you? ;D

[Santa]

Yes, difficult to envision the form is it. Allegedly time bends space so if you set out in one direction at a speed of light you will eventually come back to where you started, maybe time-space also is bent by another dimension, and if that is the case you may be able to take short cuts through that dimension...

If we can visualize it we can conceive it. If we conceive it, it becomes ours. The image that comes to me when you say time bends space is that of a line bending into a circle. Like a two dimensional cartoon or diagram on paper.

But what I can't visualize is what becomes of the negative space surrounding it. Aargh! :confused:

[Santa]

You don't suppose the first clock was invented by a Khazar, do you? ;DAnd of course we know that the first punch clock was foisted on us by IBM in Germany, but lookie here.


Nobody actually knows the reason why the day was split into 12 hours and each hour split into 60 minutes and then each minute into 60 seconds. The best guess is that it was the effing Babylonians who worked out that there were 12 full moons in a year which gave them a 360 day year. They also knew the relationship between the radius of a circle and its circumference, which split the circle into six segments. Dividing this by two gave them 12 segments, which also fitted well with their religious beliefs that the number 12 had some kind of special significance. Yep, the Babylonians,... doesn't it just figure?

The beast system is essentially based on clock time.

[Santa]

The beast system is essentially based on clock time. And so, if this is indeed the case, what does it say of the veracity of Biblical history? I don't know, but the Bible may be a history of humanity
outside of clock time.
In other words, perhaps human history itself didn't necessarily happen in an absolute clock like linear fashion from the past till now.

[Neuro]

Actually a year is 13 months... 13x28= 364 days.

I think the thirteenth month should be named Neuro, after its discoverer, and it alone should have 29 days, apart from every four years, which is a Neuro-year, then it will have 30 days. I think current December could be renamed Santa month. What should the other 11 months be called? Apply quickly with reasons if you want to be included and have your name immortalized in the NEW IMPROVED NEUROTIC CALENDAR

[Neuro]

and so, if this is indeed the case, what does it say of the veracity of biblical history? I don't know, but the bible may be a history of humanity
outside of clock time.
In other words, perhaps human history itself didn't necessarily happen in an absolute clock like linear fashion from the past till now.
Heretic! ;D

[Santa]

Heretic! ;D

Remember, the month of Santa is coming. Are you prepared? ;D


NEW IMPROVED NEUROTIC CALENDAR

Ahahaha... :)

[TheNocturnalEgyptian]

http://randomvandal.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/015_time.jpg

[Neuro]

Remember, the month of Santa is coming. Are you prepared? ;D

Hell no! But I will exchange gold for 53 times silver and $1 a gram of silver on Monday next week. By christmas that should start looking good. And by spring Equinox it should look really good!

[mamboni]

Relativity is a theory, a working hypothesis, to be tested and tested until it fails, if ever. From the standpoint of our perception of the visable world, light must travel as fast as time itself. Einstein made an assumption about the speed of light being limiting, a supposition based on logic. There is no way to prove it - and you cannot use the Lorentz contraction as that would be circular reasoning. But whose to say that a clock in the distance cannot be perceived by other means, using something other than electromagnetic waves? Why is it impossible for there to be a particle that travels faster than light?