PDA

View Full Version : The Dönmeh: The Middle East’s Most Whispered Secret Wayne Madsen



MAGNES
25th October 2011, 08:13 PM
The Dönmeh: The Middle East’s Most Whispered Secret (Part I)

Wayne MADSEN (USA) (http://www.strategic-culture.org/authors/wayne-madsen-usa.html) | 25.10.2011 | 20:39

http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2011/10/25/the-doenmeh-the-middle-easts-most-whispered-secret-part-i.html


There is a historical “eight hundred pound gorilla” lurking in the background of almost every serious military and diplomatic incident involving Israel, Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Greece, Armenia, the Kurds, the Assyrians, and some other players in the Middle East and southeastern Europe. It is a factor that is generally only whispered about at diplomatic receptions, news conferences, and think tank sessions due to the explosiveness and controversial nature of the subject. And it is the secretiveness attached to the subject that has been the reason for so much misunderstanding about the current breakdown in relations between Israel and Turkey, a growing warming of relations between Israel and Saudi Arabia, and increasing enmity between Saudi Arabia and Iran…

Although known to historians and religious experts, the centuries-old political and economic influence of a group known in Turkish as the “Dönmeh” is only beginning to cross the lips of Turks, Arabs, and Israelis who have been reluctant to discuss the presence in Turkey and elsewhere of a sect of Turks descended from a group of Sephardic Jews who were expelled from Spain during the Spanish Inquisition in the 16th and 17th centuries. These Jewish refugees from Spain were welcomed to settle in the Ottoman Empire and over the years they converted to a mystical sect of Islam that eventually mixed Jewish Kabbala and Islamic Sufi semi-mystical beliefs into a sect that eventually championed secularism in post-Ottoman Turkey. It is interesting that “Dönmeh” not only refers to the Jewish “untrustworthy converts” to Islam in Turkey but it is also a derogatory Turkish word for a transvestite, or someone who is claiming to be someone they are not.

The Donmeh sect of Judaism was founded in the 17th century by Rabbi Sabbatai Zevi, a Kabbalist who believed he was the Messiah but was forced to convert to Islam by Sultan Mehmet IV, the Ottoman ruler. Many of the rabbi’s followers, known as Sabbateans, but also “crypto-Jews,” publicly proclaimed their Islamic faith but secretly practiced their hybrid form of Judaism, which was unrecognized by mainstream Jewish rabbinical authorities. Because it was against their beliefs to marry outside their sect, the Dönmeh created a rather secretive sub-societal clan.

The Dönmeh rise to power in Turkey

Many Dönmeh, along with traditional Jews, became powerful political and business leaders in Salonica. It was this core group of Dönmeh, which organized the secret Young Turks, also known as the Committee of Union and Progress, the secularists who deposed Ottoman Sultan Abdulhamid II in the 1908 revolution, proclaimed the post-Ottoman Republic of Turkey after World War I, and who instituted a campaign that stripped Turkey of much of its Islamic identity after the fall of the Ottomans. Abdulhamid II was vilified by the Young Turks as a tyrant, but his only real crime appears to have been to refuse to meet Zionist leader Theodore Herzl during a visit to Constantinople in 1901 and reject Zionist and Dönmeh offers of money in return for the Zionists to be granted control of Jerusalem.

Like other leaders who have crossed the Zionists, Sultan Adulhamid II appears to have sealed his fate with the Dönmeh with this statement to his Ottoman court: “Advise Dr. Herzl not to take any further steps in his project. I cannot give away even a handful of the soil of this land for it is not my own, it belongs to the entire Islamic nation. The Islamic nation fought jihad for the sake of this land and had watered it with their blood. The Jews may keep their money and millions. If the Islamic Khalifate state is one day destroyed then they will be able to take Palestine without a price! But while I am alive, I would rather push a sword into my body than see the land of Palestine cut and given away from the Islamic state.” After his ouster by Ataturk’s Young Turk Dönmeh in 1908, Abdulhamid II was jailed in the Donmeh citadel of Salonica. He died in Constantinople in 1918, three years after Ibn Saud agreed to a Jewish homeland in Palestine and one year after Lord Balfour deeded Palestine away to the Zionists in his letter to Baron Rothschild.

One of the Young Turk leaders in Salonica was Mustafa Kemal Ataturk, the founder of the Republic of Turkey. When Greece achieved sovereignty over Salonica in 1913, many Dönmeh, unsuccessful at being re-classified Jewish, moved to Constantinople, later re-named Istanbul. Others moved to Izmir, Bursa, and Ataturk’s newly-proclaimed capital and future seat of Ergenekon power, Ankara.

Some texts suggest that the Dönmeh numbered no more than 150,000 and were mainly found in the army, government, and business. However, other experts suggest that the Dönmeh may have represented 1.5 million Turks and were even more powerful than believed by many and extended to every facet of Turkish life. One influential Donmeh, Tevfik Rustu Arak, was a close friend and adviser to Ataturk and served as Turkey’s Foreign Minister from 1925 to 1938.

Ataturk, who was reportedly himself a Dönmeh, ordered that Turks abandon their own Muslim-Arabic names. The name of the first Christian emperor of Rome, Constantine, was erased from the largest Turkish city, Constantinople. The city became Istanbul, after the Ataturk government in 1923 objected to the traditional name. There have been many questions about Ataturk’s own name, since “Mustapha Kemal Ataturk” was a pseudonym. Some historians have suggested that Ataturk adopted his name because he was a descendant of none other than Rabbi Zevi, the self-proclaimed Messiah of the Dönmeh! Ataturk also abolished Turkey’s use of the Arabic script and forced the country to adopt the western alphabet.

Modern Turkey: a secret Zionist state controlled by the Dönmeh

Ataturk’s suspected strong Jewish roots, information about which was suppressed for decades by a Turkish government that forbade anything critical of the founder of modern Turkey, began bubbling to the surface, first, mostly outside of Turkey and in publications written by Jewish authors. The 1973 book, The Secret Jews, by Rabbi Joachim Prinz, maintains that Ataturk and his finance minister, Djavid Bey, were both committed Dönmeh and that they were in good company because “too many of the Young Turks in the newly formed revolutionary Cabinet prayed to Allah, but had their real prophet [Sabbatai Zevi, the Messiah of Smyrna].” In The Forward of January 28, 1994, Hillel Halkin wrote in The New York Sun that Ataturk recited the Jewish Shema Yisrael (“Hear O Israel”), saying that it was “my prayer too.” The information is recounted from an autobiography by journalist Itamar Ben-Avi, who claims Ataturk, then a young Turkish army captain, revealed he was Jewish in a Jerusalem hotel bar one rainy night during the winter of 1911. In addition, Ataturk attended the Semsi Effendi grade school in Salonica, run by a Dönmeh named Simon Zevi. Halkin wrote in the New York Sun article about an email he received from a Turkish colleague: “I now know – know (and I haven’t a shred of doubt) – that Ataturk’s father’s family was indeed of Jewish stock.”

It was Ataturk’s and the Young Turks’ support for Zionism, the creation of a Jewish homeland in Palestine, after World War I and during Nazi rule in Europe that endeared Turkey to Israel and vice versa. An article in The Forward of May 8, 2007, revealed that Dönmeh dominated Turkish leadership “from the president down, as well as key diplomats . . . and a great part of Turkey’s military, cultural, academic, economic, and professional elites” kept Turkey out of a World War II alliance with Germany, and deprived Hitler of a Turkish route to the Baku oilfields.” In his book, The Donme: Jewish Converts, Muslim Revolutionaries and Secular Turks, Professor Marc David Baer wrote that many advanced to exalted positions in the Sufi religious orders.

Israel has always been reluctant to describe the Turkish massacre of the Armenians by the Turks in 1915 as “genocide.” It has always been believed that the reason for Israel’s reticence was not to upset Israel’s close military and diplomatic ties with Turkey. However, more evidence is being uncovered that the Armenian genocide was largely the work of the Dönmeh leadership of the Young Turks. Historians like Ahmed Refik, who served as an intelligence officer in the Ottoman army, averred that it was the aim of the Young Turks to destroy the Armenians, who were mostly Christian. The Young Turks, under Ataturk’s direction, also expelled Greek Christians from Turkish cities and attempted to commit a smaller-scale genocide of the Assyrians, who were also mainly Christian.

One Young Turk from Salonica, Mehmet Talat, was the official who carried out the genocide of the Armenians and Assyrians. A Venezuelan mercenary who served in the Ottoman army, Rafael de Nogales Mendez, noted in his annals of the Armenian genocide that Talat was known as the “renegade Hebrew of Salonica.” Talat was assassinated in Germany in 1921 by an Armenian whose entire family was lost in the genocide ordered by the “renegade Hebrew.” It is believed by some historians of the Armenian genocide that the Armenians, known as good businessmen, were targeted by the business-savvy Dönmeh because they were considered to be commercial competitors.

It is not, therefore, the desire to protect the Israeli-Turkish alliance that has caused Israel to eschew any interest in pursuing the reasons behind the Armenian genocide, but Israel’s and the Dönmeh’s knowledge that it was the Dönmeh leadership of the Young Turks that not only murdered hundreds of thousands of Armenians and Assyrians but who also stamped out Turkey’s traditional Muslim customs and ways. Knowledge that it was Dönmeh, in a natural alliance with the Zionists of Europe, who were responsible for the deaths of Armenian and Assyrian Christians, expulsion from Turkey of Greek Orthodox Christians, and the cultural and religious eradication of Turkish Islamic traditions, would issue forth in the region a new reality. Rather than Greek and Turkish Cypriots living on a divided island, Armenians holding a vendetta against the Turks, and Greeks and Turks feuding over territory, all the peoples attacked by the Dönmeh would realize that they had a common foe that was their actual persecutor.

Challenging Dönmeh rule: Turkey’s battle against the Ergenekon

It is the purging of the Kemalist adherents of Ataturk and his secular Dönmeh regime that is behind the investigation of the Ergenekon conspiracy in Turkey. Ergenekon’s description matches up completely with the Dönmeh presence in Turkey’s diplomatic, military, judicial, religious, political, academic, business, and journalist hierarchy. Ergenekon attempted to stop the reforms instituted by successive non-Dönmeh Turkish leaders, including the re-introduction of traditional Turkish Islamic customs and rituals, by planning a series of coups, some successful like that which deposed Prime Minister Necmettin Erbakan’s Refah (Welfare) Islamist government in 1996 and some unsuccessful, like OPERATION SLEDGEHEMMER, which was aimed at deposing Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan in 2003. Some Islamist-leaning reformists, including Turkish President Turgut Ozal and Prime Minister Bulent Ecevit, died under suspicious circumstances. Deposed democratically-elected Prime Minister Adnan Menderes was hanged in 1961, following a military coup.

American politicians and journalists, whose knowledge of the history of countries like Turkey and the preceding Ottoman Empire, is often severely lacking, have painted the friction between Israel’s government and the Turkish government of Prime Minister Erdogan as based on Turkey’s drift to Islamism and the Arab world. Far from it, Erdogan and his Justice and Development Party (AKP) seem to have finally seen a way to break free from the domination and cruelty of the Dönmeh, whether in the form of Kemalist followers of Ataturk or nationalist schemers and plotters in Ergenekon. But with Turkey’s “Independence Day” has come vitriol from the Dönmeh and their natural allies in Israel and the Israel Lobby in the United States and Europe. Turkey as a member of the European Union was fine for Europe as long as the Dönmeh remained in charge and permitted Turkey’s wealth to be looted by central bankers like has occurred in Greece.

When Israel launched its bloody attack on the Turkish Gaza aid vessel, the Mavi Marmara, on May 31, 2010, the reason was not so much the ship’s running of the Israeli blockade of Gaza. The brutality of the Israelis in shooting unarmed Turks and one Turkish-American, some at point blank range, according to a UN report, indicated that Israel was motivated by something else: vengeance and retaliation for the Turkish government’s crackdown on Ergenekon, the purging of the Turkish military and intelligence senior ranks of Dönmeh, and reversing the anti-Muslim religious and cultural policies set down by the Dönmeh’s favorite son, Ataturk, some ninety years before. In effect, the Israeli attack on the Mavi Marmara was in retaliation for Turkey’s jailing of several top Turkish military officers, journalists, and academics, all accused of being part of the Ergenekon plot to overthrow the AKP government in 2003. Hidden in the Ergenekon coup plot is that the Dönmeh and Ergenekon are connected through their history of being Kemalists, ardent secularists, pro-Israeli, and pro-Zionist.

With tempers now flaring between Iran on one side and Israel, Saudi Arabia, and the United States on the other, as the result of a dubious claim by U.S. law enforcement that Iran was planning to carry out the assassination of the Saudi ambassador to the United States on American soil, the long-standing close, but secretive relationship between Israel and Saudi Arabia is coming to the forefront. The Israeli-Saudi connection had flourished during OPERATION DESERT STORM, when both countries were on the receiving end of Saddam Hussein’s Scud missiles.

(to be continued)



Tags: Israel (http://www.strategic-culture.org/tags/israel.html) Turkey (http://www.strategic-culture.org/tags/turkey.html)

MAGNES
25th October 2011, 08:16 PM
..................

MAGNES
25th October 2011, 08:16 PM
EDIT ADD , PART II


The Dönmeh: The Middle East’s Most Whispered Secret (Part II)

Wayne MADSEN (USA) (http://www.strategic-culture.org/authors/wayne-madsen-usa.html) | 26.10.2011 | 20:27

Part I (http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2011/10/25/the-doenmeh-the-middle-easts-most-whispered-secret-part-i.html)

What will surprise those who may already be surprised about the Dönmeh connection to Turkey, is the Dönmeh connection to the House of Saud in Saudi Arabia.

An Iraqi Mukhabarat (General Military Intelligence Directorate) Top Secret report, “The Emergence of Wahhabism and its Historical Roots,” dated September 2002 and released on March 13, 2008, by the U.S. Defense Intelligence Agency in translated English form, points to the Dönmeh roots of the founder of the Saudi Wahhabi sect of Islam, Muhammad ibn Abdul Wahhab. Much of the information is gleaned from the memoirs of a “Mr. Humfer,” (as spelled in the DIA report, “Mr. Hempher” as spelled the historical record) a British spy who used the name “Mohammad,” claimed to be an Azeri who spoke Turkish, Persian, and Arabic and who made contact with Wahhab in the mid-18th century with a view of creating a sect of Islam that would eventually bring about an Arab revolt against the Ottomans and pave the way for the introduction of a Jewish state in Palestine. Humfer’s memoirs are recounted by the Ottoman writer and admiral Ayyub Sabri Pasha in his 1888 work, “The Beginning and Spreading of Wahhabism.”

In his book, The Dönmeh Jews, D. Mustafa Turan writes that Wahhab’s grandfather, Tjen Sulayman, was actually Tjen Shulman, a member of the Jewish community of Basra, Iraq. The Iraqi intelligence report also states that in his book, The Dönmeh Jews and the Origin of the Saudi Wahhabis, Rifat Salim Kabar reveals that Shulman eventually settled in the Hejaz, in the village of al-Ayniyah what is now Saudi Arabia, where his grandson founded the Wahhabi sect of Islam. The Iraqi intelligence report states that Shulman had been banished from Damascus, Cairo, and Mecca for his “quackery.” In the village, Shulman sired Abdul Wahhab. Abdel Wahhab’s son, Muhammad, founded modern Wahhabism.

The Iraqi report also makes some astounding claims about the Saud family. It cites Abdul Wahhab Ibrahim al-Shammari’s book, The Wahhabi Movement: The Truth and Roots, which states that King Abdul Aziz Ibn Saud, the first Kingdom of Saudi Arabia monarch, was descended from Mordechai bin Ibrahim bin Moishe, a Jewish merchant also from Basra. In Nejd, Moishe joined the Aniza tribe and changed his name to Markhan bin Ibrahim bin Musa. Eventually, Mordechai married off his son, Jack Dan, who became Al-Qarn, to a woman from the Anzah tribe of the Nejd. From this union, the future Saud family was born.

The Iraqi intelligence document reveals that the researcher Mohammad Sakher was the subject of a Saudi contract murder hit for his examination into the Sauds’ Jewish roots. In Said Nasir’s book, The History of the Saud Family, it is maintained that in 1943, the Saudi ambassador to Egypt, Abdullah bin Ibrahim al Muffadal, paid Muhammad al Tamami to forge a family tree showing that the Sauds and Wahhabs were one family that descended directly from the Prophet Mohammed.

At the outset of World War I, a Jewish British officer from India, David Shakespeare, met with Ibn Saud in Riyadh and later led a Saudi army that defeated a tribe opposed to Ibn Saud. In 1915, Ibn Saud met with the British envoy to the Gulf region, Bracey Cocas. Cocas made the following offer to Ibn Saud: “I think this is a guarantee for your endurance as it is in the interest of Britain that the Jews have a homeland and existence, and Britain’s interests are, by all means, in your interest.” Ibn Saud, the descendant of Dönmeh from Basra, responded: “Yes, if my acknowledgement means so much to you, I acknowledge thousand times granting a homeland to the Jews in Palestine or other than Palestine.” Two years later, British Foreign Secretary Lord Balfour, in a letter to Baron Walter Rothschild, a leader of the British Zionists, stated: “His Majesty’s government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people . . .” The deal had the tacit backing of two of the major players in the region, both descendant from Dönmeh Jews who supported the Zionist cause, Kemal Ataturk and Ibn Saud. The present situation in the Middle East should be seen in this light but the history of the region has been purged by certain religious and political interests for obvious reasons.

After World War I, the British facilitated the coming to power of the Saud regime in the former Hejaz and Nejd provinces of the Ottoman Empire. The Sauds established Wahhabism as the state religion of the new Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and, like the Kemalist Dönmeh in Turkey, began to move against other Islamic beliefs and sects, including the Sunnis and Shi’as. The Wahhabi Sauds accomplished what the Kemalist Dönmeh were able to achieve in Turkey: a fractured Middle East that was ripe for Western imperialistic designs and laid the groundwork for the creation of the Zionist state of Israel.

Deep states and Dönmeh

During two visits to Turkey in 2010, I had the opportunity of discussing the Ergenekon “deep state” with leading Turkish officials. It was more than evident that discussions about the Ergenekon network and its “foreign” connections are a highly-sensitive subject. However, it was also whispered by one high-ranking Turkish foreign policy official that there were other “deep states” in surrounding nations and Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Syria were mentioned by name. Considering the links between Ergenekon and the Dönmeh in Turkey and the close intelligence and military links between the Dönmeh-descendent Sauds and Wahhabis in Arabia, the reports of close links between ousted Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak and his intelligence chief Omar Suleiman and the Binyamin Netanyahu government in Israel may be seen in an entirely new light… And it would explain Erdogan’s support for Egypt’s revolution: in Turkey, it was a democratic revolution that curbed the influence of the Dönmeh. The influence of Wahhabi Salafists in Libya’s new government also explains why Erdogan was keen on establishing relations with the Benghazi-based rebels to help supplant the influence of the Wahhabis, the natural allies of his enemies, the Dönmeh (Ergenekon) of Turkey.

Erdogan’s desire to set the historical record straight by restoring history purged by the Kemalists and Dönmeh has earned him vitriolic statements from Israel’s government that he is a neo-Ottomanist who is intent on forming an alliance with the Muslim Brotherhood in the Arab countries. Clearly, the Dönmeh and their Zionist brethren in Israel and elsewhere are worried about Dönmeh and Zionist historical revisionism, including their role in the Armenian and Assyrian genocide, and their genocide denial being exposed.

In Egypt, which was once an Ottoman realm, it was a popular revolution that tossed out what may have amounted to the Dönmeh with regard to the Mubarak regime. The Egyptian “Arab Spring” also explains why the Israelis were quick to kill six Egyptian border police so soon after nine Turkish passengers were killed aboard the Mavi Marmara, some in execution style, by Israeli troops. Dönmeh doctrine is rife with references to the Old Testament Amalekites, a nomadic tribe ordered attacked by the Hebrews from Egypt by the Jewish God to make room for Moses’s followers in the southern region of Palestine. In the Book of Judges, God unsuccessfully commands Saul: “Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, and infant, ox, and sheep, camel and donkey.” The Dönmeh, whose doctrine is also present in Hasidic and other orthodox sects of Judaism, appear to have no problem substituting the Armenians, Assyrians, Turks, Kurds, Egyptians, Iraqis, Lebanese, Iranians, and Palestinians for the Amalekites in carrying out their military assaults and pogroms.

With reformist governments in Turkey and Egypt much more willing to look into the background of those who have split the Islamic world, Ataturk in Turkey and Mubarak in Egypt, the Sauds are likely very much aware that it is only a matter of time before their links, both modern and historical, to Israel will be fully exposed. It makes sense that the Sauds have been successful in engineering a dubious plot involving Iranian government agents trying to assassinate the Saudi ambassador to Washington in an unnamed Washington, DC restaurant. The Iraqi intelligence report could have been referring to the Zionists and Dönmeh when it stated, “it strives to . . . [the] killing of Muslims, destructing, and promoting the turmoil.” In fact, the Iraqi intelligence report was referring to the Wahhabis.

With new freedom in Turkey and Egypt to examine their pasts, there is more reason for Israel and its supporters, as well as the Sauds, to suppress the true histories of the Ottoman Empire, secular Turkey, the origins of Israel, and the House of Saud. With various players now angling for war with Iran, the true history of the Dönmeh and their influence on past and current events in the Middle East becomes more important.

MAGNES
25th October 2011, 08:17 PM
Madsen is following carefully the rift between Israel and Turkey.

This is a key story, a major shift in power in Turkey, crypto Jews
losing power.

Jabotinsky is one of the founders of Turkey, a Bolshevik and Zionist,
founder of the USSR and Israel as well, related to modern NeoCons/Likud
like Feith, Netanyahu.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jabotinsky


The NeoCons were the head Turks in the USA.

Who’s Afraid of Sibel Edmonds? MUST READ ! (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?55247-Who%E2%80%99s-Afraid-of-Sibel-Edmonds-MUST-READ-%21)


Updated paragraph full of links, as of October 25 2011.

http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

Sacking of Turkish top military officers appears to have been something more serious -- perhaps the suppression of an attempted military coup by Ergenekon holdouts. (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/31/us-turkey-military-idUSTRE76S70M20110731)Reuters/Rothschild calls Ergenekon an "alleged conspiracy." There's nothing alleged about the Rothschild/Israeli connection to Ergenekon and the Turkish Donmeh. Turkey's situation linked to Breivik and his Zio-Nazi network: Breivik had a keen interest in Ergenekon's tactics. (http://www.todayszaman.com/news-251550-norway-attacker-conducted-a-case-study-of-ergenekon.html) A European-wide set of coups appears to have been in the Zio-Nazi playbook -- Breivik also sought to launch a coup against Norwegian government and King Harald V. (http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hyMvFu-d0NDBPyQ-Pf6PUX8iXrxQ?docId=CNG.f2ed397e94f16f28e9cb1e95e42 fe650.221) Breivik refuses to divulge other cells but he had traveled to several countries: Sweden, Denmark, UK, Germany, Poland, Belarus (http://en.rian.ru/world/20110728/165436665.html) (where he underwent paramilitary training), France, Austria, Hungary, Croatia, Lithuania, Estonia (http://news.err.ee/889324cf-ca8e-4798-a337-c406e8e2e771), Latvia, Switzerland, Spain, Cyprus, Malta (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/breiviks-mentor-linked-to-exiled-loyalist-johnny-mad-dog-adair-16029586.html), US (where he allegedly visited for two months last year Lake Elmo, Minnesota, the home of Bachmann & Associates, the "de-gaying" clinic owned by Marcus Bachmann, husband of GOP presidential candidate Michele Bachmann), Turkey, Mexico (http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/europe/07/28/knights.templar.groups/), China, Nigeria, Cote d’Ivoire and Liberia. Cyprus has seen political instability since a massive explosion of a weapons cache at its main naval base, which also destroyed Cyprus's main power plant forcing blackouts (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0729/1224301564137.html). President Demetris Christofiasis the first president from the Communist AKEL Party. From Norway to Turkey and Cyprus, a connected network, with links to Israel, appears to be targeting nations that support Palestinian sovereignty.

letter_factory
25th October 2011, 10:14 PM
does these donmeh have anything to do with ousting the jew gaddaffi and instilling shariah law in libya?

Awoke
25th October 2011, 10:18 PM
tag

Nomoss
25th October 2011, 11:04 PM
Thanks some good info.

Neuro
26th October 2011, 02:00 AM
Interestingly my wifes family may be Dönmeh, her family emigrated from Saloniki, today Thessaloniki, in the early 1920's in the breakup of the Ottoman empire, and has always been staunch secularists. However this subject has been secret for such a long time, that neither my wife nor her parents know anything about it, at least recently I have managed to make my wife consider the idea. Turkey is a country were not knowing history is the norm, with Atatürk came an era where the past was to be forgotten, and since then Atatürk took on a near demigod status where it has been impossible to even mention mistakes and ideological flaws in Atatürks doctrines and his dictatorial side, or the military that has been seen as the gurantoors of Atatürks heritage... Combine that with arrests of journalists, that is still ongoing, and you get a general lack of sense of history in the population...

MAGNES
28th October 2011, 09:28 PM
Updated thread with Part II, Ibn Saud acknowledges Donmeh roots to British.

" At the outset of World War I, a Jewish British officer from India, David Shakespeare, met with Ibn Saud in Riyadh and later led a Saudi army that defeated a tribe opposed to Ibn Saud. In 1915, Ibn Saud met with the British envoy to the Gulf region, Bracey Cocas. Cocas made the following offer to Ibn Saud: “I think this is a guarantee for your endurance as it is in the interest of Britain that the Jews have a homeland and existence, and Britain’s interests are, by all means, in your interest.” Ibn Saud, the descendant of Dönmeh from Basra, responded: “Yes, if my acknowledgement means so much to you, I acknowledge thousand times granting a homeland to the Jews in Palestine or other than Palestine.” Two years later, British Foreign Secretary Lord Balfour, in a letter to Baron Walter Rothschild, a leader of the British Zionists, stated: “His Majesty’s government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people . . .” The deal had the tacit backing of two of the major players in the region, both descendant from Dönmeh Jews who supported the Zionist cause, Kemal Ataturk and Ibn Saud. The present situation in the Middle East should be seen in this light but the history of the region has been purged by certain religious and political interests for obvious reasons. "


I have many related threads on this forum.
Check them out. Like my White Gold thread,
the Turks ran North Africa taking slaves and
waging war, Jews actually ran the whole show.

The Father of Europe fought them, Islamist Invaders.
Like the Spanish fighting them, Jews were always allied
with Muslims.

See my Eustace Mullins thread on key hidden related history.

Plus many more threads.

MAGNES
15th December 2011, 05:36 PM
Interestingly my wifes family may be Dönmeh, her family emigrated from Saloniki, today Thessaloniki, in the early 1920's in the breakup of the Ottoman empire, and has always been staunch secularists. However this subject has been secret for such a long time, that neither my wife nor her parents know anything about it, at least recently I have managed to make my wife consider the idea. Turkey is a country were not knowing history is the norm, with Atatürk came an era where the past was to be forgotten, and since then Atatürk took on a near demigod status where it has been impossible to even mention mistakes and ideological flaws in Atatürks doctrines and his dictatorial side, or the military that has been seen as the gurantoors of Atatürks heritage... Combine that with arrests of journalists, that is still ongoing, and you get a general lack of sense of history in the population...


From the information you gave you don't know and she does not know.
I know the history of this area very well, who, etc, your wife could be
anything, if she was Donmeh you would know it for sure. So I doubt
she is. You posted about your wife, I don't want to tell you what she
is, but if I spoke to her and gave you some ideas you may have a better
understanding. Even if she was " secularist " as you say, she still could
be any one of the populations in the city, a convert of some kind, Muslims
were kicked out of Greece at that time, forced out, most of them were
Greek converts, some may have been Bulgarian Muslims, etc, many converts
converted for various reasons, to have an easier life, people in the country
side fought to the death, like my family. Most definitely her family speaks
some sort of local vernacular, did they speak Greek, just these basic questions
answered and in my person, I would have a good idea of her family background.
Problem is when people converted they may have intermarried, but back then
people still did not mix, even between Muslims, marry your daughter over 3 villages
was mocked, in the city it may have been a little different for lovers meeting of
various communities. People did not date, people gave their daughters away with
dowries, it was nothing like what is today in the West. There is a joke about Pontians,
date their daughter, you just married her or you die, lol .
Neuro, does her family hate Greeks ?

People don't know their history because Turkey is new nation, artificially created on the
bones of the decimated indigenous, full of waves of immigrants that never stopped.
Turkey is a NWO Masonic creation and blueprint for what they want to do to Europe and
the rest of us. Study this, it ain't pretty. Some admit parts of this history, others get enraged.

The Masonic connections are most revealing to me and new. And Jabotinsky's involvment as a
founding propagandist, same role in USSR and Israel, buried in NY, and the modern connections
to LIKUD and NeoCons amaze me, how they get away with it.

In Attaturks official biography written by an Englishman, his mother is Jewish and they are from Thessalonike.
The capital of the Ottomans in Europe, the center of administration/tax collecting of the Ottomans, kicked out
of Spain, the Ottomans gave them the city after they murdered all the Greeks, 40,000 .

Neuro
18th December 2011, 03:15 PM
No my wife don't know, and she neither her parents hate Greeks. Fact is during my 5 years here I haven't met a single person who stated they hate greeks. I have met a few though that thinks it was a big mistake pushing the Greeks out of Turkey in the 20's, 40's and 50's. I must state though that the opinions I state about Turks is true only for the better educated/thinking part of the population, the rest I really don't know, but I don't think they even think about Greeks... It is odd though, in a country, which just 2-4 generations ago pushed out or even killed, a large part of its minority population, there is not any outward expression of hate or even dislike against these very same minorities. Certainly I can see that the masses of uneducated Turks could have been rallied by Politicians against minorities, for political purposes at the time, further I also see a lot of educated Turks holding a grudge against Kurds, at this day. So it is a definitive possibility that also better educated Turks in 1940's and 50's held the same against Greeks.

Generally speaking almost all Turks are clueless about history. They have been taught that almost everything prior to Atatürk was bad, without an analysis of what was bad. Everything that Atatürk did and thought was good, and you are not allowed to question it. They are taught from the kindergarten to love Atatürk unquestioningly.

Interestingly not even the ruling AK-party, which ideologically is a polar opposite of Atatürk questions him. Though
practically they continue using the same power tactics he used, imprisonment of political dissenters, with the Ergenekon fantasy now. Certainly some top brass military leaders, may have had the idea to topple the islamist AK-party, but it is ridiculous to think they would have involved several hundreds of people in the planning stages, including lawyers, authors, journalists, apart from military officers. They just decided to frame dissenters in the process. This is the norm in Turkish politics. No matter from what side you are... I don't think it is that different from Greek politics either...

gunDriller
18th December 2011, 05:35 PM
[B]
Madsen is following carefully the rift between Israel and Turkey.

This is a key story, a major shift in power in Turkey, crypto Jews
losing power.

the world is full of crypto-Jews, Christians and Muslims who profess loyalty to Jesus & Mohammed, yet secretly work for Israel and related elites.

lots of people want to be "members of the country club".


i always wondered about Sybil Edmonds, who is Turkish. Her revelations about the crime she uncovered as a translator after 9-11 - she fingers Turkey but not Israel.

MAGNES
18th December 2011, 06:10 PM
the world is full of crypto-Jews, Christians and Muslims who profess loyalty to Jesus & Mohammed, yet secretly work for Israel and related elites.

lots of people want to be "members of the country club".


i always wondered about Sybil Edmonds, who is Turkish. Her revelations about the crime she uncovered as a translator after 9-11 - she fingers Turkey but not Israel.

gunDriller, I know you are a student of all of this, she totally outs
the NeoCons, what she provides is the connections, ATC=AIPAC,
and they are connected, the Jews and Turks in many ways, going
back through history even, again I refer to Jabotinsky and his modern
day connections to NeoCons, Likud, even blood relations.

Don't forget she is gagged but protected at the same time, everything
she links is the same investigation that Fitzgerald had, same targets,
they shut him down, for sure she was working with him.

All crimes are the same people she says, drugs, money laundering,
WMD, PlameGate, the AIPAC scandals, Feith OSP, 9/11, etc

She gave court testimony that outed their blackmailing as well.
Media being totally silent.

MAGNES
18th December 2011, 06:11 PM
Generally speaking almost all Turks are clueless about history.

There is a reason for that, only the Stones Speak.

I think the plan is to do the same to Europe and
all countries built by Europeans.

Turkey is a Masonic NWO creation built on the bones of destroyed peoples.

MAGNES
26th September 2012, 04:33 PM
Madsen is following carefully the rift between Israel and Turkey.

This is a key story, a major shift in power in Turkey, crypto Jews
losing power.

Jabotinsky is one of the founders of Turkey, a Bolshevik and Zionist,
founder of the USSR and Israel as well, related to modern NeoCons/Likud
like Feith, Netanyahu.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jabotinsky


The NeoCons were the head Turks in the USA.

Who’s Afraid of Sibel Edmonds? MUST READ ! (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?55247-Who%E2%80%99s-Afraid-of-Sibel-Edmonds-MUST-READ-%21)


Updated paragraph full of links, as of October 25 2011.

http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

Sacking of Turkish top military officers appears to have been something more serious -- perhaps the suppression of an attempted military coup by Ergenekon holdouts. (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/07/31/us-turkey-military-idUSTRE76S70M20110731)Reuters/Rothschild calls Ergenekon an "alleged conspiracy." There's nothing alleged about the Rothschild/Israeli connection to Ergenekon and the Turkish Donmeh. Turkey's situation linked to Breivik and his Zio-Nazi network: Breivik had a keen interest in Ergenekon's tactics. (http://www.todayszaman.com/news-251550-norway-attacker-conducted-a-case-study-of-ergenekon.html) A European-wide set of coups appears to have been in the Zio-Nazi playbook -- Breivik also sought to launch a coup against Norwegian government and King Harald V. (http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hyMvFu-d0NDBPyQ-Pf6PUX8iXrxQ?docId=CNG.f2ed397e94f16f28e9cb1e95e42 fe650.221) Breivik refuses to divulge other cells but he had traveled to several countries: Sweden, Denmark, UK, Germany, Poland, Belarus (http://en.rian.ru/world/20110728/165436665.html) (where he underwent paramilitary training), France, Austria, Hungary, Croatia, Lithuania, Estonia (http://news.err.ee/889324cf-ca8e-4798-a337-c406e8e2e771), Latvia, Switzerland, Spain, Cyprus, Malta (http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/breiviks-mentor-linked-to-exiled-loyalist-johnny-mad-dog-adair-16029586.html), US (where he allegedly visited for two months last year Lake Elmo, Minnesota, the home of Bachmann & Associates, the "de-gaying" clinic owned by Marcus Bachmann, husband of GOP presidential candidate Michele Bachmann), Turkey, Mexico (http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/europe/07/28/knights.templar.groups/), China, Nigeria, Cote d’Ivoire and Liberia. Cyprus has seen political instability since a massive explosion of a weapons cache at its main naval base, which also destroyed Cyprus's main power plant forcing blackouts (http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0729/1224301564137.html). President Demetris Christofiasis the first president from the Communist AKEL Party. From Norway to Turkey and Cyprus, a connected network, with links to Israel, appears to be targeting nations that support Palestinian sovereignty.

MADSEN UPDATE
http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/

COUNTRY FOCUS OF THE DAY: Turkey.

326 current and former military officers convicted in coup plot (http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/turkish-court-to-reach-verdict-for-hundreds-of-military-officers-accused-of-plotting-coup/2012/09/21/1f5bb3a6-03c1-11e2-9132-f2750cd65f97_story.html).

Case is central to Ergenekon underground.

[ Donmeh Crypto's lost control of Turkey to Islamists ]

[ On a related note, a relative of Jabotinsky possibly, definitely direct links to Jabotinsky. ]

Netanyahu to run campaign ad in Florida (http://www.politico.com/blogs/burns-haberman/2012/09/netanyahu-ad-to-debut-in-florida-136034.html). Bibi's gross interference in American politics is duly noted. And our take on Netanyahu's congenital racism is also duly noted. (http://www.presstv.com/detail/2012/09/19/262454/antiislam-film-aims-to-corner-obama/)

------------------------

Turkish court convicts 326 former and current military officers of plotting coup

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/turkish-court-to-reach-verdict-for-hundreds-of-military-officers-accused-of-plotting-coup/2012/09/21/1f5bb3a6-03c1-11e2-9132-f2750cd65f97_story.html

ANKARA, Turkey — A Turkish court on Friday convicted 326 military officers, including the former air force and navy chiefs, of plotting to overthrow the nation’s Islamic-based government in 2003, in a case that has helped curtail the military’s hold on politics.

A panel of three judges at the court on Istanbul’s outskirts initially sentenced former air force chief Ibrahim Firtina, former navy chief Ozden Ornek and former army commander Cetin Dogan to life imprisonment but later reduced the sentence to a 20-year jail term because the plot had been unsuccessful, state-run TRT television reported. The three were accused of masterminding the plot.

The court also convicted 323 other active or retired officers, including a former general elected to Parliament a year ago— of involvement in the conspiracy, sentencing some to as much as 18 years in prison. Thirty-six were acquitted, while the case against three other defendants was postponed.

The officers were all expected to appeal the verdicts.

The trial of the high-ranking officers — inconceivable in Turkey a decade ago — has helped significantly to tip the balance of power in the country in favor of civilian authorities.

Turkey’s generals have staged three coups since the 1960s and forced an Islamist government to quit in 1997.

But the current government of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has grown ever more confident with each of its three electoral successes since 2002, and has been limiting the powers of the armed forces which have long seen themselves as the guardians of Turkey’s secular traditions.

Erdogan’s government has hailed the trial, which began in December 2010, and other similar ones as a break with a tradition of impunity and a move toward greater democracy.

However, the officers’ case — dubbed “Sledgehammer” after the alleged conspiracy — has been marred by the suspects’ long confinement without a verdict and some judicial flaws, including allegations of fabricated evidence. The government’s secular critics have denounced the coup plot trials as a ploy to intimidate opponents.

Some defense lawyers have refused to appear in court for the past five months, saying the authenticity of some of the evidence was not investigated.

Erdogan said he hoped Friday’s verdict was a “just” one but refused to comment further, saying he had not seen the reasoning behind the verdicts and the proceedings against the military officers were not over yet.

“We have to see the appeals phase,” Erdogan said. “The final dot has not been placed yet. The process is continuing.”

Transportation Minister Binali Yildirim said: “We all hope that no anti-democratic initiative ever occurs in our country again.”

Prosecutors accused the 365 defendants in the trial of plotting to depose Erdogan by triggering turmoil in the country that would have paved the way for a military takeover. They claimed the plotters, taking part in an army seminar in 2003, drew up plans for a coup which included bombings of mosques, the downing of a Turkish fighter plane and other acts of violence that would have allowed the military to intervene on the pretext of restoring order.

The military has said officers taking part in the seminar discussed a fictitious scenario involving internal conflict, but that there were no plans for a military coup.

Protests broke out soon after Friday’s verdicts were announced, Hurriyet newspaper reported, with some of the officers’ supporters booing the decision inside the courthouse and others waving Turkish flags and shouting “Turkey is secular and will remain secular” outside.

Celal Ulgen, the lawyer defending Dogan — accused of being the main ringleader — called the court’s decision unjust and unlawful. “Their rights to defend themselves were violated,” Ulgen told NTV television. “There is no independent judiciary.”

Dogan said in his final defense statement Thursday that the trial was a political one designed to undermine the military. “It is a case assembled to make soldiers, be they active-duty or retired soldiers, pay the penance for their loyalty to the republic and its (secular) principles,” he said.

More than 400 other people — including journalists, academics, politicians and soldiers — are also on trial on charges of involvement in a conspiracy by an alleged gang of secular nationalists called “Ergenekon.”

The former head of the Turkish armed forces, Gen. Ilker Basbug, and other military officers are, meanwhile, awaiting trial in a separate case.

Two elderly leaders of Turkey’s 1980 military coup, Kenan Evren and Tahsin Sahinkaya, are being prosecuted for the military takeover that saw many cases of torture, disappearance and extrajudicial killings.


RELATED THREAD

Turkey's Top Commanders Resign Bad news for Israel. (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?52669-Turkey-s-Top-Commanders-Resign-Bad-news-for-Israel)

JDRock
26th September 2012, 05:10 PM
well ill be @#$&^! if hoarder wasnt saying this 7 years ago on gim 1 but no one including me paid attention. now Magnes (of course) in typical detailed fashion lays it all out on the table for all to see! fantastic.

Neuro
27th September 2012, 07:01 AM
Protests broke out soon after Friday’s verdicts were announced, Hurriyet newspaper reported, with some of the officers’ supporters booing the decision inside the courthouse and others waving Turkish flags and shouting “Turkey is secular and will remain secular” outside.Turkey wasn't secular before, and it is even less secular now, that is the reality. Religious minorities have continuously been maltreated in Turkey, by the state, since its foundation. Sure the armed forces have tried to maintain a secular path, but they lost the war.

mick silver
28th September 2012, 08:36 AM
Two years later, British Foreign Secretary Lord Balfour, in a letter to Baron Walter Rothschild, a leader of the British Zionists, stated: “His Majesty’s government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people

JohnQPublic
28th September 2012, 09:36 AM
...It was this core group of Dönmeh, which organized the secret Young Turks...

The Young Turks (http://www.youtube.com/user/TheYoungTurks)

ShortJohnSilver
28th September 2012, 10:19 AM
Two years later, British Foreign Secretary Lord Balfour, in a letter to Baron Walter Rothschild, a leader of the British Zionists, stated: “His Majesty’s government view with favor the establishment in Palestine of a national home for the Jewish people

WRONG. The letter was written by Viscount Milner, a state secret that was classified for 20 years.

Who was Milner? A former employee of the Rothschilds, made very wealthy by his being the Chairman of a certain company called Rio Tinto Zinc. He had already helped the Rothschilds by inciting the Anglo-Boer War, which brought the new gold mines that were in the Transvaal under British (and hence Rothschild) control.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Milner,_1st_Viscount_Milner

Really want to understand the Middle East? Read the scifi book "Dune" by Frank Herbert. Baron Harkonnen = Rothschilds.

Ponce
28th September 2012, 10:40 AM
The Young Turks are but one of the many secret groups that the Zionist Jews (and Jews) have all over the world hiding behind a curtain in order to implement their plans of world conquest..........like I keep saying, those people plan centuries ahead and not only for five or ten years........every time that they buy land overseas that then becomes their vanguard headquarters for those who will follow and infiltrate the government.......and of course, they always make sure to change their names so that they cannot be ID as foreigners.

MAGNES
18th June 2020, 10:00 PM
does these donmeh have anything to do with ousting the jew gaddaffi and instilling shariah law in libya?

YES !

Something I never seen covered on this forum, I warned about Syria,
before I stopped posting way back, that will be the red line for Russia
and it was. Followed Trump and Flynn speaking out against this,
“Islamist Spring” , for the most part it stopped but it is still on slow
burnner.

MUST READ ARTICLE , goes into this history of the "islamists".

It's a Jewish/Moslem gang bang, they are a tag team,
Israel loves ISIS, lots out there on this.

Fifth Redacted Name in Rosenstein’s Scope Memo Identified as Walid Phares LastRefuge EGYPT AL-SISI ANTI Moslem Brotherhood Obongo PRO “Islamist Spring” (https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2020/06/18/fifth-redacted-name-in-rosensteins-scope-memo-identified-as-walid-phares/)

"When President Obama ignited the “Islamist Spring” with his speech in Egypt, what he really articulated was a shift in U.S. foreign policy to support The Muslim Brotherhood. As an outcome of the shift in policy President Obama helped kill the regional zookeepers (Hosni Mubarek, Egypt; Ben Ali, Tunisia and eventually Khadaffi in Libya) and Obama unleashed the big cats… radical Islamists."

"Political Islam, writ large, is represented by The Brotherhood. Turkish President Recep Erdogan sees himself as the modern leader of political Islam using the Brotherhood to recreate the Ottoman Empire."

Neuro
20th June 2020, 03:32 AM
YES !

Something I never seen covered on this forum, I warned about Syria,
before I stopped posting way back, that will be the red line for Russia
and it was. Followed Trump and Flynn speaking out against this,
“Islamist Spring” , for the most part it stopped but it is still on slow
burnner.

MUST READ ARTICLE , goes into this history of the "islamists".

It's a Jewish/Moslem gang bang, they are a tag team,
Israel loves ISIS, lots out there on this.

Fifth Redacted Name in Rosenstein’s Scope Memo Identified as Walid Phares LastRefuge EGYPT AL-SISI ANTI Moslem Brotherhood Obongo PRO “Islamist Spring” (https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2020/06/18/fifth-redacted-name-in-rosensteins-scope-memo-identified-as-walid-phares/)

"When President Obama ignited the “Islamist Spring” with his speech in Egypt, what he really articulated was a shift in U.S. foreign policy to support The Muslim Brotherhood. As an outcome of the shift in policy President Obama helped kill the regional zookeepers (Hosni Mubarek, Egypt; Ben Ali, Tunisia and eventually Khadaffi in Libya) and Obama unleashed the big cats… radical Islamists."

"Political Islam, writ large, is represented by The Brotherhood. Turkish President Recep Erdogan sees himself as the modern leader of political Islam using the Brotherhood to recreate the Ottoman Empire."

Erdogan doesn’t have any allegiance, he joins what benefits him at the moment. The prosecutions against the military commanders in 2012, was largely executed by the Gülenist phalanx of Erdogans party, which Erdogan was an integral part of. They had a falling out in 2014 mainly because of Erdogans family corruption. The military commanders and journalists where then released. Fetullah Gülen was then accused of masterminding the attempted coup in 2016, and since US wouldnt have him extradited to Turkey (good sign that he is a CIA asset), Turkeys ties with US and Nato significantly weakened.

Previously relations with Russia soured as Turkey shot down one of its military jets in Syrian airspace, but it appears they have mended that rift.

Erdogan has been bestest friends with Ghadaffi, and Assad. To turn on a quarter to be their mortal enemy. He has cozied up to European leaders and then turn to call them Nazi’s.

Now he’s getting busy in Libya and Syria militarily, supposedly an ally of the muslim brotherhood. He will only be as long he thinks it will benefit him in his ambitions.