Rules of the Court

[palani]

Read them. They are posted. Expect they will be followed.

http://www.janineturner.com/images/ecs.jpg

[palani]

There are all kinds of courts. Many things they have in common.



PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!

[palani]

The use of the court is a privilege.

[palani]

We are glad that you are here.

How else would jurisdiction attach?

[palani]

Please do not bring pets.

Good court. They don't allow agents to be present.

You need to remember to ask if anyone else present is a strawman or agent (alternative forms of pets)

[Libertytree]

WTF? Talking to yourself?

Besides, it's just a simple church basketball court sign, nothing more, nothing less.

[Glass]

You need to remember to ask if anyone else present is a strawman or agent (alternative forms of pets)

If someone was acting as an "agent" what could I do about it?

[palani]

WTF? Talking to yourself?
Do you HEAR voices?


Besides, it's just a simple church basketball court sign, nothing more, nothing less.
You see what you are permitted to see. Why would you look for more?

[palani]

If someone was acting as an "agent" what could I do about it?
If you ask them they will literally jump out their skin to tell you who the principal is. If they don't then they assume the liability for their actions. Except what THEY think is a principal is just going to turn out to be another agent (or agency) which is as irresponsible as the agent in front of you.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Undisclosed_principal


In the field of law, the term undisclosed principal relates mainly to the liability of an agent for obligations incurred on behalf of a principal. If the agent does not disclose the nature of his agency (the fact that he acts on behalf of another) and thus does not disclose the name of the principal, the agent may be held personally liable for his actions. If, however, the agent disclosed his agency and the name of the principal (disclosed principal), he will normally not be held liable for commitments undertaken within his authorized agency. A dummy buyer may sometimes have an undisclosed principal.

A good policy is to deal only with principals.

I doubt if you have ever met a principal. We are a rare breed.

[iOWNme]

Also remember, the rules of the court may be posted in plain sight.

Those rules may come in the form of a symbol. That symbol could be a flag or a gun.

[Hatha Sunahara]

This legal term (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law) article is a stub (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Stub). You can help Wikipedia by expanding it (http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Undisclosed_principal&action=edit).

Legalese is fascinating. Whatever the word is, it means something different from it's English meaning.

So, if I am at the 7-11 and I buy a pack of cigarettes, am I an agent, or am I the principal? I know if I am buying it for someone else, I am an agent. But if I am buying it for myself, am I the principal? Or, can I be both the agent and principal simultaneously, while only presenting one role to the court? The clerk who is selling it to me is an agent for his employer. I presume the employer is the principal in the sale.

Or is everything done anonymously? Please explain. I know you are trying to make a point Palani.


Hatha

[ShortJohnSilver]

Where is the consideration? And is this offer made under UCC or not?

[palani]

So, if I am at the 7-11 and I buy a pack of cigarettes, am I an agent, or am I the principal?
Hatha

If you are using credit or a debt instrument (FRN) you are not acting for yourself. Another is buying that pack leaving you with the use but perhaps not the usufruct of it. Count yourself as an equitable owner rather than a legal owner.

People who use FRNs are agents according to Congress (12 USC 411).

[palani]

Where is the consideration? Good question to ask FDR should you happen to meet him.


And is this offer made under UCC or not?

Due process. Constitutional (two places). It is comprised of notice which endows one with the right to inquire. Don't want to inquire? Then it is presumed that you agree.

Same deal when the county board of supervisors places notice in the county paper of the actions they can take against land owners who fail to take care of their noxious weeds. The notice and lack of response is what gives them authority to take care of the problem themselves and back-charge the land owner for the service.

What most people don't realize is that you can also do the same to THEM. Come up with something you think of as a problem and place a legal notice of your right to amend the problem. Should it be a county problem then send the bill to them. With any luck you might end up owning your own county.

[Hatha Sunahara]

Thank you Palani. Using FRNs or credit makes you an agent not a principal. So now I am struggling with the distinction between an equitable owner and a legal owner. I have no mortgage on my house. I paid off my mortgage years ago. Does that make me a legal owner, or am I just an equitable owner? Or did I graduate from an equitable owner to a legal owner when I paid off the lenders? I am suspicious that in the eyes of the law, I own nothing because they deem me to be a slave. However, that word will never be used in any of their verbal machinations.


Hatha

[palani]

in the eyes of the law, I own nothing because they deem me to be a slave.
Hatha

In the eyes of the law you own nothing because you are a communist. At least that is the body politic you have elected to join. I suspect most people are not communists but rather are where they are by mistake or would just rather get along rather than make waves. In any event, while you may have much less than you believe you have, count the things that cannot be taken away ... health and education, family ... and consider yourself lucky if you can survive the times we are in 'til better come along.

Nihil dat qui non habet. He gives nothing who has nothing.

[iOWNme]

In the eyes of the law you own nothing because you are a communist. At least that is the body politic you have elected to join.
Nihil dat qui non habet. He gives nothing who has nothing.

Please list the actions which would lead a person to 'join' this elected body politic.

Birth Cert?
SS card?
Registering to vote?
Drivers license?

[Hatha Sunahara]

So, I presume that if I want to 'unjoin' this communist body politic, I cannot just escape to Russia, or some other 'free' country because there are none left. I have to become a 'freeman' or a 'sovreign homo sapiens'--at least in the eyes of the law. I should give everything I own to my fellow slaves and allow them to defend what is theirs. And the things that can't be taken away from me--my education, my family, my health--they will find a way to take all that away too--so I am reduced to a pile of barely living ashes. Is there any way to make better times arrive much sooner?


Hatha

[palani]

Please list the actions which would lead a person to 'join' this elected body politic.

Birth Cert?
SS card?
Registering to vote?
Drivers license?

Your choices are
1) jus soli
2) jus sanguinis


You can claim jus sanguinis should your bloodline show that your parents were of this status. You can claim jus soli if you were born on a particular plot of ground (as, for example, the District of Columbia or the Louisiana District).

Your status can be inferred by many things but these two rights are the basis for you entrance into any body politic.

[palani]

Is there any way to make better times arrive much sooner?

Hatha
I use agents. After having been classified as one for so long I feel I am qualified to hire them now.

[iOWNme]

Your choices are
1) jus soli
2) jus sanguinis


You can claim jus sanguinis should your bloodline show that your parents were of this status. You can claim jus soli if you were born on a particular plot of ground (as, for example, the District of Columbia or the Louisiana District).

Your status can be inferred by many things but these two rights are the basis for you entrance into any body politic.


So where i was born designates who is going to rule over me? This is silly. This is the type of garbage that ALL governments enspouse. As if ANY human that is born into the world, MUST be ruled over by some authoritarian Tyrant.

Please show some case law to back up this claim. And even if you do drudge it up out of the thin air, the DoI states VERY clearly that consent is required to be governed.

I could claim to be King of 7 billion people. You might not be able to find anyone who agrees with me, but i have some fancy shmancy papers that say so.

Again, when we deduct away with simple common sense questions, we see that the Government rules by FORCE, not by Law or Reason.

[Awoke]

I am with you Sui. That's why I was asking in that other thread this stuff.

I don't see the difference in quoting the Magna Carta or other organic law to make yourself a "free man". If you are free, you shouldn't need to refer to any document at all. I am God's creation, and He has jurisdiction over me.


I never came out of my others womb, lowered my head in submission and granted authority to the PTB to be my ruler. After looking into the Freeman on the land and sovereign movements, I have determined that they are still submitting to legal paperwork. IMO, the courts and laws have no power over me because they were not installed by my heavenly Creator - They are man made instruments. Simple.

But they use violence to enforce their tyranny, so we lose.

[palani]

So where i was born designates who is going to rule over me?
Being in the body politic means you have a nationality. Without nationality one is considered "stateless". Being stateless means you can be exported to any place willing to import you. Jus soli means you were born in a particular place and have a right to remain. Should there be a body politic already in place there then feel free to join them or simply remain as an inhabitant. Local allegiance is always required of everyone in a place whether alien, inhabitant or citizen. Local allegiance has limited duties.




This is silly. This is the type of garbage that ALL governments enspouse. As if ANY human that is born into the world, MUST be ruled over by some authoritarian Tyrant. You are entitled to govern yourself. If you govern yourself do you class yourself as a tyrant?


Please show some case law to back up this claim. And even if you do drudge it up out of the thin air, the DoI states VERY clearly that consent is required to be governed. They also make provisions for inhabitants if you should happen to pick up a copy of the Articles of Confederation. Inhabitants are not citizens. They are possessors of the right called jus soli (in addition to the maxim that possession is, as it were, the position of the foot).

I don't do case law well. Lot of lies go into the creation of case law.


I could claim to be King of 7 billion people. You might not be able to find anyone who agrees with me, but i have some fancy shmancy papers that say so. You might claim to be king of yourself. A body politic and a people may be singular. No special powers can be granted by 7 billion people that you cannot claim on your own.


Again, when we deduct away with simple common sense questions, we see that the Government rules by FORCE, not by Law or Reason. Government fulfills the role of governing people who are not capable of governing themselves. You might wear a bell around your neck to let them know you are of the self-determining class of people but then you identify yourself as such to the sheep as well. Sheep feel threatened by those who don't follow herd rules.

[palani]

I don't see the difference in quoting the Magna Carta or other organic law to make yourself a "free man". If you are free, you shouldn't need to refer to any document at all.
Documents recognized through history exhibit two things .... 1) agreement and 2) reason. Agreement is consent and should be an easy "sell". Reason is law for as long as the reason exists. Both approaches should result in government agreeing with you rather than sending you to the gallows.



But they use violence to enforce their tyranny, so we lose.
Necessity is used rather than violence (although necessity includes lethal force if needed). Anytime anyone in government tells you it is necessary for you to do something or he "needs" you to do something you had best not go off half cocked. Ask for a business card where you can send the bill and fill the "need". Consider it as if he were seated at a restaurant counter telling the waitress he "needs" an apple pie. Just because the pie is placed in front of him does not mean he gets to walk out without paying for it.