Supreme Court Rules: Police can search you ANYTIME, ANYPLACE, for ANY REASON

[iOWNme]

America 2012: The Supreme Court Has Made It Legal For The Police To Strip Search You Any Time They Want


http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/america-2012-the-supreme-court-has-made-it-legal-for-the-police-to-strip-search-you-any-time-they-want


Last week the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that police in the United States can strip search anyone that they arrest. It doesn't matter how minor the crime is and it doesn't matter if they suspect that you have contraband on you or not. The Supreme Court even said that you can be strip searched if you have been arrested for a traffic violation. Any type of arrest will do. Once you are arrested, if the police want to strip off your clothes and see you naked there is not a thing you can do about it. You can read the entire Supreme Court decision right here (http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/11pdf/10-945.pdf). Considering the fact that 13 million Americans (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/inimai-chettiar/strip-search-supreme-court_b_1400325.html) are put in jail at some point each year, this is a very frightening thing. The notion that we are all "innocent until proven guilty" is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. Thanks to the Supreme Court, it is now legal for the police to strip search you any time they want. All they have to do is find some excuse to arrest you. And considering the fact that almost everything is illegal (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/19-signs-that-america-has-become-a-crazy-control-freak-nation-where-almost-everything-is-illegal) in America, that is not hard to do. America continues to become a very dark place in 2012, and very few people are speaking up in defense of liberty and freedom. But don't the police need probable cause before they search you? Aren't we protected against unreasonable searches by the U.S. Constitution? After all, the 4th Amendment says the following....

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Unfortunately, not even the Supreme Court seems to care much about the U.S. Constitution anymore.
As I have written about previously, in the "new America (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/rights-in-the-new-america-you-dont-get-any-rights)" you don't get any rights.
Instead, the government gives you a limited number of "privileges" that it can revoke at any time.
The story of the man that was at the heart of the Supreme Court case mentioned above demonstrates this. His name was Albert Florence and he was arrested for not paying a fine that he had already paid.
But the fact that he was innocent didn't seem to matter too much to the police. They held him in prison for six days and strip searched him twice. The following is how CNN described (http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/02/justice/scotus-strip-search-ruling/index.html) what Florence went through after his arrest....

Court records show Florence was subjected to an invasive strip and visual body-cavity search. He was then held for six days in the county lockup before being transferred to a Newark correctional facility, where, he claims, he was subjected to another more intrusive search before being placed in the general prison population.
"It was very disgusting. It was just a bad, bad experience," he told CNN's Kate Bolduan recently. "I was just told, 'Do as you're told.' Wash in this disgusting soap and obey the directions of the officer who was instructing me to turn around, lift my genitals up, turn around, and squat."
Are you upset when you read that?
You should be.
You see, this is how totalitarian governments act. Totalitarian regimes love to dehumanize and humiliate their "detainees" by stripping them naked.
So when we see this kind of behavior by authorities in the United States we should be very concerned.
And when we see the U.S. Supreme Court giving the stamp of approval to this kind of activity, we should be sounding the alarm.
At first, Americans were told that this kind of treatment would only happen to "prisoners of war" overseas (http://signsofthelastdays.com/archives/american-christians-approve-of-torture).
But then came the "enhanced pat-downs" from the TSA.
Then we learned that the TSA was actually strip searching old women (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/9-examples-of-elderly-americans-being-strip-searched-or-sexually-molested-by-tsa-agents-at-u-s-airports) at our airports.
And now we discover that strip searching will be legal for every single person that is arrested in the entire nation.
What in the world is happening to us?
Some will argue that if you don't want to be strip searched that you should just avoid committing a crime.
Well, in 2012 almost everything is a crime (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/19-signs-that-america-has-become-a-crazy-control-freak-nation-where-almost-everything-is-illegal) in America.
In fact, if you are just walking down the street minding your own business or even if you are in your own home doing absolutely nothing the police could still probably arrest you because there are probably about 1000 things that you are not doing that you are supposed to be doing.
And you know what horny police officers all over America are going to be thinking when they hear of this Supreme Court decision.
They are going to be thinking that it is now open season for strip searching beautiful women.
There have already been hundreds of complaints that the TSA has been specifically targeting attractive women (http://www.naturalnews.com/035018_TSA_body_scanners_women.html) during airport security screenings.
Anyone that does not believe that police are going to do the exact same thing is being delusional.
In fact, we have already seen many examples of this around the country. As I wrote about a while back (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/why-are-police-in-america-treating-women-like-dogs), one group of female pro-life demonstrators was recently strip searched by police twice. They didn't do anything wrong and they should have never been arrested, but that didn't prevent them from being strip searched in front of male police officers.
We have crossed a very dangerous line as a nation.
We have now gotten to the point where sexual humiliation is a standard law enforcement technique.
A recent article by Naomi Wolf (http://www.commondreams.org/view/2012/04/06-8) detailed how the use of sexual humiliation as a control technique has been steadily increasing in our society in recent years....

Our surveillance state shown considerable determination to intrude on citizens sexually. There's the sexual abuse of prisoners at Bagram – der Spiegel reports that "former inmates report incidents of … various forms of sexual humiliation. In some cases, an interrogator would place his penis along the face of the detainee while he was being questioned. Other inmates were raped with sticks or threatened with anal sex". There was the stripping of Bradley Manning is solitary confinement. And there's the policy set up after the story of the "underwear bomber" to grope US travelers genitally or else force them to go through a machine – made by a company, Rapiscan, owned by terror profiteer and former DHA czar Michael Chertoff – with images so vivid that it has been called the "pornoscanner".
We have all been told that we must sacrifice personal dignity for the greater good.
We have all been told that "national security" trumps our liberties and our freedoms.
But the further we go down this road, the more we become like communist China, the USSR, North Korea (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/rise-of-the-beast-system-11-ways-that-amerika-is-becoming-more-like-north-korea) and Nazi Germany (http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/20-signs-that-the-nazification-of-america-is-almost-complete).
In New York City, the police do not even need to arrest you in order to put their hands on you. Officials in New York have implemented a nightmarish "stop-and-frisk" policy. During 2011, there were 684,330 (http://www.wnyc.org/blogs/wnyc-news-blog/2012/mar/30/bloomberg-stop-and-frisk-program-working/) "stop and frisk" searches in New York City. Mayor Bloomberg contends that these unconstitutional searches are necessary to keep the city safe.
But even if you don't go outside you can still be stopped and frisked. Thousands of apartment buildings in New York have signed up for the "Clean Halls" program which allows police officers to freely roam the hallways of apartment buildings and stop anyone that they want for any reason.
The following is how a recent Rolling Stone article (http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/blogs/taibblog/mike-bloombergs-new-york-cops-in-your-hallways-20120403) described this program....

According to the NYCLU, which filed the suit, "virtually every private apartment building [in the Bronx] is enrolled in the program," and "in Manhattan alone, there are at least 3,895 Clean Halls Buildings." Referring to the NYPD’s own data, the complaint says police conducted 240,000 "vertical patrols" in the year 2003 alone.
If you live in a Clean Halls building, you can’t even go out to take out the trash without carrying an ID – and even that might not be enough. If you go out for any reason, there may be police in the hallways, demanding that you explain yourself, and insisting, in brazenly illegal and unconstitutional fashion, on searches of your person.
Can you see where all of this is going?
We are rapidly becoming a society where there is absolutely no privacy left and where citizens are routinely dehumanized and humiliated.
If those in charge of protecting us cannot keep us safe and respect our liberties and our freedoms at the same time, then they should resign and give their jobs to someone else.
Many of the things that are being done in this nation right now in the name of "security" are absolutely shameful. Our leaders are turning their backs on what it means to be American, and millions of citizens all over the country should be howling in disgust.
Unfortunately, most people seem to be buying in to the "new America", and the U.S. Supreme Court has just given police departments all over the country the green light to strip search citizens any time they want.
Oh how far you have fallen America.

[palani]

Who have you given the authority to arrest you?

[MAGNES]

This is used already by the police as a power trip for compliance, control, to degrade and humiliate you, it is a form of punishment, police think this is funny too, stripping people and looking up their but holes, they enjoy doing this to people.

[osoab]

But yet they will arrest you for public indecency if you run down the street nekkid.

[palani]

If the sheriff has no authority to arrest you what makes you believe anybody else does?

[Hatha Sunahara]

If the sheriff has no authority to arrest you what makes you believe anybody else does?

I don't know where you live Palani, but I read about the police shooting and killing people with enough frequency to make me believe that regardless of what the law says, they assume the authority to not only arrest you, but to be able to do whatever vile things they please with you, and if you resist, they have the power to summarily execute you on the spot and no accountability for it. Just routine paperwork--whatever they do.

Do you think they will just let you go if you remind them that the Sheriff is the highest law enforcement power in the county, and if he has not power to arrest you, where do they get that power? They will just laugh at you.

Can you illustrate for us what we can say to a cop that has detained us that challenges his power to do so? Without suffering the consequences of 'contempt of police'?


Hatha

[Uncle Salty]

I don't know where you live Palani, but I read about the police shooting and killing people with enough frequency to make me believe that regardless of what the law says, they assume the authority to not only arrest you, but to be able to do whatever vile things they please with you, and if you resist, they have the power to summarily execute you on the spot and no accountability for it. Just routine paperwork--whatever they do.

Do you think they will just let you go if you remind them that the Sheriff is the highest law enforcement power in the county, and if he has not power to arrest you, where do they get that power? They will just laugh at you.

Can you illustrate for us what we can say to a cop that has detained us that challenges his power to do so? Without suffering the consequences of 'contempt of police'?


Hatha

Agreed. Try telling a cop he has no authority under Common Law, blah blah blah, to detain you or whatever else palani would say. Law enforcement has gone rogue and the judicial branch allows it. De facto practices rules the day, not some high brow rant that is true.

[Uncle Salty]

Who have you given the authority to arrest you?


That is not the point. The point is, what can anyone do to prevent cops doing from basically whatever they want? Spell it out for us. What do we say to cops to prevent this type of behavior should we find ourselves in their custody due to no fault of our own?

[General of Darkness]

God damn it, I'm really starting to hate this fucking place.

[sirgonzo420]

The Court said they can strip search you in JAIL.

Of course, it becomes increasingly easier to go to jail all the time.

[palani]

I don't know where you live Palani, but I read about the police shooting and killing people with enough frequency to make me believe that regardless of what the law says, they assume the authority to not only arrest you, but to be able to do whatever vile things they please with you, and if you resist, they have the power to summarily execute you on the spot and no accountability for it. Just routine paperwork--whatever they do.

Why are you resisting? Agreeing is what you were INSTRUCTED to do.


Do you think they will just let you go if you remind them that the Sheriff is the highest law enforcement power in the county, and if he has not power to arrest you, where do they get that power? They will just laugh at you. Why would the topic come up? Corporate police operate to protect corporate property and to turn a profit. Unless you plan on charging them for history lessons why bring up common law?


Can you illustrate for us what we can say to a cop that has detained us that challenges his power to do so? Without suffering the consequences of 'contempt of police'?


Hatha

"Would you like to see me do the dance of the seven veils? Today's special. Only $5,000."

[palani]

Try telling a cop he has no authority under Common Law, blah blah blah, to detain you or whatever else palani would say.

There you go engaging in the self-punishing practice of argument. Turn your back and walk away. There is nothing to be gained by engaging in the benefit of conversation. If he is going to shoot you let it be in the back (harder to justify self defense).

[palani]

What do we say to cops to prevent this type of behavior should we find ourselves in their custody due to no fault of our own?
"Do you have a jet ski? I always wanted to own one but then I am willing to accept anything that can be liened, seized or attached."

[Gaillo]

God damn it, I'm really starting to hate this fucking place.

Starting to? If you haven't hated this place for a LONG time by now, then you haven't been paying attention! :o

[iOWNme]

The Court said they can strip search you in JAIL.

Of course, it becomes increasingly easier to go to jail all the time.

It actaully says that they can strip search you for being arrested. SO it appears all they have to do is make an arrest, and your done for.

No Judge, no Jury.


Sadly, ALOT of good cops are going to be killed over the NDAA and rulings like this one. MARK MY WORDS.

[ximmy]

Brace yourself...
http://xrt-ed.org/images/Rectal-probe2.gif

[Hatha Sunahara]

"Would you like to see me do the dance of the seven veils? Today's special. Only $5,000."

You've already described this dance when you suggested we make a counter offer to the cop. You might agree that it is 'counter-intuitive' to negotiate with an armed person who is demanding something from you. What is intuitive for most people is to give them whatever they want, regardless of how unreasonable it is. It doesn't matter if that armed person is a cop or a criminal. Once they have detained you, all you can do is damage control. My instincts tell me to avoid armed people who make demands as though they were the plague.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around how to own nothing they can lien, seize, or attach. I can create a corporation that owns everything, and just allows me to use 'my stuff' while I do not hold title to any of it.

I find it difficult to rearrange my life in ways that protect me from an insane legal system, but the practitioners of this system view me as insane for not engaging in such protective measures. It's not good any more to just live and let live. Too many legally sanctioned predators around.


Hatha

[Libertytree]

Anyone that thinks that spouting off some semantical, magical, obscure legal talk will deter a legalized criminal from assaulting them is friggin crazy and or stupid. Force needs no reason, it does not want or need it. Force only understands one thing and that is equal or greater force. Every single one of us are potential victims, there are no exceptions.

[Twisted Titan]

Amen LT

Every time I leave the house I just mumble some thing to myself.

God guide my path so I do not come to the Moment of Truth.

Cause I really don't want to take drastic measures to defend myself.or those whom I love the most.

But I will if need be.

[k-os]

Darn it, now I have to wear the good undies every day . . . just in case!

[ximmy]

Darn it, now I have to wear the good undies every day . . . just in case!

and keep our legs shaved... :-\

[k-os]

and keep our legs shaved... :-\

Ugh, really? See, that's crossing the line.

[Serpo]

These people think they own us and they want to inspect us naked to check on their belongings every now and then.http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00807/mexicomain_807919a.jpg

They rule by force .

[Libertytree]

Serpo, I agree with your assertion but....the pic you used appears to be of the prison variety but I'm not sure. Do you have any details about it?

[palani]

Anyone that thinks that spouting off some semantical, magical, obscure legal talk will deter a legalized criminal from assaulting them is friggin crazy and or stupid. Force needs no reason, it does not want or need it. Force only understands one thing and that is equal or greater force. Every single one of us are potential victims, there are no exceptions.
Your BEHAVIOR is what is rewarded or punished. What BEHAVIOR have you engaged in that got you where you are today? What situation has your panties wadded up and how did you get in that situation? If you have a right that means you have a remedy. Put another way, if you are so dense you cannot figure out a remedy then maybe you shouldn't be crying about a trespass on a right. Figure it out first and THEN assert the right. Until then you are just another victim looking for a situation to complain about.

Learn how to give due process and maybe you can expect to receive some due process in exchange.

[Serpo]

Serpo, I agree with your assertion but....the pic you used appears to be of the prison variety but I'm not sure. Do you have any details about it?

Not really maybe Mexico.......or crowd control in the FUTURE.........

[ximmy]

Your BEHAVIOR is what is rewarded or punished. What BEHAVIOR have you engaged in that got you where you are today? What situation has your panties wadded up and how did you get in that situation? If you have a right that means you have a remedy. Put another way, if you are so dense you cannot figure out a remedy then maybe you shouldn't be crying about a trespass on a right. Figure it out first and THEN assert the right. Until then you are just another victim looking for a situation to complain about.

Learn how to give due process and maybe you can expect to receive some due process in exchange.

Police issued arrest warrant for wrong man
Fullerton police review video, admit to arresting wrong man
Fiesta Island Rape Accuser Says Police Arrested Wrong Man
Police may have arrested wrong person in Glen Ridge robbery
Crime: Police Arrest Wrong Man in Buffalo, NY
Friends say wrong man arrested in Durham
Police Charge Arrest Wrong Person Drunk Driving
the hazard police arrest wrong guy
Lawsuit: Kansas City police arrested wrong man
Wrong man arrested in armed hold-up
Police reviewing case that resulted in arrest of the wrong man
Police Arrest Wrong Person in Mall Of Louisiana Shooting
Police arrest wrong man for Norton Street murder
Police apologize after man hurt in mistaken arrest

etc.

[Libertytree]

Your BEHAVIOR is what is rewarded or punished. What BEHAVIOR have you engaged in that got you where you are today? What situation has your panties wadded up and how did you get in that situation? If you have a right that means you have a remedy. Put another way, if you are so dense you cannot figure out a remedy then maybe you shouldn't be crying about a trespass on a right. Figure it out first and THEN assert the right. Until then you are just another victim looking for a situation to complain about.

Learn how to give due process and maybe you can expect to receive some due process in exchange.

Talk all ya want, now. If the criminals decide to rain on your little party, 3 on 1 with guns and clubs you'll do very little talking, unless it's yes sir.

[palani]

Police issued arrest warrant for wrong man
Fullerton police review video, admit to arresting wrong man
Fiesta Island Rape Accuser Says Police Arrested Wrong Man
Police may have arrested wrong person in Glen Ridge robbery
Crime: Police Arrest Wrong Man in Buffalo, NY
Friends say wrong man arrested in Durham
Police Charge Arrest Wrong Person Drunk Driving
the hazard police arrest wrong guy
Lawsuit: Kansas City police arrested wrong man
Wrong man arrested in armed hold-up
Police reviewing case that resulted in arrest of the wrong man
Police Arrest Wrong Person in Mall Of Louisiana Shooting
Police arrest wrong man for Norton Street murder
Police apologize after man hurt in mistaken arrest

etc.

Consensus tollit errorem. Consent removes or obviates a mistake.


MISTAKE, contracts. An error committed in relation to some matter of fact affecting the rights of one of the parties to a contract.

2. Mistakes in making a contract are distinguished ordinarily into, first, mistakes as to the motive; secondly, mistakes as to the person, with whom the contract is made; thirdly, as to the subject matter of the contract; and, lastly, mistakes of fact and of law. See Story, Eq. Jur. 110; Bouv. Inst. Index, h. t.; Ignorance; Motive.

3. In general, courts of equity will correct and rectify all mistakes in deeds and contracts founded on good consideration. 1 Ves. 317; 2 Atk. 203; Mitf. Pl. 116; 4 Vin. Ab. 277; 13 Vin. Ab. 41; 18 E. Com. Law Reps. 14; 8 Com. Digest, 75; Madd. Ch. Prac. Index, h. t.; 1 Story on Eq. ch. 5, p. 121; Jeremy's Eq. Jurisd. B. 3, part 2, p. 358. See article Surprise.

4. As to mistakes in the names of legatees, see 1 Rop. Leg. 131; Domat, l. 4, t. 2, s. 1, n. 22. As to mistakes made in practice, and as to the propriety or impropriety of taking advantage of them, see Chitt. Pr. Index, h. t. As to mistakes of law in relation to contracts, see 23 Am. Jur. 146 to 166.


WRONG. An injury; (q. v.) a tort (q. v.) a violation of right. In its most usual sense, wrong signifies an injury committed to the person or property of another, or to his relative rights, unconnected with contract; and these wrongs are committed with or without force. But in a more extended signification, wrong includes the violation of a contract; a failure by a man to perform his undertaking or promise is a wrong or injury to him to whom it was made. 3 Bl. Com. 158.

2. Wrongs are divided into public and private. 1. A public wrong is an act which is injurious to the public generally, commonly known by the name of crime, misdemeanor, or offence, and it is punishable in various ways, such as indictments, summary proceedings, and upon conviction by death, imprisonment, fine, &c. 2. Private wrongs, which are injuries to individuals, unaffecting the public: these are redressed by actions for damages, &c.

A "wrong" person or a "wrong" man is just plain bad English. Did he/she start out wrong? When did he/she become wrong?

[Hatha Sunahara]

Aha, Palani, I must be dense, but I got it finally. You're not offering to do the dance of the seven veils for me in exchange for $5000.

That is an illustration of what counteroffer I should make to the cop. That might make the poor beast feel more like he's human, and establish some rapport with him so he might just go easy on me. The theory is that a little civility (good behavior) begets the like. All of us do really enjoy having our ass kissed occasionally.

You're clever Palani. Ass kissing for leniency might have some great short term rewards. Very pragmatic. Doesn't even require me to abandon thinking of them as anything but pigs. I'd just temporarily have to tolerate the odour.


Hatha

[osoab]

Darn it, now I have to wear the good undies every day . . . just in case!


and keep our legs shaved... :-\


Ugh, really? See, that's crossing the line.

Actually, the more disgusting you present yourselves, the less likely the JBT's would be likely to take liberties with you. Granted they do hire degenerates now.

[Awoke]

As much as I appreciate Palani's knack for circumlocution, it will not work.

The rest of us know and understand that the NWO pigs are nothing more than thugs who seek the thrill of dominating and dehumanizing victims, and they will do what they want, when they want. They are the biggest and most organized gang of extortionist thugs in the world, and the "courts" are in their favor.

I have tried to warn Palani in the past about this "Legal-talk your way out of it" in the past, and I have determined it is a lost cause. (1 (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?51140-Ron-Paul-Gold-prices-could-hit-10-000...How-he-would-fix-the-economy....&p=426301),2 (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?51111-“Stay-And-Fight”-Is-This-Realistic&p=426110&highlight=Palani#post426110),3 (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?51111-“Stay-And-Fight”-Is-This-Realistic&p=425907&highlight=Palani#post425907) plus many more times)

The truth is, the thugs are getting worse, and only when people start fighting back are the pigs going to start second-guessing their decision making process. LibertyTree's post #18 is truth. Pigs don't even know how to pronounce Magna Carta, nevermind recognize its applicability.

[Awoke]

Actually, the more disgusting you present yourselves, the less likely the JBT's would be likely to take liberties with you. Granted they do hire degenerates now.

They don't care.
Police rapes... (http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&output=search&sclient=psy-ab&q=police+officer+rapes&oq=police+officer+rapes&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_l=hp.3...1454l7344l0l8703l26l19l3l4l4l1l469l556 3l0j2j5j5j5l24l0.frgbld.&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=3fd82a47a5e2a5f5&biw=986&bih=563)

[palani]

you'll do very little talking, unless it's yes sir.

People sure do have a reading comprehension problem. Haven't I been saying all along that you are instructed to AGREE? What better way of doing it than saying "yes, sir"? Attorneys are licensed to argue. Arguing is a sin. Learn to be more agreeable and you will have fewer problems.

Once you have learned to be agreeable then you might consider throwing in some conditions that could be of benefit to you. If you happen to throw a counter-offer his way then don't wait for his response, just go ahead and do it. Specific performance is one measure of a contract.

What you actually do when you are out of range is an entirely different matter.

[palani]

I'd just temporarily have to tolerate the odour.


Hatha

You are right. The suggestion to perform the dance of the seven veils is a counter-offer.

You'll get the odor out of your system quicker by eliminating yourself from his vicinity. Stand-your-ground might work for non-sanctioned criminals but is a bad policy for the licensed kind.

[palani]

http://i42.tinypic.com/2ugjx8y.jpg

[palani]

According to Bacon duress can be discharged should any consideration be involved ... remember ... your counter-offer is your consent .. don't do anything that is not worth your while to do (or anything illegal for that matter).

http://i39.tinypic.com/o5xgz8.jpg

[Libertytree]

More total fucking bullshit!

Exchange the words "yes sir" with " yes, here's my little piece of paper/counter-offer that tells you to quit messing with me.....ouch! that hurts........please stop, I haven't done anyt..... fuck you!, In the name of ________ I command you to cease and........ FUCK YOU that hurts asshole!"

[palani]

More total fucking bullshit!

Catch many flies with vinegar? Attitude gets you attitude. If that is what you want then that is the way you get it.

[Libertytree]

Catch many flies with vinegar? Attitude gets you attitude. If that is what you want then that is the way you get it.

I agree with that premise whole heartedly! I'm always polite and courteous but...you're missing the main point that there are times when it will get you nowhere! To argue this point is moronic.

[milehi]

I don't know if this fits here, but today after lunch I was walking back to my car. There was a traffic officer walking towards it too. I was partly parked in a red zone and he flipped open his ticket book. I was already in the car by then and I told him, "I'm driving away". He causually said "OK", closed his book and walked back to his car. My other choice was to be silent and wait for him to write the ticket.

[palani]

I was already in the car by then and I told him, "I'm driving away". He causually said "OK", closed his book and walked back to his car.

You made an offer. He accepted.

I observed a sheriff tell someone "If you take one step toward that door I will arrest you." The step was made and so was the arrest.

You have to be able to communicate ... as in COOL HAND LUKE ... "What we have here is a failure to communicate."

[palani]

To argue this point is moronic.

I never argue. I do provide due process which starts with NOTICE and ends with opportunity to be heard.

[dys]

Anyone that thinks that spouting off some semantical, magical, obscure legal talk will deter a legalized criminal from assaulting them is friggin crazy and or stupid. Force needs no reason, it does not want or need it. Force only understands one thing and that is equal or greater force. Every single one of us are potential victims, there are no exceptions.

Is it that Palani thinks this, or is it that Palani is yet again peddling his 'blame the victim' meme?

dys

[sirgonzo420]

I don't know if this fits here, but today after lunch I was walking back to my car. There was a traffic officer walking towards it too. I was partly parked in a red zone and he flipped open his ticket book. I was already in the car by then and I told him, "I'm driving away". He causually said "OK", closed his book and walked back to his car. My other choice was to be silent and wait for him to write the ticket.

Also, when getting "pulled over", the victim usually initiates the interaction by stopping their car and pulling over to the side of the road just because some asshole with flashing lights is behind him.

I once watched a cop follow an elderly man who was driving down the road in his car. The cop's lights were on, and it was obvious he was trying to get the guy to pull over, but instead the gentleman simply waited at the stoplight (cop behind him with lights on all the while), and when the light turned green, he proceeded along his way at a reasonable speed. I happened to be headed the same direction, so I followed, and the cop continued to follow him with lights and sirens, waiting for the guy to pull over, but he never did... the old fella kept headibg toward his destination. After another minute or two, the cop turned off his lights and turned down a different street, and I presume he left the guy alone, since they were going different directions last time I saw them.

[Libertytree]

I don't know if this fits here, but today after lunch I was walking back to my car. There was a traffic officer walking towards it too. I was partly parked in a red zone and he flipped open his ticket book. I was already in the car by then and I told him, "I'm driving away". He causually said "OK", closed his book and walked back to his car. My other choice was to be silent and wait for him to write the ticket.

You got lucky! If the cop had a burr up his/her ass or a quota to meet you would have been told to take the keys out of the car, lisc/tags/registration check and the you broke the law and I have to write you up spiel. There was NO offer/counter offer in play.

[palani]

There was NO offer/counter offer in play.

I see you studied law at the Acme Academy along with the roadrunner and Wiley Coyote.

[palani]

Is it that Palani thinks this, or is it that Palani is yet again peddling his 'blame the victim' meme?

dys

Don't you believe it is irresponsible to always blame the other guy? Are you ever responsible for ANYTHING? As James Allen might point out in AS A MAN THINKETH your garden has become full of weeds. Best tend it soon.

[palani]

The cop's lights were on, and it was obvious he was trying to get the guy to pull over
It is a felony to turn on the emergency lights when there is no emergency.

[Libertytree]

I see you studied law at the Acme Academy along with the roadrunner and Wiley Coyote.

I see you have a masters degree in Obfuscation. The OP is about the expanding police state, laws that are being passed that effect all of us!! GOD DAMNIT ARE YOU A FUCKING SHILL? WTF? Yeah, you think your superior intellect gives you the power of the force or with your legalese to be above the very possible facts right before your eyes? Riiiigggghhhtttt, they'll just leave Palani alone, he really knows his shit..chuckle. The problem is, that's BULLSHIT!

[palani]

they'll just leave Palani alone, he really knows his shit

Chances are palani will be left alone because he is not an insurgent; however there are no guarantees. One must simply follow his own nature and be responsible for his own actions and not become agitated over irrational actions of others when the goal is to be made whole.

[Libertytree]

Chances are palani will be left alone because he is not an insurgent; however there are no guarantees. One must simply follow his own nature and be responsible for his own actions and not become agitated over irrational actions of others when the goal is to be made whole.

Chances are, your chances are as good as ours no matter what language you choose to speak. But......I wouldn't be surprised if your IP was from the DC/VA area. Insurgent?

[palani]

I wouldn't be surprised if your IP was from the DC/VA area. I have no IP.


Insurgent? It's a status reserved for those who profess one thing and practice another.

[Libertytree]

I have no IP.

It's a status reserved for those who profess one thing and practice another.

No IP? Really? That in itself is interesting.

So, you're an insurgent?

[gunDriller]

i thought this case was about strip-searching when you are in police custody.

e.g., if you're pulled over by a cop who's fishing for a traffic violation ticket, and pulls you over for a bullshit reason. he can write you a ticket, but you won't be strip-searched unless you, for example, smack the officer and they take you into custody.

[iOWNme]

i thought this case was about strip-searching when you are in police custody.

e.g., if you're pulled over by a cop who's fishing for a traffic violation ticket, and pulls you over for a bullshit reason. he can write you a ticket, but you won't be strip-searched unless you, for example, smack the officer and they take you into custody.


It says you have to be under arrest, then they can search you. The arrest could be for ANYTHING it appears....

[palani]

No IP? Really? That in itself is interesting. I don't know why it would be. You might have a drivers license in your wallet but it doesn't belong to you.


So, you're an insurgent? I don't vote. Being insurgent is a requirement to vote. You figure it out.

[palani]

It says you have to be under arrest, then they can search you. The arrest could be for ANYTHING it appears....

Except what they currently consider an arrest is a citizens arrest. No peace officer has the authority to arrest. The sheriff has not the authority to arrest. The sheriff lost his shire leet court centuries ago and now only has the authority to execute process.

Nobody can arrest you. You volunteer.

You can be required to post a recognizance bond and you can be held until you do so.

[Cebu_4_2]

Nobody can arrest you. You volunteer.


I certainly did not volunteer to be arrested for walking down a road minding my own business while talking on my cell phone... BUT I WAS.

[palani]

I certainly did not volunteer to be arrested for walking down a road minding my own business while talking on my cell phone... BUT I WAS.

1) "Am I under arrest?" ... answer "no"
2) "Am I free to go?" ... answer "no"

This results in a constitutional seizure. No arrest ever occurred.

[Libertytree]

I certainly did not volunteer to be arrested for walking down a road minding my own business while talking on my cell phone... BUT I WAS.

So was I Cebu.

But if you're a member of the tribes bullshit team they'll tell you it's just your imagination.

[Libertytree]

1) "Am I under arrest?" ... answer "no"
2) "Am I free to go?" ... answer "no"

This results in a constitutional seizure. No arrest ever occurred.

See, just like I predicted and said, Cebu never got fucked with, it was just a seizure, Constitutional at that!

[palani]

But if you're a member of the tribes bullshit team they'll tell you it's just your imagination.

And when you are insurgent you may be treated as an insurgent. Big surprise!!!

[Libertytree]

Sounds like a threat? LOL. Like I care. You are showing your true colors though.

[Cebu_4_2]

Like I said I was WALKING and on my CELL PHONE I did not say anything to anyone besides my phone and was knocked to the fucking GROUND and handcuffed. I was not read any rights or was I told why I was handcuffed. The next day when I left<- "was released" from jail I found that it was for DUI even though I was over a MILE away from my home or car. They claim that I refused a breathalyzer which I did... Now I have a restricted license but never charged for anything. So much for a jog around the block (a block is 4 miles here).

[palani]

Sounds like a threat?

Funny. I thought it was just an observation. But then when dealing with irrational people I find they fantasize frequently.

[palani]

Like I said I was WALKING and on my CELL PHONE I did not say anything to anyone besides my phone and was knocked to the fucking GROUND and handcuffed....So much for a jog around the block

Walking in a JOGGING zone?

[sirgonzo420]

It is a felony to turn on the emergency lights when there is no emergency.

If you DO pull over, it's fun to ask if there is any emergency. If they say no, say "oh because I just noticed you had your emergency lights on".

[palani]

If you DO pull over, it's fun to ask if there is any emergency. If they say no, say "oh because I just noticed you had your emergency lights on".

One old timer told me he would jump out of his car, run to the front, get down and look under the car. When the cop would ask what he was doing he would say "trying to find the corpus delicti ... you had your emergency lights on and I figured I ran over someone".

[Cebu_4_2]

Walking in a JOGGING zone?

No it's called a road... made of dirt and sand, no lines and very little traffic, surely you have heard of these?

[dys]

Don't you believe it is irresponsible to always blame the other guy? Are you ever responsible for ANYTHING? As James Allen might point out in AS A MAN THINKETH your garden has become full of weeds. Best tend it soon.

I take responsibility for that which I do that is wrong, not that which other people do that is wrong. YOU should take responsibility for repeatedly attempting to pervert the notion of accountability. AKA blame shifting. AKA blame the victim.
In the style of masonic triple meanings, your palaver creates 3 seperate distorted concepts in those that are unfortunate to be deceived by it:

1. The victim blames himself for the actions of the perpetrator.
2. Other people blame the victim for the actions of the perpetrator.
(something darker)
3. Lambs to the slaughter, those that accept your BS that they can 'opt out' or 'withdraw consent', try to do so, and are 'dealt with' by TPTB.

I say that you are a shill and a deceiver. But then again, I've been saying that for a long time. Looks like other people are starting to get clued in now, too.

dys

[7th trump]

I take responsibility for that which I do that is wrong, not that which other people do that is wrong. YOU should take responsibility for repeatedly attempting to pervert the notion of accountability. AKA blame shifting. AKA blame the victim.
In the style of masonic triple meanings, your palaver creates 3 seperate distorted concepts in those that are unfortunate to be deceived by it:

1. The victim blames himself for the actions of the perpetrator.
2. Other people blame the victim for the actions of the perpetrator.
(something darker)
3. Lambs to the slaughter, those that accept your BS that they can 'opt out' or 'withdraw consent', try to do so, and are 'dealt with' by TPTB.

I say that you are a shill and a deceiver. But then again, I've been saying that for a long time. Looks like other people are starting to get clued in now, too.

dys
Actually Dys you think at a lower level therefore perceive reality at the same level!

[palani]

I take responsibility for that which I do that is wrong, not that which other people do that is wrong.
dys

So you disclaim responsibility. Isn't that irresponsible?

That is the root of your problem. Don't look to other parties to blame for actions that happen to you. What happens to you solely belongs to you. Look at it this way, if you never bothered to make an appearance then nothing anybody else did would affect you. Are you responsible for your own appearance or are you prepared to blame someone else for that as well?

Once you find that you are responsible for your own actions then you might be able to ask forgiveness for them. If you are out blaming others for interacting with you then you are not seeking forgiveness. Instead you are seeking retribution and retaliation. Neither of these two goals leaves particularly spectacular results. They result in more hate and lack of closure.

[Kruger]

If someone were to post a video of a bunch of cops beating the crap out of Palani as he wailed on with his law school dropout bullshit..... I would of course condemn the cowardly pigs, but I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't enjoy watching it.

[palani]

If someone were to post a video of a bunch of cops beating the crap out of Palani as he wailed on with his law school dropout bullshit..... I would of course condemn the cowardly pigs, but I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't enjoy watching it.

Thinking really hurts sometimes, doesn't it? I suppose that is why so many people avoid it at all cost.

[sirgonzo420]

If someone were to post a video of a bunch of cops beating the crap out of Palani as he wailed on with his law school dropout bullshit..... I would of course condemn the cowardly pigs, but I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't enjoy watching it.

That's part of what's wrong with people today.

[Book]

But then when dealing with irrational people I find they fantasize frequently.



http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_KgBT8kIRgBo/SnkpHREVO6I/AAAAAAAAFsU/Vgdo_jh6PL4/s400/LAPD+Beating.jpg

::) Palani's nose does not recognize the jurisdiction of a police fist...lol.

[palani]

Palani's nose does not recognize the jurisdiction of a police fist...lol.

Would the agents in your photo be men responsible for their own actions or are they agents acting under the limited liability of a principal whose uniform and badge they prominently display?

Would that so called principal (aka "the State") be nothing more than a legal fiction?

Inquiring minds would like to hear your response to these questions.

[JJ.G0ldD0t]

we need a do - over on this thread....

It's so far OT.

[Santa]

So was I Cebu.

But if you're a member of the tribes bullshit team they'll tell you it's just your imagination.

The Police can never harm you if you're wearing the SUPER PALANI suit by Palani Inc.

http://i915.photobucket.com/albums/ac358/jackconrad/junk/15172a6f.jpg

[Hatha Sunahara]

One thing I have learned here is to find a precise meaning of words. Something I have to do regularly when reading Palani's posts:


Definition of INSURGENT

1
: a person who revolts against civil authority or an established government; especially : a rebel not recognized as a belligerent

From Merriam-Webster's Dictionary.

I think Palani is suggesting we not revolt against our civil government, but to play by its rules to our advantage. And, of course, to do that, you need to know the rules.

Perhaps the underlying assumption here is that "If you can't beat them, join them". I don't think that extends to helping them oppress others, but to just protecting yourself.


Hatha

[ximmy]

"If you can't beat them, join them".
Hatha

http://theblacksentinel.files.wordpress.com/2007/07/police-brutality.gif

[palani]

I think Palani is suggesting we not revolt against our civil government, but to play by its rules to our advantage. And, of course, to do that, you need to know the rules.

Hatha

Actually my reference to "insurgent" was taken from the 14th amendment. The first quote is verbatim from sec. II of that amendment. The second quote is after extra verbiage is eliminated.


But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State.


...the right to vote at any election ... is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States,... except for participation in rebellion...

In other words, only those willing to participate in rebellion against the organic constitution are permitted to cast ballots as citizens of the United States. Those who vote are insurgents to the principles that established the United States prior to the (un)Civil War. I didn't make this up. See if you can get your hands on a copy of The Red Amendment by L.B. Bork.

Until this (un)Civil War gets resolved I suggest that it is best to maintain a low LAWFUL profile as an inhabitant of either an established federal territory (where Congress has ultimate authority yet rarely directs their laws at inhabitants) or as one of the several States of the union that formed the FEDERATION called The United States of America.

[Awoke]

What a bunch of shit.

Here we have members that have gotten ticketed for walking and and talking on a cel phone, and they are to blame?

So Palani, when they make a law against breathing, are you going to stop?

[palani]

Here we have members that have gotten ticketed for walking and and talking on a cel phone, and they are to blame? You deviate from fact to attend argument. There has been no evidence of any of this.


So Palani, when they make a law against breathing, are you going to stop?
If they could pass such a law would it be consonant with Reason? Wouldn't a court of first impression have to consider such a law first?

[dys]

What a bunch of shit.

Here we have members that have gotten ticketed for walking and and talking on a cel phone, and they are to blame?

So Palani, when they make a law against breathing, are you going to stop?

"When someone tells you who they are, believe them."
Maya Angelou

dys