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Serpo
1st May 2012, 04:51 PM
Catholic Church says that under canon law priests are not allowed to marry and must remain celibate for life. ;D;D


A Sydney Catholic priest who revealed he has been married for a year has been removed from his post by church officials.
Father Kevin Lee, a priest at Padre Pio parish in Glenmore Park, told Channel Seven last night he married his wife, whom he met in the Philippines, in secret last year.
''I've fallen in love and I've got married and it's outside of most people's awareness,'' he said. ''But I'm sure people within the church could have had a suspicion.''
He said his public admission was motivated by the fact that many priests led a double life. ''I think celibacy has to go,'' he said.
The head of the Diocese of Parramatta, Anthony Fisher OP, denied Father Lee's claims that most priests lived double lives and that the church knew about the priest's marriage.
''As Father Kevin is aware, by his actions he can no longer operate as a priest and as a result I will immediately be appointing an administrator to Padre Pio parish,'' Bishop Fisher said in a statement.
Father Lee said he expected his family would be ''deeply disappointed about these revelations''.
The Catholic Church says that under canon law priests are not allowed to marry and must remain celibate for life.



http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/australia/6843579/Church-dumps-Sydney-priest-who-wed

StreetsOfGold
1st May 2012, 04:58 PM
One thing is for certain, the Catholic Church are not Bible believers... that's for sure!

1 Timothy 3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

1 Corinthians 7:9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

Serpo
1st May 2012, 05:10 PM
, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.
let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn

chad
1st May 2012, 07:27 PM
One thing is for certain, the Catholic Church are not Bible believers... that's for sure!

1 Timothy 3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
1 Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

1 Corinthians 7:9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

i don't know who you are or who you work for, but you get paid to shill on here about catholics. anytime anything catholic is posted, you have a 99.9% comment rate almost immediately. you'll go days, weeks without posting until something catholic related shows up, and then BAM, you're in for the big win.

Awoke
1st May 2012, 08:08 PM
Catholic Priests traditionally are not allowed to be "married" in the flesh, because they are to dedicate their lives and devotion to the Bride of Christ, which is the Church.

It's really not complicated. I don't know if I agree with it or not, but it's a simple premise.

banjo
1st May 2012, 11:47 PM
I think that Catholic priests are allowed to be married --- provided that they were married prior to becoming priests. Don't have a source on that, but I believe that I've read that somewhere.

Serpo
2nd May 2012, 12:27 AM
Catholic Priests traditionally are not allowed to be "married" in the flesh, because they are to dedicate their lives and devotion to the Bride of Christ, which is the Church.

It's really not complicated. I don't know if I agree with it or not, but it's a simple premise.

Dont normally like talking about religion as it is often a touche subject

So Priests become married to the church ,sort of

Christ has a bride, but priests dont ,which is the church,

did Christ get a say in this or is it a one sided marriage.

StreetsOfGold
2nd May 2012, 06:20 AM
Chad says: i don't know who you are or who you work for, but you get paid to shill on here about catholics. anytime anything catholic is posted, you have a 99.9% comment rate almost immediately. you'll go days, weeks without posting until something catholic related shows up, and then BAM, you're in for the big win.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

You can do a search for my posts (by user name) to find out that your accusations are completely FALSE!
Perhaps the Lord had me login just after the post. Never considered that? Thought not.

It is approiate that I respond since my testimony is that of an Ex-Catholic. The catholic church almost sent me to hell, I got saved by the grace of God trusting in the blood of Jesus Christ as the ONCE for all sacriifce for sins forever. Something that the Cat church refuses to accept and if you're Catholic and trusting in the Catholic church... you're going to hell, in fact you're as good as in hell with the door shut right this second! The Catholic church is satan's church, make no mistake about it.

Hebrews 10:11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, (like the mass) which can never take away sins:
Hebrews 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

Santa
2nd May 2012, 07:08 AM
There's a world of difference between Christ's Church and the Catholic Church.

Shami-Amourae
2nd May 2012, 07:19 AM
Most Protestants practice the occult anyways and don't know about it. You guys aren't much different than the Catholics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDdqsf4TGCU

goldleaf
2nd May 2012, 07:32 AM
The Catholic church was established about 400 years before the bible was completed. All our Gospels and Epistles are scripture. Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists etc. came along much later, Usually getting their start from some disgruntled
fallen away Catholic.

StreetsOfGold
2nd May 2012, 07:38 AM
Most Protestants practice the occult anyways and don't know about it. You guys aren't much different than the Catholics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDdqsf4TGCU

You assume if you're not Catholic you are automatically a "Protestant". Tis not true.
Personally, I am a Bible believer and do not fall into either category, if I have any linage (spiritually) it is with the Baptists which DID NOT come out of the reformation.

PROT'ESTANT, a. Pertaining to those who, at the reformation of religion,protested against a decree of Charles V. and the diet of Spires; pertaining to the adherents of Luther, or others of the reformed churches; as the protestant religion.

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 07:41 AM
i don't know who you are or who you work for, but you get paid to shill on here about catholics. anytime anything catholic is posted, you have a 99.9% comment rate almost immediately. you'll go days, weeks without posting until something catholic related shows up, and then BAM, you're in for the big win.

Actually, I have found no fault in Street's words. If you see a fault in what he has written, please point it out. Having a consistent stance is not something to fault.



I think that Catholic priests are allowed to be married --- provided that they were married prior to becoming priests. Don't have a source on that, but I believe that I've read that somewhere.

Nope. If you adhere to Roman Catholic doctrine and that is what you preach, then to live otherwise is hypocritical. Practice what you preach. This guy was a liar.



The Catholic church was established about 400 years before the bible was completed. All our Gospels and Epistles are scripture. Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists etc. came along much later, Usually getting their start from some disgruntled
fallen away Catholic.

The "canonization" of the bible is not inspired. It is a collection of scripture voted on by fallible men and does not include the full canon (the complete word) of God. The bible is only a sampling and sufficient guide for those seeking truth. The Spirit is required to lead believers into peace and righteousness. The claim of the Roman church is that it pre-exists and preeminates all christian theology and they base this on Peter being the first pope. All fallacy.

StreetsOfGold
2nd May 2012, 07:49 AM
The Catholic church was established about 400 years before the bible was completed. All our Gospels and Epistles are scripture. Lutherans, Methodists, Baptists etc. came along much later, Usually getting their start from some disgruntled
fallen away Catholic.

The origins of the Catholic church goes back way further than this. Try Judges Chapter 17 and Jeremiah 7, 44

Judges 17:4 Yet he restored the money unto his mother; and his mother took two hundred shekels of silver, and gave them to the founder, who made thereof a graven image and a molten image: and they were in the house of Micah.
Judges 17:11 And the Levite was content to dwell with the man; and the young man was unto him as one of his sons.
Judges 17:10 And Micah said unto him, Dwell with me, and be unto me a father and a priest, and I will give thee ten shekels of silver by the year, and a suit of apparel, and thy victuals. So the Levite went in.

The Catholic church is THE "religion" which can have a younger man who is called "father" be a "priest" that uses "*graven images" for worship and is provided for materially. *This is also why the Catholic Bible REMOVES the 2nd commandment from the Bible. ie. Catechism
Exodus 20:4 Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:

chad
2nd May 2012, 08:04 AM
the original texts that turned in to the bible had no numbering system for the commandments. hence, no one can say the catholics "left out the second commandment." there never was anything labeled #2 to begin with. the numbering system was added in later. i can see the commandment right on the vatican's very own website:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__P21.HTM

chad
2nd May 2012, 08:04 AM
double post, sorry.

banjo
2nd May 2012, 08:07 AM
Nope. If you adhere to Roman Catholic doctrine and that is what you preach, then to live otherwise is hypocritical. Practice what you preach. This guy was a liar.



.

Wrong.

"In Latin-Rite (Western) Catholic churches, married men may (since the time of the Second Vatican Council in 1965) be ordained deacons, but may not be ordained priests or bishops, nor may one marry after ordination. Since the start of the pontificate of Pope Pius XII (1939–1958), exceptions may be allowed for married Protestant ministers or Anglican priests who convert to Catholicism and wish to become priests in the Catholic Church, provided their wives consent."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clerical_celibacy

StreetsOfGold
2nd May 2012, 08:53 AM
the original texts that turned in to the bible had no numbering system for the commandments. hence, no one can say the catholics "left out the second commandment." there never was anything labeled #2 to begin with. the numbering system was added in later. i can see the commandment right on the vatican's very own website:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0839/__P21.HTM

They may not have been numbered like the chapter and verse markings we use today but there were ten according to God

Exodus 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.

It's either a commandment or it's not. Breaking up the LAST ONE to make it appear likes there is ten is DISHONEST at best and an obvious attempt to cover up some devilment.

http://soulrefuge.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/baltyten2.jpg?w=640

After I became a Christian I had an insatiable desire to read the Word of God [The Bible]. One of the first things that I noticed in my reading of the Ten Commandments, which can be found in Exodus 20:1-17, is that the Second Commandment was different from what I learned growing up as a Roman Catholic. I remember learning the Second Commandment as “Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord Thy God in vain.” which you can read for yourself in the Catechism above.These are the Ten Commandments as found in the Roman Catholic New Saint Joseph Catechism, which has the Imprimatur of the Catholic Church. Having the Imprimatur means that they approve of the doctrine which is contained inside the Catechism. [Item #195, page 100]After I was born again, I went to the Bible and saw that the Second Commandment spoke about the making and worshiping of graven images. It is obvious that the statues, which I was so used to seeing in church when I was growing up, fit into that category. Here is the REAL Second Commandment as found in the King James version of the Bible.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments. (Exodus 20:4-6)

source (http://soulrefuge.org/2008/07/17/rome-and-the-missing-commandment/)

Tumbleweed
2nd May 2012, 10:07 AM
Well Seventh if you were worshipping a statue in a catholic church you were doing something I've never seen a catholic do in my whole life. Catholics don't worsip statues. ::)

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 10:50 AM
Well Seventh if you were worshipping a statue in a catholic church you were doing something I've never seen a catholic do in my whole life. Catholics don't worsip statues. ::)

Then why have them? Why bow and kneel before them? Why call them names?

But get to the real point. Who is the pope? Is he infallible? If he tells you what is moral and what you must do, is that your only option to follow his commands?

chad
2nd May 2012, 10:56 AM
Then why have them? Why bow and kneel before them? Why call them names?

out of a sign of respect. i don't worship the flag, but i take my hat off and do the pledge when it is presented out of a sign of respect for what it represents.

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 11:16 AM
Then why have them? Why bow and kneel before them? Why call them names?

out of a sign of respect. i don't worship the flag, but i take my hat off and do the pledge when it is presented out of a sign of respect for what it represents.

Would you do the same thing to the flag of Puerto Rico? Russia? Portugal?

chad
2nd May 2012, 11:36 AM
Would you do the same thing to the flag of Puerto Rico? Russia? Portugal?

hmm, never thought about it.

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 12:42 PM
hmm, never thought about it.

In like manner, God would not accept His people to pledge their allegiance to anything else. I believe He was so concerned about it that He wrote it in stone.

Tumbleweed
2nd May 2012, 12:47 PM
Then why have them? Why bow and kneel before them? Why call them names?

But get to the real point. Who is the pope? Is he infallible? If he tells you what is moral and what you must do, is that your only option to follow his commands?


When I've attended Mass the focus and attention were always on the life and teachings of Jeusus Christ. I suppose the statues are there as a reminder but I've never paid much attention to them and no one else seems to either. Worshiping a satutue would be pretty silly and I've never seen anyone do it.

I think we need to look to the history of the church, what the apostles taught and what other popes have had to say in the past if we have questions concerning a pope. I question some of the things the current pope does. There has been and still is a struggle within the church between those who would destroy it and those who are working to defend and preserve the teachings of Jesus Christ.

Sparky
2nd May 2012, 12:59 PM
http://gold-silver.us/forum/images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by banjo http://gold-silver.us/forum/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?p=538875#post538875)
I think that Catholic priests are allowed to be married --- provided that they were married prior to becoming priests. Don't have a source on that, but I believe that I've read that somewhere.




Nope. If you adhere to Roman Catholic doctrine and that is what you preach, then to live otherwise is hypocritical. Practice what you preach. This guy was a liar.



The Roman Catholic Church does make provisions for married men to become priests.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=94635&page=1

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1226449/Pope-allows-married-men-priests-bid-attract-Anglican-recruits.html

chad
2nd May 2012, 01:03 PM
In like manner, God would not accept His people to pledge their allegiance to anything else. I believe He was so concerned about it that He wrote it in stone.

this says it better than i can:

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-worship-statues

JohnQPublic
2nd May 2012, 01:03 PM
As Sparky points out, the Church has allowed married priests. Celibacy is not an absolute requirement for Priests, it is a long held discipline.

And if any Catholics are worshiping statues, they are not following Church teachings.

goldleaf
2nd May 2012, 01:13 PM
I was taught that the statues or images were to remind, and make you think about the Saint that you were praying to help intercede for you. It's similar to having photographs of deceased relatives in the house. It makes you think about them, not worship them.

StreetsOfGold
2nd May 2012, 01:22 PM
The one thing that Israel was told by God more than anything else was to destroy the images (idols) of the heather and NOT worship idols which they did time and time again.
Over and over again you read verses like this >>

Exodus 23:24 Thou shalt not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do after their works: but thou shalt utterly overthrow them, and quite break down their images.
Leviticus 26:1 Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the LORD your God. (doesn't even say worship...just bow down to it)
Deuteronomy 7:5 But thus shall ye deal with them; ye shall destroy their altars, and break down their images, and cut down their groves, and burn their graven images with fire.
Deuteronomy 29:17 And ye have seen their abominations, and their idols, wood and stone, silver and gold, which were among them:
2 Kings 10:26 And they brought forth the images out of the house of Baal, and burned them.
2 Kings 18:4 He removed the high places, and brake the images, and cut down the groves, and brake in pieces the brasen serpent that Moses had made: for unto those days the children of Israel did burn incense to it: and he called it Nehushtan.
1 Kings 15:12 And he took away the sodomites out of the land, and removed all the idols that his fathers had made. (Note: sodomy associated with idols)
2 Kings 17:12 For they served idols, whereof the LORD had said unto them, Ye shall not do this thing.
Psalms 106:36 And they served their idols: which were a snare unto them. (Key verse: an idol is a snare)
Psalms 135:15 The idols of the heathen are silver and gold, the work of men's hands.

This is just a small sampling of how much God mentioned idols and images and NOT to fool with them.
A Catholic today may say "Well, our church doesn't worship them" That may be the case but
1) you are disobeying God by even having them.
2) It is an object to "snare" you at the approiate time and there have been many cases in a Catholic church where the "idol" is indeed worshipped
3) it is the setting up the stage for the practice of doing so and getting you prepared for the Anti-Christ who WILL cause all to WORSHIP his IMAGE

Revelation 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

Sparky
2nd May 2012, 02:24 PM
I was taught that the statues or images were to remind, and make you think about the Saint that you were praying to help intercede for you. It's similar to having photographs of deceased relatives in the house. It makes you think about them, not worship them.

Actually, the very idea that you'd need a Saint to intercede on your behalf is another very Catholic notion. The bible implies no intercession is necessary. Why would it be? He's omnipotent and omniscient, right?

The other point here is that the Catholic church may have legal explanations about things like idols being mere "reminders", but in practice, these are often overshadowed by what's really in the prayer's heart. You say it's a reminder, but just see what the reaction from Catholics would be if you were to desecrate one of these "reminders".

And there are lots of these inconsistencies that show up within the Catholic church, which is why critics get so emotional about it. Another example is the scriptural directive that "you should call no man on earth father." Yet priests are called father. Their answer would be that clearly Christ didn't mean for us not to call a male parent father. True, but just as clearly, his comment was in a worshiping context.

I attend a Catholic church, but I certainly understand how these types of issues reek of scriptural conflict to non-Catholics.

JohnQPublic
2nd May 2012, 02:24 PM
"...A Catholic today may say "Well, our church doesn't worship them" That may be the case but
1) you are disobeying God by even having them..."

Streets of Gold- do you have a picture of your mom?

goldleaf
2nd May 2012, 02:36 PM
Christ came and everything is new. Although the old testament has historical value, The new testament did away with the old ways of thinking, ( eating pork, lobster, animals without a cloven hoof, women never cutting their hair etc.). Actually there shouldn't even be a jewish religion anymore after the coming of Christ.

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 03:00 PM
this says it better than i can:

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-worship-statues


I started to put together some answers and research this for you.... but I realize that it will make no difference. You can worship and pretend not to worship anything you want. It is your choice.

How is it that the god of the catholics is so whimsical that it is a deadly sin for a priest to marry and then one day it is ok if he was already married? And if it is ok for a married man to become a priest, why can't a priest also take a wife? Couldn't he just quit the church, get married, and join back up again? Either it is wrong or it is not.

It was a sin to eat meat on Friday and then it was not. All sin must be forgiven through a priest in confession and that priest gets his authority from the pope. If you are a catholic, the pope stands between you and God.

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 03:02 PM
Christ came and everything is new. Although the old testament has historical value, The new testament did away with the old ways of thinking, ( eating pork, lobster, animals without a cloven hoof, women never cutting their hair etc.). Actually there shouldn't even be a jewish religion anymore after the coming of Christ.

There is no longer a temple as a building since the indwelling Spirit makes the believer a temple. Those who think they can decorate a church building like a temple - a meeting place with God- are deceived and lack the Spirit.

Serpo
2nd May 2012, 04:24 PM
God dwells within every man and if you go to worship him you worship a part of yourself..............not from teachings but direct experience................

Spectrism
2nd May 2012, 07:55 PM
God dwells within every man and if you go to worship him you worship a part of yourself..............not from teachings but direct experience................

Then there is no God. Either God is a separate and personal being with a personality or he is a universal energy or life force. The personal being that inspired the prophets- moving them into writing what they did- said specifically that He was not in fallen mankind and sent His messiah to dwell among us.

Santa
3rd May 2012, 06:57 AM
Then there is no God. Either God is a separate and personal being with a personality or he is a universal energy or life force. The personal being that inspired the prophets- moving them into writing what they did- said specifically that He was not in fallen mankind and sent His messiah to dwell among us.

What is indwelling Spirit?

Awoke
3rd May 2012, 07:27 AM
I have posted on this before.

Christ only found two Churches to be without fault.





So then let's look at a significant difference in what Jesus had to say to the 7 Churches that Jesus addressed through John:

Ephesus:
He finds good work and praises their efforts, and He finds bad and scolds their misdeeds. (Rev2:4)

Smyrna:
He finds good work and praises their efforts, and warns them against the synagoue of Satan (Rev2:9)

Pergamum:
He finds good work and praises their efforts, and He finds bad and scolds their misdeeds. (Rev2:14)

Thyatira:
He finds good work and praises their efforts, and He finds Jezebel teaching immorality. (Rev2:20)

Sardis:
He does not find too much of good work, except for a few, and He finds bad and scolds their misdeeds. (Rev3:1)

Philadelphia:
He finds good work. The Lord mentions no fault in this Church. (Rev 3:7)

Laodicea:
This Church is found neither cold nor hot, but Lukewarm, and the Lord says they will be spit out as a result. (Rev 3:140


So then, where are these Churches now? The Catholic Church is not perfect, but then neither is Baptist, Pentacostal, Lutheran, or whatever other label you want to put on it. Simply put, none of the current modern day Churches are the Church of Smyrna or Philadelphia, and whether you like it or not, those are the only two Churches that Jesus Christ Himself addressed and found no fault in.

As I Christian, I find strength in this knowledge. I attend a Catholic Church, but I don't consider myself a "Catholic".
I am a "Christian". I am not a "Protestant" or anything else.
I love Jesus, and Jesus Christ is my Lord, and my faith needs no label put on it, nor do I need other people to agree with me. My faith has been steered and shaped by the Lord through Prayer, Scripture and friends/angels that the Lord has put in my life to help me along the way as I seek the truth.



I attend a Catholic Church, but I do not buy into the dogma. The reason is simple: The Catholic Church claims to be infallible.

If the Catholic Church was infallible, there would be no such thing as an anti-pope (of which there are many), excommunicated 5th columnists, etc. The very fact that the Catholic Church has had satanic imposters elected into position as pope, only to excommunicate him and redact all his canons, shows that it is fallible. Nowhere in the scriptures does Jesus tell me to pray the rosary, so I don't. I don't venerate anyone but God. I don't ask Angels or Saints to pray for me. In fact, I ask Christ to send His angels when I need them.

I am at a point in my faith that I don't believe there is a single Church that Jesus would look at and approve of, like He did with Philadelphia or Smyrna.

sirgonzo420
3rd May 2012, 10:40 AM
Then there is no God. Either God is a separate and personal being with a personality or he is a universal energy or life force. The personal being that inspired the prophets- moving them into writing what they did- said specifically that He was not in fallen mankind and sent His messiah to dwell among us.


"the Kingdom of God is within you..."

Sparky
3rd May 2012, 01:58 PM
"the Kingdom of God is within you..."
So, this turns out to be a very controversial scriptural quote, taken from Luke 17:20-21. More recent translations, such as the New International Version, translate the Greek as "the Kingdom of God is in your midst". Still other translate it as "within your reach".

Spectrism
3rd May 2012, 03:10 PM
There are two distinct terms to consider:

the kingdom of God
the kingdom of heaven


The kingdom of God is not bound by geopgraphy or political decree. Wherever members of the kingdom of God are, there is the kingdom of God. Those who are indwellt by His Spirit, having been washed in the blood of Messiah, they have been born into the kingdom of God. Their presence brings with them the kingdom of God. Such are born twice and no more than once to die.

StreetsOfGold
3rd May 2012, 05:06 PM
"...A Catholic today may say "Well, our church doesn't worship them" That may be the case but
1) you are disobeying God by even having them..."

Streets of Gold- do you have a picture of your mom?

If you are implying that I worship my Mom, of course I don't, even Catholics don't do that, but some do worship the Mom of Jesus, who BTW.. WAS A SINNER

Luke 1:46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
Luke 1:47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour.

Mary needed a saviour, just like everyone else.

Luke 2:21 And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called JESUS, which was so named of the angel before he was conceived in the womb.
Luke 2:22 And when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were accomplished, they brought him to Jerusalem, to present him to the Lord;
Luke 2:23 (As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord;)
Luke 2:24 And to offer a sacrifice according to that which is said in the law of the Lord, A pair of turtledoves, or two young pigeons.

If she was sinless as the Catholic church claims, she would not needed to have done this. Good thing God gave us a book and RECORDED this so that we can check on those that try and teach something contrary to what God said.

StreetsOfGold
3rd May 2012, 05:25 PM
this says it better than i can:

http://www.catholic.com/tracts/do-catholics-worship-statues

I won't take the time to critique every point but 2 of the main points here are the justification for statues (a newspeak way of saying idol or images) is the commandment to make images of cheribims. What they don't tell you is this is an exception and WHY it was an exception. It was for the temple and the temple on earth is a depection of the one in heaven so God made an exception for this reason and ONLY for this reason. They certainly were not there to be worshipped or (as the Catholic church might argue) to "remind them" (oh brother) of them.

The other example was also an exception, the making of the fiery serpent.

Numbers 21:8 And the LORD said unto Moses, Make thee a fiery serpent, and set it upon a pole: and it shall come to pass, that every one that is bitten, when he looketh upon it, shall live.
Numbers 21:9 And Moses made a serpent of brass, and put it upon a pole, and it came to pass, that if a serpent had bitten any man, when he beheld the serpent of brass, he lived.

This exception was for the sake of Jesus fulfilling prophecy

John 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up:
John 3:15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life.

and possibly the most popular verse ever written:

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This is a critical passage as it goes completely AGAINST Catholic church teaching.

The example is clear. Salvation comes from Jesus Christ ALONE. Looking to Jesus will save you, not doing the works the Catholic church decrees, giving grace as they taught me. Kind of like a bank account. Every sacrament, for example, you do gives you a deposit of grace into your (eternal) bank account and if you have enough you'll make it to heaven or perhaps not spend as much time in the (non-Biblical) place they call purgatory. It's an insult to the finished work of Jesus Christ to add anything to salvation aside from looking to him.

Look and Live

I’ve a message from the Lord, hallelujah!
This message unto you I’ll give,
’Tis recorded in His word, hallelujah!
It is only that you “look and live.”

Refrain:
“Look and live,” my brother, live,
Look to Jesus now, and live;
’Tis recorded in His word, hallelujah!
It is only that you “look and live.”

I’ve a message full of love, hallelujah!
A message, O my friend, for you,
’Tis a message from above, hallelujah!
Jesus said it, and I know ’tis true.

Life is offered unto you, hallelujah!
Eternal life thy soul shall have,
If you’ll only look to Him, hallelujah!
Look to Jesus who alone can save.

I will tell you how I came, hallelujah!
To Jesus when He made me whole—
’Twas believing on His name, hallelujah!
I trusted and He saved my soul.