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View Full Version : denmark just went negative interest rate policy



chad
5th July 2012, 08:28 AM
%0.2. coming soon to a bank near you. paying banks to hold your money. i think i'll go with PMs that just sit there instead.

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http://www.zerohedge.com/news/central-banks-helpless-denmark-goes-nirp-cuts-certificate-deposit-rate-negative-02

A few days ago we noted (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/europes-monetary-twilight-zone-neutron-bomb-nirp)that the ECB may well be contemplating the monetary neutron bomb, which would see it lower rates to below zero, ushering in a Negative Interest Rate Policy. Today, Mario Draghi cut such speculation short promising the ECB has not discussed this. Yet one bank which certainly has is the Danish Central Bank, which just lowered (http://www.nationalbanken.dk/DNDK/Presse.nsf/side/PresseDNN201216562/$file/DNN201216562.pdf)its Discount Rate to 0%, joining China, England, the ECB, and, of course, Kenya in easing, but also went one step further and cut its deposit rate to negative 0.2%. Keep a note of this: NIRP is coming to a central bank, and shortly thereafter to a bank deposit branch, near you very soon.
From Bloomberg:





Denmark’s central bank cut its main borrowing costs to record lows and brought the rate it offers on certificates of deposit below zero, as policy makers test uncharted territory to fight a capital influx.

The benchmark lending rate was cut to 0.2 percent from 0.45 percent, while the deposit rate was reduced to minus 0.2 percent from 0.05 percent, Copenhagen-based Nationalbanken said in a statement today. The move followed a quarter of a percentage point cut in the European Central Bank’s main rate to 0.75 percent. Nationalbanken doesn’t hold scheduled meetings and only adjusts rates to defend the krone’s peg to the euro.

“There’s no experience of how negative deposit rates will affect the financial markets and the krone,” Jacob Graven, chief economist at Sydbank A/S, said in a phone interview today before the decision was announced. “It’s a sign of the strong Danish economy. This is good. The opposite situation would be far worse, if the central bank would have to hike rates to defend the krone. We have a luxury problem.”

Denmark has stepped up its battle to prevent the krone from strengthening beyond its currency band as the nation’s haven status attracts investors. Danske Bank A/S, the country’s biggest lender, said last week it now has a risk scenario that envisages Denmark abandoning the peg should the cost of fighting currency appreciation grow too high. The bank doesn’t view this as a likely outcome, it said.
The liquidity trap has been sprung. Soon everyone will be paying their banks for the privilege of holding their cash for them.

General of Darkness
5th July 2012, 08:31 AM
That's insane.

chad
5th July 2012, 08:33 AM
i think it's probably time we all watched this again:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0nERTFo-Sk

osoab
5th July 2012, 08:42 AM
On par with the Swiss now? They have had a negative rate for a few months.

palani
5th July 2012, 08:46 AM
Imagine that! A penalty for accepting another parties debt instruments.

Uncle Salty
5th July 2012, 09:58 AM
Just one step closer to the collapse of floating exchange rates pegged to nothing but other currencies.

Gold will soon be in play again and will be repriced super duper high.

Freegold here we come.

madfranks
5th July 2012, 11:04 AM
Wake me when the lending rates are negative. Negative deposit rates don't make much sense to me, why would anyone pay the bank to hold their deposits?

vacuum
5th July 2012, 11:09 AM
Wake me when the lending rates are negative. Negative deposit rates don't make much sense to me, why would anyone pay the bank to hold their deposits?

Can someone also explain to me why the interest rates must continue to drop at all costs? Is it because the derivatives that the largest banks hold are based off of these interest rates being low, and an increase in them would cause these banks to collapse?

chad
5th July 2012, 11:09 AM
Wake me when the lending rates are negative. Negative deposit rates don't make much sense to me, why would anyone pay the bank to hold their deposits?

retarded?

edit: should have added "they're" in front of retarded as to not make it sound like i was addressing mf.

Horn
5th July 2012, 07:27 PM
It’s a sign of the strong Danish economy. This is good...

The banking business is good business, until the music stops.

Sparky
5th July 2012, 09:14 PM
Wake me when the lending rates are negative. Negative deposit rates don't make much sense to me, why would anyone pay the bank to hold their deposits?
It will be viewed as a service charge for the bank to protect your assets, in the same way that you pay a fee for a safety deposit box. People are afraid to hold assets on their own for fear of theft or fire. So for a small 0.2% per year, they can "insure" the safety of their paper/digital assets. Insane, right? Fascinating really.

Sparky
5th July 2012, 09:19 PM
Think what's going on here. A country with a strong fiat currency, relative to that of other countries, is at a competitive disadvantage in international trade. This is what a race to the bottom looks like. This is the reason to hold gold and silver.

(And nickels, for that matter.) :)

Horn
6th July 2012, 03:51 AM
Think what's going on here. A country with a strong fiat currency, relative to that of other countries, is at a competitive disadvantage in international trade. This is what a race to the bottom looks like. This is the reason to hold gold and silver.

(And nickels, for that matter.) :)

Apparently there's a number of different ways to get there, stopping capital inflows just seems counter intuitive.

Costa Rica just opened up more so (thru laws) bond purchases from the outside, supposedly interest rates are to hike...

When the price of gas starts to go down in the local currency something needs to change (is the meme) I guess.

Toll booth here went from 290 to 300 for 6 months, then back down to 290. lol :)

Hatha Sunahara
6th July 2012, 09:14 AM
Imagine that! A penalty for accepting another parties debt instruments.


It's actually a penalty the lender has to pay to lend the money. If the lender has a positive cash flow with a positive interest rate, then he would have a negative cash flow with a negative interest rate. They would be paying us to borrow money.

Or am I misunderstanding your point?


Hatha

palani
6th July 2012, 10:54 AM
Or am I misunderstanding your point?


Hatha

Negative interest means people take their money to the bank for safekeeping and are charged a fee for the service. Banks will never make loans free or pay you to take their money.

Osiris
6th July 2012, 06:02 PM
That is not how I understood it but I get it now. Who would do that?

Skirnir_
6th July 2012, 06:56 PM
Think what's going on here. A country with a strong fiat currency, relative to that of other countries, is at a competitive disadvantage in international trade. This is what a race to the bottom looks like. This is the reason to hold gold and silver.

(And nickels, for that matter.) :)

A race to the bottom will occur because of that orthodoxy i.e. devaluations are thought necessary. In practice, though, a devaluation merely subsidises exporters at the expense of currency holders, and is a net negative on account of the dislocation the former caused. If wages and prices were to readjust in light of a currency appreciating on a trade-weighted basis, it would be nominal deflation, but things would readjust on their own. Exporters, industry, etc. tend to be closer to power and thus will not hesitate to use legal plunder to advance their interests as explained by Bastiat.

Hatha Sunahara
9th July 2012, 08:40 AM
Negative interest means people take their money to the bank for safekeeping and are charged a fee for the service. Banks will never make loans free or pay you to take their money.

What you are describing is the bank's borrowing rate. The Danish bank here has a negative borrowing rate. France, on the other hand has banks with negative lending rates. When the bank's borrowing rate is negative, you pay them for your deposits. When their lending rate is negative, they pay you to borrow money from them. They can pay you a rate up to the inflation rate and still break even. If the inflation rate was 10%/year, they could pay you 10% on what you borrow, and both you and the bank will break even.

Why would banks make their depositors pay them interest to hold their money? Their deposits would shrink as people went out to buy gold or silver or something else that has a positive return. Banks need deposits to be able to lend 10 times as much money or more.



Hatha

palani
9th July 2012, 11:01 AM
Banks need deposits to be able to lend 10 times as much money or more.



Hatha

Actually they need assets rather than deposits. No money actually changes hands in a lot of so called purchases. Say you borrow $100,000. It never actually exists until you create it with your signature. Then the loaning bank makes an entry on their disbursement side and another entry on their receiving side. At the end of the day their books balance.

The money you think you borrowed ends up going to another branch of the Federal Reserve.

Nobody ever sees $100,000. All it is are account balances.

osoab
14th July 2012, 12:30 PM
On par with the Swiss now? They have had a negative rate for a few months.


I think the Swiss rates, if you can call them that, are more important.

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/pictures/picture-5.jpg (http://www.zerohedge.com/users/tyler-durden)

Swiss 2Y Rates Plunge To -43bps As All Trust Is Lost (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/swiss-2y-rates-plunge-43bps-all-trust-lost)