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Ares
19th July 2012, 08:02 PM
The subject of revolution is a touchy one. It’s not a word that should be thrown around lightly, and when it is uttered at all, it elicits a chaotic jumble of opinions and debates from know-it-alls the world over. The “R” word has been persona non grata for quite some time in America, and until recently, was met with jeers and knee-jerk belligerence. However, let’s face it; today, the idea is not so far fetched. We have a global banking system that is feeding like a tapeworm in the stagnant guts of our economy. We suffer an election system so fraudulent BOTH sides of the political spectrum now represent a hyper-rich minority while the rest of us are simply expected to play along and enjoy the illusion of choice. We have a judicial body that has gone out of its way to whittle down our civil liberties and to marginalize our Constitution as some kind of “outdated relic”. We have an executive branch that issues special orders like monarchical edicts every month, each new order even more invasive and oppressive than the last. And, we have an establishment system that now believes it has the right to surveil the citizenry en masse and on the slightest whim without any consideration for 4th Amendment protections.

There are plenty of pessimists out there who would assert that Americans are totally oblivious to these developments. I have not found that to be true at all. Millions of people are awake to such issues, and millions more are, at the very least, angry at the state of things, though they may not fully understand the source of their distress.

Only a fool would deny that a fight is in the air…

Though the atmosphere of conflict is present, we are indeed experiencing a pause, a breath, a quiet moment before the breach, and this is a confusing time for many.

We human beings have a very odd tendency to view our own species as inherently and irrevocably violent, or at the very least terribly flawed. However, for all the negative press mankind gets for being “warlike”, if we look back at history it is much more customary to find people desperately trying to avoid conflict, not provoke it, especially if there is an element of tangible risk. Wars are usually not fought by the general citizenry, or the men who promote the pursuit of hostilities. They pay other people to fight for them. If they were ever expected to actually participate in the same battles they lust after, they would probably change their minds about the whole idea rather quickly.

Most often the only instances in which common people take up arms and charge towards combat based on principle have been revolutions. Some revolutions are based on lies, and some are based on inspiration, but all of them require men to conquer their own apathy and fear of confrontation. This is no easy task, and it sometimes takes years or decades of social adaptation and organization.

The elements of a revolution are synchronous. They are like the ingredients of a boiling tropical storm. Each vital aspect of the event must be in place, or there can be no energy or direction. That said, if an environment is left sweltering and volatile, and this electric stew is maintained long enough, eventually, a tempest will rise.

The real question is; where is the tipping point? What causes a population to tolerate or ignore certain crimes by governments, but not others? Where is the line in the sand that if crossed, turns an apprehensively meek citizen into an “enemy of the state” ready to lay down his life against the very system he was born into? The answer is an intuitive and psychological one, rather than mathematical.

Colonial Americans suffered through numerous and mounting indignities over the course of many years before taking up arms. They attempted nearly every method imaginable to counter or reason with British oppression without turning to violent means. They exhausted every avenue, legal, political, and social. They held rousing protests. They decentralized economically and countered British trade controls. They constructed brilliant legal arguments appealing to the monarchy to embrace logic. They attempted diplomatic redress after redress. It was abundantly clear that they did not want a war. When average Americans consider the revolution that gave birth to our free republic, they tend to forget the long struggle that was necessary to rally support for a declaration of liberties. No society, no matter how right in their position, and no matter how heinous the tyranny, jumps directly behind the muzzle of a gun to solve the problem. Revolution takes time…

As difficult as it is to rationally gauge the exact moment or circumstance that triggers revolt, the intensity or build up to conflict can certainly be felt. That pressure is tactile in America today, and is becoming difficult to ignore. The reasons are obvious. In the past 10 years alone elements of our government have cemented into place the “legal” framework to:

Detain U.S. citizens indefinitely without trial under the guise of enemy combatant status.
Assassinate U.S. citizens without trial and without due process under the law, including the very clear requirements of the treason clause.
Confiscate resources, including your private property, in the name of national security and preparedness.
Take control of or eliminate all communications networks including phone, radio, television, cell, internet, etc. in the name of national security.
Unleash a swarm of unmanned Predator Drones over our homes and towns to make mass surveillance of the public easier. All without probable cause or the protections of the 4th Amendment.
Capture, collate, and monitor the communications of millions of citizens without probable cause or a warrant under the FISA domestic spy bill.
Declare martial law without congressional oversight and embed active serving military amongst the populace in a law enforcement capacity. This includes the institution of Northcom, which is a standing military presence in the U.S. whose primary mission is to quell domestic dissent.

Most of the laws and executive orders that qualify this behavior from our government have been tested, at least in a limited capacity. These abuses of power have already galvanized a groundswell of activists across the country, and I believe that if implemented in a broader manner, will instigate revolution. Where is the line? I believe the line will be drawn with these trespasses:

Any action that involves the standardization of indefinite detainment or rendition against American citizens will result in rebellion. The second due process is thrown out the window and the right to a trial by jury is revoked, there is not much left for a population to do but fight back. This includes pre-emptive assassination as well. The more often enemy combatant status is applied to get around Constitutional protections, the more exponential public anger and fury will be. Black bagging people will lead to war.
Economic mismanagement or deliberate derailment by banks has been accomplished with the aid and collusion of government. This has been made abundantly clear by numerous instances of exposed fraud, including the Libor Scandal, in which the private Federal Reserve and agencies within our own system have openly admitted to hiding the precarious nature of our financial situation. Any further implosion of the overall economy will be blamed on this fraud by a considerable portion of the public. When people’s wallets and bellies become empty, it’s amazing how quickly they will get off their couches to solve a crisis. If they can’t find justice within the system, history has shown that they will look for justice outside of it.
The institution of checkpoints, invasive technology like naked body scanners, and exaggerated law enforcement presence on a wide scale, will invariably lead to revolt. Dealing with TSA thugs in an airport is one thing; people fly voluntarily, and when they do it often involves a particular level of fear and anxiety, which can be used as rationalization for extreme security measures. Dealing with blue-shirts on the streets near your home, at the bus stop, or on the highway, on the other hand, is not going to go over too well. These tactics have already been experimented with on a small scale. I don’t care how sheepish the American people appear to be in this era; start invading their personal space on a regular basis and many will eventually respond with fists instead of shrugged shoulders.
Predator drone fleets hovering over every square mile of the U.S. is not only completely unacceptable, it is going to escalate dissent into the realm of revolution. Any society that harbors even the slightest morsel of individualism is going to think “expedient regime change” when flying surveillance cameras are buzzing over their shoulders 24 hours a day. Set aside the fact that many of these drones will be launched weapons capable. No government has the right to categorize the whole of a citizenry as potential criminals. “When innocent until proven guilty” becomes “guilty until proven innocent”, revolutions become inevitable.
Martial Law is an impractical solution to any national crisis. The Founding Fathers understood this well, which is why they specifically opposed the use of standing armies, especially in peace time. Under the Constitution, the private citizenry was supposed to be the disaster reaction force, not government paid centurions. There were multiple reasons behind this position. First, military troops are not trained for and do not have the capacity to police a domestic population (especially their own) in a practical manner. They are trained to do one thing; dominate an enemy. Second, the citizens within a particular state or county would have a much better understanding of that region’s needs and complexities. A military composed of mostly unfamiliar outsiders would not know or care about how a local system operates, and would instead try to impose its own one-size-fits-all methodology. Finally, as apathetic as many people seem, they still do not like to feel bullied or subjugated. Being surrounded by armed troops at every turn with the executive granted legal authority to detain or kill without verifiable cause would make any man a little perturbed. I do not believe many in the U.S. will quietly accept a martial law scenario, regardless of the excuse given by government (terrorism, economic disaster, foreign war, etc.). A move towards military administration of domestic affairs will lead to revolution.

The internal strife of a nation is not predicated on the transitory moods of its people but the attitude of its government. Revolutions are not waged by happy men in an honorable land. True revolutions are a product of generations of discontent stemming from dishonest and vicious bureaucracy. An establishment government facing a wave of discord from the masses has, in most cases, done something to deserve it. I, like many, do not relish the idea of a new American revolt, but if I am to be honest in the face of the facts, I have to acknowledge that the potential for one within my lifetime is significant. I also can’t say that it is not necessary. Unless tomorrow brings a miraculous shift in current totalitarian trends, revolution may be all we have left…

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/guest-post-where-line-revolution

BabushkaLady
19th July 2012, 08:09 PM
That's a darn good question!

Golden
19th July 2012, 08:56 PM
The power is on and food on the shelves.

General of Darkness
19th July 2012, 09:42 PM
Interesting topic.

My perception of it really has a TON of layers.

The first thing that people need to remember. The next revolution that's fought, if it's ever fought isn't going to just against the guberment, it will be against the system.

So what is the system.

1 - Guberment and all the layers of people that work for them, it's massive.
2 - Affirmative action idiots
3 - Unions

I can't stress this enough and if there's one thing I can ingrain into the minds of people is that the human works in THEIR interests. So in the future the revolution will be fought against the postman, the school bus driver, i.e. everyone that's vested into the system. I wish I had the numbers, but if I were to take a stab at it, it's probably 10 - 15 million people, and I might be completely wrong. Just something to think about.

Skirnir_
19th July 2012, 10:09 PM
Federal employees number about 2m, state and local about 16m. 15M was within 20%, not bad for a stab.

Yet, 18m is merely the tip of the iceberg. The various positions that exist but for the system's coffers number in the tens of millions, especially given the regime's tentacles in medicine, automotive, and defence contractors, must also be counted, for their interests would be trampled upon by regime change.

The circumstances of the United States are unique in history. That does not change the underlying principles by which regimes change, only the attributes of the various composite pieces by which it operates. Think of it as changing the movement of the various chess pieces, though the underlying principles of strategy remain the same.

Plato sheds light on this matter: in The Republic, he explains how democracy passes into despotism. There is a bifurcation into a class that is organised and becomes wealthy, and the disorganised and disinterested. The former class become despotic and a revolt takes place among the latter, their leader becoming a despot.

The strategy that presents itself would be to become the most organised group, though covertly so, among the rabble so that you might pick the next despot.

Shami-Amourae
19th July 2012, 10:22 PM
I have no faith in the American people too revolt. Once Collectivism sets in, it pretty much stays for generations. I would expect to see America under at least a 100 years of Communism. My only hope is some regions of the US will break off and form their own Republics. Americans love to be slaves. The people who care about liberty are a small handful who are on YouTube and a few Internet forums. The Collectivists will vote in the next dictator to promise them a free lunch since these people are fucking retarded and retarded people outnumber intelligent people. The White population has dropped significantly and I highly doubt we can reverse the trend.

Ann Barnhardt did a history lesson on France. She talks about how Individualism/morality died in France and it never recovered. I think this is probably what will happen in America.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaMLoLtFn6s

Collectivism is an idea prevalent of people who live in cities. Literally I think our only hope is complete collapse since then it will force people out of the cities, back to reality. I think if they can hold together things and prevent collapse, we are fucked. All they have to do is keep the lights on and food on the shelves. (Un)fortunately I don't think that is THAT hard to do.

Osiris
19th July 2012, 10:47 PM
No government has the right to categorize the whole of a citizenry as potential criminals. “When innocent until proven guilty” becomes “guilty until proven innocent”, revolutions become inevitable.

Well then, I guess we are about due....

This is an optimistic view... IMHO

Twisted Titan
20th July 2012, 01:25 AM
It varies for each person............some of us can eat a whole lot sh!t , some very little.

If I had to hazard a guess on my own moment of Truth. it would have to be the point at which I dont feel like I can talk my way outta of a jam with the local jackboot. When verbally stroking his ego and feigning submission is not enough. That is when I suppose things are going to get hairy for me

palani
20th July 2012, 04:09 AM
Like revolution ... a donut has no middle and no end.

Santa
20th July 2012, 05:47 AM
It's not yet time for a revolution.

I'm waiting till technology catches up so I can have my brain scraped out and
transplanted into a super cool robot like this one.

3218



Oops! No wait... I mean like this one. :)

3217

iOWNme
20th July 2012, 10:48 AM
Where Is The Line For Revolution?

About 10 million lines behind us.

If you have to ask where the line is, you've already lost your Liberty. Time to go back to the original line and DEFEND IT.




The line 'should' be drawn at Private Property. Something that we have all never experienced. This is why it is so hard to see the line.

JDRock
20th July 2012, 10:53 AM
the line was the civil war. The good guys lost.

Tumbleweed
20th July 2012, 04:13 PM
Here's a pretty good rant by Greg Evenson on raising some hell because of what's been going on in this country.

I don't know why this copied the way it did. Click on the link and it's easier to read.

http://www.theheartlandusa.com/editorials/2012/ge_010812.htm





RESISTANCE OR APATHY--VICTORY OR DEFEAT IN 2012

By Greg Evensen ▪ January 8, 2012







http://gold-silver.us/images/d60_.gif






Many, many times I have been asked about armed resistance to national tyranny, leaving no doubt that those who want this to occur are ready, prepared and anxious to do so. Still others are very angry, but unwilling to commit to anything other than their own arguments and a belly full of Budweiser loudmouth. Agenda warriors wave the flag for their pet peeve but are unwilling to use their real names for anything other than a “Facebook” entry. I have been insulted by patio patriots who like rare steak, but don’t like the sight of blood. “Do something,” they shout, “but leave me alone. I don’t want to lose my internet service.”
Keep filing your taxes, vote for the lesser of two evils, bitch about the price of gas, go to your do nothing church, watch the city council vote in one more Agenda 21 UN grab, send a donation to Human Rights watch and “Twitter” your life away. Then, write to me and brag about how you are doing everything you can to throw off the police state that has surrounded you. Devotion to stupidity, denial of truth, and deliverer of destruction has given you every right to be at the center of our devastation. Thank you for your clear dedication to encouraging all levels of government to strip you of every right passed on by inheritance from those who knew what those rights meant and paid the price for maintaining them. It all stopped with your REFUSAL to stand with the heroes of history and their on-going sacrifice to see to it that we lived in freedom and prosperity.
Police officers are telling me on a weekly basis that the ultimate confrontation between authority and the general population is the center of training. Lethal force will be used on a widespread application. The slightest resistance will be met with overwhelming force. Demotivation of the civilian population is their goal and it will be achieved quickly. Law enforcement expects surrender rates to be nearly 100% as examples will be made of resisters and no quarter given.
Military officers admit that they have been weeding out “weak” or overly sympathetic troops from the ranks so that order compliance will not be an issue. Congress enacted all of the precedent (unconstitutional) setting legislation to target you, persecute you, apprehend you, and incarcerate you indefinitely, for the crime of innocence, anti-government sentiments, your faith, your belief in the Bill of Rights, gold and silver money, natural supplements, buying raw foods, smoking, drinking soda, being overweight, speaking your mind, or owning a firearm. Am I exaggerating? You tell me. I cannot call a sodomite unnatural or a danger to my children. I cannot read Scripture on a public street without permits, and even then I am subject to arrest for being a public nuisance or disturbing the peace, yet gays and deviates march nude in the public streets---well, just because it is their right, you know.
I can be forced to take a vaccination, yet I cannot consume fresh, raw milk. I need six absolute proofs of identity to get a driver’s license, yet if I am an illegal alien, I can apply for and get social security within two weeks of my application. I can protest in the streets about gay rights, animal rights, tree rights, rock rights and predator wolf rights, but I cannot put a bumper sticker on my car that says, “Christian Bible Rights” or “Rights for the Unborn,” without being chased down, stopped, harassed or tasered by Fusion Center Cops, Homeland Security enforcers and corrupted Sheriffs.
You tell me! Is it way, way past time to resist or isn’t it? Have you come to a turning point or not? Have you surrendered to the government’s steel fist in your face or have you decided to pursue liberation? Clearly, the overwhelming evidence says that you will continue to do nothing what-so-ever to end this dastardly and ever increasing stranglehold on your country and your life.
I will not bore you with further examples and situations that you have heard thousands of times. It did not do any good then, and it will not do any good now. The die has been cast and I believe we have lost the struggle.
The government will continue to push you into the stockade until you simply cannot resist. They will eventually disarm you (the plans and strategy to do that are well rehearsed) and then complete the encirclement of America from within. People here will march up to the gates of the detention centers and asked to be let in. It will make all other subjugated people’s surrender in wars past look heroic. We deserve what we have done to ourselves. Do you yet disagree? Then show me a different America.
No new national effort is needed to get people together. What is needed is an agreement between the Tea Party folks, the Oath Keepers and many liberty minded organizations to dedicate what they are doing to an all out merging of efforts to pursue an “OPERATION LIBERATION” offensive as soon as local groups can meet to do so. A small contingent of men and women working with me over the past several weeks have committed to bringing this confidential plan into being. There are two or three methods to achieving this and it will require representatives from all of the state republics to come together for the framework of this effort to be revealed and enacted. The final plan has a state by state agenda that will liberate us from the tyranny of the federal legislative and judicial beast that dictates our lives and our destinies. That must end. We are engineering a solution. You must get on board. No excuses, no “let someone else do it,” no cowardly complaints and keyboard protests. YOU WANT A BETTER ANERICA, THEN GET GOING!
I will be speaking, by invitation, to Tea Party gatherings and Oath Keeper meetings across America by conference call, radio interviews, and in person public forums as they can be established. We are most serious about this and must move now to be heard before the fall elections. No delays, no excuses, no wait and see people need to be involved. This is, in my view, the last possible means by which open rebellion, bloodshed and chaos can be avoided, if it can be avoided at all. It is worth the effort I assure you.

mick silver
21st July 2012, 08:28 AM
never going to happen , as i write this our gov going around the world and taking control of every thing

Dogman
21st July 2012, 08:32 AM
never going to happen , as i write this our gov going around the world and taking control of every thing Probably right, there are more of them than us.