Geocentrism

[mick silver]

back up for later

[Bigjon]

Gravity is a push.

http://keelynet.com/gravity/wright.htm

[JohnQPublic]

Gravity is a push.

http://keelynet.com/gravity/wright.htm


Very possible.

[Horn]

Ahh yes, I see the universe is meant to rotate about such other monstrous egos...^ ^ ^ ^

[Neuro]

Bingo. The movie exposes them. A lot of scientists realized we were making this movie and decided to get on the right side of history. In their circles they are talking about the new discoveries. Cosmology is in a crisis, but they put forward a unified face, but it is breaking down.
Are you a producer of this movie, or are you working on the set? Why don't you answer my questions?

[JohnQPublic]

Are you a producer of this movie, or are you working on the set? Why don't you answer my questions?

I have been working with the producers of the film for years especially around the idea of geocentrism. I am involved in the project in more of an advisory role plus do a lot of internet work. Sorry, Neuro. I am not trying to ignore you.

[gunDriller]

for those who don't want to see the ad every time a new page opens, if you use a Flash-blocker with your web browser, there is no preview.

Firefox Flash Blocker -
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/flashblock/

[Dogman]

You also can use adblock and totally block the frame, Poof = Gone , and things are back to what could be called normal. (Whateverinthehellthatis)

[Horn]

5810

[JohnQPublic]

Anything that gives Michio Crapoo top billing is ALWAYS suspect.

He is liberal Globalist bootlicker.



Did you notice the propraganda in the trailer

Anytime they mention that god made a mistake what are the images that you see ?

Churches and Jesus statue.

What in the subliminal message : it is the christian god that is in error.

Here is Krauss (and Dawkins) in The Unbelievers. Lovely.


http://youtu.be/ZxDLkoK8vQQ

[JohnQPublic]

for those who don't want to see the ad every time a new page opens, if you use a Flash-blocker with your web browser, there is no preview.

Firefox Flash Blocker -
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/flashblock/

For the record, I am not trying to force the film on all of you. I have already presented it. You can take it or leave it. I put it there for passers by. Who can resist playing a youtube?

[Horn]

For the record, I am not trying to force the film on all of you. I have already presented it. You can take it or leave it. I put it there for passers by. Who can resist playing a youtube?

How about some Death Metal next week?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uRyaYkymJY

[JohnQPublic]

Is Earth the Center of the Universe? (http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/2672345?origin=Event+Broadcast&mixpanel)

[Neuro]

Is Earth the Center of the Universe? (http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/2672345?origin=Event+Broadcast&mixpanel)
Got bored after 8 minutes of self promotion! Synopsis?

[JohnQPublic]

Got bored after 8 minutes of self promotion! Synopsis?

It talks about the movie, shares some clips, etc.

[JohnQPublic]

Got bored after 8 minutes of self promotion! Synopsis?

Did you at least get past the promotions for Michael Voris (he runs the website)?

[Neuro]

Did you at least get past the promotions for Michael Voris (he runs the website)?
In the eight minutes I watched nothing was said re Geocentrism...

[Horn]

In the eight minutes I watched nothing was said re Geocentrism...

Egoic expansion is an integral part of Geocentrism.

[JohnQPublic]

Interesting happenings.

It started with Lawrence Krauss who came out and said "he did not recall" doing the interview. This prompted Kate Mulgrew (Captain Janeway), who studied the script for 2 weeks then read the entire narration into a microphone to say that she did not know what the movie was about (go figure)! After that there was a media fury including Time magazine blog, Huffington Post, PopSci, etc. During this other scientists distanced themselves. Max Tegmark, who was interviewed twice and had a consulting contract with the movie and a long email chain discussing the Copernican Principle and implications for it relative to the CMB anisotropies, complained that he and others were tricked into making a "non-normal" cosmology movie! Poor Max (Mad Max?). The producer was very disappointed, because he really liked Max Tegmark.

[JohnQPublic]

"The Principle" Has A Major Announcement To Make! (http://magisterialfundies.blogspot.com/2014/05/the-principle-has-major-announcement-to.html)
On Wednesday, May 28, 2014, at 8pm Eastern, on Michael Voris' "Mic'd Up" show streaming worldwide on ChurchMilitant TV, the Executive Producer and Producer of "The Principle" will officially announce our release date and additional particulars concerning our upcoming theatrical distribution!

Heads up!- we will also be addressing in delicious and hilarious detail the various claims which have been advanced concerning our alleged preternatural powers to hypnotize the smartest guys in the world into interviews so we could cleverly edit them into saying they are all geocentrists, and to somehow manage to have Captain Janeway read the entire script of the film into the microphone without ever having understood what the film was about.

Also, we will address just who might have…you know…sort of "pushed the button" on this comical media narrative, which spread throughout the internet in twenty four short hours.

Who was behind this amazing example of media buffoonery?

(HINT: It Ain't The Jews!)

Do.

Not.

Miss.

This.

One!

Tally-ho and away we go!

[Horn]

I think this is the first time in my life I've be afraid of asking a question. lol!:)

[JohnQPublic]

I think this is the first time in my life I've be afraid of asking a question. lol!:)

Be afraid. Be very afraid. --)

[JohnQPublic]

The Conspiracy Theorist Who Duped The World's Biggest Physicists (http://www.popsci.com/article/science/how-conspiracy-theorist-duped-worlds-biggest-physicists?src=SOC&dom=fb) Popular Science spoke with Rick DeLano, whose movie The Principle shows the world's most famous cosmologists promoting the idea that the Earth is the center of the universe.

[JohnQPublic]

OH THANK GOD: Kate Mulgrew Is Mad About the Geocentric Documentary, Too (http://www.geekosystem.com/kate-mulgrew-not-geocentrist/) All you people who called her "too stupid to live" should probably apologize.

6352

"Yesterday, we ended the day on a major bummer when we learned that Kate Mulgrew, the actor best known for playing Captain Kathryn Janeway in Star Trek: Voyager, would be narrating a documentary backed by geocentrists and Holocaust deniers. Today, she’s set the record straight."

[JohnQPublic]

I can tell you how Lawrence Krauss ended up in our film. He signed a release form and cashed a check (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/04/09/i-can-tell-you-how-lawrence-krauss-ended-up-in-our-film-he-signed-a-release-form-and-cashed-a-check/)
6353

"This week, The Raw Story created a small avalanche of publicity (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/04/07/star-trek-actress-lends-her-gravitas-to-film-promoting-idea-that-sun-revolves-around-earth/) for a forthcoming movie that was otherwise struggling in obscurity. Called The Principle, it has Star Trek actress Kate Mulgrew as its narrator, and it also features the participation of noted scientists Lawrence Krauss (pictured above) and Michio Kaku.


But it was brought to our attention that one of the film’s executive producers is a controversial man named Robert Sungenis, a dedicated Catholic who is convinced that his church was right and Galileo was wrong when they clashed several centuries ago over the ideas of Copernicus, the Renaissance astronomer who promoted the idea that it was the Sun, not the Earth, at the center of the universe, with the Earth revolving around the Sun. (Later, of course, we realized that the Sun also isn’t the center of the universe — our solar system isn’t even near the center of our own galaxy.)"

[JohnQPublic]

The Sun Revolves Around You? Narcissism on a Cosmic Scale (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/peter-m-j-hess-phd/geocentrism-the-principle-documentary_b_5162760.html)Huffington Post


"Lawrence Krauss, a cosmologist at Arizona State university who directs the "Origins" project, discovered that some public-domain video clips of himself had been co-opted for the film. He was less tactful in describing Sungenis' geocentrism and holocaust denial: "It is tempting to say that both claims are obscene nonsense, but I believe that does a disservice to the word 'nonsense'."

Note the bolded statement is an outright lie. JQP

[JohnQPublic]

The Rachel Maddow Show (http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show) / The MaddowBlog (http://www.msnbc.com/maddowblog)

This Week in God, 4.12.14 (http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/week-god-41214)
"By all appearances, the film is a pretty slick production, narrated by Kate Mulgrew (yes, Captain Janeway from “Star Trek: Voyager”). It wasn’t long before lots of confused people started asking why notable figures from the worlds of science and entertainment would want anything to do with this fringe “documentary.”


The answer, it turns out, is that they didn’t do so knowingly. Krauss, for example, wrote a Slate piece (http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/08/lawrence_krauss_on_ending_up_in_the_geocentricism_ documentary_the_principle.html) this week explaining, “I have no recollection of being interviewed for such a film, and of course had I known of its premise I would have refused. So, either the producers used clips of me that were in the public domain, or they bought them from other production companies that I may have given some rights to distribute my interviews to, or they may have interviewed me under false pretenses, in which case I probably signed some release. I simply don’t know.”

Several other actual scientists featured in the film soon followed (http://thinkprogress.org/culture/2014/04/08/3424505/kate-mulgrew-duped/), saying they had been misled into participating in the project. For her part, Mulgrew this week issued a statement through Facebook, forcefully rejecting geocentrism and explaining that she’d been “misinformed” about the true nature of the film. The actor added that she “would most certainly have avoided” the project if she knew the truth about the filmmakers’ intended agenda."

[JohnQPublic]

Kate Mulgrew Speaks Out Against Geocentrism Film (http://trekcore.com/blog/2014/04/kate-mulgrew-speaks-out-against-geocentrism-film/)TrekCore

"Bottom line: nobody panic. Captain Janeway doesn't really believe that modern science is all wrong... she just booked the wrong gig. While her overall role in the film is yet to be determined, remember that when it comes to voiceover work, participants can often have no idea of the overall tone or purpose of a production outside of their own area of participation."

Of course, the fact that she had the script 2 weeks before, and read the narration into the microphone might have some impact on her knowing what the film [that she, ummm, narrated] was about. But, hey don't let facts get in the way of a good Trek story!

[JohnQPublic]

http://grab-media.com/premium-videos/5263489

[JohnQPublic]

The Cosmological Principle and geocentrism (http://johnhartnett.org/2014/02/22/the-cosmological-principle-and-geocentrism/)
"You may have heard of the documentary film “The Principle” (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/) written and produced in the US by Rick DeLano, which is to be released in the Spring of 2014. It features interviews with a line-up of notable cosmologists including Michio Kaku (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michio_Kaku), Laurence Krauss (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Krauss), and Max Tegmark (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Tegmark). Many are big bang cosmologists who support the standard paradigm, whose proponents hold to a worldview which assumes there is no privileged frame of reference in the Universe. Others interviewed hold to alternate cosmological worldviews, notably those who hold to the idea that the Earth is in a privileged place in the Universe. I am interviewed in the film."

[JohnQPublic]

Mulgrew’s Role In Controversial Documentary (http://www.trektoday.com/content/2014/04/mulgrews-role-in-controversial-documentary/)Trek Today


6354


"Yesterday, many Star Trek fans were confused when they heard that Kate Mulgrew was the narrator of The Principle, a documentary claiming that the sun revolves around the Earth.


The documentary, produced by Holocaust-denier Robert Sungenis, makes an argument for geocentrism, a theory debunked by Galileo Galilei hundreds of years ago.


“I understand there has been some controversy about my participation in a documentary called The Principle,” said Mulgrew, via her Facebook account. “Let me assure everyone that I completely agree with the eminent physicist Lawrence Krauss, who was himself misrepresented in the film, and who has written a succinct rebuttal in Slate. I am not a geocentrist, nor am I in any way a proponent of geocentrism. More importantly, I do not subscribe to anything Robert Sungenis has written regarding science and history and, had I known of his involvement, would most certainly have avoided this documentary. I was a voice for hire, and a misinformed one, at that. I apologize for any confusion that my voice on this trailer may have caused.”


Sungenis runs a website claiming that “Galileo was Wrong – The Church was Right.”


Physicist Lawrence Krauss cried foul in a Slate article, located here (http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/08/lawrence_krauss_on_ending_up_in_the_geocentricism_ documentary_the_principle.html), but unlike Mulgrew, he didn’t even knowingly participate in the documentary. “I have no recollection of being interviewed for such a film, and of course had I known of its premise I would have refused,” he said. “So, either the producers used clips of me that were in the public domain, or they bought them from other production companies that I may have given some rights to distribute my interviews to, or they may have interviewed me under false pretenses, in which case I probably signed some release. I simply don’t know.” "

[Neuro]

Controversy sells. What a horrid man that Sungenis, being a holocau$t denier and all... :) Gives it street cred, but I doubt it would be bought by the network Telavivzion channels.

[Santa]

The Cosmological Principle and geocentrism (http://johnhartnett.org/2014/02/22/the-cosmological-principle-and-geocentrism/)
"You may have heard of the documentary film “The Principle” (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/) written and produced in the US by Rick DeLano, which is to be released in the Spring of 2014. It features interviews with a line-up of notable cosmologists including Michio Kaku (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michio_Kaku), Laurence Krauss (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Krauss), and Max Tegmark (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Tegmark). Many are big bang cosmologists who support the standard paradigm, whose proponents hold to a worldview which assumes there is no privileged frame of reference in the Universe. Others interviewed hold to alternate cosmological worldviews, notably those who hold to the idea that the Earth is in a privileged place in the Universe. I am interviewed in the film."

"those who hold to the idea that the Earth is in a privileged place in the Universe."

OMG! Anti-Semitic Cosmological Supremacism...:o "Check Your Privilege". :)

[JohnQPublic]

Controversy sells. What a horrid man that Sungenis, being a holocau$t denier and all... :) Gives it street cred, but I doubt it would be bought by the network Telavivzion channels.

The movie will open in theaters. This whole situation is hilarious. These scientists are scared shitless at this point. None of them had any issue with doing the interviews, but now the cosmic writing is on the wall, and they are starting to realize its implications.

[JohnQPublic]

"The Principle" Has A Major Announcement To Make! (http://magisterialfundies.blogspot.com/2014/05/the-principle-has-major-announcement-to.html)


On Wednesday, May 28, 2014, at 8pm Eastern, on Michael Voris' "Mic'd Up" (http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/3016104) show streaming worldwide on ChurchMilitant TV, the Executive Producer and Producer of "The Principle" will officially announce our release date and additional particulars concerning our upcoming theatrical distribution!

Heads up!- we will also be addressing in delicious and hilarious detail the various claims which have been advanced concerning our alleged preternatural powers to hypnotize the smartest guys in the world into interviews so we could cleverly edit them into saying they are all geocentrists, and to somehow manage to have Captain Janeway read the entire script of the film into the microphone without ever having understood what the film was about.

Also, we will address just who might have…you know…sort of "pushed the button" on this comical media narrative, which spread throughout the internet in twenty four short hours.

Who was behind this amazing example of media buffoonery?

(HINT: It Ain't The Jews!)

Do.

Not.

Miss.

This.

One!

Tally-ho and away we go!

[Dachsie]

I have read Dr. Robert Sungenis for a few years and I find nothing to indicate he is a "Holocaust denier." I guess I would need your definition of that term.

Here is the January 2014 Mic'd Up show Dr. Sungenis did with ChurchMilitant.TV (Voris).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIqsVMQGoK0

Mic'd Up "The Principle: Is Earth Really the Center of the Universe?

_______________
Following fact referenced in many articles by Catholics in several places...

The Red Cross itself released it's estimates of all Concentration Camp deaths as 262,000 here: http://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6924&start=15

_____________

_________________

I had copied several of Dr. Sungenis' articles over the years but now the URLs are no longer working for various reasons as is the following. Archive.org does have quite a bit of the hundreds of great articles he used to have on his site, Catholicintl.org but it is difficult to find things on the Wayback machine in my opinion.

Dr. Sungenis gutted his website and basically turned it into a store of his books and tapes. I wonder if someone forced that on him. He wrote me an email and said he would send me any old articles I wanted but I did not take him on that. The poor man is under extreme pressure for the stance he has taken against the Jews, and he supports everything he says with quality bible verse exegesis. Dr. S. is now a professor at Fisher-Moore traditional Catholic college in Ft. Worth, Texas. He moved his large family (eleven children) from Pennsylvania to Texas. Good fortune for Texas.

http://www.sungenisandthejews.com/Section2.html

From Question #47, November 2006

Sungenis: "The documented records of the International Red Cross show that there were less than a few hundred thousand Jews who died in Nazi camps, and that most of those were from disease." (October, 2009)

______________

“R. Sungenis…. I have my doubts that it was 6 million, but even if it was
1 million, still, the point remains that they were a marked race by the Nazis. Hitler hated the Jews, not only for what he saw as a youth, but because the Jews had a stranglehold on European finance and banking for many years. There are some stories, however, that suggest these Jewish banking familes actually helped Hitler in his quest, since their objective was to ellicit world-wide sympathy so as to migrate European and Russian Jews to Palestine, their long-sought goal which they have, indeed, accomplished.”
(End of correspondence)
__________________

Sungenis: “every place that [the Jews] have beeen throughout history, they have been excised. Because they do the same thing every time they go in there, they try to take over places that they go to! And every time they do, people get wise to it, just we’re doing now, and they get themselves in trouble. And then they wonder why they’re so persecuted, and vagabonds across the face of the earth for the last 2,000 years – well this is why!”

[JohnQPublic]

May 28th, 8 PM EST

"The Principle" Fights Back! See It Live!

http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/3016104

[Horn]

Sales lesson #1


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NwP3wes4M8&feature=kp

[JohnQPublic]

I anticipate that some scientists who opened their mouths and said stupid things about a movie that they freely participated in (and got paid for in most cases) will feel a bit more foolish after tonight. :rolleyes:

[JohnQPublic]

The Principle - Under Attack (http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/3016104)
Spiritual Event

Date Wed May, 28 2014 5:00 PM PST — Wed May, 28 2014 6:00 PM PST
About The Principle has become “the most reviewed movie never to be seen by its reviewers” in the history of films. The sad part is, every review been filled with lies, accusations and insinuations. Some of these lies include such things as: “the participants have no knowledge of ever giving permission to use their names, photos or words in the film,” “the producers of The Principle obtained clips from Youtube, not actual interviews,” “the producers of The Principle duped the participants into doing a movie about geocentrism,” “the producer of The Principle is an anti-semite and holocaust denier,” and many other things. LIVE tonight, producers Rick DeLano and Bob Sungenis, will be defending themselves against these lies. They will be showing the signed release forms. They will also bring a copy of the script to show that Kate Mulgrew knew precisely what she was saying when she did the recording; She was sent the script for her approval weeks in advance of her recording in New York.
Links

ChurchMilitant.TV (http://www.churchmilitant.tv/) http://www.churchmilitant.tv/
Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/ChurchMilitant.TV?fref=ts) http://www.facebook.com/ChurchMilitant.TV?fref=ts
Twitter (http://www.twitter.com/bornforcombat) http://www.twitter.com/bornforcombat
YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/user/ChurchMilitantTV) http://www.youtube.com/user/ChurchMilitantTV
The Principle Movie (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/
Donate (http://www.churchmilitant.tv/store/donate.php) http://www.churchmilitant.tv/store/donate.php

[JohnQPublic]

From what I understand, there will be some amusing clips, etc. :cool:

[Shami-Amourae]

I've been looking all over the Internet for a trailer. Any idea where?
:rolleyes:

[Dachsie]

Watch live stream tonight May 28

The Principle - Under Attack

Spiritual Event · More event details ...

Wed May, 28 2014 7:00 PM CST — Wed May, 28 2014 8:00 PM CST

http://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/3016104

8 pm EST

7 pm CST

6 pm MountainTime

5 pm PST

[JohnQPublic]

I've been looking all over the Internet for a trailer. Any idea where?
:rolleyes:

Raise thine eyes to the rising sun... ;)

[Dachsie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8cBvMCucTg

[Cebu_4_2]

I want the movie not the trailer, any clue?

[Dachsie]

The movie is not released yet. It will be released in major theaters in September 2014. This delay in the release of the movie was caused by disgusting "Catholic" establishment bloggers - Mark Shea, Karl Keating and David Palm. There were "contract denials", "death threats," and other brouhaha. These three fake Catholics have done everything they can to make this movie seem like a Jew-bashing effort and that has scared the Hollywood people who are producing this movie.

The fake Catholic people, named above, who continually say Dr. Sungenis and Rick Delano the other person who made this movie happen are claiming that the whole movie is about "the Jews" when it is about the cosmos and has absolutely nothing to do with "the Jews."

The whole and true theme or thesis of the movie is that there is God and the Earth is very special and holds a very unique and special place in the universe, possibly the center of the universe.

Dr. Sungenis talks much less than the very animated other guest, rick Delano, because he has been under attack by the same "Church of Nice Catholic Blog-hysterics". He has 11 children and had to take a professor job teaching theology in Ft. Worth traditional Catholic College that is also under attack by other "Catholics." He still has his website, CatholicIntl.com, but all of the excellent articles he wrote over the years have been taken down from the site and some can only be found at archive.org, the Wayback Machine.

There was several minutes in the show where there was no audio but a good recording of the show should be available here sometime today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNV29nGPlAk&list=UUX17igkZ9JhU64JoTBVSWeQ

[Ponce]

I never worried about something that I cannot do anything about......I leave that to "The Force".

V

[JohnQPublic]

The whole show is available here with full audio.

https://new.livestream.com/churchmilitanttv/events/3016104

Robert Sungenis made a conscious decision to concentrate on things like cosmology and evolution as opposed to social and other Church issues. This includes issues related to the Jews. He hung out in circles including people like E. Michael Jones (and still does). He was under a lot of attack from both Catholic and secular forces fir his position on the Jews (including being named one of the Dirty Dozen by the SPLC).

The movie involves recent observation that call into question the Copernican Principle. It is discussed in this thread: http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?62820-Geocentrism

[Bigjon]

The principle is that people will "believe" anything.

Knowing is beyond these people.

[singular_me]

I have watched the trailer and read this this thread

I am puzzled: so earth is the center of the universe despite the fact that we have pictures of galaxies/milky way?

[Dogman]

I have watched the trailer and read this this thread

I am puzzled: so earth is the center of the universe despite the fact that we have pictures of galaxies/milky way? No problem, we see them because they are imbedded and part of the crystal sphere, that we are in the center of.

Everything in the sky revolves around us, we are in the center of everything!

;D

[singular_me]

duplicate

[JohnQPublic]

I have watched the trailer and read this this thread

I am puzzled: goecentrism... so earth would be the center of the universe despite the fact that we have pictures of galaxies/milky way ???

What do pictures of the galaxy/milkyway have to do with it? Interestingly, the signals embedded in the CMB are aligned to the ecliptic (the plane the planets travel around the sun) and the equinoxes (i.e., the earth), and NOT the galactic plane (which is substantially different). This is part of why Lawrence Krauss said (http://edge.org/conversation/the-energy-of-empty-space-that-isn-39t-zero) (in 2005): (my emphasis)

"But when you look at CMB map, you also see that the structure that is observed, is in fact, in a weird way, correlated with the plane of the earth around the sun. Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us? That's crazy. We're looking out at the whole universe. There's no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe. The new results are either telling us that all of science is wrong and we're the center of the universe, or maybe the data is [s]imply incorrect, or maybe it's telling us there's something weird about the microwave background results and that maybe, maybe there's something wrong with our theories on the larger scales."

Maybe not.

Of course a lot of people in 2005 thought it was likely instrument error, and they all looked to the Planck satellite, which had a much better design to be sure instrument errors would be eliminated, to referee. Note that Krauss interviewed in 2011, as did Kaku, and many others (2011-2012). The Planck results were released in 2013. Oops. No instrument error. Oops, what did we say during those interviews? Yikes!



http://youtu.be/U6_adWD5H-s

[singular_me]

I edited quite a bit this morning.


That would say we are truly the center of the universe. The new results are either telling us that all of science is wrong and we're the center of the universe

Maybe what the claims of principle documentary could be applicable to just any celestial object? The point of view of the observer being unique and the only one that matters in The Whole In One perspective...

in a way I can agree with that, but coming from another concept as I subscribe to the Whole Being One, and The One Being The Whole. In this theory, though, there is no center per se as everything is. Could the principle movie prove that Pantheism (the belief that the universe or nature as the totality of everything, God is the transcendent reality of which the material universe and human beings are only manifestations) be scientifically correct ?

If so, there is nothing new, this teachings have been around for at least 5000 years. And I believe this to be the only One World Religion threat vs Monotheism which regards God separated from his creation. Pantheism is endorsed by the new age movement, hence why new age is tagged as evil. There is nothing new with Pantheism... this new age label has no legs. But I surely can understand why Abrahamic faiths feel threatened, especially Judaism as it is the starting point.

does goecentrism claim that earth is unique, we are alone in the Universe?

[JohnQPublic]

I edited quite a bit this morning.



Maybe what the claims of principle documentary could be applicable to just any celestial object? The point of view of the observer being unique and the only one that matters in The Whole In One perspective...

in a way I can agree with that, but coming from another concept as I subscribe to the Whole Being One, and The One Being The Whole. In this theory, though, there is no center per se as everything is. Could the principle movie prove that Pantheism (the belief that the universe or nature as the totality of everything, God is the transcendent reality of which the material universe and human beings are only manifestations) be scientifically correct ?

If so, there is nothing new, this teachings have been around for at least 5000 years. And I believe this to be the only One World Religion threat vs Monotheism which regards God separated from his creation. Pantheism is endorsed by the new age movement, hence why new age is tagged as evil. There is nothing new with Pantheism... this new age label has no legs. But I surely can understand why Abrahamic faiths feel threatened, especially Judaism as it is the starting point.

does goecentrism claim that earth is unique, we are alone in the Universe?

The signals embedded in the CMB are uniquely aligned to earth. They are not aligned to the Milky Way or any other cosmic object or objects. Having someone like Lawrence Krauss say what he did means it is pretty significant. Max Tegmark, Dagan Huterer, and others have echoed this sentiment. Krauss' tendency is to bash anything smacking of the possibility of a God. Ultimately he is a scientist, and if he sees overwhelming evidence for something, he needs to be honest and state it (and to his credit he did in this case). Of course, (I suspect) he expected that the Planck satellite would demonstrate that the signal was an artifact of instrumentation or scanning errors in WMAP (as many scientists did expect, and in fact some labored to design Planck to not have these issues based on analysis of what could have caused false readings), but alas, Planck not only confirmed the observation, but practically eliminated the possibility of instrumentation or scanning error. This is very big (at least as big as the universe, likely even bigger ;) ).

[mick silver]

so john are you saying every thing that we have been told about the world and the stuff around us is all a lie are just wrong ?

[JohnQPublic]

so john are you saying every thing that we have been told about the world and the stuff around us is all a lie are just wrong ?

The picture of the universe that we have been presented is not what the universe is. What we see and do in our daily lives is totally unimpacted by this fact.

[Jerrylynnb]

Please overlook my relative ignorance on this subject, but would someone more knowledgeable please explain this in concrete specific terms and not philosophical, or consequential?

What I am wondering is exactly what was the CMB measuring? What was the Plank satellite measuring? (What is CMB)?

As I always understood the ecliptic, it is the plane on which most of the planets revolve around the sun (Pluto's orbit is a bit outside that plane), even though there are small differences in the planar angle for each of the orbiting planets. Then the plane in which the earth rotates is about 18 degrees (I forgot that exact number) off the ecliptic - right? Then there is the plane on which most of the stars in the milky way are orbiting (very slowly) around a galactic center. Are they saying that the galactic plane is different than the solar system plane? And what did the CMB (and Plank) measure that leads them to conclude that "the earth is the center of the universe"? That sounds like poppycock, since we already know the earth orbits the sun, and the sun orbits the galactic center.

If anyone here can get right to the specific details of what they were measuring and why, and how they jumped to whatever conclusions they are making that are causing such a fuss - please advise.

Thank you so much, whoever wants to pin this all down in simple, concrete terms.

[JohnQPublic]

Please overlook my relative ignorance on this subject, but would someone more knowledgeable please explain this in concrete specific terms and not philosophical, or consequential?

What I am wondering is exactly what was the CMB measuring? What was the Plank satellite measuring? (What is CMB)?

As I always understood the ecliptic, it is the plane on which most of the planets revolve around the sun (Pluto's orbit is a bit outside that plane), even though there are small differences in the planar angle for each of the orbiting planets. Then the plane in which the earth rotates is about 18 degrees (I forgot that exact number) off the ecliptic - right? Then there is the plane on which most of the stars in the milky way are orbiting (very slowly) around a galactic center. Are they saying that the galactic plane is different than the solar system plane? And what did the CMB (and Plank) measure that leads them to conclude that "the earth is the center of the universe"? That sounds like poppycock, since we already know the earth orbits the sun, and the sun orbits the galactic center.

If anyone here can get right to the specific details of what they were measuring and why, and how they jumped to whatever conclusions they are making that are causing such a fuss - please advise.

Thank you so much, whoever wants to pin this all down in simple, concrete terms.

Start here:


https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-special-place
https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-special-place/8b99ee2d3466
https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-special-place/26f88f17a732
https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-special-place/3aea2f3ed819

[Santa]

The more I read, the more confused I get. Could someone please just tell me where the coin slot to this universe is located so I can play the danged thing?

[Jerrylynnb]

Ok, JohnQPublic, I looked at those websites and the only one that had even a hint of anything specific was the third one:

https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-speci...e/26f88f17a732

in which they claim that the distribution of background radiation detected shows an "alignment" that "correlates" to the ecliptic (the orbital plane of the planets around the sun). Big fucking deal!

They don't specify in any detail what this "alignment" is, nor what the "correlation" is. Can we visualize what is bothering them?
Faced with an uneven distribution of background radiation, wouldn't one try to look for influences of our nearest star (the sun) as to how it might be affecting the readings?

How far away from the Sun was that Plank satellite - far enough to dampen any of the Sun's influence?

This sounds to me like a phoney baloney jewish snake oil trick show from the back of a gypsy wagon to an easily bamboozled audience - using the "awe" of scientific boogaboo ("alignment/correlation") that no one bothers to spell out in enough detail to even know what the hell they are so worried about.

Common sense, by ordinary farmers, can suggest that the Sun's influence on all things we can detect is enough to blur what you might find from a great distance from any star - especially if all you are doing is measuring radiation. Isn't the Sun spewing out radiation all the time, varying amounts and bursts and flares, and varying frequencies and even some not fully understood here on earth? Why would these scientists not be working their models to account for the Sun's influence on their measurements, instead of trying to make some philosophical end-of-the-world mambo jumbo talk to the common folks out here? I smell some kind of cheap-jew-trickery bamboozlement in the air here.

[singular_me]

still cannot wrap my mind about a theory asserting that earth is the center or the universe, unless this can be applied to any celestial objects. I explained why earlier. If not, sorry this is just another "earth is flat" delusion. Additionally, there is a multiverse... center of what?

a center also would imply that planets/stars move and spin at the same speed... impossible, only the galaxy is. All objects within it, have various motions.


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/30/Galactic_longitude.JPG


The Universe within 50000 Light Years
http://www.atlasoftheuniverse.com/tycho.gif

[Horn]

Why would these scientists not be working their models to account for the Sun's influence on their measurements, instead of trying to make some philosophical end-of-the-world mambo jumbo talk to the common folks out here? I smell some kind of cheap-jew-trickery bamboozlement in the air here.

They need to keep the Pope alive until such time as after the great leveling of heads,

so he can then tell all males Not to wear a condom again.

It is a wholly unnatural thought, and only notional to possible alien that everything in the universe spins while the Earth does not.

Weak gravity force alone would tear our condom that is Earth to ribbons. :)




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUspLVStPbk

[JohnQPublic]

Ok, JohnQPublic, I looked at those websites and the only one that had even a hint of anything specific was the third one:

https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-speci...e/26f88f17a732

in which they claim that the distribution of background radiation detected shows an "alignment" that "correlates" to the ecliptic (the orbital plane of the planets around the sun). Big fucking deal!

They don't specify in any detail what this "alignment" is, nor what the "correlation" is. Can we visualize what is bothering them?
Faced with an uneven distribution of background radiation, wouldn't one try to look for influences of our nearest star (the sun) as to how it might be affecting the readings?

How far away from the Sun was that Plank satellite - far enough to dampen any of the Sun's influence?

This sounds to me like a phoney baloney jewish snake oil trick show from the back of a gypsy wagon to an easily bamboozled audience - using the "awe" of scientific boogaboo ("alignment/correlation") that no one bothers to spell out in enough detail to even know what the hell they are so worried about.

Common sense, by ordinary farmers, can suggest that the Sun's influence on all things we can detect is enough to blur what you might find from a great distance from any star - especially if all you are doing is measuring radiation. Isn't the Sun spewing out radiation all the time, varying amounts and bursts and flares, and varying frequencies and even some not fully understood here on earth? Why would these scientists not be working their models to account for the Sun's influence on their measurements, instead of trying to make some philosophical end-of-the-world mambo jumbo talk to the common folks out here? I smell some kind of cheap-jew-trickery bamboozlement in the air here.

This is coming from mainstream scientists, and believe me they have been trying for years to make it go away, but it does not. Take a look at this:

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~huterer/PRESS/CMB_Huterer.pdf

[Dachsie]

I think some here do not fully know what the thesis of this film is.

From what I know so far, with the entire movie not being released yet, they never claim that the "earth is at the center" of the universe. I used that term loosely but they do not specifically claim the "center" idea.

I do not know much at all about cosmology, but their thesis seems plausible to me and I respect them for having the courage to put it forward. The authors of the film are being persecuted by the Zionist establishment including the Catholic Zionist establishment. The only thing I do not understand is the real reason Dr. Sungenis and Mr. Delano went to Hollywood and sought the expertise of the mainly Zionist film makers there. I can understand their wanting the material made into a very high-quality professionally directed movie, but it seems that is obtainable elsewhere.

Nothing good comes out of Hollywood.

[JohnQPublic]

See this, too: http://www-personal.umich.edu/~huterer/Papers/cmb_review.pdf

"(i) the four area vectors of the quadrupole and octopole
are mutually close (i.e., the quadrupole and octopole
planes are aligned) at the 99.6% C.L.;
(ii) the quadrupole and octopole planes are orthogonal
to the ecliptic at the 95.9% C.L.; this alignment was at 98.5% C.L.
in our analysis of the WMAP 1 year maps.
The reduction of alignment was due to WMAP’s
adaption of a new radiometer gain model for the 3
year data analysis, that took seasonal variations of the
receiver box temperature into account—a systematic
that is indeed correlated with the ecliptic plane. We
regard that as clear evidence that multipole vectors
are a sensitive probe of alignments;
(iii) the normals to these four planes are aligned with
the direction of the cosmological dipole (and with
the equinoxes) at a level inconsistent with Gaussian
random, statistically isotropic skies at 99.7% C.L.;
(iv) the ecliptic threads between a hot and a cold spot
of the combined quadrupole and octopole map,
following a node line across about 1/3ofthe sk yand
separating the three strong extrema from the three
weak extrema of the map; this is unlikely at about the
95% C.L."

[JohnQPublic]

still cannot wrap my mind about a theory asserting that earth is the center or the universe, unless this can be applied to any celestial objects. I explained why earlier. If not, sorry this is just another "earth is flat" delusion. Additionally, there is a multiverse... center of what?

a center also would imply that planets/stars move and spin at the same speed... impossible, only the galaxy is. All objects within it, have various motions.

The Universe within 50000 Light Years


You are making assumptions. You are assuming isotropy. This is what mainstream science also assumes, but they look for evidence to support the assumption. The CMB data actually hurts that assumption. From Hawking, A Brief History of Time (illustrating mainstream science's understanding of the assumption):

...all this evidence that the universe looks the same whichever direction we look in might seem to suggest there is something special about our place in the universe. In particular, it might seem that if we observe all other galaxies to be moving away from us, then we must be at the center of the universe.

He does provide and alternative view, though:

There is, however, an alternate explanation: the universe might look the same in every direction as seen from any other galaxy, too. This, as we have seen, was Friedmann’s second assumption. We have no scientific evidence for, or against, this assumption. We believe it only on grounds of modesty: it would be most remarkable if the universe looked the same in every direction around us, but not around other points in the universe.

As for the multiverse, that is really out there. It is an untestable assumption. The beauty of the CMB observations is that they are viewable and testable. Their interpretation is very open, but the CMB signal is clearly correlated to us.

[EE_]

Scientists can only begin to understand very small pieces of larger puzzle. Until they can answer the ultimate questions, they know nothing and their theories about the universe are worthless.
The ultimate questions are:
Why does the universe exist?
How can the universe be infinate?
How can something exist with no beginning?
How can something be created without a creator?

Oh, and Stephan Hawking is a shithead and a liar that has many people fooled.

[Horn]

The whole show is available here with full audio.

Why isn't anyone giving us a link to where we can view it from a pre-release Chinese dup recording?

Or is it still in audience capture mode?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYHwX0PlWAc

[JohnQPublic]

I think some here do not fully know what the thesis of this film is.

From what I know so far, with the entire movie not being released yet, they never claim that the "earth is at the center" of the universe. I used that term loosely but they do not specifically claim the "center" idea.

I do not know much at all about cosmology, but their thesis seems plausible to me and I respect them for having the courage to put it forward. The authors of the film are being persecuted by the Zionist establishment including the Catholic Zionist establishment. The only thing I do not understand is the real reason Dr. Sungenis and Mr. Delano went to Hollywood and sought the expertise of the mainly Zionist film makers there. I can understand their wanting the material made into a very high-quality professionally directed movie, but it seems that is obtainable elsewhere.

Nothing good comes out of Hollywood.

The film was largely independently made. It did not involve any large Hollywood studios (or any for that matter). It was made on a pretty small budget. Rick Delano is a traditional Catholic, and just happens to live in the LA area. He was in the music business previously (in finance I think). Rick kept very tight control of the content of the film. The only Hollywood guy involved is another Catholic who was part of promoting The Passion of Christ. It was a small enough production that until recently no one even knew about it. Now that it is going to release, more Hollywood channels need to be consulted. Rocky Mountain Pictures is an independent distribution channel.

[JohnQPublic]

Scientists can only begin to understand very small pieces of larger puzzle. Until they can answer the ultimate questions, they know nothing and their theories about the universe are worthless.
The ultimate questions are:
Why does the universe exist?
How can the universe be infinate?
How can something exist with no beginning?
How can something be created without a creator?

Oh, and Stephan Hawking is a shithead and a liar that has many people fooled.

Science cannot answer those questions. But they claim to try.

I think Hawking has himself fooled. But he is not stupid, and I do not think he is necessarily a liar. Many mainstream scientists want to maintain the philosophical view they threaded into their theories, and they are willing to believe a lot of bunk to keep it going (dark energy, dark matter, inflation, multiverse, etc.). They invented all this stuff and ideas to maintain the status quo. If they did not the big bang theory would have collapsed under the weight of evidence a long time ago. So, as each failure comes along, they invent something new that cannot be tested.

[Horn]

they never claim that the "earth is at the center" of the universe.

And when a quasar explodes on the opposite side of alpha-centari, the redistribution effect of gravity center in the universe makes possible those levitating gurus in India.

[EE_]

Science cannot answer those questions. But they claim to try.

I think Hawking has himself fooled. But he is not stupid, and I do not think he is necessarily a liar. Many mainstream scientists want to maintain the philosophical view they threaded into their theories, and they are willing to believe a lot of bunk to keep it going (dark energy, dark matter, inflation, multiverse, etc.). They invented all this stuff and ideas to maintain the status quo. If they did not the big bang theory would have collapsed under the weight of evidence a long time ago. So, as each failure comes along, they invent something new that cannot be tested.

Exactly! When something is unanswerable, people invent their own answers. Until then, nothing really makes sense.

[JohnQPublic]

They need to keep the Pope alive...

Sorry, Horn. A lot of geocentrists are Protestant, such as Gerardus Buow, Martin Selbrede, and John Byl. It is an issue of interest to all Christians.

[Horn]

geocentrist - egocentric

notice any similarities?

Luv you for our differences, John. :)

[singular_me]

watching but dont know if I will finish it as it has a "church" undertone.... Delano lauds the church for funding sciences in the past ...

they also dismiss the existence of dark matter in their thesis, what is in my view an absolute fail as it is the Aether that produces electromagnetism (and thus Photons, Light), The Aether is the "blood" of every living cell. No atom can exist without it. And that is why the Church went after Alchemy, as it is a science that includes the Aether in its theories. As a result progress has been delayed by centuries.

also look for: Geocentrism - The Coming Scientific Revolution, on youtube with same guys

ChurchMilitantTV

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIqsVMQGoK0
Michael Voris is joined in-studio by Robert Sungenis and Rick DeLano, to discuss highly debated documentary, 'The Principle'. Set for release this spring, 'The Principle', is a 90 minute spectacle of cinematography which presents the most compelling 21st century scientific and cosmological data. All of this latest research raises numerous questions about Earth's place in the Universe. Could our Earth really be at the center of the entire universe? Is mankind at the center of this vast universe? And if we are...why?

[singular_me]

that isnt true at all... because you are a staunch catholic you just dismiss early christianty, with the Gnostism and later hermeticism, all these questionds have been answered but the Church made sure to obliterate that knowlege during the middle ages with its witch hunts.

this knowledge is still there but since it is occulted, the consequences are disastrous for mankind

there is a reason why numerology/kaballah are embedded in the Bible

this documentary may well fuel fundamentalism. And if so, look no further: NWO



Science cannot answer those questions.

[JohnQPublic]

...they also dismiss the existence of dark matter in their thesis, what is in my view an absolute fail as it is the Aether that produces electromagnetism (and thus Photons, Light), The Aether is the "blood" of every living cell. No atom can exist without it...

A lot of geocentrists are aether scientists. Dark matter was invented first to keep Newtonian gravity universal (because it failed at the galaxy level without additional unseen matter), and was then needed to keep the big bang theory alive (since they could only identify 4-5% of the needed mass in the universe). So dark matter is not the same as aether. The very scientists that eliminated aether (when it was convenient to explain the failure of Michelson-Morley to detect the earth's motion around the sun) also invented dark matter (when it was convenient for them as explained).

[Horn]

When Earth in the center of your Universe, the existence or non existence of dark matter really has no relevance to matter. lol!

[JohnQPublic]

When Earth in the center of your Universe, the existence or non existence of dark matter really has no relevance to matter. lol!

Some may still want to evoke it to keep Newtonian gravity alive.

[Horn]

Something for you to toy with, Herp Derp...

A Goecentric view of the solar system


This page provides a different way of looking at the solar system. It is geocentric and shows where the Sun and all the planets (and the moon) are in the sky. It doesn't show the distances to the planets and so this version of the orrery does not have any of the usual orbit controls or centre object selector. However all other controls work as stated in the guide (http://www.theplanetstoday.com/help.html)

http://www.theplanetstoday.com/geocentric_orrery.html

[JohnQPublic]

Eating Crow: Lawrence Krauss admits he was interviewed for The Principle, BUT, they are antisemites, dinosaur & human footprints together, edited to make me a geocentrist (he has not seen the movie)... What a jerk. Then he tries to throw Kate Mulgrew under the bus...

Watch the first 8 minutes.


http://youtu.be/vkXGyy7M3gE

"...let it drift into the dustbin of history...", like Larry's movie, The Unbelievers

[crimethink]

I am very much looking forward to the movie The Principle.

I am a scientific agnostic on so many things we cannot see or could not experience.

I am willing to give the Geocentrism theory a fair analysis.

Official cosmology - which we are expected to believe - insists on a variety of assumptions that cannot, as real science requires, be tested and proven. I'm not one keen on "just trust us."

[Horn]

I am

I am

I am willing to give the Geocentrism theory a fair analysis.



Is it Fred Flintstone, or just Fred?

[crimethink]

Is it Fred Flintstone, or just Fred?

I do not follow you. You believe I am a cartoon character?

[JohnQPublic]

On Monday "The Principle" begins its official pre-release campaign.

Our Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, and website will be reflecting our just-completed staffing up under the direction of Bob Angelotti of angel com media, inc., who has put together a remarkable team to introduce "The Principle" to, first, the Chicago theater going audience, and soon, the US and the world.

Our distributor, Rocky Mountain Pictures, will be officially announcing our release date (October 24) and theater (Marcus Cinemas Addision).
I cannot begin to express my heartfelt gratitude to everyone who has stood with us through all of the amazing episodes this project has already gone through......

Believe me, the best is yet to come- in fact, it starts Monday!!
www.theprinciplemovie.com (http://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theprinciplemovie.com%2F&h=UAQG_zqsC&enc=AZMKcEiA9x1kXnz2ujsKID-mhYKZAySTdkXqZJ0nRVcuqT0uHM9pkrL6sKoIsARDBU2EF4PgX 2qe4zqTyM7yzpDEtJupqVY8hMEVBvizOhLXkJp8x7xtYJThLc1 85uPRGANIDk-unOpmvyf1hlzhpGcG&s=1)

Message from the Producer, Rick Delano

[Horn]

Does this mean the prelude will be removed shortly from this sites banner?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0FViwZmsGQ

[JohnQPublic]

THE PRINCIPLE - Rocky Mountain Pictures to Distribute Highly-Anticipated Documentary, Theatrically in North America. Film Set To Open in Chicago on October 24. Rocky Mountain Pictures , the distributor behind such ground-breaking documentaries as Obama 2016 and Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed, has picked-up the North American theatrical distribution rights for The Principle, the much-anticipated feature documentary which explores the significance of the Earth's place within the Cosmos. The film is set to open in Chicago, on October 24.
Los Angeles, CA (PRWEB) September 25, 2014
Rocky Mountain Pictures , the distributor behind such ground-breaking documentaries as Obama 2016 and Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed, has picked-up the North American theatrical distribution rights for The Principle, the much-anticipated feature documentary which explores the significance of the Earth's place within the Cosmos. The film is set to open in Chicago, on October 24.
Destined to become one of the most controversial films of our time, The Principle brings before the public eye surprising results from recent large-scale surveys of our universe - surveys which disclose unexpected evidence of a preferred direction in the cosmos, aligned with our supposedly insignificant Earth.
The Principle features narration by Kate Mulgrew (Star Trek Voyager, Orange Is The New Black and Ryan’s Hope), visual animations by BUF Compagnie Paris (Life of Pi, Thor, The Matrix: Revolutions, Van Helsing, Harry Potter), and commentary from prominent scientists including George Ellis, Michio Kaku, Julian Barbour, Lawrence Krauss, and Max Tegmark.
Tracing the development of cosmology from its inception (Stonehenge, the Great Pyramid at Giza), through the great revolution of Copernicus, to the astonishing new discoveries of Earth-oriented alignments in the largest structures of our observable universe, The Principle leads us face-to-face with the question, and the challenge - are we significant within the structure of the Universe, and, if so, why and finally, what does this mean for the future of mankind?
"The question of our place in the cosmos is the greatest scientific detective story in all of the history," states Rick DeLano, the writer/producer of The Principle. "The world has been shaped by two great assertions - one places us in the center of it all and the other one relagtes us to utter insignificance. Amazingly, The Principle is the first documentary to examine this persistent puzzle at the heart of modern science."


"The Principle is important picture that presents some compelling evidence about our planet and our place in our universe," said Randy Slaughter and Ron Rodgers, partners of Rocky Mountain Pictures. "As with Obama 2016 and Expelled, we are enthused about bringing a movie to the marketplace that will get people to rethink their preconceived notions about things and have the potential to make an impact on the culture. We are very excited to be working with Rick DeLano and his team on The Principle and we believe that the documentary will have an impact on audiences everywhere.”
The Principle opens October 24 at the Marcus Addison Cinema (1555 West Lake Street) in Addison, IL, with a scheduled national expansion to follow.
The film was written and produced by Rick DeLano through his Stellar Motion Pictures, LLC and was directed by Katheryne Ktee Thomas of In Ohm Entertainment. Executive Producer is Robert Sungenis. The media marketing campaign is being spearheaded by Bob Angelotti of Angelcom Media Group, Inc.


http://youtu.be/p8cBvMCucTg

[EE_]

I'm interested in hearing what their thoughts are regarding the universe being infinite and how something can exist eternally. Once they get those two nailed down everything can start to make sense.

If they can't, then everything they say about our place in the universe is not important, is nothing but a dream and fantasy.

Are we significant within the structure of the Universe? I'd say no.
Are we significant in God's eyes? Yes.

What does this mean for the future of mankind? More of the same, greed, evil and the slaughter of man, while the good bows to the masters of this evil.

Will this movie have the potential to make an impact on the culture? No...unless the producers make a strong case for all good men to rise up now and destroy the evil people that have taken control of our planet.

I'll watch the movie, but I'll view it in the same category as I would a Harry Potter movie, all fantasy.

PS. I will be happy once the movie is old news and the trailer is removed from this site :)

[JohnQPublic]

I think this movie could actually make a difference. Could you imagine the wake-up call if 100,000,000 people around the world start to understand that the universe appears to be aligned to our little planet? This is being indicated by the evidence, and to their current embarrassment, this is what top scientists are saying in the movie. I think they realize how much they said, and the reason this film came under attack is because people are beginning to realize its potential implications. Things are about to start getting pretty hot in regards to this film. It is not fantasy, and that is why some people somewhere are really really worried about its release. Please spread the word if only as a 1st amendment issue, because I assure their will be attempts to stop this film from ever being aired. Regular people, John Q Public and Joe Sixpack, are going to be told that they cannot understand this stuff, and that they need to be protected from seeing it. We need as much exposure as possible over the next month to be sure that our one big chance to get this film out succeeds. You saw what happened to Expelled and The Passion of Christ. One major "Catholic" apologist even threatened to contact "his friends at the Bnai B'rith" about this film. Robert Sungenis has been accused of anti-semitism and was even honored as one of the Dirty Dozen by the SPLC, and he is the executive producer. Rocky Mountain Pictures released both these films also. We do have the best possible group of people on our side (or really their own side, because they will profit, but that is how capitalism works).

Regardless of what you think of the film (and I assure you your view will change once you see it), pleas help spread the word.

I have seen the final cut, and it is awesome. From a pure entertainment value it is AS GOOD or better than Cosmos. In terms of content, it is infinitely better, firstly because it was not a monologue form one scientist, but a dialog between many top scientists, and also and most importantly, they were asked the right questions.

[EE_]

Is the film pro-God or anti-God?

Why would an Atheist be interested in a film about something that cannot be proven, or that they cannot touch?

[Shami-Amourae]

It's more likely we are in a computer simulation than a "God" existing.

[EE_]

It's more likely we are in a computer simulation than a "God" existing.

Or we are in a computer simulation with "God" existing.

Anything is possible.

[JohnQPublic]

Is the film pro-God or anti-God?

Why would an Atheist be interested in a film about something that cannot be proven, or that they can touch?

The implications are so pro-God that the atheists are scared of the film. Some of the interviewees state an explicitly pro-God message (including John Hartnett, George Ellis, Ronald Hatch, Robert Sungenis, Robert Bennett, John Byl and Martin Selbrede). The film will also appeal to some new age types because even if they choose not to interpret the evidence in an explicitly Chrtistian manner, they will understand the significance of the the cosmos at its largest scales pointing back to having a spiritual significance. The atheists will be drawn to the film by its cast of characters (Lawrence Krauss, Michio Kaku, George Ellis, Max Tegmark, Julian Barbour, Bernard Carr) and the smell of controversy. ALL will come away with a fresh perspective on everything.

[Ponce]

To me nothing is what is or what could be till it happens, everything changes second to second... stand or be at the wrong place at the wrong time and you could get a bullet or get wrong over by a car.....the fact that you believe does not means that it is........nothing happens till it happens.

In the Congo the Simbas just to carry a JUJU bag around their neck that was supposed to saved them from bullets, if they did die it then meant that they did not believe in their holy man..........the same way that a Christian carry a cross around their neck for "good" luck and to show their belief.

V

[Shami-Amourae]

Or we are in a computer simulation with "God" existing.

Anything is possible.

That's true too. God could be a janitor named Joe wearing a VR set (the Universe) on his lunch break for all we know.

[EE_]

The implications are so pro-God that the atheists are scared of the film. Some of the interviewees state an explicitly pro-God message (including John Hartnett, George Ellis, Ronald Hatch, Robert Sungenis, Robert Bennett, John Byl and Martin Selbrede). The film will also appeal to some new age types because even if they choose not to interpret the evidence in an explicitly Chrtistian manner, they will understand the significance of the the cosmos at its largest scales pointing back to having a spiritual significance. The atheists will be drawn to the film by its cast of characters (Lawrence Krauss, Michio Kaku, George Ellis, Max Tegmark, Julian Barbour, Bernard Carr) and the smell of controversy. ALL will come away with a fresh perspective on everything.

Someone has to stop this propaganda! There can be no God!

[Santa]

Please God, don't let Ben Stein be in this movie.

[JohnQPublic]

Please God, don't let Ben Stein be in this movie.

Nope. No Ben Stein. See, God does give you what you want. :)

[mick silver]

didn't you john work on this movie to help people be able to see it

[JohnQPublic]

didn't you john work on this movie to help people be able to see it

I still am!

[Santa]

It's more likely we are in a computer simulation than a "God" existing.

How can a computer simulation exist without a programmer, or a "God"?

Atheism tries to avert the paradox by ignoring it, or by assuming that logic will solve it sometime in the future
after science has accumulated enough knowledge,...

[crimethink]

The film is set to open in Chicago, on October 24.

Any word on DVD or Pay-Per-View (web) release date? Those of us in the rural parts likely won't be able to see it in a theater.

[crimethink]

Why would an Atheist be interested in a film about something that cannot be proven, or that they cannot touch?

Atheists typically believe in a great many things that cannot be proven or they cannot touch. Darwinist evolution, for example.

Sadly, this movie will appeal to people largely based on their already-existing belief system. If one hates God, one will be "offended" by this movie. If one loves God, one will likely enjoy it.

For me, this is something for me to further enjoy and appreciate the greatness of God's design.

[crimethink]

Someone has to stop this propaganda! There can be no God!

Everyone has a god: money, government, celebrities, sex, themselves. Or the real One.

[Horn]

PS. I will be happy once the movie is old news and the trailer is removed from this site :)

Praise the Lord

[Neuro]

I was interested in it in the beginning, but now I feel like I have been overexposed to it.

[Dogman]

I was interested in it in the beginning, but now I feel like I have been overexposed to it.

It does take up page space and acts like a landmine plus being annoying for us here while growing visibly older dealing with it!

But it also our dear and beloved slum lords sandbox, and we (members) are here only at his convenience and pleasure!

:)

[Horn]

It does take up page space and acts like a landmine plus being annoying for us here while growing visibly older dealing with it!

But it also our dear and beloved slum lords sandbox !

:)

That, and its in the form of an all seeing masonic eye.

[FreeEnergy]

There's clearly many, many unsettled things even in a trailer.

1. Universe and life is way different than we think - yes
2. Universe will run out of energy - no
3. Universe has become from nothing - no
4. Nothing is almost everything - duh, mathematicians have been saying this for a few 100 years
5. Dark energy - fantasy of folks trying to fix holes (now giant) in General Relativity theory.
6. Lots of Nobel prizes for secrets of dark matter - british scientists (now an oxymoron) are wishing to play this to the end regardless if it all falls apart
7. Universe created for us - no
8. Earth created for us - possible, by alien life forms, we may even not be their first take
9. We are the only life in entire universe - no

Watch, or not?

[JohnQPublic]

There's clearly many, many unsettled things even in a trailer.

1. Universe and life is way different than we think - yes
2. Universe will run out of energy - no
3. Universe has become from nothing - no
4. Nothing is almost everything - duh, mathematicians have been saying this for a few 100 years
5. Dark energy - fantasy of folks trying to fix holes (now giant) in General Relativity theory.
6. Lots of Nobel prizes for secrets of dark matter - british scientists (now an oxymoron) are wishing to play this to the end regardless if it all falls apart
7. Universe created for us - no
8. Earth created for us - possible, by alien life forms, we may even not be their first take
9. We are the only life in entire universe - no

Watch, or not?

The main theme of the film is the challenging of the Copernican Principle. If there is no Copernican Principle, there is no need for dark energy, big bang, etc. All the mythology gets stripped out. If there is no Copernican Principle, the tower they built over the last 400 years collapses, and we are back to our observations.

[mick silver]

so john do all the members here get a free down load of the movie

[Horn]

If there is no Copernican Principle, the tower they built over the last 400 years collapses, and we are back to our observations.

Who is this, they?

And if there is a "they" side, who is this "our" side?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-7BeEkYwgk


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqFc4wriBvE

[crimethink]

Who is this, they?


The so-called "scientific community."




And if there is a "they" side, who is this "our" side?

Those who prefer reality to "consensus."

[Horn]

Those who prefer reality to "consensus."

Reality is you're standing on the face of Earth, and Foucault proved you're rotating.

If Earth were center of the universe you would in some form be statically clung to the moon.

Though there is a distinct possibility that parts of you are orbiting around it.

[crimethink]

Reality is you're standing on the face of Earth, and Foucault proved you're rotating.

If Earth were center of the universe you would in some form be statically clung to the moon.

Though there is a distinct possibility that parts of you are orbiting around it.

I am not convinced of a particular theory of cosmology, though I think "the Big Bang" and associated claims are garbage. Earth is almost certainly rotating. And yes, the rest of the universe could also be rotating - faster. But nothing we think we know is certain. That is unlike the so-called "scientific community" that proclaims they do "know" when they don't or even can't.

I look forward to The Principle because it appears to be well-put-together, and, the "scientific community" is in an uproar over it. If it's nonsense, why fear it? Their reaction is religious fanatic-like in intensity.

[Dogman]

As it stands all science and any point of fact or theory is hypotheses and best guesses until something better trumps the current line of thinking! Two things that are certain birth and then death, and death (physical) raises the hotly debated but can not be proven nor answered question that is there something beyond for the soul or id !

Almost everything in life is conjecture!

imo

[Horn]

I am not convinced of a particular theory of cosmology, though I think "the Big Bang" and associated claims are garbage. Earth is almost certainly rotating. And yes, the rest of the universe could also be rotating - faster. But nothing we think we know is certain. That is unlike the so-called "scientific community" that proclaims they do "know" when they don't or even can't.

I look forward to The Principle because it appears to be well-put-together, and, the "scientific community" is in an uproar over it. If it's nonsense, why fear it? Their reaction is religious fanatic-like in intensity.

I imagine the film doesn't use their interviews in whole, but in part splice fashion to create an "aura" or bend the curvature of space time in the movie's pointed direction.

I don't view the "scientific community" being anywhere near a so called "towering" impasse, in fact everything is turning up and out to appear quite weak in most instances.

[Horn]

Almost everything in life is conjecture!

imo

Now you've gone straight from Worshipful Master, to Sitting Bull.

[Dogman]

Now you've gone straight from Worshipful Master, to Sitting Bull. ! ? scratching head!

[crimethink]

I imagine the film doesn't use their interviews in whole, but in part splice fashion to create an "aura" or bend the curvature of space time in the movie's pointed direction.

I don't view the "scientific community" being anywhere near a so called "towering" impasse, in fact everything is turning up and out to appear quite weak in most instances.

"Sound bytes" is one of the complaints of the "experts" in the film. But extensive editing is the usual technique when the interview is long, and the space is short. For any documentary or news report.

The "scientific community" has a core of "consensus" that is regarded as "science." It functions in a monolithic manner for topics that are controversial and/or impinge on traditional beliefs. "Global warming," Darwinist Evolution, and "the Big Bang" are examples.

[Neuro]

As I understand it one of the main 'proofs' offered as evidence that Universe would be aligned to earth is the background heat map of the universe, which appears to be aligned in a north and south distinct sphere. However I think the most probable explanation for the anomaly is the Suns magnetic field. I suppose the good thing is that every star system that have some quasi intelligent life forms could based on their observations assume their star system being in the center of the universe.

I wonder if other stars systems have Hypertigers at the very center of their system. Or are we in a unique position of the universe?

[Horn]

As I understand it one of the main 'proofs' offered as evidence that Universe would be aligned to earth is the background heat map of the universe, which appears to be aligned in a north and south distinct sphere. However I think the most probable explanation for the anomaly is the Suns magnetic field. I suppose the good thing is that every star system that have some quasi intelligent life forms could based on their observations assume their star system being in the center of the universe.

I wonder if other stars systems have Hypertigers at the very center of their system. Or are we in a unique position of the universe?

Sounds more like evidence counter to big bang theory, to which there is already plenty. I don't see it as any evidence countering Foucault's rotation, or anything there to even suggest a relation, or even as any sort of anomaly.

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6820&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

As I understand it one of the main 'proofs' offered as evidence that Universe would be aligned to earth is the background heat map of the universe, which appears to be aligned in a north and south distinct sphere. However I think the most probable explanation for the anomaly is the Suns magnetic field. I suppose the good thing is that every star system that have some quasi intelligent life forms could based on their observations assume their star system being in the center of the universe.

I wonder if other stars systems have Hypertigers at the very center of their system. Or are we in a unique position of the universe?

The hot and cold areas in the CMB are segregated by the planes of the ecliptic and the eqiunoxes.

[JohnQPublic]

Sounds more like evidence counter to big bang theory, to which there is already plenty. I don't see it as any evidence countering Foucault's rotation, or anything there to even suggest a relation, or even as any sort of anomaly.

The movie is not trying to prove geocentrism, only discuss evidence challenging the Copernican Principle.

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6825&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6827&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

Advance tickets to the documentary, The Principle are available now. Opening week starts October 24th.

Marcus Addison Cinema
1555 West Lake Street
Addison, IL 60101
(630) 932-0864


http://www.movietickets.com/movie/mid/193516/SearchZip/60101/ShowDate/24/SearchRadius/15/tstate/0

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6831&stc=1

[Shami-Amourae]

In other news, Christians discovered in Chicago.
:rolleyes:

[JohnQPublic]

In other news, Christians discovered in Chicago.
:rolleyes:

Look at the cast. This is going to attract more than Christians; though a lot of Christians will go see it.

[mick silver]

why is it opening in a commie city are their no better places for it to open

[EE_]

why is it opening in a commie city are their no better places for it to open

Maybe they're hoping some crazy God hating liberal will shoot up the place so they can shut down any other theaters from showing it?

[Horn]

Cosmologists base everything on gravity, string theory is a bridge to the electric universe. Plank's filters or any others will never be long or strong enough to filter out the feed line microwaves to our closest star, The Sun.

Watch her string out into a mulitiverse to try and explain how she is looking through the wrong end of her telescope. While her contributions are important and her science sound, she still hasn't made the quantum leap into the electric universe.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAL1-vzMvmA

[Horn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EPlyiW-xGI

[Neuro]

Cosmologists base everything on gravity, string theory is a bridge to the electric universe. Plank's filters or any others will never be long or strong enough to filter out the feed line microwaves to our closest star, The Sun.

Watch her string out into a mulitiverse to try and explain how she is looking through the wrong end of her telescope. While her contributions are important and her science sound, she still hasn't made the quantum leap into the electric universe.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAL1-vzMvmA
Of course everything she is talking about is nothing but pure fantasy. Great way of stringing up the best mathematical minds into a completely useless endeavor... Start them up by indoctrinating them in religious theories of mad men.

[Neuro]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9EPlyiW-xGI
That actually looks very promising after having looked at Part 1. Getting rid of black holes, dark matter and dark energy does it for me.

[Cebu_4_2]

Maybe they're hoping some crazy God hating liberal will shoot up the place so they can shut down any other theaters from showing it?

Did they shut down the batman movie?

[Horn]

Of course everything she is talking about is nothing but pure fantasy. Great way of stringing up the best mathematical minds into a completely useless endeavor... Start them up by indoctrinating them in religious theories of mad men.

Wait there's more, Repulsive Gravity & Miracle Inflation.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xoqgka2W7YA#t=1046

[Horn]

That actually looks very promising after having looked at Part 1. Getting rid of black holes, dark matter and dark energy does it for me.


The search presented in this paper targets mostly very heavy monopoles, which cannot achieve relativistic speeds. “With the null detection, we now close the window on a connection between such hypothetical monopoles and dark matter. The resulting constraints on the flux are so low that monopoles cannot constitute the dominant amount of dark matter in the universe,” says Sebastian Schoenen, an IceCube researcher at RWTH Aachen University. Following these results, only monopoles with a mass larger than the so-called Planck mass could be responsible for a large fraction of dark matter, but this mass is above the scale predicted by GUT theories

http://icecube.wisc.edu/news/view/202



Physicists create synthetic magnetic monopole predicted more than 80 years ago


(Phys.org) —Nearly 85 years after pioneering theoretical physicist Paul Dirac predicted the possibility of their existence, an international collaboration led by Amherst College Physics Professor David S. Hall '91 and Aalto University (Finland) Academy Research Fellow Mikko Möttönen has created, identified and photographed synthetic magnetic monopoles in Hall's laboratory on the Amherst campus. The groundbreaking accomplishment paves the way for the detection of the particles in nature, which would be a revolutionary development comparable to the discovery of the electron.

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6832&stc=1
Due to the fact that every whirl carries an artificial magnetic field (http://phys.org/tags/magnetic+field/), their creation or destruction occurs at the point of merging. "This means that an artificial magnetic monopole (http://phys.org/tags/magnetic+monopole/) has to sit on this point," describes Prof. Rosch, "whenever two magnetic whirls merge in the experiment, an artificial magnetic monopole has flown through surface."

http://phys.org/news/2013-05-artificial-magnetic-monopoles.html

[Neuro]

Seriously The Primer Field dude, if indeed it is his theory, deserves the Nobel Prize in Physics, but since his breakthrough contradicts many of the previous Nobel prize laureates he will probably never get it. But his work on photones (part 3) is just astonishing in its common sense explanation after more than a century of madness! Damn I haven't been this excited re anything in physics and astrophysics ever before. On to part 4!

[Horn]

Damn I haven't been this excited re anything in physics and astrophysics ever before. On to part 4!

Possible he was since compromised by tptb, tranquilized by payments or vanished. Maybe, He was overly excited about it also, and his press to put it into action was harder than imagined?

Nothing has come since as far as i can see. i don't think a 4th part is coming, but oh well someone else will pickup on it.

Apparently some theory was based on a Walter Russells work.

[Neuro]

Possible he was since compromised by tptb, tranquilized by payments or vanished. Maybe, He was overly excited about it also, and his press to put it into action was harder than imagined?

Nothing has come since as far as i can see. i don't think a 4th part is coming, but oh well someone else will pickup on it.

Apparently some theory was based on a Walter Russells work.
Yeah I just saw that 4th part was put on hold. I am disappointed about that.

[Horn]

More Primer Field structures...?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rENyyRwxpHo#t=80

[Neuro]

I
More Primer Field structures...?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rENyyRwxpHo#t=80
It looks that way! Where is David LaPoint? seems to have disappeared off the end of the Universe in a handbasket... Damn his work on magnetism, galaxies, pulsars, supernova remnants and photones is nothing but groundbreaking, but part 4 was on how matter is held together. Which was announced in the beginning of 2013!

[Horn]

Was following a post of his in a thread of thunderbolts forums.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=9221&start=45

I got to about page 7 and my brain suffered electrostatic discharge. :)

[Horn]

Bone for thread topic,



In 1926 a very ambitious ring interferometry experiment was set up by Albert Michelson (http://www.answers.com/topic/albert-abraham-michelson) and Henry Gale (http://www.answers.com/topic/henry-gale-astrophysicist). The aim was to find out whether the rotation of the Earth has an effect on the propagation of light in the vicinity of the Earth. The Michelson–Gale–Pearson experiment (http://www.answers.com/topic/michelson-gale-pearson-experiment) was a very large ring interferometer, (a perimeter of 1.9 kilometer), large enough to detect the angular velocity of the Earth. The outcome of the experiment was that the angular velocity of the Earth as measured by astronomy was confirmed to within measuring accuracy. The ring interferometer of the Michelson-Gale experiment was not calibrated by comparison with an outside reference (which was not possible, because the setup was fixed to the Earth). From its design it could be deduced where the central interference fringe ought to be if there would be zero shift. The measured shift was 230 parts in 1000, with an accuracy of 5 parts in 1000. The predicted shift was 237 parts in 1000.

Practical uses

The Sagnac effect is employed in current technology. One use is in inertial guidance systems (http://www.answers.com/topic/inertial-navigation-system-1). Ring laser gyroscopes (http://www.answers.com/topic/ring-laser-gyroscope) are extremely sensitive to rotations, which need to be accounted for if an inertial guidance system is to return accurate results. The ring laser also can detect the sidereal day (http://www.answers.com/topic/sidereal-time), which can also be termed "mode 1". Global navigation systems (http://www.answers.com/topic/global-navigation-satellite-system), such as GPS (http://www.answers.com/topic/global-positioning-system), GLONASS (http://www.answers.com/topic/glonass), COMPASS (http://www.answers.com/topic/beidou-navigation-satellite-system) or Galileo (http://www.answers.com/topic/galileo-positioning-system), need to take the rotation of the Earth into account in the procedures of using radio signals to synchronize clocks.


Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/sagnac-effect#ixzz3ExBBRneh



Speed of light illusion?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qy_9J_c9Kss

[JohnQPublic]

Interesting video on magnetism, but am not sure what it really means. As to Sagnac and Michelson-Gale, this is covered quite a bit in Galileo Was Wrong. Both are seen asn challenging reltaivity, and spporting geocentrism.

[Horn]

The movie is not trying to prove geocentrism, only discuss evidence challenging the Copernican Principle.


Interesting video on magnetism, but am not sure what it really means. As to Sagnac and Michelson-Gale, this is covered quite a bit in Galileo Was Wrong. Both are seen asn challenging reltaivity, and spporting geocentrism.

The observations with Sagnac and Michelson-Gale may work well to challenge Relative Theory,

while basing itself in heliocentrism.

[Neuro]

The observations with Sagnac and Michelson-Gale may work well to challenge Relative Theory,

while basing itself in heliocentrism.
hmmm... Does that mean they are no good?

[Horn]

hmmm... Does that mean they are no good?

Current Relative Theory is defined as much as "who" you are working with.

Most or all people these day are duelists. I am not, I finish the game before it is started.

Good and bad are consequential reactionary judgement opinions segregated by winners and losers.

1 and 1 is 11

2 and 2 is 22

:)

[Neuro]

Could there even be a current relative theory? CURRENT sounds far to absolute to be relative...

I took my driving licence when I was 18
18=3x6=666

[Horn]

I took my driving licence when I was 18
18=3x6=666

Uh huh, Uh huh, see is right there.. and all this time u thought you were behind the wheel.

Is just not so, Navigation has been provided for u by your conscious creator, and copilot.

I am willing to hedge 30 pieces of silver that he (It's) just as naive as you were at 18.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHDMy_O6WLQ#t=11

[Neuro]

When will it come to Sweden and/or Turkey? IOW, will I ever be able to see this? Get it out of my system...

[EE_]

http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/message-principle-producerwriter-rick-delano-people-faith/

Message From “The Principle” Producer/Writer Rick Delano For People Of Faith
Video October 2, 2014 theprinciplenews Leave a comment

Some ideas are so powerful that they have burned heretics, overturned civilizations, and turned our view of reality upside down.

The Copernican Principle is one of them.

This simple idea- that we occupy no specially favored or central location in the universe- lies at the very heart of the modern scientific world.

In fact, this single idea brings that modern world into existence.

Christians and people of faith generally have essentially forgotten the worldview of Genesis (be honest- when was the last time you really considered the implications of the astonishing last three words of Genesis 1:1?).

That ancient world viewed Earth as the center of creation; Christendom overwhelmingly concurred. For the medievals, Earth had to be the center of the universe, since it was the place of the Incarnation of Jesus Christ, of the Son of God, for the redemption of the lost descendants of Adam.

The story of how that view of reality was completely overturned is one of the most fascinating in all of history, and it is the story of our film.

You see, something amazing is happening……

The most recent and comprehensive scientific surveys of our universe are reporting inexplicable alignments of the very largest structures with supposedly insignificant Earth.

The simple question “what is our place in the cosmos?” has already overturned medieval Christendom with the Enlightenment; has already overturned the Enlightenment with Relativity, and has now returned to confront our most basic certainties yet again.

In the words of atheist physicist Lawrence Krauss:

“Could this be Copernicus coming back to haunt us”?

Some ideas are so powerful that they have burned heretics, overturned civilizations, and turned our view of reality upside down.

“The Principle” is one of them.

[crimethink]

I don't live near nor travel to the concrete jungles called cities. Any idea on when this will be available as Video on Demand or DVD? Very much eager to see it! This is one of the very few movies I'm willing to pay to see.

[JohnQPublic]

I don't live near nor travel to the concrete jungles called cities. Any idea on when this will be available as Video on Demand or DVD? Very much eager to see it! This is one of the very few movies I'm willing to pay to see.

I imagine sometime next year it should be out of theaters, and available on other formats. Let's see how well it does in Chicago. It is actually Addison, but that is pretty close to Chicago.

[Horn]

Some ideas are so powerful that they have burned heretics,,,, “The Principle” is one of them.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lu5_5Od7WY

[JohnQPublic]

Seven Interesting Facts About The Principle Documentary (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/six-interesting-facts-principle-documentary/)

October 6, 2014 (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/six-interesting-facts-principle-documentary/)

1. The Principle questions some of the most fundamental assumptions of our modern understanding of the cosmos. And some people are up in arms about it!

http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/MichelsonMorley-300x168.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/MichelsonMorley.png) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/earth-300x168.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/earth.png)

2. The scientists and interviewees who appear in The Principle hold to beliefs that range from Biblical literalism to atheism and everything in between.

http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Sungenis-150x150.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Sungenis.png) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Ellis-150x150.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Ellis.png) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Hartnett-150x150.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Hartnett.png) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Tegmark-300x168.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Tegmark.png) http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Krauss-150x150.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Krauss.png)

3. The Principle is distributed and promoted by team members who participated in Mel Gibson’s The Passion of Christ, Ben Stein’s Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed, and Dinesh Souza’s Obama 2016. Controversial film? No problem. The Principle has the right team behind it.

4. The Principle is narrated by Kate Mulgrew, aka Captain Janeway in Star Trek Voyager. Let the captain take you on an eye opening journey that is science but not fiction.

http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Kate_Narrate-300x258.png (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/Kate_Narrate.png)

5. The Principle, through challenging but probing interviews with top scientists, uncovers startling new evidence that indicate the cosmos at its largest scales is aligned to specific features of the earth. The implications of this are stupendous, and do not align with current cosmological theories.

6. The Principle lays out the history of cosmology to John Q Public using the simple unifying theme of the Copernican Principle. The journey from geocentrism to Copernican heliocentrism, through the amusement park like relativity theory and today’s quagmire of dark matter, dark energy and the multiverse become accessible concepts through the understanding of this key principle. The startling new evidence understood through these ideas has led top scientists to ask such questions as “Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us?” (Lawrence Krauss, 2005 (http://edge.org/conversation/the-energy-of-empty-space-that-isn-39t-zero)).

7. The world will never be the same once you watch The Principle.

[JohnQPublic]

http://youtu.be/izVCRpAFnn4?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA


http://youtu.be/Fk2Lgi3R4W4?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA


http://youtu.be/i1VUHJz3MPM?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA

[JohnQPublic]

http://youtu.be/jtTrseGTlvQ?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA


http://youtu.be/8qXN7huzD5w?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA


http://youtu.be/V0-6r-6BsRk?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA

[mick silver]

Is that you john in the first video

[JohnQPublic]

Is that you john in the first video

Max Q Tegmark? No. lol

[Cebu_4_2]

Will I have to eat a bunch of morning glory seeds or drop acid to watch this?

[JohnQPublic]

Will I have to eat a bunch of morning glory seeds or drop acid to watch this?

Scrape a banana peel and let it dry then smoke that.

[Cebu_4_2]

Scrape a banana peel and let it dry then smoke that.

I heard that is an old wives tale.

[JohnQPublic]

I heard that is an old wives tale.

It probably is, but it is probably not going to hurt you. ;)

[Cebu_4_2]

Scrape a banana peel and let it dry then smoke that.

The Definitive Instructions for Smoking Banana Peels

Go to the grocery store and buy 10 pounds of bananas. (You used to need 200 pounds, but the potency has gone up 20x in the last 30 years.)
Remove the skins from the fruit. Save the fruit for later - if you mix it with orange juice and drink it while you're smoking, it'll make you trip real hard.
Dry the skins in the microwave. This won't affect the potency, as bannadine is not microwave soluble.
The next two steps are a simple nonpolar-polar extraction of the bannadine. This is necessary to get rid of the fungicide they put on the skins, which is a type of strychnine. Grind up the dried peels really well, and soak them in methylene chloride (zippo lighter fluid makes a good substitute). Let soak for 2 days, and then rinse well with ether. Discard the liquid and save the mush.
Take the mush from step 4 and soak it in ethyl alcohol for another 2 days. Filter, and put the mush aside - you won't be smoking it.
Evaporate the alcohol. The resultant crystals are 150% pure bannadine. Put these in your pipe, light up and enjoy! (Keep reading for the secret step 7!)
Bannadine is normally only active when smoked; that's why eating bananas won't do anything. However, that mush left over from step 5 is pretty tasty, and that's how I discovered that bannadine is orally active if potentiated by dried peanut skins! Yes, its true. I looked up the structure, and it turns out bannadine is really closely related to DMT - it has carbon atoms and everything!

Hope this helps! And all of you who say bananas don't work can just shut up

[JohnQPublic]

Geez, I should start an anarchists cookbook forum.

[Cebu_4_2]

Geez, I should start an anarchists cookbook forum.

Just write a book, make copies and pass them around.

[JohnQPublic]

Cookbooks are too common.

[JohnQPublic]

Listen to Adam McManus Chat with Rick DeLano of 'The Principle' (http://www.christiancinema.com/catalog/newsdesk_info.php?newsdesk_id=3037&src=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter#)

A good listen. Christian Cinema.

Here is the copy:
http://www.christiancinema.com/catalog/newsdesk_info.php?newsdesk_id=3037&src=rss&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter#

Adam McManus chats with Rick DeLano, the writer/producer of an explosive new documentary called The Principle (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com) which explores the significance of the Earth's place within the Cosmos – the first film of its kind.

Most mainstream scientists have sadly bought into the notion that humans and the Earth itself are nothing special. We inhabit, in Carl Sagan’s words, “an insignificant planet of a humdrum star lost in a galaxy tucked away in some forgotten corner of a universe in which there are far more galaxies than people.” In physical cosmology, the Copernican principle, named after the astronomer Nicolaus Copernicus who died in 1543, states that the Earth is not in a central, specially favored position in the universe.


"The question of our place in the cosmos is the greatest scientific detective story in all of history," states Rick DeLano, the writer/producer of a new movie called The Principle (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com). "The world has been shaped by two great assertions -- one places us in the center of it all and the other one relegates us to utter insignificance. Amazingly, The Principle is the first documentary to examine this persistent puzzle at the heart of modern science."
Recent large-scale surveys of our universe – as late as March of 2013 -- disclose unexpected evidence of a preferred direction in the Cosmos, aligned with our supposedly “insignificant” Earth.


The Principle features compelling narration by Kate Mulgrew (Star Trek Voyager, Orange Is The New BlackandRyan’s Hope), dazzling visual animations by BUF Compagnie Paris (Life of Pi, Thor, The Matrix: Revolutions and Harry Potter) and riveting commentary from prominent scientists including George Ellis, Michio Kaku, Julian Barbour, Lawrence Krauss, and Max Tegmark. The interviewees range in belief from Biblical literalism to atheism and everything in between.


Rocky Mountain Pictures, the distributor behind such ground-breaking documentaries as Dinesh D’Souza’s Obama 2016, Ben Stein’s Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed and Mel Gibson’s The Passion of Christ, has picked-up the North American theatrical distribution rights for The Principle, the much-anticipated feature documentary which explores the significance of the Earth's place within the Cosmos. The film is set to open in Chicago on October 24.


Already before its release, the film is being unfairly attacked by atheist scientists and left-wing media pundits alike who have only seen the trailer. Read Rick DeLano’s [Mark Wyatt's] detailed response (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/concise-overview-media-hoax-principle-documentary/).

[JohnQPublic]

A Concise Overview of the Media Hoax Against The Principle Documentary (http://www.theprinciplemovie.com/blog/concise-overview-media-hoax-principle-documentary/)


“The Principle Movie earns the distinction of being the most reviewed movie ever, never having been seen by any of its reviewers”- – – Rick DeLano – Michael Voris’ “Mic’d Up” episode titled, “The Principle Under Attack (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvR7pMqAEso)“.



The Principle is an amazing low budget independent film which examines a key component of modern cosmology: The Copernican Principle (http://youtu.be/2OMKwFurmXo?list=UUwyM0CLywu127gMw7aLC0TA). As we go through this concise history, please keep in mind the simple formula that seemed to escape the media giants of the modern age: The Principle is a documentary about The Copernican Principle. What makes The Principle so special is that amongst other things, it reviews powerful and controversial new evidence that the universe on its largest scales is correlated to our purportedly tiny and insignificant little earth, and most importantly, those who interview in it are some of the key scientists who have studied this correlation and who, even, have discovered the correlation.


In summary, on April 8, 2014 Lawrence Krauss and Kate Mulgrew simultaneously released statements critical of the movie and claiming they were tricked into participating, while joined by a simultaneous media blitz, which built upon these statements and added quotes from other participants.

This was clearly coordinated to hit simultaneously on April 8, 2014. The self described “journalists” involved did not bother to obtain information from the primary information source- the producer of the film!- indicating this was not an act of journalism, but rather a coordinated hit piece on a small independent film that asked important people uncomfortable questions that relate to life, the universe and everything.


Clearly the propagandists from Time, NPR, Yahoo, and various other media sources took time to research the movie, contact various participants, and form opinions, but neglected the most basic and critical task, which is to research the primary source for the story! By not contacting the primary source, they ended up creating a strawman thesis for the movie (i.e., that it promoted geocentrism), and scared/embarrassed many of the interviewees into reacting with negative statements. This represents a complete failure by media outlets to act competently, and is indicative of why many people do not trust mainstream media sources.


The truth is that The Principle is a very controversial movie with the potential to shake-up modern western civilization. The media participants are as confused and misinformed about this topic as is John Q Public, and frankly did not handle this very well. By not having the due diligence to consult primary sources, they ultimately failed miserably. Had they followed their own tried and true rules for journalistic investigation, there is a chance a more balanced outcome would have resulted. We must leave open the possibility that they did not want a balanced outcome, and would prefer that through the power of their deception, awareness of this movie would fade, and the information and ideas it contains would not become widely disseminated.


A brief overview of the history of The Principle



2010: Robert Sungenis and Rick Delano partnered, and The Principle was conceived.


2011-2012 Interviews were conducted with Lawrence Krauss, Max Tegmark, Michio Kaku, George F.R. Ellis, Max Tegmark, Julian Barbour, Bernard Carr, Robert Sungenis, and others, some of whom have and others of whom have not been included in the final film.
2013 Max Tegmark participates in a second interview after earth shattering evidence is confirmed by the Planck satellite. Kate Mulgrew, after serious study of the script and the science behind it, agrees to and does narrate The Principle.


Max Tegmark agrees to a scientific consultancy contract for The Principle.


December 2013: A trailer for The Principle is uploaded to YouTube (http://youtu.be/p8cBvMCucTg).


December 2013 – April 8 2014: A few minor blogs comment on The Principle Trailer.


April 8, 2014: On a single day a coordinated media blitz is unleashed. This will be summarized below. Basically Lawrence Krauss and Kate Mulgrew claim they were tricked, and a series of other articles simultaneously explore this theme also adding quotes from Max Tegmark, George Ellis, Michio Kaku, and Julian Barbour, all whom appear in the trailer and movie. None of the interviewees, nor the article writers had seen the movie, only the two minute trailer. The movie was not complete at this point in time.


April 9, 2014: One reviewer who actually bothered to call the producers as part of his investigation writes a blog piece (Tony Ortega). The title of this piece is “I can tell you how Lawrence Krauss ended up in our film. He signed a release form and cashed a check” (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/04/i-can-tell-you-how-lawrence-krauss-ended-up-in-our-film-he-signed-a-release-form-and-cashed-a-check/).


April 9-May 7, 2014: The media blitz continues, but less intense than the opening salvo on April 8.


May 8-present: After realizing that their blitz backfired on them, media silence ensues. Even as an opening date of October 24th, 2014 is announced in September 2014, the media silence continues.


Examination and annihilation of the claims



Lawrence Krauss:
Lawrence Krauss laments on April 8, I Have No Idea How I Ended Up in That Stupid Geocentrism Documentary (http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/04/08/lawrence_krauss_on_ending_up_in_the_geocentricism_ documentary_the_principle.html) in an article written by himself on Slate. He goes on to state: “A month or so ago, and again last night, my email, Facebook, and Twitter accounts began to buzz about clips of me appearing in some purported new documentary film promoting … wait for it … geocentrism!”


Let’s stop here for a moment. Remember what we said The Principle was about? It is about The Copernican Principle. So why is he making the case that it is about geocentrism? Ok, let’s give him some benefit of doubt. Some of the minor blogs were reporting this based on the trailer, in which geocentrism was mentioned. Most modern astronomers consider geocentrism ancient history, and it is understandable that Lawrence Krauss might be embarrassed if he thought he were tricked into supporting it. The movie, being about The Copernican Principle, not remarkably, does contain interviews with geocentrists. Geocentrism of some form becomes a real possibility once the Copernican Principle is questioned.


But Lawrence Krauss continues: ” I have no recollection of being interviewed for such a film, and of course had I known of its premise I would have refused. So, either the producers used clips of me that were in the public domain, or they bought them from other production companies that I may have given some rights to distribute my interviews to, or they may have interviewed me under false pretenses, in which case I probably signed some release. I simply don’t know.”


Let’s take these claims one at a time:


1. “I have no recollection of being interviewed for such a film…”. Ok, he may have forgotten, but the interview occurred, and he signed for it. Here is a view of Lawrence Krauss’ release form, which he signed (http://beforeitsnews.com/contributor/upload/306150/images/Krauss_Composite.jpg).


2. “…had I known of its premise I would have refused…”


What premise? That there is new evidence regarding the validity of The Copernican Principle? No, he means the promotion of geocentrism, which is not what The Principle is about. Lawrence Krauss was quite aware that The Principle would contain controversial views, as this line in his release states:


” “Interviewee…agrees that the footage… will be used in a feature documentary … interviewee also understands Producer will seek out … unconventional interpretations and theories as well as mainstream views.””


3. Lawrence Krauss continues: “So, either the producers used clips of me that were in the public domain, or they bought them from other production companies that I may have given some rights to distribute my interviews to, or they may have interviewed me under false pretenses, in which case I probably signed some release. I simply don’t know.”


On May 22, 2014, Lawrence Krauss clarifies the situation for us on the Rationally Thinking weblog (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkXGyy7M3gE) (watch the first 7 minutes) when he states:


“Well…I didn’t really know how it happened, but now I put things together after the fact…”


“…they interviewed me…”


Ok, that clarifies it, he was interviewed, and yes, he signed a release. Clearly it was not under false pretenses, but we will leave it to the verbage of the release form to argue that point


He continues, “I thought they used footage of me… from another interview…that maybe they bought…”


Ok, that clarifies that this point was not correct “So, either the producers used clips of me that were in the public domain, or they bought them from other production companies that I may have given some rights to distribute my interviews”


He continues, “…and of course they cut and paste and of course and apparently I come out promoting the earth as the center of the universe…”


No one in The Principle had to cut and paste anything to get Lawrence Krauss to say this, as he has published it himself in 2006 after observing the WMAP satellite results (THE ENERGY OF EMPTY SPACE THAT ISN’T ZERO (http://edge.org/conversation/the-energy-of-empty-space-that-isn-39t-zero) A Talk With Lawrence M. Krauss[7.5.06]):


“But when you look at CMB map, you also see that the structure that is observed, is in fact, in a weird way, correlated with the plane of the earth around the sun. Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us? That’s crazy. We’re looking out at the whole universe. There’s no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe.”


Lawrence Krauss was ASKED about this quote in his interview. His response as well as that of other prominent scientists tell an important story for The Principle. And Lawrence Krauss does not promote geocentrism specifically in The Principle, but you will have to watch The Principle to see for yourself. He did a pretty good job in the quoted article though!


Lawrence Krauss may be embarrassed that he made this observation in 2005. Given that his interview was in 2011, and there was still a chance that the Planck satellite could demonstrate that this observation he commented on was some type of fluke or error in the WMAP satellite data or analysis. Once Planck returned its results in 2013, there was little question that the observation was real.


Oh, and to this day, as far as the producers know, Lawrence Krauss has not seen the film. This is supported by his own statement that he “apparently” supports geocentrism in the film.


Kate Mulgrew:
On the same day as Lawrence Krauss released his Slate article claiming a lapse of memory, Kate Mulgrew posted a statement on her facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=10151985862292466&id=7122967465):
“I understand there has been some controversy about my participation in a documentary called THE PRINCIPLE. Let me assure everyone that I completely agree with the eminent physicist Lawrence Krauss, who was himself misrepresented in the film, and who has written a succinct rebuttal in SLATE. I am not a geocentrist, nor am I in any way a proponent of geocentrism. More importantly, I do not subscribe to anything Robert Sungenis has written regarding science and history and, had I known of his involvement, would most certainly have avoided this documentary. I was a voice for hire, and a misinformed one, at that. I apologize for any confusion that my voice on this trailer may have caused. Kate Mulgrew”


Let’s break this down:


“… Let me assure everyone that I completely agree with the eminent physicist Lawrence Krauss, who was himself misrepresented in the film, and who has written a succinct rebuttal in SLATE.”


Was Krauss misrepresented? Recall that on the day this was released, he had a memory lapse, and it was not until perhaps a month and a half later that he regained his memory and recalled that in fact he was interviewed. So, Kate Mulgrew was basically told a falsehood (whether purposeful or not), i.e., that Lawrence Krauss was misrepresented (in a movie he has not seen anyway).


“ I am not a geocentrist, nor am I in any way a proponent of geocentrism.”


Given that The Principle is about The Copernican Principle, the movie that Kate narrated did not require her to state whether or not she was a geoncentrist.


As one observer wryly noted: Kate no more had to be a geocentrist to narrate The Principle then she had to believe in warp drive to play Captain Janeway in Star Trek.



Apparently she has been misled on what The Principle is about or she misinterpreted the trailer or both.


“More importantly, I do not subscribe to anything Robert Sungenis has written regarding science and history and, had I known of his involvement, would most certainly have avoided this documentary.”


Yes, Robert Sungenis is a geocentrist, and in the interest of exploring The Copernican Principle, which historically relates to geocentrism vs. heliocentrism Robert Sungenis was interviewed. And yes, a few people have been unhappy with some of his controversial work on other topics in the sphere of Catholic apologetics, but this film has no relation to those topics. It is a movie about cosmology.


“I was a voice for hire, and a misinformed one, at that. I apologize for any confusion that my voice on this trailer may have caused.”
Well hardly anyone has even seen this film, including Kate Mulgrew. I think it was a bit premature for Kate Mulgrew to apologize for the use of her voice, which adds greatly to The Principle. Clearly Kate Mulgrew was scared into making this statement in concert with the media blitz.


Max Tegmark
Max Tegmark plays a pivotal role in the cosmology that is explored in The Principle. Max Tegmark played a pivotal enough role that he was interviewed twice (once before release of the Planck satellite data and once afterwards), and was hired as a scientific consultant for The Principle.
Max is quoted in at least two articles. The first on the thinkprogress website, in an article titled “Orange Is The New Black’ Star Duped Into Narrating Film That Says The Sun Revolves Around The Earth (http://thinkprogress.org/culture/2014/04/08/3424505/kate-mulgrew-duped/)”


“I was told that this would be a science documentary by independent filmmakers who wanted to increase public appreciation for science. I should clearly have asked for more details in advance! These geocentric arguments are about as unscientific as things get.”


Let’s break this statement apart:


“I was told that this would be a science documentary by independent filmmakers who wanted to increase public appreciation for science.”
Rick DeLano and Robert Sungenis are independent filmakers. They clearly want to increase public appreciation for science (thus they made this film).
” I should clearly have asked for more details in advance! ”


Max was a scientific consultant for the project. He should have asked more questions? Well the producers have a long chain of email correspondence with Max Tegmark on questions of interest to the CMB and The Copernican Principle. I think Max probably knew quite a bit about what the movie was about.


“These geocentric arguments are about as unscientific as things get.”


He may find, after he actually views the film that some of the arguments put forward by the geocentrists in the film are not to his satisfaction. That is his right. Everyone gets their views expressed in The Principle. No big issues here. Again, keep in mind that the media spun the topic of this movie to being about geocentrism, which would be fine if it were. The movie is about The Copernican Principle, and that is what was represented to Max.
Later, May 7 2014, Max gets quoted in an article in Popular Science. The article is titled, “The Conspiracy Theorist Who Duped The World’s Biggest Physicists (http://www.popsci.com/article/science/how-conspiracy-theorist-duped-worlds-biggest-physicists?dom=PSC&loc=slider&lnk=2&con=center-of-the-universe)“.


Max is quoted: “They cleverly tricked a whole bunch of us scientists into thinking that they were independent filmmakers doing an ordinary cosmology documentary, without mentioning anything about their hidden agenda or that people like Sungenis were involved.”


Again, Rick DeLano and Robert Sungenis are independent filmmakers. What is an “ordinary cosmology movie”? A puff piece like Cosmos, where establishment assumptions are presented as fact? Sorry, Max, The Principle is not a puff piece. That is why you were brought in as a scientific consultant. As to the hidden agenda: once again, Max Tegmark has not seen the film. How does he know what, if any, hidden agenda exists? The film is about The Copernican Principle not geocentrism as spun by the media.


As to not being told Robert Sungenis was involved? Robert Sungenis was involved increating the idea for the film and funding it, plus developing content and ideas at a high level. Rick DeLano wrote and produced the film, and director KTEE Thomas, along with the film crew, were the feet on the ground. They were the people that Max came into contact with. There were a lot of people involved in the film that Max probably did not know about. Sorry, Max, you strike out on this one. You were duped by the media, and spoke without thinking.


The PopSci article is another in which the author actually contacted the producers (about 1 month after the initial blitz).


George F.R. Ellis
George Ellis is the only scientist contacted by the media in their hoax/blitz who put some thought into his answer. In the cleverly titled (not) livescience propoganda piece (also carried by Yahoo), “Clever Editing’ Warps Scientists’ Words in New Geocentrism Film (http://news.yahoo.com/clever-editing-warps-scientists-words-geocentrism-film-120818059.html)“, The author states:”George Ellis, a mathematics professor emeritus at the University of Cape Town in South Africa, said geocentrism never came up in his interview.” (emphasis added)


Maybe that is because The Principle is about The Copernican Principle and not geocentrism, and thus, there was not a reason to interview George Ellis about geocentrism? I guess this profound thought never crossed the author’s mind. Nor did the thought of perhaps calling the producers of the film to interview them.


George Ellis upholds this as he is quoted: “The interviewers never put that idea to me…”


So, George Ellis was not interviewed about geocentirsm in The Principle. One would think that if The Principle were principally about geocentrism, he would have been interviewed about it given that in Scientific American, “Thinking Globally, Acting Universally”, October 1995, George Ellis stated:
“People need to be aware that there is a range of models that could explain the observations,” Ellis argues. “For instance, I can construct you a spherically symmetrical universe with Earth at its center, and you cannot disprove it based on observations…You can only exclude it on philosophical grounds…we are using philosophical criteria in choosing our models. A lot of cosmology tries to hide that.”



Dangerously enough, The Principle joins George Ellis in trying to expose that.


Back to the “clever” title of the news story. This is likely based the 2005 New Scientists title “‘Axis of evil’ warps cosmic background (http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn8193-axis-of-evil-warps-cosmic-background.html)“, which indicates that the media hoaxters knew a bit about one of the themes of the film, which indicates they were probably not acting out of complete ignorance, and likely were coordinating a hit piece on the movie.


Julian Barbour
Julian Barbour was also quoted in ‘Orange Is The New Black’ Star Duped Into Narrating Film That Says The Sun Revolves Around The Earth (http://thinkprogress.org/culture/2014/04/08/3424505/kate-mulgrew-duped/). He is quoted in an update to the story:


“I was alerted to the existence of the film about 10 days ago. I never gave permission to be included in the film and certainly do not agree with its thesis.”


Julian Barbour’s release form is displayed in Michael Voris’ Mic’d Up “The Principle, Under Attack“ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvR7pMqAEso), an interview with the producers of The Principle. Clearly Julian Barbour did give his permission to be in the film. As to the thesis, he is clearly referring to the media-hoax strawman-thesis that the film is promoting geocentrism. So, Julian Barbour also was misinformed by the media hacks.


Michio Kaku
In the article, ‘Clever Editing’ Warps Scientists’ Words in New Geocentrism Film, (http://news.yahoo.com/clever-editing-warps-scientists-words-geocentrism-film-120818059.html)Michio Kaku states:


“It borders on intellectual dishonesty to get people to be a part of a debate they don’t want to be a part of…”
Again, Michio Kaku was duped into believing The Principle is about geocentrism. If only the bulk of reporters had contacted the primary information source for the story, they would have gotten this right. But then again, was their intent ever to get it right?


SUMMARY



Lawrence Krauss initially claimed lack of memory, but eventually ‘fesses up to being interviewed in The Principle. Lawrence Krauss has not seen the film, and certainly did not see it when his statement was released (the film was not even complete at that point). It is clear that his statement was released on the exact day that Kate Mulgrew’s was, and the rest of the media blitz was unleashed. About a month and a half later, Lawrence Krauss back-pedaled on his charges, putting into question all the other charges from the other interviewees. Interestingly the self described “journalists” did not bother to obtain information from the primary information source- the producer of the film, indicating this was not an act of journalism, but rather a coordinated hit piece on a small independent film that asked important people uncomfortable questions that relate to life, the universe and everything.


Kate Mulgrew was intimidated into dismissing the movie, and claims to have been misinformed about its topic even after she narrated it! She did a great job in the narration of the film.


Max Tegmark, a scientific consultant to the film, apparently had second thoughts about his participation, long after the fact. Still his role in cosmology and in The Principle are key.


George Ellis’ statements actually support the contention that The Principle is not primarily about geocentrism, just as presented by the producer. The false idea is clearly created by the media hoaxters (who in general did not bother to even call the producers for facts).
Julian Barbour’s claim that he did not extend permission to be in the film is easily dismissed as false by presentation of his release form.
Michio Kaku was misled as to the topic of The Principle by the media hoaxters, and commented on a strawman argument.

[crimethink]

Everything about the current world system is founded upon the idea that neither humans nor the Earth are "special" - in fact, to most, we are not only not special, but nearly meaningless in an incomprehensibly large Universe, which is "obviously [sic] filled with other lifeforms and Earth-like planets."

But if the Earth is "special," in the sense that its position in the Solar System or even the entire Universe are, somehow in some ways unique, this forces a presumption of intelligent design - the existence of God.

Proof of God's existence destroys the very roots of what the current world system is depending upon. All the moral, philosophical, ideological, economic, and political concepts are effected - greatly, possible devastatingly so.

And because of that, The Principle "must be destroyed" before it is even seen.

[JohnQPublic]

Everything about the current world system is founded upon the idea that neither humans nor the Earth are "special" - in fact, to most, we are not only not special, but nearly meaningless in an incomprehensibly large Universe, which is "obviously [sic] filled with other lifeforms and Earth-like planets."

But if the Earth is "special," in the sense that its position in the Solar System or even the entire Universe are, somehow in some ways unique, this forces a presumption of intelligent design - the existence of God.

Proof of God's existence destroys the very roots of what the current world system is depending upon. All the moral, philosophical, ideological, economic, and political concepts are effected - greatly, possible devastatingly so.

And because of that, The Principle "must be destroyed" before it is even seen.

Bingo!

[mick silver]

john when are we getting the a copy of the movie

[JohnQPublic]

john when are we getting the a copy of the movie

It is opening in Chicago next week. If all goes well, it should go national. After that it will go to DVD, and it will be available in your home perhaps through some digital means.

[Horn]

Is that you john in the first video

Is the Great Deceiver, look at the golden smile and proposition.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2j4ZIDjZ9Y0

[mick silver]

it look like I will be waiting for the dvd don't do groups of people no more

[JohnQPublic]

it look like I will be waiting for the dvd don't do groups of people no more

Just go to the theatre, and if you are worried, wear a bullet proof vest!

[mick silver]

to the top for more lookers

[Neuro]

Who cares really what position earth has in relation to the Galaxy or the universe, what happens here is important to us. We are not going to go anywhere else, what we have here we have to make do with. Most people here live their lives like it is an egocentric universe, they themselves are the most important, followed by family, friends, neighbours, acquaintances, villagers, countrymen, races, humanity, in that descending order. Whether you believe in the Copernican principle or not, that is what most cares about! Whether we are at the center of the universe, or we are an insignificant planet, at an insignificant star in an insignificant position of our galaxy in an insignificant part of the universe it doesn't really matter! This planet matters to us. Live or let die!

[JohnQPublic]

Who cares really what position earth has in relation to the Galaxy or the universe, what happens here is important to us. We are not going to go anywhere else, what we have here we have to make do with. Most people here live their lives like it is an egocentric universe, they themselves are the most important, followed by family, friends, neighbours, acquaintances, villagers, countrymen, races, humanity, in that descending order. Whether you believe in the Copernican principle or not, that is what most cares about! Whether we are at the center of the universe, or we are an insignificant planet, at an insignificant star in an insignificant position of our galaxy in an insignificant part of the universe it doesn't really matter! This planet matters to us. Live or let die!

Some people understood its significance. Pragmatists may not want to think about it, but it is very significant, and has a huge impact on society and culture.


""Whither is God?" he cried; "I will tell you. We have killed him---you and I. All of us are his murderers. But how did we do this? How could we drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon?

What were we doing when we unchained this earth from its sun? Whither is it moving now? Whither are we moving? Away from all suns? Are we not plunging continually? Backward, sideward, forward, in all directions? Is there still any up or down? Are we not straying, as through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not become colder? Is not night continually closing in on us? Do we not need to light lanterns in the morning? Do we hear nothing as yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we smell nothing as yet of the divine decomposition? Gods, too, decompose. God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him."

Friedrich Nietzsche (http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/nietzsche-madman.asp)

[Neuro]

Some people understood its significance. Pragmatists may not want to think about it, but it is very significant, and has a huge impact on society and culture.

I thought about it. God put us here in the center of the universe, so that we could really fuck it up by our free will, and then he could punish us for it because he loves us. Well it is just another project, he can create another one with a wave of his wand or a snap of his finger, when we fuck up and burn in hell for eternity.

[EE_]

I thought about it. God put us here in the center of the universe, so that we could really fuck it up by our free will, and then he could punish us for it because he loves us. Well it is just another project, he can create another one with a wave of his wand or a snap of his finger, when we fuck up and burn in hell for eternity.

God doesn't punish everyone...some get to go straight to heaven.

http://www.superyachttimes.com/articles/Image/Editorial/Ports-Marinas/2013-10-Port-Vell/Superyacht-Soiree-big.jpg

[JohnQPublic]

I thought about it. God put us here in the center of the universe, so that we could really fuck it up by our free will, and then he could punish us for it because he loves us. Well it is just another project, he can create another one with a wave of his wand or a snap of his finger, when we fuck up and burn in hell for eternity.

We certainly were not promised a rose garden here on earth (well at least after Adam)!

[Shami-Amourae]

If there is a God, he is Evil.

Evil runs this world. It always has. Good is only permitted to exist as a plaything for Evil. It's like a cat who has a paw on a mouses' tail, playing with it before it devours it.

Religion was created by Evil people to control you, and give you a false sense of security, so others more powerful can stomp all over you unopposed.

You're the butcher, or you're the cattle.

[Neuro]

We certainly were not promised a rose garden here on earth (well at least after Adam)!
How is that relevant to what I wrote? Most of us will go to hell for our "crimes" after this life on earth...

[JohnQPublic]

If there is a God, he is Evil.

Evil runs this world. It always has. Good is only permitted to exist as a plaything for Evil. It's like a cat who has a paw on a mouses' tail, playing with it before it devours it.

Religion was created by Evil people to control you, and give you a false sense of security, so others more powerful can stomp all over you unopposed.

You're the butcher, or you're the cattle.

We are living in the "1000" years of the Apocalypse. There is a spiritual battle ongoing. Choose your side wisely.

[JohnQPublic]

How is that relevant to what I wrote? Most of us will go to hell for our "crimes" after this life on earth...

Which "crimes" are those, Neuro?

[crimethink]

Who cares really what position earth has in relation to the Galaxy or the universe, what happens here is important to us. We are not going to go anywhere else, what we have here we have to make do with. Most people here live their lives like it is an egocentric universe, they themselves are the most important, followed by family, friends, neighbours, acquaintances, villagers, countrymen, races, humanity, in that descending order. Whether you believe in the Copernican principle or not, that is what most cares about! Whether we are at the center of the universe, or we are an insignificant planet, at an insignificant star in an insignificant position of our galaxy in an insignificant part of the universe it doesn't really matter! This planet matters to us. Live or let die!

If Earth's position and nature are "special" and "unique," then Intelligent Design becomes self-evident. And if Intelligent Design is "proven," the fundamental foundations of the entire world system are called into question. A reversal of the "God is Dead" movement over the last century-plus would profoundly alter our world.

[crimethink]

If there is a God, he is Evil.


Non-sequitur.

God allowed us to choose, and we chose wrong. And keep choosing wrong, over, and over, and over, ad infinitum.




Evil runs this world. It always has.


Since man chose wrong, yes, this is true. The Bible acknowledges this.




Good is only permitted to exist as a plaything for Evil. It's like a cat who has a paw on a mouses' tail, playing with it before it devours it.


"Evil" is not a thing. Evil is the absence of Good. And where God is not welcome, Good is much less likely to exist. Think of Evil as Darkness...it's been equated for very good reason for millennia. It is the absence of Light.

When humans reject God, Goodness diminishes where He is dismissed and denounced.




Religion was created by Evil people to control you, and give you a false sense of security, so others more powerful can stomp all over you unopposed.


This is absolutely correct. Jesus Christ was murdered because of and by religion. "My burden is light..." He didn't give us another religion; He gave us relief from it.




You're the butcher, or you're the cattle.

Or you're the visionary and idealist who can see that there is something much, much more beyond this material world.

[crimethink]

How is that relevant to what I wrote? Most of us will go to hell for our "crimes" after this life on earth...

People who choose to reject God are given their desire in the next life. "Hell" is separation from God, forever. God does not "send" anyone anywhere. He permits them their choice, just as Adam & Eve were given the choice.

[Neuro]

Which "crimes" are those, Neuro?
I don't know I didn't make that shit up!

[Neuro]

If Earth's position and nature are "special" and "unique," then Intelligent Design becomes self-evident. And if Intelligent Design is "proven," the fundamental foundations of the entire world system are called into question. A reversal of the "God is Dead" movement over the last century-plus would profoundly alter our world.
You don't think earth revolves around the sun?

[Shami-Amourae]

Non-sequitur.

God allowed us to choose, and we chose wrong. And keep choosing wrong, over, and over, and over, ad infinitum.
..............
..............
Or you're the visionary and idealist who can see that there is something much, much more beyond this material world.

None of the stuff you said makes sense. Again, I don't believe in a god. Your statements are based around the belief in the Christian religion.

[crimethink]

You don't think earth revolves around the sun?

Can it be proven?

It is "probably true."

[crimethink]

None of the stuff you said makes sense.


Didn't make any sense to me at one time in my life, either.



Your statements are based around the belief in the Christian religion.

I don't believe in it because it's Christian. I'm a Christian because it's true.

I can only explain what I know.

[Neuro]

Can it be proven?

It is "probably true."
The other option is that sun revolves around earth and all the other planets revolves around the sun. But Martians or Titans or Plutonians could likewise argue the exact same thing for their planets in relation with the sun and the other planets. Everyone could be in a special and unique place of the Universe... ;D

[mick silver]

shami when you go outside look around can you make the things you see

[JohnQPublic]

The other option is that sun revolves around earth and all the other planets revolves around the sun. But Martians or Titans or Plutonians could likewise argue the exact same thing for their planets in relation with the sun and the other planets. Everyone could be in a special and unique place of the Universe... ;D

But no one else has the CMB (and other phenomenon) aligned specifically to them. Our ecliptic and equinoxes (and potentially equator) seem to be partitioning the cosmos at its largest scales. Not Pluto's, not Mars', not the sun's, not even our galaxy's, only earth. Keep an open mind until you get a chance to see the movie. Read this for now if you want: https://medium.com/we-are-in-a-special-place/planck-satellite-confirms-wmap-findings-universe-is-not-copernican-26f88f17a732

[JohnQPublic]

http://youtu.be/U6_adWD5H-s

[mick silver]

john the earth has to be a special place they have not show us one other place were life can are be seen alive are I would say they have the tools by now to look far out

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6908&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6911&stc=1

[Horn]

Just go to the theatre, and if you are worried, wear a bullet proof vest!

The Principle: Rise of The Dark Ages...

[JohnQPublic]

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6918&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

http://youtu.be/ikOaq4BhCaI

[chad]

do you have like 51% ownership in this movie or something? :cool:

[JohnQPublic]

do you have like 51% ownership in this movie or something? :cool:

I wish! :)

[JohnQPublic]

http://nycmovieguru.com/oct24th14.html

The Earth revolves around the sun, right? At least according to 16th Century cosmologist Nicolaus Copernicus, we live in a heliocentric universe. 20th Century cosmologist even went to the extent of saying that Earth is insignificant in a galaxy that's among many other galaxies. Along comes the groundbreaking documentary The Principle, directed by Katheryne Thomas, which presents very compelling evidence that disproves the Copernican Principle and to, ultimately, make you feel happier to be living because Earth is significant. Director Katheryne Thomas initially provides you with a wide range of perspectives from various scientist such as Michio Kaku, Max Tegmark and George Ellis, among others. Each of them is interviewed separately, but the things they say are sometimes at odds with one another which highlights how complex the issue of heliocentricity vs geocentricity. By including those different opinions, Thomas acheives something that too few documentaries acheive: fairness, balance and critical thinking without resorting to ad hominum against naysayers. The arguments for geocentricity are quite persuasive, and easy-to-follow with graphics and narration used in a lively way that makes it accessible to the laymen without being exhausting or too dry. The Principle ultimately finds just the right balance between entertaining the audience and proking them emotionally and intellectually no matter what they believe in before sitting down to watch it. By the time it's over, you'll never look at the Copernican Principle the same way again. This is the kind of doc that you'll be talking about for weeks. Rocky Mountain Pictures opens The Principle at Addison Cinema in Chicago.

[EE_]

One review.

Protecting Faith from Pseudoscience: A Review of The Principle

by Guest Contributor | Oct 21, 2014 | The Faith | 13 comments
Protecting Faith from Pseudoscience: A Review of The Principle

Camille M. Carlisle is the science editor at Sky & Telescope magazine.

I was recently asked to review a new movie called The Principle, being released this month. The film, produced by Catholic theologian Robert Sungenis, uses science to raise the specter of geocentrism — the theory that Earth is at the physical center of the universe. With breathtaking cinematography and intellectual one-two punches, it paints a compelling argument that geocentrism might be right and the world’s scientists are willfully blind to the evidence.

Compelling, that is, if you know nothing about astrophysics.

If you do, you’ll soon see that the movie is a combination of science, bogus science, and conspiracy theory, tied up in a Gordian knot that would take much more than a blog to fully unravel.

The reason I’m writing about it in a Catholic blog is this: the movie has the potential to erode the scientific literacy of believers and convince nonbelievers that science and Christianity don’t mix. No doubt the movie’s creators are well intentioned. But good intentions make hell-bound paving stones. This isn’t me, a science journalist, merely ranting about the movie’s deplorable lack of fact-checking. This is me, a Catholic, worried about the error it will seed in the minds of God’s little ones.

Because in watching the movie and having a dozen pages of e-mail back-and-forth with the producer and publicist, one thing became clear: the movie’s creators do not understand physics.

Let’s take their argument about center of mass as an example. The movie correctly says that, according to Newtonian gravity, bodies in the solar system orbit around their common center of mass. What that means is that, technically speaking, Earth and the planets don’t orbit the Sun; rather, the Sun and planets orbit their common center of mass.

But the movie then tries to make the argument that, if Earth sits at the universe’s center of mass, then it wouldn’t move and everything — Sun, stars, our Milky Way galaxy, the cosmic web of galaxies and galaxy clusters we see in the universe — would rotate around that fixed point. In other words, Earth is stationary in a giant, rotating celestial sphere.

However, gravitationally, that just doesn’t work. First of all, the Sun has 99% of the solar system’s mass, and so the center of mass for our planetary system lies inside the Sun. Second, there’s no gravitational reason that Earth would sit still where it is. For example, Earth can’t be as close as it is to the Sun and not feel our star’s gravitational influence. Earth is made of matter: it has mass. It’s also a mere 93 million miles from the Sun — astronomically speaking, right on top of it. And the Sun is roughly 300,000 times more massive than Earth. Therefore, even if Earth were at the universe’s center, our planet would still not evade the Sun’s pull. Why? Because the closer two objects are to each other, the stronger the gravitational pull is. And Earth is just too close to the Sun.

In addition, decades of velocity measurements, radio observations, and many other lines of evidence show that our solar system sits in the outer-ish part of a spiral galaxy that’s rotating around a center that isn’t Earth. Observations also show that our galaxy is in a group of galaxies, and that this Local Group is on the outer edge of a giant supercluster. Geocentrism simply doesn’t match the empirical evidence. Nor is there any coherent theory of gravity that can both explain all our observations and put Earth at the universe’s physical center.

There are many other examples in the movie like this one. One that might catch you off guard is the work by astronomer John Hartnett, whose analysis of cosmic structure seems to reveal concentric spheres centered on us. However, as astronomer Tom Bridgman explains in his several blogs on this subject, this is a flaw in Hartnett’s analysis. (Bridgman’s blogs are quite technical — the man really knows his analytic techniques! — but if you want a hard science analysis I recommend reading his blogs on Hartnett’s work and on The Principle.)

The movie also argues against what it calls “patches,” things such as dark matter and dark energy that, it accuses, astrophysicists invoke to try to “save” their theories. But this is a shortsighted argument: it’s equivalent to saying that, since we don’t know everything about the universe, we don’t know anything. Yet however much distaste you might have for dark energy, something is making the universe’s expansion speed up. “Dark energy” is the filler word for that something, until we figure it out.

The Principle’s creators really seem to have it in for Einstein. This is a common problem for those not trained in modern physics. Many think that Einstein’s theory of gravity (colloquially called general relativity, or just GR) is esoteric nonsense. But if you’ve ever used GPS, you’ve used GR. According to GR, Earth creates a gravitational well in the fabric of spacetime. Because of that, time runs slightly slower on Earth than it does for the GPS satellites in orbit. (The delay is about 38 microseconds per day.) In order to use GPS, we have to account for relativistic effects. A world without GR is a world without Google Maps.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

But my biggest complaint is the movie’s underlying philosophical argument. The movie claims that moving Earth from the physical center of everything implies that “man means nothing,” that if the universe doesn’t revolve around Earth, we aren’t special.

This dichotomy is a materialist lie. As Stephen Barr brilliantly lays out in his book Modern Physics and Ancient Faith, we need to separate scientific results from the philosophy that uses them to make its case.

Too many people buy into the mantra that science disproves faith. Wrong. Materialism uses science to argue that faith isn’t true. We can just as easily do the opposite. (Read Barr’s book for more info.) The movie quotes prominent scientists such as Lawrence Krauss and the deceased Carl Sagan to set up this geocentrism-or-insignificance choice, but both of these men are infamous militant atheists. Of course they’re going to interpret scientific results as proving we aren’t special.

The sad thing is, The Principle buys into this dichotomy, too. The question you should ask yourself is, Why? Why does not being in the middle of everything mean we’re not special? Who said the two have to go together?

In fact, salvation history suggests the opposite is true: God picks the least and the lowly. The Jews were a tiny little people among great peoples: “It was not because you are more numerous than all the peoples that the LORD set his heart on you and chose you; for you are really the smallest of all peoples. It was because the LORD loved you and because of his fidelity to the oath he had sworn to your ancestors” (Dt 7: 7-8). Jesus Himself was from a backwater town in Israel. Heck, He picked fishermen as apostles. And think of the many saints who were not at the center of anything — the children of Fatima come to mind — yet He chose them. So why on Earth should we expect our planet to be the physical center of the cosmos? Is it not more amazing that we aren’t? Doesn’t it speak to God’s providence and love and tenderness, and the fact that He’s God and we aren’t?

Noted cosmologist Max Tegmark raises a useful point in the movie when he says, “We had this arrogance, and we got it knocked out of us. And we realized that we’re not the center of everything” — except we haven’t had it knocked out of us. Because if we had, we wouldn’t sin. Sin is (spiritually) putting ourselves at the center. That the weight of scientific evidence suggests Earth is not at the physical center of the solar system, the galaxy, or the local supercluster of galaxies doesn’t tell us anything theologically — ‘cause hey, it’s only physics, and physics only deals with physical reality, not metaphysics. But it wouldn’t hurt us to meditate on the point for a while.
http://truthandcharity.net/protecting-faith-from-pseudoscience-a-review-of-the-principle/

[singular_me]

if true, the few lines here throw me off .... North, South, East and West are determined according to our position with the sun. There is no galactic center, IMHO



But my biggest complaint is the movie’s underlying philosophical argument. The movie claims that moving Earth from the physical center of everything implies that “man means nothing,” that if the universe doesn’t revolve around Earth, we aren’t special.


I have difficulties to visualize earth as the center of the galaxy here... does the movie claim that earth is the only planet inhabited in the entire cosmos?

http://d1jqu7g1y74ds1.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/tumblr_mj0vvcqnZx1qdlh1io1_400.gif

[crimethink]

Camille M. Carlisle is the science editor at Sky & Telescope magazine.


Expecting anything different from her is like expecting the director of a Holocaust™ "museum" to speak well of Leuchter, Cole, or Irving. It just cannot be done. At least not with any hope of keeping one's profession.




Compelling, that is, if you know nothing about astrophysics.


I'd propose, Camille, that you "know" nothing about astrophysics. What you think you "know" is actually belief based on things you can never personally experience, highly-dependent upon opinions and interpretations of what people think they see.




The reason I’m writing about it in a Catholic blog is this: the movie has the potential to erode the scientific literacy of believers and convince nonbelievers that science and Christianity don’t mix. No doubt the movie’s creators are well intentioned. But good intentions make hell-bound paving stones. This isn’t me, a science journalist, merely ranting about the movie’s deplorable lack of fact-checking. This is me, a Catholic, worried about the error it will seed in the minds of God’s little ones.


You are worried that your actual religion, modern so-called "science," is under threat. Your livelihood is based upon your religion, which is not Catholicism. You're afraid that "unapproved" and "unacceptable" ideas are being presented - ideas that will cause some to question the monolithic expectation of faith in your actual religion - modern so-called "science."




The Principle’s creators really seem to have it in for Einstein. This is a common problem for those not trained in modern physics. Many think that Einstein’s theory of gravity (colloquially called general relativity, or just GR) is esoteric nonsense. But if you’ve ever used GPS, you’ve used GR. According to GR, Earth creates a gravitational well in the fabric of spacetime. Because of that, time runs slightly slower on Earth than it does for the GPS satellites in orbit. (The delay is about 38 microseconds per day.) In order to use GPS, we have to account for relativistic effects. A world without GR is a world without Google Maps.


LOL. Hyperbole much?

Einstein, the Jewish brand name (and much less so a man), was the product of numerous other scientists' work. His theories remain just that, and much of what is claimed as his was not. He denied many things now accepted as true by even modern so-called "science." 38 microseconds? Is that a lot? (sarcasm). GPS satellites are also 12,600 miles out, taking 0.068 light-seconds for their signals to reach the surface. It is assumed that "Einstein's General Relativity" is the explanation of the perceptual-increase in speed of the GPS satellite clock.



As Stephen Barr brilliantly lays out in his book Modern Physics and Ancient Faith, we need to separate scientific results from the philosophy that uses them to make its case.


Modern so-called "science" is not a value-less ideology. It is every bit a religion of olden times, only with its followers denying it has fanatic dogma. Whether it's "global warming," evolution, or Sagan's "insignificant" pale, blue dot, the alleged "results" are generated from and through the "philosophy."

Modern so-called "science" alleges to be based upon the truly value-less scientific method, but in reality, most of what alleges to be "science" is untestable.

[JohnQPublic]

"But the movie then tries to make the argument that, if Earth sits at the universe’s center of mass, then it wouldn’t move and everything — Sun, stars, our Milky Way galaxy, the cosmic web of galaxies and galaxy clusters we see in the universe — would rotate around that fixed point. In other words, Earth is stationary in a giant, rotating celestial sphere.

However, gravitationally, that just doesn’t work. First of all, the Sun has 99% of the solar system’s mass, and so the center of mass for our planetary system lies inside the Sun."

Oops. The old switcharoo! and GR can account for this, and this is what all modern cosmology is based on. Anything can be center and the universe will supply the forces to create the needed balance.

This is a poorly thought out and written piece. Really bad.

And finally, "But the movie then tries to make the argument that, if Earth sits at the universe’s center of mass, then it wouldn’t move and everything — Sun, stars, our Milky Way galaxy, the cosmic web of galaxies and galaxy clusters we see in the universe — would rotate around that fixed point"

The movie does not try and make that point! Bad journalism. Sorry, complete fail.

[JohnQPublic]

Status Update
(https://www.facebook.com/theprinciplemovie/posts/335686233269427)
By The Principle [Rick DeLano, producer, JQP]

What an amazing first day for "The Principle".

Final numbers won't be available until tomorrow, because it's time for a well deserved dinner and celebration, but suffice it to say, if Saturday and Sunday continue along the same trend, we will have an absolutely stellar opening weekend!

Three shows sold out today, and the fourth was within 4 seats of selling out when I left.

One show was added to the schedule to accommodate the overflow.

People showed up BIG TIME in Chicago for "The Principle" tonight.

And every single one of them knows who has been telling the truth about this film now :-) - Rick DeLano

[JohnQPublic]

http://youtu.be/2IxQY7Fr9I0

[JohnQPublic]

Robert Sungenis and Rick DeLano opening night in Addison, Illinois (~15 min. from O'Hare). Picture from Facebook.


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6920&stc=1

[EE_]

http://youtu.be/2IxQY7Fr9I0


Why did the Jews need to play the anti-Semite card on Bob Sungenis?

He must have feared for his life, having to say "I believe in the Holocaust, I love the Jewish people, I'm not an anti-Semite"

[JohnQPublic]

Why did the Jews need to play the anti-Semite card on Bob Sungenis?

He must have feared for his life, having to say "I believe in the Holocaust, I love the Jewish people, I'm not an anti-Semite"

He is basically saying that he does not have to hate someone to be critical of them. The Jewish people are free to convert to Christianity as is anyone else. As to the holocaust, I think he questions aspects of it, but not necessarily that the Nazis ran prison camps and a lot of people perished in them.

[crimethink]

Why did the Jews need to play the anti-Semite card on Bob Sungenis?


Because it works.




He must have feared for his life, having to say "I believe in the Holocaust, I love the Jewish people, I'm not an anti-Semite"

Being identified as an "anti-Semite" is far worse than being identified as a child molestor - for your career, for your relationships, sometimes, for your life.

[mick silver]

glad you guys had a great opening weekend , I guess I will wait till it out on dvd because we no longer go out and watch movies . so has the hate started yet on the movie . be well mick

[JohnQPublic]

Science May Never Be the Same After October 24, 2014 (http://www.kevinott.net/blog/2014/10/22/science-may-never-be-the-same-after-october-24-2014)

Movies (http://www.kevinott.net/blog/?category=Movies)
It will likely become one of the most controversial documentaries ever made. I just saw an advanced screening of a documentary that premiers October 24. When I say controversy, I mean the same level of controversy and meaningful impact as when Copernicus made his claims about the nature of the universe or when Einstein dropped the theory of relativity on us. It is causing a crisis in the scientific community -- at least for those who are wholly invested in what 20th century science has embraced as indisputable. This is absolutely jaw-dropping. I look up into the heavens full of stars and everything looks different now -- just knowing what I know now compared to two hours ago. More info to come soon. I just finished it 10 minutes ago, and my mind has been racing just considering all of the implications. More info to come in the next couple days. [written at midnight on Wednesday, October 22]

[JohnQPublic]

Thank you Chicago! (https://www.facebook.com/theprinciplemovie/photos/a.220406061464112.1073741828.218291998342185/336253663212684/?type=1) Due to your incredible support of The Principle this weekend, the Marcus Addison Cinema (https://www.facebook.com/MarcusAddisonCinema) has extended the movie for a second week! Get your tickets today! http://bit.ly/1vFsXR9


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=6926&stc=1

[JohnQPublic]

The Principle (https://www.facebook.com/theprinciplemovie?hc_location=timeline)30 minutes ago

Audiences were breaking out into applause at tonight's sold-out 4:15 showing...word is spreading and it is now very clear that "The Principle" is on the way to expansion both in Chicago, and in other cities.

But first things first-

California here we come!

[singular_me]

ir is always good when there is a controversy, regardless of the aftermath, it offers the possibility to rethink points of view that we take for granted.

But I dont think the geocentrism can be resurrected because the Singularity (the Dot or zero point energy) is at the center of every vortex (life motion) found at every level of creation/matter, would it be in an atom, planet earth or any galaxy. So I am sticking to what I have said months ago, everything at a cosmic level represents the center of The Greater Scheme of All Things. The All That Is.

[crimethink]

But I dont think the geocentrism can be resurrected because the Singularity (the Dot or zero point energy) is at the center of every vortex (life motion) found at every level of creation/matter, would it be in an atom, planet earth or any galaxy. So I am sticking to what I have said months ago, everything at a cosmic level represents the center of The Greater Scheme of All Things. The All That Is.

Zero Point Energy is found at every point of the entire Universe, vortex or not. In matter, in vacuum - everywhere.

When we peer into the Quantum level, we are seeing a blurry vision of God's domain. The Higgs Boson may very well be an important particle, but it's not "the god particle" - it would be, rather, God's particle.

[mick silver]

hey john what do you think of the show ancient aliens , what I have seen there making shit up and hoping people buy this crap I hope I am not the only one that see this

[JohnQPublic]

Robert Sungenis has come out with a video form of his book "Galileo Was Wrong". It is pretty good, and the animations explain a lot of what is happening. You can get it here: http://gwwdvd.com/.
(http://gwwdvd.com/)

"The Principle", which explores the Copernican Principle, will be available this fall on DVD also. The two make great companion DVDs.

[Horn]

This has got to be JQP's favorite all time thread.

[JohnQPublic]

This has got to be JQP's favorite all time thread.

Sandy Hook and Fukushima are close seconds ;).

[Glass]

The Producer of the Principle will be joining Flat Earther Jeranism on Monday the 28th Sept on Globebusters. 6PM PST.

Trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBU0rxA6_j8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBU0rxA6_j8

Jeranism Channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCS_FY5mR4g22L_E9t1D_ExQ/videos

[Jewboo]

https://i.4cdn.org/pol/1452736213753.jpg

[JohnQPublic]

The Producer of the Principle will be joining Flat Earther Jeranism on Monday the 28th Sept on Globebusters. 6PM PST.

Trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBU0rxA6_j8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBU0rxA6_j8

Jeranism Channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCS_FY5mR4g22L_E9t1D_ExQ/videos

...and argues against flat earth.

[Glass]

...and argues against flat earth.

well yeah, thats the pont.

The thing about flat earth is that it's geocentric in concept. They just don't like the ball. They'd rather live on a plane or maybe in a bowl. All I know is, things are round and things move around but my perspective doesn't enable me to determine which around what.

The principle is a good doco. Well worth watching for anyone who hasn't already.

[JohnQPublic]

Another nail in the coffin of acentrism:

"Unless the Local Universe has a significant anisotropic distribution of galaxy morphologies aligned with the orientation or the orbit of the Earth (which would be a challenge for the Cosmological Principle), our results show that there seems to be a systematic bias in the classification of galaxy morphological types between the data from the Northern and the Southern Equatorial sky. Further studies are absolutely needed to find out the exact source of this anisotropy."

"We can clearly see a region in the south of the Celestial Equator occupied mostly with early type galaxies and the northern sky is more populated by late type galaxies."

"Interestingly, the hemispherical asymmetry that we found in the distribution of the morphological types of galaxies is aligned with both the Ecliptic and the Celestial Equator planes."

"If this significant deviation from isotropy is real and not due to issues with the catalog and the classifications, it could mean that the galaxies in these two opposite directions have had different evolution and/or formation history which would be a major challenge for the Cosmological Principle..."



https://arxiv.org/pdf/1609.06719v1.pdf

[JohnQPublic]

Compare quotes:



Lawrence Krauss commenting on anisotropy of the CMB
https://www.edge.org/conversation/lawrence_m_krauss-the-energy-of-empty-space-that-isnt-zero

" But when you look at CMB map, you also see that the structure that is observed, is in fact, in a weird way, correlated with the plane of the earth around the sun. Is this Copernicus coming back to haunt us? That's crazy. We're looking out at the whole universe. There's no way there should be a correlation of structure with our motion of the earth around the sun — the plane of the earth around the sun — the ecliptic. That would say we are truly the center of the universe."

Javanmardi and Kroupa
https://arxiv.org/pdf/1609.06719v1.pdf

"Unless the Local Universe has a significant anisotropic distribution of galaxy morphologies aligned with the orientation or the orbit of the Earth (which would be a challenge for the Cosmological Principle), our results show that there seems to be a systematic bias in the classification of galaxy morphological types between the data from the Northern and the Southern Equatorial sky. Further studies are absolutely needed to find out the exact source of this anisotropy."

[Neuro]

Another nail in the coffin of acentrism:

"Unless the Local Universe has a significant anisotropic distribution of galaxy morphologies aligned with the orientation or the orbit of the Earth (which would be a challenge for the Cosmological Principle), our results show that there seems to be a systematic bias in the classification of galaxy morphological types between the data from the Northern and the Southern Equatorial sky. Further studies are absolutely needed to find out the exact source of this anisotropy."

"We can clearly see a region in the south of the Celestial Equator occupied mostly with early type galaxies and the northern sky is more populated by late type galaxies."

"Interestingly, the hemispherical asymmetry that we found in the distribution of the morphological types of galaxies is aligned with both the Ecliptic and the Celestial Equator planes."

"If this significant deviation from isotropy is real and not due to issues with the catalog and the classifications, it could mean that the galaxies in these two opposite directions have had different evolution and/or formation history which would be a major challenge for the Cosmological Principle..."



https://arxiv.org/pdf/1609.06719v1.pdf
I don't have the ability to question the observation, but is it possible that the difference is due to observation bias? As the magnetic poles would distort the observation in terms of charged particles...

[JohnQPublic]

I don't have the ability to question the observation, but is it possible that the difference is due to observation bias? As the magnetic poles would distort the observation in terms of charged particles...

Not likely. The authors are attempting to claim some type of bias, such as different telescopes being used in the southern and northern hemispheres.

[Neuro]

Not likely. The authors are attempting to claim some type of bias, such as different telescopes being used in the southern and northern hemispheres.

Do they even mention the bias of magnetic polarity? One side of earth would get more negatively charged particles, the other more positive....,

[Glass]

Do they even mention the bias of magnetic polarity. One side of earth would get more negatively charged particles, the other more positive....,

Doesn't the polarity flip on a regular basis? Or is that the Sun?

I'm not sure I grasp the issue they have raised. Are they saying that the star systems behind us are older when in fact they should be younger because they are traveling behind us, meaning they came out of the big bang after us, making them younger?

or is it a rotational direction bias? Systems rotating predominately in one direction when there should be a mix of directions?

[Horn]

"more later galaxies" sounds like a 50/50 statement.

probably observed on the debatable "redshift notion", if that is the case, then it certainly is a 50 percent correct statement... light bending in the direction you're heading does not seem too very improbable.

[Neuro]

Doesn't the polarity flip on a regular basis? Or is that the Sun?

I'm not sure I grasp the issue they have raised. Are they saying that the star systems behind us are older when in fact they should be younger because they are traveling behind us, meaning they came out of the big bang after us, making them younger?

or is it a rotational direction bias? Systems rotating predominately in one direction when there should be a mix of directions?

Polarity of earth magnetism flips every 10 or 100,000 years or so, sun flips every 11 years or so... give or take two-three... No they haven't measured a shift in earths magnetism since we started to be able to think rationally.