The Question now becomes......what am I willing to do to make this better?

[Twisted Titan]

The Fallout is still occurring it is pretty much certain The Aggressors on the other are going to do their damdest to make sure this is a ELE ( Extinction Level Event) for the average Lawfull Person trying to go about their daily.

We are standing at The Cusp of A Thousand Years of Darkness. What we do.......or fail to do will affect our Bloodlines for Generations.

So the being that as it may ........the only Question of any relevancy now is ...... WHAT AM I GOING TO PERSONALLY DO ABOUT THIS?

I am just tossing out what seems to be prudent actions in the face of the decimating onslaught........ feel free to add





1) Cash Purchases for anything gun related ( even if it is at a premium) Right about now anonymity is a most precious commodity.



2) If you have to purchase online do be aware the day may come when your activity records could be subpoenaed and you have have to give a account for the current where about of that "large" ammo purchase. One strategy that you could employ is to make one or Several visits to the local range. That way if you are questioned you can answer that you and few buddies "shot it all up" if pressed to provide where you can do so with confidence . Most people if interviewed might not think this far out and all they that Federal Goon the faintest whiff that you are stockpiling you got a hell of nightmare on your hands that could end really really badly.





3) Unless you have been living in a cave its all but apparent what the Hell is happening unfortunately rather then bringing out the best in the Common Man or Woman it will bring out the worst. I fully expect to see price gouging the likes of which that will make the Fuel and Supply Riots of Super storm Sandy look like minor playground tussles. I also expect people to sell compromised ammo at "cheap" prices. ......... The bottom line is there will be few deals and anything that looks to go to be true will most likely be just that.



4) If your in Panic mode not knowing where to start one of the most proactive things you could do is start to stock up on high capacity mags and reliable ammo in common calibers ( even if you DO NOT own the firearm). The bottom line is when the hammer falls you will be in a powerful position and that could be leveraged multiple different ways. Ex It would not surprise me in the least to see a Glock Factory 33 rd mag fetching north of 1500 dollars when the ban is in place.



This is what has been rambling in my mind the last few days......... anybody is welcome to chime in or offer criticisms

[chad]

ammo here is cleared out, especially in high velocity .22LR. it's impossible to find mini mags, stingers, or velocitors. actually thinking about selling my beretta bobcat, as it will only function with this ammo, and i simply can't buy it face to face locally anymore. starting this past sunday, i'm now carrying $200 cash at all times in case i find some secret stash of stingers somewhere.

[Twisted Titan]

#5) Now is the time to be Cash Heavy as great deals could be struck on the fly.

Excellent Point my Good Sir.

[Shami-Amourae]

Can you please make/find a list of recommended calibers/types/brands of ammo? I've focused on buying ammo lately, but it's hard getting physical cash. I also like keeping a lot of cash on hand for SHTF. I don't want to use all that up.

I live in an area where there's almost no gun stores and I have to drive almost an hour to get any relatively cheap ammo. I also don't want to shop at the same stores over and over to raise red flags.

How much should I spend in a transaction for ammo? I've been keeping under $200.

[vacuum]

I think ammo is the key. Hide it in small amounts so that if a stash is found, it's just some ammo you bought a while back. They can't make owning a couple boxes of normal ammo illegal, because lots of people will have something like that and just forget about it. Just keep it separated.

Ammo is like gasoline...useless on it's own, but in many ways actually worth more than the thing that uses it.

It would be nice to have a list of what to get though, I honestly don't buy this stuff very often.

[Twisted Titan]

22
9mm
40 cal
45 ACP



223
30-06
7.62x39
7.62 x54r


00
Sabot Slugs



That some commons one off the top of my head Im waiting for Liberty Tree and Midnight Rambler to weigh in as they are much better well versed

[chad]

Can you please make/find a list of recommended calibers/types/brands of ammo? I've focused on buying ammo lately, but it's hard getting physical cash. I also like keeping a lot of cash on hand for SHTF. I don't want to use all that up.

I live in an area where there's almost no gun stores and I have to drive almost an hour to get any relatively cheap ammo. I also don't want to shop at the same stores over and over to raise red flags.

How much should I spend in a transaction for ammo? I've been keeping under $200.

i'm a huge fan of .22LR. it's a great head sniping & hunting round. lately i've been buying up anything i can find. my grandfather told me stories of people bartering with .22LR rounds in iowa during the depression. people used to poach pheasants for food, and the .22LR was the caliber of choice due to it's quietness. also, almost everyone on the planet has a .22LR rifle somewhere.

[vacuum]

22
9mm
40 cal
45 ACP



223
30-06
7.62x39
7.62 x54r


00
Sabot Slugs



That some commons one off the top of my head Im waiting for Liberty Tree and Midnight Rambler to weigh in as they are much better well versed

Lets say you only have $1000 or $1500 to spend. In that case, what is the optimal breakdown in terms of calibers and also grade (surplus, standard, or specialty)?

[Shami-Amourae]

I'd add 308 Winchester, 357 Magnum, 38 Special. I have guns that fire all those too. I have some 30-06 and don't even own a gun for it.

[mick silver]

hell i would like just one more gun , but i am holding off hoping i can buy it off a person ... really would like a stage coach gun 12 ga

[Twisted Titan]

Lets say you only have $1000 or $1500 to spend. In that case, what is the optimal breakdown in terms of calibers and also grade (surplus, standard, or specialty)?

i would drop 500 buck per category pistols, rifles and shot guns as each firearm covers a specific scenario.

I would stay away from any specialty ammo... you now that stuff that is marketed as "zombie killer or Flame thrower etc"

I would stick with tried and true I would only in interested in Hollowpoints and +P as those have proven themselves to be force multipliers if you should find yourself at the moment of truth

[chad]

i have a whole bunch of winchester pdx1 in .410 that i got at a steal (place going out of business). currently, i only have a .410 shotgun. i'd love to have one of those judge things i could shoot it in.

[midnight rambler]

There will always be a need for:

.38 special/.357 mag
.357 Sig
10mm
.30-.30
.45-70
5.45x39
.308/7.62 NATO
any sort of 2 3/4" 12 ga. buck

However generally I suggest only loading up on the calibers you use yourself.

FYI, almost all sabot slugs are made for rifled shotgun barrels (actually haven't found any for smooth bore). Brenneke style slugs are superior to Foster style slugs when you can find them.


22
9mm
40 cal
45 ACP



223
30-06
7.62x39
7.62 x54r


00
Sabot Slugs



That some commons one off the top of my head Im waiting for Liberty Tree and Midnight Rambler to weigh in as they are much better well versed

[midnight rambler]

It is suggested one also load up on hi-cap mags of one's favorite flavor.

[midnight rambler]

Here's one thing you can do to make this 'better' - engage everyone you come into contact with in a conversation pointing out why the citizenry *needs* to be armed with hi-cap 'assault weapons' (by asserting the clearly obvious): Because that's what the competition is going to have. It has NOTHING to do with hunting, PERIOD. You don't have to tell anyone you own such a thing, hell, even lie to 'em (like we're being lied to) that you don't even have one but you can clearly see why people should be able to acquire 'assault weapons' and possess them lawfully without restraint.

[Twisted Titan]

Just spoke to wife who was at College today.

Newton became a topic of discussion.

Good Lord the collective stupid in that room from the Professor right to last student was so thick you couldn't cut it with a Conan's Broadsword.


More Laws should be passed
Teachers shouldnt have access to guns.
We have to find a way to stop crazy people
The President and congress have to "do something"

Let their be no mistake Gun Owners in this country are now The Spartans at the Battle of Thermopalye.

We are vastly outnumbered

Defeat is almost a certainty

But Love of Family,Freedom and Way of Life we Dare to Defy The Odds.

[General of Darkness]

TT IMHO, this whole cluster fuck just needs to run its course. I don't mean to sound defeatist, but outside of some massive disaster, the "system" has all the cards.

They got the brainwashed masses
They control the media
They control everything

The only thing they don't control are the ones that aren't brainwashed. And those us who aren't are too damn afraid to communicate with each other so we don't get on the list and somehow have an accident no knock incident. Time are really scary if you're in the know. I however have resided myself to not giving a fuck about anyone but myself. The ONLY thing at this stage of my life that would push me to lay waste to the people on my "LIST" is if someone fucked with my dogs or my family. In a fucking heart beat and it wouldn't be reactionary. It would be a scorched earth policy.

[Twisted Titan]

God I hear man but I respectfully disagree.

The same this that is happening in 2012 happened in 1776.




“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.”

http://thinkexist.com/i/sq/as4.gif Margaret Mead (http://thinkexist.com/quotes/margaret_mead/)

[General of Darkness]

I'd love to see the rise of The Order from the ashes.

[palani]

Go for lawful weapons http://www.cabelas.com/ensemble/Shooting/Black-Powder/Pistols-Revolvers|/pc/104792580/c/104701680/sc/104503680/LeMat-Revolver/5745.uts?destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct.jsp%3Fpr oductId%3D705701%26type%3Dproduct&WTz_l=DirectLoad%3Bprd705701

http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/005745?hei=373&wid=770&op_sharpen=1


our Cavalry version has a nine-shot, .44-caliber cylinder and rifled 6-3/4" barrel. What sets it apart from other revolver designs is the 20-gauge, .645" diameter 5-7/8" smoothbore barrel, originally intended for firing buckshot. Both are fired by a pivoting striker. In combat, the firepower from the pistol barrel plus a hefty dose of "blue whistlers" made the LeMat a fearsome weapon to face.

[midnight rambler]

Go for lawful weapons http://www.cabelas.com/ensemble/Shooting/Black-Powder/Pistols-Revolvers|/pc/104792580/c/104701680/sc/104503680/LeMat-Revolver/5745.uts?destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct.jsp%3Fpr oductId%3D705701%26type%3Dproduct&WTz_l=DirectLoad%3Bprd705701 (http://www.cabelas.com/ensemble/Shooting/Black-Powder/Pistols-Revolvers%7C/pc/104792580/c/104701680/sc/104503680/LeMat-Revolver/5745.uts?destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct.jsp%3Fpr oductId%3D705701%26type%3Dproduct&WTz_l=DirectLoad%3Bprd705701)

http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/005745?hei=373&wid=770&op_sharpen=1

Do you really think you're going to be left alone if you have one of those AFTER you've already bought new guns on a form 4473 (especially those of the evil black variety)??

Not only that, why put yourself at an extreme disadvantage in a storm when the competition is going to have hi-cap semi-autos?? A single action black powder revolver up against a hi-cap pistol would be sure suicide UNLESS one got the drop on the bad guy and capped him before he had a chance to pull his piece.

On top of all that, do you *really* think a cop is going to make a distinction between you having a black powder revolver and you having any smokeless powder handgun which falls under 'commerce'??

[palani]

Do you really think you're going to be left alone if you have one of those AFTER you've already bought new guns on a form 4473 (especially those of the evil black variety)?? You might consider singing out 'FEDERAL OFFICER' as well.



Not only that, why put yourself at an extreme disadvantage in a storm when the competition is going to have hi-cap semi-autos?? A single action black powder revolver up against a hi-cap pistol would be sure suicide UNLESS one got the drop on the bad guy and capped him before he had a chance to pull his piece. Would it help to be able to actually aim it rather than spray it?


On top of all that, do you *really* think a cop is going to make a distinction between you having a black powder revolver and you having any smokeless powder handgun which falls under 'commerce'?? Don't use smokeless. Use black powder and hide behind the smoke.

[gunDriller]

eat healthy.

live healthy.


since a personal Waterloo/ revelation i had about 1 month ago, regarding the broken-ness of most American institutions, something i already knew, i just had it shoved in my face like some fresh cowpie (good compost material ! :) ), i have been making it a very deliberate point to -
A/ get to sleep early & get a good night's sleep
B/ get up early, be at the desk at 5 AM.
C/ work harder, and to make it a point not to avoid unpleasant tasks.
D/ pay a little extra attention to provisioning, to make sure i got good healthy food 24/7.
E/ to not take stuff personally.
F/ to recognize that almost every American business organization in my life is playing hardball with me, and that there's no shame in playing hardball back - harder - even if it takes me out of my personal comfort zone.

good coffee helps :)


i'm also approaching "fun" sort of like a job. to take a day off, to go skiing or whatever - is good for your head.

[General of Darkness]

I have yet to put even ONE shot through this shotgun. But the reason I got the FN SLP is because FN purchased Winchester and uses the same internals and the SX3 is the fastest shot gun on the planet. Enjoy.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj7T_1mNSf0

[chad]

what's one of those run?

[General of Darkness]

what's one of those run?

Chad I think I paid $850 or something like that for it maybe 2 years ago plus. So it might be more expensive now because it was a quiet semi-shotgun at the time. Kinda like my Dan Wesson 1911 which was $1050 and now it's like $1300

[chad]

Chad I think I paid $850 or something like that for it maybe 2 years ago plus. So it might be more expensive now because it was a quiet semi-shotgun at the time. Kinda like my Dan Wesson 1911 which was $1050 and now it's like $1300

thanks man, will have to check in to one of those.

[midnight rambler]

Would it help to be able to actually aim it rather than spray it?

Don't use smokeless. Use black powder and hide behind the smoke.

Don't be asinine.

[palani]

Don't be asinine.

Some events are not survivable. Won't make a difference if you are armed or not.

[Libertarian_Guard]

Go for lawful weapons http://www.cabelas.com/ensemble/Shooting/Black-Powder/Pistols-Revolvers|/pc/104792580/c/104701680/sc/104503680/LeMat-Revolver/5745.uts?destination=%2Fcatalog%2Fproduct.jsp%3Fpr oductId%3D705701%26type%3Dproduct&WTz_l=DirectLoad%3Bprd705701

http://images.cabelas.com/is/image/cabelas/005745?hei=373&wid=770&op_sharpen=1

That gun has proven it's self in the bubble bath as well.

[midnight rambler]

Some events are not survivable. Won't make a difference if you are armed or not.

Having actually been on the two way range myself, I want ALL the (unfair) advantage I can get. Having the right combat arm will more likely than not give one the edge over the competition (as opposed to having a single action black powder revolver limited to five rounds and completely incapable of fast reloads). Not to mention that modern personal defense ammo DEFINITELY has far better stopping power than a lead ball.

[midnight rambler]

That gun has proven it's self in the bubble bath as well.

lol In the movies.

[palani]

I want ALL the (unfair) advantage I can get.

Survivability is a transient phenomena. Look at Gordon Kahl and the toll it took on his wife and kids. Look at Bill Cooper. Ambushed. How about the guy and his son down in Memphis who got away only to be surrounded and have their dog shot?

[vacuum]

Survivability is a transient phenomena. Look at Gordon Kahl and the toll it took on his wife and kids. Look at Bill Cooper. Ambushed. How about the guy and his son down in Memphis who got away only to be surrounded and have their dog shot?

I think basically what you're saying is: the most survivable scenario is to be legally armed and everyone in the community know that you are armed. That is the primary deterrent. However, not be so armed that others feel too threatened or that they want to steal what you have. In your opinion that is the 'most survivable' scenario.

[Libertytree]

If I had to pick and choose I'd go with 22LR and 9MM. The 22LR is IMHO greatly underestimated and the 9MM is a very common round, both are relatively cheap to boot.

[Steal]

Well, here's maybe a what not to do. (unless this just part of the escalating propaganda front to descimate our 2nd amendment rights to keep govt incheck.

An 11-year-old student may face charges after he said his parents encouraged him to bring a gun to school for protection. (http://fox13now.com/2012/12/17/west-kearns-elementary-student-brings-gun-to-school/)
Fox Salt Lake City reports that the boy said his parents' suggestion (http://fox13now.com/2012/12/17/west-kearns-elementary-student-brings-gun-to-school/) came after the devastating Sandy Hook Elementary shooting (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/17/newtown-ct-plans-burials-_n_2314785.html) on Friday.
The student allegedly pulled the .22-caliber pistol out of his backpack during recess Monday morning and pointed it at one of his classmates.
"He pulled out a gun and he put it to my head — me and my friend — (and) said he was going to kill us," Isabelle Rios told KSL. (http://www.ksl.com/?sid=23430406&nid=148&title=kearns-elementary-student-brings-gun-to-school-to-protect-self-officials-say&s_cid=queue-1) "I told him I was going to tell, but he said, ‘If you tell, I'm going to kill you.'"


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/student-brings-gun-to-school_n_2324143.html?icid=maing-grid10%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk2%26pLid%3D247502

[hoarder]

hell i would like just one more gun , but i am holding off hoping i can buy it off a person ... really would like a stage coach gun 12 gaMick, I love sawed-off side by side 12 guage shotguns. The "Coach Guns" usually have external hammers, which is a little more desirable. Most that you find were made in Russia in the last 15 years for cowboy shooting aficionados and the barrel is already 18 to 20' long and chambered for 3".

You can also find plenty of older 12G SxS shotguns that were made in USA or South America, usually chambered in 2 3/4" and don't have external hammers. You'll have to cut the barrels yourself on these. Use a 14' abrasive chop saw and cut at the nearest web beyond 18", then clean it up with a file. 18" is the Federal minimum, some states require longer barrels. Cut it a little longer in case you drop it and flatten the tubing at the muzzle, that way you can cut it again. Many of the US made SxS are so old they don't have serial numbers which is a big plus! That is measured from the breech-block.

There is no shotgun made that gets the first 2 shots off faster than a double. If that don't do the trick (unlikely), drop it and draw your handgun.
They're also shorter than any pump or semi-auto, which makes them great for house clearing and vehicles.

[Half Sense]

Ruger LCR-22. 8-shot revolver, DAO ("hammerless"). Lightweight, rugged, reliable, chambers and fires any .22 Short, Long, or Long Rifle ammo. About $400.