Sandy Hook - Numbers don't add up

[sunshine05]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2CcDTipX4Rc

[old steel]

Nothing adds up about what happened that day.

[midnight rambler]

I noted that the *official* timeline from several sources did not sync up, it was off by up to at least 14 minutes.

[Twisted Titan]

kinda like NORFED and the stand down order

[Kali]

So as this is unfolding, how would that guy (in vid above) know Soto was 27?

He says I was hoping it wasnt that beautiful young 27 yr old teacher....sounds kinda odd he would know that.

Then from Huff. Post it says..."Rosen, a 69-year-old retired psychologist, took the four girls and two boys into his home, and over the next few hours gave them toys, listened to their stories and called their frantic parents."

Why would he take them into his home for "a few hours". He didnt notice the place was swamped with cops?

He didnt call the cops but instead, over the next few hours, called their parents?

WTF?

[Neuro]

It is just keep getting weirder...

[sunshine05]

So as this is unfolding, how would that guy (in vid above) know Soto was 27?

He says I was hoping it wasnt that beautiful young 27 yr old teacher....sounds kinda odd he would know that.

Then from Huff. Post it says..."Rosen, a 69-year-old retired psychologist, took the four girls and two boys into his home, and over the next few hours gave them toys, listened to their stories and called their frantic parents."

Why would he take them into his home for "a few hours". He didnt notice the place was swamped with cops?

He didnt call the cops but instead, over the next few hours, called their parents?

WTF?

Regarding the notification of parents - in one of the interviews he states that the kids didn't know their parents' cells numbers so the bus driver called the dispatch office and they had them on file and the office called each parent! WTF? Everyone was supposed to meet at the first station. THIS story is certainly a bunch of BS!

[Glass]

It would be odd for police dispatch to have all the numbers of the kids wouldn't it? The school office, for sure but no use. Maybe not knowing if the school area was safe enough to take them back there.

[sunshine05]

It would be odd for police dispatch to have all the numbers of the kids wouldn't it? The school office, for sure but no use. Maybe not knowing if the school area was safe enough to take them back there.

No, he said the bus dispatch office found the numbers. Certainly the bus driver would have known to take the kids to the fire station and NOT joined them in Rosen's house for several hours! But the biggest thing is that there is NO explanation for how there could have been 6 kids from Soto's class there when according to the media none of them survived.

[Horn]

I still haven't seen one picture of the crime scene, one of these interviews the reporter said he shotup the front doors with his AR to get thru.

You'd think at least they could get a shot of the front doors.

[Hermie]

"...one of these interviews the reporter said he shotup the front doors with his AR to get thru."

It's reported the rifle was still in the car trunk.
There is news video of the police removing it.
Definitely a lot of, something, going on with this story.

[Glass]

No, he said the bus dispatch office found the numbers. Certainly the bus driver would have known to take the kids to the fire station and NOT joined them in Rosen's house for several hours! But the biggest thing is that there is NO explanation for how there could have been 6 kids from Soto's class there when according to the media none of them survived.
Thanks for clearing up the bus thing. I didn't realise that.

Can someone describe to me the emotions they perceive this man as having while he is talking.

Does anyone have any thoughts about the very last thing this man says in light of what sunshine05 points out?

[midnight rambler]

"...one of these interviews the reporter said he shotup the front doors with his AR to get thru."

It's reported the rifle was still in the car trunk.
There is news video of the police removing it.
Definitely a lot of, something, going on with this story.

The video you're referring to was posted on ARF.com, much discussion about it. The consensus is that the video shows a shotgun, however the question remains - why did they wait several hours (until after sundown) to examine the contents of the car. Makes no sense knowing how cops work, they would have checked the contents of the car very early on to make sure it wasn't concealing an IED.

[sunshine05]

http://sandyhooktruth.wordpress.com/2012/12/21/the-numbers-dont-add-up-the-stories-dont-make-sense/

[Glass]

I sense 2 things from the OP video. sexual excitement and disappointment right at the end.

[vacuum]

It's my understanding no one has seen the bodies. That the parents were only given locked coffins. Is this correct?

[sunshine05]

It's my understanding no one has seen the bodies. That the parents were only given locked coffins. Is this correct?

I don't know about locked coffins but they are saying that, yes. But then if they're all actors they won't be concerned about the fake coffins or the fake funerals.

[Cebu_4_2]

I don't know about locked coffins but they are saying that, yes. But then if they're all actors they won't be concerned about the fake coffins or the fake funerals.

Organ doners?

Disgusts me to even think of that.

[Sparky]

I don't know if it's all correct, but as usual, Wikipedia does a good job at trying to piece the entire story together.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_shooting

It says 14 were killed in one classroom, and 6 in the other. I don't really understand why the video in the OP claim that the numbers don't add up, since there were so many conflicting reports that emerged. The fact that "the media" reported all 16 in Soto's class were killed seems irrelevant, other than it was just one of many flawed reports.

And Rosen knowing the teacher's name and age is completely plausible. He lived across the street, and she had taught there several years.

[sunshine05]

It says 14 were killed in one classroom, and 6 in the other. I don't really understand why the video in the OP claim that the numbers don't add up, since there were so many conflicting reports that emerged. The fact that "the media" reported all 16 in Soto's class were killed seems irrelevant, other than it was just one of many flawed reports.



It's not irrelevant because the media has reported about the kids' funerals for the past several days! It can't be just a "flawed" report.

[sunshine05]

Wikipedia says that 14 from one class were killed ; 6 from the other but if you add up the kids from Soto's class, there were 17 (2 were not in the class photo). They state that one girl survived by playing dead, 6 escaped, yet there have been funerals for 16 of the kids from Soto's class.

The other 4 - there is NO story about them. We don't know who the teacher was or anything. What's up with that?

[Sparky]

Wikipedia says that 14 from one class were killed ; 6 from the other but if you add up the kids from Soto's class, there were 17 (2 were not in the class photo). They state that one girl survived by playing dead, 6 escaped, yet there have been funerals for 16 of the kids from Soto's class.

The other 4 - there is NO story about them. We don't know who the teacher was or anything. What's up with that?
Why do you think there have been funerals for 16 Soto students? Has that been reported?

[sunshine05]

Why do you think there have been funerals for 16 Soto students? Has that been reported?

Yes, all of the funerals have been reported, as well as family members talking about their dead children and all 16 of them allegedly from Soto's class are included. That's what I'm saying - the numbers don't add up with what Rosen is saying about the 6 survivors from her class. No one is bothering to look into the contradiction. No one interviewed the bus driver, no one interviewed the 6 students who survived nor their parents. The media is content to just let this go it seems.

Isn't it odd that there's no mention about how the kids from the other classroom died? We don't even know who their teacher was. It is bizarre.

[Horn]

Is it too coincidental that the little girl's smiling family funeral portrait with Obama, is the same girl not in the class photo?

None of the eyewitnesses I've seen have anything slightly genuine about them with regards to the case.

[Serpo]

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/12/20/sandy-hook-massacre-official-story-spins-out-of-control/

[Kali]

Kinda creepy too how this old man (Gene) had young kids toys in his home for the 6 kids to play with.

I have watched several of his interviews and not one tear either just the scrunchy "I'm trying to squeeze out a tear" face.

That goes for many of those interviewed.

There was a nurse that hid under a desk that also gave two different versions of her story.

[Glass]

just the scrunchy "I'm trying to squeeze out a tear" face.

Are you sure that's what that face is?

[Glass]

just wanted to poke this thread. The other thread has an argument going about whether or not you can run a false event if it appears to involve 100 people or more. I am looking for a video interview of a local Sandy Hook resident who says, no one in the area knows the children killed or their parents. I thought the OP video may be it but the link is dead.

[Neuro]

I don't know if any others have had issues with the long thread on Sandy Hook, but right now I can't post on it, I get logged out as I try to reply to Joobot's post, yesterday I got logged out from the forum when only opening the thread, it doesn't happen anywhere else.

Anyway he tells us to use a "realistic filter", not to believe our own lying eyes, when something is too far away from the official version of events. I guess we should believe that Osama Bin Laden was killed in Pakistan at the raid, and that Obama's obviously faked birthcertificate and admitted by his lawyer, was in fact real...

It is becoming very clear what Joobot's reason for being here is...

[Hatha Sunahara]

Keep in mind when they were leading the surviving kids out of the school, they told them to close their eyes. What is it they didn't want them to see? Or was there nothing to see? And how strange is it that an entire class--Soto's class, including the teacher were killed? And the kids from the other class who were killed had an unnamed teacher. Did anyone from that class survive? Do they miss their dead classmates? Or did that entire class get killed as well. Did any classmates of the dead kids survive? If so, can they tell us anything about their dead friends?


Hatha

[gunDriller]

Isn't it odd that there's no mention about how the kids from the other classroom died? We don't even know who their teacher was. It is bizarre.


not a peep from the media about the role of SSRI's & other drugs in many of these incidents.

[sunshine05]

Keep in mind when they were leading the surviving kids out of the school, they told them to close their eyes. What is it they didn't want them to see? Or was there nothing to see? And how strange is it that an entire class--Soto's class, including the teacher were killed? And the kids from the other class who were killed had an unnamed teacher. Did anyone from that class survive? Do they miss their dead classmates? Or did that entire class get killed as well. Did any classmates of the dead kids survive? If so, can they tell us anything about their dead friends?


Hatha


I wrote an article about this last week. I spent more time tracking down everything that was reported about the two classes.

1st one - teacher: Lauren Rousseau (not listed as staff, though they called her a "permanent" substitute teacher)
15 kids - most reports state all but one shot and killed. There are some reports about a girl who played dead and ran out of the school.

2nd class - teacher: Victoria Soto - 15 (or 16) kids depending on the report
reports claim that 7 were found alive in a closet, 6 were shot and killed while trying to escape and 6 ran out of the classroom and escaped right beside Lanza, right after he shot Soto.
NO explanation for 19 kids and of course there are many versions of what happened with the 6 kids who fled (via Rosen and one of the kids' parents) and there's more that I haven't covered yet but I recently found.

Many contradictory reports of what happened in Victoria Soto’s classroom (http://sandyhooktruth.wordpress.com/2013/01/02/many-contradictory-reports-of-what-happened-in-victoria-sotos-classroom/) Posted on January 2, 2013 (http://sandyhooktruth.wordpress.com/2013/01/02/many-contradictory-reports-of-what-happened-in-victoria-sotos-classroom/) by lynne0312

(http://sandyhooktruth.wordpress.com/author/lynne0312/)

To begin, Ms. Soto was declared a hero by all of the media sources just hours after the tragedy occurred. This was at a time when investigators should have been just barely understanding what happened in the school. There were many witnesses to interview, evidence to analyze, family to notify, etc. Yet they somehow presented this hero story (and others) before anyone fully understood the details. After reading many news reports and listening to interviews about what happened or at least what is being reported to have happened, I’m not understanding what she did that was considered heroic. Anyone with common sense would have done whatever possible to protect themselves as well as the children, yet with so many different versions of this event, it is impossible to understand what really happened.


This (http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2012/12/us/sandy-hook-timeline/index.html?iid=article_sidebar) article has Soto directing the kids “away from the door”.


“In another classroom, Victoria Soto, 27, moved her first-grade students away from the door. The gunman burst in and shot her, according to the father of a surviving student. Six students were killed in that classroom.”



This article (http://www.news.com.au/world/teacher-victoria-soto-threw-herself-in-front-of-her-students-to-save-them-at-sandy-hook-elementary-school/story-fndir2ev-1226537530317) has her throwing her body in front of the children.


“Miss Soto sacrificed herself to save her students – throwing her body in front of the young children.”
And a “friend” had this to say:


A friend posted a tribute to Miss Soto on her Tumblr account. (http://flagonthemoon.tumblr.com/post/37960470291/my-good-friend-vicki-soto-passed-away-in-todays)In her tribute she wrote: “I talked to Vicki Tuesday and she told me that she loved her 16 angels and never wanted to let them go. Today when the shooting started Vicki hid her kids in closets and when the gunman came into her room she told them the class was in gym. She was then murdered. Not one of her students were harmed. Words can not express how heartbreaking and tragic this is. I will miss you dearly.”


Does this sound like something a teacher would say about her students??? And, it’s then stated that not one of her students were harmed?!


Another version (http://www.digtriad.com/news/article/259640/57/Family-Friends-Attend-Funeral-Of-Teacher-Student):


Her students told police that she tried to distract gunman Adam Lanza, but when half of the class tried to run, Lanza opened fire. According to investigators, when Vicki was found, it was clear that she died trying to shield her students from harm.



This contradicts what has been reported (http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/16/us/connecticut-school-shooting-narrative/index.html) by the parents of Aidan Licata. They state that he walked in the room, shot Soto and he and 5 others escaped by walking right past him in the doorway!


This article (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2250441/Sandy-Hook-shooting-Family-Dylan-Hockley-pay-tribute-teachers-died.html)describes Soto hiding the kids in a closet and when telling Lanza that the kids were at the opposite end of the school, 6 kids tried to escape and he shot them all.
“Dylan’s teacher Vicki Soto died while saving her pupils. She hid them in her classroom closet and confronted Adam Lanza, telling them the children were at the other end of the school.



Six children panicked and tried to escape but the teacher put herself in the line of fire so she could save them, but they were all shot multiple times.
Mr and Mrs Hockley said their son’s teacher was ‘warm and funny’ and Dylan ‘loved her dearly’.
The couple also said they take ‘great comfort’ in knowing that their son did not die alone.
He was found in the arms of teacher’s aide Anne Marie Murphy, who was also shot dead.



There are more variations – some have her hiding some of the kids and Murphy under her desk, some have her huddled with the children, etc. Who knows what to believe. The official story is the 14 kids were shot in Rousseau’s class and 6 in Soto’s. Since Murphy was in Soto’s classroom and it’s stated that the 6 kids were shot “trying to escape”, then how did she get shot? It’s reported that Hockley died in her arms. None of it makes sense!


There are also reports that 6 children escaped unharmed. How can that possibly reconcile with “6 children were shot trying to escape”?


And (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/12/16/newtown-shootings-gunman-soto-details/1772791/),


“Finally, they (police) opened that door and there were seven sets of eyes looking at them,” the Courant reported, citing a law enforcement officer familiar with the events. The kids told the officer what had happened. “She tried to save her class,” he said of Victoria Soto.



If 6 kids were shot trying to escape, 6 kids escaped unharmed and 7 kids survived hiding in the closet, how does one explain that she only had 15 (or 16 according to the “friend”) students? Here is the class photo that’s being presented.


http://sandyhooktruth.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/class-500x281.jpg?w=640 (http://sandyhooktruth.wordpress.com/2013/01/02/many-contradictory-reports-of-what-happened-in-victoria-sotos-classroom/class-500x281/)


It is all so confusing. Here is a short video that consists of two separate (and inconsistent) interviews with the parents of Aidan Licata as well as a short part of Gene Rosen’s interview. Rosen is the neighbor who claims that 6 students from Soto’s class ended up at his house. He reported that their parents eventually picked the students up there. In an interview, Aidan’s mother reported that she picked her son up from the police station. In a news article (http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/16/us/connecticut-school-shooting-narrative/index.html), it’s reported that she found him at the fire station, so three versions.


Where was Aiden? He has to be safe. Relief came in the form of a text on her phone. Aiden, she learned, was in the firehouse already.

He had come face-to-face with the gunman when he entered Soto’s classroom and ran right by him to escape, he later told his parents.



I get the sense that the general story was written but the actors involved in this didn’t remember the exact script so that the stories would be consistent. Where are the journalists questioning all of these inconsistencies? It is no wonder that so many people are trying to understand what really happened in Sandy Hook.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ocx6qLZ6BnU