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Cebu_4_2
2nd April 2013, 05:30 PM
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joboo
2nd April 2013, 06:37 PM
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Cebu_4_2
2nd April 2013, 06:39 PM
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Ares
2nd April 2013, 06:51 PM
How the Bitcoin Block Chain works

http://spectrum.ieee.org/img/06Bitcoin-1338412974774.jpg

Cebu_4_2
2nd April 2013, 07:01 PM
Keiser Report: Bitcoin vs Banksters (E426)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP6pBS6uptE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KP6pBS6uptE

steyr_m
2nd April 2013, 07:49 PM
I want to pull the trigger on buying, but want to look at historical charts....

Ares
2nd April 2013, 08:03 PM
I want to pull the trigger on buying, but want to look at historical charts....

http://www.litecoinpool.org/charts

The chart you want is at the bottom of that page.

vacuum
2nd April 2013, 08:11 PM
$124 per BTC



And I saw someone buy 292 of them at that price

Someone else just bought 108 at that price


now $125 per BTC


281 bought at 124.93
146 bought at 125

vacuum
2nd April 2013, 08:33 PM
$127 per BTC

That's the price of silver +$100

Ares
2nd April 2013, 08:39 PM
The number of transactions is incredible. Check this out

Transactions last 24h 62,514
Transactions avg. per hour 2604.75
Bitcoins sent last 24h 2,586,349.58 BTC
Bitcoins sent avg. per hour 107,764.57 BTC <----- WOW

Source: http://bitcoincharts.com/bitcoin/

optionT
2nd April 2013, 09:00 PM
What is a safe exchange for purchasing litecoins?

sirgonzo420
2nd April 2013, 09:07 PM
What is a safe exchange for purchasing litecoins?

if buying with bitcoin, btc-e.com

Ares
2nd April 2013, 09:08 PM
You can GPU mine, and CPU mine LTC on the same box.

"Pooler" wrote an assembly level routine for CPU (scrypt) processing. How the hell he did that I would like to know. Assembly level programming is insanely removed from anything resembling a language.

Fire it up on top of GUIminer etc..

I'm predicting the LTC difficulty factor is going to climb sharply very soon as butterfly labs is shipping any day now, and they are massively back logged in pre-orders (thousands).

I used to work with Assembly back in the day. Convoluted fucked up mess is what I like to call that "language". All hexadecimal based. However he figured that out, congrats to him. lol

optionT
2nd April 2013, 09:20 PM
When funding your mt gox account, is AurumXchange the easiest way to fund it using USD?

Ares
2nd April 2013, 09:33 PM
When funding your mt gox account, is AurumXchange the easiest way to fund it using USD?


Dwolla is, if you live in the U.S. I set that account up a month ago waiting for my ASIC miner.

Shami-Amourae
2nd April 2013, 09:33 PM
When funding your mt gox account, is AurumXchange the easiest way to fund it using USD?


I've used Dwolla for years. You have to give both Dwolla and Mt Gox a lot of personal info though and there's a lot of waiting.

joboo
2nd April 2013, 09:52 PM
$127 per BTC

That's the price of silver +$100


I brought up bitcoin over a year or two ago on Kitco silver forums, and people freaked about it being OT. Shitcoin I think was the term it ended up being called.

My guess is some people are regretting not letting that thread play out with the info I was able to provide at the time, and telling me to shut up about it.

madfranks
2nd April 2013, 10:30 PM
I brought up bitcoin over a year or two ago on Kitco silver forums, and people freaked about it being OT. Shitcoin I think was the term it ended up being called.

My guess is some people are regretting not letting that thread play out with the info I was able to provide at the time, and telling me to shut up about it.

How many bitcoins do you have?

Cebu_4_2
2nd April 2013, 11:03 PM
current GPU mining 32x the CPU.

Definitely need a new card!

only avg 3.25 Mhps lol

vacuum
2nd April 2013, 11:19 PM
$131.57

sirgonzo420
3rd April 2013, 04:49 AM
All-time high: $143.50

madfranks
3rd April 2013, 07:10 AM
I can't help but think with this astronomical surge up in value that there's going to be a phenomenal crash as well.

Neuro
3rd April 2013, 07:37 AM
I can't help but think with this astronomical surge up in value that there's going to be a phenomenal crash as well.
No, no, no, it is different this time, it is going to accelerate upwards a few more magnitudes higher, then it will plateau at around $10-50.000, and after that it will consistently give 10% return annually after inflation has been deducted... Fantastic opportunity! ;D

madfranks
3rd April 2013, 07:54 AM
No, no, no, it is different this time, it is going to accelerate upwards a few more magnitudes higher, then it will plateau at around $10-50.000, and after that it will consistently give 10% return annually after inflation has been deducted... Fantastic opportunity! ;D

I get your sarcasm, but actually, it is different this time, because this is the first time in human history a crypto-currency has taken hold of the world economy. This truly is uncharted grounds here. Consider that the audience and potential users of bitcoin is everyone in the world. It's not a local currency or even a national currency, it's a world wide currency.

For the record, gold and silver are also world wide currencies.

Ares
3rd April 2013, 07:58 AM
I get your sarcasm, but actually, it is different this time, because this is the first time in human history a crypto-currency has taken hold of the world economy. This truly is uncharted grounds here. Consider that the audience and potential users of bitcoin is everyone in the world. It's not a local currency or even a national currency, it's a world wide currency.

For the record, gold and silver are also world wide currencies.

True and TPTB were the first to get the largest accumulations of silver and gold and work to enslave the rest of us whose ancestors didn't get in on the deal of gold / silver accumulation. This has the potential to be a world changer. ESPECIALLY if bitcoin can get a market cap of 1 trillion FRN's. Image the amount of pull a valuation like that can have on a global economy.

chad
3rd April 2013, 08:22 AM
why does bitcoin have capital controls?

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html

this makes me suspicious.

Cebu_4_2
3rd April 2013, 08:29 AM
why does bitcoin have capital controls?

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html

this makes me suspicious.

Most likely to keep stability?

vacuum
3rd April 2013, 08:31 AM
why does bitcoin have capital controls?

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html

this makes me suspicious.

Hackers have attacked exchanges before. They just want to make sure no one can potentially clean out a very large account if somehow they gain access to it.

If these controls are unpopular, people will leave that exchange and use another one without them.

sirgonzo420
3rd April 2013, 08:31 AM
why does bitcoin have capital controls?

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html

this makes me suspicious.


That's just MtGox, who is licensed with FinCEN, and so must meet AML/KYC regulations.

There are no "capital controls" for Bitcoin.

There are other exchanges besides MtGox (who, by the way, got its name because the domain name was originally for "Magic The Gathering, Online Exchange", but then bitcoins really took off), and there are more and more new ones all the time. Bitcoins<--->USD and/or bitcoins<--->gold/silver can also be traded "over the counter" between private parties.

At current market price, the 1,000 btc limit for MtGox is about $140,000 per day for "verified users", and 10,000 btc (about $1,400,000 per day) for "trusted users".

I'm not sure that this is as much of a problem as you think.... don't like the way they are set up, don't use MtGox - I don't use 'em.

Sparky
3rd April 2013, 08:32 AM
The total bitcoin value has still not approached the total market value of Beanie Babies in circulation at their peak. Yet the price has just tripled in the last three weeks? C'mon people. The price may well reach $1,000, but know that it will be under $10 within a few years.

madfranks
3rd April 2013, 08:32 AM
why does bitcoin have capital controls?

https://mtgox.com/press_release_20130313.html

this makes me suspicious.

Bitcoin doesn't have capital controls. It looks like Mt. Gox, one of many bitcoin exchanges, is enacting capital controls. The solution is, don't use Mt. Gox. They are about to get a lesson in free markets. By restricting withdrawals, people will move away from using them and move towards other exchanges.

steyr_m
3rd April 2013, 09:40 AM
Well said, buddy.

steyr_m
3rd April 2013, 09:42 AM
Wonder who is going to be the next [ex GSUS] Silver Shield/Chris Duane? Maybe the guy who's selling his house in Edm. for BTC.

Neuro
3rd April 2013, 12:28 PM
I get your sarcasm, but actually, it is different this time, because this is the first time in human history a crypto-currency has taken hold of the world economy. This truly is uncharted grounds here. Consider that the audience and potential users of bitcoin is everyone in the world. It's not a local currency or even a national currency, it's a world wide currency.

For the erecord, gold and silver are also world wide currencies.
Sure, it was different with the Internet bubble 2000 also, Internet companies were not to be valued according to how other companies were valued according to assets and profits, it was called a paradigm shift... With bitcoins you really have the ultimate bubble product, cause there is absolutely no way of determining its proper value, it could be $100,000 or it could be $1/100,000, it is all in the eye of the beholder. Right now the holders are probably the very few that started it, and mined millions of it when it was easy a couple of years ago, and a bunch of young people who don't have much money, but put what they could scrape together into bitcoins. The first group is making a killing, selling to the speculators coming in now. VERY unstable market!

sirgonzo420
3rd April 2013, 12:46 PM
Sure, it was different with the Internet bubble 2000 also, Internet companies were not to be valued according to how other companies were valued according to assets and profits, it was called a paradigm shift... With bitcoins you really have the ultimate bubble product, cause there is absolutely no way of determining its proper value, it could be $100,000 or it could be $1/100,000, it is all in the eye of the beholder. Right now the holders are probably the very few that started it, and mined millions of it when it was easy a couple of years ago, and a bunch of young people who don't have much money, but put what they could scrape together into bitcoins. The first group is making a killing, selling to the speculators coming in now. VERY unstable market!


Your thoughts are valued and should be given due consideration. One should not throw life-savings around willy-nilly.

Bitcoin is a gamble, but it is still a faaaar better bet than the lottery. Perhaps the members here should view it as such, and not necessarily as a digital rival to gold.


Also, the original Bitcoin whitepaper is here: http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

It's only 9 pages long.

If one wants to attack Bitcoin as a protocol, then the whitepaper (and of course the open source code as well) is the place to start finding flaws.

madfranks
3rd April 2013, 02:06 PM
Check it out, bitcoins are settling lower into $117 range.

Spun Gold
4th April 2013, 12:25 AM
http://bitcoinmonitor.com/ Fun to watch the transactions.

BTC price currently $ 128.80 usd

chad
4th April 2013, 07:17 AM
mtgox or whatever it is called was "hacked" last night.

Cebu_4_2
4th April 2013, 07:21 AM
135 was 142 earlier.

Ares
4th April 2013, 07:23 AM
mtgox or whatever it is called "hacked..."

Nah, it wasn't hacked. They suffered a DDoS attack. That's equivalent to say if I owned a botnet of a million or so nodes. I tell each one to visit gold-silver.us all at once and just keep refreshing the page to flood the server with millions of request. You'll choke any server with that type of an attack.

DDoS is a denial of service attack. Whoever was targeting Mtgox was doing it to interrupt bitcoin transactions is my guess.

Son-of-Liberty
4th April 2013, 08:08 AM
The problem the bankers have with Bitcoin is they can't suppress the price with counterfeit coins. With gold and silver and the miners they can just create more paper to flood the market with and give the appearance of unlimited supply.

To suppress the bitcoin price they would have to sell bitcoins into the market. To do that they would have to buy bitcoins first which would drive the price higher. So they can't play games like they can with PM's.

This leaves them with hacking, and denial of service attacks to try and disrupt the market.

steyr_m
4th April 2013, 08:26 AM
Nah, it wasn't hacked. They suffered a DDoS attack.

I was wondering why it was flat-lining yesterday

Ares
4th April 2013, 08:50 AM
The problem the bankers have with Bitcoin is they can't suppress the price with counterfeit coins. With gold and silver and the miners they can just create more paper to flood the market with and give the appearance of unlimited supply.

To suppress the bitcoin price they would have to sell bitcoins into the market. To do that they would have to buy bitcoins first which would drive the price higher. So they can't play games like they can with PM's.

This leaves them with hacking, and denial of service attacks to try and disrupt the market.

Yep, which is why I'm a fan of bitcoins. It cannot be manipulated like Gold / silver, fiat can be. No central issuing authority and has the potential to completely disrupt tyrannical governments the world over, including our own.

steyr_m
4th April 2013, 09:06 AM
I dunno, I reading some guys slagging it last night. Why?

FRN, CAD, Euro, GBP are worse that BTC to me. Those currencies have value by decree and is set by Central Banks in terms of inflation.

Of all places, I would think this is the last place to see people balk at BTC. It has everything going for it. -- No-one owns it or controls it; it has the potential to be a defacto globally accepted currency; payments can be made totally anonymously for the payer and recipient; easily convertible to cash or PMs.

What's not to like about it?

Horn
4th April 2013, 12:20 PM
What's not to like about it?



The program is set up so that there will be 21 million (http://blockchain.info/charts/total-bitcoins) mined Bitcoins by 2140, and then it stops (there are about 11 million Bitcoins in circulation today).Each transaction has a unique digital signature (http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2013/04/the-future-of-bitcoin.html) so that everyone in the network can keep track of every Bitcoin and prevent counterfeiting or double-counting. Because the number of new Bitcoins is set to grow at predetermined rate, their value can’t be diluted or inflated away, they are far more portable than normal currency for use in online transactions, and they can be denominated down to 0.00000001, a “Satoshi” (named after Bitcoin’s pseudonymous creator, Satoshi Nakamoto). This has all the properties of a medieval mint -- security, limited supplies, and trustworthy denominations -- but is entirely decentralized.

t's a remarkable success, but it won't be the future of money. Even putting aside security problems -- not surprisingly, a digital currency is a favorite target of hackers (http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/09/hacker-steals-250k-in-bitcoins-from-online-exchange-bitfloor/) -- there’s the potential that Bitcoin will turn from a way of doing anonymous, simple digital transactions and into a speculative-asset investment item, especially if it continues to soar in price. That might promote hoarding of Bitcoins by early adopters and choke off the marketplace.
Although transactions haven’t fallen off a cliff yet, a currency whose value is distinctly bubble-tastic (http://www.cnbc.com/id/100613010) is not something that even digital libertarians will readily spend.

Here’s where a state could easily step in by just … printing more money, so that economic activity is not choked off by scarcity or hoarding. This would be totally consistent with the C View, where money is created by states to facilitate economic activity. But since Bitcoins can only be produced at a predetermined rate, deflation is a constant possibility, or that Bitcoins turn more into a commodity people buy than a currency people use.

It's a remarkable success, but it won't be the future of money. Even putting aside security problems -- not surprisingly, a digital currency is a favorite target of hackers (http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/09/hacker-steals-250k-in-bitcoins-from-online-exchange-bitfloor/) -- there’s the potential that Bitcoin will turn from a way of doing anonymous, simple digital transactions and into a speculative-asset investment item, especially if it continues to soar in price. That might promote hoarding of Bitcoins by early adopters and choke off the marketplace. Although transactions haven’t fallen off a cliff yet, a currency whose value is distinctly bubble-tastic (http://www.cnbc.com/id/100613010) is not something that even digital libertarians will readily spend.
Here’s where a state could easily step in by just … printing more money, so that economic activity is not choked off by scarcity or hoarding. This would be totally consistent with the C View, where money is created by states to facilitate economic activity. But since Bitcoins can only be produced at a predetermined rate, deflation is a constant possibility, or that Bitcoins turn more into a commodity people buy than a currency people use.
Even if Bitcoin remains a niche item for online libertarians, it is still a potent lesson in monetary economics. Call it the B View.



http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-04/sorry-libertarians-history-shows-bitcoin-isn-t-the-future.html

madfranks
4th April 2013, 12:51 PM
Here’s where a state could easily step in by just … printing more money, so that economic activity is not choked off by scarcity or hoarding. This would be totally consistent with the C View, where money is created by states to facilitate economic activity.

I know you didn't write that article Horn, but nobody on this forum should take this argument seriously. It's the same argument why gold shouldn't be money, because it can't be printed. They fear deflation, they fear a valuable money, they think a valuable money will kill the economy, when in fact a valuable money is the bedrock of a prosperous economy.

Horn
4th April 2013, 02:22 PM
I know you didn't write that article Horn, but nobody on this forum should take this argument seriously. It's the same argument why gold shouldn't be money, because it can't be printed. They fear deflation, they fear a valuable money, they think a valuable money will kill the economy, when in fact a valuable money is the bedrock of a prosperous economy.

Gold has yet to be finite. Bitcoin is, i think anyway. Or at least the article states it is.

Finite money creates only death.

Hitch
4th April 2013, 02:51 PM
Finite money creates only death.

I asked this question awhile back and did not receive any concrete answer.

Money supply needs to grow at the same rate as the population, in order to maintain some sort of stability. With bitcoin, too many folks rush into it, and the price soars. There's only 21 million bitcoins (so they say). That means bitcoin, if used as a viable currency, has a capped limit to it's future. It maybe an investment, but not a currency. Currencies must move and change hands. You can park wealth in investments. Bitcoin, to prosper, must be able to grow, at a stable rate, with demand and the population.

This is why gold and silver seem to be the best currency. You can mine them, creating jobs, etc...and pull enough out of the ground to keep up with population growth....

Anyway, what do I know, I'm a blue collar guy who has greasy fingernails.

madfranks
4th April 2013, 03:05 PM
Butterfly labs just doubled their prices for mining rigs. Congrats if you bought one before the jump: http://www.butterflylabs.com/

Horn
4th April 2013, 04:03 PM
Anyway, what do I know, I'm a blue collar guy who has greasy fingernails.

Imagine had you (the unwashed mass) never come to know the cleanliness which is GSUS.

Hitch
4th April 2013, 04:19 PM
Imagine had you (the unwashed mass) never come to know the cleanliness which is GSUS.

I just like to hang out with folks who are smarter than me.;D

Every. Time. I visit this forum I learn something. That is a fact.

sirgonzo420
4th April 2013, 05:57 PM
I just like to hang out with folks who are smarter than me.;D

Every. Time. I visit this forum I learn something. That is a fact.

Not to belabor the point, but it is worthwhile, even at the current price of ~$120 -$140, to purchase at least one bitcoin. Just to have. I personally do not care what you do, but I am just trying to be that little voice that whispers "bitcoin" before it is everywhere and all over, and too damned expensive to afford a whole one.

If I had bought $140 worth of bitcoins on the very first day I ever read the word "bitcoin", I'd have millions of dollars from that initial $140 or I could have mined them on my regular PC. Instead I was skeptical... and took the immediate attitude of "sounds like bullshit", but I finally got around to reading the whitepaper (http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf) and really looking into it, and decided I definitely should have been in it from the beginning!

optionT
4th April 2013, 06:34 PM
I started poking around mt gox and it looks like I have to upload my license and another proof of residency in order to buy/sell. Is there an easier/quicker way to go and buy some bitcoins?

Ares
4th April 2013, 06:43 PM
I started poking around mt gox and it looks like I have to upload my license and another proof of residency in order to buy/sell. Is there an easier/quicker way to go and buy some bitcoins?

Unfortunately not... Not a part I was all that comfortable with but once I get my ASIC miner I need a reliable place to sell my newly mined coins and mtgox is the most trusted.

sirgonzo420
4th April 2013, 06:47 PM
I started poking around mt gox and it looks like I have to upload my license and another proof of residency in order to buy/sell. Is there an easier/quicker way to go and buy some bitcoins?

http://localbitcoins.com

First, school yourself on bitcoin so you don't get fucked.

Then find people locally with cash or whatever other payment method, and exchange for bitcoin sent to an address that only you control, and that you have properly protected and backed up.


Or, ebay sellers are now selling bitcoin.

http://coinbase.com will link to a bank account and allow you to buy from them direct.

http://bitfloor.com - you can deposit cash in their account and be credited to buy BTC on their exchange.

http://bitinstant.com allows you to make a cash deposit at some gas stations and supposedly even walmart, and they sent bitcoin to you quickly.

Horn
4th April 2013, 06:59 PM
Not to belabor the point, but it is worthwhile, even at the current price of ~$120 -$140, to purchase at least one bitcoin. Just to have. I personally do not care what you do, but I am just trying to be that little voice on

If I had bought $140 worth of bitcoins on the very first day I ever read the word "bitcoin", I'd have millions of dollars from that initial $140 or I could have mined them on my regular PC. Instead I was skeptical... and took the immediate attitude of "sounds like bullshit", but I finally got around to reading the whitepaper (http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf) and really looking into it, and decided I definitely should have been in it from the beginning!

You still wouldn't have been any wiser...

How many "Satoshi" would you have spent by now, and what on?

ximmy
4th April 2013, 07:10 PM
Remember this thread... WOW so amazing!

http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?52794-My-bitcoins-Oh-my-bitcoins&highlight=bitcoins


Last: 7.7039 USD

EE_
4th April 2013, 07:11 PM
New: Max Keiser – Bullish on Bitcoins

—————————————————————————————

An interesting thread regarding Bitcoins is playing out on my own site right now. From “Robert,” here is something that may be of interest to Max and Stacey’s audience:

Bitcoin is NOT the brainchild of some random, anonymous genius.Since Cyprus, Bitcoins have gained in value tremendously- this week they even surpassed the parabolic slope and reached toward a truly vertical (and infinite) trajectory.

Do any of you find it counter-referential that the NSA is building the worlds largest/fastest cypher-cracking facility SPECIFICALLY in order to crack the AES cipher (which coincidentally underpins Bitcoin’s “unbreakable” security algorithm)?

Ummmm….. the NSA actually INVENTED the AES cipher in the first place.
And, is it not hysterical that they are going to spend 100 times more on this project than they spent on the project that originally delivered AES…?

Doctor Frankenstien- frantically trying to find the method to kill the beast that he himself unleashed on the world – comical, if not pathetically sad.

But, back to Bitcoins:

Bitcoins are designed to be “mined” ever more efficiently as processing speeds and machine memory continue accelerating due to Moore’s law (that’s Gordon, not me…)

So, The Bitcoin money supply is a function of how effectively computers do their work, just as the Gold money supply has always been a function of how effectively humans do their (real/honest) work.

Here’s the monetary rub with Bitcoin, and consider this CAREFULLY:

Governments each want their currency to rule all others – therefore, they inflate their own currency supply, and buy the others, creating currency strength that incapacitates the internal economy behind the competing currency.

If I was a Central Banker who understood the destructive nature of currency bubbles, would I not use my powers of infinite currency issuance to buy the living hell out of the competing currency? By doing so, I draw in the suckers who see the path to immediate riches, and then pull the rug out from under them at some random top, and watch the whole thing crash and burn…

Beware the Bitcoin.

Mind your Aristotle, my young (and old) disciples:

ALL real and valid money has inherent and intrinsic value (meaning it can never be regarded as totally “worthless” by society)

Bitcoins are data. Data is inherently worthless, except when used as a constructor to true information.

Money is information- it indicates that the holder produces more than they consume, and that they have generated an excess of production that they wish to trade for other forms of excess production.

How can my smartphone full of Bitcoins demonstrate or prove that I am productive?

And here’s a further post from Robert re Silver:

The urge to go 100% Martingale must be be eating at the psyche of the London physical traders right now…

The New York futures market is speculative – it can easily and readily go to zero. Profits are made at the margin, and the futures margins ANYWAYS move inverse to retail premiums on “real” products.

Anyone taken a solid look at retail premiums on bullion products lately?

You find me JUST ONE Silver product anywhere on Earth that can be had for less than $30 per ounce, and I’ll show you a product that is “out of stock”

I fully expect the Wall Street hyenas to start feasting on each other (ala late 2008) real soon here…

http://maxkeiser.com/2013/04/04/regarding-bitcoins/#more-65374

Son-of-Liberty
4th April 2013, 07:14 PM
I started poking around mt gox and it looks like I have to upload my license and another proof of residency in order to buy/sell. Is there an easier/quicker way to go and buy some bitcoins?

I would look into bitinstant if you are in the US. That is how I would have bought some but I live in Canada and they do not service us yet. You can place an order, and print out a receipt. Take it to walmart, they will scan the receipt and then you pay them. Once you have paid they will deposit bitcoins to your wallet.

I haven't done this just what I read.

Jewboo
4th April 2013, 09:01 PM
I started poking around mt gox and it looks like...





The most popular bitcoin exchange, Tokyo-based Mt.Gox announced overnight that it had been the victim of a hacking attack after experiencing a severe lag with its systems. The complications meant the price quickly sank to below $115 before regaining ground to $130 by 6.00 a.m. London time on Thursday, according to Bitcoincharts.com.

Linky (http://www.cnbc.com/id/100615508)

:o

sirgonzo420
4th April 2013, 09:11 PM
The most popular bitcoin exchange, Tokyo-based Mt.Gox announced overnight that it had been the victim of a hacking attack after experiencing a severe lag with its systems. The complications meant the price quickly sank to below $115 before regaining ground to $130 by 6.00 a.m. London time on Thursday, according to Bitcoincharts.com.

Linky (http://www.cnbc.com/id/100615508)

:o

DDOS is a pain.

vacuum
4th April 2013, 09:17 PM
DDOS is a pain.

Probably some guy who is attempting to drive down the price of bitcoins so he can buy a bunch.

BrewTech
4th April 2013, 09:33 PM
perhaps it time to change the name of the forum to bitcoin-litecoin.us.

vacuum
4th April 2013, 10:57 PM
Here's a place where you can buy and sell bitcoins locally:
https://localbitcoins.com/




And here's the sound of change taking place:
http://www.listentobitcoin.com/

Horn
4th April 2013, 11:07 PM
The program is set up so that there will be 21 million (http://blockchain.info/charts/total-bitcoins) mined Bitcoins by 2140, and then it stops (there are about 11 million Bitcoins in circulation today)

What happens when they hit the magic ceiling, do they all self-destruct?

Miners will be forced to reduce their work hours shortly, to span their lifespan.

Shami-Amourae
4th April 2013, 11:53 PM
The algorithms make it mathematically impossible to create any more coins. The more coins that are found, the more difficult they are to find.

Basically if you mined Bitcoins 3 years ago you'd discover more with the same computing power than if you did today, since the difficulty has increased since then.

Horn
5th April 2013, 07:39 AM
The algorithms make it mathematically impossible to create any more coins.

Booo, They should then at some interval start reversing themselves to de-mine at random, so you have to spend it before it destructs.

or they turn into to butterfly bitcoins after being cocooned until another one is created in their image.

Why do I have all the better ideas?

Uncle Salty
5th April 2013, 05:29 PM
http://distilleryimage4.s3.amazonaws.com/537909763e2911e1abb01231381b65e3_7.jpg

Imagine what the CIA/Rothschilds/NSA bit mining rig looks like.

Heck, they could mine the crap out of bitcoins and play pump and dump.

madfranks
6th April 2013, 12:36 PM
I wonder if this guy will find any takers...

Silver Dime Rolls for Bitcoins (http://denver.craigslist.org/clt/3727169799.html)

Hitch
6th April 2013, 02:36 PM
I wonder if this guy will find any takers...

Silver Dime Rolls for Bitcoins (http://denver.craigslist.org/clt/3727169799.html)

I'd jump on that. Imagine, what is better 150 silver dimes or .75 bitcoin, don't pass that up madfranks....that guy has no clue about silver anyway.

AndreaGail
6th April 2013, 03:16 PM
I wonder if this guy will find any takers...

Silver Dime Rolls for Bitcoins (http://denver.craigslist.org/clt/3727169799.html)

I think I know the person who created that ad :D

vacuum
6th April 2013, 11:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4FeS3tFHTg

Shami-Amourae
7th April 2013, 12:35 AM
Imagine what the CIA/Rothschilds/NSA bit mining rig looks like.

Heck, they could mine the crap out of bitcoins and play pump and dump.

They're too busy playing sailboat with Mrs. Doubtfire...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSX7IT2_iQc


The Rothschilds are complete inbred morons with a printing press. It's hard for them to fuck up, but they really are clueless.

vacuum
7th April 2013, 12:51 AM
What's the best way to buy bitcoins fast? The dwolla->mtgox method is taking a very long time.

Shami-Amourae
7th April 2013, 12:54 AM
Virwox used to take me like 2-5 minutes, but that went poof.

I use the Dwolla -> Mt Gox method, and yeah, it takes forever, usually 3-4 days. Make sure you have all your accounts verified before you try doing things too. Verification can take about 24 hours or so. You'll typically need a scan of your drivers license and a proof of an address (like an electric bill scan.)

Once you have your Bitcoins transactions take 5-30 minutes usually. Make sure if you're using a wallet all the block chains are downloaded too.

vacuum
7th April 2013, 12:56 AM
Virwox used to take me like 2-5 minutes, but that went poof.

I use the Dwolla -> Mt Gox method, and yeah, it takes forever, usually 3-4 days. Make sure you have all your accounts verified before you try doing things too. Verification can take about 24 hours a so. You'll typically need a scan of your drivers license and a proof of an address (like an electric bill scan.)

Once you have your Bitcoins transactions take 5-30 minutes usually. Make sure if you're using a wallet all the block chains are downloaded too.


This is what I'm getting:


Your Position in the Verification Queue 12740

Your account verification request has been received, and will be reviewed within the next 10 business days. Please contact aml@mtgox.com if you have any questions or comments.

Shami-Amourae
7th April 2013, 12:58 AM
Yikes that sucks. We'll I've had an account with them for years, and I've spoken to MagicalTux various times over IRC, so it must be a lot different now.

That's why I hate Mt Gox's monopoly on the market.


I'm also pissed off with BTC-e. They have a monopoly on Litecoin trading, so they charge you a 0.5 LTC transaction fee just to take your Litecoins out of their exchange. This crap happens since of lack of competition.

vacuum
7th April 2013, 01:31 AM
http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1ar4cq/its_nearly_impossible_to_buy_bc_in_us/

Neuro
7th April 2013, 02:22 AM
Virwox used to take me like 2-5 minutes, but that went poof.

I use the Dwolla -> Mt Gox method, and yeah, it takes forever, usually 3-4 days. Make sure you have all your accounts verified before you try doing things too. Verification can take about 24 hours or so. You'll typically need a scan of your drivers license and a proof of an address (like an electric bill scan.)

Once you have your Bitcoins transactions take 5-30 minutes usually. Make sure if you're using a wallet all the block chains are downloaded too.
So you are not really anonymous in your bitcoin transactions then?

vacuum
7th April 2013, 02:32 AM
So you are not really anonymous in your bitcoin transactions then?

Not ones which involve converting to or from USD. But after you buy bitcoins on an exchange, you can then use what's called a mixing service.

Basically, you put the bitcoins in a large common ewallet, then transfer them to another address you own. That one will be anonymous.


https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mixing_service

madfranks
7th April 2013, 07:19 AM
What's the best way to buy bitcoins fast? The dwolla->mtgox method is taking a very long time.

With eBay you can have a bitcoin transferred within minutes, just be prepared to pay a large premium for this convenience.

Neuro
7th April 2013, 09:31 AM
Not ones which involve converting to or from USD. But after you buy bitcoins on an exchange, you can then use what's called a mixing service.

Basically, you put the bitcoins in a large common ewallet, then transfer them to another address you own. That one will be anonymous.


https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mixing_service
I buy and sell gold and silver anonymously with cash. I can after purchasing it shift it around to locations i own, without anyone knowing it, and I am sure the day is approaching, where I dont know where I stashed it either... I wouldn't like to do it any other way...

Ponce
7th April 2013, 09:55 AM
A train going to fast can overturn while going around a curb .....remember, there is need and then there is greed.

First post of the day...... good morning to one and all.

V

sirgonzo420
7th April 2013, 10:18 AM
So you are not really anonymous in your bitcoin transactions then?

You can be anonymous if you know how.

All bitcoin transactions in real-time (as well as the entire history of transactions) are viewable by anyone with an internet connection here: http://blockchain.info and a copy of this universal ledger is kept on every computer running a full node.

madfranks
7th April 2013, 11:46 AM
all time high: $161.89

madfranks
7th April 2013, 11:47 AM
A train going to fast can overturn while going around a curb .....remember, there is need and then there is greed.

First post of the day...... good morning to one and all.

V

That is good advice, and you are absolutely right. There is need, there is greed, but there is also good timing.

vacuum
7th April 2013, 02:52 PM
I spent last night looking at the "fundamentals" of bitcoin, and I think they look really good.

Basically, right now there is so much vested in it that it can't be stopped by anyone, except possibly as a state-sponsored 51% attack. possibly.

I was concerned that the fundamental design could have flaws in it, and would need to be replaced by a v2 or something. But it appears to me that the things which can't be changed are very, very basic and new client versions can be released which add features and the miners will mostly all upgrade because they are a tight community.

So flaws in the system can pretty much be fixed. Only huge architectural issues, such as the concept of mining if it were a problem, can't be changed.

For example, the original bitcoin client used a version 1 data structure to store the block chain transaction history with a slow berkley database. Well, I believe that data structure has been updated to a super fast one. The clients and fee structures can be tweaked to adjust confirmation times of purchases.

Any developer, user, or miner who calls for everybody changing to a new crypto currency, away from bitcoin, is ostracized because it is against the interest of those who hold bitcoins. Essentially, it's like a corporation with a $1.6 billion market cap which seeks only to increase that market cap. It will do whatever software upgrades are needed, it will create whatever exchanges are needed, and it will continue to move forward and evolve regardless of any individual's opinion.

I see no reason it will slow down. I predict it will continue to evolve over the very long term, even at the protocol level. The only thing that will remain unchanged is the record books of who holds what. Everything else will be changed or discarded if it begins to hurt the value. Unlike almost all other open source projects, this is the first one driven so hard by time and money.

That's what I got from the research I've done on it.

vacuum
7th April 2013, 05:46 PM
New high of 165.80

edit: closing in on 170 in a matter of seconds

4676

sirgonzo420
7th April 2013, 06:41 PM
LOL. Say what you will about bitcoins, but the entertainment value has been exceedingly high to me thus far.

My silver and gold have been and are good "investments", but my bitcoins are runnin' fuckin' circles around them.

Sure, it could all disappear tomorrow, but so could everything else. The $169 price for one bitcoin is still cheap for the entertainment value. If you *do* buy one, one day perhaps not long from now you may marvel that you have a whole one.

In the words of the late Hunter S. Thompson: Buy the ticket, take the ride!

If you don't hold bitcoin, then you are not diversified.


New high of 165.80

edit: closing in on 170 in a matter of seconds

4676

$172.50

vacuum
7th April 2013, 06:53 PM
173.75

Look at the sizes of these trades.

$30k, $40k, trades going through like nothing. I saw a $570k trade earlier today.

4678

Cebu_4_2
7th April 2013, 08:18 PM
Unregulated market, only time til the FEDS are in here shutting shit down. They have unlimited expenses... Fuk them anyways, I'm going to hook up a new card shortly.

vacuum
8th April 2013, 12:18 AM
http://i.imgur.com/TAHgUPy.jpg

sirgonzo420
8th April 2013, 05:24 AM
Current price: $187.11 per bitcoin, new All Time High







EDIT: new high now $188.79

chad
8th April 2013, 05:26 AM
completely retarded.

mamboni
8th April 2013, 05:36 AM
"A new piece of malware is rocking the Internet society now as it has been found that it is spreading through Skype which basically uses the infected computers to mine for Bitcoins and then make the owner of the malware money. It was discovered by by security firm Kaspersky, the malware is named “Trojan.Win32.Jorik.IRCbot.xkt,” and is spreading at an alarming rate. The malware is thought to have started in Europe, with the worst hit places including Italy, Russia, Poland, Costa Rica, Spain, Germany, and Ukraine. The average clicking rates have hit around 2,000 clicks per hour."
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/04/05/bitcoin_mining_malware_appears/

Jewboo
8th April 2013, 05:46 AM
http://www.cyberpunkreview.com/images/matrix-revolutions-55.jpg
NEO BEGGING FOR HIS BITCOIN




:D Jew Hollywood prepared the goyim for their bitcoin thingie years ago...lol.

Jewboo
8th April 2013, 05:58 AM
completely retarded.



http://0.tqn.com/d/urbanlegends/1/0/i/8/mondex12.gif
STEP RIGHT UP..........GIT YUR BITCOIN INTERFACE GOYIM

https://lh3.ggpht.com/_MSWYMxkfxMY/SA9VPMbRAWI/AAAAAAAAAAc/izUXD84mA-g/s320/000426-medium.gif

Jewboo
8th April 2013, 06:26 AM
I spent last night looking at the "fundamentals" of bitcoin, and I think they look really good.



http://www.a-gc.com/images/2012/11/chips-casino-gambling-games-HD-Wallpapers.jpg

Ok. After we play the game and accumulate all those bitcoin chips who is the real world "Cashier" who hands us some real money so we can buy a real hamburger or cup of real coffee in the real world?

:)

Son-of-Liberty
8th April 2013, 07:57 AM
To be honest, the continued rise in bitcoin prices has me very uneasy about the whole thing. It claims to be a digital currency but as long as the price continues to rise it can't function as one. For a currency to be viable there has to be a market. With the price exploding though you would be a fool to spend your bitcoins on anything right now.

I don't like the structure of the bitcoin where the total in circulation in capped. This design basically guarantees early adopters get rich and everyone who waited will scramble to get in the market. At some point the price could get so outrageous that nobody will want to use bitcoin except those already invested.

That said I don't feel bad playing this market. The bankers are suppressing PM's and messing with every other market right now. What is a guy to do that doesn't want to be economically enslaved?

Just be safe. Have multiple wallets. Don't put all your holdings on one exchange or in one place and take some profits here and there even if that might mean a smaller return. If this thing does blow up in every ones faces at some point it will be those who are "all in" that get burned.

Otherwise the risk to reward ratio on bitcoins is worth it.

sirgonzo420
8th April 2013, 08:13 AM
To be honest, the continued rise in bitcoin prices has me very uneasy about the whole thing. It claims to be a digital currency but as long as the price continues to rise it can't function as one. For a currency to be viable there has to be a market. With the price exploding though you would be a fool to spend your bitcoins on anything right now.

I don't like the structure of the bitcoin where the total in circulation in capped. This design basically guarantees early adopters get rich and everyone who waited will scramble to get in the market. At some point the price could get so outrageous that nobody will want to use bitcoin except those already invested.

That said I don't feel bad playing this market. The bankers are suppressing PM's and messing with every other market right now. What is a guy to do that doesn't want to be economically enslaved?

Just be safe. Have multiple wallets. Don't put all your holdings on one exchange or in one place and take some profits here and there even if that might mean a smaller return. If this thing does blow up in every ones faces at some point it will be those who are "all in" that get burned.

Otherwise the risk to reward ratio on bitcoins is worth it.

Bitcoin is proving to be more of a digital commodity than a currency.

Still worth buying one just for shits and giggles, even at ~$200.

Horn
8th April 2013, 04:53 PM
Bitcoin is proving to be more of a digital commodity than a currency.

Some commodities have short shelf lives.

sirgonzo420
8th April 2013, 08:18 PM
Some commodities have short shelf lives.

Some do. And some don't. Gold, for example, has proven to have more or less an indefinite shelf life. Beanie Babies, as a temporary phenomenon, not so much so...

Being less than a handful of years into this techno-crypto-anarcho-monetary experiment, it remains to be seen as to what Bitcoin will prove to be.

I *have* given a look to the technical fundamentals of Bitcoin, and there is more *substance* to the overall concept in theory, and as the past few years have shown so far, in practice, than the stuffing of all the Beanie Babies in the world.

EDIT: I hold some bitcoin, so I am not buying at these prices... but if I didn't have any, I would pay $200 just to have one for the hell of it, because the concept is intriguing when properly understood.

Shami-Amourae
8th April 2013, 08:27 PM
Being less than a handful of years into this techno-crypto-anarcho-monetary experiment, it remains to be seen as to what Bitcoin will prove to be.

I personally believe there will be a crash, then all the critics will come out and pat themselves on the back and be like "Told you so!" Chris Duane will laugh at us and life will go on as people stop talking about it. When they are beating their chest, and most Bitcoiners are quiet, that's when you buy.

Then 1-2 years later Bitcoin or Litecoin will be back in the spotlight setting new record levels.
:p

Chris Duane will be like "ZOMG it's CIA Illuminati 666 Lizard Agenda!!!"

This process will keep occuring till theres large enough of a market cap, and enough business using cryptocurrencies until Chris Duane claims he was pro-Bitcoin/Litecoin all along and starts calling people 'tards for not buying in like he did.

sirgonzo420
8th April 2013, 08:42 PM
By the way, as a general note, it should be understood that success is not dependent upon price.

The security of the Bitcoin protocol and network is what would constitute success/failure.

I keep expecting some large holders to cash out, but I expected a drop like that at $100 and it didn't exactly happen.

Horn
8th April 2013, 09:34 PM
Gonzo, yur gonzo.

Beanie Babies have intrinsic value uncompared.:)*#*

MNeagle
8th April 2013, 09:40 PM
Gonzo, yur gonzo.

Beanie Babies have intrinsic value uncompared.:)*#*

I think I will forever link Beanie Babies to Avalon...

Horn
8th April 2013, 09:46 PM
Well, I really do wish you all do well with your Bitcoins, as I consider you all to be assets to me.

Just remember me as your poor silver brother when u get there. :)

vacuum
8th April 2013, 10:23 PM
I personally believe there will be a crash, then all the critics will come out and pat themselves on the back and be like "Told you so!" Chris Duane will laugh at us and life will go on as people stop talking about it. When they are beating their chest, and most Bitcoiners are quiet, that's when you buy.

Then 1-2 years later Bitcoin or Litecoin will be back in the spotlight setting new record levels.
:p

Chris Duane will be like "ZOMG it's CIA Illuminati 666 Lizard Agenda!!!"

This process will keep occuring till theres large enough of a market cap, and enough business using cryptocurrencies until Chris Duane claims he was pro-Bitcoin/Litecoin all along and starts calling people 'tards for not buying in like he did.

Possibly, but if europe goes down any time soon I see it continuing to rise.

Neuro
9th April 2013, 03:00 AM
Possibly, but if europe goes down any time soon I see it continuing to rise.
Stairway to heaven? If Europe were to go down I doubt many people would put their trust in something as flimsy as bitcoins, which at least require an Internet connection...

Blink
9th April 2013, 07:11 AM
Bitcoins is just a way for the cabal to steal the remaining wealth from those holding cash close to the chest. The poor do not matter (Agenda 21). We know the cabal wants a OWG and what better way to get everyone on board is to have "the people" develop a virtual global currency themselves. Can't blame the PTB for something we created, can we? When JFK tried to messy with the money, he ended up dead. When Ghaddfi tried to mess with the dollar, he ended up dead. Saddam went the same route as well. So, what prevented them from knocking off a couple of IT hacks? Nothing. This crypto-currency is being flaunted in the government/banker's faces and nothing is happening. Maybe, they're making a list of those that subscribe to circumventing legal tender laws (FEMA camp membership) or after crashing this (BTC), they'll come up with their own "new and improved" version. You will need power/equipment/internet to run (not very self sufficient to say the least)............ We are being set up.

Son-of-Liberty
9th April 2013, 08:22 AM
Bitcoins is just a way for the cabal to steal the remaining wealth from those holding cash close to the chest. The poor do not matter (Agenda 21). We know the cabal wants a OWG and what better way to get everyone on board is to have "the people" develop a virtual global currency themselves. Can't blame the PTB for something we created, can we? When JFK tried to messy with the money, he ended up dead. When Ghaddfi tried to mess with the dollar, he ended up dead. Saddam went the same route as well. So, what prevented them from knocking off a couple of IT hacks? Nothing. This crypto-currency is being flaunted in the government/banker's faces and nothing is happening. Maybe, they're making a list of those that subscribe to circumventing legal tender laws (FEMA camp membership) or after crashing this (BTC), they'll come up with their own "new and improved" version. You will need power/equipment/internet to run (not very self sufficient to say the least)............ We are being set up.

There is some potential that this is a set up but if so I think it has grown out of their control. The software is open source. Anyone can see the code. Weaknesses are being fixed and competitors are cropping up.

As for lists. I am already on them all if they do exist.

We're not saying that this is the end all be all just another option for those trying to protect themselves from theft of their wealth.

IF it does come down it is more likely to be the result of the inherent weaknesses in the design of bitcoin to be used as a viable currency. Size of blockchain and limited supply are the biggest weaknesses I see.

Son-of-Liberty
9th April 2013, 08:29 AM
The banksters/government indirectly created bitcoin by their stranglehold on the money supply and constant financial abuse of the people of the world. Only a matter of time before someone came up with a solution to the problem they created.

I don't think that bitcoin will always be the ultimate in cryto currencies however. One of the competitors it spawns will be.

vacuum
9th April 2013, 08:49 AM
It's at $223 right now for a bitcoin

It's going to continue going up daily. Why? Because it's not that easy to transfer money into bitcoin and it can only be done during business hours when banks are open. Every day starting at about 6 - 7 am eastern time more money flows into bitcoin till it stops flowing in at the end of the day on the west coast. At night there isn't much trading going on because there's a fixed amount of dollars in the system.


Edit: 227.73 and rising
4683

Sparky
9th April 2013, 09:50 AM
It's at $223 right now for a bitcoin

It's going to continue going up daily. Why? Because it's not that easy to transfer money into bitcoin and it can only be done during business hours when banks are open. Every day starting at about 6 - 7 am eastern time more money flows into bitcoin till it stops flowing in at the end of the day on the west coast. At night there isn't much trading going on because there's a fixed amount of dollars in the system.


Edit: 227.73 and rising
4683

So even though it's already up 10x since the beginning of the year, it can really only continue to go up. I think I understand now.

vacuum
9th April 2013, 10:16 AM
So even though it's already up 10x since the beginning of the year, it can really only continue to go up. I think I understand now.

Since bitcoins have no intrinsic value, their price can increase unimpeded. The only thing that determines the price is how many dollars/euros/whatever there are that want bitcoins. Because the market cap is only $2 billion or so right now, there are many many dollars/euros/etc left which may want to move into bitcoin. People are just now starting to hear about it.

For example, look at how much the search volume has increased, and look at the country which is doing the searching: russia
http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=bitcoin

Because of cyprus, russians are learning about bitcoin. The only thing stopping much more money from going into it is that it's new, and it's uncertain whether everything won't somehow go poof. The other thing is it's not too easy to transfer money right now. If you mis-type a single character of the alpha-numeric address you are trying to send your bitcoins to, it's gone permanently. So as tools make it using it more fool-proof, and as the system proves it's robustness, people will move more and more capital into it.

The only thing that's important, which would cause the price to drop, is if the system fails to work as designed. If you can't move money from address A to address B for example. Or if someone could create fake coins. Other than that it's just a book-keeping system that's 100% honest. Why would people abandon this book keeping system as long as it stays honest and is always available?



Make no mistake though, the bankers are really poweful and this is something they'd really hate. So who knows what will happen. There will be some epic price collapses I'm sure due to the heavy handed tactics they will employ. For example, they might confiscate and destroy bitcoins from an exchange. That would hurt the book keeping system. But it won't affect those who hold their own bitcoins.

It will probably be like with physical during a price collapse. You really want to buy some, but you can't, either because the exchange was swat-teamed, or it was outlawed, or whatever.

vacuum
9th April 2013, 10:25 AM
It hit $239

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 10:51 AM
Bitcoins is just a way for the cabal to steal the remaining wealth from those holding cash close to the chest.
How? Bitcoins were developed by the crypto-anarchist community. All money "pumped" into it enriches the anarchist/libertarian movement. Why would they want to make the people who want to destroy them wealthy? Seriously do you understand how much the people who are in the Bitcoin community absolutely hate the NWO/bankers/Rothschilds?



This crypto-currency is being flaunted in the government/banker's faces and nothing is happening.
Because they don't know WTF it is. More than half the people on this forum don't know WTF it is, and this is a decent group of very intelligent, awake people. I'm pretty sure the controllers don't know WTF it is either.

They don't know how to shut it down. They know if they talk about it too much more people will get interested and they will lose total power. They have no power over this, other than shutting down exchanges (the current weakness.) This is the tool(s) we need to destroy the bankers once and for all. Their whole system is based on confidence. We have an alternative now and people are moving into that alternative. As time goes on there will be a shift (hopefully). Right now we need education and convince more people to leave the banking system and join the free and decentralized cryptocurrency movement. Prices will stabilize eventually whether its on the upside or downside and more commerce can commence. The price is skyrocketing from new entrants, not by old timers pushing up the price. This is an obvious shift.

Is this a bubble, or the implementation of new technologies? Will it return back to the long term mean?
http://gailtheactuary.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/world-population-and-fuel-use.png




they'll come up with their own "new and improved" version.
The best cryptographers and hackers are almost all anarchists/libertarians. If the bankers/government came out with a cryptocurrency no one would use it, and it wouldn't even work since you need the users confidence for it to work. People who are computer savvy enough to even know what a Bitcoin is aren't dumb enough to trust the government. The people who are using Bitcoin are fully awake on how the banks and governments really work. They know about the Federal Reserve, they know about they Rothschilds, that's why they designed/put faith in the cryptocurrencies to BEGIN with.




You will need power/equipment/internet to run (not very self sufficient to say the least)............ We are being set up.
No we aren't. The bankers/government aren't that smart. They are just a 10 year old autistic kid with a printing press. They are not intelligent by ANY stretch. Do you have any idea how hard it is to fuck up and fail when you have a printing press? It's very hard, you pretty much have to try to fail. They can employ intelligent people to help enslave us, but as a whole these people are slow moving, and completely retarded. Imagine trying to go before the Congress and explaining what Bitcoins are, and on top of that what Cryptography is. These people wouldn't and wont get it before it's too late for them. The elites are inbred and completely detached from reality. They will lose their power before they know what hit them. The trick is to not fight on their terms, that's why we ALWAYS fail before. If you fight on their terms by doing things like voting, or using physical violence (which they hold monopolies one) they will win.

You can take Goliath down easily with a very simple weapon, and a well placed shot. Never attack an enemy who is bigger and stronger than you from an angle they expect. Find a weakness, attack them by surprise and watch them fall. We don't have to be slaves anymore. We can be free. There are solutions now with the new technologies that are emerging.

Ares
9th April 2013, 11:13 AM
How? Bitcoins were developed by the crypto-anarchist community. All money "pumped" into it enriches the anarchist/libertarian movement. Why would they want to make the people who want to destroy them wealthy? Seriously do you understand how much the people who are in the Bitcoin community absolutely hate the NWO/bankers/Rothschilds?

Because they don't know WTF it is. More than half the people on this forum don't know WTF it is, and this is a decent group of very intelligent, awake people. I'm pretty sure the controllers don't know WTF it is either.

They don't know how to shut it down. They know if they talk about it too much more people will get interested and they will lose total power. They have no power over this, other than shutting down exchanges (the current weakness.) This is the tool(s) we need to destroy the bankers once and for all. Their whole system is based on confidence. We have an alternative now and people are moving into that alternative. As time goes on there will be a shift (hopefully). Right now we need education and convince more people to leave the banking system and join the free and decentralized cryptocurrency movement. Prices will stabilize eventually whether its on the upside or downside and more commerce can commence. The price is skyrocketing from new entrants, not by old timers pushing up the price. This is an obvious shift.

Is this a bubble, or the implementation of new technologies? Will it return back to the long term mean?
http://gailtheactuary.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/world-population-and-fuel-use.png




The best cryptographers and hackers are almost all anarchists/libertarians. If the bankers/government came out with a cryptocurrency no one would use it, and it wouldn't even work since you need the users confidence for it to work. People who are computer savvy enough to even know what a Bitcoin is aren't dumb enough to trust the government. The people who are using Bitcoin are fully awake on how the banks and governments really work. They know about the Federal Reserve, they know about they Rothschilds, that's why they designed/put faith in the cryptocurrencies to BEGIN with.




No we aren't. The bankers/government aren't that smart. They are just a 10 year old autistic kid with a printing press. They are not intelligent by ANY stretch. Do you have any idea how hard it is to fuck up and fail when you have a printing press? It's very hard, you pretty much have to try to fail. They can employ intelligent people to help enslave us, but as a whole these people are slow moving, and completely retarded. Imagine trying to go before the Congress and explaining what Bitcoins are, and on top of that what Cryptography is. These people wouldn't and wont get it before it's too late for them. The elites are inbred and completely detached from reality. They will lose their power before they know what hit them. The trick is to not fight on their terms, that's why we ALWAYS fail before. If you fight on their terms by doing things like voting, or using physical violence (which they hold monopolies one) they will win.

You can take Goliath down easily with a very simple weapon, and a well placed shot. Never attack an enemy who is bigger and stronger than you from an angle they expect. Find a weakness, attack them by surprise and watch them fall. We don't have to be slaves anymore. We can be free. There are solutions now with the new technologies that are emerging.



Quoted for truth, couldn't of said it better myself. Nice job

sirgonzo420
9th April 2013, 11:14 AM
New all time high: $240

How many days ago did I post a thread about it reaching parity with an ounce of silver at ~ $27?

vacuum
9th April 2013, 11:18 AM
I don't think that bitcoin will always be the ultimate in cryto currencies however. One of the competitors it spawns will be.
Likely, but I think it will be around for a long time.

The misconception people have with bitcoin is that it's static, and therefore either copies of it can be created or a version 2 will come out and displace it with another crypto currency.

However, new versions of it are being released all of the time. Only the past history and total number of coins remains static. Almost everything else is subject to change: encryption algorithms used, data structures, number of decimal points available, transactions per second allowed by the network, etc. What they call a "hard fork" means that people need to update their clients. It doesn't mean people's balances change.

Horn
9th April 2013, 01:01 PM
Why would Bitcoin curse itself to a death sentence in 2140 then, Shami?

vacuum
9th April 2013, 01:05 PM
Why would Bitcoin curse itself to a death sentence in 2140 then, Shami?

There is nothing stopping it from working after that date. Miners not only get money from mining coins, but also from collection transaction fees on the transactions they facilitate. Between now and 2140, their revenue will gradually shift from being mostly mined bitcoins into being mostly from transaction fees.

Ares
9th April 2013, 01:06 PM
Why would Bitcoin curse itself to a death sentence in 2140 then, Shami?

Unlike the fiat FRN which can be printed into infinity, bitcoins can only be mined until the year 2140 to limit them being inflated. If you still mine for bitcoins after that year. You'll be given transaction fees for securing the ledger and confirming that the coin is authentic.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 01:13 PM
What they said.

madfranks
9th April 2013, 01:25 PM
The price is skyrocketing from new entrants, not by old timers pushing up the price. This is an obvious shift.

I think that could be it. Bitcoin is proving itself to be a viable alternative to state issued currencies, and with what 1 or maybe 2% of the population even knowing what they are, with every passing day, thousands more enter the bitcoin economy and make the currency more valuable. We are so used to depreciating money (it's all we've ever known) that when an appreciating money comes along we're skeptical that it can't be real! Remember, when the US was on the gold coin standard, the money appreciated every year. You could buy more next year with your gold dollars than you could this year, which is the opposite of our money today.

On the other hand, I can't help but think that this phenominal increase in the trading value for bitcoins is a massive pump and dump courtesy of central bankers around the world. Isn't the Fed permitted to buy any asset it wishes? What if the Fed is simply pumping money via thousands of anonymous exchange accounts into the bitcoin economy? Then once they own a controlling share they can dump it. The longer they maintain the bubble, the more people will be attracted to it, the more people will put their own money in it, and wham! once they dump it, humanity's faith in cryptocurrencies is shattered.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 01:41 PM
humanity's faith in cryptocurrencies is shattered.

Many of us felt that humanities faith in cryptocurrencies was shattered in the 2011 crash of Bitcoin when the price went from $30 to $2. In the larger scale of things all it did was strengthen the fundamentals, shake out weak hands, and send prices to all time highs. The Bitcoin market is basically the example of what the Gold/Silver market would be if bankers weren't able to manipulate Gold/Silver with paper (derivatives.)

If the bankers somehow buy up all of the Bitcoins we always have alternatives, like Litecoin. All of my money is with Litecoin, not Bitcoin, since I think that's a better place to be since prices are still low. Once Mt Gox officially implements it it will skyrocket, even if Bitcoin plunges. Mt Gox already has the API in place:
https://mtgox.com/api/1/generic/currency?currency=LTC

Even if this current run ends in a crash (which is likely) it will have educated more people about cryptocurrencies, and more people will stick around than leave. Check out these Google Trends for Bitcoin:
http://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=bitcoin&cmpt=q

This is a no brainer investment once you understand the fundamentals and this new groundbreaking information. Litecoin is your second chance to get at the bottom of the Bitcoin style run. I may be wrong, but that's what I personally believe.


The idea of cryptocurrencies is here to stay forever.

Horn
9th April 2013, 02:30 PM
Miners not only get money from mining coins,

How to get more Bitcoins, when there ain't no more Bitcoins?

Sorry, your currency is a dead flop without expansion.

Silver and Gold's is unlimited.

madfranks
9th April 2013, 02:57 PM
How to get more Bitcoins, when there ain't no more Bitcoins?

Sorry, your currency is a dead flop without expansion.

Silver and Gold's is unlimited.

You trade for it, just like you trade for gold and silver today. Stability is a key factor in what a good money provides. Gold is incredibly stable due to it's rarity, but is still being mined. The biggest market bumps during the gold standard days where when lots of gold was found during the gold rush days. Do you think if all the gold was mined on earth that gold would become a "dead flop"? What about silver? There's lots of talk about the silver supply drying up; once you can't mine any more silver, will that cause the price of silver to collapse?

Horn
9th April 2013, 03:07 PM
will that cause the price of silver to collapse?

The world to.

There's always the moon Alice...

Yes, people would revert to Tallysticks been there done that.

Horn
9th April 2013, 03:49 PM
I believe it was created by computer manufacturers who's profit margins were falling below expected levels.

Whether or not they had any sense as to the scale it might achieve or was needed, is debatable, maybe it was only designed towards a specific market & quantity of users & their equipment.

Well them and Internet Gambling sites teamed up.

Those casino makers are among the most secure and insured programs on the face of the planet. Obama did them wrong.

Sparky
9th April 2013, 05:15 PM
New all time high: $240

How many days ago did I post a thread about it reaching parity with an ounce of silver at ~ $27?

Too few to give any sense of price stability.

I'm not saying it can't go to $1000, but the ride might make a lot of people sea sick.

Blink
9th April 2013, 05:29 PM
How? Bitcoins were developed by the crypto-anarchist community. All money "pumped" into it enriches the anarchist/libertarian movement. Why would they want to make the people who want to destroy them wealthy? Seriously do you understand how much the people who are in the Bitcoin community absolutely hate the NWO/bankers/Rothschilds?



Because they don't know WTF it is. More than half the people on this forum don't know WTF it is, and this is a decent group of very intelligent, awake people. I'm pretty sure the controllers don't know WTF it is either.

They don't know how to shut it down. They know if they talk about it too much more people will get interested and they will lose total power. They have no power over this, other than shutting down exchanges (the current weakness.) This is the tool(s) we need to destroy the bankers once and for all. Their whole system is based on confidence. We have an alternative now and people are moving into that alternative. As time goes on there will be a shift (hopefully). Right now we need education and convince more people to leave the banking system and join the free and decentralized cryptocurrency movement. Prices will stabilize eventually whether its on the upside or downside and more commerce can commence. The price is skyrocketing from new entrants, not by old timers pushing up the price. This is an obvious shift.

Is this a bubble, or the implementation of new technologies? Will it return back to the long term mean?
http://gailtheactuary.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/world-population-and-fuel-use.png




The best cryptographers and hackers are almost all anarchists/libertarians. If the bankers/government came out with a cryptocurrency no one would use it, and it wouldn't even work since you need the users confidence for it to work. People who are computer savvy enough to even know what a Bitcoin is aren't dumb enough to trust the government. The people who are using Bitcoin are fully awake on how the banks and governments really work. They know about the Federal Reserve, they know about they Rothschilds, that's why they designed/put faith in the cryptocurrencies to BEGIN with.




No we aren't. The bankers/government aren't that smart. They are just a 10 year old autistic kid with a printing press. They are not intelligent by ANY stretch. Do you have any idea how hard it is to fuck up and fail when you have a printing press? It's very hard, you pretty much have to try to fail. They can employ intelligent people to help enslave us, but as a whole these people are slow moving, and completely retarded. Imagine trying to go before the Congress and explaining what Bitcoins are, and on top of that what Cryptography is. These people wouldn't and wont get it before it's too late for them. The elites are inbred and completely detached from reality. They will lose their power before they know what hit them. The trick is to not fight on their terms, that's why we ALWAYS fail before. If you fight on their terms by doing things like voting, or using physical violence (which they hold monopolies one) they will win.

You can take Goliath down easily with a very simple weapon, and a well placed shot. Never attack an enemy who is bigger and stronger than you from an angle they expect. Find a weakness, attack them by surprise and watch them fall. We don't have to be slaves anymore. We can be free. There are solutions now with the new technologies that are emerging.


Then it would safe to say we disagree. For what its worth, you have too many absolutes in your explanation. The government isn't that smart, limited intelligence, your also assuming who invented it (I thought the guy is still unknown, could be wrong), they don't know what it is, they don't know how to shut it down, to name a few. You assume a lot about Bitcoin and government/bankers ability to shut it down or affect it. And of course anti-government, anti-NWO types are driving it, thats who its being sold to in this atmosphere of financial instability. And I'll say it again, its being flaunted in government's face and nothing is being done. Not even a speech (in case they can't shut it down like you say) discouraging people that circumventing taxes and legal tender laws could be hazardous to their health. Naw, smells fishy to me, but, to each its own............

madfranks
9th April 2013, 06:16 PM
Then it would safe to say we disagree. For what its worth, you have too many absolutes in your explanation. The government isn't that smart, limited intelligence, your also assuming who invented it (I thought the guy is still unknown, could be wrong), they don't know what it is, they don't know how to shut it down, to name a few. You assume a lot about Bitcoin and government/bankers ability to shut it down or affect it. And of course anti-government, anti-NWO types are driving it, thats who its being sold to in this atmosphere of financial instability. And I'll say it again, its being flaunted in government's face and nothing is being done. Not even a speech (in case they can't shut it down like you say) discouraging people that circumventing taxes and legal tender laws could be hazardous to their health. Naw, smells fishy to me, but, to each its own............

Do you think the DEA could shut down Silk Road any day and are just pretending that they can't?

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 06:28 PM
Then it would safe to say we disagree. For what its worth, you have too many absolutes in your explanation. The government isn't that smart, limited intelligence, your also assuming who invented it (I thought the guy is still unknown, could be wrong), they don't know what it is, they don't know how to shut it down, to name a few. You assume a lot about Bitcoin and government/bankers ability to shut it down or affect it. And of course anti-government, anti-NWO types are driving it, thats who its being sold to in this atmosphere of financial instability. And I'll say it again, its being flaunted in government's face and nothing is being done. Not even a speech (in case they can't shut it down like you say) discouraging people that circumventing taxes and legal tender laws could be hazardous to their health. Naw, smells fishy to me, but, to each its own............

To me, that's like saying the MPAA/RIAA invented Bit-Torrent.

Bit-Torrent almost wiped out the entire recording and movie industries, and forced them to radically reform and become less powerful/influential in the world. We know Bit-Torrent was invented by Bram Cohen, but it's no longer in his control. He made his system open sourced and now it's part of the community, and developed in a decentralized fashion by the community. Bram Cohen has a lot to do with the creation of Bitcoin since Bit-Torrent was one of the things that inspired it.

The banking system wont be entirely destroyed, but it will be forced to be more honest and run better. It will also have less power since it will have more competition. This is how Bit-Torrent changed the Entertainment industry, and this is how Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will change the Financial industry. That's the entire point. That is the goal.


I don't assume these things since I'm a programmer and have dealt with virtual currencies like this FOR A LIVING since 2006. I make my entire income on virtual currencies. My entire life is virtual. I have a long history of doing this stuff.

Blink
9th April 2013, 06:51 PM
Do you think the DEA could shut down Silk Road any day and are just pretending that they can't?

Don't know, never been there. Really don't care about it anyways from what I heard........

Blink
9th April 2013, 07:05 PM
To me, that's like saying the MPAA/RIAA invented Bit-Torrent.

Bit-Torrent almost wiped out the entire recording and movie industries, and forced them to radically reform and become less powerful/influential in the world. We know Bit-Torrent was invented by Bram Cohen, but it's no longer in his control. He made his system open sourced and now it's part of the community, and developed in a decentralized fashion by the community. Bram Cohen has a lot to do with the creation of Bitcoin since Bit-Torrent was one of the things that inspired it.

The banking system wont be entirely destroyed, but it will be forced to be more honest and run better. It will also have less power since it will have more competition. This is how Bit-Torrent changed the Entertainment industry, and this is how Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies will change the Financial industry. That's the entire point. That is the goal.


I don't assume these things since I'm a programmer and have dealt with virtual currencies like this FOR A LIVING since 2006. I make my entire income on virtual currencies. My entire life is virtual. I have a long history of doing this stuff.


Thats all fine and dandy, but, you still assume what government/banks can and cannot do, and any programmer knowledge won't help you in that regard. That type of certainty is dangerous not only to you but to others. Maybe BTC is legit (I don't know), but, I do know it has a track record of about 4 years now and its only really taken off in the last year (few months really). Every forum I've been too has cheerleaders talking about how government "can't" stop it. Jesus, its like you all read from the same playbook. Like I said before, to each its own.............

Horn
9th April 2013, 07:42 PM
I make my entire income on virtual currencies. My entire life is virtual. I have a long history of doing this stuff.

Great debate, anything created by man can be destroyed by men in short order, IMO.

The creators should step forward and make their intentions known, anything else leads you to believe otherwise.

Or at least have something representing them, then if they did get cut down (by those entities that they were opposed to) there would be even more move towards the cause.

Ares
9th April 2013, 07:49 PM
Thats all fine and dandy, but, you still assume what government/banks can and cannot do, and any programmer knowledge won't help you in that regard. That type of certainty is dangerous not only to you but to others. Maybe BTC is legit (I don't know), but, I do know it has a track record of about 4 years now and its only really taken off in the last year (few months really). Every forum I've been too has cheerleaders talking about how government "can't" stop it. Jesus, its like you all read from the same playbook. Like I said before, to each its own.............

So if we're cheer leaders, does that make you a "Debbie downer"? Making excuses and accusations about a protocol you simply do not understand and have no desire to even learn.

As you say, to each their own.

Ares
9th April 2013, 07:57 PM
Great debate, anything created by man can be destroyed by men in short order, IMO.

The creators should step forward and make their intentions known, anything else leads you to believe otherwise.

Or at least have something representing them, then if they did get cut down (by those entities that they were opposed to) there would be even more move towards the cause.
That also applies to the banking system you appear to be defending. The author of the BTC has made his intentions know. Read the damn papers he/she/they published http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

So you don't look like a fool spouting non-sense about a system, protocol, or currency you simply do not know, don't want to know and just dismiss as a slight. To each their own, no one is forcing you to read, respond or remark in this forum. But all I see is back in forth between you, Blink, and a couple others. Looking completely foolish because you have no understanding of how a P2P system works. You act like governments or banks can just flip a switch and shut it down. THEY CAN'T!!
You act like they are all powerful THEY ARE NOT!
You act like they are all knowing THEY ARE NOT!
Don't you think they would of shut down bit-torrent networks by now? Silk Road, up and running for 3+ years now, not so much as a raid on the site by any authorities in any country. If you know how to mask your IP, you can appear anywhere in the world. Bitcoin is a currency developed to meet the needs of people who want to transact business without having their government or bank involved in the process. I thought that's why we were all here is it not?
So a solution comes along, you and others like you dismiss it and throw some wild ass conspiracies with no proof, no thought, and no understanding of it's foundations.

sirgonzo420
9th April 2013, 08:00 PM
Too few to give any sense of price stability.

I'm not saying it can't go to $1000, but the ride might make a lot of people sea sick.

Absolutely no argument here.

"Price discovery mode" for Bitcoin has been insane to put it mildly.

Blink
9th April 2013, 08:10 PM
So if we're cheer leaders, does that make you a "Debbie downer"? Making excuses and accusations about a protocol you simply do not understand and have no desire to even learn.

As you say, to each their own.


Yeah, I wobbled about using the term "cheerleader", though its not really derogatory, just enthusiastic (maybe I should have said that instead), anyways, I'm not a "Debbie downer", I'm just watching to see how this evolves and I haven't made any accusations about anything, just stating concerns, thats all. You should calm down a bit if you want to sell the product in a good light. And you assume I have "no desire" to learn. You know sh*t about me. But, at least we agree on "to each its (don't know what you are) own".............

Blink
9th April 2013, 08:17 PM
That also applies to the banking system you appear to be defending. The author of the BTC has made his intentions know. Read the damn papers he/she/they published http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

So you don't look like a fool spouting non-sense about a system, protocol, or currency you simply do not know, don't want to know and just dismiss as a slight. To each their own, no one is forcing you to read, respond or remark in this forum. But all I see is back in forth between you, Blink, and a couple others. Looking completely foolish because you have no understanding of how a P2P system works. You act like governments or banks can just flip a switch and shut it down. THEY CAN'T!!
You act like they are all powerful THEY ARE NOT!
You act like they are all knowing THEY ARE NOT!
Don't you think they would of shut down bit-torrent networks by now? Silk Road, up and running for 3+ years now, not so much as a raid on the site by any authorities in any country. If you know how to mask your IP, you can appear anywhere in the world. Bitcoin is a currency developed to meet the needs of people who want to transact business without having their government or bank involved in the process. I thought that's why we were all here is it not?
So a solution comes along, you and others like you dismiss it and throw some wild ass conspiracies with no proof, no thought, and no understanding of it's foundations.


I'm not going to go through your whole list of rants. You act like you have all the answers, YOU DON'T!! There doesn't seem to be a discussion, its all rah, f*cking rah BTC (There, I learned the acronym, happy) and any concerns are brushed aside like we're frightened children. F*ck you and horse you rode in on. You want to sell me something, I want assurances (especially these days) and Bitcon doesn't provide enough of them and neither do you........

Ares
9th April 2013, 08:21 PM
Yeah, I wobbled about using the term "cheerleader", though its not really derogatory, just enthusiastic (maybe I should have said that instead), anyways, I'm not a "Debbie downer", I'm just watching to see how this evolves and I haven't made any accusations about anything, just stating concerns, thats all. You should calm down a bit if you want to sell the product in a good light. And you assume I have "no desire" to learn. You know sh*t about me. But, at least we agree on "to each its (don't know what you are) own".............

You haven't expressed a desire to learn, just vent your concerns and make baseless accusations. I don't need to know shit about you. Do I care? Nope, only thing I get sick and tired of is people making accusations about something they don't understand. Its not my job to educate you or sell you a "product" that's YOUR job. I'm not going to spoon feed you anything.

Ares
9th April 2013, 08:24 PM
I'm not going to go through your whole list of rants. You act like you have all the answers, YOU DON'T!! There doesn't seem to be a discussion, its all rah, f*cking rah BTC (There, I learned the acronym, happy) and any concerns are brushed aside like we're frightened children. F*ck you and horse you rode in on. You want to sell me something, I want assurances (especially these days) and Bitcon doesn't provide enough of them and neither do you........

LOL temper temper little child. No fuck you and the ignorant horse that brought you here. I do have answers when it pertains to something I've studied for a while. You're being brushed aside for the frightened child that you are. Cling to your gold and silver, fine by me.

But it's not my fucking job to educate you, or to sell your worthless ass anything. Not my job to give you any assurances. So go back into that hole you crawled out of and stay there while the world moves on without you.

Horn
9th April 2013, 08:38 PM
That also applies to the banking system you appear to be defending. The author of the BTC has made his intentions know. Read the damn papers he/she/they published http://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf

So what's his name?

Everyone was saying they had no idea who he was.

Jewboo
9th April 2013, 08:40 PM
So what's his name?



...and who pays all the programmers to maintain the Bitcoin software?

:(??

Ares
9th April 2013, 08:46 PM
So what's his name?

Everyone was saying they had no idea who he was.

Nope, no one knows his real identity. If you developed a system that could collapse empires, would you want to be known for it?

Satoshi Nakamoto, who created Bitcoin in 2009, left the system to develop on its own in 2011; his true identity was never revealed.
One popular theory among Russian bloggers speculates that Nakamoto is Grigory Perelman, a reclusive Russian mathematician famous for solving the Poincaré conjecture and receiving the Fields Medal – the 'Nobel prize of math,' – for the achievement.

http://rt.com/news/bitcoin-challenge-dollar-currency-121/

Ares
9th April 2013, 08:48 PM
...and who pays all the programmers to maintain the Bitcoin software?

:(??

No one, that's the beauty of it being Open Source. The source code is there, you can improve upon it, add your name for recognition and go on to the next project.

Horn
9th April 2013, 08:51 PM
If you developed a system that could collapse empires, would you want to be known for it?

Of course.

Other than that, the only thing about intention in the white papers is that it removes trust.

This thing is doomed without it.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 08:53 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlKwQEk31a4

Ares
9th April 2013, 08:56 PM
Of course.

Other than that, the only thing about intention in the white papers is that it removes trust.

This thing is doomed without it.

So are all currencies, even gold. It's why it's measured, drilled and under goes acid test to verify that it is what it is. The mathematical equation removes the human element and your trusting machines to verify that the coin is real, and not counterfeited.

Jewboo
9th April 2013, 08:57 PM
No one, that's the beauty of it being Open Source. The source code is there, you can improve upon it, add your name for recognition and go on to the next project.



https://seattle98.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/126.jpg

I happen to share Blink's apprehension. According to you, no one is personally responsible for the integrity of Bitcoins and anyone can "improve" the code. What or who prevents someone from "improving" the code to divert credits into their own Bitcoin Wallet?

If our Bitcoins get stolen who do we call?

:(??

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:07 PM
So are all currencies, even gold. It's why it's measured, drilled and under goes acid test to verify that it is what it is. The mathematical equation removes the human element and your trusting machines to verify that the coin is real, and not counterfeited.

Trust with gold is inherit that it isn't created by man or machine, and is intrinsic.

His removal of trust was solely based in the transaction (powered by fiat) is my understanding, there isn't a single code created by man that won't be broken by men.

The original intent was finite based on some specific market of fish bait, or how long it might take before noticed & broken.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 09:07 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3MBJUhIu2b4

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 09:09 PM
What or who prevents someone from "improving" the code to divert credits into their own Bitcoin Wallet?

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths#Bitcoin_is_not_decentralized_because_the_dev elopers_can_dictate_the_software.27s_behavior


Bitcoin is not decentralized because the developers can dictate the software's behavior

The Bitcoin protocol was originally defined by Bitcoin's inventor, Satoshi Nakamoto (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Satoshi_Nakamoto), and this protocol has now been widely accepted as the standard by the community of miners and users.
Though the developers of the original Bitcoin client still exert influence over the Bitcoin community, their power to arbitrarily modify the protocol is very limited. Since the release of Bitcoin v0.3, changes to the protocol have been minor and always in agreement with community consensus.
Protocol modifications, such as increasing the block award from 25 to 50 BTC, are not compatible with clients already running in the network. If the developers were to release a new client that the majority of miners perceives as corrupt, or in violation of the project’s aims, that client would simply not catch on, and the few users who do try to use it would find that their transactions get rejected by the network.
There are also other Bitcoin clients made by other developers (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Category:Clients) that adhere to the Bitcoin protocol. As more developers create alternative clients, less power will lie with the developers of the original Bitcoin client.


Lets say I wanted to alter the code myself. I could, and know how to. I make my own client, and do like you said. My client would be rejected by the network and any transactions I tried to do would be ignored/declined.

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:09 PM
https://seattle98.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/126.jpg

I happen to share Blink's apprehension. According to you, no one is personally responsible for the integrity of Bitcoins and anyone can "improve" the code. What or who prevents someone from "improving" the code to divert credits into their own Bitcoin Wallet?

If our Bitcoins get stolen who do we call?

:(??

The protocol itself is set in "stone" so there are limitations on what can be changed or updated. Enhancements to the wallet, like maybe you want to add an automatic backup feature, that's allowed.

The way the system works it would be entirely impossible for someone to modify the code to divert coins into ones wallet. When you make a change or "mine" coins each coin has to get the approval of all nodes on the network to make sure that it is what it is. The same way a transaction occurs, it has to be approved by all the nodes on the network in order for the transfer to take place. If you have a bitcoin / litecoin wallet, you'll get a payment. It shows up on an "Unconfirmed" field. Then once it has been verified it ends up in your wallet and is valid. It can take about 5-10 minutes (depending on network speed) to verify the transaction. All those miners mining bitcoins are also the ones verifying all the transactions. So you would have to deceive every single one in order to create fake coins, or to transfer authorized coins.

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:14 PM
If our Bitcoins get stolen who do we call?

:(??

I thought yur girlfriend ximmy had hers plucked, didn't she?

Ask her.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 09:20 PM
If our Bitcoins get stolen who do we call?

:(??

No one. You're fucked. Me and ximmy both had Bitcoins stolen for different reasons. I sold Bitcoins for a fiat currency and got them stolen in a chargeback scam where they claimed the money they gave me was stolen. Ximmy had her wallet/Bitcoins stored with someone else and they got stolen there (I think that's her story, she can clarify.) In my instance my Bitcoins weren't actually stolen, but the money I sold them for was basically, so in turn the Bitcoins where "stolen". If you steal Bitcoins from a website its like stealing physical cash or physical gold/silver from a cash register at a store.

The safest thing to do is keep your Bitcoins in your OWN wallet, and keep it encrypted (http://www.truecrypt.org/) with a password until you use it. Have it split into multiple wallets too and have copies of it in multiple locations. For instance, I keep copies of my wallets on free upload servers, in Gmail accounts, and so forth, and they are all password encrypted so only I know where they are. I can also rename them as .doc or .pdf files or whatever so no one will suspect what they are.

I believe there will be intermediaries that will exist, sort of like for insurance, as time goes on. Theft is a real issue with Bitcoin, but it really deals with that fact that people aren't used to the concept of trusting people we don't know with our Bitcoins, when we should store them in our own wallets, or learn to only buy/sell them from reputable sources like exchanges.


https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Myths#Bitcoin_has_no_built-in_chargeback_mechanism.2C_and_this_isn.27t_good


Bitcoin has no built-in chargeback mechanism, and this isn't good Why some people think this is bad: Chargebacks are useful for limiting fraud. The person handling your money has a responsibility to prevent fraud. If you buy something on eBay and the seller never ships it, PayPal takes funds from the seller's account and gives you back the money. This strengthens the eBay economy, because people recognize that their risk is limited and are more willing to purchase items from risky sellers.
Why it's actually a good thing: Bitcoin is designed such that your money is yours and yours alone. Allowing chargebacks implies that it is possible for another entity to take your money from you. You can have either total ownership rights of your money, or fraud protection, but not both. That said, nothing inherent in the dollar or euro or any other currency is necessary for chargebacks to be possible, and likewise, nothing prevents the creation of PayPal-like services denominated in Bitcoin that provide chargebacks or fraud protection.
The statement "The person handling your money has a responsibility to prevent fraud" is still true; the power has been shifted into your own hands. Fraud will always exist. It's up to you to only send bitcoins to trusted entities. It is possible to trust an online identity without ever knowing their physical identity; see the OTC Web of Trust (http://wiki.bitcoin-otc.com/wiki/OTC_Rating_System).

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:23 PM
I thought yur girlfriend ximmy had hers plucked, didn't she?

Ask her.

Yep that is a significant risk with crypto-currencies in general. If they are stolen there is no insurance, no FDIC, and no safety deposit box. The same could be said that if your house catches fire and you didn't back up your bitcoin wallet offsite. Your SoL. That was also the same risk that the gold standard had. If a bank got robbed and a good portion of the patrons gold was taken, the people who had gold that was stolen were screwed. That was also the time that Wells Fargo transported their gold under armed coaches. The ONLY time you have insurance is a fractional reserve system where the banks can just print up (debase) and give you what was taken at the cost of depreciating the asset that everyone else had.

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:25 PM
You act like governments or banks can just flip a switch and shut it down. THEY CAN'T!!

Btw, I never said anything like that, or eluded to it. Whoever figures out how to compromise it would never be so stupid.

They could double their dough by doing it slowly as they've done in the past with commodities.

Anyway my trust in the GSUS still holds.

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:28 PM
Btw, I never said anything like that, or eluded to it.

Whoever figures out how to compromise it would never be so stupid.

They could double their dough by doing it slowly as they've done in the past with commodities.

My apologies then. I thought somewhere in this long thread of back and forth that I saw that it could just be shut down. In any regard, the biggest threat is them buying large portions of bitcoins through the exchange then dumping them on the market all at once. But at the same time that could result in a blow back. I imagine there are quite a few people who are wanting to buy Bitcoins but at 200-250 a coin feel it's too expensive. If there were a significant drop I have a feeling a lot of people would buy in. Myself included.

Jewboo
9th April 2013, 09:32 PM
The protocol itself is set in "stone" so there are limitations on what can be changed or updated. Enhancements to the wallet, like maybe you want to add an automatic backup feature, that's allowed.

The way the system works it would be entirely impossible for someone to modify the code to divert coins into ones wallet. When you make a change or "mine" coins each coin has to get the approval of all nodes on the network to make sure that it is what it is. The same way a transaction occurs, it has to be approved by all the nodes on the network in order for the transfer to take place. If you have a bitcoin / litecoin wallet, you'll get a payment. It shows up on an "Unconfirmed" field. Then once it has been verified it ends up in your wallet and is valid. It can take about 5-10 minutes (depending on network speed) to verify the transaction. All those miners mining bitcoins are also the ones verifying all the transactions. So you would have to deceive every single one in order to create fake coins, or to transfer authorized coins.



https://www.farmersmerchants-bank.com/media/1355/pic_internal_auditor.jpg

"Approve" and "Verify".

Again...if our Bitcoins get stolen or mysteriously disappear from our Bitcoin Wallet WHO do we call? Is there an 800 number? Online audit trail?

These somebodies apparently have authority to "approve" and "verify" but can they also be held responsible for loss and contacted?

:(??

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:35 PM
https://www.farmersmerchants-bank.com/media/1355/pic_internal_auditor.jpg

"Approve" and "Verify".

Again...if our Bitcoins get stolen or mysteriously disappear from our Bitcoin Wallet WHO do we call? Is there an 800 number? Online audit trail?

These somebodies apparently have authority to "approve" and "verify" but can they also be held responsible for loss and contacted?

:(??

Learn networking Book, there is no one for you to call. If you lose a bitcoin, wallet stolen, destroyed in a fire, laptop / desktop stolen you're fucked. There is no one approving, verifying anything. It's computer hardware running cryptographic algorithms to approve, verify transactions and mined coins to insure the integrity of the currency and network. Securing your wallet is up to you. The state and its benefactors like banks cannot help you here.

Personal responsibility, yeah I know. Pretty dangerous stuff.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 09:38 PM
Online audit trail?


There is the block chain, where you can see all the transactions. For example, a popular Bitcoin supporter is BrotherJohnF. His Bitcoin address is the following:

1KDMja8Jwf2E42zp7KoK6ypmT5c36yNx7E

You can see transactions BrotherJohnF has engaged in with this block chain search:
https://blockchain.info/address/1KDMja8Jwf2E42zp7KoK6ypmT5c36yNx7E

You can search the block chain and see all his transactions. He purposely chooses to keep this address tied to his wallet. He can also set things up where he generates a new address for EVERY transaction he makes, thus making him completely anonymous. Basically if a thief is dumb enough to use the same address, as the Bitcoin wallet he/she steals from, then there is a trail and the thief can be caught, but I think thieves aren't THAT stupid.

Jewboo
9th April 2013, 09:41 PM
Learn networking Book, there is no one for you to call. If you lose a bitcoin, wallet stolen, destroyed in a fire, laptop / desktop stolen you're fucked. There is no one approving, verifying anything. It's computer hardware running cryptographic algorithms to approve, verify transactions and mined coins to insure the integrity of the currency and network. Securing your wallet is up to you. The state and its benefactors like banks cannot help you here.

Personal responsibility, yeah I know. Pretty dangerous stuff.



Ares...while writing my last post you since posted some really eye-opening realities that now only confirm my skepticism about Bitcoins: Theft without any audit trail. Poof.

:)

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:42 PM
Wish you success, Ares.

If I knew more about the ins & outs I might trust it enough one day to also. I think, I'm too earth an astrological sign, or something? All you friggin fire/air people will reap the benefits, and when I get in there it will be doused mud.

The codes themselves & mining in electrical fields, makes one get all philosophical about Gold and Silver, like was it the answer that they all reached when finished mining? :)

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:43 PM
Ares...while writing my last post you since posted some really eye-opening realities that now only confirm my skepticism about Bitcoins: Theft without any audit trail. Poof.

:)

There's always the block chain, that is if the thief is stupid enough to use the same address to make purchases then yes it can be followed. What good it will do you is uncertain. The state knowing that BTC's are a threat to its existence probably won't really work all that hard on getting your wallet back.

Jewboo
9th April 2013, 09:51 PM
There's always the block chain, that is if the thief is stupid enough to use the same address to make purchases then yes it can be followed. What good it will do you is uncertain. The state knowing that BTC's are a threat to its existence probably won't really work all that hard on getting your wallet back.



http://images.nymag.com/news/crimelaw/madoff100614_1_560.jpg

Exactly. Bitcoins go missing within the "computer hardware running cryptographic algorithms" and nobody else cares.

Poof. Bitcoins gone.

:o

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 09:53 PM
If I knew more about the ins & outs I might trust it enough one day to also. I think, I'm too earth an astrological sign, or something? All you friggin fire/air people will reap the benefits, and when I get in there it will be doused mud.

The codes themselves & mining in electrical fields, makes one get all philosophical about Gold and Silver, like was it the answer that they all reached when finished mining? :)

In general people who are younger, and more tech/computer savvy are the ones adopting this stuff with open arms. I don't think thats from naivety, but, rather familiarity and trust of the code/technology. I do recognize Bitcoin or any cryptocurrencies can go to 0, and so I will always want to have Gold/Silver. The problem with Gold/Silver is you can't transact them online with ease like you can with Bitcoins, and keep the same anonymity (if you choose.) I prefer having a code memorized in my head of how to decrypt my currency, and travel freely, than have physical anything, but that's based on preference. This entire issue splits the entire Gold/Silver community in half. If you notice it's more of the Silver people who like Bitcoin and more of the Gold people who think it's nutty/dangerous. I think there is something to that.

My point is that I think there is a place for both, and to not rule out either. If Bitcoin crashes, it may just crash all the way down to $150, or something like that, which really isn't a crash but a correction. If it crashes to 0 it will because another cryptocurrency has taken it's place, which is why I hold Litecoin almost exclusively now, and recommend that to others as the way forward since I believe the protocol is superior to that of Bitcoin. I have no idea if I'm right about that though. It's an educated guess.

You can still store you wealth in Gold/Silver, and when you need to, sell them for a cryptocurrency and do online transactions ALL while staying out of the banking system. The ultimate point of this is to be free of the money changers.

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:53 PM
Don't you think they would of shut down bit-torrent networks by now?

I think Bittorrent has an alt. effect of spreading Hollywood & Microsoft into previously untapped markets.

Most of it gets tapped at the civil level once a fledgling company, or movie rental takes hold. .gov/insurance co. steps in & caps it off again.

I'm a terrible seeder, I'm sorry. I just get my stuff then leave, really I'm terribly sorry :)

One would be nothing without the other.

Ares
9th April 2013, 09:53 PM
Wish you success, Ares.

If I knew more about the ins & outs I might trust it enough one day to also. I think, I'm too earth an astrological sign, or something? All you friggin fire/air people will reap the benefits, and when I get in there it will be doused mud.

The codes themselves & mining in electrical fields, makes one get all philosophical about Gold and Silver, like was it the answer that they all reached when finished mining? :)

When I first started reading about Bitcoins / Litecoins the process of mining Gold and Silver is what came to mind. The reason gold / silver is used as a medium of exchange is there is a finite amount, which gives it intrinsic value. But what gives BTC / LTC value is not only can it not be inflated into infinity is that you have removed the human element from the money / currency equation(corruption, fraud, oppression, lying, cheating, counterfeiting etc). Basically your trusting a code that a machine processes to confirm that the transaction / coin is genuine. I've been around machines all my life, and machines will only do what you tell it them to do. If you set a protocol that you cannot change the machine will following that protocol until its conclusion. It will do nothing else, it does not think, act or even care about it's self existence. It just is.

The benefit in all of this is that it threatens the very institutions that hold a monopoly on power for the past 500 years. If this currency or type of currency can really bring them to their knees what's not to like? I got into gold and silver to "stick it to them" as well as preserve my wealth. But I also see that it is controlled. We all know that JPM games the silver markets. There's no way 20 something should justify the price for an ounce of silver when the supply is limited and is a dual purpose metal. Same goes for gold. So that really opened my eyes seeing as how they keep the price suppressed to the point that it does not threaten them. They can drop it whenever they want, and will continue to do so until they are damn good and ready to let it rise.

I still hold all of my metals, but I'm also venturing into LTC mining, while I wait for my BTC ASIC to show up at my door step to start mining them. It's an investment, and I don't invest more than what I am comfortable in losing.

Horn
9th April 2013, 09:58 PM
In general people who are younger, and more tech/computer savvy are the ones adopting this stuff with open arms.

I know you meant young & dumb so I will forgive you. I'm only 44!

I've heard pier to pier being compromised before.

Shami, the transaction shouldn't go quick & painless. It should be like making love. :)

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 10:04 PM
I know you meant young & dumb so I will forgive you. I'm only 44!

I've heard pier to pier being compromised before.

Shami, the transaction shouldn't go quick & painless. It should be like making love. :)

I don't think either is dumber or smarter. There is wisdom in cautioning against it, but I feel we have no choice anymore, since we've tried the other route, and it hasn't gotten us any closer to freedom from the Money Changers. I want freedom for all humanity, and I'm willing to try something new and untested to do that.

Technology will either enslave you or free you. It only enslaves you if you don't let it free you first.

Ares
9th April 2013, 10:07 PM
I don't think either is dumber or smarter. There is wisdom in cautioning against it, but I feel we have no choice anymore, since we've tried the other route, and it hasn't gotten us any closer to freedom from the Money Changers. I want freedom for all humanity, and I'm willing to try something new and untested to do that.

Technology will either enslave you or free you. It only enslaves you if you don't let it free you first.

Same here, it's something different and has a really powerful potential. Whether it lives up to that potential is yet to be seen. Strap in and enjoy the ride.

Horn
9th April 2013, 10:15 PM
The reason gold / silver is used as a medium of exchange is there is a finite amount,

Was used as, and still not processed or yet undiscovered. You can guestimate but not be sure what lies untapped.

Now you're storing value that is easily convertible, yet no intrinsic (but for the notional unbreakable code). & has predetermined death phase.

Key is its all mostly still powered by fiat, and is already through half of its creation phase while still fledgling and powered by fiat.

The mining seems to be moving at break neck speeds for the overall creation phase till 2140 given, No?

Horn
9th April 2013, 10:18 PM
I don't think either is dumber or smarter. There is wisdom in cautioning against it, but I feel we have no choice anymore, since we've tried the other route, and it hasn't gotten us any closer to freedom from the Money Changers. I want freedom for all humanity, and I'm willing to try something new and untested to do that.

Technology will either enslave you or free you. It only enslaves you if you don't let it free you first.

Silver kills all Masons. LOL!

Your computer would never live without it!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WdrSP0V-KLg

Ps. this song also doesn't rock like alot of silver songs I know of.

ximmy
9th April 2013, 10:36 PM
When mine got stolen I called the interwebs police... They
should get back to me soon with some promising leads...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9CynvMlFyo

Neuro
9th April 2013, 10:43 PM
Is this a bubble, or the implementation of new technologies? Will it return back to the long term mean?
http://gailtheactuary.files.wordpress.com/2011/03/world-population-and-fuel-use.png

As the bacteria in the petridish finishes up its sugar supply they start cannibalizing each other, and the population explosion turned into a nightmare...

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 10:50 PM
Just giving an example. Just since something goes up parabolic doesn't mean it's crashing back to zero.

Here's maybe a better example, it's Microsoft stock (I'm borrowing BrotherJohnF's example from his video I just watched):
http://www.telco2research.com/custom/microsoft%20share%20price%20yahoo%20feb%202011.png

Parabolic rise from virtually nothing, and then a 50% correction. That's a healthy rally, NOT an overall bubble. The bubble is the top 50%, which gets corrected. This was a turning point in computer history since the vision Microsoft had was that the market would be driven by software, not by hardware. The people at Microsoft were correct about this and were greatly rewarded for their innovation.

If Bitcoin is successful it will possibly hit a peak (lets say $300) then crash down (lets say $150) and then stabilize, and then slowly go up over time...

That's a possible scenario.

Again, if it hits 0 I think it will because another cryptocurrency has taken its place, not because people have lost faith in it completely. In other words a smart trade in a collapsing cryptocurrency wouldn't be to cash out into dollars, but leap over into the next best cryptocurrency...

Horn
9th April 2013, 10:55 PM
When mine got stolen I called the interwebs police... They
should get back to me soon with some promising leads...

That's the thing, ximmy

You're young enough that you should be able to get out in the webs and Be your own Aeon Flux.

ximmy
9th April 2013, 11:03 PM
That's the thing, ximmy

You're young enough that you should be able to get out in the webs and Be your own Aeon Flux.


ooh.. then I could perform a little femdom on the bad man...

Horn
9th April 2013, 11:05 PM
http://www.geek.com/apps/skype-malware-into-bitcoin-mining-zombie-1551332/


A new piece of malware is floating around, but that seems like par for the course these days. What makes this malicious bit of code notable is the goal its creators have in mind. The malware is being spread via Skype messages and is designed to turn your PC into a remote Bitcoin (http://www.geek.com/tag/bitcoin/) mining rig without your knowledge or consent.


Bitcoin is a decentralized all-digital currency that has become quite trendy as of late. The value of one Bitcoin has recently skyrocketed to nearly $100 (http://www.geek.com/news/bitcoins-are-worth-more-than-ever-1550684/), and then well over that point and back again. In the past, users could “mine” bitcoins by contributing CPU cycles to process Bitcoin transactions. As the number of Bitcoin users increased, it has — by design — started to take more effort to earn a single coin. This is because Bitcoin production is governed by an algorithm which ensures the supply is limited.


Effectively mining Bitcoins takes a lot of power at this point, which is why this piece of malware (http://www.geek.com/tag/malware/) exists. By enslaving many computers, the authors can generate Bitcoins at essentially no cost. All it takes is a Skype message.


The target will receive a Skype message with an attention-grabbing phrase like, “this is my favorite picture of you.” Yes, this is an old trick, but it clearly still works. The user then clicks the link, which is obscured by a bit.ly address, and instead of downloading a photo, they will get a file called skype-img-04_04-2013.exe. This is, of course, the malware installer.

Blink
9th April 2013, 11:40 PM
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-09/guest-post-bitcoin-money-future-or-old-fashioned-bubble

Horn
9th April 2013, 11:45 PM
I still have this picture in my mind of a small predictable & dieing oil well trying to power the Las Vegas strip.

It just won't leave.

Shami-Amourae
9th April 2013, 11:59 PM
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-09/guest-post-bitcoin-money-future-or-old-fashioned-bubble

Watch the video I posted by BrotherJohnF above. He rebutts this article.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlKwQEk31a4

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 12:49 AM
Ps. this song also doesn't rock like a lot of silver songs I know of.




http://youtu.be/VKEk7b2vfoQ

http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Smileys/bth_SmileyHappyDance.gif

Jesus. Won't be long before Justin Bieber releases his new Bitcoin album and the jew recording industry gets behind this.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 01:34 AM
Here's a new industry that's being created by bitcoins: girls taking their clothes off for bitcoins.


http://i.imgur.com/sRET8Gx.jpg



how's that for intrinsic value?

vacuum
10th April 2013, 01:44 AM
http://i.imgur.com/gzw0t4ml.jpg

Sold for 100 bitcoins.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=170706.0

vacuum
10th April 2013, 01:53 AM
A $16.5 million dollar transaction went through today (69,471 BTC). Zero fees, paperwork, instant transfer.
http://blockchain.info/tx/5d9ef693d41cb3bb4c6d98e70ea8b2cc91be29a804245a06ec 8761d9cddc103c



Here appears to be a fund set up so people like hedge funds can invest in bitcoins. Minimum account size is 100,000 euros.
https://exante.eu/press/news/266/

They manage your key for a 1% fee.

Once hedge funds go into bitcoin, it's price will go through the stratosphere.

Max Keiser might be working on this:
The actual tweet from his twitter account @maxkeiser: "I have a personal goal of getting hedgies involved to drive BTC to $1,000. | For non-US res. Exante.eu can hook you up with BTC ($100K min.)"

Take advantage of this opportunity. It's unique. We're actually ahead of the big money because they can't get their money into bitcoin at the moment. They aren't ballsy enough to risk doing it themselves because if you miss-type a single character of your bitcoin address you permanently lose everything. The exchanges aren't big enough or trustworthy enough for very big money. We're ahead of them this time.

And I'd personally go for bitcoins and not the others. At least hold some.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 03:37 AM
New high: $250

I recommend bitcoin above any other crypto currency. Why? Because bitcoin will become the back-end system for the financial industry. Few people will actually use bitcoins directly in the future.

There will be banks that you have an account with, just like today. Except everything will be denominated in bitcoins. Your bank account will be a bitcoin address. You can go to an atm, branch, or online, to withdraw or deposit.

Withdraws will be in any denomination you like. $1 to $1000000 and anything in between. That's because each note will be like a money order. You request the money order, put money on it, and can use it one time. If you lose it, it's gone. Unlike a money order, they will have no counter-party except for the bitcoin network itself. They can be put in a vault and stored for 10 years.

There will also be check-like notes you can request, which will have a special code on them from that specific bank. Banks will agree on these codes such that you can take it to another bank and the first bank will transfer bitcoins directly to the second bank. These check-like notes would be equivalent to banknotes like in the old days.

There will be no fractional reserve banking, because each bank account will be a bitcoin address. You can view the exact amount in your address (or any other address) by going to www.blockchain.info (http://www.blockchain.info) and typing it in. The bank will simply take care of holding the private key and provide insurance in case it gets lost or stolen.

Micro transaction networks can be formed on top of bitcoin. Basically, instantaneous, small purchases will be handled by the bank instantly, like email, and settled with the bitcoin network minutes later as the blocks are constructed.

Right now it's like the wild west, but it is the foundation upon which multiple financial systems will be constructed.





On the other hand, it's possible that the financial system will make a clone of bitcoin and announce they are standardizing on that specific coin version. In that case, nobody would hold previous coins and the value would be high from day 1 because it would be the agreed-upon standard.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 04:13 AM
I'm still sticking with Litecoin. I hope I'm right about it. I may be wrong, and everything just goes to Bitcoin.

:(

Litecoin is still almost double from where I purchased it at least.

Neuro
10th April 2013, 04:36 AM
A $16.5 million dollar transaction went through today (69,471 BTC). Zero fees, paperwork, instant transfer.
http://blockchain.info/tx/5d9ef693d41cb3bb4c6d98e70ea8b2cc91be29a804245a06ec 8761d9cddc103c



Here appears to be a fund set up so people like hedge funds can invest in bitcoins. Minimum account size is 100,000 euros.
https://exante.eu/press/news/266/

They manage your key for a 1% fee.

Once hedge funds go into bitcoin, it's price will go through the stratosphere.

Max Keiser might be working on this:
The actual tweet from his twitter account @maxkeiser: "I have a personal goal of getting hedgies involved to drive BTC to $1,000. | For non-US res. Exante.eu can hook you up with BTC ($100K min.)"

Take advantage of this opportunity. It's unique. We're actually ahead of the big money because they can't get their money into bitcoin at the moment. They aren't ballsy enough to risk doing it themselves because if you miss-type a single character of your bitcoin address you permanently lose everything. The exchanges aren't big enough or trustworthy enough for very big money. We're ahead of them this time.

And I'd personally go for bitcoins and not the others. At least hold some.
Hmmm hedge funds for bitcoins, sounds like a fractional reserve paper market getting started, recommended by Max Keiserstein... 10:1 ratio? Not a bad deal for them. Selling fake bitcoins for $250, to the public, crashing the market with a coordinated smack down and media campaign. They will make a killing!

Neuro
10th April 2013, 04:39 AM
They aren't ballsy enough to risk doing it themselves because if you miss-type a single character of your bitcoin address you permanently lose everything.
That sounds a bit scary?

sirgonzo420
10th April 2013, 05:21 AM
That sounds a bit scary?

This isn't as scary as it sounds:



Most Bitcoin addresses are 34 characters. They consist of random digits and uppercase and lowercase letters, with the exception that the uppercase letter "O", uppercase letter "I", lowercase letter "l", and the number "0" are never used to prevent visual ambiguity.


Some Bitcoin addresses can be shorter than 34 characters (as few as 27 in theory) and still be valid. A significant percentage of Bitcoin addresses are only 33 characters, and some addresses may be even shorter. Every Bitcoin address stands for a number - somewhat like an account number. These shorter addresses are valid simply because they stand for numbers that happen to start with zeroes, and when the zeroes are omitted, the encoded address gets shorter.


Several of the characters inside a Bitcoin address are used as a checksum so that typographical errors can be automatically found and rejected. The checksum also allows Bitcoin software to confirm that a 33-character (or shorter) address is in fact valid and isn't simply an address with a missing character.



from https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Address

Horn
10th April 2013, 07:36 AM
On the other hand, it's possible that the financial system will make a clone of bitcoin and announce they are standardizing on that specific coin version. In that case, nobody would hold previous coins and the value would be high from day 1 because it would be the agreed-upon standard.

Or the market could turn them into Beanie Babies. Why one bitcoin could windup carrying the value of all U.S. Debt.

osoab
10th April 2013, 07:39 AM
http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/pictures/picture-5.jpg (http://www.zerohedge.com/users/tyler-durden)
Bitcoin Parabola Not Enough? Here Comes Bitcoin Opportunity Fund... This Time With Leverage! (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-10/bitcoin-parabola-not-enough-here-comes-bitcoin-opportunity-fund-time-leverage)

chad
10th April 2013, 07:39 AM
bitcoin: now with improved leverage and day trading-

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-10/bitcoin-parabola-not-enough-here-comes-bitcoin-opportunity-fund-time-leverage

edit: osab beat me to it!

osoab
10th April 2013, 07:44 AM
bitcoin: now with improved leverage and day trading-

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-10/bitcoin-parabola-not-enough-here-comes-bitcoin-opportunity-fund-time-leverage

edit: osab beat me to it!

:D

extra characters

vacuum
10th April 2013, 09:43 AM
$225 and dropping!

madfranks
10th April 2013, 09:47 AM
$225 and dropping!

Good, it needs to stabilize. Where, is the question?

Horn
10th April 2013, 10:19 AM
$225 and dropping!

New and improved with leverage.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 11:07 AM
$190

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 11:25 AM
Yep, this is the crash officially now. Wonder how low it goes.

My Litecoin theory isn't holding up, since that's crashing with Bitcoin.... yet.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 11:36 AM
On BTC-e the price of BTC just went from 240 to 135 back to 190 (to match the Mt Gox price.)

mamboni
10th April 2013, 11:42 AM
Good, it needs to stabilize. Where, is the question?


You call this price action stability? You are one hardass investor, kudos.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:05 PM
$120 and dropping

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:14 PM
You call this price action stability? You are one hardass investor, kudos.

I think holding silver for a few years does that to you.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 12:17 PM
On Gox the price keeps hovering up/down around $150. That was my guestimated price target of a crash. I hope it holds there.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:26 PM
On Gox the price keeps hovering up/down around $150. That was my guestimated price target of a crash. I hope it holds there.

It looks closer to $100 to me.

edit: nvm, there are trades at $105 and others at $150. It's oscillating like crazy.

madfranks
10th April 2013, 12:31 PM
You call this price action stability? You are one hardass investor, kudos.

No, which is why I said it needs to stabilize. Because what we're seeing is not stable. I think it's bitcoin price discovery time. The question is, what exactly is an anonymous decentralized currency worth to the world? And this probably isn't the last time we'll see crazy moves. It will probably take years for bitcoins to establish themselves; these are the birth pangs.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:38 PM
Look at the volatility

4685

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 12:45 PM
You should see BTC-e. It's crazier there. I won't trade at Gox anymore.

I still think $150 is the price to be discovered. But my opinion could change in 5 minutes at this rate.
:p

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:51 PM
Part of the issue is that Mt Gox is experiencing continual DDoS attacks as I understand it.

Also, bitcoin only supports 7 transactions per second currently!

Horn
10th April 2013, 12:51 PM
when I get in there it will be doused mud.

So when should I push the fire button, Shami?

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 12:57 PM
So when should I push the fire button, Shami?

It was already pressed.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 12:58 PM
http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/10/bitcoin-crash/

Bitcoin is undergoing a classic correction after quintupling in price over the past 30 days. The currency, which was trading as high as $265 earlier today on Mt. Gox, plummeted and is now trading at around $150 (http://realtimebitcoin.info/).
We’ve reached out to one of the biggest exchanges, Mt. Gox, to see what happened. But another San Francisco-based exchange called TradeHill is saying that the crypto-currency is falling because of apparent distributed denial of service attacks on Mt. Gox and Bitstamp. (https://tradehill.com/) A denial of service attack happens when an attacker overwhelms a target with external requests, so that it can’t honor regular requests from legitimate users.
This also happened last week when Mt. Gox when Bitcoin reached $142 and hackers attacked the exchange. At that point, Mt. Gox said it had suffered (https://www.facebook.com/MtGox/posts/453409538076792) ”its worst trading lag ever.”
The Tokyo-based exchange said last week that hackers are engaging in a strategy (https://www.facebook.com/MtGox/posts/453409538076792) to manipulate the price of the currency: “Attackers wait until the price of Bitcoins reaches a certain value, sell, destabilize the exchange, wait for everybody to panic-sell their Bitcoins, wait for the price to drop to a certain amount, then stop the attack and start buying as much as they can. Repeat this two or three times like we saw over the past few days and they profit.”
It looks like this may be happening again. Aside from that, any kind of 400% increase over 30 days is probably unsustainable from a technical point of view. A correction at this point would be healthy and natural.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:03 PM
If my $150 price holds this will be very healthy and things will resume.

Expect Chris Duane to claim victory as Silver has gone down in value over the same time period as Bitcoin as still gone up by multiples.
"Your investment may be up, and my investment may be down, but you're all wrong! I told you so!"

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 01:04 PM
Bitcoin is undergoing a classic correction after quintupling in price over the past 30 days. The currency, which was trading as high as $265 earlier today on Mt. Gox, plummeted and is now trading at around $150 (http://realtimebitcoin.info/).



http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2013/04/BTC%20crashy.png

Closing at $135.

Losing HALF your investment in six hours is not a "classic correction".

:D

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:06 PM
Nothing is "normal" with a Bitcoin market. None of us are used to unmanipulated markets. The same crap would happen if Silver wasn't manipulated, it would just happen in slower motion.

Santa
10th April 2013, 01:09 PM
The Tokyo-based exchange said last week that hackers are engaging in a strategy to manipulate the price of the currency: “Attackers wait until the price of Bitcoins reaches a certain value, sell, destabilize the exchange, wait for everybody to panic-sell their Bitcoins, wait for the price to drop to a certain amount, then stop the attack and start buying as much as they can. Repeat this two or three times like we saw over the past few days and they profit.”


This perfectly defines the classic pump and dump. And it's completely anonymous.

Santa
10th April 2013, 01:11 PM
Nothing is "normal" with a Bitcoin market. None of us are used to unmanipulated markets. The same crap would happen if Silver wasn't manipulated, it would just happen in slower motion.


Unmanipulated market?
The Tokyo-based exchange said last week that hackers are engaging in a strategy to manipulate the price of the currency:

vacuum
10th April 2013, 01:13 PM
This perfectly defines the classic pump and dump. And it's completely anonymous.

Once people catch on that this is what's happening, they'll be like 'meh' even if entire exchanges are taken down. It's actually healthy over the long run because that makes everyone's confidence much less vulnerable when a state starts confiscating or shutting down exchanges.

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 01:14 PM
Yep, this is the crash officially now.



http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/App_Data/MediaFiles/D/C/9/%7BDC90E488-2DBD-4C7C-AA3D-F037D5C3406D%7D04092012_Wall_Street_article.jpg

No....No...Mr. Chump. This is great news. This is now a wonderful BUYING OPPORTUNITY !!!

:D

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:15 PM
This perfectly defines the classic pump and dump. And it's completely anonymous.


If it goes to $20 or below, I'll agree with you.

If it stays at $150, it's a correction.

We all agree this was a bubble, but was the bubble at $20 when this mania started, or $150, which is half of the top, like my example I showed last night:

If the market acts like this, the bubble was at $150, and this was a successful rally, meaning it only overshot with the rally.
http://www.telco2research.com/custom/microsoft%20share%20price%20yahoo%20feb%202011.png

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:16 PM
No....No...Mr. Chump. This is great news. This is now a wonderful BUYING OPPORTUNITY !!!

:D

Are you planning on being interviewed by King World News soon?

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 01:30 PM
Are you planning on being interviewed by King World News soon?



http://abcnews.go.com/images/Technology/abc_expert_advice_brain_090327_mn.jpg

Cramer and the lesbian jewess will soon be promoting Bitcoin.

:)

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:33 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/images/Technology/abc_expert_advice_brain_090327_mn.jpg

Cramer and the lesbian jewess will soon be promoting Bitcoin.

:)

Why do that when Facebook stock is a STEAL now.

BUY BUY BUY!

Horn
10th April 2013, 01:42 PM
Once people catch on that this is what's happening, they'll be like 'meh' even if entire exchanges are taken down. It's actually healthy over the long run because that makes everyone's confidence much less vulnerable when a state starts confiscating or shutting down exchanges.

Vacuum sounds like a Silver guy.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 01:52 PM
NO! It's crashing all the way up to $180!

Fucking chickens!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ9dtZ8lYww

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 02:03 PM
https://lh3.ggpht.com/-TWdYWRC63Rc/TqGNqcstdmI/AAAAAAAAJWc/LteSwcr75c0/s1600/gemini_02.jpg

Bitcoin vs. Litecoin Pricing Mechanism

Race to the bottom...lol.

:)

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 02:14 PM
I sold everything at a +33% ROI in just a few days.

I'm out right now.
:p



I want to buy when/if things crash. If they don't, oh well, I profited either way.

Horn
10th April 2013, 02:19 PM
Bitcoin crashes, losing nearly half of its value in six hours

Plunge happens on the same day one anonymous redditor made it rain in Bitcoin.


4686



On Wednesday afternoon, the Bitcoin bubble appears to have burst (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-04-10/bitcoin-tumbles-25-hours). As of this writing, its current value (http://mtgox.com) is around $160—down from a high of $260 (http://bitcoin.clarkmoody.com/). (It fell as low as $130 today.) There is no obvious explanation for why the digital currency has fallen so far and so fast, although the market correcting after such a huge rise might be a good explanation. (Update 4:05pm CT: Bitcoin seems to have somewhat recovered and appears to be hovering around $200.)

Some redditors have taken solace in a comment thread entitled "Hold Spartans (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1c2n5z/hold_spartans/)."

"This is just the market venting some pressure after these huge gains," wrote anotherblog (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1c2n5z/hold_spartans/c9cg43i). "To be honest I'm glad it's happening now. If it recovers, it will demonstrate resilience in the market and give confidence to future buyers and current holders that they don't need to panic sell, reduce the chances of a crash in the future."

Coincidentally, the plunge came several hours after a reddit user by the name of “Bitcoinbillionaire (http://www.reddit.com/user/bitcoinbillionaire)” suddenly, spontaneously decided to give away around $12,000 (more than 63 BTC) worth of the digital currency (https://blockchain.info/address/1Hi9Nuh5pHCC3SkC1gH75k5AMV5hmZgdjd?sort=0). Bitcoinbillionaire rewarded 13 seemingly random redditors, then stopped the whirlwind spree after about eight hours. At the moment, no evidence links the currency's plunge with this random reddit charity.

Bitcoinbillionaire took advantage (http://www.businessinsider.com/who-is-bitcoinbillionaire-2013-4) of reddit’s Bitcointip (http://www.reddit.com/r/bitcointip) mechanism, which allows users to send each other small amounts of cash (usually less than $5). The mysterious benefactor appears to have given away 20 BTC (now worth slightly less than $4,000) as his or her first gift to one Karelb (http://www.reddit.com/user/karelb). This gift happened under a comment (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1c0yi4/i_wish_for_the_price_to_crash/) titled: “I wish for the price to crash.” That comment now seems prophetic.

A look at the account transferring all this money (https://blockchain.info/address/1Hi9Nuh5pHCC3SkC1gH75k5AMV5hmZgdjd?sort=0) shows that two hours before the giveaways began, Bitcoinbillionaire received 50 BTC (about $9,500) from another account without an IP address.

Business Insider reported (http://www.businessinsider.com/who-is-bitcoinbillionaire-2013-4) that Bitcoinbillionaire has left hints that he or she was an "early adopter," (http://www.reddit.com/r/bitcointip/comments/1c1hp2/a_4680_tip_really/c9c7lm9) and had forgotten he or she even had any bitcoins (http://www.reddit.com/r/bitcointip/comments/1c1hp2/a_4680_tip_really/c9c7opm?context=3). Not much is known beyond that, as Bitcoinbillionaire vanished as suddenly as he or she appeared.
"You've made me change my mind about this whole thing," Bitcoinbillionaire wrote (http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1c0er1/can_we_get_google_to_add_bitcoins_to_their/c9c5x16?context=3). "I'm done."

Don’t feel bad if you missed the action. Business Insider also notes (http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-billionaire-tips-being-passed-on-2013-4) that this pot of cash is now being “paid forward.”


http://arstechnica.com/business/2013/04/bitcoin-crashes-losing-nearly-half-of-its-value-in-six-hours/

Santa
10th April 2013, 02:20 PM
If it goes to $20 or below, I'll agree with you.

This is the gamble.
Is Bitcoin functioning on normal market principles? Or is it being manipulated by anonymous strategic attacks?
Why would anyone want to exchange $1000 USD for the equivalent in Bitcoin when it might cut their $1000 down to $500
faster than they can go and get their hair cut at the barber shop?

Imagine some poor grandmother who just had that 50% haircut on her savings while she was at the salon.

A stable currency HAS to remain stable. Now how will that be possible when it's being traded like any other penny stock on the internet,
especially when it's susceptible to strategic lightning attacks by anonymous attackers?

Think of currencies like this. Currency is more or less the equivalent of electric current. What happens when the current spikes or drops without protection? It blows the lights and kills the computer, leaving us in the dark and without power. It leaves us blind and dumb.

Without sufficient protections, eCurrency at this stage amounts to little more than a lotto ticket, a dream for the wannabe rich.

chad
10th April 2013, 02:24 PM
there's a futures market for it now, so good luck with it having a real price.

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 02:25 PM
...one anonymous redditor made it rain in Bitcoin.



Hey Horn: They even call it TAINT (https://blockchain.info/taint/1Hi9Nuh5pHCC3SkC1gH75k5AMV5hmZgdjd)

:)

vacuum
10th April 2013, 02:31 PM
Looks like it's back up to $200. So much for a buying opportunity.

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 02:36 PM
I'm currently on the other side of the trade. I want BTC/LTC to crash so I can buy a crap load more.
:p

madfranks
10th April 2013, 03:42 PM
Wow, what a day!

High - $266

Low - $105

Weighted Avg - $188

Last Trade - $170

vacuum
10th April 2013, 04:30 PM
http://i.imgur.com/DjLAsir.jpg

Horn
10th April 2013, 04:33 PM
Hey Horn: They even call it TAINT (https://blockchain.info/taint/1Hi9Nuh5pHCC3SkC1gH75k5AMV5hmZgdjd)

:)

We need to get Hitcher in here to bob for Adam's apples...:eek:

Horn
10th April 2013, 04:39 PM
http://i.imgur.com/djlasir.jpg


MORE RAM COWBELL, PLEASE!:)**

Where's ARES?

Shami-Amourae
10th April 2013, 04:53 PM
Prices seem to be stabilizing. I did some daytrading, since it was simply just too easy to do with the volatility. I'm completely back into Litecoins, with an about 100 more Litecoins than I had yesterday thanks to my daytrading.

Today was a good day (so far.)

Litecoin is maintaining a 1:0.02 ratio with Bitcoins.

Ares
10th April 2013, 04:58 PM
MORE RAM COWBELL, PLEASE!:)**

Where's ARES?

LOL I'm here. Watching all the excitement. I hope BTC goes down further so I can buy some more.

Ponce
10th April 2013, 06:09 PM
Bitcoins looses half its value in SIX HOURS.....that was today.

V

mick silver
10th April 2013, 06:21 PM
no one knows his real identity ...... your fucking kidding right they know everyone thats on the internet , dont kid yourself thinking that . and one more thing i thought no one wanted to see a digtal money , hell the bankers are the one hoping this play out

Horn
10th April 2013, 06:28 PM
I hope BTC goes down further so I can buy some more.

According to my calculations there's only 127± years left to hope.

vacuum
10th April 2013, 07:16 PM
Anyone else buy at the greed phase? Not that I necessarily support this, lol.




http://i.imgur.com/FW34gwu.jpg

Jewboo
10th April 2013, 07:41 PM
Anyone else buy at the greed phase?



14 pair of THESE (http://www.duofold.com/Mens/HikeBackPack/Varitherm/BBPseries/detail.aspx?id=1&style=BBP2&demo=&gender=) for half price at Amazon with no tax and free shipping.

Five dozen pair of THESE (http://i731.photobucket.com/albums/ww312/skull_hide/IMAG0759.jpg) at Costco.

:)

madfranks
10th April 2013, 08:03 PM
Bitcoins looses half its value in SIX HOURS.....that was today.

V

It only lost half it's value if you bought at the peak. If you bought when Gonzo started his thread about bitcoin trading in tandem with silver spot, you're still ahead 5 to 6 times what you bought in for.

Ponce
10th April 2013, 08:28 PM
It only lost half it's value if you bought at the peak. If you bought when Gonzo started his thread about bitcoin trading in tandem with silver spot, you're still ahead 5 to 6 times what you bought in for.


From $267.00 to $125.00 to $180 to $140....... that was two hours ago.....I don't know right now.

V