Just thinking outside of the box, is Snowden a psyop

[General of Darkness]

We haven't had a "hero" in a long time and I think we all want to believe that they exist too the point that we let our guard down.

Just like Kokesh, something didn't feel right and I'm getting the same thing with Snowden.

Thoughts?

[Mouse]

Fake news. If they didn't want you to see it, you would not see it. It's something....

[gunDriller]

a situation like this gives perma-liars like Obama a chance to confess their sins, to pretend to 'dial back' their bullshit ... when they're actually doubling down.

so far, i think Snowden is as he pretends to be. but it's still the first half of the first inning.

[EE_]

I say hero.

I think we are going to be up to bat soon
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2554/3810888812_68e43bcfc2.jpg

[Libertytree]

As of now my opinion is that he's a good guy but time will tell and things will be clearer especially after we know the rest of the info he's gonna spill.

[EE_]

As of now my opinion is that he's a good guy but time will tell and things will be clearer especially after we know the rest of the info he's gonna spill.

He better get spilling...he can only hide so long. They will get him.

And where is the terrorist that said he should be disappeared? Shouldn't the DHS be looking him up?

[palani]

We haven't had a "hero" in a long time

In related news Hillary suddenly decided upon a twitter presence.

Quite a coincidence.

[EE_]

In related news Hillary suddenly decided upon a twitter presence.

Quite a coincidence.

How interesting! This should really help her become the first Presbian of the US

[JohnQPublic]

Quite possible. I have not ruled out the possibility that Obama is in on this. Who knows. Of course if the COG (continuation of government), is actually in force, then Obama is only a figure head anyway. On the other hand, Snowden may be legit, in which case, he deserves some praise.

[Twisted Titan]

I cant believe people are seriously entertaining this.


This guy is a spook for the NSA.

Let that sink in.

Thes effers dont all of a sudden "find religion" and why is that??

Because those that DID are DEAD.

The NSA is rumored to be 7 to 10 times the size of the CIA.

Do you really believe this is not contrived??

These pricks kill babies and grandmothers like you and me swat gnats and dont lose a shred of sleep over it.


This is the Hegelian Dialetic Playing out in real time.

Cause when the smoke clears the average Jane and Jack are going to just accept that their Personal Data is being memory holed by whatever alphabet agency calls for it.

The fact that this even made it to the MSM is confirmation that this is over little to no concern to the men behind the curtain.

[vacuum]

The massive blowback seems detrimental to their goals. This has been a rallying point which people are organizing around. People are going to develop new software and services because of this. Foreign governments are going to mandate decentralization of internet services. People are suing the government.

Furthermore and perhaps most importantly, one dude defying the entire NSA, CIA, and government is inspiring people not to be afraid of standing up. Why put a name and a face, and create an international incident, instead of just leaking the documents?

Even if they are able to turn this into a political net-positive, which they are good at, I still see it as an overall net-negative for them.

[Libertytree]

I cant believe people are seriously entertaining this.


This guy is a spook for the NSA.

Let that sink in.

Thes effers dont all of a sudden "find religion" and why is that??

Because those that DID are DEAD.

The NSA is rumored to be 7 to 10 times the size of the CIA.

Do you really believe this is not contrived??

These pricks kill babies and grandmothers like you and me swat gnats and dont lose a shred of sleep over it.


This is the Hegelian Dialetic Playing out in real time.

Cause when the smoke clears the average Jane and Jack are going to just accept that their Personal Data is being memory holed by whatever alphabet agency calls for it.

The fact that this even made it to the MSM is confirmation that this is over little to no concern to the men behind the curtain.


I don't understand TT. All of us are always saying that people need to stand up and speak out about all the crap the .gov is pushing and forcing on us, then when someone does they're called spooks etc... Could it be that one man decided to do the right thing? No, I can't make a positive 100% judgement on this right now as it's still way too early but at the same time I don't think that judgement can be made as to his complicity with them either. I do think though that there are still people who are willing to do the right things no matter what the costs.

[iOWNme]

I do think though that there are still people who are willing to do the right things no matter what the costs.

I find it ironic that it is always AFTER they have committed numerous crimes for the STATE. We are far enough down the shit hole that ANYONE working for these criminals is complicent to their crimes.

There is no 'Hero' in working for the 'Government'. Recieving STOLEN funds for whatever you do is neither 'Heroic' nor 'Honorable'.

[Libertytree]

I find it ironic that it is always AFTER they have committed numerous crimes for the STATE. We are far enough down the shit hole that ANYONE working for these criminals is complicent to their crimes.

I realize that the old adage applies, "if you lay down with dogs you wake up with fleas" but if he's legit I'm assuming that he reached a break point sometime ago and started compiling info then, until he felt he had enough proof to disclose.

[Twisted Titan]

I respect your opinion LT

I am just highly soured by anybody that works for gubbermint

And it goes above any beyond for those at my Fab Five ( ATF.FBI.CIA.NSA.DHS)

anything associated with these people always ends up bad.

Any true change is going to come from the outside.

[JohnQPublic]

I find it ironic that it is always AFTER they have committed numerous crimes for the STATE. We are far enough down the shit hole that ANYONE working for these criminals is complicent to their crimes.

There is no 'Hero' in working for the 'Government'. Recieving STOLEN funds for whatever you do is neither 'Heroic' nor 'Honorable'.


Granted, but even anyone can have a change of heart. IF he is legit, he gave it all up to do this.

[Libertytree]

As do I yours TT.

Now he is ex abc, xyz and is causing them damage and waking people up to what they've been doing. This is a good thing, no? I can't call him a hero at this time but it seems he sure put his ass on the line to pull this off.

[Twisted Titan]

Im going on record this guy is a spook.

Everyone one of them have turned out to be spooks


Julian Assange. ......wont touch 911 with a 100ft pole and of the 6 billion documents not one is found to implicate Israel in anything

Samuel Perkins........can detail millions of dollars going every which way. Ask him if he knows about any covert action isral did in the 80s the man will give you a blank stare.

I forget the name of the last fellow(he did a presentation with a red shirt on and had a beard) but he has come out saying dont worry about the bilderbergs they are just some old guard dying away. Just keep blogging and the gubbermint cant stop you. Yada yada yada


Everyone of these "flippers" eventually are shown to be "floppers".

I will wager Three Mercury Dimes the same happens here.

[Shami-Amourae]

This sort of stuff will drive more people towards Crypto-Anarchy. Don't expect Google, Yahoo, Microsoft, and all these other companies to exist forever and control our data. There will be emerging alternatives that integrate privacy and decentralize systems making it impossible for governments to control/manipulate. If you want change use these technologies and promote them with everyone you can.

[EE_]

Trust is hard to come by these days...
If you can't rally around Snowden, rally around his message.

What is the message? Is it not the same as ours?

[Libertytree]

Trust is hard to come by these days...
If you can't rally around Snowden, rally around his message.

What is the message?

Fuck you! This shit is wrong!

[sirgonzo420]

As do I yours TT.

Now he is ex abc, xyz and is causing them damage and waking people up to what they've been doing. This is a good thing, no? I can't call him a hero at this time but it seems he sure put his ass on the line to pull this off.


Yeah but when you work for intelligence agencies, you are already putting your ass on the line. For example, one of many possible perils is being set up as a patsy for some job. There are countless others. It's a rough ass game.

Sacrificing yourself for Liberty is still preferable to sacrificing yourself to Tyranny, even though the sacrifice is more sure and more severe.

[EE_]

Fuck you! This shit is wrong!

What is wrong?

[Libertytree]

What is wrong?

Not at you EE, I was answering your question about what his message is. Solly for not being more clear.

[Libertytree]

Ran across this, no link though. Only there for 3 months?

Statement by BAH:

"Booz Allen can confirm that Edward Snowden, 29, was an employee of our firm for less than 3 months, assigned to a team in Hawaii. Snowden, who had a salary at the rate of $122,000, was terminated June 10, 2013 for violations of the firm’s code of ethics and firm policy. News reports that this individual has claimed to have leaked classified information are shocking, and if accurate, this action represents a grave violation of the code of conduct and core values of our firm. We will work closely with our clients and authorities in their investigation of this matter."

[Horn]

Timing has alot to do with it.

TpTb could be choosing now as a time to hoedown, because if it continues along the same path, they may not stand a chance to.

The inevitable will occur eventually.

[EE_]

Not at you EE, I was answering your question about what his message is. Solly for not being more clear.

Oh :) I take the message as: the gov is a corrupt POS unworthy of our trust, our support and our money. The gov is not working in the interest of it's citizens or abiding by the constitution. (insert the word Jew in that)

[JohnQPublic]

The only sane answer at this time is a radical reduction of the federal government in a controlled manner. Much as Ron Paul campaigned for.during the last pres. cycle.

[Horn]

The only sane answer at this time is a radical reduction of the federal government in a controlled manner. Much as Ron Paul campaigned for.during the last pres. cycle.

Go ahead an call for a rapid reduction of NSA.

Atleast try for a governor's position on it before going straight to the Whitehouse.

[Hitch]

"Booz Allen can confirm that Edward Snowden, 29, was an employee of our firm for less than 3 months, assigned to a team in Hawaii. Snowden, who had a salary at the rate of $122,000, was terminated June 10, 2013 for violations of the firm’s code of ethics and firm policy.."

Snowden claimed to have made $200,000 a year. Where did the extra $78,000 come from? That's a big difference in pay being well more than most folk's salaries.

[Shami-Amourae]

The $122,000 info might be false info to discredit him?

[JohnQPublic]

Snowden claimed to have made $200,000 a year. Where did the extra $78,000 come from? That's a big difference in pay being well more than most folk's salaries.

I remember hearing that, too. Maybe $122,000 was base, and the rest bonus. Maybe he got 0.1 penny for each American Citizen his group spied on?

[Hitch]

I remember hearing that, too. Maybe $122,000 was base, and the rest bonus. Maybe he got 0.1 penny for each American Citizen his group spied on?

Good point, as well as Shami's.

A couple of thoughts on this whole story. First off, this whole thing seems like the making of a movie, with the characters Snowden and his bombshell girlfriend the perfect cast. Snowden, as described by his girlfriend, was your quintessential "computer geek" being very shy and reserved. Yet, he seems perfectly comfortable being in the spotlight world wide all of a sudden? He does not seem shy and reserved on camera either, but more of the well spoken, outgoing, charismatic personality you'd expect from a leader.

As to the arguments of why it would be a psyop. Think Cyprus banking. Just as the bank used Cyprus to get everyone, or exposed to, open theft of accounts.

A story like this could be fabricated to get folks used to, and exposed, to being openly spied on.

[Libertytree]

I'd imagine that the $122k is base pay, add in the insurance package, bennies etc and 200k ain't a stretch.

[JohnQPublic]

Z Big News… Dave Is Snowed In (http://tradewithdave.com/?p=16948)
By now, Dave’s fairly sure that you have heard about Edward Snowden. Then again what you may not be aware of is just how small the circle is. The nice lady conducting this interview of the nice journalist who broke the story on Snowden and the nice company that Snowden worked for run in the same circles… correction, same circle.


The lady’s name is Mikka Brzezinski. Her father is Zbignew Brzezinski. Her brother was a partner in Booz Allen Hamilton where Snowden worked. Snowden, not the Snowden who spilled his guts in Catch-22, but the Snowden who barely finished high school, dropped out of community college and went on to work for the CIA and making $200K working for Booz Allen Hamilton (in Hawaii of all birthplaces) before having his Jerry Maguire moment which now results in a choke-hold on any and all government contractors… Benghazi security providers included.


Why exactly is “Little Z” (as Dave calls him – Ian Brzezinski) out at Booz Allen and no longer a principal at the Carlyle controlled firm? A bigger question is whether or not “Big Z” is still in the Big “O” circle especially in light of these happenings. No doubt the revolving door at Hopkins SAIS is buzzing with activity as George Soros’ Hong Kong connections are stretched to their limits this time around? Just a coincidence folks… nothing to see here… move along.
I guess Z big news is what ZBig told Salon: http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/01/23/Brzezinski-Tells-Salon–Those-Rich-Jews-Control-Congress (http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/01/23/Brzezinski-Tells-Salon--Those-Rich-Jews-Control-Congress)
That’s the Catch-22 about the Nitze School and the Aspen Institute… it’s always snowing somewhere, especially in Siberia. What are the odds that the lady doing the interviewing about the guy who spilled his guts on the NSA are brother, sister and employee, not to mention children (a super-majority at least) of the one man who may have the President of the United State’s ear more than any other single person? Purely a coincidence… nothing to see here folks… move along. You can forget the Trilateral Commission… everyone’s focused on Bilderberg.


If they’re not careful, these “mechanisms” for judging the law are going to be brought forth to the American people and jury nullification is not something that the powers that be (especially these Judges that Eric Holder is going to include in the new plan: http://tradewithdave.com/?p=16910) want the American people to know about.

[Uncle Salty]

Here is a blog asking some the same question. Seems a bit odd this kid ended up where he ended up. He is being played. They want us know this shit. Order through chaos. This is just a big distraction for something else. Maybe they want Obama gone.

http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/06/10/nsa-leaker-are-there-serious-cracks-in-ed-snowdens-story/

[JohnQPublic]

Here is a blog asking some the same question. Seems a bit odd this kid ended up where he ended up. He is being played. They want us know this shit. Order through chaos. This is just a big distraction for something else. Maybe they want Obama gone.

http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/06/10/nsa-leaker-are-there-serious-cracks-in-ed-snowdens-story/

" ...Snowden claimed he could do very heavy damage to the entire US intelligence community in 2008, but decided to wait because he thought Obama, just coming into the presidency, might make good changes."

Hmmm...

[Libertarian_Guard]

" ...Snowden claimed he could do very heavy damage to the entire US intelligence community in 2008, but decided to wait because he thought Obama, just coming into the presidency, might make good changes."

Hmmm...

Is he on record, having said this back in 2008?

I don't think so.

[Serpo]

Im staying inside the box


all those companies proven to be in with the gov

embarrassment for gov around world

[Hatha Sunahara]

JQP, you might want to go back to Jon Rappoport's blog and check out this interesting speculation:

http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/06/11/did-someone-help-ed-snowden-punch-a-hole-in-the-nsa/

He's weighing the likelihood that Snowden was the CIA's man at the NSA, and somebody from the CIA helped him gain access to the documents that he leaked to Glenn Greenwald. He brings up the possibility that the NSA was horning in on the financial spheres that the big banks like GS, JPMorgan, Chase, and the banks that hold derivatives, and these banks recruited the CIA to bring down the NSA, and Snowden is how they did it. Pretty interesting hypothesis by Rappoport. He buyilds up to it n the piece that you cited.


Hatha

[Uncle Salty]

JQP, you might want to go back to Jon Rappoport's blog and check out this interesting speculation:

http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/06/11/did-someone-help-ed-snowden-punch-a-hole-in-the-nsa/

He's weighing the likelihood that Snowden was the CIA's man at the NSA, and somebody from the CIA helped him gain access to the documents that he leaked to Glenn Greenwald. He brings up the possibility that the NSA was horning in on the financial spheres that the big banks like GS, JPMorgan, Chase, and the banks that hold derivatives, and these banks recruited the CIA to bring down the NSA, and Snowden is how they did it. Pretty interesting hypothesis by Rappoport. He buyilds up to it n the piece that you cited.


Hatha

That actually makes some sense. Turf wars to determine who gets to fuck over the American people the best and hardest. The CIA wants its crown back. There is much more than meets the eye with this thing.

[Sparky]

I've said repeatedly that it will be the Millenial Generation that turns this government on its head, once they become of age. Millenials were born 1982-2004, so the oldest are just entering their early 30s. Snowden was born in 1983. That's the generation that's not going to tolerate the bullshit.

In generational theory, every fourth generation is the "hero generation", which comes of age during each Fourth Turning, which is the "crisis" turning. The Millenials are the hero generation.

As such, I'm willing to accept him as such until there is sufficient to believe otherwise.

Here is a summary of generational theory and the Fourth Turning. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory)

[learn2swim]

Seems like Benghazi set off a number of scandals, Boston attacks, IRS, and NSA. Seems like a distraction to me.

[sirgonzo420]

I've said repeatedly that it will be the Millenial Generation that turns this government on its head, once they become of age. Millenials were born 1982-2004, so the oldest are just entering their early 30s. Snowden was born in 1983. That's the generation that's not going to tolerate the bullshit.

In generational theory, every fourth generation is the "hero generation", which comes of age during each Fourth Turning, which is the "crisis" turning. The Millenials are the hero generation.

As such, I'm willing to accept him as such until there is sufficient to believe otherwise.

Here is a summary of generational theory and the Fourth Turning. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory#Millennia ls_Rising)

I knew someone with asperger's syndrome and that book and theory was his "thing".

It has merit. Everything is cyclical.

[Glass]

The guys appearance immediately made me think of a bolshevik or canadian. Or both. When I look at people the first thing I see if the nose. Bolshies have a distinct nose. Cheney, bush, lot of celeb people. The nostrils.

[Uncle Salty]

I've said repeatedly that it will be the Millenial Generation that turns this government on its head, once they become of age. Millenials were born 1982-2004, so the oldest are just entering their early 30s. Snowden was born in 1983. That's the generation that's not going to tolerate the bullshit.

In generational theory, every fourth generation is the "hero generation", which comes of age during each Fourth Turning, which is the "crisis" turning. The Millenials are the hero generation.

As such, I'm willing to accept him as such until there is sufficient to believe otherwise.

Here is a summary of generational theory and the Fourth Turning. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strauss%E2%80%93Howe_generational_theory)

I hope the Millenials don't try and take away our guns. Seems to me a lot of them were raised to be anti-gun.

[jimswift]

You don't get on TV nowadays unless your needed.

[Spectrism]

It is good to have a healthy skepticism and question everything. My current understanding is that this guy revealed to the American people that they were being channelled into a slaughterhouse chute. I think his message is true. Is he being used? Possibly.

But consider that the biggest traitors in government are calling him the traitor, I would say he is one of the good guys.

[aeondaze]

This has a direct corrolory to ingsoc in 1984. They're basically saying outright that they retain the power to demand total submission.



" Ingsoc demands the complete submission – mental, moral and physical – of the people, and will torture to achieve it (see Room 101). Ingsoc is a masterfully complex system of psychological control that compels confession to imagined crimes and the forgetting of rebellious thought in order to love Big Brother and the Party over oneself. The purpose of Ingsoc is political control"

Ingsoc would have no power whatsoever if the subjects were unware of being monitored and assumed they're activities went on unhindered and in private. It's efforts at phsychological control would be minimal at best and dissapointing most of the time, goats will always be be goats at the end of the day, which I believe is what we see. Why most peolpe we know haven't a clue at the repercusions of these intelectual pogroms and of those that did, 95% would prefer to look the otherway

They're basically telling us explicitly and attempting to strike a phsychological blow and defeat the last goats amongst the sheep. They're saying the gloves off and a new day dawns.

Whether its somewhat contrived or actually true at this point is irellevant. The intention is to inflict psychological trauma and shock the noncompliant into total compliance of their aticities.

Thats why it is being beamed 24/7 into our living rooms. The Europeans are feigning sand in their vaginas but this will be engineered to blow over, once the message has reached saturation. None of this should come as a surprise to any of us. What should cause us to pause though, and appears to be here is the fact they've decided to come forward and let it be known???

It looks a though Ingsoc has officially arrived.

[palani]

Related to me 25 years ago by a guy who had observed this:

In Japan after the war he noticed that when walking thru crowds of Japanese they would walk straight and force him to change his path. That is until he bounced one off his chest and then he stated it was like a subconscious message went out to the rest of the crowd. They would part to allow him passage.

The same observation is true of government. If you go along meekly government will just keep pushing harder to make you turn aside. Bounce a bureaucrat off your chest every once in a while just to keep them under control. You may be surprised at how quickly word gets out to leave you alone.

In a way this is saying that you are responsible for managing your own government. Don't be surprised if you are having problems if you fail to do your own duty of managing them.

[Libertytree]

It seems that all of this has possibly started the awakening process in some.

Sales of Orwell's '1984' up over 6,000 percent after NSA news
Could revelations about the U.S. government’s massive surveillance program be sending people hunting for that classic novel about a nation under the oppressive rule of "Big Brother?"
Amazon has recorded a spike in sales of the George Orwell novel, “1984” in the wake of revelations about the National Security Agency's data collection programs (http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/06/18796204-nsa-snooping-has-foiled-multiple-terror-plots-feinstein?lite).
The centennial edition of the book ranked number 4 on the seller’s “movers and shakers list,” (http://www.amazon.com/gp/movers-and-shakers/books/ref=zg_bsms_nav_0) as of Tuesday afternoon. Book sales increased by more than 6,000 within the last 24 hours, jumping to the 123rd spot on book sales overall, from it's spot at 7,636 the previous day.


The book, originally published in 1948, centers on a rebellious effort against totalitarianism and was meant to serve as a futuristic look into a government with overreaching powers.
Sales may have received a boost as the book has been referenced by politicians in relation to the news.


President Obama mentioned the novel last week when he defended the surveillance programs."In the abstract, you can complain about Big Brother and how this is a potential program run amok, but when you actually look at the details, then I think we've struck the right balance,” he said last Friday.


U.S. Sen. Bernie Sanders also used the book to describe the programs overseen by the super-secret NSA.
“Kids will grow up knowing that every damn thing that they do is going to be recorded some place in a file,” the Vermont Independent told MSNBC’s Chris Hayes (http://video.msnbc.msn.com/all-in-/52162770#52162770)on Monday. “And I think that will have a very Orwellian and very inhibiting impact on the way we live our lives."


A representative for Penguin, the novel's publisher, said there's clearly a link between the NSA news and the book's surge in sales.

Sales of George Orwell's '1984' have jumped since news of the NSA's surveillance programs broke.



"Absolutely," Liz Keenan told TODAY.com via email. "The current coverage has translated in a surge in mentions and conversations about Orwell's classic providing new platforms of discovery to bring readers to the book."
While she acknowledged that the novel is often popular this time of year as students prepare for the upcoming school year, she called the current uptick in sales "dramatic" and noted the publisher is happy to have the book in the public conversation.


"It is exciting that Orwell’s classic is being discovered by a new readership and rediscovered by readers, but not surprising," she said. "It is a perennial classic on the Plume perpetual bookshelf, and the interest and relevancy of it has never really waned since its original publication. Of course the themes and political and social issues explored in the book feel even more relevant. And the current news cycle, prophetic."

http://www.today.com/news/sales-orwells-1984-over-6-000-percent-after-nsa-news-6C10282307