Bill still "biggest tipping point for human freedom is here"

[Large Sarge]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BWuBNeOhGc&feature=youtu.be

[Ares]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BWuBNeOhGc&feature=youtu.be

[Horn]

Great show, great words there @ 14 min. in.

"Its what we've been fighting for, for centuries"

[Horn]

Guess human freedom isn't a big seller...

[Shami-Amourae]

Guess human freedom isn't a big seller...

Most people don't want to be free.

[PatColo]

BStill was on Red Ice Radio 8/26

Bill Still - Hour 1 - Fixing Greece, The Crumbling EU & Monetary Reformation (http://www.redicecreations.com/radio/2013/08/RIR-130826.php)

[Horn]

Most people don't want to be free.

So we need to mix the message into killing zionism, or something?

I'm all about a good sales pitch.

[vacuum]

I didn't get a chance to watch the whole thing, but one interesting thing he said was that they are trying to turn us against government, when in reality it's an essential tool which we need to fix rather than be against. It makes sense because government is just what happens when a bunch of people get together and make some rules which they all agree to follow. But if we lose that ability then any sub-group within the population that does have the ability to come together and make agreements with themselves will then be in the position of automatically being more powerful than anyone else.

The reason our government is so bad right now is because they've mastered the use of the tool. The answer isn't to permanently discard it, thereby fully giving it to them, but rather master it ourselves. Or something like that.

[Hatha Sunahara]

Most people don't want to be free.

Yes, that's true. Our education system and our mainstream media have taken care of that. They want good slaves. Good slaves don't want to be free. Hitler told the Germans that they had the 'freedom to starve'. If you think about it, it assumes they don't have the ability to feed themselves. It assumes that everyone is beholden to 'the organizers of society'--the big corporations who will give you a job and tell you what to do, and keep out anybody else who could give you a job and tell you what to do, including yourself. That's why people don't want to be free. It's too much of a hassle. And the 'owners' have made it so. Most of us are so dependent on 'the owners' that we equate freedom with starvation. Great example of self destructive mythology here, but people believe it. So, it's true. Yay for Hitler. He was telling those Germans what they already knew. Telling them the 'truth'. And our 'leaders' are telling us the 'troof'.


Hatha

[Hatha Sunahara]

The reason our government is so bad right now is because they've mastered the use of the tool. The answer isn't to permanently discard it, thereby fully giving it to them, but rather master it ourselves. Or something like that.

I think the reason it's so bad right now is because it is too big and too powerful.

People should be able to govern themselves at the local level, but even cities are too big and too powerful. So, what does that leave us with? The best form of government is.....ta da....anarchy--no government. Instead, we need organizing forums--where people can get together with other people and discuss common problems and agree on solutions, and hire other people on an ad hoc basis to administer solutions to those problems, and when the problems are addressed, the 'solution administrators' are disbanded. No permanent structures for government, no entrenched bureaucrats--only voluntary associations. The only conformity that would be required would be to Common Law and the golden rule. All taxes would be voluntary. People should be able to connect themselves via local mesh networks. There should be no government that can force people to do anything. There should only be voluntary associations, and everybody should have the power to 'disassociate' themselves with any association--i. e. no forced memberships. And cops who shoot people claiming it was for officer safety should be given a speedy trial and hung. I could go on ad nauseam with trivia, but I think any intelligent reader should have grasped the idea by now. Take the power away from the Too Big To Fails, and give it back to those who can fail. And one principle that should be followed is that any monopoly that usurps its privilege can be shut down on grounds of systemic corruption.

Hatha

[Shami-Amourae]

So we need to mix the message into killing zionism, or something?

I'm all about a good sales pitch.

Try to organize the people who want to live free in a geographical area, take over the area, and live free. Stay vigilant in preventing anyone from the inside or outside from destroying it, though human nature is that till will happen eventually. Then you repeat the process. That's have the United States was founded anyways.

[Horn]

That's have the United States was founded anyways.

The problem then was the horse driven Representative part, and English counterfeiting.

[EE_]

Yes, that's true. Our education system and our mainstream media have taken care of that. They want good slaves. Good slaves don't want to be free. Hitler told the Germans that they had the 'freedom to starve'. If you think about it, it assumes they don't have the ability to feed themselves. It assumes that everyone is beholden to 'the organizers of society'--the big corporations who will give you a job and tell you what to do, and keep out anybody else who could give you a job and tell you what to do, including yourself. That's why people don't want to be free. It's too much of a hassle. And the 'owners' have made it so. Most of us are so dependent on 'the owners' that we equate freedom with starvation. Great example of self destructive mythology here, but people believe it. So, it's true. Yay for Hitler. He was telling those Germans what they already knew. Telling them the 'truth'. And our 'leaders' are telling us the 'troof'.


Hatha

Police storm homeschool class, take children by force
'Officers brought a battering ram and were about to break the door in'

Four children, ages 7 to 14, have been forcibly taken from their Darmstadt, Germany, home by police armed with a battering ram, and their parents have been told they won’t see them again soon, all over the issue of homeschooling, according to a stunning new report from the Home School Legal Defense Association.

HSDLA, the world’s premiere advocate for homeschoolers, said the family of Dirk and Petra Wunderlich has battled for several years Germany’s World War II-era requirement that all children submit to the indoctrination programs in the nation’s public schools.

The shocking raid was made solely because the parents were providing their children’s education, HSLDA said. The organization noted the paperwork that authorized police officers and social workers to use force on the children contained no claims of mistreatment.

“The children were taken to unknown locations,” HSLDA said. “Officials ominously promised the parents that they would not be seeing their children anytime soon.”

The raid, which took place Thursday at 8 a.m. as the children were beginning their day’s classes, has been described by observers as “brutal and vicious.”

A team of 20 social workers, police and special agents stormed the family’s home. HSLDA reported a Judge Koenig, who is assigned to the Darmstadt family court, signed an order authorizing the immediate seizure of the children by force.

“Citing the parents’ failure to cooperate ‘with the authorities to send the children to school,’ the judge also authorized the use of force ‘against the children’ … reasoning that such force might be required because the children had ‘adopted the parents’ opinions’ regarding homeschooling and that ‘no cooperation could be expected’ from either the parents or the children,” HSLDA said.

Dirk Wunderlich told the homeschool group: “I looked through a side window and saw many people, police and special agents, all armed. They told me they wanted to come in to speak with me. I tried to ask questions, but within seconds, three police officers brought a battering ram and were about to break the door in, so I opened it.”

His narration continued: “The police shoved me into a chair and wouldn’t let me even make a phone call at first. It was chaotic as they told me they had an order to take the children. At my slightest movement the agents would grab me, as if I were a terrorist. You would never expect anything like this to happen in our calm, peaceful village. It was like a scene out of a science fiction movie. Our neighbors and children have been traumatized by this invasion.”

Human rights violations

Michael Farris, HSLDA founder, said in a report the actions violated a number of established European precedents, including provisions of the European Convention of Human Rights.

“The right to homeschool is a human right,” he said, “and so is the right to freely move and to leave a country. Germany has grossly violated these rights of this family.

“This latest act of seizing these four beautiful innocent children is an outrageous act of a rogue nation.”

Farris said the U.S. Constitution is “not alone in upholding the right of parents to decide how to educate their children.”

“Germany is a party to numerous human rights treaties that recognize the right of parents to provide an education distinct from the public schools so that children can be educated according to the parents’ religious convictions,” he said.

“Germany has simply not met its obligations under these treaties or as a liberal democracy. HSLDA and I will do whatever we can to help this family regain custody of their children and ensure that they are safe from this persecution. This case demonstrates conclusively why the Romeike asylum case is so important. Families in Germany need a safe place where they can educate their children in peace.”

As WND reported, the Romeike case has been submitted to the U.S. Supreme Court. In 2010, an immigration judge granted asylum in the U.S. to the family, which fled Germany because their children were forced to go to public schools.

The Obama administration, unhappy with the outcome, appealed and obtained an order from a higher court that the family must return to Germany. The Obama administration has argued in court parents essentially have no right to determine how and what their children are taught, leaving the authority with the government.


Government custody

The German government already has confronted the Wunderlich family several times over homeschooling. Less than a year ago, a German court granted custody of the children to state youth officials.

However, government authorities at that time decided to leave the children in the family home because they were well-cared for.

WND reported the government told the family it had failed to meet the government’s demands for “integration.” The decision came from Judge Markus Malkmus, who ordered the children into the custody of the states’ “child protective agency,” called the Jugendamt.

The family earlier was subjected to an ordeal in France when police snatched the children from their home there, accusing them of “being alone.”

At the time, two French social workers and two police officers appeared without notice at the home of Dominique Chanal in St. Leonard, France, where Dirk and Angela Wunderlich and their children were living.

The family had fled Germany because of a series of fines imposed for homeschooling. The children were released a short time later. But Dirk Wunderlich was forced last year to return his family to Germany because he could not find work elsewhere.

Wunderlich told Mike Donnelly, HSLDA director for international affairs, that he and his wife were devastated.

“These are broken people. They said they felt like they were being ground into dust. They were shaken to their core and shocked by the event. But they also told me that they had followed their conscience and the dictates of their faith,” Donnelly said. “Although they don’t have much faith in the German state – they have a lot of faith in God. They are an inspiring and courageous family.

Donnelly said his question to the political leadership of Germany is: “How long will you permit these kinds of brutal acts to be perpetrated against German families?”

“Why is it so important to you to force people into your state schools? The echo of this act rings from a darker time in German history. When will leaders stand up and make changes so that brutality to children like the Wunderlichs no longer happens because of homeschooling? Isn’t there any German statesman willing to stand up for what is right anywhere in Germany?”

Dirk Wunderlich told HSLDA his 14-year-old daughter was forcibly taken out of the home.

“When I went outside, our neighbor was crying as she watched. I turned around to see my daughter being escorted as if she were a criminal by two big policemen. They weren’t being nice at all. When my wife tried to give my daughter a kiss and a hug goodbye, one of the special agents roughly elbowed her out of the way and said – ‘it’s too late for that.’”

After the children were taken, authorities “invited” the parents to a meeting with social workers. They were told they were not even being allowed an immediate court hearing on the status of the children.

Hitler youth

Germany has a long history of persecuting homeschooling families.

It was in 1937 when Adolf Hitler said: “The youth of today is ever the people of tomorrow. For this reason we have set before ourselves the task of inoculating our youth with the spirit of this community of the people at a very early age, at an age when human beings are still unperverted and therefore unspoiled. This Reich stands, and it is building itself up for the future, upon its youth. And this new Reich will give its youth to no one, but will itself take youth and give to youth its own education and its own upbringing.”

Just a few years ago, a German government spokesman, Wolfgang Drautz, emphasized the importance of socializing children through public schools.

His statement followed a response from the German government to another family that objected to police picking up their child and delivering him to a public school.

“The minister of education does not share your attitudes toward so-called homeschooling,” said a government letter. “You complain about the forced school escort of primary school children by the responsible local police officers. … In order to avoid this in future, the education authority is in conversation with the affected family in order to look for possibilities to bring the religious convictions of the family into line with the unalterable school attendance requirement.”

HSLDA previously has documented in the Konrad and Plett cases how the German government considers homeschooling to be child abuse, even though it is recognized as a right by the Universal Declaration on Human Rights, the European Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms, the United Nations International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights.

HSLDA has warned that the behavior of German authorities is a foreshadowing of what American parents should expect if the U.N. Convention on the Rights of the Child ever is ratified in the U.S. Its concerns are detailed at the website Parental Rights.

In nearby Sweden, WND also reported a case in which authorities snatched a 7-year-old child from an airplane as the parents were moving to India so they could homeschool.

Swedish courts have ordered Dominic Johansson to be permanently separated from his parents, Christer and Annie Johansson.


Read more at http://www.wnd.com/2013/08/police-storm-homeschool-class-take-children-by-force/#d3RJoSljTHymAbf7.99

[Son-of-Liberty]

I didn't get a chance to watch the whole thing, but one interesting thing he said was that they are trying to turn us against government, when in reality it's an essential tool which we need to fix rather than be against. It makes sense because government is just what happens when a bunch of people get together and make some rules which they all agree to follow. But if we lose that ability then any sub-group within the population that does have the ability to come together and make agreements with themselves will then be in the position of automatically being more powerful than anyone else.

The reason our government is so bad right now is because they've mastered the use of the tool. The answer isn't to permanently discard it, thereby fully giving it to them, but rather master it ourselves. Or something like that.

That is a good point and as much as I lean towards Anarchy I think there needs to be some sort of government to enforce common law.

The big problem we have is that the the government and the people believe that the government has the authority to do things that break the common law.

This is a Mark Stevens line of reasoning but:

DO you have a right to kick someones door down and arrest them if they might have drugs in the house? No of course not, so if the government gets it's authority from the people, we have a problem because they are exercising powers that they could not have been granted by the people.

Now if you think your neighbor is raping or torturing a child in their home you do have a right to kick down their door and even make the arrest yourself. That is because it is within the bounds of common law. It would therefore be OK to grant government the same powers.

Problem is the brain washed masses think that the government is basically god and can do no wrong and should have no limit put on it's power or authority. Most people don't even know what common law is.

[Hatha Sunahara]

I think it was Lenin who said "Let me teach the young for four years and there will be changes that will never be undone.'

Yes, these bastards want to teach our children to be slaves. There is a story in the bible about slaves wandering around in the desert for 40 years, or until they died so that they could not bring their slave mentality to the promised land of their children.

Our money system teaches us to be slaves. How will we live without money? And who is it that doles it out to us? You know how they train animals to do tricks? They reward the animal every time he does the trick with some food. No trick, no food. The animal learns or goes hungry. Same thing for people--except they use money.


Hatha

[vacuum]

I think the reason it's so bad right now is because it is too big and too powerful.

People should be able to govern themselves at the local level, but even cities are too big and too powerful. So, what does that leave us with? The best form of government is.....ta da....anarchy--no government. Instead, we need organizing forums--where people can get together with other people and discuss common problems and agree on solutions, and hire other people on an ad hoc basis to administer solutions to those problems, and when the problems are addressed, the 'solution administrators' are disbanded. No permanent structures for government, no entrenched bureaucrats--only voluntary associations. The only conformity that would be required would be to Common Law and the golden rule. All taxes would be voluntary. People should be able to connect themselves via local mesh networks. There should be no government that can force people to do anything. There should only be voluntary associations, and everybody should have the power to 'disassociate' themselves with any association--i. e. no forced memberships. And cops who shoot people claiming it was for officer safety should be given a speedy trial and hung. I could go on ad nauseam with trivia, but I think any intelligent reader should have grasped the idea by now. Take the power away from the Too Big To Fails, and give it back to those who can fail. And one principle that should be followed is that any monopoly that usurps its privilege can be shut down on grounds of systemic corruption.

Hatha

Even though we appear to be saying opposite things, I think in reality we're actually agreeing. We're both saying the average person needs to be much more involved. If everyone is actively involved in ruling themselves, I think a "statist" and "anarchist" world will start to look like the same thing. Think of the early American colonies. They didn't call themselves anarchists, they believed in a government, but the fact that so many people were actively involved in it made it look like an anarchist system. The main change between then and now is that people no longer get involved, so there are fewer who are responsible for the many. So I think it's the same thing.

[Hatha Sunahara]

Yer absolutely right Vacuum. When people govern themselves, that is Anarchy. They don't need rulers. What we see in our government today is a mirror image of ourselves (or most people, possibly present company excluded). Most people need this behemoth government because they are unable or unwilling to govern themselves.

I don't see any easy way out of this. The vast majority of Americans need to be re-educated, but that won't happen. We need to follow Lenin's advice and take our children back for four years. Their generation will then be able to fix this morass we've fallen into.

Where is Sui Juris on this. Just mention the word anarchism, and he's johnny on the spot. Hey SJ, wake up! You on vacation or something?


Hatha

[Horn]

A Representative Republic is no longer needed, wouldn't that be Mob Rules, or just a Re-public?

Who is going to patrol the fish in the lake for people with fishing licenses?