What is law?

[midnight rambler]

“Law is solely the organization of the individual right of self-defense which existed before law was formalized. Law is justice.”
― Frederic Bastiat

[Ares]

“Law is solely the organization of the individual right of self-defense which existed before law was formalized. Law is justice.”
― Frederic Bastiat

My definition is better. lol

"Law is a man made construct to control those who wish to remain outside of society, it is used for theft, violence, extortion, and murder by the state, law is anything but justice".

[mick silver]

law is anyone with the biggest gang with the most arms that dont care how the job gets done

[midnight rambler]

My definition is better. lol

"Law is a man made construct to control those who wish to remain outside of society, it is used for theft, violence, extortion, and murder by the state, law is anything but justice".

You're thinking about something else entirely, something which is dressed up to *appear* as law but is in reality some contractural nonsense.

[palani]

Reason is law.

Gold is currency in international law.

Silver is currency in land based law.

[Buffalo]

Not to eat meat.
Not to go on all fours.
Not to spill blood.

[Ares]

You're thinking about something else entirely, something which is dressed up to *appear* as law but is in reality some contractural nonsense.

Not really, "law" has been used by societies since the dawn of civilization to force segments of society into "compliance". It's the "law".

Law is entirely imaginary. If there was no one to enforce law, would it exist? Would it be justice? No. It's just words written on paper to give the parasite class power over a larger population when in reality they are powerless.

My definition of law is in physics, law of gravity, law of motion etc.. You know absolutes, that do not change with interpretation by men or society with agendas.

[Ponce]

It used to be called "rules", till the big wigs took over and made it into "laws".

V

[iOWNme]

All 'Law' is a threat of violence. Its not so much about who, its more about when. Since there is no such thing as 'Government' or 'Law' or 'Police' or any other obfuscation or euphemism, we must recognize they are just human beings in costumes, we must then ask WHEN is it morally justifiable to issue threats of violence?

Every individual has the right to not only issue threats of violence, but to use defensive force to protect their person or property. But would we call this 'Law' if an individual issued such a threat?

The difference is that all 'Governments' throughout history have attempted to alter this key concept of human morality, by issuing threats of violence in other situations as well. It stands to reason that if everyone has the right to use inherently justified 'Defensive Force' and 'the Law' authorizes agents of 'Government' to use force in other situations as well, then all 'Law' is nothing more than the attempt to legitimize immoral force.

In short, 'Law' is always the permission to commit evil – to do things that would be recognized as immoral and unjustified if anyone else did them.


Furthermore, even when 'good men' have created 'Laws' that attempt to only mimmick the individual Rights of man, those 'Laws' are at best redundant and irrelevant. If you choose to not murder, good for you because murder is wrong, but the 'Law' isnt why its bad. If you choose to not steal, good for you because stealing is bad, but the 'Law' isnt why its bad. Why dont we need to pass a 'Law' to make the sun come up in the morning? Could it be because that already happens in reality? Could it be because the 'Law makers' cannot change it with their scribbles?

Writing down on paper what already exists in reality DOES NOT CHANGE OR ALTER REALITY, hence the redundant and irrelevant part.

[BrewTech]

Not really, "law" has been used by societies since the dawn of civilization to force segments of society into "compliance". It's the "law".

Law is entirely imaginary. If there was no one to enforce law, would it exist? Would it be justice? No. It's just words written on paper to give the parasite class power over a larger population when in reality they are powerless.

My definition of law is in physics, law of gravity, law of motion etc.. You know absolutes, that do not change with interpretation by men or society with agendas.

Law of Gravity.

Laws of Physics (two objects cannot occupy the same space at the same time, for example).

...and so on. Laws are universally applicable and nothing (and no one) is exempt.

"Law", as most people (think they) know it, is imaginary. What they are referring to is POLICY. Administrative public policy.

These are nothing but rules that arbitrarily declared and selectively applied, and enforced through threat of violence, by one group to gain and/or maintain control over another group.

ETA: Probably should have read Ares' entire post before posting... LOL

[palani]

These are nothing but rules that arbitrarily declared and selectively applied, and enforced through threat of violence, by one group to gain and/or maintain control over another group.

Not necessarily all. Reason does happen occasionally and that is why I occasionally look at statutes before I reject them out of hand. Old laws are frequently a source of reason as well, as are movies, cartoons, and internet forums.

One old law resulted in the feudal system. While some appear to believe this was a construct of 'the dark ages' quite possibly necessarily resulting from an insufficient money supply and a need to defend the nation(s) caused this system to come into being. If this is the case then quite possibly history is in the process of repeating itself because 1) it appears there is no money and 2) it appears that pirates are just over the horizon.

[BrewTech]

Not necessarily all. Reason does happen occasionally and that is why I occasionally look at statutes before I reject them out of hand. Old laws are frequently a source of reason as well, as are movies, cartoons, and internet forums.

One old law resulted in the feudal system. While some appear to believe this was a construct of 'the dark ages' quite possibly necessarily resulting from an insufficient money supply and a need to defend the nation(s) caused this system to come into being. If this is the case then quite possibly history is in the process of repeating itself because 1) it appears there is no money and 2) it appears that pirates are just over the horizon.

These days, "law"(policy) has ZERO to do with reason, and everything to do with control.

[Santa]

Emotions beget reasons beget lawyers beget laws.

[monty]

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Common Law Grand Jury Movement Now Active in 47 States ...

Common Law Grand Jury Movement Now Active in 47 States ...

Sent: Monday, October 21,
2013 8:55 AM
Subject: Common Law Grand
Jury Movement Now Active in 47 States!
WARNING:
NUMEROUS DISCUSSIONS PROMOTING OBAMA’S PUSH FOR ‘NEW WORLD ORDER’ – SECONDED BY
JOE BIDEN.


Good Morning:

Wanted to share the
following extremely important information with you:

New World Order:

Common Law Grand Jury Movement Now Active in 47 States!-Posted on The Post & Email-By Sharon Rondeau-On October
20, 2013:
“TRUE LAW IS BUILT UPON MAXIMS AND PRINCIPLES”
by Sharon Rondeau
Is the United States about to be “reset” to 1789 and the
Declaration of Independence?
(Oct. 20, 2013) —[Editor’s Note: The following is a
continuation of our interview with an organizer of the New York State Common
Law Grand Jury, who explained how people in virtually all of the states are
prepared to go into the courts and oversee the administration of justice as
they believe the Founders had intended it, as evidenced by the creation of the U.S.
Constitution and Bill of Rights.
Our two previous installments of the interview are here and here. Here, the
organizer continues to educate readers on how constitutional justice can return
to America’s courtrooms.]
Once you have that kind of control and you find a problem, you
give them a written prescription, and they have 48 hours to fix it. Now
you’ve taken back the whole system, and the New World Order crumbles. If we can do
this in 26+ states, the whole New World Order crumbles. It’s a very
simple thing. People look at this through complexity and are trained to
fight every battle when all you have to do is win the courts to take the entire
country back.
We have been studying law for about four years, looking at common
law and trying to figure it out. Over time, we did figure it out and
found some great people to learn from. We heard about the grand jury
about two years ago, and we knew it was something we wanted to get involved
in. We needed to learn common law and processes of the court procedures,
and we were working on all of those things. At the beginning of June of
this year, someone sent me a copy of United States v. Williams, which I had
seen but never read. They said, “John, you have to read this.” So I
looked at it and read it, and I called a few people up and they read it, and we
decided we needed to change gears from “committeemen” to “grand jury.” By
July 18, the first grand jury was elected here in New York in my county, and
now we have 17 grand juries elected in New York, and hopefully within the next
60 days, maybe 90 at the most, we’ll have a grand jury in every county here in
New York.
We have 47 states that have come on board with us. We are
doing our meetings online, and some people had come in and were interested, and
they wanted to copy what we were doing. So we were sharing information,
and we ended up going national. We went from NewYorkCommitteemen.org to NationalLibertyAlliance.org in July, and we kept
building state after state until we had 47 states on board. Some states
will probably beat New York as far as getting their counties involved
throughout the entire state. We have Florida, Utah, California, Ohio,
Pennsylvania – just a lot of states across the board – and Washington is
starting to move now.
We had the prerequisitional requirements of understanding how
things worked before we found United States v. Williams. If we had
found it two years ago, we probably would be making the same mistakes everybody
else has made. So we were blessed to have the knowledge so that we would
have the right tools to use. We have other people around us with good
knowledge. We did all of this without a plan; it’s just something that
happened.
Even though we’ve accomplished a lot, our accomplishments were
speedy and unplanned. Every time we’d try to make a plan, we’d find
ourselves going in different directions. We’re finding the right thing at
the right time. Numerous times, we tried to get word out to the media,
and we realized, “Well, we didn’t want you anyway.” We did interviews on
radio; we talked with small groups, networking, but we didn’t want to talk to
the major news networks.
Now we’re at a point where we have a major story. We’re at
the point where the shot heard around the world
has just happened. What we are about to do is going to bring this country
back to 1789. The
repercussions of what is happening here are just as great as the Declarations
of Independence was, which was the birth of our country. We’re going through
what I would call a rebirthing. That’s where we’re headed, and as
Jefferson said, “Those who expect
to be both ignorant and free, expect what never was and never will be.”
So we teach people that they have to become re-educated. They have to
come to the realization that their heritage is the law. They thought they
had to give it to the New World Order or a lawyer, but no…you can’t give your
life force to an individual who is controlled by other individuals,
anyway. This is your heritage; your heritage is common law. If you
get rid of common law, you’ve gotten rid of the heart of America.
We all have to become “lawyers,” lawyers of true law, which
is natural law. And it’s really pretty simple because it’s so
logical. Natural law runs off of maxims, and maxims of truth cannot be
denied. For example, water doesn’t run uphill. Nobody can argue
that point. That’s how true law is built; it’s built upon maxims and
principles. It’s all about the facts. The whole focus is to find
the injured party and repair it, and that’s what it’s all about. It
doesn’t get any more difficult than that. Anything that may appear
complex is made of complexities.
Source Link:
http://www.thepostemail.com/2013/10/20/common-law-grand-jury-movement-now-active-in-47-states/print/

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner

[mick silver]

thats what i said own but with less words

[Hypertiger]

White Black

Knowledge ignorance

Reality fantasy

Truth lie

Positive negative

Logic reason

Something nothing

Victory defeat

Yes no

Law rule

Supply demand

Need want

infinite finite

Constant variable

Hot cold

Red blue

Life death

1 0

White = Knowledge = Truth = Positive = Logic = Something = Victory = Yes = Law = Supply = Need = infinite = indestructible = Constant = Hot = Red = life = 1

Black = ignorance = lie = negative = reason = nothing = defeat = no = rule = demand = want = finite = fragile = variable = cold = blue = death = 0

People have no power to make or break Law.

All that people have the power to make or break are rules and to call rules Law

But if a rule attempts to break Law

Law will break the rule.

Truth is the supply of power to the demand of the paradox of the lie that wants to become Truth and never die.

Probability that a lie can defeat Truth = 0% = absolutely NO = defeat = death = 0 = impossible

Probability that Truth can defeat a lie = 100% = absolutely YES = victory = life = 1 = Possible

You can manipulate the Universe however you desire as long as you do not attempt to break LAW (impossible) or are caught breaking a rule (possible).

[palani]

These days, "law"(policy) has ZERO to do with reason, and everything to do with control.
Is it possible that the reasoning processes of a communist differ in some ways from the reasoning processes of a normal individual? See when 'they' come up with a 'law' they still must have a reason for it and control could be considered a valid reason. When the reason goes away the law goes away.

I find insects tend to go away as well once they have decimated the garden. As long as they have something to munch on they tend to hang around. I think there is a law in there somewhere.

[osoab]

Welcome back HT. Good post.

[singular_me]

I basically agree with HT...

also laws are meant to be broken as they are written by the same PTBs who will use all the loopholes intentionally left to suit their agenda.

while Laws are supposedly designed to protect us, the real goal is to dispossess us on a regular basis. The threat to lose what we hold dear makes us a lot more manipulable.

However, all laws are doomed in essence as they set into motion the use of force to start with.

The only Law that should be in place, if any, is "no coercion of any kind".

[Hypertiger]

Take a byte of the forbidden fruit of logic and gain awareness of 1 and 0

Truth is GOD and GOD is Truth

GOD is LAW and LAW is GOD

A pseudo random number generator is an equation that generates a random number based on when you command a random number to be generated and the time from the computer timing chip...conneted to an algorithm between you and the number based on the demand sent to the clock to see what the count is.

A real random number generator is when Satan rolls dice and demands GOD to supply Satan with a number.

Just have to roll 3 6's in a row...to get what you want....but you only are supplied with what you need from GOD...not what you want.

Your head is below water and you cells want air and they demand you to supply what they want.

You demand GOD to supply the demand for what you want and you are supplied with what you need or water.

Which is not what you want.

You have to get your head above water and then demand GOD for supply and then you will get what you need again...but this time it is air....what you want and need are the same...You won the roll against GOD....under water you lost...you had to cheat and get your head above water to win the roll.

Which is what you want...Positive, victory, YES, 1

GOD helps those which help themselves.

"Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."--George Washington

Government is the supply of power...the Governed is the demand for power.

Truth is not reason; Truth is not eloquent; Truth is power. Like fire, Truth is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.

Logic is not reason; Logic is not eloquent; Logic is power. Like fire, Logic is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.

LAW is not reason; LAW is not eloquent; LAW is power. Like fire, Law is a dangerous servant and a fearful master.

Truth which is infinite and indestructible is the supply of power to the demand of lies which are finite and fragile but want to become infinite and indestructible.

Truth is the supply of power to the demand of the paradox of the lie that wants to become Truth and never die.

Bread and circuses

food and entertainment

truth and lies

reality and fantasy

The invisible order of Truth or signal supplying the demand of the noise or visible chaos of rules and rulers pretending to be Law and Order.