Historians identify 'Holy Grail' as goblet in Spanish museum, new book says ld Histor

[Serpo]

(http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world) http://nypost.com/2014/03/31/historians-...oly-grail/ (http://nypost.com/2014/03/31/historians-claim-to-have-recovered-fabled-holy-grail/)
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/hi...-1.1740633 (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/historians-holy-grail-goblet-spanish-museum-article-1.1740633)
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/03/...oly-grail/ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/03/31/historians-explosive-claim-theyve-found-the-holy-grail/)
http://news.discovery.com/history/religi...140331.htm (http://news.discovery.com/history/religion/crowds-flock-to-basilica-after-holy-grail-claim-140331.htm)
http://www.news.com.au/world/historians-...6870442706 (http://www.news.com.au/world/historians-claim-holy-grail-is-in-church-in-leon-northern-spain/story-fndir2ev-1226870442706)




ld (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world)
Historians identify 'Holy Grail' as goblet in Spanish museum, new book says

Margarita Torres and Jose Manuel Ortega del Rio - authors of the book 'Kings of the Grail' - claim the much sought-after cup used by Jesus Christ at the Last Supper was given as a gift to Spanish King Fernando I by a Muslim ruler. The historians said they identified the goblet after a three-year investigation.

BY Joel Landau (http://www.nydailynews.com/authors?author=Joel%20Landau)
NEW YORK DAILY NEWS
Monday, March 31, 2014, 2:50 PM






http://static2.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1740631.1396291307%21/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_1200/grail1n-3-web.jpg Ending the quest: This cup at a church in northern Spain is the Holy Grail, say historians and book authors Margarita Torres and Jose Manuel Ortega del Rio. The artifact is currently not on display as San Isidro Basilica looks to find a larger space to keep it.
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Enlarge (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/historians-holy-grail-goblet-spanish-museum-article-1.1740633#)

CESAR MANSO/AFP/Getty Images
Two historians claim the search for the Holy Grail is over.
The famous cup used by Jesus Christ during the Last Supper was identified in a book written by Margarita Torres Jose Manuel Ortega del Rio, titled "Kings of the Grail" and published last week, as the jewel-encrusted goblet on display at the San Isidro Basilica in the northwestern Spanish city of Leon.
News of the discovery caused masses of people to flock to the historic church to view the precious chalice - forcing the operators of the museum to pull the piece from the exhibit, according to French news agency Agence France-Presse.
The museum's director told AFP that they were looking for space large enough to accommodate the crowds.
"It was in a very small room where it was not possible to admire it to the full," Raquel Jaen told the agency.
There are more than 200 golden cups that have been thought to be the one used during the Last Supper, but Torres and del Rio identified the Spanish goblet during a three-year investigation that started with a piece of Egyptian parchment found at the University of Al-Azhar in Cairo, the agency reported.
The supposed Holy Grail was offered to King Fernando I, who ruled between 1037 and 1065, as a peace offering by the head of a Muslim kingdom within Spain, the historians said.
The cup, made of agate, gold and onyx, is actually two goblets formed together, the authors claim.
The artifact had been known until last week as the goblet of the Infanta Dona Urraca, King Fernando I's daughter, AFP reported.

[Glass]

They were saying there are hundreds of holy grails around spain and italy. So there are plenty to choose from. And where would Jesus or any of his mates get the scratch to buy one of these. Sure it's a nice drinking glass. Maybe someone who got paid 21 pieces of silver bought it for him as a gift? Putting on a bit of a kegger. Need some good glasses.

I remember watching a tv show. Father Ted. Where the Catholic church artifacts committee where coming to visit to upgrade the local religious artifacts from class 4 to class 3 artifacts. The local priest, Father Ted was quite excited because it could mean more pilgrims and we all know more pilgrims means more cash.

If I recall the whole visit turned out to be a fairly shitty affair.

[singular_me]

I'd like to know who sponsored the investigation :)

the 'holy grail' is much like the 'philosopher stone', they are spiritual concepts

[Serpo]

ORMUS
Is It The
Philosopher's
Stone?

http://www.spiritofmaat.com/archive/dec3/carter.htm

[Glass]

Do they use a replica of it at mass/communion? Will every church have to upgrade now? They've probably got cupboards of old ones that they no longer use then.

[Ponce]

Sure, turn it over and at the bottom you will read "Made In China".......by the way, my cat is using the real one to drink water from.

V

[Horn]

So they spun glass B.C. ?

[Dogman]

So they spun glass B.C. ?

If one exists and started "plane" it probably got embellished over the century's.

As most so called relics Of the church!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[Horn]

C'mon Dogman, there's a crack at the base held together with superglue.

the holy grail should not need superglue...! :)

[Celtic Rogue]

There are some that say the Holy Grail is the blood line of Jesus through Mary Magdalene. There was said to be a child that was smuggled out of the middle east to France. I think this makes more sence than a bejeweled cup that as others pointed out would be way out of the price range of Jesus or his disciples.

[midnight rambler]

There are some that say the Holy Grail is the blood line of Jesus through Mary Magdalene. There was said to be a child that was smuggled out of the middle east to France. I think this makes more sence than a bejeweled cup that as others pointed out would be way out of the price range of Jesus or his disciples.

The notion of Jesus using such a bejeweled cup is completely incongruent with the life of Jesus. In fact during the time of Jesus I'm thinking that what is being presented as a genuine article would be considered WAY over the top bling, and I can't help but think this is a much more recent construct/fabrication. I cannot fathom that anyone would be so easily deceived, but then again I can. lol

ETA: Upon closer inspection I can see that there's a 'graven image' near the rim...yeah, sure...no shortage of fools out there.

[Atocha]

The notion of Jesus using such a bejeweled cup is completely incongruent with the life of Jesus. In fact during the time of Jesus I'm thinking that what is being presented as a genuine article would be considered WAY over the top bling, and I can't help but think this is a much more recent construct/fabrication. I cannot fathom that anyone would be so easily deceived, but then again I can. lol

ETA: Upon closer inspection I can see that there's a 'graven image' near the rim...yeah, sure...no shortage of fools out there.


I agree. If anything I am sure that the cup/goblet that Jesus would have used would have probably been a simple piece made from wood or perhaps even clay.

[chad]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DGFuHC75aY

[Dogman]

If one exists and started "plane" it probably got embellished over the century's.

As most so called relics Of the church!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner


There are some that say the Holy Grail is the blood line of Jesus through Mary Magdalene. There was said to be a child that was smuggled out of the middle east to France. I think this makes more sence than a bejeweled cup that as others pointed out would be way out of the price range of Jesus or his disciples. In part I can agree with you, Tho in the 2000 years most if any truth has been thoroughly muddled.


The notion of Jesus using such a bejeweled cup is completely incongruent with the life of Jesus. In fact during the time of Jesus I'm thinking that what is being presented as a genuine article would be considered WAY over the top bling, and I can't help but think this is a much more recent construct/fabrication. I cannot fathom that anyone would be so easily deceived, but then again I can. lol

ETA: Upon closer inspection I can see that there's a 'graven image' near the rim...yeah, sure...no shortage of fools out there.

Zing, over the head, For most of the so called "relics" ether real or not , most if all have over time have been embellished. What was simple to began with was enhanced (bling) to stress its importance. That given the time, could be anything simple, as a plan cup of mud, thrown on a wheel and shaped and them fired, To a stone that was carved into a cup.

Then over time, because of its importance, as in religious importance, what ever this thing is (cup/piece of wood, etc, or even a spear point) can and will be enhanced/embellished with gold,silver/jewels that are added over the century's.

The Catholic church (amounts others] was big on this kind of stuff in the past, to impress and add to the "mystery) and power (mystical) to shill its line of thought/control/power. That it welded in the past.


I agree. If anything I am sure that the cup/goblet that Jesus would have used would have probably been a simple piece made from wood or perhaps even clay.

Yes that was my trying in a sorry way to say, if real, it probably was simple, then as time went by, it was enhanced and embellished. But the important thing if it was simple at the heart, (remove all of the valuable crap that probably was added over the century's, if it is real and in the running the cup inside all of the "bling" will be simple.)


Edit: Way way back in the day, most people were not educated, could not read nor write, Latin and or greek, was the "universal" language both written with greek in the mix also for understanding the older texts! Latin was the common language of the educated, it was the bridge for people from different country's/backgrounds/languages (sorta like English is now the standard language of international aviation) (you were rich or a scribe) And most people were "street" smart, but most did not a clue of any written text, which again most was in Latin or Greek. The nobility and trade class's but more to the nobility/and the church more so were the educated ones. But the trades also had at least a hand hold on reading/writing and more.

Hell back way back in those days, they wanted the serf's and such to remain , stupid.

Which is funny because today, the Muslim faith, unlike what it was back in its heyday, while the western civilizations were in the dark ages. Were in a heyday of enlightenment of knowledge and sciences. Now they want to keep the faith, stupid, and only the teaching of the "book" is important!

But I am getting off topic! sorry!

So for the "church" at the time "visual bling" was the thing, to convey the "message" to the masses. In pictures/carvings and relics. Bigger churches. With a relic, which would make a bigger impression?

A plain piece of wood, cup, or anything that is considered a true relic, as is? Probably not so much, so the ptb will "enhance" the piece, bling the holy hell out of it (pun intended) to impress the ignorant! Remember this at the time, as now, that a very few, are in control of the very many.

Anyhoo, could hold forth, on this one for a bunch.

[singular_me]

what you say is a possible explanation on the physical-reality plane, but I think it is too romantic to be true. There is too much "power" involved. On the other end, and since truth is always simple, on the metaphysical plane, it is the union of the sacred masculine with the sacred feminine

but wait the plot thickens:
The Merovingians kings claimed Jewish descent from King David, King Solomon and, posturing as Christians, from Jesus Christ through Mary Magdalene.

have fun researching, my 2 cents stop here... :) as politics and religions are same. and I am not in the mood for another battle.


There are some that say the Holy Grail is the blood line of Jesus through Mary Magdalene. There was said to be a child that was smuggled out of the middle east to France. I think this makes more sence than a bejeweled cup that as others pointed out would be way out of the price range of Jesus or his disciples.

[Dogman]

There is the metaphysical, and then there is the more likely of the physical world and the bullcrap that shaped our history, especially this subject.

On this mud ball we call home, from the dawn of time to this day have many beliefs (religion,faiths) that had and died and still exist. I hold that they all cannot be wrong and only one right. From which can never be proven,came about from , fear of the unknown, and a way to lay rules for people to live together, without killing each other, (it is called civilization).

Plus a great way for the few to control the many, belief is a very powerful thing, when combined with the metaphysical! And give answers, real and not to explain the unknown.

But it is a truth, that most religions today "embellish" their "relics" ether physically gold plate them (solid or not) or enhance them for the wow factor, to imbue a mystical theme to the object.

Hell whole temples/churches some huge have been built to house such "relics" real or not!

Part maybe truth, more so in my mind for the "few" to lead and "control or direct" the many.

Funny thing if all the tests that man can apply to this object and it passes, there is a good chance, but we mortals will never know if it is real or just from the same timeline.

But if it tests to the same period, watch out!

It will be a rock star for they that want to believe. We have seen nothing yet! The Catholic church and all decedents from the same, (protestant) will go nuts..(thinky)

I just hold that of all of the other "beliefs" from before, Christianity that still exist today, (which all teach the same basic truths and share, very similar story's "suspiciously similar" )

Nuff from me..

[singular_me]

I hear ya, I know... looks like we are freaking doomed. People would prefer fighting to death to keep their possessions rather than abandoning everything for the sake of True Knowledge. The end result is the same (disposession), only the way to achieve it is different....



There is the metaphysical, and then there is the more likely of the physical world and the bullcrap that shaped our history, especially this subject.

On this mud ball we call home, from the dawn of time to this day have many beliefs (religion,faiths) that had and died and still exist. I hold that they all cannot be wrong and only one right. From which can never be proven,came about from , fear of the unknown, and a way to lay rules for people to live together, without killing each other, (it is called civilization).

Plus a great way for the few to control the many, belief is a very powerful thing, when combined with the metaphysical! And give answers, real and not to explain the unknown.

But it is a truth, that most religions today "embellish" their "relics" ether physically gold plate them (solid or not) or enhance them for the wow factor, to imbue a mystical theme to the object.

Hell whole temples/churches some huge have been built to house such "relics" real or not!

Part maybe truth, more so in my mind for the "few" to lead and "control or direct" the many.

Funny thing if all the tests that man can apply to this object and it passes, there is a good chance, but we mortals will never know if it is real or just from the same timeline.

But if it tests to the same period, watch out!

It will be a rock star for they that want to believe. We have seen nothing yet! The Catholic church and all decedents from the same, (protestant) will go nuts..(thinky)

I just hold that of all of the other "beliefs" from before, Christianity that still exist today, (which all teach the same basic truths and share, very similar story's "suspiciously similar" )

Nuff from me..

[Dogman]

I hear ya, I know... looks like we are freaking doomed. People would prefer fighting to death to keep their possessions rather than abandoning everything for the sake of True Knowledge. The end result is the same (disposession), only the way to achieve it is different.

My response is while your methinks are still posting! Only doomed for they have a narrow/locked minds and do NOT really look and question what is told to you and you have to take what is said on faith alone. Most churches!

I say again not all religions on this mud ball can be wrong and a Johny come lately (sorta) is right. Catholic/christian. The spiritual is real if one listens. Read my thoughts writen, established religions are a great way to give humans, laws, to live and not kill each other, civilization.

The there is the control thing which is a bloody truth. The few to control the very many.

I know there is a creator, that is bigger than anything man can see and understand that is behind the universe, it can not just be chance.

I could carry on, but not now.