What the hell is wrong with the silver price?

[Ponce]

It has been stuck at $19.97 for a long time.

V

[Dogman]

Burn one of your tp rolls that should kick it!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[Ponce]

I'll burn my wife, my gun, my dog, my home, my food........but never, never, never, my tp....don't worry Pluto, I won't burn you hahahhahahahha

V

[Dogman]

I'll burn my wife, my gun, my dog, my home, my food........but never, never, never, my tp....don't worry Pluto, I won't burn you hahahhahahahha

V
Gasp

Thanks amego!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[Silver Rocket Bitches!]

It just means buy more more more.

[Uncle Salty]

The only to assure its rise is to SELL it all!

[Twisted Titan]

I am still of the opinion we will shocking vault up prices this year because the current price is way below the cost of production and this causing smaller and midsize operations to be mothballed or abandonded.

The big companies like Pan American et al unless they are getting a sweetheart deal kickback from the gubbermints are getting their profits eaten in production costs.


The price must go up and significantly to keep the producers on line.

[1970 silver art]

This is not very surprising to me that silver is going down. I feel that this year it will break the 2013 intra-day low of $18.14 and go down to $14-$15 level as a low for this year and will eventually go down to $8 level on or before March 2017. It is going to get ugly for the DOG imo so brace for it.

[Camp Bassfish]

This is not very surprising to me that silver is going down. I feel that this year it will break the 2013 intra-day low of $18.14 and go down to $14-$15 level as a low for this year and will eventually go down to $8 level on or before March 2017. It is going to get ugly for the DOG imo so brace for it.

Silver Sammy????..... Is that you??

[1970 silver art]

Silver Sammy????..... Is that you??Nope. I am just skeptical of the DOG and I feel that it will go down much further from where it is now (currently it is at $19.62). I feel that I will be right on this. I am bearish on silver and what I posted in post #8 of this thread is just my gut feeling. Nothing more nothing less.

[Camp Bassfish]

As an aside, I have a couple old silver art bars laying around. One is from the early 70's of the NYC skyline.... without the towers, as they had not been completed yet. The other is of the Saint Lawrence River near 1000 Islands. I think there are a few more in a bag somewhere, but those are the ones that come to mind......

[chad]

of course i want it to go up so i can join ponce on silver island, but owning it and being a cheerleader aside, something is very wrong with the price. even my investment banker cousin who hates metals commented on it this weekend while we were hanging out. $1,300 gold and $20 silver is odd. really odd. a pizza costs $20 these days, to be able to buy an ounce of ag for the same price is beyond weird.

[Libertarian_Guard]

Lopsided Short Positions in Silver Futures Markets Put Near-Term Damper on Rallies


So why has silver been frustratingly unable to sustain breakout rallies in recent weeks? Look no further than who has the ammunition to kill rallies in the futures market.
The Commercial net short position in silver now stands at 144.5 million ounces. According to analysis by Ted Butler, JPMorgan holds an astounding 76% of the total Commercial net short position (110 million troy ounces).

Silver is unique among all commodities in that just four institutional traders together hold short positions that are the equivalent of 110 days of world production (and the top eight traders are short nearly 160 days of silver production). In the long-term, this is a bullish setup since short positions are eventually covered (bought back). But in the near-term, the big players can sell more paper contracts into the market in order to quell rallies.

https://www.independentlivingbullion...-shorts-000529

[chad]

Lopsided Short Positions in Silver Futures Markets Put Near-Term Damper on Rallies


So why has silver been frustratingly unable to sustain breakout rallies in recent weeks? Look no further than who has the ammunition to kill rallies in the futures market.
The Commercial net short position in silver now stands at 144.5 million ounces. According to analysis by Ted Butler, JPMorgan holds an astounding 76% of the total Commercial net short position (110 million troy ounces).

Silver is unique among all commodities in that just four institutional traders together hold short positions that are the equivalent of 110 days of world production (and the top eight traders are short nearly 160 days of silver production). In the long-term, this is a bullish setup since short positions are eventually covered (bought back). But in the near-term, the big players can sell more paper contracts into the market in order to quell rallies.

https://www.independentlivingbullion...-shorts-000529

"near term" as referenced in this article is 33 years.

[hoarder]

What happens when the supply of anything increases? The price goes down. The supply of paper gold and silver is unlimited.

[Silver Rocket Bitches!]

Silver is in backwardation yet the nominal price plummets. To me it's a good thing. I don't plan on liquidating so it provides me an opportunity to keep shoveling onto my pile.

[osoab]

How much did you buy yesterday chad?

[chad]

How much did you buy yesterday chad?

none, but i thought about it. watch this, it's going down again in 5 minutes...

[Dachsie]

I know this whole forum is full of members who know a lot about silver and gold. I know almost nothing about it but do have a couple of gold and silver coins.

But I have read quite a few articles about what is happening to our economy and the deep coruption in banking and finance. I have read several articles that say that silver and gold is totally manipulated. It never reaches the price it "should" because of the manipulations of the big banks.

I remember Max Keiser was really harping on buying lots of silver to put I think it was J.P. Morgan in a really bad position. That failed and Keiser has jumped on to other promotions of his and hardly mentions silver much anymore.

I do think precious metals are a way to sort "hold your own" or "stay afloat" in the coming economic woes, but I do not think it is really a way to get ahead.

The few times I have tried to see about buying some precious metal coins with some of the advertisers of the alternative talk shows, I have been thoroughly disgusted with their huckster type behavior. I just go down to a local coin show and buy a piece now and then and I check Kitco before I go to see that they do not charge too much of a margin.

[madfranks]

I almost bought some yesterday, too. But I didn't, now I want to wait for it to go lower.

[Ponce]

Frank? get on the train before it leaves the station......this train has no schedule.

In the future silver will not be for selling but for trading........after all, there will be no economy.

V

[EE_]

I heard Jim Cramer say he was glad to see gold down this morning on the Jew business channel.
With stocks at record highs, why do they care about gold.

[Neuro]

I know this whole forum is full of members who know a lot about silver and gold. I know almost nothing about it but do have a couple of gold and silver coins.

But I have read quite a few articles about what is happening to our economy and the deep coruption in banking and finance. I have read several articles that say that silver and gold is totally manipulated. It never reaches the price it "should" because of the manipulations of the big banks.

I remember Max Keiser was really harping on buying lots of silver to put I think it was J.P. Morgan in a really bad position. That failed and Keiser has jumped on to other promotions of his and hardly mentions silver much anymore.

I do think precious metals are a way to sort "hold your own" or "stay afloat" in the coming economic woes, but I do not think it is really a way to get ahead.

The few times I have tried to see about buying some precious metal coins with some of the advertisers of the alternative talk shows, I have been thoroughly disgusted with their huckster type behavior. I just go down to a local coin show and buy a piece now and then and I check Kitco before I go to see that they do not charge too much of a margin.
Max Keiser is of course a shill, as he encouraged people to buy tons of silver in the $35-50 range, to take down JPM... Actually what he did was to recruit bagholders, who now or earlier sold the physical silver in disgust, with a great loss. He did the same with Bitcoin. He is pretty similar to Jim Kramer, though their audiences are different...

Anyway it is a good idea to at least put some discretionary money into physical gold and silver. It is pretty much the only thing that doesn't depend on the performance of a counterparty, and it is also an inflationary hedge, over short to medium term if you are unlucky or shilled you may lose some in purchasing power, so general advice is not to use money that you need soon...

[mick silver]

whats wrong with silver well my guess would be the one's with what little paper they have left are not buying silver but paying bills buying food an whats nots i buy in smalls lots now not like i did when i started buying back in those days buying 2 or 3 hundred ozs a week are gone most are looking for other ways to make it like storing food and things they need . out in the woods here people know in there hearth something big coming this way i see people digging holes and building bunker homes back in the woods theys day . they are starting to trust no one .... plus the banks own the markets not us anymore ....

[1970 silver art]

As an aside, I have a couple old silver art bars laying around. One is from the early 70's of the NYC skyline.... without the towers, as they had not been completed yet. The other is of the Saint Lawrence River near 1000 Islands. I think there are a few more in a bag somewhere, but those are the ones that come to mind......I do not think that I have seen those '70's silver art bars that you described. So far this year, It has been slow for me as a silver art bar collector. I did not buy many silver art bars this year because they are much harder to find. With that said, I did buy a few '70's nude woman silver art bars from a couple of coin shows in February and early March of this year and I bought a 1-oz 1990 Robert Westfall Nude Marilyn Monroe silver art bar at a LCS a month ago. I paid .999 generic silver premiums for the 1-oz '70's nude woman bars and I paid $5 over spot for the Marilyn Monroe bar that I purchased from the LCS. I also bought a 1984 Pamp nude HoneyComb with Bees silver art bar from a coin show last weekend for $23.00. Even though this year is not over yet, I suspect that those bars will probably end up being the highlights of 2014 in terms of silver art bar purchases in 2014.

[aeondaze]

http://www.haveanexitstrategy.com/artwork/blockeddoor.png

There will be no escape.

[old steel]

http://www.vixensandangels.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/b/u/bullet-belt-matte-black-silver-tip-223cal_1.gif

[pitwab]

I don't know, what's wrong with the price? To cheap, to expensive or what is the bitch here.

[Buddha]

I'll burn my wife, my gun, my dog, my home, my food........but never, never, never, my tp....don't worry Pluto, I won't burn you hahahhahahahha

V

Lol Ponce, you need to sacrifice something of value to the PM Gods... burn a roll and meditate while you do it, the PM Gods will appresiate your sacrifice.

[Ponce]

pitwab? first of all.....welcome to gold-silver.us......I am bitching about it because this time around I have been holding silver for the past 32 years, how can I buy my "Silver Island" if the price doesn't go up?

Buddha? you are right, I will give a silver round to the first person who asked me for a donation.

V

[pitwab]

pitwab? first of all.....welcome to gold-silver.us......I am bitching about it because this time around I have been holding silver for the past 32 years, how can I buy my "Silver Island" if the price doesn't go up?
V

If you bought it for a way to make more money then I suppose you could have picked something better. If you bought it as a hedge against SHTF then it is still doing it's job[we just don't know if it will work]. Doing anything for 32 years is remarkable and I commend you for that.

[Silver Rocket Bitches!]

pitwab? first of all.....welcome to gold-silver.us......I am bitching about it because this time around I have been holding silver for the past 32 years, how can I buy my "Silver Island" if the price doesn't go up?
V

How much did you let go when we hit $48 in 2011?

[milehi]

Im out of town, but I stopped by a local coin shop. Picked up two handfuls of generic for only a buck fifty over spot.

[Hitch]

I have been holding silver for the past 32 years, how can I buy my "Silver Island" if the price doesn't go up?

Buy a smaller island? :) It is not the size of the island, but rather the man who inhabits it (you Ponce). There will never be the perfect time to buy the island, you just need to go for it at some point.

[Hypertiger]

There was this rumor going around years ago...that Gold an silver are a measure of inflation...and for some odd reason...it's now a measure of deflation...

maybe you all have not realized that in 2008...it was game over...The QE is just to keep the banking system and the 200 trillion dollar global credit trade system...from imploding.

The top...is milking the gold an silver markets...

since 2008...the credit inflation...has stopped...from 1944 the US credit supply was exponentially growing by 7.8% per year...it began...in 1941...but the inflation did not show up until after WW2...since war...is deflationary.

1941 to 2008 = 66.6 years

the last gold an silver spike...was a blow off top...

since 2008...all the credit inflation...has been QE...and it's returning back into thin air almost as fast as it is created out of thin air.

the democrats were installed...they shot the obamacare torpedo into the sinking ship...and then the US congress was manipulated into a deadlock...and since 2009...the inflation of US government spending...has been stalled

all the babble about money printing by the FED and insane spending by the US federal government...has been smoke and mirrors...

Food prices rising?

Fuel prices rising?

The top owns and controls the global food an fuel acquisition and distribution networks...the gulf blow out...staged...to shut down the exploration of oil there...the environmentalists?...have been used to stop the pipelines from being built...and now oil is forced to travel by rail...which consumes more oil than a pipeline.

during the last great depression...England dumped grain at sea...while the population starved...to support price.

the interlocked directorships at the top...have all been buying back stocks...to reduce the supply...in relation to the demand...to keep the markets going up.

the 1991 to 2006 new home real estate boom...ended...not because credit was being created out of thin air an lent to people that could not pay it back...because the supply of people signing on the dotted line requesting the credit inflation...was exhausted.

the massive forclosures were to take sypply off the market to keep the pre existing real estate from collapsing.

it's all about keeping inflationary expectations high...if you all became aware that the system was deflating...you would cut back...and accelerate the systemic collapse that is already in progress.

below 6.448% yield...and long term credit inflation is hyperdeflationary...or negative...above is hyperinflationary or positive...above you require less an less volume to supply yields...below you require more an more volume to support yields....that is the purpose of the QE...in 2008...the USA transformed from a fundable asset...or positive yielding investment...into an unfundable liability...or negative yielding investment...or useless.

the too big to fail is not the banks...it's the population of the USA...without the QE...the USA along with the rest of the world would implode into a nightmare beyond current abilities of the just think positive worshipers to fathom...I assure you...I was born with some kind of difference from other people...making me...abnormal...compared to you all which a normal...while you all can not seem to see what I can see...I do not want to see what I can see...I want what you all are smoking...

since the collapse in 2006 of the new home real estate boom...which dominoed up to the 2008 controlled demolition of Lehmans...there has been no recovery...the volume to sustain yields...does not exist...an never will.

You all are being set up to be suckered by the next staged event.

I figure you have this spring and summer to stock up for the winter...since the elections are coming up...and the deadlock of congress is going to be removed...and the conservatives will be given power.

to deal with...the collapse...that is coming.

silver an gold...should spike up...once the equity markets collapse...since last I saw...the insiders were building positions to capitalize upon this...so they are...either going to commit suicide...or rape you all again...as usual.

you all meaning...they win...and you all lose...like the owners of the markets are supposed to...unless you are just one of those non speculators...that is just stacking gold an silver till the day you die...to pass on to the next person...until one day your descendants have a pile big enough to be give the time of day...or killed and looted.

get the return of the gold standard crusade out of your head.

you either have gold...or you do not...that is the gold standard...

and ultimately...to play a doomsday spike...you want to have a bail out plan...find a depressed asset...to dump the inflation extracted from the doomsday spike into...like a chunk of land...

you all think that hyperinflation comes after comes after inflation...and then after that...2X hyperinflation...then 4X hyperinflation...then 8X hyperinflation...until you can use an atom of gold to buy the world.

That is not going to happen...and whatever you think an economic collapse of the USA and world is going to look like...must be positive...or a fantasy...because the reality...even the best case scenario...is so negative...that you do not want to live to see the day.

Jessie Ventura has the right idea...get away from populated areas...they all are debt bubbles...that will pop.

The only reason I come here an post...because I detest...lies...and hate to see people manipulated without their knowledge...while you all do supply power to the system...you are not the master minds...you all and everyone globally...has been deceived for decades and decades...and you deserve to know...

to brace for impact...or jump out of the way.

according to your belief system...the smart rule the dumb...I...if I was a normal person should be taking you all to the cleaners and laughing...that is not me.

but you all...if taking people to the to the cleaners is not against you religion...then increase your plunder to the maximum potential.

because the with absolute capitalism...if you don't...someone else will.

and do not think because you are a conservative...that will save you...and you are on the winning side of the trade...the top...does not care about you all below at all...they are just singing songs you like to hear...to gain your support...the instant you supply NO to their demand for YES.

you are going to be annihilated.

It's YOU...VS...everyone an everything...do not think the people outside your mafia family are your friends...or countrymen or comrades...they will eat you an your family and crap out the bones.

you see inflation now...but that is just the visible chaos...behind it...is 70 years of deflationary potential...that will show up...when inflation can not be powered anymore.

the stories of buying a house in Germany for an ounce of gold...that was the hyperdeflationary implosion of the credit system...which followed the hyperinflationary explosion.

when the credit system collapsed...there were food riots...and the german army machine gunned people down in the streets...the wheelbarrls of money...that is the funny positive phase...the blood in the streets...that is the sad negative phase.

the just think positive (fantasy) ignore negative (reality) religion...keeps you all blind...until you are blindsided...and the top...then tell you all what happened...and you all are forced to believe the lie...if you have no clue to begin with.

[1970 silver art]

pitwab? first of all.....welcome to gold-silver.us......I am bitching about it because this time around I have been holding silver for the past 32 years, how can I buy my "Silver Island" if the price doesn't go up?

Buddha? you are right, I will give a silver round to the first person who asked me for a donation.

VMaybe you should go to JPM and tell them to stop manipulating silver. If they stop manipulating silver, then maybe it will go up. However, JPM will probably not listen to you but it does not hurt to try. In reality, JPM controls the (paper) silver market and as long as they control it, then they will do anything that they want to it. With that said, I see $8 silver happening within 3 years from now (March 2017). JPM can do anything it wants with its naked short positions. Sorry to give you that bad news.

[1970 silver art]

Im out of town, but I stopped by a local coin shop. Picked up two handfuls of generic for only a buck fifty over spot.While I was on lunch break from work, I decided to call 3 dealers to see if they had any old silver art bars and all 3 of them had no old silver art bars. It's so hard out there for a silver art bar collector.

[Hypertiger]

if you are a player in the greater fool games you call markets...you are price manipulators...JPM...has billions and billions and ultimately trillions of dollars to play with...unless you ban billionaires from manipulating the markets by playing them...then all of the pipsqueaks are going to have to suffer.

the global credit supply is around 200 Trillion dollars...and the investors...er...gamblers...are just trying to fill up their trading accounts...which are hard disk platters...with more and more bits of information...from playing the markets.

silver and gold...is just google an twitter stocks to them...bitcoins...they do not care about silver or gold or anything...just getting richer and richer...to one day build their own Ironman suits...and save the world from manipulation by the evil forces of evilness.

[1970 silver art]

if you are a player in the greater fool games you call markets...If buying silver art bars from a LCS or coin show makes me a player in the greater fools game called markets, then so be it but it is my opinion that I am not manipulating anything and I do not consider myself a player in the greater fools game. As a silver art bar collector, I do not matter in the big scheme of the silver market since I am a tiny player that will not be noticed by the big boy manipulators. I am not a (paper) silver trader. That is beyond my pay grade.

[hoarder]

Maybe you should go to JPM and tell them to stop manipulating silver. If they stop manipulating silver, then maybe it will go up. However, JPM will probably not listen to you but it does not hurt to try. In reality, JPM controls the (paper) silver market and as long as they control it, then they will do anything that they want to it. With that said, I see $8 silver happening within 3 years from now (March 2017). JPM can do anything it wants with its naked short positions. Sorry to give you that bad news.All true. but subject to the supply of physical silver. They can't push silver down to $8 or even $15 if bullion dealers have no inventory.
If physical silver can't be had in any form for $5 over spot, they lose credibility and eyebrows get raised. That said, we will probably never see divergence because they will raise paper silver prices to a threshold where divergence is undectable, yet as physical prices go up they lose much control.

This is not what happened two years ago when silver reached almost $50. They let that happen while their silver gurus said "buy, goyim buy". Now they are reaping the psychological benefit of the beatdown and getting a lot of mileage out of it.

[old steel]

"The whole world is in a paradigm shift. We are transitioning into a new era, much like the transition into the industrial revolution or the car and airplane revolution. Old and traditional business models simply will not survive as we move into something different. What that new something is, I have no idea. All I know is the world is changing. And just like every other paradigm shift in human history many people are going to not like the change and say the world / country / whatever, is dying. And they're correct, they are dying. They will make way for whatever the next era is. The storefront capitalism and evil communism models are done, we're living in the middle of it's end. Humanity will emerge on the other side with new forms of everything, technology, government, financial systems, and economies. Everything is going to change, completely, just like the industrial revolution changed everything for everyone. Just like cars crushed the carriage manufacturers, people claimed the car was killing industries and killing jobs. Eventually the car completely took over and look where it took us.

Based on history I see the following taking place over the next 50 years. Some fast, some more gradual. Not listed in any specific order.

1. No more burning shit to make things move
2. Much much fewer brick and mortar storefronts
3. More "online" shopping
4. Most storefronts will be services and needs, not wants (this takes things like best buy, sears, JC Penny's, Radio Shack out of the picture but leaves grocery stores, fuel stations (some gas some something else) and things you cannot buy on the internet, like a massage or tan, or barbershop).
5.More people will move back into the cities as commutes from the burbs completely suck. This will push city housing prices up and push out lower incomes. (this will cause a backlash btw)
6. Total surveillance of everything online.


When a transition like this occurs several things happen, governments collapse, old business models collapse, economies collapse, and there's typically massive upheaval and many revolutions. This is nothing new. So yes, I agree with the OP, this country is dying, in terms of what we're used to. There will be something on the other side, that's for sure, and it will not run like it does today.

The question is, how will that other side look? Well, I think it's up to us to make that determination. Rather than being the victims of a situation we cannot change, the transition, we certainly can guide the way it goes.

I honestly feel the US is going to break apart over the transition. We're too divided a people now and something is going to come along and really break everything. It would be anything from a famine, an EMP attack, a solar flare, a nuclear war, an economic collapse, whatever, something is going to happen in this country where one group or another, and in large enough size, to where they just say, screw it, we're going to do our own thing over here. And the government will try to stop it, but there will be too many people. We're too divided now and have, generally, been trained to blame someone instead of doing something, it will be our demise. I also think our government knows it's coming, some day, and they have prepared and are just waiting for whatever that spark is, to set the land on fire."

Stay frosty.

[Ponce]

Well, like I said before.......the first time....1972-1980........I made (hey Buddha how much?).......bough it at $2.95 and sold it at $43.65, started again in 1982-2002 when I had what I wanted .......... never sold any of it but traded a few ounces for gas.

I am lucky in that I am living like a king with my social security alone...I say like a king because I have no debts of any kind... and like I said before "My ideal condition would be that I die with all my silver and gold because that would mean that TSHTF never happened and that I never ran out of cash for what I wanted to buy"

V

[Hypertiger]

Well, like I said before.......the first time....1972-1980........I made (hey Buddha how much?).......bough it at $2.95 and sold it at $43.65, started again in 1982-2002 when I had what I wanted .......... never sold any of it but traded a few ounces for gas.

I am lucky in that I am living like a king with my social security alone...I say like a king because I have no debts of any kind... and like I said before "My ideal condition would be that I die with all my silver and gold because that would mean that TSHTF never happened and that I never ran out of cash for what I wanted to buy"

V

I can always get work...that supplies my needs.

Like attention deficit disorder.

Where your irrational ability to play or consume power...lasts until you drop dead...but your irrational ability to work or supply power...ends almost instantly.

You want me to be mind controlled or supply YES...I supply NO power to your demand for power.

Imagine if the Internet was shut off.

Like I used my powers of mind control...to make someone push the kill switch.

Or maybe just the off for awhile to get your attention.

Maybe eventually becomes a certainty.

[Hypertiger]

"The whole world is in a paradigm shift."

is from positive to negative.

from the fantasy...you are currently enjoying now...the lie you believe is Truth that you have fallen in love with...or your cherished delusion...to reality...where it shatters.

The just think positive fantasy...ignore negative reality...religion.

It's what flies worship...when they are headed to the paradigm shift of the singularity...at the zapper.

They follow the path of least resistance to the logical conclusion of the reasonable assumption...Which is a cherished delusion...where it is shattered...but a nice quick polarity shift...from the fantasy of life...to the reality of death.

Or is it the other way around?

you mean that we are going to switch from sniffing glue...to more powerful drugs.

like dogs an cats licking up sweet tasting lies...they believe are Truth and fall in love with...the cherished delusion of antifreeze being bliss...of course until the polarity shift...and they die in a fit of agony...when they suffer the consequences of worshiping ignorance as bliss.

that paradigm shift has a massive pile of skeletons as evidence of it's existence at the logical conclusion of the take more power than is given equation.

that is that is the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

[chad]

old steel's observation about cities is spot on. people everywhere here are flocking back to town because of gas costs and increased rural regulations & fees. my county just raised septic tank dumping fees $20 "just because." i pump twice a month, so that is an extra $480 a year. there's countless more examples (such as the $150 a year i have to now pay starting in may to "control weeds" in the county ditches, or the $100 yearly culvert fee i got last week to "control wetland water flow").

i know of 2 people on hobby farms near me that have thrown in the towel and are moving back to town. if i didn't know any better, i would think there's some organzied plan to get people off big tracts of land and in to 300 foot apartments in a city containment zone.

[gunDriller]

i like Silver on Sale. :)

[1970 silver art]

i like Silver on Sale. :)

With spot at under $20, I like silver art bar sales at the LCS and coin shows. If/when silver hits $8, then I will like silver art bar sales even more. :) The lower the spot price of silver, the better it is for me as a collector since, I can find them for a lower price at the LCS.

[Neuro]

old steel's observation about cities is spot on. people everywhere here are flocking back to town because of gas costs and increased rural regulations & fees. my county just raised septic tank dumping fees $20 "just because." i pump twice a month, so that is an extra $480 a year. there's countless more examples (such as the $150 a year i have to now pay starting in may to "control weeds" in the county ditches, or the $100 yearly culvert fee i got last week to "control wetland water flow").

i know of 2 people on hobby farms near me that have thrown in the towel and are moving back to town. if i didn't know any better, i would think there's some organzied plan to get people off big tracts of land and in to 300 foot apartments in a city containment zone.
If you and your neighbors lived in France, you would pump your septic tanks yourself and dump it in front of City Hall (whatever that may be called in France)...