Argentina defaults

[Serpo]

LIVE: ARGENTINA DEFAULTS http://media.zenfs.com/284/2011/06/08/biz-insider-65x27_102440.gif (http://www.businessinsider.com/) By Linette Lopez 1 hour ago























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http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/29Vqd.VpMzZT1yPJwQ4z5A--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTEyMDA-/http://globalfinance.zenfs.com/en_us/Finance/US_AFTP_SILICONALLEY_H_LIVE/LIVE_ARGENTINA_DEFAULTS-0133de3d39f9b43b57f0897079ee0077
REUTERS/Eduardo Munoz
UPDA
Argentine Finance Minister Axel Kicillof is now addressing the world from Argentina's consulate in New York City.
He has delivered the news that Argentina is in default, having failed to satisfy the demands of a group of hedge fund creditors negotiating over $1.3 billion worth of debt owed to them for over a decade.
"The Argentine Republic has filed for a stay [on payment] with Judge Griesa... The Judge decided that if the vulture funds said there could be a stay there would be a stay," said Kicillof. "The vulture funds were not willing to grant the stay."
He repeated the same argument that the administration has been making for months — that paying the "vultures" would be a violation of Argentine law. That's because there is a clause in The Republic's bond agreements called the RUFO clause.
According to RUFO, if Argentina negotiates better terms with some bondholders, all bondholders have a claim on those terms. That would open the country to up to $15 billion worth of payments. Earlier this month, the Court didn't buy that, and refused Argentina's request for a stay on payment until negotiations could be worked out (http://www.businessinsider.com/judge-will-not-grant-argentina-stay-2014-7)(ideally with a payment to NML due in 2015).
That $15 billion is chump change compared to what the country might have to pay if it goes into default, though. Default opens the country up to "acceleration clause" claims — in which bondholders sue for all their money at once, and immediately — worth $29 billion. That's everything in Argentina's Central Bank.
The "vulture funds" are investors known collectively as NML Capital and led by hedge fund billionaire Paul Singer. They would not take haircuts on debt dating back to Argentina's last default in 2001 like over 90% of their fellow bond holders.
To Argentina that made them vultures, and you don't pay vultures. Instead you sue them all the way up to the Supreme Court and lose.
Earlier today, Argentine bankers put together a last ditch rescue package. They offered to put down $250 million as collateral (http://www.businessinsider.com/argentina-offers-more-attractive-terms-in-negtotiations-2014-7)— a show of good faith that the country was willing to pay in 2015. Another option would be for banks to buy NML's debt, and then request a stay on payment themselves.
But for any of that to happen there would have to be a stay on payment, and hedge funds would not allow that to happen.
Indeed, even before Kicillof said a word Standard & Poors cut the country's rating to "selective default" — meaning Argentina chose to renege on some of its payments, but not all of them.
"We are... lowering our long-and short-term foreign currency sovereign credit ratings on Argentina to selective default ('SD') from 'CCC-/C'," said the agency's release, "indicating that Argentina defaulted on some of its foreign currency obligations. At the same time, we are removing the 'CCC-/C' foreign currency ratings from CreditWatch, where they were placed with negative implications on July 1, 2014."
S&P said that an agreement would erase that rating, but it looks like that won't happen for a while.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/live-argentina-could-minutes-away-204102833.html

[Dogman]

Not the first time they have done so over the last 40 or so years, every generation or so!

[Ponce]

So what is the big deal.....Argentina should tell the Feds to get FXCK and keep on going........people make a big deal of all those countries that go on default and then are back in business I two or three years....well.......Cuba has been down that road for over 50 years and we are still alive........the greed of the bankers would be the only thing to be hurt.........there is no physical pain to any of us but for the fact that the money that could be used for our people living on the streets is going to the state of Israel.....so........worry more about us and not about Brazil.

V

[monty]

So what is the big deal.....Argentina should tell the Feds to get FXCK and keep on going........people make a big deal of all those countries that go on default and then are back in business I two or three years....well.......Cuba has been down that road for over 50 years and we are still alive........the greed of the bankers would be the only thing to be hurt.........there is no physical pain to any of us but for the fact that the money that could be used for our people living on the streets is going to the state of Israel.....so........worry more about us and not about Brazil. V

True

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner

[Horn]

Now do they buy back in?

No state left behind, like iceland?

[govcheetos]

This of course has led to silver being lower as expected.

[Cebu_4_2]

Thinking out loud.... Satan's spawn?

http://l3.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/29Vqd.VpMzZT1yPJwQ4z5A--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7cT04NTt3PTEyMDA-/http://globalfinance.zenfs.com/en_us/Finance/US_AFTP_SILICONALLEY_H_LIVE/LIVE_ARGENTINA_DEFAULTS-0133de3d39f9b43b57f0897079ee0077

[Twisted Titan]

It should be noted....

Argentina did NOT default

It was FORCED to default.


They ran into economic trouble on its bond payments.

They were to negotiate reasonable terms with its bond holders for about 30 cents on the dollar

Except one.....one bond holder demanded 100 cents on the dollar and would take nothing less

And to make sure he got his way The vulture gets a ny judge to hold the payment everybody agreeded to hostage until he gets his full cut


That is why argentina defaulted

One Man decided that a entire nation should suffer and business should grind to a halt for fear of stabilty

One man.


Now for giggles Take a wild ass guess what is his ethenicity???

A Fricken Shylock








te te

[Cebu_4_2]

Now for giggles Take a wild ass guess what is his ethenicity???
A Fricken Shylock



I bet no one here would have caught that. Thanks for posting it out, you or me would not even made it into the court for the handouts.

[aeondaze]

It should be noted....

Argentina did NOT default.It was FORCED to default.

They were to negotiate reasonable terms with its bond holders for about 30 cents on the dollar

Except one bond holder demanded 100 cents on the dollar and would take nothing less

And to make sure he got his way The vulture gets a ny judge to hold the payment everybody agreeded to hostage until he gets his full cut

That is why argentina defaulted

Now for giggles Take a wild ass guess what is his ethenicity???

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-07-14/argentina-refusing-talks-with-elliott-as-default-looms.html


Jay Newman and Lee Grinberg, money managers at Elliott Management Corp., the parent company of NML, were seen leaving mediator Daniel Pollack’s offices in midtown Manhattan on July 11 shortly after Argentine officials. While both sides presented arguments to Pollack, they didn’t do so in each other’s presence, he said in a statement after the meetings.

They have completely stone walled any resolution in the matter. Even if they accepted 30c on the dollar they would still stand to make a like a 600% profit from what I understand...the principal ammount was something like $49M and they're owed close to a billion. 30% of a billion is $300M

[Twisted Titan]

I cant stand them.

The day is coming they will be hunted like the vermin they are.

The pictures out of gaza are beinging to turn the information tide against them

They cant front run their lies fast enough and it leads people down the rabbit hole where things can be quickly linked

The knife of the long knives is coming for them.

[Hatha Sunahara]

The whole idea of default and bankruptcy is what holds the entire human race in a retarded state. The reason for bankruptcy is to resolve the problem of an unpayable debt. It means that creditors have to relinquish some, if not all their claim against the debtor. If creditors are unwilling to do that, there is no solution for unpayable debt. Creditors will own everything and then some. This problem, because it is a state that is defaulting is compounded by the idea that there is no such thing as 'collective debt'. If creditors are stupid enough to grant credit to a government, they should be willing to bear adverse outcomes such as the inability of the government to repay. What the creditors here expect is that the people of Argentina should honor the debts of their government. The people need to pay higher taxes, and sell off their publicly owned assets at cents on the dollar to repay debt that the creditors are not willing to discount.

Of course, no one will learn the right lessons from this set of circumstances. An ancient solution to this kind of problem was described in the bible as the Jubilee. Many millennia ago, prople understood the problems created by inequality induced by lenders, who were usurers. So every two generations or so, there was an economic reset where debts were forgiven and land was returned to the original owners. If this was not done, social unrest was guaranteed and was far more disruptive than an economic reset. Bankruptcy is the modern relief valve, but creditors are refusing to allow that to work in accordance with its intended effect--which is to reset the economy by erasing unpayable debt. If this cannot be done, we should admit that our society consists of masters and slaves, and freedom doesn't really exist.


Hatha

[gunDriller]

It should be noted....

Argentina did NOT default

It was FORCED to default.


Very good point. The way the Jew-S operates, financial markets are used as an instrument of war.


Maybe they want Argentina to give more money to Israhell ?

[Horn]

What The World Can Learn From Iceland's Default Model

Iceland's basic economic indicators are now stronger than countries that received bail-outs

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/what-the-world-can-learn-from-icelands-default-model-2011-8?op=1#ixzz396YeK9x4

[Glass]

The whole idea of default and bankruptcy is what holds the entire human race in a retarded state. The reason for bankruptcy is to resolve the problem of an unpayable debt. It means that creditors have to relinquish some, if not all their claim against the debtor. If creditors are unwilling to do that, there is no solution for unpayable debt. Creditors will own everything and then some. This problem, because it is a state that is defaulting is compounded by the idea that there is no such thing as 'collective debt'. If creditors are stupid enough to grant credit to a government, they should be willing to bear adverse outcomes such as the inability of the government to repay. What the creditors here expect is that the people of Argentina should honor the debts of their government. The people need to pay higher taxes, and sell off their publicly owned assets at cents on the dollar to repay debt that the creditors are not willing to discount.

Of course, no one will learn the right lessons from this set of circumstances. An ancient solution to this kind of problem was described in the bible as the Jubilee. Many millennia ago, prople understood the problems created by inequality induced by lenders, who were usurers. So every two generations or so, there was an economic reset where debts were forgiven and land was returned to the original owners. If this was not done, social unrest was guaranteed and was far more disruptive than an economic reset. Bankruptcy is the modern relief valve, but creditors are refusing to allow that to work in accordance with its intended effect--which is to reset the economy by erasing unpayable debt. If this cannot be done, we should admit that our society consists of masters and slaves, and freedom doesn't really exist.


Hatha

This is a good assessment. I've been looking into bankruptcy for personal reasons. There is no longer any safety from creditors in personal bankruptcy. So I had to find another way. National debts are worse and the specific type of creditor we are dealing with here as a general belief amongst themselves that the debtor must always pay in full no matter what. Even if the debtor was not actually lent any money which is the case 100% of the time. This is why they are eliminating/hobbling bankruptcy protections from the laws/statutes.

[Horn]

Where's HT with domino theory,

and why do we keep treating him like a rocket tossing Palestinian?

[mick silver]

one day we all may see the world burn . from greed