What is 'Government'?

[iOWNme]

I would like some of the members here at GSUS who disagree with me about this topic to define for me what they think 'Government' is.

I think one of the biggest problems of communication can be the meaning of the word. A discussion can go perfectly normal, whether agreeing or disagreeing, and when a word comes up that both people have 2 opposite definitions for, this seems to be the point of no return for the conversation. Im hoping to understand what members think 'Government' is by using their own definitions of what they think it is.

Once we can define just what it is, then maybe we can further the discussion about how 'it' should do X Y Z.

If you are someone who clashes with me because you believe in a 'small limited constitutional republic' i would really like to hear it explained to me: What is 'Government'?

[palani]

define for me what they think 'Government' is

Government is defined as the regulation of ones activities to avoid excesses. Bad government or a complete lack of government violates this law of excesses and results in either gout or beheading. In extreme cases bad government could result in pot holes, toppling tall buildings with large planes or pirates on the land or sea.

[Carl]

The Second Treatise of Civil Government (http://www.constitution.org/jl/2ndtreat.htm)

[iOWNme]

Government is defined as the regulation of ones activities to avoid excesses.

If man cannot be truted to 'regulate' his own activites to avoid 'excess' then what species are we going to put into 'Government'?

[iOWNme]

The Second Treatise of Civil Government (http://www.constitution.org/jl/2ndtreat.htm)

Carl, maybe you can give me YOUR opinion on this matter? Im not interested in what dead men have to say about this topic, i want to know what YOU personally think 'Government' is.

[Carl]

....Im not interested in what dead men have to say about this topic...

And that right there, is the reason why you will never know or understand anything. You choose to live in ignorance based upon a juvenile 'temper tantrum' ideology.

There is absolutely nothing I, or anyone else, can say that will sway you from the choice you've consciously made.

P.S. My opinion is derived from that treatise.

[palani]

If man cannot be truted to 'regulate' his own activites to avoid 'excess' then what species are we going to put into 'Government'?

You might draw a clue from Cicero

Wise men are instructed by reason;
Men of less understanding, by experience;
The most ignorant, by necessity;
The beasts by nature.
Letters to Atticus[?], Marcus Tullius Cicero

If you insist upon ignorance as a guide then NECESSITY is your king. Don't make any difference what system of government you choose or even none at all. NECESSITY is the state of constant WAR. Constant WAR can only be funded by FRNs or a fiat currency similar to FRNs. For if your monetary system is gold the war stops when the gold runs out. Everyone goes back to plowing their own field. Even during the feudal system a knights service was a mere 40 days rather than 3 tours of duty in Afghanistan.

[iOWNme]

And that right there, is the reason why you will never know or understand anything. You choose to live in ignorance based upon a juvenile 'temper tantrum' ideology.

I started this thread to have an honest discussion, and you have already resorted to name calling. Do you IMAGINE this to be some intellectual response?



There is absolutely nothing I, or anyone else, can say that will sway you from the choice you've consciously made.

P.S. My opinion is derived from that treatise.


We may never know because you cant even articulate to me what 'Government' is. You still have not given me YOUR personal definition of what a 'Government' is. Who is it made up of? How is it funded? What functions does it carry out?

[iOWNme]

You might draw a clue from Cicero

Wise men are instructed by reason;
Men of less understanding, by experience;
The most ignorant, by necessity;
The beasts by nature.
Letters to Atticus[?], Marcus Tullius Cicero

If you insist upon ignorance as a guide then NECESSITY is your king. Don't make any difference what system of government you choose or even none at all. NECESSITY is the state of constant WAR. Constant WAR can only be funded by FRNs or a fiat currency similar to FRNs. For if your monetary system is gold the war stops when the gold runs out. Everyone goes back to plowing their own field. Even during the feudal system a knights service was a mere 40 days rather than 3 tours of duty in Afghanistan.


You didnt answer my question. If man is untrustworthy (i agree) What species are we going to put into this 'Government'?



Because i point out contradictions in your position, and i use principles to ground position, this means that i am choosing 'ignorance'? Please articulate to me where the idea of a VOLUNTARY based place is 'ignorant', but the idea of a NON VOLUNTARY based place is 'smart' and 'noble'.

When you tell me that 'necessity' is my King, what you are doing is parroting back to me Hobbes insane presumptions: That 'Anarchy' is a state of constant war, but that a republic is not. This is provably false as every 'Republic' in history has been based off of a democratically elected voting system: A CONSTANT STATE OF WAR for the people. A constant state of trying to control your neighbor. A constant state of trying to use the hammer of 'Government' to get yourself goodies. A constant state of trying to fund the things you want by forcibly dominating your fellow man to pay for it.

Contradiction.

[Shami-Amourae]

Human farming.

[palani]

If man is untrustworthy (i agree) What species are we going to put into this 'Government'? Govern yourself. If you cannot then you will be governed by others.

Because i point out contradictions in your position, and i use principles to ground position, this means that i am choosing 'ignorance'? Because you are willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater, you are choosing ignorance.

Please articulate to me where the idea of a VOLUNTARY based place is 'ignorant', but the idea of a NON VOLUNTARY based place is 'smart' and 'noble'. Could you define for me what you mean by 'place'?

When you tell me that 'necessity' is my King, what you are doing is parroting back to me Hobbes insane presumptions: That 'Anarchy' is a state of constant war, but that a republic is not. I could be mistaken but I don't believe Hobbes included the random thoughts of irrational people in his analysis.

This is provably false as every 'Republic' in history has been based off of a democratically elected voting system: A CONSTANT STATE OF WAR for the people. What is a republic?

A constant state of trying to control your neighbor. The ignorant get to be controlled. That is true.

A constant state of trying to use the hammer of 'Government' to get yourself goodies. This might be your 'negative' view. A positive view might be attempting to bring your neighbor to the same level of understanding as you. You do know that stupid is forever yet ignorance may be fixed don't you?

A constant state of trying to fund the things you want by forcibly dominating your fellow man to pay for it. Nothing has been 'paid for' since 1933 when Roosevelt outlawed gold. YOU, for example, have never had the opportunity to pay for anything in your life. You discharge rather than extinguish. So how is it that you view others as making you 'pay for' their goods? You absolutely have no ability to pay. You are bankrupt.


Contradiction.
IGNORANCE!!!

[iOWNme]

Human farming.


I agree!

But why do you advocate for this? Do you think we caould make it without the Farmer controlling us?

[iOWNme]

Govern yourself. If you cannot then you will be governed by others.

I try to, but you keep telling me that i am untrustworthy, and that i need to be violently controlled by 'Politicians'. Are you contradicting yourself again?



Because you are willing to throw the baby out with the bathwater, you are choosing ignorance.

Can you articulate to me what part of Voluntaryism is 'ignorant'?



Could you define for me what you mean by 'place'?

Does the location alter morality?


I could be mistaken but I don't believe Hobbes included the random thoughts of irrational people in his analysis.

He wrote an entire book chalk full of contradictions. Its called 'Leviathan'.


What is a republic?

An area ruled by a Parasitic Ruling Class.


This might be your 'negative' view. A positive view might be attempting to bring your neighbor to the same level of understanding as you. You do know that stupid is forever yet ignorance may be fixed don't you?

Ive been trying to for 2 years. My neighbor clings to his beliefs instead of rationality and logic. My neoighbor then advocates for the initiation of violence against me because i disagree with him. How do i get through to him to show him that i am not the bad guy for wanting to keep what i earn and run my own life?


Nothing has been 'paid for' since 1933 when Roosevelt outlawed gold. YOU, for example, have never had the opportunity to pay for anything in your life. You discharge rather than extinguish. So how is it that you view others as making you 'pay for' their goods? You absolutely have no ability to pay. You are bankrupt.

More scribbles?


IGNORANCE!!!

This doesnt fix your contradiction.

[iOWNme]

Palani - Can you articulate to me how 'Government' is supposed to be funded?

[mick silver]

I will ......... by your hard labor

[iOWNme]

I will ......... by your hard labor

Do i have a choice in whether i get to fund it or not?

[mick silver]

Nope

[iOWNme]

Nope


Then its not 'Government', it is a gang of violent criminals who seek to control my life and steal my money.

'Government' is a logical impossiblity.

[mick silver]

did I say you were not right are wrong . some pay and most don't I see that , most here see that . I have no one in government looking out for me and mine

[Hatha Sunahara]

I don't disagree with you about government, IownMe. But here's my definition of government. It's an authority that exists to tell people what they can and cannot do, regardless of whether people need that kind of control or not. It doesn't matter what the source of the government's power is--whether it is democratically elected, or there 'by divine right'. Government is an organization of rulers--people who rule other people. It is the opposite of freedom. It is a system whereby others tell you what to do, and what your rights are. It rules people who exercise their freedom responsibly as well as those who don't. It is an entity which denies you sovereignty as an individual. Governments claim to derive their power from the consent of the governed, but only fools believe that. Worst of all, it is forced on you--it is not a voluntary association. Government is totally unnecessary among people who are able to rule themselves.


Hatha

[Libertytree]

"A government is a bunch of people, usually, notably ungoverned"...Shepherd Book, Firefly

[Dogman]

In some ways a bunch of neighbors agreeing on what is cool and not in their area could be called a government on a very local level. Making policy decisions for what is or not acceptable in the neighborhood, all between the neighbors and not a hoa with contracts, all verbal.

[iOWNme]

I don't disagree with you about government, IownMe. But here's my definition of government. It's an authority that exists to tell people what they can and cannot do, regardless of whether people need that kind of control or not. It doesn't matter what the source of the government's power is--whether it is democratically elected, or there 'by divine right'. Government is an organization of rulers--people who rule other people. It is the opposite of freedom. It is a system whereby others tell you what to do, and what your rights are. It rules people who exercise their freedom responsibly as well as those who don't. It is an entity which denies you sovereignty as an individual. Governments claim to derive their power from the consent of the governed, but only fools believe that. Worst of all, it is forced on you--it is not a voluntary association. Government is totally unnecessary among people who are able to rule themselves.


Hatha


Although i agree with you, you didnt actually give me a definition for 'Government'. All of the criteria you laid out sounds like the Mob or the Bloods and the Crips, etc. All you described was a gang of violent criminals. The exact definition i use for 'Government'! LOL

Now why doesnt anyone call these gangs 'Government'? Meaning, yes people obey the Mob out of fear and hand over their money to them, but they dont IMAGINE it to be legitimate when they do. There is something more to this. There is something else that we're missing. There is another ingredient. If we keep digging we can all find it. Ive been trying to point it out for years.....


I believe, if you are going to define 'Government' you have to be able to use the exact same definitions that exist for individuals. For 'Government' is supposed to be made up of mortal men. Next, i believe you have to define what its functions are. And again, you have to base this off of individually accepted standards of human morality. For 'Government' is supposed to be made up of individuals. And finally, you have to be able to define how it will be funded. Again, you have to logically start with individual rights, and work from there.


For all of the members that disagree with me, not one of them has ever been able to articulate any of these principles to me about what 'Government' is......And i know why because i used to be them.

[iOWNme]

In some ways a bunch of neighbors agreeing on what is cool and not in their area could be called a government on a very local level. Making policy decisions for what is or not acceptable in the neighborhood, all between the neighbors and not a hoa with contracts, all verbal.

dogman, i agree with what your saying, but i disagree about the concept. Let me explain:

In your analogy the 'bunch of neighbors' can ONLY do what they all agreed to do. This is not 'Government'. They would have to FORCE their 'decision' on other neighbors who didnt want to participate in order to be 'Government'. They would have to FORCE their 'decision' on other neighbors who had no clue they were even 'deciding' on anything in order to be 'Government'. These are two complete opposite ideologies once examined: One of these is voluntary, one of them is not! LOL

If its Voluntary = ITS NOT GOVERNMENT!

If its Non-Voluntary = ITS NOT GOVERNMENT!



(The problem is in my sig!)


:)

[Dogman]

dogman, i agree with what your saying, but i disagree about the concept. Let me explain:

In your analogy the 'bunch of neighbors' can ONLY do what they all agreed to do. This is not 'Government'. They would have to FORCE their 'decision' on other neighbors who didnt want to participate in order to be 'Government'. They would have to FORCE their 'decision' on other neighbors who had no clue they were even 'deciding' on anything in order to be 'Government'. These are two complete opposite ideologies once examined: One of these is voluntary, one of them is not! LOL

If its Voluntary = ITS NOT GOVERNMENT!

If its Non-Voluntary = ITS NOT GOVERNMENT!


(The problem is in my sig!)

:)

No not only do, but set a base line! When neighbors come together to agree with sharing living in the same ares.

Any one that crosses that line, it is up to the individual neighbor, to determine the reaction to respond to the irritating neighbors actions.

I do disagree with you on voluntary agreements any collection of minds that decide what is civil in action.

Can be called a gov! Because they determine what is considered being civil and respectful to each other!

Suspect back in the past, ones that were not civil with their neighbors got/killed or run out of the area!

You propose true anarchy, all individuals are totally independent from each other on how what they do that in an area and live together

That way only the strongest will prevail, without respect to others!

Which you demonstrate on this forum!

;D

Its your way or the highway!

[iOWNme]

No not only do, but set a base line! When neighbors come together to agree with sharing living in the same ares.

Any one that crosses that line, it is up to the individual neighbor, to determine the reaction to respond to the irritating neighbors actions.

I do disagree with you on voluntary agreements any collection of minds that decide what is civil in action.

Can be called a gov! Because they determine what is considered being civil and respectful to each other!

Suspect back in the past, ones that were not civil with their neighbors got/killed or run out of the area!

You propose true anarchy, all individuals are totally independent from each other on how what they do that in an area and live together

That way only the strongest will prevail, without respect to others!

Which you demonstrate on this forum!

;D

Its your way or the highway!


More insults, huh?

You literally dont understand the concepts being discussed here. One one breath you describe 'Government', in the next you describe 'Anarchy'. And in your brain these two concepts are all mushed together.

If all it took to create a 'Government' was men coming together voluntarily, then the local Movie Theater, Walmart and the band Aerosmith would all be 'Government' according to your own definition. Yet if any of them tried to boss you around and steal your money , you would inherently recognize them as illegitimate and resist them.

Again, you advocate for something that you dont even understand. You demonstrate this by parroting back to me the same old provable lies like "under anarchy all individuals are totally independent from each other". Really? WHO would be able to stop people from organizing and cooperating?

[Horn]

Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil, in its worst state an intolerable one.

...

[mick silver]

government is what I tell you it is , just like laws I am the ruler of my own mine until I get the new up todate chip in my head

[iOWNme]

.Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil, in its worst state an intolerable one..

Do you see a contradiction in saying that in order to have a 'civil society' we will need to have 'Evil' as a necessity?

[Shami-Amourae]

I agree!

But why do you advocate for this? Do you think we caould make it without the Farmer controlling us?

Since government will happen no matter what. Government comes from the initiation of force, and that exists everywhere, even "Anarchist" countries like Somalia. Only a minority of idealistic White people believe in this stuff. You need a state to keep the mongrels out who will want to use the/a government to loot the most productive people (Whites.) If you had a real anarchist country that worked it would be so productive and rich that all the Blacks/Jews would move in and force the creation of a government to get a cut of the pie.

Wanting anarchism is wanting human nature to change. It's just not realistic without force. And force is government. You can't get away from it. There is no solution. The only hope is doing the least worst system.


If you want anarchism get a group of idealistic White anarchists and build a floating city in the middle of the ocean. Watch how fast Jews/Blacks come in and demand "their share". True freedom only comes from the racially awake.

:rolleyes:
http://www.kpnvandaag.nl/publisher/app/anp/BUI/resource/anp-180314-151
http://www.cnnb.com.cn/pic/0/03/50/28/3502837_444983.jpg
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/world/cms/binary/9695222.jpg
http://static.euronews.com/articles/258500/606x341_258500.jpg?1393609645

WHERE BE MUH FREE SHIT WHITEY?!! RACIIIIISSSSMMMMM!!!!

[Horn]

Do you see a contradiction in saying that in order to have a 'civil society' we will need to have 'Evil' as a necessity?

Do you see the contadiction in saying "civil society"?

[EE_]

Do you see the contadiction in saying "civil society"?

http://www.gamingpsych.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/contradiction_o_188908.jpg

[iOWNme]

Since government will happen no matter what.

There is no such thing as 'Government'. You STILL dont understand the actual concepts being discussed here.

We will be ruled by 'Volcano Gods' no matter what.
We will have Kings no matter what.
The earth is flat no matter what.

Do you think there were British loyalists who told the founders "We will have a King no matter what"?



Government comes from the initiation of force, and that exists everywhere, even "Anarchist" countries like Somalia. Only a minority of idealistic White people believe in this stuff. You need a state to keep the mongrels out who will want to use the/a government to loot the most productive people (Whites.) If you had a real anarchist country that worked it would be so productive and rich that all the Blacks/Jews would move in and force the creation of a government to get a cut of the pie.

Do you see a contradiction in saying we will have 'Government' (the IMAGINED moral right to rule) in an Anarchistic place? (where nobody IMAGINES anyone has the right to rule)



Wanting anarchism is wanting human nature to change. It's just not realistic without force. And force is government.


You see, you STILL dont get it.

'Government' isnt force, it is the INITIATION of force. (Which you admitted above). Now why on EARTH do you think we need the INITIATION of force?

And since there is no mortal man who has the right to INITIATE force, where are we going to get this right to give to 'Government'? You might as well tell me we need 'kadiddly bobbs and weewaah's' in order to make the world better. The only problem is 'kadiddly bobbs and weewaah's' dont exist. Just like 'Government'.

(Whatever you do, dont address what i said here using YOUR own judgement, because you might run into the very same contradiction i ran into years ago.)



You can't get away from it. There is no solution. The only hope is doing the least worst system.

Holy smokes your Master has enslaved your MIND to an amazing degree. He has convinced you to resist is futile, and that you are better off just accepting his dominion over you. Doesnt this sound EXACTLY like Jewish propaganda to you? LOL




If you want anarchism get a group of idealistic White anarchists and build a floating city in the middle of the ocean. Watch how fast Jews/Blacks come in and demand "their share". True freedom only comes from the racially awake.

Ummm.......I have to ask.....WHO are these Jews/Black going to 'ask for their share' from in an Anarchist place? LOL

You literally STILL dont even grasp the concepts of Voluntaryism. Your post show it time and time again. Your not the only one. I know all of the logical and rational debates against my position and yet nobody here uses them. Which tells me its not that they disagree with Voluntaryism, its that they literally dont understand the underlying concept and principles.

I can see why we dont agree. Your trying to use 'kadiddly bobbs and weewaah's' to fix the symptom, while im actually standing back, analyzing the principle behind the root of the problem, and at least trying to address THAT.

[iOWNme]

Do you see the contadiction in saying "civil society"?

No, why would I?

Civil = 'Government'

Society = a creation of 'Government'





?

[Shami-Amourae]

I actually agree with what you're saying on a philosophical level. But the world you imagine never will or can exist. I'm just more realistic about the situation.

You and others around you can agree to the principle of there being no initiation of force. The problem is that it only requires one individual in the population to say "fuck that", initiate force, and enslave everyone. You cannot achieve true anarchy/freedom that ever unless its a very tiny group of people who are out in the middle of nowhere with little to no contact with the outside world. You probably could only get away with that these days if you're living on Europa, since the State can get you anywhere else.

I want the same thing you do, ultimately, I just think my path to it is more realistic. I think things are headed to the way I describe them.

There are many things we can do to promote anarchism, that can push us in that direction. I think that's the correct path to take.

Support things like Bitcoin and other decentralized systems. Encourage people to buy guns and learn to defend themselves. If individuals can protect/defend themselves they need police less and less. There are plenty of little things you, and others like you can do to promote these ideals.

[Dogman]

6697

As shami says, it will never happen and never existed.

Unless you live alone on a hill top or more probably a cave, and have no neighbors within many hundreds or more likely thousands of square miles near you. And even then it will crumble into dust.


Hundred or so years ago, yes , just dodge the superpowers of those days, today no way in hell.

[Hypertiger]

Truth is the supply of power.

Lies are the demand for power.

Truth governs the birth and death of lies.

Truth needs to supply power to the demand for power by the paradox or lie that wants to become truth and never die.

[iOWNme]

I actually agree with what you're saying on a philosophical level. But the world you imagine never will or can exist. I'm just more realistic about the situation.

You mean this entire time you've actually agreed with me in principle, you just disagreed in the practicality of it? Well that is a completely different discussion. Its hard for me to even get to that discussion if you cant even agree on the moral principles behind them.


You and others around you can agree to the principle of there being no initiation of force. The problem is that it only requires one individual in the population to say "fuck that", initiate force, and enslave everyone. You cannot achieve true anarchy/freedom that ever unless its a very tiny group of people who are out in the middle of nowhere with little to no contact with the outside world.

If man is untrustworthy (i agree) what species are we going to put into 'Government'?

In other words, if we agree there will always be bad people, how can you think that these exact same bad people arent going to get into, use, manipulate, control, it for THEIR own good? This is seriously CRAZY talk.

Again you dont even understand the problem. The problem isnt that one guy is bad, its that millions of his enforcers IMAGINE an obligation to obey him. If you actually understand this, your post above sounds contradictory and insane. (im not trying to be a dick)

The damage that one guy or a group of guys can do is almost non-existent compared to the damage that the belief in 'Government' causes. What your arguing for is FAR WORSE than just dealing with only the bad guys. Now we have to deal with a massive amount of good natured well intentioned people who IMAGINE the obligation to obey 'Authority', while they beat us, rob us, cage us and kill us.



I want the same thing you do, ultimately, I just think my path to it is more realistic. I think things are headed to the way I describe them.

I know we want the same thing. You want to live your life how you see fit. I want to live my life how i see fit. Voluntaryism allows both of us to have what we want. But, your 'small limited Government' will not allow me to live my life. How can you not see this? Yet you agree Im right! LOL


There are many things we can do to promote anarchism, that can push us in that direction. I think that's the correct path to take.

I agree, which is why i do what i do. The time to talk about this stuff is NOW. If i made a post about how owning black slaves on plantations is wrong, big friggin deal! Everyone knows its wrong. The time to make posts about how the use of the initiation of violence is immoral IS NOW while nobody else is saying it. THATS how thr world changes.


Support things like Bitcoin and other decentralized systems. Encourage people to buy guns and learn to defend themselves. If individuals can protect/defend themselves they need police less and less. There are plenty of little things you, and others like you can do to promote these ideals.

I know you are an Anarchist because i see your posts (outside of our debating) and they are totally voluntaryist in nature. Please dont ever think im trying to get you to throw away your beliefs and follow mine. Im trying to get you to look inside your own head, and see if your belief system matches your belief system.

This is why i point out contradictions to people, and boy it pisses them off!!!! LOL I dont even tell them i think their wrong, i just point out contradictions. Because i know for myself i was very uncomfortable trying to hold 2 contradictory thoughts inside my head.

[palani]

I tried anarchy the other day. I think it almost got me thrown into the pokey.

Bailiff said "All rise when the jury enters the courtroom". I analyzed the situation. I am not 'ALL' . In fact I am not even very MANY. So I stayed seated. [Anarchy at its' finest hour]. Bailiff (looking at me) "Sir ... You must Stand". Me: Studying my notes intensely and ignoring him. He repeats several times "Sir ... You must Stand". Then the courthouse settles down and proceeds with business. Everyone else stands when the jury leaves. I stay seated. Then the fun started. His HONOR decided to do a CIVICS lesson on HONORING the JURY!!!

[EE_]

http://sj.blacksteel.com/media/images/gb01.jpg

Caption reads: It's a sad case doctor, this delusional patient can't convince even a dozen people on self-ownership, voluntaryism and non-aggression principles, but he still thinks he can change the world and all evil men will just disappear?

[Shami-Amourae]

If man is untrustworthy (i agree) what species are we going to put into 'Government'?

Play the Deus Ex series if you haven't. If gives several different possibilities of a future. This is the one I want:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBeoreJr4Yc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeboqg4t9vs
Nanobots "infect" every human and it allows a central AI to collect all of human consciousness and bring about order based on the best possible efficiency based on the total of human needs/desires and all of that. The nanobots only collect data, they don't push it on the individual. So if you witness a traffic accident, it will tell the AI and the traffic lights in the area around you might change based around the traffic accident.

Simple answer is humans merge with machines and we become part of a collective consciousness. I believe humanity will merge with machines, or go extinct. It will be one or the other.

There's actually an Anarchist ending (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLMn3_SzBiU), and an Illuminati ending (status quo) and some may like/dislike it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIX0BIuRYGo


But, your 'small limited Government' will not allow me to live my life. How can you not see this? Yet you agree Im right! LOL
My Limited government will fuck with you far less than the current one. It would be there primarily to block more oppressive governments from coming.


I agree, which is why i do what i do. The time to talk about this stuff is NOW. If i made a post about how owning black slaves on plantations is wrong, big friggin deal! Everyone knows its wrong. The time to make posts about how the use of the initiation of violence is immoral IS NOW while nobody else is saying it. THATS how thr world changes.
Freedom is something that must be learned over generations. It will take generations to fix this "Statism" problem. If a government collapses today another fill the void. I'm just trying to do things at an incremental fashion. I really am an Anarchist at heart. I always was. I don't think I am contradicting myself either.

I want to ween people off the State. That requires a pussified State. That's why I like National-Libertarianism. I think that's the best stepping stone. I also think most "Conservatives" are being pushed into that direction with things like the Tea Party (despite being controlled at the higher levels.)

[Libertytree]

I think it's obvious as hell. What real good has the government ever done for you? It seems to me that the only one benefiting is the .gov itself, meaning its members and the layers of beauracracy.

[Hatha Sunahara]

So, on top of it being an 'organization' in the real world--a specialized kind of 'person'--an artificial being, isn't it really nothing more than a mental construct? An apparition. One that resides only in your imagination? An apparition put into your imagination by carefully contrived social engineering processes--designed to program your mind to react in a specific way under changing circumstances. Government exists on the shoulders of a false consensus that people need it. No one is encouraged to examine that false consensus, and in fact are punished if they do.



Hatha

[Libertytree]

I think another pertinent question that runs parallel to the OP is...."Who is the government?"

[Horn]

There are plenty of little things you, and others like you can do to promote these ideals.

Promotion and politicking only leads to indifference.

Exemplification thru self-exorcism would make differences, more common to publicans.

And now that I've offered a kind word, I can continue bludgeoning you in altruistic fashion.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuLguNf0SJ0