Report: Civilization will collapse unless greed is stopped

[singular_me]

one thing I have learned on my road trip: worries about tomorrow often fix themselves without looking too much for solutions, less stressful. when one is obsessed with fixes and deadlines, coercion often gets us what we do not want to get, delays and/or unworthy solutions.

in a coercion-free environment, the ideal/utopia at this stage, problems come along with near instant solutions because the mind has much less constraints. way to many are just chasing money the same way cavemen hunted for meat. Some stress is healthy but coercion is a scourge.

meanwhile, the NWO instills guilt and powerlessness, so we'll turn to them for the cures. Sure, now climate change is blamed on greed. Although this article is from 2010, it tells us what lies ahead.

-------------
Human civilisation would “collapse” and efforts to tackle global warming will fail unless the world curbs its culture of greed and excessive consumerism, a report has warned.

The world's population is burning through the planet's resources at such a reckless rate – about 28 per cent more last year - it will eventually cause environmental havoc, said the Worldwatch Institute, a US think-tank.

In its annual State of the World 2010 report, it warned any gains from government action on climate change could be wiped out by the cult of consumption and greed unless changes in our lifestyle were made.

Consumerism had become a "powerful driver" for increasing demand for resources and consequent production of waste, with governments, including the British, too readily wanting to promoted it as necessary for job creation and economic well-being.

More than £2.8 trillion of stimulus packages had been poured into economies to pull the world out of the global recession, it found, with only a small amount into green measures.

But the think tank warned that without a "wholesale transformation” of cultural patterns the world would not be able to "prevent the collapse of human civilisation”.

................

The think tank said it was not just the United States that was guilty of a culture of excess with other developing countries such as Brazil, India and China adopting greed as a success symbol.

China, one of the world’s biggest greenhouse gas emissions producers, recently overtook the US as the world's top car market.

"More than 6.8 billion human beings are now demanding ever greater quantities of material resources, decimating the world's richest ecosystems, and dumping billions of tons of heat-trapping gases into the atmosphere each year," the report said.

This number will only increase as people in the developing world aspire towards a Western-styled consumer lifestyle.

Mr Assadourian added: “Until we recognise that our environmental problems, from climate change to deforestation to species loss, are driven by unsustainable habits, we will not be able to solve the ecological crises that threaten to wash over civilisation.

more
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/environment/6979611/Human-civilisation-will-collapse-unless-greed-culture-is-stopped-report-warns.html


yes and in order to do this, people have to come to term with
5 Lies The System Tells And How Believing Them Could Ruin Your Life
http://elitedaily.com/life/motivation/lies-system-tells-believing-ruin-life/855549/

[Hatha Sunahara]

It's not just greed. It is the abdication of thinking for yourself that will collapse civilization.



Hatha

[midnight rambler]

It's not just greed. It is the abdication of thinking for yourself that will collapse civilization.



Hatha

As well as giving up one's power to say 'No.'

This movie clip sums up much of the problem nicely (and most interestingly this movie was produced 35 years ago) -


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g_mivWFkSKU

[mick silver]

every were I go I see bigger homes with 3 or 4 living there hell I would hate to heat those homes . most of the people that have the houses build for there family's later ask why did I need a house this big builded ....have heard this more then once .... that part of not thinking before you do things I see more an more of , then later end up losing the house . just why do people with 3 or 4 need 5000 are 6000 sg feet house

[Ares]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/4/40/Gordon_Gekko.jpg/220px-Gordon_Gekko.jpg


Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works. Greed clarifies, cuts through, and captures, the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Greed, in all of its forms; greed for life, for money, for love, knowledge, has marked the upward surge of mankind and greed, you mark my words, will not only save Teldar Paper, but that other malfunctioning corporation called the U.S.A.

- Gordon Gekko

Just being sarcastic :)

[Shami-Amourae]

Diversity will destroy civilization, not Greed.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRWPfCVfUoE


What killed Detroit?

Greed or Diversity?
http://www.davidduke.com/images/Detroit.jpg


UNICEF Report: Africa's Population Could Hit 4 Billion By 2100 (http://www.npr.org/blogs/goatsandsoda/2014/08/13/340091377/unicef-report-africas-population-could-hit-4-billion-by-2100)

[madfranks]

The problem is "greed" is an incredibly nebulous term. For it to be stopped, it must first be defined. Can someone define greed for me, in a clear and objective way?

I have a decent car, but would like to have an upgraded, nicer vehicle. Does that make me greedy? I just got back from an awesome vacation, and I really want to take another one, does that make me greedy? I wish I could afford higher end clothes, food, and housewares, does that make me greedy? I don't know if any of you remember a guy named Richard Sider, it was his opinion that anyone holding on to more than the bare minimum for survival when other people are starving is greedy.

[Ares]

The problem is "greed" is an incredibly nebulous term. For it to be stopped, it must first be defined. Can someone define greed for me, in a clear and objective way?

I have a decent car, but would like to have an upgraded, nicer vehicle. Does that make me greedy? I just got back from an awesome vacation, and I really want to take another one, does that make me greedy? I wish I could afford higher end clothes, food, and housewares, does that make me greedy? I don't know if any of you remember a guy named Richard Sider, it was his opinion that anyone holding on to more than the bare minimum for survival when other people are starving is greedy.

Good questions, and I'll do what I can to try and answer them. Greed on a personal individual level I feel is fine. With the examples you listed, some would call you greedy. I wouldn't as I find that to be perfectly natural as its your own personal wants. You don't impact your neighbor with those. What I don't find perfectly natural is greed at a corporate or governmental level. Because that greed usually involves money and power that affect hundreds of thousands if not millions of people.

[Hatha Sunahara]

I'll give you a good definition of greed: Wanting things that have no possibility of satisfying anything but the desire to have them.

Hatha

[crimethink]

Human civilisation would “collapse” and efforts to tackle global warming will fail unless the world curbs its culture of greed and excessive consumerism, a report has warned.

Translation from Newspeak to English:

You little bastards need to die more quickly, and/or live much more cheaply, and we'll use the myth of "global warming" to get you to accept it, so that we filthy rich elitists can keep our party going forever.

[crimethink]

Diversity will destroy civilization, not Greed.

Divershitty is a symptom of greed.

Divershitty exists because people lust(ed) for power and money, and use(d) Niggers (etc.) to attain them.

[madfranks]

I'll give you a good definition of greed: Wanting things that have no possibility of satisfying anything but the desire to have them.

Hatha

For the sake of the discussion then, why must this be stopped?

[crimethink]

Greed on a personal individual level I feel is fine.

Of course you do. :)

Greed is condemned in every benevolent spiritual tradition. "It's my 'right' to have everything I want, and I don't give a shit who may be affected by it."

[crimethink]

For the sake of the discussion then, why must this be stopped?

Because resources are finite, and human lusts are infinite. Want in moderation is not a problem, but how many people can be moderate in today's era?

Q: "How much money is enough money?"

A: "Just a little bit more." (John D. Rockefeller)

[mick silver]

I just got they's at a sale , I didn't need them but I wanted them does this make me greedy http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIwMFgxNjAw/z/xZYAAOSwnDxUoIcH/$_35.JPG

[Ares]

Of course you do. :)

Greed is condemned in every benevolent spiritual tradition. "It's my 'right' to have everything I want, and I don't give a shit who may be affected by it."

So who is affected by Madfranks desires for more vacations and a newer vehicle?

I could care less what some man made religion says about greed. If any spiritual book was the word of god every human being would know it.

You're going to let a JEW define greed for you? Now that's rich.

[crimethink]

I could care less what some man made religion says about greed. If any spiritual book was the word of god every human being would know it.

You're going to let a JEW define greed for you? Now that's rich.

You really are an imbecile, aren't you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_poisons_%28Buddhism%29

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Thieves

(I won't even provide anything from the Christian tradition, because you, completely not surprisingly, dishonestly conflate Khazar with Israelite).

[mick silver]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a5/Bhavacakra_Thikse.jpg (http://gold-silver.us/wiki/File:Bhavacakra_Thikse.jpg)

[Ares]

You really are an imbecile, aren't you?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_poisons_%28Buddhism%29

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Thieves

(I won't even provide anything from the Christian tradition, because you, completely not surprisingly, dishonestly conflate Khazar with Israelite).

Well ladies and gentleman you heard it from Fred yourself. Never bother to do better for yourself or your family as that is "greed". Learn to live by the motto of: "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need."

:rolleyes:

[singular_me]

UNICEF Report: Africa's Population Could Hit 4 Billion By 2100 (http://www.npr.org/blogs/goatsandsoda/2014/08/13/340091377/unicef-report-africas-population-could-hit-4-billion-by-2100)

I dont believe this... at the pace they are "vaccinating" the populations there, it wont happen.

if the wake up call fails, by 2100, global demographics can be cut by half

[Hatha Sunahara]

For the sake of the discussion then, why must this be stopped?

It has to be stoppd because it is irrational and wasteful. Also, it is a practice that leads to psychologically imbalanced people owning the entire world.. Greed knows no limits. People who already own nearly everything and control everything, think they needto own and control more. Plus, they think they are not accountable for their behavior. And they aren't because they have everything and all the power, and who is there to challenge them when they are wrong? Greed simply is a form of insanity. If you argue that you should lett it take its course, then you should prepare yourself to be victimizrd by it and to suffer the effects of it. Also, if you argue that greed should not be stopped, you make yourself a supporter of oligarchs and vast inequalities in wealth in society. We all know that societies where vast wealth inequalities exist do not last for long.


Hatha

[mick silver]

back up for hatha

[madfranks]

I agree that greed should be stopped, but I believe it's an issue of a man's heart between him and his God, not something to be enforced by state policies and coercion. In the latter case, the cure is worse than the disease (i.e., state enforced rationing, price & wage controls, monitoring everyone's economic activities, etc).

[mick silver]

but if the government would stop helping them . enforced by state policies ... that wrong they own the laws they are for us not them . every bill an laws writhen for there asses are to help them not us .

[Hatha Sunahara]

Greed is the motivation for usury. If you argue that greedisgood, you might as well argue tha usury is divine. Usury is a practice that is an embodiment of a mental disorder. . If you think that stopping greed is an argument between a man and his own heart, then so is crime, and alcoholism, and drug addiction. These disorders between a man and his own heart have societal costs, as does usury. Civilized societies try to control those costs.

If you go back to the philosophy of Gordon Gekko, you will note that he also made a famous, but less well known statement about his role in society. Here, listen to it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9mWAxHpeew

Isn't there a legal maxim that says you can only control what you create? That's why our legal system creates 'strawmen'--so they can control them. Does it make sense that the legal system should also extend this principle to ownership? If you create nothing, you should own nothing. I think the major flaw of every civilization that existed to this day is that they have not come to grips with the issue of the upper limit of what an individual or an organization can own or control. That issue is what will make the NWO fail. If it doesn't work to have one person own or control everything in a single country or even a single smaller group, how could it possibly work on a global scale without violating the human rights of everybody but the owner/controller. Greed is what drives the NWO. . There are higher human spiritual values than the need for ownership and control of everything.While it may not be a good idea to set limits on how much greedy people can own, it would be great to set policies on how much help they can expect from the society in pursuing their greedy ambitions.

Hatha

[madfranks]

but if the government would stop helping them . enforced by state policies ... that wrong they own the laws they are for us not them . every bill an laws writhen for there asses not are to help them not us .

Exactly! No laws or special benefits to help the greedy bastards at the top. Retracting all these laws would do wonders to keep greed in check, but no law can stop a person from being greedy.

[crimethink]

I agree that greed should be stopped, but I believe it's an issue of a man's heart between him and his God, not something to be enforced by state policies and coercion. In the latter case, the cure is worse than the disease (i.e., state enforced rationing, price & wage controls, monitoring everyone's economic activities, etc).

Government is now a weapon of the filthy rich to be used against us. Its powers are hired for money by the self-appointed elite to enable them to amass even more capital.

No sane man wants to deny another the opportunity to earn a home and even land for himself. Anyone earning less than, say, $200,000/year is not the problem.

What is the problem is the lootocracy that now runs amok across our country, and the world.

[steyr_m]

Human civilisation would “collapse” and efforts to tackle global warming will fail unless the world curbs its culture of greed and excessive consumerism, a report has warned.


There goes that GW hoax again, next.

[Neuro]

I don't think anyone enjoying the fruits of his own labour can be guilty of greed.

[crimethink]

I don't think anyone enjoying the fruits of his own labour can be guilty of greed.

I agree, but what is defined as "fruits of one's own labor" has been perverted beyond any logical or even sane definition. No one "earns" millions of dollars. Someone has to be "taken" - a lot of someones - in order to amass such capital.

[Hatha Sunahara]

I agree, but what is defined as "fruits of one's own labor" has been perverted beyond any logical or even sane definition. No one "earns" millions of dollars. Someone has to be "taken" - a lot of someones - in order to amass such capital.

The most common way people are taken is by going into debt. The people who own everything certainly didn't achieve that ownership by 'working for it' What they own is not from the 'fruits of their labor'. Maybe greed can be defined as an obsession with enjoying the fruits of other peoples' labor..

Hatha

[crimethink]

The most common way people are taken is by going into debt.


In the Mystery America System, "going into debt" is a "privilege" of citizenship. The "Federal" Reserve makes certain of it.

[Neuro]

I agree, but what is defined as "fruits of one's own labor" has been perverted beyond any logical or even sane definition. No one "earns" millions of dollars. Someone has to be "taken" - a lot of someones - in order to amass such capital.
I agree. Hatha's definition works... 'An obsession to enjoy the fruits of others labour'

[madfranks]

I agree, but what is defined as "fruits of one's own labor" has been perverted beyond any logical or even sane definition. No one "earns" millions of dollars. Someone has to be "taken" - a lot of someones - in order to amass such capital.

I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.

[Neuro]

I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.
Ahh you Chinese?

http://m.alibaba.com/showroom/toothbrush-factory-china.html

over 28,000 hits on alibaba for 'toothbrush factory'

[Hitch]

Ahh you Chinese?

Change his name to madchinks!

[Hatha Sunahara]

I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.

The rewards of entrepreneurship are the fruits of your labor. Publishing is the same. Intellectual property is the fruit of your labor if you created it. Unfortunately people who market intellectual property often take an unfair cut of the market value.

Hatha

[Hitch]

I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.

From a supply and demand aspect, yes. However, if you accept dollars for those toothbrushes, what you've done is accepted debt as payment. You become a debt collector, having being owed value you have not collected on yet. If you barter those toothbrushes for bullets, or silver coins, etc, then you have not taken anyone.

[Neuro]

The rewards of entrepreneurship are the fruits of your labor. Publishing is the same. Intellectual property is the fruit of your labor if you created it. Unfortunately people who market intellectual property often take an unfair cut of the market value.

Hatha
I haven't looked it up, but I would imagine the number of patents owned by multi-national corporations vs physical persons is staggering, and those multi-national corporations hasn't created anything. I haven't got anything against an entrepreneur earning millions or even billions. An example would be Swedens Ingvar Kamprad, the creator of IKEA...

[crimethink]

I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.

The only way you can sell a toothbrush for one dollar is to pay someone only $1.00/hour to make them.

Most "millions" are made in finance, with which I include real estate. This "industry" is dependent upon actual creation of value by those who actually do work, as well as sorcery in creating "virtual value."

[crimethink]

The rewards of entrepreneurship are the fruits of your labor. Publishing is the same. Intellectual property is the fruit of your labor if you created it. Unfortunately people who market intellectual property often take an unfair cut of the market value.


Microsoft's pricing structure can only be defined as greed.

Likewise with the "entertainment" industry.

[singular_me]

that would be a giant factory... but where to get the $$ to launch such an enterprise?

rich-insider relative, bank loans, winning the lottery... u-um... starting small with friends putting their 20 year savings on the table.

Honest options are seldom



I disagree. It's never been easier to legitimately earn millions of dollars. Say you own a toothbrush factory and sell toothbrushes for a dollar each. If, over the course of a year you sell 10 million toothbrushes, then you haven't "taken" anyone, you've just sold lots of product.

[crimethink]

Honest options are seldom

The Mystery Babylon System has eliminated honest options.

[singular_me]

I dont think there is any room for cannibalistic multinationals on the planet but rather small and medium size businesses. And if people still wish to plan big, then they should have at least enough $$ to advertise to be contacted by potential (debt free) investors directly, we dont need pump and dump stock market casino.



The Mystery Babylon System has eliminated honest options.