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Ares
2nd February 2015, 05:01 AM
Although the financial media is blathering about negotiations and gamesmanship, the truth is Greece just blew up the Empire's Death Star of debt. There's nothing left to negotiate except the official admission that the Imperial Death Star of debt, the most fearsome threat in the galaxy, has been blown to smithereens.

http://www.oftwominds.com/photos2015/Death-Star-kablooie.jpg

There are three fundamental points that need to be emphasized, mostly because they've been lost in handwringing, fearmongering and the ceaseless chatter of propaganda shills.


1. Impaired debt and defaults result from imprudent underwriting and lender incompetence/ greed. Since when did it become accepted policy to reward imprudent lending, incompetence and greed?

Classical Capitalism is very clear on what should happen to lenders who ignored risk management; they get destroyed. As imprudently issued loans default, the losses pile up and the lender become insolvent. At that point, Capitalism kicks in and the management is fired, the stock goes to zero, the lender's assets are auctioned off and the creditors are issued whatever remains after wages, taxes, accounts payable, etc. are paid.

There's nothing complicated about it: Capitalism requires the discipline of losses being taken by those responsible, the firing of incompetents and the destruction of imprudent lenders.

Yet somehow the dominant narrative has reversed this essential core of Capitalism into blaming the borrower for the losses.

Look, if someone offers to loan me a billion dollars with no collateral and no assessment of the risks that I might not be able to pay the interest or principal, then who's the fool? The idiot who wants to give me $1 billion without any risk assessment, or the borrower who takes the "free money" being offered?

Yes, no one should borrow money that they can't pay back, blah blah blah, but the primary fiduciary responsibility is on the lender to not offer loans to marginal borrowers and those at high risk of defaulting on their debts.

Yet the official line on debt is "the lenders are blameless, the borrowers are at fault and should pay." The borrowers were imprudent to take on debt they couldn't service, but it is the lenders who made the bad loans who are ultimately are at fault and who should suck all the losses.

Let's set aside the propaganda for a moment and get real: anyone with the slightest knowledge of Greek finances and the power structure of the Greek economy/society knew it was insanely risky to loan Greece billions of euros. No one can deny this, yet somehow the lenders deserve to be paid for their avarice, stupidity, incompetence and total disregard for the standards of prudent lending? No, they deserve to be destroyed--closed down and their assets auctioned off.

2. Greece will not be wiped out by leaving the euro currency--it will be freed to rebuilt itself with prudent fiscal management and policies that reward investment and penalize risky borrowing, speculation and corruption.

Here's the thing about Greece issuing its own fiat currency--it will force fiscal discipline in a way that the euro did not and could not. This is why the Greek Status Quo is quivering with fear--the gravy train of irresponsibility enabled by the euro is ending, and they are terrified of living within their means and having to face the discipline that the market will impose on the Greek fiat currency.

If there's one thing Greece needs more than anything, it's the discipline and the rewards of the market. Any nation that issues its own fiat currency has a choice: it can exercise fiscal prudence and enforce policies that reward entrepreneurism, prudent lending, savings, wise investments, fair taxation, etc., or it can try to prop up its bloated, corrupt kleptocracy by printing rivers of fiat money.

If it chooses the Dark Side and prints money in excess, it will soon drive the value of that currency to near-zero. The kleptocracy that hoped to benefit from money-printing is impoverished or forced to move their capital elsewhere.

In other words, Greece returning to being responsible for its own currency is a good thing. The new currency will be valued cheaply relative to other currencies at first, and this is also a good thing, as imports will be unaffordable for all but the wealthy (kiss BMW sales in Greece good-bye) and everything produced in Greece becomes a bargain globally.

This will attract capital seeking places where it can make a profit and is treated fairly, and it will enable Greece to rebuild its export sector and boost its substantial tourist trade.

The promise that marginal borrowers would be transformed into sterling-credit borrowers by adopting the euro was always a fantasy--and a painfully visible fantasy at that. Anyone with their eyes even partially open could see that the vast differences in productivity, credit, risk and culture between the eurozone nations made the euro unworkable from the start.

It was equally visible that the eurozone's inept policies and loose lending standards would obscure these fundamental differences until the damage would be too great to hide--which is exactly what transpired.

3. The hundreds of billions of euros in so-called bailouts did not help Greece--all they did was bail out imprudent lenders and Euroland Elites. Virtually none of these vast sums helped the Greek nation or its people; what little did stay in Greece flowed to the kleptocrats that continued to rule Greece.

http://www.oftwominds.com/photos2015/greek-debt.jpg

The harsh reality of misrule and corruption was recently spelled out in Misrule of the Few: How the Oligarchs Ruined Greece:

"Greece has failed to address (rising wealth/income inequality) because the country’s elites have a vested interest in keeping things as they are. Since the early 1990s, a handful of wealthy families -- an oligarchy in all but name -- has dominated Greek politics. These elites have preserved their positions through control of the media and through old-fashioned favoritism, sharing the spoils of power with the country’s politicians. Greek legislators, in turn, have held on to power by rewarding a small number of professional associations and public-sector unions that support the status quo. Even as European lenders have put the country’s finances under a microscope, this arrangement has held."

Greece just blew up the Death Star of debt, and now the threat has been lifted from other debtor nations suffering from the yoke of Imperial misrule. The Greek Elites and kleptocrats are terrified of the discipline that leaving the euro will impose, but the general public should welcome the transition to an economy and society that has been freed from the shackles of Imperial debt and the kleptocracy that has bled the nation dry.

http://www.blacklistednews.com/Greece_Just_Blew_Up_the_Empire%27s_Death_Star_of_D ebt/41411/0/38/38/Y/M.html

singular_me
2nd February 2015, 05:12 AM
I think Greece deserves a mega thread (what I tried to do) as what is unfolding is a real eye opener... but what else can I say?

special greece thread
http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?81662-Greeks-Stop-Paying-Taxes-Ahead-Of-Elections

Ares
2nd February 2015, 05:14 AM
I think Greece deserves a mega thread (what I tried to do) as what is unfolding is a real eye opener... but what else can I say?

I'd like to see Greece hang their former political class from trees and lamp posts. Gut their bankers and leave their bloated carcases as reminders to what happens to usurers... But that's just me.

Horn
2nd February 2015, 06:14 AM
Greece returning to its own currency then still paying euro debt, would not only start out cheap but continue to slide.

Glass
2nd February 2015, 03:59 PM
yes we have a couple threads on this now: http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthread.php?81858-Greece-hires-Lazard-to-advise-on-debt

but as I predicted when posting about the 50% haircut proposed by Lazard that it would not stick and instead the debt would be restructured to the benefit of the bankers and giving even deeper and longer debt servitude to the Greeks.

And like presto magic Zerohedge is reporting a Debt Restructure is on the table for Greece. No hair cut. no debt discount. Greece took a bold step but it's no walk in the park. No one gets out of their debt, fraudulent or otherwise.

steyr_m
2nd February 2015, 06:24 PM
I would not be surprised if there was a Charlie Hebdo incident to pull them in line. I also heard some news that Russia may pay off their debt...

Horn
2nd February 2015, 07:36 PM
And like presto magic Zerohedge is reporting a Debt Restructure is on the table for Greece. No hair cut. no debt discount. Greece took a bold step but it's no walk in the park. No one gets out of their debt, fraudulent or otherwise.

If it were followed with ability to reproduce Iphones at their leisure taking away market position from China and Apple, maybe then.

PatColo
6th February 2015, 06:32 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73qPJAWqslc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73qPJAWqslc

*Usury: Weapon of the International jewish Banking Cartel Families against the world (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2014/02/usury-weapon-of-international-jewish.html)
*Money For People NOT Jewish Bankers (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2014/02/money-for-people-not-jewish-bankers.html)
*Secrets Of Jewish Money Control (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2014/11/secrets-of-jewish-money-control.html)
*Jew Money and our World Leaders (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2014/11/jew-money-and-our-world-leaders.html)
*AFP’s Most Viewed Article: Rothschilds Want Iran’s Banks (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2013/07/afps-most-viewed-article-rothschilds.html)
*The New Babylon: Those Who Reign Supreme - PDF (http://grizzom.blogspot.com/2014/06/the-new-babylon-those-who-reign-supreme.html)
*WHO CONTROLS AMERICA? (http://thezog.info/)

singular_me
6th February 2015, 07:34 AM
1000s rally in support of Greek government
http://www.presstv.ir/Detail/2015/02/06/396361/1000s-rally-in-support-of-Greek-government

http://217.218.67.233/photo/20150206/c8d208cd-c65b-4cf9-88c1-f65cfb5626ae.jpg

mick silver
6th February 2015, 08:35 AM
Bloomberg: Europe Will Continue to Totter
February 06, 2015



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Will the Next Recession Destroy Europe? ... The initial hardline posturing on both sides of the Greek debt stand-off is already moderating. This latest European crisis can be resolved and, as I recently explained, most likely will be. Yet don't be overly optimistic about the euro area's longer-term chances of survival. The hash that the European Union has made of this latest Greek emergency, a small and relatively tractable issue, tells you those chances aren't good. Imagine another bad recession. The euro area in its present form couldn't hope to survive. Even now, after all that's happened, the EU's leaders can't bring themselves to think about this. Perhaps they're assuming that another bad recession won't ever happen. That's the kind of foresight that built the single currency. – Bloomberg
Dominant Social Theme: After Greece comes ... prosperity.
Free-Market Analysis: In the other article in this issue, we've analyzed the dialectic now taking hold between Greece and the EU. We pointed out that the EU may be trying to control negotiations as best it can but that these negotiations are disruptive nonetheless and presumably the Brussels bureaucracy would rather not have embarked on them.
The larger question – the one that lingers – is what happens after the Greek palaver concludes. This Bloomberg opinion piece tries to address that issue in a surprisingly honest way.
Here's more:
Greece is not the problem – or shouldn't be, anyway. It can be managed because it's a small country and because no other euro member country is in nearly so much trouble. The resources necessary to restore its prospects are relatively small; and a new debt settlement for Greece needn't serve as a template for other debt-relief supplicants. Greece can plausibly be presented as a one-off.
There's good justification for that, in fact. The country's previous debt restructuring was bungled. It wasn't big enough to restore solvency – Greece's government debt is still more than 170 percent of GDP – and the relief, such as it was, came with draconian fiscal conditions that stomped on an economy already on its back. The coming Greek settlement should be thought of as correcting those errors, a second chance to get things right, not as a precedent-setting innovation.
Having predicted the negotiations will provide a satisfactory near-term conclusion, the article asks the larger question, which is actually the most pertinent one: Can Europe survive the current trends of "low inflation and high unemployment"?
The article goes on to predict that a European QE will not prove as "effective" as the one that took place in the US. (Of course, even the QE in the US is subject to question as the US's vaunted recovery continues to stagnate.)
The speculation here is that "another severe downturn" might further destabilize what is left of the European economy. "That exposes the EU to bigger-than-normal risks of financial accidents."
It is true, in fact, that there are not many options available via monetary policy. Interest rates are at the zero bound and other tools available to the ECB are far more limited than those that the Fed (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/1855/) can use. Additionally, there is a good deal of antipathy in Germany to even the modest QE program that the ECB has embarked upon.
The other option is fiscal stimulus, or pump-priming. But this is currently out of the question because such Keynesian (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/831/) remedies are the property of nation-states and the EU remains a confederation not a nation.
The article then provides us with its most interesting section, the conclusion. It bluntly admits that it would be difficult at this point to build a closer union because of the current unpopularity of the dream of "European unity." In other words, the belief is lacking.
We've been predicting this for years now. The combination of the Internet – which has enlightened Europeans about the chicanery and manipulation of the EU's expansion – and the insularity of European "tribes" that will support empire-building aspirations only so long as they are domestically profitable, is making it most difficult for Brussels' to expand its brief.
The article tells us, in fact, "the commitment to European solidarity, invoked down the years to motivate the whole project, has all but vanished." That's a big admission.
Now, it could be that European leaders are yet desirous of a larger catastrophe that will lead the way to a closer union (as they themselves have stated), but it is surely just as likely at this point that such a strategy would operate differently in this Internet era (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/2195/), pushing EU members further apart.
This may even seem a more likely scenario and it is one that would have a knock-off effect on other economies around the world. We've often speculated that the trigger to a worldwide economic meltdown might lie with the Chinese, but it surely could come from the EU as well.
Conclusion: These are the potential consequences with which the modern financial environment is fraught. The world is in a delicate place, and here at The Daily Bell we have introduced readers (http://www.thedailybell.com/special-reports/) to a portfolio of programs to help you cope. Tangible assets, second homes overseas and various kinds of asset protection are all available for those who anticipate further turbulence ahead.

- See more at: http://www.thedailybell.com/news-analysis/36062/Bloomberg-Europe-Will-Continue-to-Totter/#sthash.cyniJNYy.dpuf

mick silver
6th February 2015, 08:51 AM
Despite Controlling Factors, Greek Negotiations Remain Fraught
February 06, 2015



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Greece pleads with Berlin for time and money to re-write debt deal ... Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis evokes fears of Nazism in Greece in a bid to end his country's "ritual humiliation" at the hands of its creditors. – UK Telegraph
Dominant Social Theme: Negotiations with Greece are necessary but perilous.
Free-Market Analysis: Is this a dance between the EU and Greece, designed to yield tension, headlines and ultimately resolution? Or is it a legitimate unraveling of the EU's program?
Once again, the world waits and watches while powerful government officials bargain over national and banking solvency. The larger meme here is that only the bureaucracy can figure out a legitimate solution.
But if we confine our analysis to the negotiations themselves, we can observe a practical dialectic at work. The dialectic places a controlled Syrizan team at the negotiating table – one more reasonable than its rhetoric might suggest. Alternative journo Wayne Madsen has commented on this in a column focused on globalist forces inside the new Greek government.
As Greece celebrates the inauguration of its anti-austerity government, the euphoria should be tempered with a bit of realism. Although new Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras, who named his son "Ernesto" after Cuban revolutionary Ernesto "Ché" Guevara, and the vast majority of his new Coalition of the Radical Left (SYRIZA) government have good left-wing and pro-labor credentials, the same cannot be necessarily said of the man Tsipras chose to be Greece's new finance minister.
Yanis Varoufakis a citizen of Australia who was educated in Britain and worked as a professor at the University of Texas. Europe has witnessed such dual nationals with conflicting loyalties take power in countries in Eastern Europe, most notably in Ukraine, where American Natalie Jaresko became finance minister in order to deliver International MonetaryFund (IMF (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/1823/)) and European Central Bank (ECB) austerity "poison pills" to Ukraine ... Varoufakis has had a past close relationship with the global entities with which he is expected to battle.
Madsen goes on to point out that Varoufakis was an economic adviser to PASOK's Prime Minister George Papandreou. Under Papandreous, Greece first acquiesced to "austerity." Nonetheless, it is Varoufakis that is apparently leading negotiations between Greece and the EU. These negotiations recently have been reported in dire terms. There is said to be little or no give between the two sides.
The Telegraph article reports it this way:
Greece's finance minister pleaded for his country to be given time and money to negotiate a new debt deal with its creditors, after the European Central Bank sought to pull the carpet from under the feet of the country's stricken banks.
Following an uneasy two-hour showdown with his German counterpart in Berlin, Yanis Varoufakis admitted he had failed to "agree to disagree" with Wolfgang Schauble over his government's demands to re-write its €240bn bailout agreement.
The meeting was the last leg of Syriza's tour of Europe's capitals, where Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras and his number two hoped to drum up support for an alleviation of the bailout terms imposed by the Troika.
Varoufakis is arguing for an "emergency bridging loan" that will help Greece continue to function during current negotiations. But Schauble and the Germans have proven to be resistant. Schauble apparently wouldn't give Varoufakis his cell phone number at recent negotiations.
The European Central Bank has also decided not to accept Greek "junk bonds" as loan collateral. Greek banks now only have the European Central bank (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/2958/) emergency liquidity programme (ELA) to depend on, according to reports. The ELA program charges high interest rates.
Tsipras is taking a tough stance, however. "Greece won't take orders any more, especially orders through emails," Mr Tsipras reportedly said. "Greece has its own voice. Greece cannot be blackmailed because democracy (http://www.thedailybell.com/definitions/params/id/1862/) in Europe cannot be blackmailed."
Greece may or may not be subject to "blackmail," but it seems obvious that lines have been drawn and positions set. The conversation has changed and Greece's position has become more assertive, but perhaps once again – as before – there is an outcome waiting in the wings that will reconfigure the EU's position regarding austerity and Greece in particular.
If so, the Greece negotiations are a kind of formal dance leading to an outcome that is at least roughly available – and ready to be implemented. Our position would be that these talks could lead to significant changes in the relationship between the EU and Greece, perhaps even a kind of controlled expulsion of Greece from the EU.
Any such solution would be carefully "calibrated" to ensure damage to the EU is minimized – though such an outcome is probably not ideal from the standpoint of Brussels. Even with a good deal of talk about how these negotiations are more collegial than reported, their presence cannot be especially pleasant for either side.
Conclusion: The dialectic may be controlled but it is also a necessary one ... one that could easily spin out of control, with ramifications that could be felt worldwide. The outcome is certainly not preordained, and markets will watch nervously.

- See more at: http://www.thedailybell.com/news-analysis/36061/Despite-Controlling-Factors-Greek-Negotiations-Remain-Fraught/#sthash.EsjK10Je.dpuf

slvrbugjim
7th February 2015, 08:41 AM
As long as Greece does not have the power to issue their own currency they will be powerless and it really is as simple as that.

Horn
7th February 2015, 09:35 AM
Their power to print is their bargaining chip to ensure people can still buy iphones with what they do print.

Sanctions dont work in Iceland because it is by nature already sanctioned as an island.

Neuro
8th February 2015, 04:33 AM
Their power to print is their bargaining chip to ensure people can still buy iphones with what they do print.

Sanctions dont work in Iceland because it is by nature already sanctioned as an island.
They have virtually endless amounts of fish off their coast and geothermal energy to grow vegetables in greenhouses, and a large population of sheep (of the sheep kind) for meat and clothes, the worst sanctions could do against the Icelanders is stopping gasoline imports, and they have to go back to using the Icelandic horse, which is probably better if you want to go somewhere remote. Probably the best way to enslave Icelanders is to prevent sanctions against them at any cost, so they don't get any ideas... They shouldn't even had said anything about their banks debt default.

Ragnarök!