PDA

View Full Version : the bread thread



chad
10th February 2015, 04:31 PM
okay, 1 year late, but whatever. hopefully this gave you extra time to get all your stuff ready. i will be bitching at you and lecturing you in this post, because i want your recipe to turn out really well, not becasue i am an asshole. so just listen to me. as mentioned before, you will need the following:


1 bag white flour. WHITE not some blend or mix. bleached or unbleached, it doesn't matter.


1 box of vital wheat gluten. i use this one, but it doesn't matter what kind:


http://www.bobsredmill.com/vital-wheat-gluten.html


orange rind


some olive oil


a bottle of carbonated water. doesn't matter what kind. don't get anything with flavor added, etc. just regular, plain carbonated water. pretend you are in france.


some sugar, 1/4 a cup or so.


2 eggs


some yeast. i normally don't use yeast, but i'm too lazy to make this thread a 10 day epic with growing a starter, so go buy some yeast. it has to be from a jar, not in packets. i use red star. don't buy anything that says "fast rising."


sea salt. you don't have to add salt, so you can skip this part if you want, but it inhibits mold growth. that's all it's in there for.


a 5 quart cast iron dutch oven. this absolutely won't work without one, so go buy one if you don't already own one. here is one you can get in a week:


http://www.amazon.com/Lodge-L8DOL3-P...8808031&sr=1-2


a water spray bottle from the dollar store. one of those little mister sprayer things.


a razor blade.


lastly, your oven needs to be able to go to 450 degrees.


okay, so now you have all of that stuff. i will give you options. you can either follow dough recipe 1 or dough recipe 2. #1 will make crusty rustic bread. #2 will make french brioche. all breads are basically variations of these 2 dough recipes. crusty rustic is like the stuff you'd tear apart and eat with cheese, brioche is more of a sweet, desert type bread. the crusty will have big air pockets in it, the brioche will be denser with no air pockets. once you master these 2 dough recipes, you can move on to dumping things in the dough like olives, garlic, cheese, fruit, whatever.


before i tell you how to make the dough, let me caution you to not be making this like you think you should, otherwise it won't turn out. do it like i tell you, no matter how counter intuitive to how you've always made bread it sounds. especially when it comes to kneading.


okay, first we have to make the poolish. take a small bowl and put maybe 1/2 cup of room temperature NOT WARM water in it. put in a pinch of sugar, barely any. put in 2 tablespoons or so of the yeast. mix it up and let it sit on the counter while you dump the following in to your mixer (pick a dough):


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7267&stc=1


dough recipe #1 rustic crusty bread


3 cups flour WHITE not any sort of blend
1 teaspoon salt (inhibits mold)
5 teaspoons vital wheat gluten


dough recipe #2 brioche


3 cups flour
5 teaspoons vital wheat gluten
1 teaspoon salt
2 eggs
1/4 cup or so olive oil
1/2 cup or so of sugar
if you want it to be "real france" put in a tablespoon or so of finely grated orange rind


okay, you have all of that stuff in your mixer, dump in the poolish and get ready to mix.


the next step is the most important step of bread making. it is why your bread never turns out like the bread you buy at those artisan places. it's called hydration.


people have been taught that you make bread "dough." you don't. you make bread batter. recipes that tell you to add this much water "in measurements" suck. you can't do it like that, you have to just keep adding water until you get to the perfect hydration point. i can't explain how to do this exactly, it's something you learn as a baker; you have to experience it. you'll get better at it every time you try, and one day it will just click.


if you picked dough #1 you'll be using room temperature NOT WARM carbonated water. if you picked #2 use room temperature NOT WARM tapwater. carbonation makes the air pockets in dough #1. you can do it without carbonated water, but then it take like 14 hours and i don't have that long, so just use carbonated water. it's useless in dough #2 because the eggs and oil make brioche too dense to really have much of an effect. room temperature water makes the fermentation proceed slowly. we want slow.


okay, so start adding in water while you mix. you want this to be somewhere in between muffin batter and dough when you are finished. when you pick the dough up, it should run down and break apart, not be solid like a piece of traditional dough. it should stick to your hands so badly that it takes 5 minutes to scrub your hands and get it off. it should be completely messy. you'll be like "wtf is this, i can't ever bake this," but trust me. here's a picture of me holding it and what my hands look like after taking it out of the mixer:


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7268&stc=1



http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7269&stc=1

if you mess this step up and make solid dough like grandma did, your recipe will fail. bakers make dough with 75% or more hydration. the dough has to be really wet to get correct fermentation and correct loaf spring during baking. make it wet. if it's not a huge mess, you did it wrong.


okay, so now we need to ferment it. put it in an oiled bowl, put a cover on it (i use an old enamelware roasting pan with fitting lid, has to be covered, humidity). now, we need to put it in our proofing box. boil a pot of water. once boiled, put the boiling pan of water in to a cold oven. put your oiled pan in the oven with the pot of water, close door, and wait 40 minutes. take the lid off & it will look like this after 40 minutes:


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7270&stc=1


now, we need to turn it. DO NOT BE KNEADING IT, BE TURNING IT. take one edge of the dough and pull it, and turn it over on to the top. do this 2 or 3 times, not 15. if you knead it, it will suck. form it back in to a ball and put it in the oiled pan. cover it. re-boil the water, and put it all back in to the oven. this time, wait an hour.




at the end of an hour, turn it again, 2 or 3 times max, no kneading. be careful at this point, you'll see big air bubbles forming and it will feel billowly. reboil the water, put it all back in, (covered) wait another hour. here's what it will look like:


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7271&stc=1


this time, do not put it back in the oven. sit it someplace warma and not drafty. cover it. set your oven to 450 degrees. after half an hour, put the dutch oven, including the lid, in the oven. wait another half hour.


okay, so now the final hour is up, the oven is at 450, and you have a hot as shit cast iron pan & lid in the oven. do this next part fast. safely, but fast.


take the dutch oven out. take the big pillowy dough ball (yeah, we never punched it down, it's a big airy thing), and put it in the dutch oven. no oil or anything to coat the sides, just put it in the dry pan. take a razor blade and slit either a big "x" on the top, or some other design. if you skip this step, it will not get pan spring and it will suck. slashes more to the side instead of the top work better, but whatever.


now for the second most important part. what they never tell you about commercial bakeries or artisan shops is that they all have special ovens with water jets in them. the jets spray water throughout the cooking process to keep the hydration level up. we'll do it the poor man's way instead of buying a $20,000 oven.


take the little water spray bottle and mist the shit out of the top of the loaf. spray a whole bunch on there, and then immediately put the lid on. now, the loaf will steam the whole time it cooks, just like a loaf would in a commercial bakery.


put it in the oven and bake it for 40 minutes. don't take the lid off to check on it. if you take the lid off, you will ruin it, and it will suck. don't take the lid off.


after 40 minutes you can take the lid off. at this point you have two options: take it out and it on a rack to cool, or continue cooking it with the lid off to burnish it further. it's a personal choice. if you keep baking it, it'll get crustier. personally, i like it burnished because quite frankly, it looks better. monitor it very closely, because it will go from done to burn edin less than 30 seconds when it reaches burnishing point. when ready, use a spoon or something to get it out. it'll be hot as shit, so wear gloves. tap the bottom of it. a fully formed loaf should sound hollow when tapped.


so now it's done, and you want to try it. don't. leave it sit until completely cooled, or you will ruin the air pocket formation. the air pockets are still soft at this point, and if you cut it warm, they'll collapse. will power. DON'T BE CUTTING IT OPEN UNTIL IT'S COMPLETELY COOLED. now, listen to it. you'll hear it cracking and snapping. bakers call this bread song. it's cool.


as you can see, this isn't hard, but the secret is water, water, water and no kneading it.


post some pictures as you do this, i'd love to see what you make. keep trying, it'll probably take you several attempts to master it. nobody does the water right the first time. you'll get the hang of it.

chad
10th February 2015, 04:32 PM
oh yeah, this is what it should like.
http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7272&stc=1

Dogman
10th February 2015, 04:35 PM
New nickname for you!


Speedy!

;)

BTW, nice looking future toast and sandwich material.

Looking at that , gets me wanting to break out some of my frozen sourdough starter and let the flour fly!

chad
10th February 2015, 04:39 PM
yeah, normally i do a starter made with 100% undilluted, organic apple juice, but i ain't got time to do no post about making 14 day starters. ;)

Dogman
10th February 2015, 04:45 PM
yeah, normally i do a starter made with 100% undilluted, organic apple juice, but i ain't got time to do no post about making 14 day starters. ;)

Been there, doing wild yeast starter combos can take time and a pain in the nether regions with no guarantees the time spent will be worthwhile!

Have several frozen starters here all unique in taste in the final loaf or what ever it is baked in.

Thanks, Speedy~!

Lmfao!

Peace !

For everything bread and baking , you can not beat this forum.

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/

Been a member for many years, great people and wonderful help if needed.

chad
10th February 2015, 05:01 PM
fresh loaf is a great site. oh yeah, and if you want to make the best pizza ever, make your dough like in my post, and then cook in a cast iron skillet with the lid on. it'll turn out like at a restaurant. same premise, hydration of dough. you can't pre-heat the pan though (obviously).

Dogman
10th February 2015, 05:08 PM
fresh loaf is a great site. oh yeah, and if you want to make the best pizza ever, make your dough like in my post, and then cook in a cast iron skillet with the lid on. it'll turn out like at a restaurant. same premise, hydration of dough. you can't pre-heat the pan though (obviously).

Have made sour dough crusts , Yummy!

Dammit !

Got me seriously thinking of defrosting all of my starters, feeding them and do some baking then freezing again. Have the same but dried for backup I know those can last for years.

Sourdough toast and jam, over easy eggs and bacon!

Humm?

chad
10th February 2015, 05:12 PM
having this, white wine, and some cheese tonight myself. defrost em dogman!

Dogman
10th February 2015, 05:19 PM
having this, white wine, and some cheese tonight myself. defrost em dogman!

Sounds great speedy, Humm?

I retract my nickname for you Chad!

No guarantee others will tho!

;)

With wild yeast, the saying 'all things good take time!' Holds!

But was your yeast storebotten or wild in your loaf pic's?

;)

chad
10th February 2015, 05:48 PM
Sounds great speedy, Humm?

I retract my nickname for you Chad!

No guarantee others will tho!

;)

With wild yeast, the saying 'all things good take time!' Holds!

But was your yeast storebotten or wild in your loaf pic's?

;)

store bought, red star. i'm too lazy in the winter to mess with starters. all fairness though, that was an old pic from last year. kids attacked the one i made in this post before i could get a pic.

Dogman
10th February 2015, 06:10 PM
excuses , excuses all we get are excuses !

But a viable one at least !

;)

chad
10th February 2015, 06:31 PM
here's a few i've made this winter.

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7274&stc=1http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7275&stc=1http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7276&stc=1http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7277&stc=1

Dogman
10th February 2015, 06:45 PM
There is one direction I have yet to try.

No knead bread, all I have ever made was old school, regular let rise and punch down rise and bake, sourdough I may let it rise and then punch down, several times to develop the flavor. It depended on the temp/humidity at the time and how the dough was acting or what I was looking for in the result.

Good looking bread there. never went with molds ether, round loafs are kool, tho the toaster may complain.

chad
10th February 2015, 06:52 PM
There is one direction I have yet to try.

No knead bread, all I have ever made was old school, regular let rise and punch down rise and bake, sourdough I may let it rise and then punch down, several times to develop the flavor. It depended on the temp/humidity at the time and how the dough was acting or what I was looking for in the result.

Good looking bread there. never went with molds ether, round loafs are kool, tho the toaster may complain.

i have some cast iron rectangle ones i use for sandwich bread, but to be honest, they don't get used much. everyone seems to prefer the round ones.

i should also note that in some of those photos you can see flour on the bread. it's a presentation thing. before you put it in the hot pan, you can plop the loaf gently in rice flour to achieve that effect. it makes it rustic-er.

Dogman
10th February 2015, 07:24 PM
Round loafs make great sandwiches, you just have to get inventive with the fillings. ;)

mick silver
10th February 2015, 07:24 PM
thanks clad you know I have been on you to get this done , this weekend it going to be so cold it will be something we give a try .. warm fresh bread . ps can we used are bread marker for this clad , thanks again this will keep us busy we had to put a pet down today so it's been hard mick

chad
10th February 2015, 07:28 PM
thanks clad you know I have been on yu o get this done , this weekend itgoing to be so cold it will be something w give a try .. warm fresh bread . ps can we used are bread marker for this clad , thanks again this will keep us busy we had to put a pet to down today so it's been hard mick

you absolutely cannot use a bread maker mick, it will not work. get yourself a broasting pan with lid, cast iron dutch oven. you can do the mixing with a hand mixer, i use a cuisinart to mix it. after you make this, you will toss your bread maker in the recycling pile.

sorry about your pet :( they are family members.

mick silver
11th February 2015, 05:59 AM
get up and make some bread , we need a couple of things so we are off to the big store this morning

madfranks
11th February 2015, 10:40 AM
Wow, chad finally did it! My wife loves this kind of bread so once we get one of those dutch ovens we'll give it a shot.

chad
11th February 2015, 02:19 PM
Wow, chad finally did it! My wife loves this kind of bread so once we get one of those dutch ovens we'll give it a shot.

you don't have one yet? i gave you a year ;)

madfranks
11th February 2015, 07:54 PM
you don't have one yet? i gave you a year ;)

I take it back. I showed my wife this recipe and she told me that we do, in fact, have a cast iron Dutch oven! We're going to try this this weekend, I'll take pics and try to make you proud :D

Dogman
11th February 2015, 07:59 PM
I take it back. I showed my wife this recipe and she told me that we do, in fact, have a cast iron Dutch oven! We're going to try this this weekend, I'll take pics and try to make you proud :D

Smart wife !

;)

chad
12th February 2015, 08:14 AM
$64

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004QM8SLG/ref=as_li_ss_sm_fb_us_asin_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=213733&creative=399837&creativeASIN=B004QM8SLG&linkCode=shr&tag=wwwperson08ef-20&linkId=KLH33A5VUIQ5FBS5&qid=1423752383&sr=8-8&keywords=lodge

mick silver
12th February 2015, 09:35 AM
we have all the stuff we need now to make clad bread ... I have more cast iron pot and oven then walfart got . me cast iron ... clad stoves

Dogman
12th February 2015, 09:38 AM
we have all the stuff we need now to make clad bread ... I have more cast iron pot and oven then walfart got . me cast iron ... clad stoves

WOW !

Didn't think that was possible !

;)

mick silver
13th February 2015, 04:20 PM
back it up for more bread

Shami-Amourae
13th February 2015, 04:29 PM
:confused:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGw0g7RpzZw

chad
13th February 2015, 04:58 PM
so where my loafs at?

Dogman
13th February 2015, 05:05 PM
so where my loafs at?

Wondering Chad ?

Are you asking them in relation to real time or Chad's time? :)

Seems there is a possible temporal time shift evolved, in difference between the two !

:)

mick silver
13th February 2015, 06:42 PM
good thing always comes of Saturdays

zap
13th February 2015, 09:27 PM
I am going to make a sourdough starter, ok its started ..... just flour and water, take 7 days apparently... then I will try to make some bread. :)

mick silver
18th February 2015, 02:33 PM
up
up and away

Dogman
18th February 2015, 02:48 PM
I am going to make a sourdough starter, ok its started ..... just flour and water, take 7 days apparently... then I will try to make some bread. :)

Watch closely you should see action activity when the wild yeast starts eating, the mix can double in volume,

the recommended way is to divided throwing half away and feeding the remainder. Checking and feeding at least once a day in cooler kitchen , the hotter the more often the starter needs to be checked.

There are several good sites that helped me learn the how to do a good starter.

Will add to this post later the links!

Proper feeding is very important to keep the yeast healthy and growing, it is amazing how fast yeast can eat flour and then needs more to stay healthy!

That is why ether drying or freezing the starter is a must unless you bake daily .

Some I know even think of their long time starters as pets!

;)

Have one that has been with me close to 10 years!

Pets= you feed them take time with them and care for them, look after their health clean up after them, and get great pleasure from them?

Hell that also sounds like caring for kids also! ;)

Cebu_4_2
18th February 2015, 02:51 PM
up
up and away

http://blogs.agu.org/martianchronicles/files/2010/11/rocket-launch.jpg

Camp Bassfish
18th February 2015, 04:49 PM
I wish we could pull the original bread thread into this one..... I rose on a point of privledge.

Bun intended.

Camp Bassfish
13th March 2015, 07:58 PM
Bumped because I'm gonna give it a "roll"