Steam engine airplane flew in 1931, why not now?

[Ponce]

In 1931 a airplane flew with a home made steam engine which created a 1,200 lbs pressure and 150 hp and 1,650 rpm.....it was made, and flew, in Oakland CA by William Besler and his brother...it also had a supercharger to blow more air into the carburetor.

Found this in old, old, and long article that I have to learn how to post..... first time that I have read about a steam engine airplane..... I hope that I gave you something new.

V

[ximmy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nw6NFmcnW-8

[palani]

Never heard of no steam engine with a carburetor.

http://orig15.deviantart.net/04c0/f/2014/008/1/3/steam_powered_mothership_by_cutangus-d71glpy.jpg

[ximmy]

some technology has been lost or forgotten.
----
Use of exhaust steam from steam engine driving such a blower it as hopeless a task as controlling steam jet blower proportions Instead of trying to measure out amounts in constant propor of air and separately generated steam water might be measured mechanically in proportion to air through a supply pipe and vaporized by some device equivalent to a flash boiler and consisting of more than the necessary amount of heated metal warmed to excess temperatures by the producer top or its delivered gases Such an arrangement would be quite equivalent to an ordinary gasolene carburetor so far as proportioning is concerned and would differ from it functionally only as far as the subsequent heating to secure vaporization is concerned which is itself a simple matter since excess heating is not harmful but really beneficial especially when the source of heat is delivered gases on their way to water cooled scrubbers To be quite equivalent the producer must be suction operated and this for many very good practical reasons is the ultimate form or system that must be adopted universally Among the most important of these reasons are fire and operator's health risk both of which are dangerously increased by pressure generators in chambers that become so easily leaky as producers and that must be periodically opened for management cleaning or adjustment The suction producer then may have a carburetor type of steam air proportioner and it may be expected to do as well as that in use on automobiles and similar apparatus which while not perfection is very much better than the average equipment provided with producers where the service conditions are not so exacting For example the gasolene engine carburetor must operate from maximum to nearly zero flow whereas a gas producer seldom if ever operates at less than a quarter of its maximum capacity even when one producer supplies one engine and not as low as this when several producers operate together The full range of types of carburetor have not been applied to air steam proportioning of producers in fact only a few of the simplest have been attempted partly because the necessity for accurate adjustment of proportions has not been very generally recognized but also because the next type has seemed a better chance No matter how accurately water is mechanically measured out in proportion to air variations in atmospheric humidity constantly taking place will disturb the final mixture and render it variable and not constant The only reasonable possibility of mixture maintenance in spite of atmospheric moisture fluctuations lies in the use of humidifying appliances saturating the air from whatever natural condition it may be in to the maximum moisture carrying capacity at a definite temperature This will of course involve a temperature control which is not so difficult a matter as steam air or water air proportioning Experience along the lines of constructing apparatus for air conditioning for textile and some chemical manufacturing operations indicates the solution for this problem Passing air through water chambers exposing very great wetted surfaces to the air will saturate it easily and temperature control of the mixture may be accomplished by the water temperature except for most extreme atmospheric conditions provided there is ample supply of cool water available and if not it may be cooled by the very operation of humidifying air which is identical as a process

[ximmy]

For a number of years now work has been proceeding in order to bring perfection to the crudely conceived idea of a transmission that would not only supply inverse reactive current for use in unilateral phase detractors, but would also be capable of automatically synchronizing cardinal grammeters. Such an instrument is the turbo encabulator.

Now basically, the only new principle involved is that instead of power being generated by the relative motion of conductors and fluxes, it is produced by the modial interaction of magneto-reluctance and capacitive-directance.

The original machine had a baseplate of prefamulated Amulite, surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing in such a way that the two spurving bearings were in a direct line with the panametric fan. The latter consisted simply of six hydrocoptic marzel vanes so-fitted to the ambifacient lunar wane shaft that side fumbling was effectively prevented.

The main winding was of the normal lotus-o-delta type placed in panendermic semi-boloid slots of the stator; every seventh conductor being connected by a non-reversible trem'e pipe to the differential girdlespring on the up-end of the grammes.

The Turbo Encabulator has now reached a high level of development, and is being successfully used in the operation of nofer trunnions. Moreover, whenever a farescent skor motion is required, it may also be employed in conjunction with a drawn reciprocation dingle arm to reduce soinasodial repleneration.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLDgQg6bq7o

[crimethink]

A steam-powered aircraft sounds as logical as this:

http://www.nationalmuseum.af.mil/shared/media/photodb/photos/060720-F-1234S-020.jpg

[ximmy]

A steam-powered aircraft sounds as logical as this:



http://bentcorner.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/michalkwolekcoaldrivenairplane.jpg

[monty]

There aren't many water towers or coal stations in the sky.

[monty]

They also had a diesel aircraft engine.


http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7735&stc=1

[ximmy]

They also had a diesel aircraft engine.




That's Diesel Punk, we want Steam Punk...

Steam aircraft refueling station...

http://th01.deviantart.net/fs70/PRE/f/2012/267/4/8/steampunk_flying_aircraft_by_jamis27-d5frzd7.jpg

[Neuro]

There aren't many water towers or coal stations in the sky.
Err neither jet fuel filling stations...

[Serpo]

It was going well until it run out of steam................

[Ponce]

Hey you lazy guys.........go to search.......as I just did......and type his name. You will find a handful of links to what I posted.

V

[crimethink]

Err neither jet fuel filling stations...

You are incorrect:

https://www.tampabay.com/resources/images/dti/rendered/2014/04/0420951413_13039156_8col.jpg

:D

[crimethink]

Hey you lazy guys.........go to search.......as I just did......and type his name. You will find a handful of links to what I posted.

V

I don't doubt he made a steam-powered plane...it's just that it's not practical. The fuel & water needed to keep it aloft would give it a range in yards, not miles.

[Serpo]

Hey you lazy guys.........go to search.......as I just did......and type his name. You will find a handful of links to what I posted.

V


Hey Ponce ,you just maybe onto something here..............


George & William BESLER
Steam-Powered Airplane




http://www.archive.org/details/BeslerCo1932
15-minute silent film of Besler and his steam-driven vehicles (plane, car, train)



Popular Science Monthly (July 1933) Vol 123, No. 1
World’s First Steam-Driven Airplane
by
H J Fitzgerald
Successful Flights with Long-Sought Craft Crown Many Similar Attempts by Early Aviation Engineers
Over the Oakland, CA Airport, a few days ago, a silent planet slanted across the sky trailing a thin ribbon of white vapor. Spectators heard the pilot shout a greeting from the air. They saw him flash past, skimming the ground at 100 miles an hour. They watched him bank into a turn, slide to a landing, and, with the propeller spinning backward, roll to a stop in less than 100 feet. They had seen, for the first time in history, a man fly on wings powered by steam!
Two brothers, George and William Besler, the former a geologist 31 years old, and the latter a mechanical engineer, two years younger, have achieved the dream of Maxim, Langley, and other pioneers of flight. Through their work, the steam-driven airplane, long talked about, long planned, has become a reality.
This spectacular development in the field of aeronautics is the result of three years of secret experiment. The inventors began their work in 1930, in a machine shop at Emeryville CA. A few weeks ago, they brought the product of their researches, a 180-pound engine developing 150 horsepower, to the Oakland Airport and installed it at the nose of a conventional Travel Air biplane.
This blue machine, with William Besler at the controls, sped down the runway and climbed into the air without a sound except the low whine of the propeller and the hum of wind through the wires. Swinging back over the field at 200 feet, the pilot shouted ‘Hello!’ and heard the answering calls from spectators below. Conversation in the craft, the two inventors told me when I interviewed them a few hours after their historic demonstrations, was as easy as conversation in an open automobile.
Three times, the blue plane blazed a steam trail into the air, taking off, landing, circling about, remaining aloft for 5 minutes at a time. The constant, wearing vibration of the gas engine was gone; the smooth push and pull of steam power had supplanted it. Each time, as the machine swooped down and the wheels touched, Besler pulled back a small lever at the side of the cockpit and the steam engine at the nose of the ship instantly raced in reverse, whirling the propeller backward to act as a powerful brake and reduce the landing run to a minimum.
This method of slowing down, possible only with steam power plants, applies the braking effect above the center of gravity and thus prevents nosing over in a quick stop. When wheel brakes are jammed on suddenly, a plane nose over or somersaults in a ground crash. Coming in at 50 miles an hour, the Beslers told me, the new steam plane can sit down and come to a stop in a field hardly 100 feet square.
The engine is a 2-cylinder, compound, double-acting, V-type power plant. Its high-pressure cylinder has a 3-inch bore and a 3-inch stroke; its low-pressure cylinder has 5 and a quarter inch bore and a 3-inch stroke.
Just behind the engine, the inventors showed me the barrel-shaped metal boiler which, with its super-efficient burner, explains why they have succeeded where others have failed in attempting to drive planes with a steam engine.
Using vaporized fuel oil, the patented burner releases as much as 3 million BTU per cubic foot of firebox space. This, they told me, is far in excess of anything hitherto attained. An electric blower drives this tremendous heat down among the flat spirals of a single 500-foot pipe coiled within the boiler. Three-eights of an inch thick, inside measurement, at the bottom, the pipe gradually increases in size until it has an inside diameter of five-eights of an inch at the top. The water supply to the coiled pipe is thermostatically controlled to keep the temperature constant regardless of pressure.
Under the fuselage nose is the condenser which looks like an ordinary radiator for a water-cooled motor and which is said to recover more than 90 percent of the water from the used steam. By using a steam-fed water pump, the inventors employ the exhaust vapor to preheat the feed water entering the boiler and thus decrease the time required to build up pressure within the coils.
The operation of the power plant, once it is started, is practically automatic. At the start of a flight, William Besler climbs into the cockpit and flips over a small switch. Instantly the electric blower goes into action, driving air mixed with oil spray through the burner. Here, an electric spark ignites the mixture and send a blowtorch of flame roaring downward around the coils of pipe. A few minutes later, steam pressure is high enough for the take-off. All the pilot has to do, from then on, is to operate the throttle and reverse lever.
At 800 degrees F, the steam pressure built up within the coils reaches 1500 lbs. With a 1200 lb pressure, the engine will deliver 150 horsepower, whirling the propeller at 1625 rpm. Tests have shown that 10 gallons of water is sufficient for a flight of 400 miles. By increasing the size and efficiency of the condenser, the experimenters told me, they believe they can make this amount of water last indefinitely.
As news of their sensational flights flashed to all parts of the country, eager interest was aroused among aeronautical authorities. The prospect of steam planes on the skyways opens up fascinating possibilities.
Burning fuel oil so non-explosive that it merely smolders if struck by the flame of a blowtorch, the new power plant eliminates the menace of fire. In addition, the Beslers told me, enough fuel oil for a 100-mile trip can be bought for 40 cents.
Because, above 1000 feet, steam-driven planes would be as silent as soaring birds, they would have particular value in military work. Noiseless warplanes have long been sought. But muffling gasoline engines reduces their power to such an extent that the plan is impractical. The new power plant, silent by nature, would permit long-distance raids above the clouds by ghost ships giving off no telltale drone of motors to warn the enemy or to aid in directing anti-aircraft fire.
Most spectacular of all are the possibilities of steam on the airways of the stratosphere. In the thin atmosphere of this region, 10 miles or more above the surface of the earth, experts agree, the high-speed transport ships of the future will fly. Here there are no clouds, no storms, and the steady trade winds of the upper blue will increase the speed of long distance passenger, mail, and freight machines…
http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps1.jpghttp://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps2.jpg

http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps3.jpg

http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps4.jpghttp://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps5.jpg
http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/ps6.jpg

Scientific American ( September 1933 )
A Steam Driven Airplane Engine
By A. K.
Two brothers, William J and George Besler recently installed a reciprocating steam engine in a conventional Travelair biplane, and a number of successful flights have been made at the Oakland, CA airport. The power plant is illustrated in these columns by photographs and a diagram. As the engine was really an old automobile engine, the airplane came out 300 lbs overweight, but it is expected that savings in weight will be readily made later.
The Besler brothers’ steam engine is a two-cylinder double-acting, compound 90-degree V engine, with a cut off at about 50 percent of the stroke. The high pressure cylinder has a bore of 4-1/4 inches and a stroke of 3 inches. The low pressure cylinder has the same stroke, but a 5 inch bore. The ordinary working pressure is 950 psi, and the temperature of the steam is 750 degrees F. The engine not only drives the propeller but also drives a blower through an over-running clutch. The blower (an electric motor used when starting) supplies air to a Venturi in which the fuel lines terminate. The Venturi leads the mixture to a fire box, where an ignition plug sets the mixture aflame. Once ignition has been started, the process of combustion is continuous.
The steam generator is of a modified flash type. The tubing is continuous in length, about 500 ft in total length; the coils are covered with metallic wool insulation and sheet aluminum. A pop valve is set to give relief at 1500 psi. A thermostatic normalizer device injects water into the superheater whenever the temperature goes over 750 degrees F. From the boiler the steam passes through a throttle to the engine proper, and then to two condensers --- one mounted at the top of the fuselage and one below. From the two radiators or condensers, the steam passes into the water tank, which is provided with a steam dome. From the water tank, a pump passes the water through a primary heater and then to a secondary heater. By preheating the water, some of the energy of the exhaust steam is put back into the system, ad thus the overall efficiency is improved. After passing through the heaters the water again goes back to the boiler, and the process is repeated over and over again.
In the tests the rapidity with which the boiler got up steam was remarkable. In 5 minutes the plane was ready to take the air. In the air, the absence of noise was remarkable. On landing a very interesting possibility of the steam engine was in evidence. As soon as the pilot landed he reversed the engine (reversing the engine is a simple matter on a reciprocating steam engine). With the propeller driven in the opposite direction, a powerful braking effect was obtained. Perfect control and smoothness of operation was noted throughout the test flights.
A great deal of the technical work on the Besler steam engine was done at the Boeing School of Aeronautics, and we are indebted to Mr Welwood Beall of this school for a first-hand account of the design.
http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/sa1.jpghttp://www.rexresearch.com/besler/sa2.jpg

Patents
Coil Spacer
CA451529
1948-09-28
Controlled Balance Flow of Parallel Boiler Circuits [ PDF (http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/us2293929.pdf) ]
US2293929
1942-08-25
http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/2293-1.jpghttp://www.rexresearch.com/besler/2293-2.jpg



Boiler Control System [ PDF (http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/besler1.pdf) ]
US2269705
1942-01-13

more patents at link
http://www.rexresearch.com/besler/beslerst.htm

[Serpo]

I don't doubt he made a steam-powered plane...it's just that it's not practical. The fuel & water needed to keep it aloft would give it a range in yards, not miles.


Tests have shown that 10 gallons of water is sufficient for a flight of 400 miles. ......

[Serpo]

Whats the good of something if the oil companies cant profit, and not to mention all those carbon credits, they would be useless also, the idea is frightening............

[crimethink]

Tests have shown that 10 gallons of water is sufficient for a flight of 400 miles.

Bullshit.

[Serpo]

Bullshit.


thats from the link , most people dont know much about steam powered planes.................

[crimethink]

thats from the link , most people dont know much about steam powered planes.................

But I know about steam engines.

[Serpo]

But I know about steam engines.

who knows.........

[Neuro]

But I know about steam engines.
It says 90% of the water is recovered through condensation of the steam, post engine. Further the steam pressure is very high and hot, which means a relatively small amount of water is needed to run the engine. As I understand it a steam engine if well constructed could have energy efficiency surpassing 50%, which means less fuel required compared with a gasoline powered equivalent. So why not?

[crimethink]

It says 90% of the water is recovered through condensation of the steam, post engine. Further the steam pressure is very high and hot, which means a relatively small amount of water is needed to run the engine. As I understand it a steam engine if well constructed could have energy efficiency surpassing 50%, which means less fuel required compared with a gasoline powered equivalent. So why not?

The fact it didn't take off (HA HA) is strong evidence the design was not sound. Similar reason diesel engines weren't widely successful in aircraft: power-to-weight ratio. Diesel engines worked fine for Zeppelins; I imagine steam might work for them, too. But fixed-wing, heavier-than-air?

[Neuro]

The fact it didn't take off (HA HA) is strong evidence the design was not sound. Similar reason diesel engines weren't widely successful in aircraft: power-to-weight ratio. Diesel engines worked fine for Zeppelins; I imagine steam might work for them, too. But fixed-wing, heavier-than-air?
This came in the dying throes of the steam era. Peoples minds where already set on steam being a technology of the past and gasoline was the future, you wouldn't be able to get investors in the 30's for steam technology. But yes steam engines with boilers are heavier power ratio wise.

[Neuro]

You are incorrect:

https://www.tampabay.com/resources/images/dti/rendered/2014/04/0420951413_13039156_8col.jpg

:D
Seems very energy efficient! ;D

[Serpo]

https://s3-eu5.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Fwww.pollutionissues.com% 2Fphotos%2Fnonaqueous-phase-liquids-napls-3602.jpg&sp=d81285db42978db568a9d68273853471

[brosil]

There was also a converted Piper in the 1950s. You still burn oil and it's about 30% less efficient than internal combustion. Diesel had more promise but had fuel problems above 10k feet and in the winter, of course. Pretty much every scheme has been tried at least once. There were even some alcohol-water engines used in WW1 for extreme high altitude bombers and interceptors.

[Neuro]

Here you can buy a 1:2 engine kit, that was designed for an airplane, for $295 +$22 shipping.
http://www.myersengines.com/engines/steam_aircraft_engine.htm
Machining is required and extra parts. I was in contact with them some years ago, but I never got a reply, maybe they thought it was too difficult shipping to Sweden...

[Neuro]

Here you can buy a 1:2 engine kit, that was designed for an airplane, for $295 +$22 shipping.
http://www.myersengines.com/engines/steam_aircraft_engine.htm
Machining is required and extra parts. I was in contact with them some years ago, but I never got a reply, maybe they thought it was too difficult shipping to Sweden...
From the link:
http://www.myersengines.com/images/Steam_Aviation_Engine_museum1.jpg
http://www.myersengines.com/images/Steam_Aviation_Engine_museum2.jpg
A 1:2 model should develop around 1/8th of the power, so just under 10hp. Was thinking of using this engine as a generator for a steam/electric hybrid car. The benefit would be you could use pretty much anything that burns as fuel...

[Ponce]

The wanabe Herr Hitler came back to this board to raise hell with one and all and not to post anything useful. He is specially dedicated to be against anything that "El Supremo" post.....he should take another vacation.

V

[crimethink]

not to post anything useful

How often do you "post anything useful"?

[Jewboo]

....he should take another vacation.




https://contentednessdotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/woman-smoking-cigar-in-cuba-2-by-tibor-vegh-u-s-dept-of-agriculture.jpg?w=640

HEY PONCE: Go back to Cuba. They have daily flights out of Miami now.

:rolleyes:

[ximmy]

Steam powered cellular phone...

http://recyclenation.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/04/8_stp-mob_1.jpg

[Ponce]

Jewboo? they don't want me back, I am to "Americanise", did try twice :) ........besides, now that my dad is dead there is no reason to go back, even for a vacation..........the only thing that I really, really, really, miss is the food yum yum yum, haven't had it in 18 years OUCHHHHHHHH.

To Herr Hitler........you post a lot.........but say nothing.

V

[crimethink]

To Herr Hitler........you post a lot.........but say nothing...


...my Marano eyes wish to see.

[Jewboo]

Jewboo? they don't want me back...



https://cs7059.vk.me/c624026/v624026404/39d05/F_fWqhXfww8.jpg

Castro would rather you parasite on our USA Social Security and Medicare than his food bank and clinics...lol.


:rolleyes: go home

[Ponce]

...my Marano eyes wish to see.

"You can only see what you know"........this guy walking on a hill sees a piece of glass on the ground and gave it a kick......it was a perfect white raw diamond with a value of $250,000, he lost it because he didn't know what he was looking at.

Jewboo? I earned my SS and I go to the VA hospital after serving, and doing a few things, for YOUR country.

V

[Shami-Amourae]

https://contentednessdotnet.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/woman-smoking-cigar-in-cuba-2-by-tibor-vegh-u-s-dept-of-agriculture.jpg?w=640

HEY PONCE: Go back to Cuba. They have daily flights out of Miami now.

:rolleyes:


He's got a Land Patent. Why would he give that up?
http://backcountrypost.com/addedsmilies/facepalm.gif

[Jewboo]

...but say nothing.



http://www.nbcnews.com/health/aging/drug-helps-one-worst-alzheimers-symptoms-agitation-n396616


A drug that combines a cough suppressant with a medication to fight heart arrhythmias might offer some peace for one of the most troubling symptoms of advanced Alzheimer's disease - agitation - researchers reported Wednesday.


:rolleyes: get some Ponce

[Jewboo]

Jewboo? I earned my SS and I go to the VA hospital after serving, and doing a few things, for YOUR country.




http://www.gannett-cdn.com/-mm-/c191c847a4f7fd4f0383ae3e229d7ba427390c32/c=0-0-1600-1200&r=x383&c=540x380/local/-/media/Wausau/2015/01/30/B9316030376Z.1_20150130172236_000_GPE9QOG73.1-0.jpg
Free hormone shots courtesy of the American Taxpayer for "disabled" Ponce.

[Ponce]

Jewboo?...thanks, good article, but the only problem is that tomorrow they will find that something else is the problem.....and that's why I take nothing, not even aspirin.......middle of next week I finally got an appointment to see a heart specialist to get a stress test....my problem is that I feel dizzy all the time, but not when I drive, the car and the road and I moves all over the place at the same time.

V

[monty]

"Besler dropped the project for unknown reasons . . . . . . ."




Doble Steam Car Co & Boeing School of Aeronautics, Oakland CA.

http://www.aerofiles.com/pix1.gif Besler (http://www.aerofiles.com/besler.jpg) [X4259] blowing off steam for take-off (poor quality clip from film)
http://www.aerofiles.com/pix1.gif Besler (http://www.aerofiles.com/besler-cloud.jpg) A much better shot of steam cumulus
http://www.aerofiles.com/pix1.gif Besler (http://www.aerofiles.com/besler-rig.jpg) The Beslers and the installation (enhanced clips from film)
http://www.aerofiles.com/cleardot.gif
1933 = Travel Air 2000 with 150hp 2-cylinder Besler V-2 steam engine (a converted switch-locomotive powerplant), totaled 650# with its accessories, liquids, and boiler! William Besler; ff: 4/12/33. Then the only airplane to fly under steam power [X4259], it flew about 30 minutes on 10 gallons of water; inexpensive fuel oil use for heating. Operation was so quiet that a crowd of spectators and newsmen on the ground could hear Beseler shout to them from 800'. Reversible prop rotation allowed the plane to back up. Advantages of the "Besler System" claimed at the time included elimination of audible noise and destructive vibration, greater efficiency at low engine speeds and also at high altitudes where lower air temperatures assisted condensation, reduced likelihood of engine failure, reduced maintenance and fuel costs—fuel oil was used in place of petrol, reduced fire hazard since the fuel was less volatile and operating temperatures were lower. and a lack of need for radio shielding. After flight tests, Besler dropped the project for unknown reasons, perhaps satisfied in merely proving his point. He also had a successful car so equippeed.


http://www.aerofiles.com/_ba.html

[Jewboo]

...my problem is that I feel dizzy all the time, but not when I drive, the car and the road and I moves all over the place at the same time.



http://www.sansonelaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/drunk-driving-bike-accident-crash-lawyer-missouri-and-illinois1.jpg

Don't worry about us gringos. You continue being Ponce.





:rolleyes: "If you can't see it you can't hit it." -Ponce

[Ponce]

I never do, Ponce will always be Ponce not matter what......hope to die as a Ponce hahahahahaah.

V

[Serpo]

"Besler dropped the project for unknown reasons . . . . . . ."


https://s3-eu5.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Fstatic4.businessinsider. com%2Fimage%2F52c2f1d16bb3f7ff52613ad0%2Fhow-to-respond-if-somebody-holds-a-gun-to-your-head.jpg&sp=18a377a127127e33f9bd1d4972533acb

[crimethink]

https://s3-eu5.ixquick.com/cgi-bin/serveimage?url=http:%2F%2Fstatic4.businessinsider. com%2Fimage%2F52c2f1d16bb3f7ff52613ad0%2Fhow-to-respond-if-somebody-holds-a-gun-to-your-head.jpg&sp=18a377a127127e33f9bd1d4972533acb

Almost certainly not...

It's not a like-steam powered aeroplane is harnessing Zero Point Energy.

[Serpo]

Almost certainly not...

It's not a like-steam powered aeroplane is harnessing Zero Point Energy.


Na , just water.................

[Dogman]

Na , just water.................

What is the heat source that makes the steam? How big is the boiler? Steam power requires a boiler of some kind , a reservoir of water or whatever liquid used, plus the fuel to heat and make the steam. Be it wood,coal, or whatever for external combustion. All together is massive weight!

Which is why internal combustion won out, no external boiler required.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[Neuro]

What is the heat source that makes the steam? How big is the boiler? Steam power requires a boiler of some kind , a reservoir of water or whatever liquid used, plus the fuel to heat and make the steam. Be it wood,coal, or whatever for external combustion. All together is massive weight!

Which is why internal combustion won out, no external boiler required.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner
Sure I agree, those are the things that tipped the balance in favour of the combustion engine a 100 years ago, plus you had standard oil, with the Rockefellers. Most business people wouldn't like to bet against them, not because they held a gun against their head, but simply because they were usually on the winning side, owning legislators etc. And steam was out. But it was developing, from the steam engine image we have from the railway era, to something smaller and more efficient. But investors were siding with the oil business at the time, because that was the future, and internal combustion and gasoline was the road ahead...

[Dogman]

Probably efficiently rules in the long run, and one reason or the reason that steam was abandoned for flight. Tho some ships and nuke subs plus rail (in some country's) still use steam powered engines as prime movers for transporting stuff and transportation.

Steam does still has major use as prime movers in utilities in other uses and areas, but mostly in fixed location's that can support them.

Most steam prime movers are now mostly turbines (power) not so many piston driven in use now, tho steam piston engines can deliver massive toque and use fuels that are not suitable for internal combustion.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Forum Runner

[crimethink]

Na , just water.................

The complete secrecy of steam power is still being suppressed! That's why UP 4014 is currently being restored:

http://www.up.com/aboutup/special_trains/steam/index.shtml

:rolleyes:

[crimethink]

More "suppressed" aviation technology:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttCDsyKFJzc

[Camp Bassfish]

Wax Wings Airline circa Ancient Greece

[ShortJohnSilver]

If the skeptics about steam power actually demonstrated they knew anything, it might be interesting to read their scoffing... when you consider that steam turbines are used in every nuke plant, you might start asking the right questions.

Here is a hint: a quarter cup of water, heated and going through a steam engine, was enough to move an entire train 1/4 mile.

[crimethink]

If the skeptics about steam power actually demonstrated they knew anything, it might be interesting to read their scoffing... when you consider that steam turbines are used in every nuke plant, you might start asking the right questions.

Here is a hint: a quarter cup of water, heated and going through a steam engine, was enough to move an entire train 1/4 mile.

You said something about "knowing anything"?

http://www.air-and-space.com/20111115%20UP%20844/20111115%20UP%20844_0539%20Coolidge%20Union%20Paci fic%20Centipede%20Tender%20right%20rear%20m.jpg

If what you say were true, one cup per mile, they'd need a barrel, not a tender, for the water.