Confusion

[palani]

Confusion by definition (mine) is trying to operate a COUNTRY with the rules of a FEDERATION.

The U.S. has never been a COUNTRY. Prior to the 14th amendment the U.S. was not a COUNTRY. Under the organic constitution the U.S. was a FEDERATION. After the 14th amendment there is suddenly nunc pro tunc (a begining which began in 1868 and not before) a COUNTRY called the United States where one did not exist before (E Pluribus Unum ... FROM MANY ONE). Since the 14th amendment actually CREATED this COUNTRY (a.k.a. The United States) then the 14th amendment is the CONSTITUTION of said COUNTRY. Q.E.D.

The organic constitution exist as the rules by which a federation is operated. The 14th amendment (with many fewer restrictions) is the constitution by which a COUNTRY operates.

Why else would there be a DUE PROCESS clause in both the organic constitution and the 14th amendment?

[Dogman]

Humm?

Fishing for one of these ?

Or another species ?

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7762&stc=1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trumpetfish

;D
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trumpetfish)

[Ponce]

Glad to see that I am not the only foreigner in this coutry hahahahahahah.........

V

[7th trump]

Confusion by definition (mine) is trying to operate a COUNTRY with the rules of a FEDERATION.

The U.S. has never been a COUNTRY. Prior to the 14th amendment the U.S. was not a COUNTRY. Under the organic constitution the U.S. was a FEDERATION. After the 14th amendment there is suddenly nunc pro tunc (a begining which began in 1868 and not before) a COUNTRY called the United States where one did not exist before (E Pluribus Unum ... FROM MANY ONE). Since the 14th amendment actually CREATED this COUNTRY (a.k.a. The United States) then the 14th amendment is the CONSTITUTION of said COUNTRY. Q.E.D.

The organic constitution exist as the rules by which a federation is operated. The 14th amendment (with many fewer restrictions) is the constitution by which a COUNTRY operates.

Why else would there be a DUE PROCESS clause in both the organic constitution and the 14th amendment?

There's two Due Process laws because there's two separate citizenship's.
"We the People" (state citizens) is one citizenship holding certain protections under the Bill of Rights.

The other citizenship eminates from the 14th amendment...."US citizens" who dont have much, if any, protections under the Bill of Rights.

Why do you think there is the Bill of Rights and then the Civil Rights Act of 1866?

Why do you sew confusion Palani?

Theres plenty of Court cites explaining this and few websites that go over this with detail.

[palani]

There's two Due Process laws because there's two separate citizenship's.

Duhhhhh!!!

So you are suggesting that prior to 1868 (when there was merely a SINGULAR) due process clause that there was one ONE type of citizenship? And would that SINGULAR citizenship be to one's country or to the FEDERATION?

Think carefully on this topic because your point supports my position.

[7th trump]

Duhhhhh!!!

So you are suggesting that prior to 1868 (when there was merely a SINGULAR) due process clause that there was one ONE type of citizenship? And would that SINGULAR citizenship be to one's country or to the FEDERATION?

Think carefully on this topic because your point supports my position.

Making a mountain out of an ant hill Palani...thats all you're doing.


It would be to their state which is a country....why do you think each state has a capital and its own Constitution........DUHHHHH!

[ximmy]

Duhhhhh!!!



DUHHHHH!

Please do not plagiarize other users retorts.
Thank you for your thoughtful consideration.

[Ponce]

Posted by Ponce...........DAHHHHHHHHHHHHH.........Spanish for the English........DUHHHHHHHHHHHH. HAHAHHAAHAHAAHAH

V

[7th trump]

Please do not plagiarize other users retorts.
Thank you for your thoughtful consideration.

I told you ximmy....I will not date you.

[ximmy]

I told you ximmy....I will not date you.


Nice try...
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VCTBJqEIdyc/UlRa_uH-pJI/AAAAAAAAKU0/u_xS55umEtA/s1600/reverse+psychology+parenting.jpg

[Hitch]

I told you ximmy....I will not date you.

Come on...you two bicker like an old married couple.

Face it, you have an internet forum "marriage". Maybe you should do something nice for your wife ximmy for a change. She's probably feeling neglected.

For the record, this post is on topic. You are both confused!

[palani]

would that SINGULAR citizenship be to one's country or to the FEDERATION?


It would be to their state which is a country....why do you think each state has a capital and its own Constitution.
See .. now this is progress. You agree there was a singular citizenship prior to 1868 and dual citizenship following. The extra citizenship did not exist prior to 1868. And you agree that this singular citizenship was to a country NOT the United States but to each state which has a capital and its' own constitution.

So (small baby step here for the mentally challenged) now where is the capital and constitution for this NEW 1868 citizenship? Remember that the constitution for the FEDERATION is NOT the same as the constitution for the new country formed in 1868. Why would the constitution of a federation be considered of any use to any politician planning on running a country?

My observation is that the 14th amendment is the sole constitution all wrapped up in as few words as possible for this 2nd class of citizenship and the quasi-country it is connected to. Forget what went on before because THAT constitution is for a FEDERATION of INDEPENDENT COUNTRIES.

See ... that wasn't so hard now was it? Now have your mommy bring you a glass of warm milk and get ready for nappy time again.

[7th trump]

Come on...you two bicker like an old married couple.

Face it, you have an internet forum "marriage". Maybe you should do something nice for your wife ximmy for a change. She's probably feeling neglected.

For the record, this post is on topic. You are both confused!

Hahahaha....you're awesome Hitch!
And I truly mean that.

Lmao!

[7th trump]

See .. now this is progress. You agree there was a singular citizenship prior to 1868 and dual citizenship following. The extra citizenship did not exist prior to 1868. And you agree that this singular citizenship was to a country NOT the United States but to each state which has a capital and its' own constitution.

So (small baby step here for the mentally challenged) now where is the capital and constitution for this NEW 1868 citizenship? Remember that the constitution for the FEDERATION is NOT the same as the constitution for the new country formed in 1868. Why would the constitution of a federation be considered of any use to any politician planning on running a country?

My observation is that the 14th amendment is the sole constitution all wrapped up in as few words as possible for this 2nd class of citizenship and the quasi-country it is connected to. Forget what went on before because THAT constitution is for a FEDERATION of INDEPENDENT COUNTRIES.

See ... that wasn't so hard now was it? Now have your mommy bring you a glass of warm milk and get ready for nappy time again.

That is hillarious Palani.....but you forget ....I've been saying this for years now. I'm not the one who goes off on wild goose chases about stupid conspiracy theories like you. You're all over the board with all your conspiracy bullshit. Every now and then you might say something that makes a little sesne.
I think its you who just now coming to this conclusion.

And no the US is not a single country....its still a federaltion of 50 union states. Where you get all confused is you think just because theres two classes of citizenships then there must no longer be the original union 50 states. If that was true then there wouldnt be 50 capitals and 50 constitutions to each country state.
You have federal personnel (5usc 552a (13)) confused with being a country...its not that way.

Your other problem is you do not look for the truth in law....you are looking for conspiracy within the law.

You are "0" in providing any evidence of a conspiracy. You'd think after beating a dead horse for years you'd come to the conclusion that its simply..............dead!

[palani]

You'd think after beating a dead horse for years you'd come to the conclusion that its simply..............dead!

If you think I am going to give up my claim to $5 in lawful money based upon the 1862 civil war note I hold just because the U.S. won't honor it you are mightily mistaken.

As long as I have a claim the U.S. is going to exist as the debtor.

I can see that the federal U.S. is dead from your perspective.

YOU LACK A CLAIM AND HAVE NO POSITION FOR WHICH RELIEF MAY BE GRANTED!!!

[7th trump]

If you think I am going to give up my claim to $5 in lawful money based upon the 1862 civil war note I hold just because the U.S. won't honor it you are mightily mistaken.

As long as I have a claim the U.S. is going to exist as the debtor.

I can see that the federal U.S. is dead from your perspective.

YOU LACK A CLAIM AND HAVE NO POSITION FOR WHICH RELIEF MAY BE GRANTED!!!

Hahahahaha......take your meds Palani....or stop taking them?

Ummm Palani...............you dont have a claim.

Lawful money huh?
Always injecting conspiracy or one of your fallacies into the truth. Theres no such thing as lawful money and the courts have repeatedly cited this.
You're so far lost in the law I doubt you yourself even understands what it is you are talking about.


My only claim in this thread is that I've been saying, for years now, theres two citizenships and they are differentiated by knowing what "RIGHTS" (some are mere privileges) they can access.
You ...all you do is jump from one fallacy to another and never ever have you answered one (1) question asked of you from anyone on this site thats read your bullshit.

[palani]

you dont have a claim.
Are you suggesting I don't have an 1862 civil war era U.S. note?


my only claim in this thread is that I've been saying, for years now, theres two citizenships and they are differentiated by knowing what "RIGHTS" (some are mere privileges) they can access.
Citizenship is not about rights so much as it is about countries and obligations, trusts and fiduciaries. You have blinders on. You merely see the beneficiary side and call everything else CONSPIRACY.

What a loonie!!!!

[Spectrism]

I happen to enjoy teaching although I am not a teacher by profession. I will sometimes use a riddle or lead a student down a winding path to teach a good lesson. But someone who only talks in riddles and uses bits of facts or ideas to torment others is not a teacher in any way. I find such people arrogant, ignorant and loathsome.

[Dogman]

This just has to be both of you guys plank on the wall....

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=7765&stc=1

Get a room ! ;D

[palani]

I find such people arrogant, ignorant and loathsome.

What is it you wish to be taught?

My point in this thread is that a country governed by a constitution intended for a federation is doomed to confusion.

Has this point escaped your notice? Is this point too obscure or not clearly stated in the OP?

Maybe if you opened your mind you would discover a teachable moment. Otherwise thanks for your input but you have stated nothing other than that you have an obtuse nature.

[Hitch]

Maybe if you opened your mind you would discover a teachable moment. Otherwise thanks for your input but you have stated nothing other than that you have an obtuse nature.

He basically stating that people are different, and learn differently. Personally, I hate to say this, but I can barely learn anything from you. Riddles don't work with me either. Answering questions with questions doesn't work as well. My brain follows logic and the big picture. If I can't put all the pieces together to form the process, I'm not getting it. I learn from guys like Ron Paul, Kyle Bass as well. They lay out a point, put all the pieces together so folks like me can understand that point.

[palani]

He basically stating that people are different, and learn differently. Personally, I hate to say this, but I can barely learn anything from you. Riddles don't work with me either. Answering questions with questions doesn't work as well. My brain follows logic and the big picture. If I can't put all the pieces together to form the process, I'm not getting it. I learn from guys like Ron Paul, Kyle Bass as well. They lay out a point, put all the pieces together so folks like me can understand that point.
You stated a position clearly and politely. He didn't.

Frankly my intention is not to teach anything. I generally use logic and rhetoric to connect bits of history that have assumed the character of fact. In the process I might put a different spin on these ideas than others might have conceived. The process is more of informing than teaching. Teaching is about absolutes. An expert teaches on the topic he is an expert on. The things I look at have had professionals crafting and spinning for their own reasons. My goals being different than theirs makes my spin produce different observations and conclusions.

[Spectrism]

You stated a position clearly and politely. He didn't.

Frankly my intention is not to teach anything. I generally use logic and rhetoric to connect bits of history that have assumed the character of fact. In the process I might put a different spin on these ideas than others might have conceived. The process is more of informing than teaching. Teaching is about absolutes. An expert teaches on the topic he is an expert on. The things I look at have had professionals crafting and spinning for their own reasons. My goals being different than theirs makes my spin produce different observations and conclusions.

Your words require constant and detailed parsing.


Frankly my intention is not to teach anything.
And you have been quite successful.


An expert teaches on the topic he is an expert on.
So you admit you lack expertise, so much so, that you cannot teach or be a teacher. Yet, you still talk.


Teaching is about absolutes.
You cannot offer absolutes, yet you demand everyone else to provide absolutes.

[palani]

Your words require constant and detailed parsing.


And you have been quite successful.


So you admit you lack expertise, so much so, that you cannot teach or be a teacher. Yet, you still talk.


You cannot offer absolutes, yet you demand everyone else to provide absolutes.

There you go with the negative attacks, Moriarty.

I can only return what I am sent. I match negative for negative and positive for positive.

You on the other hand receive positives and return with negatives.

Your chi is unbalanced and this will eventually cause you problems if it hasn't already.

[Spectrism]

There you go with the negative attacks, Moriarty.

I can only return what I am sent. I match negative for negative and positive for positive.

You on the other hand receive positives and return with negatives.

Your chi is unbalanced and this will eventually cause you problems if it hasn't already.

LOL... you crack me up. I call you out on your
bullshat and that is the best answer you can come up with?

[palani]

that is the best answer you can come up with?
Root cause, Moriarty. Root cause.