Cheating

[palani]

Consider VW and their TDI diesel scandal.

Now the EPA designs a test. They put the front wheels of the vehicle on a set of rollers and leave the back wheels stationary. They run the vehicle at a certain MPH and check at the exhaust for emissions and compare these emissions against some standard. That is the test.

According to news reports VW writes software to pass this specific test. They sense the lack of motion of the back wheels and the software then presumes this is an emissions test and changes key operating characteristics to minimize these emissions (principally nitrous oxide).

Media is condemning VW because they 'cheated'. How so? They designed a system that meets emission standards when two wheels are rotating. If the EPA wanted to regulate emissions when all four wheels were turning wouldn't their test have incorporated four rotating wheels instead of just two?

My opinion? There was no cheating involved. The German's examined the test and figured out how to ace it and still produce something that gives them a sales advantage. If there is a failure it is in the test rather than in the product that can successfully pass the test. Applying concepts of morality to a corporation is sort of like asking a politician to tell the truth.

Rather than the CEO of VW resigning the director of the EPA should be placed on trial for incompetence.

[7th trump]

Consider VW and their TDI diesel scandal.

Now the EPA designs a test. They put the front wheels of the vehicle on a set of rollers and leave the back wheels stationary. They run the vehicle at a certain MPH and check at the exhaust for emissions and compare these emissions against some standard. That is the test.

According to news reports VW writes software to pass this specific test. They sense the lack of motion of the back wheels and the software then presumes this is an emissions test and changes key operating characteristics to minimize these emissions (principally nitrous oxide).

Media is condemning VW because they 'cheated'. How so? They designed a system that meets emission standards when two wheels are rotating. If the EPA wanted to regulate emissions when all four wheels were turning wouldn't their test have incorporated four rotating wheels instead of just two?

My opinion? There was no cheating involved. The German's examined the test and figured out how to ace it and still produce something that gives them a sales advantage. If there is a failure it is in the test rather than in the product that can successfully pass the test. Applying concepts of morality to a corporation is sort of like asking a politician to tell the truth.

Rather than the CEO of VW resigning the director of the EPA should be placed on trial for incompetence.

Wow........a very good and logical post. Couldnt agree with you more Palani.

[Silver Rocket Bitches!]

Rest assured there are other car companies doing this. The difference is, they are playing the game so the authorities look the other way.

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2015/09/GM%20vs%20VOW_0.jpg

[ShortJohnSilver]

It is a simplistic explanation of what happened - however, your point is excellent and it still stands.

One thing I would point out - European safety standards are different but overall, about as strict as American standards. So, why is it that any vehicle sold either in America or EU can't be bought by an individual and shipped directly to their home?

The purpose of regulation is actually to protect the incumbent car manufacturers and allow them to create a "walled garden" of customers in each area.

The car manufacturer gets all the benefits of globalization - the customer, gets none.

[gunDriller]

Rather than the CEO of VW resigning the director of the EPA should be placed on trial for incompetence.


it's not incompetence, it's look-the-other-way/ revolving-door-ness.

Because the revolving door involves the interchange of employees between corporate and government offices, it is a more complex version of what Mussolini characterized as Fascism.


expect their colleagues at the Justice Department to put them on trial ?

if they need a show trial and a scapegoat.


the VW CEO appeared marked for that.

although he does seem to be making out quite well with that golden parachute.

[palani]

Did they or did they not pass the EPA test?

Did they or did they not inform their customer(s) that they passed the EPA test?

Are they required to inform their customer that the EPA test was flawed? Isn't such a question in the realm of OPINION?

Is VW required to inform their customer(s) of their OPINION?

Is VW's understanding of the INTENT of the EPA testing required?

Were VW's engineers ever NOTICED by the EPA of the INTENT of the testing?

Is the NOTICE of the INTENT part of the testing procedure?

[mick silver]

EPA to change diesel tests to thwart VW-like cheatinghttps://media.zenfs.com/creatr-images/GLB/2015-04-20/94e89b90-e7b0-11e4-9ea9-23e8763fec68_Associated-Press.png (http://www.ap.org/) By MATTHEW DALY and TOM KRISHER 2 hours ago




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WASHINGTON (AP) — The Environmental Protection Agency said Friday that it will launch sweeping changes to the way it tests for diesel emissions after getting duped by clandestine software in Volkswagen cars for seven years.
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EPA says VW intentionally violates clean air standards (http://news.yahoo.com/epa-says-vw-intentionally-violates-clean-air-standards-164220122.html) Associated Press
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EPA, Foreign Regulators Crack Down on Emissions Over Cheating Revelation (http://www.wsj.com/articles/epa-to-overhaul-air-emissions-testing-in-wake-of-volkswagen-cheating-revelation-1443187913?ru=yahoo?mod=yahoo_itp) The Wall Street Journal
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In a letter to car manufacturers, the EPA said it will add on-road testing to its regimen, "using driving cycles and conditions that may reasonably be expected to be encountered in normal operation and use, for the purposes of investigating a potential defeat device" similar to the one used by Volkswagen.
The testing would be in addition to the standard emissions test cycles already in place, the EPA said.
VW's sophisticated software allowed its cars to pass tests in the lab and then spew pollution into the atmosphere while on the highway. The changes announced Friday are designed to detect software and other methods automakers might use to rig a test.
"We're actually making sure that this is a one-off," EPA Administrator Gina McCarthy said Friday.
The agency is going to "look at all of the other models aggressively and do the testing we need to make sure there aren't any hidden software devices or other ways they could defeat the emission system," McCarthy said.
The revelations about VW led to unwanted scrutiny for the EPA. Its testing procedures have been criticized for being predictable and outdated, making it relatively easy for VW to cheat.
EPA did not initially uncover the problem; researchers at West Virginia University did, using on-road testing that EPA did not.
Sen. Bill Nelson, D-Fla., said he was frustrated that regulatory agencies such as the EPA are failing to protect the public. "Seven years is way too long a time that the EPA has been asleep at the switch," he said.
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(http://news.yahoo.com/photos/grille-volkswagen-decorated-iconic-company-logo-lot-vw-photo-071943866.html)The grille of a Volkswagen is decorated with the iconic company logo at on the lot of a VW dealershi …

The VW case has similarities to those involving General Motors ' defective ignition switches and Takata Corp.'s exploding air bag inflators, where it also took years before those problems were disclosed to consumers, Nelson said.
"When there is this kind of deception, we've got to get these agencies to be able to cut through it and catch it," he said.
Chris Grundler, head of the EPA's office of transportation and air quality, defended the agency's testing procedures, noting that passenger vehicles with diesel engines account for far less than 1 percent of overall vehicle emissions of nitrogen oxides and other pollutants.
"It's not a question of equipment or technology or capability. It's a question of where we deploy those resources," Grundler told reporters Friday.
The EPA has conducted on-road testing on heavy duty trucks, rather than passenger cars, "because that's where the emissions are," he said. The additional testing announced Friday is part of a "continuous evolution of our oversight" of new and used cars and trucks, Grundler said.
VW has admitted to installing so-called defeat devices on Volkswagen and Audi cars with four-cylinder diesel engines. The devices switch on pollution controls when the cars are being tested, but turn off the controls when the software determines that the cars are back on real roads. The EPA says about 500,000 U.S. cars including the Jetta, Golf, Beetle, Passat and Audi A3 have the cheating software, and VW says a total of 11 million cars have it worldwide.
VW was able to fool the EPA because the agency only tested the cars on treadmill-like devices called dynamometers and didn't use portable test equipment on real roads. The software in the cars' engine-control computers checked the speed, steering wheel position, air pressure and other factors to determine when dynamometer tests were under way. It then turned on pollution controls that reduced the output of nitrogen oxides that contribute to smog and other pollution, the EPA has said.
VW started the scheme with the 2009 model year, and may not have been caught without testing performed at West Virginia University on behalf of the International Council on Clean Transportation, a nonprofit group that advises governments on regulations. EPA and California regulators confronted VW with those findings to VW in May 2014. The automaker eventually did a recall late last year, without much improvement, the EPA says.
Only when the EPA and the California Air Resources Board refused to approve VW's 2016 diesel models for sale did the company admit earlier this month what it had done.
The EPA said the cars are safe to drive but VW will have to pay to recall and fix them. VW also faces billions in fines.
The European Union became aware in 2010 that lab testing was not as accurate as on-road tests might be. In the case of carbon dioxide emissions tests — not nitrogen oxide — the discrepancy was as much as 20 percent.
The EU will introduce new tests from next year, with on-road testing complementing the laboratory work that is currently being done. Lab tests will also be refined to try to reduce the margin of error.
It's not the first time the EPA has had to change testing to make sure automakers are playing by the rules. Earlier this year the agency updated gas mileage tests after some automakers were caught with inflated window sticker estimates.
Grundler disputes the notion that EPA would never have caught VW without the outside help. European regulators were looking into VW's on-road diesel emissions as far back as 2012, and since diesels make up half the cars there, the EPA decided to let Europe take the lead, he says.
"I don't think it's fair to say that this would never have been uncovered," he says. "Do I wish we had uncovered it sooner? Absolutely."
____
Krisher reported from Detroit. Lorne Cooks in Brussels contributed to this report.


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[mick silver]

comment ...........The EPA is a terrorist organization with its primary goal to bankrupt America.

[govcheetos]

Good example of thinking outside the box.