ATF...,No more rounds for AK 47 will be made........... V

[Ponce]

Judge = OK............... told that to my gun dealer and he is ready to ORDERRRRRRRR, giving me a nice present.

Ribs feeling better but still dizzy........

V

[Joshua01]

Judge = OK............... told that to my gun dealer and he is ready to ORDERRRRRRRR, giving me a nice present.

Ribs feeling better but still dizzy........

V

Good to hear ponce and welcome back!

[osoab]

Judge upholds ATF's decision banning ammo designed for AK-47 (http://www.baynews9.com/content/news/baynews9/news/article.html/content/news/articles/ap/2016/08/10/Judge_upholds_ATF_s_decision_banning_ammo_designed _for_AK_47.html)



A federal judge on Wednesday upheld a decision by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to ban ammunition originally designed for AK-47 assault rifles.

The decision by U.S. District Judge John C. Coughenour in Seattle came in a lawsuit brought by a Redmond-based arms importer, P.W. Arms Inc., which obtained ATF permits to import more than 100 million rounds of the Russian-made ammunition, known as 7N6.

The company said in its lawsuit that in mid-2013 it successfully imported nearly 38 million rounds for civilian resale, but that in early 2014, the ATF halted further shipments as they arrived in Norfolk, Virginia. The agency tested the bullets to confirm they were armor-piercing and barred their importation for resale, a decision the company said cost it $3 million.

"The administrative record contains no evidence that 7N6 was ever used to kill or injure a police officer," the company's lawsuit said. "In fact, before ATF banned 7N6, this ammunition was used lawfully by sportsmen as rifle ammunition for target shooting."

The company challenged the ATF's decision as arbitrary, saying officials misinterpreted the definition of armor-piercing bullets under federal law.

Coughenour disagreed. The bullets contain a steel core and can be fired from a handgun, and thus classify as armor-piercing even if the handguns that can fire them are uncommon, Coughenour said.

"As defendants aptly point out, plaintiff never argues that the 7N6 bullets do not have the capacity to pierce body armor, highlighting the disingenuous nature of plaintiff's claim," the judge wrote.

In its applications to import the bullets, P.W. Arms failed to disclose that the bullets were armor-piercing, the ATF said.

Internal agency emails provided during litigation also noted that this wasn't the first time P.W. Arms had come to its attention. In 2003, federal agents seized nearly 8,000 machine-gun kits that P.W. Arms had imported from Chile; the disassembled weapons, which the company was selling with a 20-round magazine and bayonet for $250 apiece, were fully automatic, according to a search warrant filed at the time.

P.W. Arms President Stacy Prineas did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment Wednesday, nor did the company's lawyers at the Seattle firm of McKay Chadwell.

[Ares]

Looks like the government is lying................. AGAIN

CBP: We Never Asked the ATF to Reclassify 7N6 5.45×39 Ammo

On April 7th of last year the ATF reclassified the cheap and widely available 7N6 5.45×39 ammunition as “armor piercing” and banned it from importation (https://www.atf.gov/news/pr/test-examination-and-classification-7n6-545x39-ammunition). This was widely seen by the gun community as another blatant attempt to make it as expensive and onerous as possible to exercise our Second Amendment rights. The ammunition in question isn’t generally used in crimes and even less frequently used against cops (the rounds were, of course, labeled “cop killer bullets” in the media). The stated impetus for this reclassification? According to the ATF, the U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency (CBP) asked them to check it out. But according to a recently returned FOIA request, CBP never did that . . .

From the ATF’s statement on the reclassification:

On March 5, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) received a request from the U.S. Customs and Border Protection agency (CBP) to conduct a test, examination and classification of Russian-made 7N6 5.45×39 ammunition for purposes of determining whether it is considered “armor piercing ammunition” as defined by the Gun Control Act (GCA), as amended.

Given that they explicitly state the source of this “tip” as the CBP, you would expect that the CBP would have some sort of record that they made the request. An email would do (although the Obama administration doesn’t have a good track record with emails). Something in some format should exist if a request actually originated with CBP as the ATF claims.

One person, however, decided to take it upon himself to see what was really going on. He filed a FOIA request to CBP, demanding that CBP hand over any documentation that proved this communication happened. The response came yesterday: there is no record of such a conversation or such a tip ever happening.

From a Reddit thread:

This is a final response to your Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request to U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP). We conducted a comprehensive search of files within the CBP databases for records that would be responsive to your request. Unfortunately, we were unable to locate or identify any responsive records, based upon the information you provided in your request. You have the right to appeal this determination that no records exist within CBP that would be responsive to your request. Should you wish to do so, you must send your appeal and a copy of this letter, within 60 days of the date of this letter, to: FOIA Appeals, Policy and Litigation Branch, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, 90 K Street, NE, 10th Floor Washington, DC 20229-1177, following the procedures outlined in the DHS FOIA regulations at Title 6 C.F.R. 5.9. Your envelope and letter should be marked “FOIA Appeal.” Copies of the FOIA and DHS regulations are available at www.dhs.gov/foia. Please notate file number CBP-2014-020969 on any future correspondence to CBP related to this request.

To be completely accurate, this simply means that there is no record (that CBP can find) of such a conversation happening. It’s entirely possible that the head of CBP was drunk at a party with the head of the ATF and, after many Pabst Blue Ribbons, mentioned the ammo and asked an ATF buddy to look into it. It’s equally possible that CBP is too lazy to do a proper search and the evidence exists, but they can’t be bothered to find it.

Another more interesting possibility: CBP never made the request at all. The request came from somewhere else, and the ATF used CBP as cover so they could plausibly say that the idea didn’t originate from a political figure (like, say, the Attorney General or the President, both of whom see gun ownership as a disease). It would be absolutely lovely to catch the ATF in yet another cover-up.

Another FOIA request is on its way. We’ll see what happens.

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2015/09/foghorn/cbp-we-never-asked-the-atf-to-reclassify-7n6-5-45x39-ammo/

[Joshua01]

Let them ban whatever they want....I got mine

[hoarder]

Let them ban whatever they want....I got mineHooray for me, fuck everybody else.

[Ponce]

simply use the regular ones for practice and the "GOOD" ones for when needed, you will need them.

V

[Shami-Amourae]

The 5.45×39mm or 7n6 is used for the AK-74, not the AK-47 or AKM.

[Cebu_4_2]

Doesn't anyone read?

To be completely accurate, this simply means that there is no record (that CBP can find) of such a conversation happening. It’s entirely possible that the head of CBP was drunk at a party with the head of the ATF and, after many Pabst Blue Ribbons, mentioned the ammo and asked an ATF buddy to look into it. It’s equally possible that CBP is too lazy to do a proper search and the evidence exists, but they can’t be bothered to find it.

[crimethink]

To clarify, this affects AK rounds that are steel-core being imported into the United States.

It is not a ban on 5.45x39mm (or 7.62x39mm) rounds being manufactured, sold or possessed. And, at least for now, not for non-steel-core being imported from Russia, etc., as well (e.g., Wolf or Bear ammo).

The BATF "argument" is that steel-core 5.45x39mm rounds can be used in a "pistol" [specifically, the almost non-existent Polish wz. 89 Onyks carbine "pistol" (sic)], and are, therefore, "illegal." This is based on the woefully-anti-constitutional "Gun Control Act" of 1968.

https://www.atf.gov/news/pr/test-examination-and-classification-7n6-545x39-ammunition

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FB_Onyks

[Twisted Titan]

Hooray for me, fuck everybody else.

Don't blame me because I took my head outta my ass long enough to see the writing on the wall and took appropriate action.

[milehi]

"If you don't hold it, you don't own it".

"Buy it cheap and stack it deep".

Both should've been beat into your head long ago

[Ponce]

"If you don't hold it, you don't own it".

"Buy it cheap and stack it deep".

Both should've been beat into your head long ago

But............ "To be ready is not".....there is always something else to do.

V