The Norwegian Experiment

[singular_me]

... germans confiscated all the livestock and norwegians were forced into a plant based diet... guess what, circulatory diseases took a dive.

2oz worth of meat daily is the maximum intake the body will handle... how about eating more plants containing essential amino acid then? When diet is not conscious, we suffer needlessly. Most people link milk and calcium while calcium is found in vegetables too. Same with meat. The situation is so bad that we destroy the environment to farm livestock. livestock worldwide eats as much grain to feed 8 billion people. Where is this going to stop???

Eating animal related food is stimulating diseases like cancer and heart attacks. And all the processed/sugary foods didnt exist back then.
https://www.drcarney.com/images/easyblog_shared/b2ap3_large_Norway-World-War-II.JPG


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JpgzQmqZLnQ

Essential Amino Acids and the Plant-foods​ ​
LIST of ​Essential Amino Acids and the Plant-Based Foods That Contain Them. For a balanced diet
ps: no data is 100% correct, I would definitely remove "soy" and wheat (gluten) from the list
http://alternativehealthatlanta.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/essential-amino-acids-in-plant-based-foods1.pdf

[woodman]

Try surviving a cold winter eating vegetables, You will die. Maybe if you are lucky, you have some grains stashed. You will still be very unhealthy. Man has survived for untold millennia eating nothing but meat during winters that lasted much longer than they do now. If you were an ice age hunter, a good kill like a mammoth could feed you and yours and keep you very healthy all winter long. I am sure any sensible creature like an intelligent hunter would supplement with herbs when and where available but meat is the thing to have.

[chad]

i would suggest that carbohydrates and sugar are the main culprits. when the germans forced everyone on a plant based diet, i suspect cakes, sugar coffees, chocolate, piles of bread, etc. went away as well. it wasn't the meat, it was the lifestyle associated with eating meat that was to blame.

[Joshua01]

It's all in the genes my friend. Many people can't process animal fats effectively which causes blood LDL cholesterol and triglyceride levels to rise and HDL levels to drop which inevitably leads to coronary artery disease! Many more have genes which do a much better job of processing animal (saturated) fats.

Animal fat doesn't cause coronary artery disease, it simply hastens the disease in those most prone to it

[ziero0]

Years ago when I skiied Lillihammer lift tickets were twenty bucks and a hamburger cost eight. Surprisingly it had a slight fishy flavor. Not pure hamburger but I expect had some herring blended in (hamburger helper?).

If you do some research you will find the reason the British were not starved into submission during WWII was the rhubarb industry. This explains both the British culinary experience and their appalling lack of humor sense.

[crimethink]

Yet more of the half-wit "science" from Goldissima we've come to know and love! :rolleyes:

CALORIC RESTRICTION - not reduction of consumption of meat - is what led to a decline in diet-oriented mortality in Norway. Rationing for adult males was down to 1300 calories or below per day at the height of the war (2000-2500 is about right for a sedentary/low-activity male; active combat soldiers and hard-working people, 4500-5000 calories per day).

Humans are self-evidently designed to be omnivores...plant and animal...our teeth demonstrate it. But rich foods in moderation only.

Consider also: the brain is composed largely of fat/cholesterol. When the System's "medical science" advocates "low-fat" diets, and worse, the abomination of anti-cholesterol drugs, what do you think might happen? The correlation between vegans and half-wit leftists is quite strong...something for real scientists to consider.

[crimethink]

Try surviving a cold winter eating vegetables, You will die. Maybe if you are lucky, you have some grains stashed. You will still be very unhealthy. Man has survived for untold millennia eating nothing but meat during winters that lasted much longer than they do now. If you were an ice age hunter, a good kill like a mammoth could feed you and yours and keep you very healthy all winter long. I am sure any sensible creature like an intelligent hunter would supplement with herbs when and where available but meat is the thing to have.

The Arctic peoples have eaten a diet mostly of meat, with huge amounts of natural fats (fish oils, blubber) for millennia. And guess what? Their cardiovascular problems were minimal, until McDonald's & Top Ramen arrived.

[crimethink]

i would suggest that carbohydrates and sugar are the main culprits. when the germans forced everyone on a plant based diet, i suspect cakes, sugar coffees, chocolate, piles of bread, etc. went away as well. it wasn't the meat, it was the lifestyle associated with eating meat that was to blame.

Indeed! Some parts of western Europe had things so bad that tulips were ground into flour for bread. Audrey Hepburn's family did that, and it's said she suffered health problems the rest of her life due to nutritional deficiencies in childhood (i.e., during World War II in Belgium).

[crimethink]

It's all in the genes my friend. Many people can't process animal fats effectively which causes blood LDL cholesterol and triglyceride levels to rise and HDL levels to drop which inevitably leads to coronary artery disease! Many more have genes which do a much better job of processing animal (saturated) fats.

Animal fat doesn't cause coronary artery disease, it simply hastens the disease in those most prone to it

I would argue that cholesterol is, in no way, an "evil" substance. Note my previous post about the composition of the human brain.

"Hardening of the arteries" / atherosclerosis is a result of cholesterol build-up, yes, but the cholesterol is doing exactly what God intended it to do - protect damaged arteries. No damage = no build-up. The build-up is due to the industrial toxic substances, including so-called "food," that are prolific in our modern "way of life."

[Serpo]

I would argue that cholesterol is, in no way, an "evil" substance. Note my previous post about the composition of the human brain.

"Hardening of the arteries" / atherosclerosis is a result of cholesterol build-up, yes, but the cholesterol is doing exactly what God intended it to do - protect damaged arteries. No damage = no build-up. The build-up is due to the industrial toxic substances, including so-called "food," that are prolific in our modern "way of life."


Cause of heart disease .....................chlorine in the water...............



Heart Disease and Chlorine - Silkywater.com (http://www.silkywater.com/heartdiseaseandchlorine.htm)
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Chlorine.. a primary. cause of Heart Disease ! If Cancer doesn't get you Heart Disease will. Heart Disease is the number one killer in America. 62 million Americans have cardiovascular disease, angina, high blood pressure, plaque blockage, strokes, and congestive heart failure; in fact nearly a million people will die from ...


Heart Disease and Chlorine due to arterial plaques. (http://nov79.com/hrt.html)
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Evidence points to chlorinated water as cause of heart disease stemming from arterial plaques.


Dr. Fox on Chlorination - Pure Water Gazette (http://www.purewatergazette.net/chlorinationfox.htm)
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The origin of heart disease is akin to the origin to cancer. Both can be linked to chlorine and the production of excess free radicals. Dr. Joseph Price, a medical doctor, wrote a fascinating book in the late 1960's entitled, Coronaries/ Cholesterol/Chlorine. He states, "The basic cause of athereosclerosis, heart attacks and most ...


CHLORINATED WATER & HEART DISEASE - Whale (http://www.whale.to/w/chlorinated_water__heart_disease.html)
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But while reducing cholesterol intake can tower risk somewhat, the theory that cholesterol is the sole cause of heart attacks has serious flaws. It ignores the fact that heart attacks were virtually unknown until this century, when chlorination of water began, and they remain quite rare in places such as China as long as the ...


Chlorine is known to cause cancer, heart disease (http://www.reverse-osmosis-water-filter-guide.com/chlorine-drinking-water-health-effects.htm)
www.reverse-osmosis-water-filter-guide.com/chlorine-d...Proxy (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a636778694530382f413156756477557743454d6d49567 052525268555352524662774575565277304e6b74475246416 6547774635a514271515551714d316f4e56524955413156755 9786f7253554d714f566f4f556738515341784262685671555 641334d6b304f5868675953684e414c5263685146516749307 74e58676b5541424a4d5951596d4777567959567353426b6c4 b466c59525a6b527746464d684e56735842557362466c4a4b4 e454e2f4551467a6355315457513545453046636330384b636 d5137476b5675547a4d546678356c5a3164305968527745786 c51526b4163523163624d52527846514d6e5a5630514268684 e5241564b4e4570305231647a596c7846556b564e5130464f6 3674a364678637a4a45776542773d3d&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=b73fddeaa4c354bf4a45348dc6d39f29) Highlight (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a636778694530382f413156756477557743454d6d49567 052525268555352524662774575565277304e6b74475246416 6547774635a514271515551714d316f4e56524955413156755 9786f7253554d714f566f4f556738515341784262685671555 641334d6b304f5868675953684e414c5263685146516749307 74e58676b5541424a4d5951596d4777567959567353426b6c4 b466c59525a6b527746464d684e56735842557362466c4a4b4 e454e2f4551467a6355315457513545453046636330384b636 d5137476b5675547a4d546678356c5a3164305968527745786 c51526b4163523163624d52527846514d6e5a5630514268684 e5241564b4e4570305231647a596c7846556b564e5130464f6 3674a364678637a4a45776542317359546c6f5a&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=68afc3b522447d2a10ff53eaf5479ad9&mtrq=cause+of+heart+disease+chlorine&hlq=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.startpage.com%2Fdo%2Fsearch&ahs=0)
When chlorine is added to our water it forms by-products that trigger the production of free radicals in the body‚ causing cell damage‚ and are highly carcinogenic.


Chlorinated water 'can DOUBLE the risk of heart and brain ... (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1023696/Chlorinated-water-DOUBLE-risk-heart-brain-abnormalities.html)
www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1023696/Chlorinate...Proxy (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a636778694530382f413156756477557743465569506c4 e6157787751536b6c4c6231777954525278455664475678454 e546b496152684d31556c67674f316f4f4230314c465645524 e6c6431594849724f31425258784d5955674a4d4c51556d556 c5178656e7473597a3831593070616151457343316b6d4e6b3 1584778384c527735474c524d6c534634784f6c355058776b5 15178514761415971536863324d3135585630424f525151594 e42596b51675a775a4673574230354945514e4e4f454569514 64e365a466b614242354f486b4661634230304777646c49307 76565796b73586970535451734a54476736476c674742546c6 346534d4f63774a365131427a5a4135464145354c516c564b4 d304969456c4d684e51736242527766466c4a4c5a685a2f456 c526c4d553154433078665668526250554d3d&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=68cba3fc1212095d6da2a30a9fdcb089) Highlight (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a636778694530382f413156756477557743465569506c4 e6157787751536b6c4c6231777954525278455664475678454 e546b496152684d31556c67674f316f4f4230314c465645524 e6c6431594849724f31425258784d5955674a4d4c51556d556 c5178656e7473597a3831593070616151457343316b6d4e6b3 1584778384c527735474c524d6c534634784f6c355058776b5 15178514761415971536863324d3135585630424f525151594 e42596b51675a775a4673574230354945514e4e4f454569514 64e365a466b614242354f486b4661634230304777646c49307 76565796b73586970535451734a54476736476c674742546c6 346534d4f63774a365131427a5a4135464145354c516c564b4 d304969456c4d684e51736242527766466c4a4c5a685a2f456 c526c4d553154433078665668526250554e6852316c2b5a673 d3d&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=f7af1a48175ef3e1cb8592238fc2438b&mtrq=cause+of+heart+disease+chlorine&hlq=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.startpage.com%2Fdo%2Fsearch&ahs=0)
2 Jun 2008 ... All public-supply tap water is chlorinated in the UK to get rid of bugs that can cause diseases such as cholera and typhoid. However the trihalomethane content of tap water varies according to its source. Water that has run off farm land and contains a lot of organic chemicals is more likely to contain the ...


Chlorine, Cancer, and Heart Disease - Healthynewage.com (http://www.healthynewage.com/chlorine-cancer/)
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Dr. Joseph Price wrote a highly controversial book in the late sixties titled “ Coronaries/Cholesterol/Chlorine” and concluded that nothing can negate the incontrovertible fact, the basic cause of atherosclerosis and resulting entities such as heart attacks and stroke, is chlorine. Dr. Price later headed up a study using chickens


Chlorine, Heart Disease and Cancer - OAWHealth (https://oawhealth.com/article/chlorine-heart-disease-and-cancer/)
https://oawhealth.com/article/chlorine-heart-disease-...Proxy (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a4a426f516431684c594549615268306d55566b6d4e6c4 e58586c4d6153516f4e4d6a516d564555714e464e474530382 f5251394562774175534652755031704352416c55516735625 a524d30517877694f56734f5652775852514a614a554142414 5516e4e6b744343306f61516c38654e6b4969527764335a675 a435630524e486c644e4d55636c48774a374d566c464245676 44142565962774636486863334a414a75596967426178316c6 55477746630674f4d426f51636c684b596b466263453869527 746775a6c6b5642553864464155624d42647a52464d6859776 3515678744a4577524f5a45707a5178636c4a5538654231734 a565251564d513d3d&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=d3cb4d055fa8bbad37f3218856be4fae) Highlight (https://ixquick-proxy.com/do/spg/proxy?ep=484270364146312b4d6c46455768514b546b464c5 0526f684146496949774a55557839665631704c59516330517 86f734d52524c5578774c556b784d615145695230496d66467 84c5768494c54776c4e4a6741724733384d47586f465868454 9477739636441493048423573494568554741344e527856636 3424d67517838674f46494d55684a5756514a4a63684576414 677334a303943564131454630464664414933514630694d474 2435655424a414170636341496b5331562b4a30314d5652674 b565468625a524d3152566c6c4f6b745452684559534142645 9525569473151744d464e4b5252566653784e5963426370515 667744d6c784d51784d4e4731594f62515933566b67674e414 9544542414e566864416252423646786375493039545268704 5466b46466441493352564133616b684756467355556864596 26868364668637549303954516b41595478554f64553876556 b557a4a426f516431684c594549615268306d55566b6d4e6c4 e58586c4d6153516f4e4d6a516d564555714e464e474530382 f5251394562774175534652755031704352416c55516735625 a524d30517877694f56734f5652775852514a614a554142414 5516e4e6b744343306f61516c38654e6b4969527764335a675 a435630524e486c644e4d55636c48774a374d566c464245676 44142565962774636486863334a414a75596967426178316c6 55477746630674f4d426f51636c684b596b466263453869527 746775a6c6b5642553864464155624d42647a52464d6859776 3515678744a4577524f5a45707a5178636c4a5538654231734 a565251564d56516d54677879&ek=66584n484n6n4644567n386n4r6r31354n6q636s&ekdata=89e872de7e0f8a2c36ab9404953f0d66&mtrq=cause+of+heart+disease+chlorine&hlq=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.startpage.com%2Fdo%2Fsearch&ahs=0)
Chlorine, Heart Disease and Cancer. alternate text. Article Description: The addition of chlorine to our drinking water began in the late 1800s and by 1904 was the standard in water treatment, and for the most part remains so today. We don't

[singular_me]

I eat eggs and lots of veggies, and survive winters pretty well. Again, you are taking it to the extreme... the OP says, that 2oz/meat daily is fine, the body can handle it. I am NOT speaking of being fully vegan but a compromise. But I agree with veganism too. Spiritual people have preached throughout the ages in favor of veganism/vegetarianism. Nothing new.

today meat is improper to consumption anyway... how did norwegians survive then? Because they were making sure to grow lots of crops during summer time and canning/drying as much as possible for the winter. No secret.

what may for a long period of time does not work eternally, centuries ago for example, people were dying from other diseases and killed by wars... so there is no real data about it but the life expectancy chart is a good hint although not accurate too (people were dying young meat or not) , as it says that people live longer today but thanks to bigpharma keeping people on life support

what you say is pointless.

today we do have the technology and the knowledge to grow plants everywhere on the planet... but further so much grain to feed the world livestock is clearly unsustainable.

In china, you have this annual dog hunt and they make them suffer until the dogs die, claiming that it makes their meat tastier. The animal suffering is caused by meat overproduction/overconsumption mainly. Massive slaughter may have the same effect psychically.


Try surviving a cold winter eating vegetables, You will die. Maybe if you are lucky, you have some grains stashed. You will still be very unhealthy. Man has survived for untold millennia eating nothing but meat during winters that lasted much longer than they do now. If you were an ice age hunter, a good kill like a mammoth could feed you and yours and keep you very healthy all winter long. I am sure any sensible creature like an intelligent hunter would supplement with herbs when and where available but meat is the thing to have.

[Serpo]

I havnt eaten animal meat for over fifty years.

In fact I love animals, they are my friends unless they want to eat me of course.

I dont write this to prove any point but it is a fact that I dont eat meat.



My wife eats meat, two out of three of our children eat meat, people have a choice that is there own.

Meat can be a bit like cigarettes after you quit, they begin to smell really awful.

Meat is very similar if you stop...............it looks and smells terrible unless you are eating it , then it smells and tastes delicious. Strange but true.


I encounter claims that humans were designed to eat meat — that it's in our genes, that we have teeth made for eating meat, that we need meat to get all the right nutrients — all the time in casual conversation and in media in stronger (http://breakingmuscle.com/nutrition/why-all-humans-need-to-eat-meat-for-health) and weaker (http://www.thepaleomom.com/2015/09/the-diet-were-meant-to-eat-part-3-how-much-meat-versus-veggies.html) versions.
In Meathooked: The History and Science of Our 2.5-Million-Year Obsession with Meat (http://www.meathookedthebook.com/), science writer Marta Zaraska (http://www.zaraska.com/) does a great job of exposing these claims as myths.
Vegetarian animals ranging from gorillas to water deer, she reports, have bigger, sharper canines than we do; our canines aren't specially meant for processing meat. What we lack dentally is more important, in fact, than what we have. Gently open a (calm) dog's jaw, and there at the back will be the carnassial teeth, "blade-like and sharp and perfect for slicing meat." Lions and tigers, racoons and house cats — all carnivores — have them too. We don't.


https://www.npr.org/sections/13.7/2016/05/19/478645426/humans-are-meathooked-but-not-designed-for-meat-eating

[singular_me]

meat is hard on the kidneys... kidneys are the most sought among organ transplant... meat also stays/stagnates much longer in the intestinal transit, which makes feces very stinky because the meat is rotting. Colon cancer comes to mind.

Today I eat 1lb worth of meat (organic chicken tartar) monthly, 6 eggs twice weekly... and feel great. I have not had any red meat for more than 3 months.

Addiction to meat is real. As much as the nwo was behind high meat consumption, it is also promoting vegan. But as usual the truth is in the middle. Organic eggs, butter, rice/quinoa and veggies will keep anybody healthy. Essential amino acids are found in plants.

I am hearing that there is lab-grown meat available.
Will it bankrupt feedlots, factory farms, at some point? What are we going to do with all those animals?

the latest delusion
But is the world ready for synthesized cannibalism?
https://www.wired.co.uk/article/lab-grown-human-meat-cannibalism

[woodman]

In fact I love animals, they are my friends unless they want to eat me of course.








I love animals too. They are tasty! JK. I once had an enormous cow that was a sweetheart. Old 'Brownie' was a gentle, playful and affectionate bovine. When the time came, I could not butcher nor eat brownie. I sold him to a farmer who I am sure ate him with relish. It would have been akin to cannibalism for me though, as he had become my friend. I could not afford to keep him in hay and grain though.