Ohhhh Ahhhh Ohhhh! Palladium!

Here is some discussion involving palladium:

Brillouin Energy
Researchers at Brillouin Energy Corp. of Berkeley, California are developing what they term a controlled electron capture reaction (CECR) process. In their experiments, ordinary hydrogen is loaded into a nickel lattice, and then an electronic pulse is passed through the system, using a proprietary control system. They claim that their device converts H-1 (ordinary hydrogen) to H-2 (deuterium), then to H-3 (tritium) and H-4 (quatrium), which then decays to He-4 and releases energy.
In one paper on their website, the Brillouin researchers found that "excess heat is always seen" when tuned pulses are present. They report being able to obtain excess heat using ordinary water with hydrided nickel, palladium or copper. In a second paper, the researchers assert that the excess heat is "measurable and repeatable."

Additional technical details are given in a Powerpoint presentation, a report summarizing their "quantum reaction hypothesis," and in a patent application. Their patent application reads, in part, "Embodiments generate thermal energy by neutron generation, neutron capture and subsequent transport of excess binding energy as useful heat for any application."

Lawsuit Alleges Palladium, Platinum Prices Manipulated

"...Goldman Sachs Group Inc., HSBC Holdings PLC, Standard Bank Group Ltd. , and German chemical maker BASF SE have been accused of manipulating platinum and palladium prices in a lawsuit filed in New York by a jeweler.

The four companies colluded since 2007 to manipulate the twice-daily price “fixes” for the metals, said lawyers for Modern Settings LLC, a jewelry and law enforcement badge-making company in Sarasota, Fla. The alleged price rigging allowed the four to enrich themselves at the expense of other market participants, the lawsuit said.

Goldman Sachs, HSBC, Standard Bank and BASF refused to comment on the lawsuit when contacted by The Wall Street Journal..."

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

I am thinking it may have something to do with cold fusion breakthroughs, but the only breakthroughs being reported are based on nickel (ecat). Maybe there is somethig else going on that is not being reported.

http://blogs.economictimes.indiatime...ear-reactions/

http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/1...ty-of-gasoline

http://www.sifferkoll.se/sifferkoll/...portSubmit.pdf

http://www.siliconrepublic.com/clean...of-potential-c

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^ that's what I been saying, something seekrit unfolding... shhh! don't tell anyone!! :D

'Sides, nickel, Pd & Pt are found in the same mines. The "...based on nickel" thing is just misdirection to throw off the hounds. Pd's price behaviour this year speaks to the twoof.

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Originally Posted by PatColo

I did buy some SWC Mon morning; paid a touch too much though in short-term hindsight, $13.20 :rolleyes:
http://bigcharts.com/quickchart/quic...e=&freq=&show=

http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/kaa...579&mocktick=1

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SWC $13.65 high today (+78 cents, +6%), real time quote. Volume looks on track to be (only) "average" though, which is ~2MM shares/day. Volume says "market conviction." A rally above $14 on 3+ MM shares traded would say the bottom's behind us (pun there somewhere...:rolleyes:).

Insiders been buying, incl a director who bought 3K shares in Aug at 17.99, and 2K more shares Mon 12/1 at 13.51. :)

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

Lawsuit Alleges Palladium, Platinum Prices Manipulated

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Yeah I got an invite to join that class-action jobee, coz I did trade Pd futures around 06/07... but been out of the country, only forward my physical mail periodically, and got that one too late. My trades were net-profitable, but hey if the NY jooweler's suit against the other jooz resulted in them throwing some free bagels my way; I would accept.

:eek: < bagel smiley.

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Originally Posted by PatColo

'Sides, nickel, Pd & Pt are found in the same mines. The "...based on nickel" thing is just misdirection to throw off the hounds. Pd's price behaviour this year speaks to the twoof.

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It gets better than that- they are chemcially very similar. They are in the same group in the periodic table of elements, meaning their electron configuration and chemistry are very similar.

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachme...tid=7051&stc=1

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

Here is some discussion involving palladium:

Brillouin Energy
Researchers at Brillouin Energy Corp. of Berkeley, California are developing what they term a controlled electron capture reaction (CECR) process. In their experiments, ordinary hydrogen is loaded into a nickel lattice, and then an electronic pulse is passed through the system, using a proprietary control system. They claim that their device converts H-1 (ordinary hydrogen) to H-2 (deuterium), then to H-3 (tritium) and H-4 (quatrium), which then decays to He-4 and releases energy.
In one paper on their website, the Brillouin researchers found that "excess heat is always seen" when tuned pulses are present. They report being able to obtain excess heat using ordinary water with hydrided nickel, palladium or copper. In a second paper, the researchers assert that the excess heat is "measurable and repeatable."

Additional technical details are given in a Powerpoint presentation, a report summarizing their "quantum reaction hypothesis," and in a patent application. Their patent application reads, in part, "Embodiments generate thermal energy by neutron generation, neutron capture and subsequent transport of excess binding energy as useful heat for any application."

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Basically they claim that they mastered cold fusion, but without saying it. Because cold fusion isn't politically correct! LOL

I never heard of quatrium before. How can a proton and 3 neutrons decay into 2 protons and 2 neutrons?

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Originally Posted by PatColo

^ that's what I been saying, something seekrit unfolding... shhh! don't tell anyone!! :D

'Sides, nickel, Pd & Pt are found in the same mines. The "...based on nickel" thing is just misdirection to throw off the hounds. Pd's price behaviour this year speaks to the twoof.

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But I read somewhere... Most likely here, that Nickel and Palladium are found in the same mines. But you have to choose which one you are going for! If you go for Nickel you get less Pd and vice versa. So if Nickel get scarce and becomes focus of mining, Palladium, which is a much smaller market in monetary terms get much more scarcer, but the price may have to go up tenfold vs Nickel, before it becomes profitable to change focus to Pd instead of Ni...

HUI down between 1-3% all day, even gapped lower @ the open; meanwhile SWC 13.85, +.36, +2.67% :D

Not to mention, Pd up all day, contrary to the other PMs all down 1+ %

I'm telling yous losers, something's percolating below the radar somewhere.

if it goes back t $900, i'm selling it. bought it at like $190 or so.

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Originally Posted by chad

if it goes back t $900, i'm selling it. bought it at like $190 or so.

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Does anybody think that Palladium could become a Monetary metal ?

For a non-monetary metal, it's done fantastic.


I asked a local coin dealer about buying Platinum. But he wouldn't talk about spread, said he had to look into it.

Maybe I'll ask one of the good dealers about Palladium. How much they would buy it for.

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Originally Posted by gunDriller

Does anybody think that Palladium could become a Monetary metal ?

For a non-monetary metal, it's done fantastic.


I asked a local coin dealer about buying Platinum. But he wouldn't talk about spread, said he had to look into it.

Maybe I'll ask one of the good dealers about Palladium. How much they would buy it for.

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2 local dealers here won't touch palladium, that's why i'm getting out. what happens if some event happens, and the option to do it through mail and the internet goes away? then i'm stuck with it, and NOBODY outside of places like this have any inkling what it is. i'm selling all of it at $900 and buying gold with it.

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Originally Posted by chad

2 local dealers here won't touch palladium, that's why i'm getting out. what happens if some event happens, and the option to do it through mail and the internet goes away? then i'm stuck with it, and NOBODY outside of places like this have any inkling what it is. i'm selling all of it at $900 and buying gold with it.

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The ones here would only pay less than spot, forget how much, had to go to Dallas for spot at the time, way too much hassle, so bailed.

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Originally Posted by chad

2 local dealers here won't touch palladium, that's why i'm getting out. what happens if some event happens, and the option to do it through mail and the internet goes away? then i'm stuck with it, and NOBODY outside of places like this have any inkling what it is. i'm selling all of it at $900 and buying gold with it.

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Keep an ounce or two for the fantastic, if it ever happens. I bought 1.5 oz at $240, sometimes I felt like selling it, and make a profit on it, but it is nice to have some of it that one day may make a small fortune! Gold will probably keep its purchasing power +100/-50%, silver +300/-75%, Pt +1,000/-90%, Pd +10,000/-98%. Pd is just a fun play, and all of it is extraterrestrial!

I think this is what is bubbling beneath the surface:

http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthre...-are-Diverging

Low oil prices good for PGMs

"...when oil prices drop heavily on ample supply and strengthening consumer demand ... car demand tends to surge."

"Maybe cheap oil does not portend a major rally in PGM prices. At current spot, many analysts had seen fairness in palladium before oil prices dropped. Some, but not all, view $900/oz as reasonable in the year or so to come..."

Palladium:silver ratio

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachme...tid=7072&stc=1

Gold : Pd Ratio

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachme...tid=7073&stc=1

Palladium : Oil (WTC)

http://gold-silver.us/forum/attachme...tid=7074&stc=1

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Originally Posted by PatColo

SWC $13.65 high today (+78 cents, +6%), real time quote. Volume looks on track to be (only) "average" though, which is ~2MM shares/day. Volume says "market conviction." A rally above $14 on 3+ MM shares traded would say the bottom's behind us (pun there somewhere...:rolleyes:).

Insiders been buying, incl a director who bought 3K shares in Aug at 17.99, and 2K more shares Mon 12/1 at 13.51. :)

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2MM shares traded on Tue, and 3MM yesterday, or +50% of average daily.... on a price move > $14. Up another ~50 cents today, on what looks like another big volume day. :)

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Originally Posted by PatColo

HUI down between 1-3% all day, even gapped lower @ the open; meanwhile SWC 13.85, +.36, +2.67% :D Not to mention, Pd up all day, contrary to the other PMs all down 1+ % I'm telling yous losers, something's percolating below the radar somewhere.

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^ similar tale today (HUI up though), even with Pd down $5 now, SWC surging 7.X% higher, just touched $15/share, on higher than average volume. No SWC news stories. :) http://bigcharts.com/quickchart/quic...1&show=&time=6 real time: http://www.marketwatch.com/investing/stock/SWC http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/kaa...579&mocktick=1

Gold to average $1,145/oz in 2015, platinum the favoured trade – Natixis


"Natixis predicted that silver, currently trading around $16, will average $15.30 per ounce in 2015, while palladium, currently at $790, will average $770..."


Palladium predicted to rise, gold holds steady

"By the fourth quarter of 2015 the price should climb back to a high of US$912 per ounce."

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

Gold to average $1,145/oz in 2015, platinum the favoured trade – Natixis


"Natixis predicted that silver, currently trading around $16, will average $15.30 per ounce in 2015, while palladium, currently at $790, will average $770..."


Palladium predicted to rise, gold holds steady


"By the fourth quarter of 2015 the price should climb back to a high of US$912 per ounce."

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Well, at this point, Natixis seems to have the better prediction.

Back over $800. Palladium just does not give it up!

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

Back over $800. Palladium just does not give it up!

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does this mean they're selling cars ?

thought that might be a primary application.

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Originally Posted by gunDriller

does this mean they're selling cars ?

thought that might be a primary application.

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Something is happening. Maybe cheaper gas (but now increasing) has people thinking that they will sell more cars? Maybe something is happening behind the scene with cold fusion.

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Originally Posted by JohnQPublic

Something is happening. Maybe cheaper gas (but now increasing) has people thinking that they will sell more cars? Maybe something is happening behind the scene with cold fusion.

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actually, 2014 was a good year for car sales.

SWC has been making a charge at it's $15-some-odd resistance, strong volume :)

http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/qui...1&show=&time=8
http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/kaa...579&mocktick=1

Palladium is not looking as good as it was.



http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaell...ing-palladium/

"weak the Chinese auto market combined with a stronger US dollar have driven palladium to its lowest level in over a year. Sentiment is extremely negative and the chart is testing its 200-week moving average. ETF holdings, which have a big impact on this metal, are down more than 100,000 ounces year-to-date, but are still historically high. With that being said, there are plenty of reasons to be bullish. The market was in deficit last year and it’s projected to stay there until at least 2017. Norilsk recently announced plans to establish a $2 billion fund specifically for buying physical palladium. Billionaire CEO Vladamir Potanin is participating with his private wealth, and fellow oligarch Roman Abramovich may also contribute. This is the definition of insider buying, and clearly indicates they believe prices will keep rising for the foreseeable future."

Palladium is still dumping. I take this as a sign (along with cheap silver and stable gold) that people are predicting a bad economy coming up (or it is just manipulation), low car sales, fewer cell phones and solar panels, etc.

http://www.outsiderclub.com/the-pall...r-in-2015/1409

interesting article about see-saw-ing demand, related to auto industry consumption, between Pt & Pd.


i tried to do a search to see how much catalytic converters account for Pd consumption, as a percentage.

Pd certainly is tempting ... price near cost of production, which is $563 for one of the "Big's" ... BUT it is vulnerable to a disruptive technology in the auto industry (alternative for catalytic converters, or discontinuation of catalytic converters.)

they might be able to make it up (my guess is, a lot of power plants would benefit from catalytic converter type emissions devices on their smoke-stacks) ... but i don't expect widespread adoption of that.

What happened? A sudden, and welcome jump (in this gloomy PM market), of Pd around $40 today...

Start ignition? $24 up today to $675? I read somewhere Pd is an important metal in ammunition manufacturing. Could this be it?

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Originally Posted by Neuro

Start ignition? $24 up today to $675? I read somewhere Pd is an important metal in ammunition manufacturing. Could this be it?

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$702...

I know the miners in general are in the doghouse right now, but do y'all buy any Palladium mining stocks?
Such as: SWC, PLG, IVPAF, etc?

Or strictly physical...?

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Originally Posted by Neuro

Start ignition? $24 up today to $675? I read somewhere Pd is an important metal in ammunition manufacturing. Could this be it?

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That went well as usual! Down $150 since then!

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Originally Posted by Neuro

Start ignition? $24 up today to $675? I read somewhere Pd is an important metal in ammunition manufacturing. Could this be it?

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Sure would like more info !

https://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#h...+manufacturing

Tried a websearch, all I found was a gun shop in Utah, "Palladium Arms" or something.
I could see if it was a catalyst used in primer or gunpowder manufacture (maybe ?).
But had never heard of that industrial use for Pd.

Sometimes I am tempted to buy some Pd ... but I perceive that it is largely dependent on industrial demand. It seems like one of the primary uses, catalytic converters, depends on auto sales in countries that have auto exhaust restrictions. Which is sort of an artificial market - in the US, it depends on low interest rates to keep the record sales numbers going.

I know their is also a relation to diesel. Pt or Pd, one is used more for diesel cat converters. Forget which.

Palladium $490! Does not bode well for what people think of the auto market in the near term (or did cold fusion just fail?).

The official explanation:

Palladium plummets on China concerns/equities; more weakness likely - See more at: http://www.bulliondesk.com/palladium....mUouXuuD.dpuf

I figured palladium's drop was just another screw to Russia. It has been monkey hammered.

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Originally Posted by osoab

I figured palladium's drop was just another screw to Russia. It has been monkey hammered.

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Palladium dropped and will drop even further. The reason is that global car catalytic converter market is falling, despite forecasted car sales growth. I expect significant drop by 2019-2020. http://seekingalpha.com/article/3978...ium-bottom-yet