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Vanishing in the wilderness
In the past I've been a long ways in to the back country wilderness in and around Yellowstone and Glacier National Parks. Had a couple of things happen while camped there that I still wonder about. These stories are interesting and something that should be taken in to consideration when venturing in to the national parks. I've listened to a lot of these kind of stories over the years and there are two pieces of advice that seem to be good advice and consistent. Don't go alone and don't go unarmed. The government doesn't want you carrying fire arms in national parks but I don't think you should pay any attention to those communist bastards and SOB's, just keep your weapons out of sight.
Thought I'd add that the government employees I ran in to when I was in the back country were assholes that seemed to like to bully people and were always looking for some thing they could chew your ass for.
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I live adjacent to the largest cluster of National Forest in the lower 48 states so I naturally find this interesting. I can't comment of the pattern of missing shoes other than the lack of media coverage it gets. I will say that it's quite common for National Park and National Forest officials to deny the existence of large predators in areas where they are sometimes seen and reported by individuals.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I will say that it's quite common for National Park and National Forest officials to deny the existence of large predators in areas where they are sometimes seen and reported by individuals.
From what I gather after listening to a lot of these stories here that I"v posted and others that you should never go off in the wilderness alone and if you do a 44 magnum, 357 magnum or 45-70 rifle seem to be the minimum requirements if you don't want to disappear or have some one find only your shoes after you've turned up missing.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
Tumbleweed
From what I gather after listening to a lot of these stories here that I"v posted and others that you should never go off in the wilderness alone and if you do a 44 magnum, 357 magnum or 45-70 rifle seem to be the minimum requirements if you don't want to disappear or have some one find only your shoes after you've turned up missing.
I only watched the first five videos so far and I never heard them say the victim ventured out well armed. I usually carry a 44 magnum or at least a 44 special when out in the woods. Maybe Darwin's agenda is at work here. Only liberals from the cities venture out unarmed in my neck of the woods.
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Hey, the bears need to eat too! Ya don't want to be bear food?... stay home? City dwellers have no idea how dangerous it is in the wilderness. Most of them think they'll meet that nice Smokey the Bear or maybe Yogi Bear who they see on TeeVee. They deserve what they get!
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there's a guy that wrote a book or two about same. he's been a regular guest on coast to coast and other shows
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I only watched the first five videos so far and I never heard them say the victim ventured out well armed. I usually carry a 44 magnum or at least a 44 special when out in the woods. Maybe Darwin's agenda is at work here. Only liberals from the cities venture out unarmed in my neck of the woods.
I believe David Paulides has a book out on hunters disappearing now too. I think in an interview he said bow hunters are a lot more likely to turn up missing than gun hunters. People out alone seem to be the most vulnerable.
A couple of videos here of things that can happen. The first one is of a park ranger turning loose a captured bear and it's a good thing he was packing a .357. The second one is of a hiker being stalked by a mountain lion.
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One thing that strikes me as odd is that these are all National Park disappearances. What about National Forests? Don't National Forests cover about ten times as much land as National Parks?
In National Parks carrying handguns is generally illegal. In National Forests it's the norm.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
One thing that strikes me as odd is that these are all National Park disappearances. What about National Forests? Don't National Forests cover about ten times as much land as National Parks?
In National Parks carrying handguns is generally illegal. In National Forests it's the norm.
I think you've made a pretty good point for why so many people are disappearing in the national parks and it's because they are gun free zones. What ever predators are there have gotten used to people being around and don't fear them. Makes it easy pickings for them. I haven't come across any statistics that compare disappearances on national park or forrest service land but it would be interesting to see one.
I think if people are going hiking in those places they should always be armed whether the government likes it or not. You just need to find something that isn't to hard to conceal that still has pretty good knock down power. I think the glock subcompact in 357 sig is pretty good because it's not so hard to conceal and you've got a lot of fire power with it. 125 grain fmj bullets will penetrate and break bones. I've got a glock 33 that I carry all the time in a shoulder holster on one side and with a magazine pouch on the other side for two 15 round magazines. It's comfortable and pretty concealable.
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I used to own a section of desert land next to Big Bend Natl Park in Texas and hiked all over that park, well armed with a concealed handgun of course. One day I was driving a remote road a half mile from the meskin border and seen a cat that looked just like a Mountain Lion except for it was darker and only weighed about 20 pounds. The cat had a long tail like a Lion so I know it wasn't a Bobcat. It walked like an aged animal, careful not to waste the slightest bit of energy, so it could not have been a juvenile lion, aside from the dark color.
When I got back home a few days later I called the Park biologist and told him I had seen a Jaguarundi in the park (their literature says there are none there). He condescendingly told me it was not a Jaguarndi, just a young Mountain Lion.
I've spoken to many others with similar experiences. USFS and other governmental agencies habitually deny the existence of predators in spite of all the reported sightings.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I used to own a section of desert land next to Big Bend Natl Park in Texas and hiked all over that park. One day I was driving a remote road a half mile from the meskin border and seen a cat that looked just like a Mountain Lion except for it was darker and only weighed about 20 pounds. The cat had a long tail like a Lion so I know it wasn't a Bobcat. It walked like an aged animal, careful not to waste the slightest bit of energy, so it could not have been a juvenile lion, aside from the dark color.
When I got back home a few days later I called the Park biologist and told him I had seen a Jaguarundi in the park (their literature says there are none there). He condescendingly told me it was not a Jaguarndi, just a young Mountain Lion.
I've spoken to many others with similar experiences. USFS and other governmental agencies habitually deny the existence of predators in spite of all the reported sightings.
I would love to meet you in real life, but your seeing a jew under ever blade of grass or rock, says to me naw not worth my time. Want to talk cows and and critters .yes
Sad
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
Dogman
I would love to meet you in real life, but your seeing a jew under ever blade of grass or rock, says to me naw not worth my time. Want to talk cows and and critters .yes
Sad
Is there anything else you wish to add to this thread, Shlomo?
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I used to own a section of desert land next to Big Bend Natl Park in Texas and hiked all over that park, well armed with a concealed handgun of course. One day I was driving a remote road a half mile from the meskin border and seen a cat that looked just like a Mountain Lion except for it was darker and only weighed about 20 pounds. The cat had a long tail like a Lion so I know it wasn't a Bobcat. It walked like an aged animal, careful not to waste the slightest bit of energy, so it could not have been a juvenile lion, aside from the dark color.
When I got back home a few days later I called the Park biologist and told him I had seen a Jaguarundi in the park (their literature says there are none there). He condescendingly told me it was not a Jaguarndi, just a young Mountain Lion.
I've spoken to many others with similar experiences. USFS and other governmental agencies habitually deny the existence of predators in spite of all the reported sightings.
We have cougars here. Many sightings over the years and tracks also. The DNR claims they don't exist here. I don't know why. One has been seen crossing the road in front of my home. These things are dangerous. I would not let my grandkids play unattended. Also, there are eagles that could certainly carry off a small child or infant and I'm sure it has happened before.
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
Is there anything else you wish to add to this thread, Shlomo?
Naw , but! ;D
I do hold to my words which are true. In about a year once I pay off my mazda which in 5 years I have less than 4500 miles on the clock, am thinking of selling/trading it along with my house and getting a road king or better scooter with trailer and then hit the road 24/7/365 until I check out from this life. Call it an ultimate adventure..hehe. Still would like to meet you along my travels and share a cup of or what ever, we both are not young and are looking at the end sooner than later. In many ways I am a biker, better than 50 years riding, and intend to go out as one doing what I enjoy, into the wind seeing what I can see until the end.
My words to you I hold true, you do see what maybe is not true but in your mind or at least what you post seems to be major paranoia when it comes to jews, which you are methinks misdirecting from the real threat. Which is the major rich types /corporations/military industrial complex that really are the ones in control and own all or most of our political critters. Would love to ride with you ether on bikes or hay burner hehe . And swap lies and mixed truths around a fire under a starry night or so sucking down a cup of coffee or what ever as I make my final road trip however long it takes. I think cussing/discussing with you would and can be a total hoot. ;D
Live life to the max as far as gusto goes, I intend to soon, but will be doing so with care , no need to be stupid. We spend our lifes learning, one way or another to what ends?
For they that learn, probably for the better, they that stay in their ruts/blaming all ills on others without looking into a mirror, in my mind are doomed but they that do look will probably be seeing the real reasons for their ills..themselves!
Food for thought !
Peace
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I used to own a section of desert land next to Big Bend Natl Park in Texas and hiked all over that park, well armed with a concealed handgun of course. One day I was driving a remote road a half mile from the meskin border and seen a cat that looked just like a Mountain Lion except for it was darker and only weighed about 20 pounds. The cat had a long tail like a Lion so I know it wasn't a Bobcat. It walked like an aged animal, careful not to waste the slightest bit of energy, so it could not have been a juvenile lion, aside from the dark color.
When I got back home a few days later I called the Park biologist and told him I had seen a Jaguarundi in the park (their literature says there are none there). He condescendingly told me it was not a Jaguarndi, just a young Mountain Lion.
I've spoken to many others with similar experiences. USFS and other governmental agencies habitually deny the existence of predators in spite of all the reported sightings.
I've heard some stories the border patrol agents tell and they speak of things that aren't supposed to be there either. It seems to be hushed up by the government and I always wonder why. Seems like the agents also keep silent because they don't want to be ridiculed or lose their jobs. They also sometimes leave those jobs because of what they've seen that get into the strange and paranormal.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
woodman
We have cougars here. Many sightings over the years and tracks also. The DNR claims they don't exist here. I don't know why. One has been seen crossing the road in front of my home. These things are dangerous. I would not let my grandkids play unattended. Also, there are eagles that could certainly carry off a small child or infant and I'm sure it has happened before.
A few sightings here in east tex of cougars/mountain lions (same type of cat) and scat seems to prove it true. Hehe wild life do seem to able to adapt. But those cats are like ghosts they blend in so well.
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Two different neighbors of mine just recently had a couple cats and three goats killed by coyotes.
I've been hearing them howl and yip at night for years but they always kept their distance.
Not sure what made the difference in attitude. It's not like there's been any environmental disturbances and the weather's been normal. A bit of a dry spell? I don't know
Oh, and a bear got into the garbage about a week ago. Something must be disrupting predator habitat around here.
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Around here (Western Montana) the coyotes don't howl. I'm told they did before the wolves were introduced. Makes sense. The elk don't bugle anymore either. Why ring the dinner bell?
I've heard of a couple bear attacks in which the rear person was pulled out of line. In one of those cases the people were riding horseback.
The cases in which a child was nearby and the parents looked away, then turned back to find the child gone sound like Mountain Lions. Lions are very good at hiding in the brush motionless and watching their victims eyes for opportunity to advance, then freezing in crouched position just before being seen.
I'm trying to speculate on the "missing shoes" victims. In many of these cases it seems the person lost all sense or reason. Also noticed many of those cases were at high elevation. I haven't found any information indicating that elevation sickness causes people to go completely stupid, though.
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...raining-maine/
Professional runner from Kenya outruns two black bears while training in Maine woods
7 July 2017 • 1:45am
A professional runner from Kenya has described how he escaped two black bears in Maine by outpacing them.
Moninda Marube was out training on a nature trail in the woods near his home when he encountered the two charging bears
When he saw the bears early on Wednesday, he said his instincts kicked in and he did what he does best: run.
He told the Sun Journal that the bears were 20 yards (18 meters) away from him and a vacant house was 20 yards away in the opposite direction.
So he made a run for the house near Auburn Lake, with the bears closing to within 10 yards (9 meters) by the time he found safety on the house's screened porch.
The bears stopped, not realising they could've easily crashed through the flimsy porch screens, Marube said. They sniffed around for a while before wandering away.
Wardens advise people who encounter black bears to make themselves appear big, make noise and back away slowly. But they recommend people stand their ground if a black bear charges and say if the bear attacks, then fight back.
But Marube said that's easier said than done.
He said he knew that black bears can climb trees, so he couldn't climb to safety. He said he considered jumping in a nearby lake, but he can't swim.
He said he initially engaged in a stare-down with the bears but the bears charged the moment he turned his back on them.
Marube, a student at the University of Maine at Farmington who finished third in the 2012 Maine Marathon and won the 2013 half-marathon, said he'd once encountered a leopard perched in a tree while alone in Africa - but the bears were scarier.
He said he learned an important lesson from his close encounter with Maine's wildlife: "Just make peace with people. You never know when your day comes."
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
I'm trying to speculate on the "missing shoes" victims. In many of these cases it seems the person lost all sense or reason. Also noticed many of those cases were at high elevation. I haven't found any information indicating that elevation sickness causes people to go completely stupid, though.
I listened to an interview a while back of a guy named Tim Baker that did research for the government on infra sound. It can cause disorientation, anxiety, extreme fear, blurred vision, vomiting and loss of control of your bowels among other things. It may be part of an animals growl or roar that has a paralyzing affect on the intended victim. It can come from a lot of different sources and I wonder if this may have some thing to do with people wandering off and taking off their shoes or other pieces of clothing. Infra sound seems to affect some people and animals more than others. It also may be a tool of some animals to paralyze their prey.
There's a short article at this link that gives a little more information about it and sources of it. http://www.strangerdimensions.com/20...ear-frequency/
Below is a video where infra sound is discussed and the possibility of tigers using it to paralyze their prey.
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I never thought about it that way. It does make sense because predators do things for a reason. If they're in a confrontation with an adversary , they're not going to waste any energy on anything that isn't necessary. But do they actually roar at prey when there is no reason other than intimidation?
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
hoarder
do they actually roar at prey when there is no reason other than intimidation?
Good question and I don't know the answer and haven't heard any answer to that. Dogs hear sounds that we don't and it's interesting in a lot of missing person searches the tracking or cadaver dogs won't hunt or track. They just sit down and refuse to do anything. I wonder if they're hearing infra sound.
I've listened to stories hunters tell of feeling anxiety or extreme fear for no obvious reason when nothing dangerous was in sight but sometimes appeared after they had those feelings. Were they picking up on infra sound and were they receiving a level of it that was causing those feelings of fear?
Tim Baker said the sound you hear in the spring when turkeys are strutting and dragging their wings on the ground is infra sound. I hear that a lot in the spring because I have a lot of turkeys around. I can be in the house and will hear a low rumble and also feel it in my chest. From what I recall of what he said there are different levels of infra sound and the different levels have different effects. What the turkeys are doing is a mating call.
Some animals do seem to communicate with infra sound and may also use it for other things such as paralyzing their prey with extreme fear.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
Tumbleweed
From what I gather after listening to a lot of these stories here that I"v posted and others that you should never go off in the wilderness alone and if you do a 44 magnum, 357 magnum or 45-70 rifle seem to be the minimum requirements if you don't want to disappear or have some one find only your shoes after you've turned up missing.
I've got a 45-70 rifle, but I like to fly fish, so I take a small concealable 38 special +P revolver with some hot loads with me. It fits nicely in my right front pocket, and I keep it loaded while fly fishing with a couple of speed loaders ready. I wonder what you all think if that is sufficient enough for self defense while out in the woods alone. I tend to fish and hike alone.
This is an eye opening thread, and I've watched about 5 videos already. Some of the disappearances just seem to make no sense.
Regarding the shoes. A theory about that comes to mind. Sometimes folks take off their shoes while taking a break from hiking, to air out their feet, move their toes, check for blisters, adjust socks, etc. Whatever. At that time, they are not moving, sitting down usually (which makes them look small and indefensible). Plus, they are focused on their feet, looking down at them, not aware of their surroundings. That's the perfect time for a predator to attack.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
Hitch
I've got a 45-70 rifle, but I like to fly fish, so I take a small concealable 38 special +P revolver with some hot loads with me. It fits nicely in my right front pocket, and I keep it loaded while fly fishing with a couple of speed loaders ready. I wonder what you all think if that is sufficient enough for self defense while out in the woods alone. I tend to fish and hike alone.
I guess it would depend on what was stalking you or what you might encounter. The gun and ammo in this video below I'll post should be sufficient to deal with any threat you might encounter.
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The top five explanations for disappearances in the wilderness.
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More on the Colorado bear attack
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news...est-of-boulder More at link
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Bear attacks camp staffer at Glacier View Ranch Christian retreat northwest of Boulder
Eric Lupher, Amanda del Castillo
UPDATE: Officials said Monday they have killed a bear believed to be the one that attacked a camper. Get the latest details here.
BOULDER COUNTY, Colo. -- Parks and wildlife officials are looking for a dangerous bear that attacked a Christian camp staffer and dragged him roughly ten feet from his campsite in Boulder County early Sunday morning.
The attack happened around 4 a.m. at Glacier View Ranch, a Christian camp site located northwest of Boulder in the Town of Ward.
Officials told Denver7 the 19-year-old staffer, named Dylan, woke up to the bear biting his head and trying to drag him away. Fellow staffers tried to scare the bear away to save the teen's life. The animal eventually left on its own.
"The crunching noise, I guess, was the teeth scraping against the skull as it dug in," Dylan told Denver7's Amanda del Castillo.
Dylan said he and four other staffers were in sleeping bags along the camp's lakefront.
"It grabbed me like this and pulled me. Then it bit the back of my head and drug me," he said, pointing to scars on his forehead.
Dylan said the bear dragged him ten to 12-feet away before he was able to free himself. "When it was dragging me, that was the slowest part. It felt like it went forever."
Wilderness Survival is something he is very familiar with, teaching the subject at camp.
"I'm not afraid of the bears. I'm not afraid of sleeping outside anymore. You just have to be aware and respect the animals," Dylan said.
Following the attack, Dylan was taken to a hospital and has already been released, according to Jennifer Churchill with Colorado Parks and Wildlife.
Dan Hansen, director for the Glacier View Ranch, told Denver7 the bear wandered into the main area of campus where several staff members were sleeping. "Unprovoked, the bear proceeded to attack one staff member," he said.
"Campers were not threatened or involved at any time," Hansen said in a press release obtained by Denver7.
A summer camp program at Glacier View Ranch will continue through July 16, Hansen said in a statement, adding that staff is trained for contact, interaction and incidents with wildlife including moose, wild cats and bears.
But Park and Wildlife officials said that "the dangerous bear is still in the wild" and has not been caught by authorities. Officials are asking outdoor enthusiasts to be extra vigilant.
This most recent bear encounter comes after four bears were killed in the Durango area on Wednesday.
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Re: Vanishing in the wilderness
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Originally Posted by
monty
That was the only link I had any luck with. No details on just exactly what he did to fight off the bear. The Ranger said it was not common behavior for a Black Bear. If you were to say something is not common human behavior, it would sure cover a lot of ground.
Large predators do have typical behavior patterns but they are individuals subject to different levels of curiosity, temper, agressiveness etc.
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Another video here done by Rusty West of ten disappearances in national and state parks. I see in the comments that person #10 Andrew McCracken has been found and is home with his family. No explanation of why he disappeared in the news story at this link though.
http://www.actionnewsnow.com/story/3...ng-gridley-man
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Aliens. Didn't Eisenhower meet with aliens and make some kind of deal? The aliens would share technology but they wanted to harvest humans to study and breed with. Eisenhower said okay but don't make it obvious.
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^ I read a story like that in the past but I have no idea if there's any truth to it. I've never seen a UFO or a Bigfoot but I've heard stories of people who claim to have seen things like that and they sound credible. I'll be damned if I know if they really do exist. I'd have to see something like that to make up my mind and I've been out in the wilderness and I never saw anything unusual along those lines.
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The big cat population is so dense here, they're literally on top of each other (Socal mountains at 7000'). Kids go missing often. The parents turn their heads and the kids are gone.
I mountain bike and hike 100% solo. Most times I have two large dogs. I always have a 10mm in a Hill People chest rig.
