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Thread: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

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    The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"


    The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"



    "It’s to cause a break in contact, not to render that person incapable. So, if we just confidently present or actually shoot someone with a .380 and the guy runs off, is that a success? Absolutely. That’s all we care about. Now, to a law enforcement officer, that would be a failure because he couldn’t put the bracelets on them, but in our case, we don’t care."



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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Be sure and place the second shot in his head so he doesn't sue you.

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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Book, you have an extremely poor concept of what happens when someone gets shot and the inadequacy of the .380 aka 9mm Kurz. There's this thing called "a dead man's five seconds" whereby someone who has been fatally wounded has enough time to kill YOU. When I traveled in lawman circles many years ago a constant topic of conversation was about how cops would empty a full mag of 9mm into someone on drugs and not only did they remain in the fight they frequently survived (this was well before the widespread use of high performance bonded pistol ammo, and in the above cited cases the 9mm ammo was FMJ, known for lack of expansion and over-penetrating).

    In the video below you can see the guy engaging the cop get shot multiple times with the cop's service pistol (you can bet it was bonded bullets he was getting hit with) and he STILL remains 'in the fight' (more or less) and potentially deadly for AT LEAST 16 seconds. 16 seconds is a LONG time in a deadly encounter. Note that at the end of the video the cop did NOT approach what appears to be a completely incapacitated shootee because he still regards him as dangerous. I know of a case of road rage in Michigan where two CHL holders shot each other to death (dead man's five seconds came into play).

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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by midnight rambler View Post
    I know of a case of road rage in Michigan where two CHL holders shot each other to death (dead man's five seconds came into play).
    Likely that is what happened in the final shootout between Gordon Kahl and the sheriff in which both died from gunshots to the back.

    http://www.encyclopediaofarkansas.ne...x?entryID=5483

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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by ziero0 View Post
    Likely that is what happened in the final shootout between Gordon Kahl and the sheriff in which both died from gunshots to the back.

    http://www.encyclopediaofarkansas.ne...x?entryID=5483
    The two CHL holders shot each in the chest IIRC. Don’t think the one who fired the first shot had time to turn.
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." --Aristotle

    "If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable-what then?" --George Orwell

    "It's not a matter of what is true (reality) that counts but a matter of what is perceived to be true (reality)." --Henry Kissinger

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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by midnight rambler View Post
    Book, you have an extremely poor concept of what happens when someone gets shot and the inadequacy of the .380 aka 9mm Kurz. There's this thing called "a dead man's five seconds" whereby someone who has been fatally wounded has enough time to kill YOU. When I traveled in lawman circles many years ago a constant topic of conversation was about how cops would empty a full mag of 9mm into someone on drugs and not only did they remain in the fight they frequently survived (this was well before the widespread use of high performance bonded pistol ammo, and in the above cited cases the 9mm ammo was FMJ, known for lack of expansion and over-penetrating).

    In the video below you can see the guy engaging the cop get shot multiple times with the cop's service pistol (you can bet it was bonded bullets he was getting hit with) and he STILL remains 'in the fight' (more or less) and potentially deadly for AT LEAST 16 seconds. 16 seconds is a LONG time in a deadly encounter. Note that at the end of the video the cop did NOT approach what appears to be a completely incapacitated shootee because he still regards him as dangerous. I know of a case of road rage in Michigan where two CHL holders shot each other to death (dead man's five seconds came into play).

    It looked like in the first round of shots, that he was hit once in his left shoulder. So he may not have been fatally injured at all, an indication is he continues yelling at the cop. At the second round he falls immediately to the ground and loses his gun.

    Accuracy beats fire power...
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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by midnight rambler View Post
    Book, you have an extremely poor concept of what happens when someone gets shot and the inadequacy of the .380 aka 9mm Kurz. There's this thing called "a dead man's five seconds" whereby someone who has been fatally wounded has enough time to kill YOU. When I traveled in lawman circles many years ago a constant topic of conversation was about how cops would empty a full mag of 9mm into someone on drugs and not only did they remain in the fight they frequently survived (this was well before the widespread use of high performance bonded pistol ammo, and in the above cited cases the 9mm ammo was FMJ, known for lack of expansion and over-penetrating).

    In the video below you can see the guy engaging the cop get shot multiple times with the cop's service pistol (you can bet it was bonded bullets he was getting hit with) and he STILL remains 'in the fight' (more or less) and potentially deadly for AT LEAST 16 seconds. 16 seconds is a LONG time in a deadly encounter. Note that at the end of the video the cop did NOT approach what appears to be a completely incapacitated shootee because he still regards him as dangerous. I know of a case of road rage in Michigan where two CHL holders shot each other to death (dead man's five seconds came into play).

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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by ziero0 View Post
    Likely that is what happened in the final shootout between Gordon Kahl and the sheriff in which both died from gunshots to the back.

    http://www.encyclopediaofarkansas.ne...x?entryID=5483
    Another version of what happened to Gordon Kahl below starting at about the 7:00 minute mark.



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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuro View Post
    It looked like in the first round of shots, that he was hit once in his left shoulder. So he may not have been fatally injured at all, an indication is he continues yelling at the cop. At the second round he falls immediately to the ground and loses his gun.

    Accuracy beats fire power...
    Shootee fired two rounds just prior to him going down, it appears to me that cop nailed shootee with fatal shot(s) in first five rounds (unable to see effect of 2nd four rounds cop fired, but those shots appeared wild since cop was on the move). I checked timing of the two videos, cop did not shoot at shootee immediately prior to shootee going down - shootee was already dead when shootee fired those two shots just prior to going down (dead man's five seconds).
    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." --Aristotle

    "If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable-what then?" --George Orwell

    "It's not a matter of what is true (reality) that counts but a matter of what is perceived to be true (reality)." --Henry Kissinger

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    Militant Wing of the Salvation Army midnight rambler's Avatar
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    Re: The PURPOSE of a "Pocket Pistol"

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuro View Post
    It looked like in the first round of shots, that he was hit once in his left shoulder.
    I submit shootee was hit center of mass and his reaction to that center of mass shot was drawing in his left shoulder just like LHO reacted to being gut shot by Jack Ruby.

    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." --Aristotle

    "If both the past and the external world exist only in the mind, and if the mind itself is controllable-what then?" --George Orwell

    "It's not a matter of what is true (reality) that counts but a matter of what is perceived to be true (reality)." --Henry Kissinger

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