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Thread: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Federal P

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by boogietillyapuke View Post
    I can't count on both hands the number of times I've been dispatched to support Florida firefighting helicopters that were sent to control escaped federal "controlled burns". Ocala, Apalachicola, Oceola National Forests, Eglin AFB all come back to memory.
    It's the same here in Western Montana. Where I live the land is 97% National Forest. USFS does their "prescribed burns" every year to remove excess fuels. The concept of removing excess fuels is sound, but is best done by logging companies, not gummit employees and their corrupt contractors. In spring and summer there almost always seems to be smoke in the air. USFS is the worst polluter in the area.
    The old timers around here tell me of the seventies and eighties when the forests were being logged. The air was clear and whenever a fire started, the loggers in the area and other locals put it out right away. Back then the old logging roads were open.

    The USFS has obliterated many logging roads for cosmetic reasons and allowed many other roads to become completely overgrown and unusable so that when there is a fire, they can't get in there to put it out.

    When the USFS has major fires, they spend ten times an much time and 100 times as much money to put it out as the loggers and locals did in decades past. They use a lot of private firfighting contractors and the graft and corruption is unbelievable. They get them all out there and order them to "stand down" and let the fire spread to justify the costs. after the fire is put out, they spend another week out there doing nothing just to charge time.

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    It's the same here in Western Montana. Where I live the land is 97% National Forest. USFS does their "prescribed burns" every year to remove excess fuels. The concept of removing excess fuels is sound, but is best done by logging companies, not gummit employees and their corrupt contractors. In spring and summer there almost always seems to be smoke in the air. USFS is the worst polluter in the area.
    The old timers around here tell me of the seventies and eighties when the forests were being logged. The air was clear and whenever a fire started, the loggers in the area and other locals put it out right away. Back then the old logging roads were open.

    The USFS has obliterated many logging roads for cosmetic reasons and allowed many other roads to become completely overgrown and unusable so that when there is a fire, they can't get in there to put it out.

    When the USFS has major fires, they spend ten times an much time and 100 times as much money to put it out as the loggers and locals did in decades past. They use a lot of private firfighting contractors and the graft and corruption is unbelievable. They get them all out there and order them to "stand down" and let the fire spread to justify the costs. after the fire is put out, they spend another week out there doing nothing just to charge time.
    Very good example of what ever the national gov bureaucracy touches they will screw it up in some shape form or fashion. Things like you stated needs to be done by people that live and work on the land in the area.

    And not some politician driven endeavor.
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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by Dogman View Post
    Very good example of what ever the national gov bureaucracy touches they will screw it up in some shape form or fashion. Things like you stated needs to be done by people that live and work on the land in the area.

    And not some politician driven endeavor.
    All this is possible only because of distant control. If the state or county was in charge of National Forests, it would be much more difficult for them to get by with it. Even the Democrats hate the USFS here.

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    All this is possible only because of distant control. If the state or county was in charge of National Forests, it would be much more difficult for them to get by with it. Even the Democrats hate the USFS here.
    I agree with you completely on this.
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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    It's the same here in Western Montana. Where I live the land is 97% National Forest. USFS does their "prescribed burns" every year to remove excess fuels. The concept of removing excess fuels is sound, but is best done by logging companies, not gummit employees and their corrupt contractors. In spring and summer there almost always seems to be smoke in the air. USFS is the worst polluter in the area.
    The old timers around here tell me of the seventies and eighties when the forests were being logged. The air was clear and whenever a fire started, the loggers in the area and other locals put it out right away. Back then the old logging roads were open.

    The USFS has obliterated many logging roads for cosmetic reasons and allowed many other roads to become completely overgrown and unusable so that when there is a fire, they can't get in there to put it out.

    When the USFS has major fires, they spend ten times an much time and 100 times as much money to put it out as the loggers and locals did in decades past. They use a lot of private firfighting contractors and the graft and corruption is unbelievable. They get them all out there and order them to "stand down" and let the fire spread to justify the costs. after the fire is put out, they spend another week out there doing nothing just to charge time.
    The last year that I worked in the Kenworth truck shop in Reno, Nevada, 2002 we did a lot of maintenance work on BLM fire fighting equipment and also for the sub contractors who somehow or another had purchased previously owned BLM fire fighting rigs.

    In a conversation with one of those contractor types he told me that fighting fires on government land was a 2 billion dollar a year industry in 2002. I had always speculated many were intentional, not prescribed burns. The two billion dollar number only served to strengthen my suspiscions

    Also a fire needed to be over a certain number of acres before it qualified for federal funds. I think it was 10 acres, but in the 1990's lightning started a fire on the southwest of Reno. The gov't firefighters allowed it to get big enough to qualify for federal money. The fire got out of control, turning into a real disaster burning some private homes in a rather exclusive area of Reno. Government efficiancy at its best.
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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by monty View Post

    Also a fire needed to be over a certain number of acres before it qualified for federal funds. I think it was 10 acres,
    They will respond to fires smaller than that. I have seen them respond to an 8 acre fire nearby and it was less than that when they responded. They also respond to fires on private lands adjacent to National Forest. Sometimes they will send you a bill afterwards. Yes, all that money they get to fight fires and they want to harass private landowners who pay taxes for firefighting by billing them for fires on private land.

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by hoarder View Post
    They will respond to fires smaller than that. I have seen them respond to an 8 acre fire nearby and it was less than that when they responded. They also respond to fires on private lands adjacent to National Forest. Sometimes they will send you a bill afterwards. Yes, all that money they get to fight fires and they want to harass private landowners who pay taxes for firefighting by billing them for fires on private land.

    I should have clarified my statement. The did respond, but deliberately allowed the fire to spread beyond 10 acres before making any real attempt to extinguish it.
    The only thing declared necessary in the Constitution & Bill of Rights is the #2A Militia of the several States.
    “A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a freeState”
    https://ConstitutionalMilitia.org


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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by Cebu_4_2 View Post
    Reminds me of a game where you should know when to hold 'em and know when to fold 'em. Feel bad for them but if it was me I think I would have folded and moved on a while back.
    You obviously don't understand people who make their living with the land, especially those with ties going back several generations on the same property. Most of us would make them kill us before we would leave.
    I'm not saying forget what you lost.
    I suppose there's a purpose in pain.
    What we make of ourselves has a cost,
    and it's paid every time we take hold of the reins.

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by monty View Post
    I should have clarified my statement. The did respond, but deliberately allowed the fire to spread beyond 10 acres before making any real attempt to extinguish it.
    In Montana landowners pay county tax for firefighting. It's actually listed on my tax bill. Like everything else, the funding system is probably too convoluted for most people to track down. They might have one policy for fires on remote USFS land, another policy for fires on private land and another for BLM land and so on.

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    Re: BLM Going After Hammond Family! Declared Terrorists Sentenced to 5 Years in Feder

    Quote Originally Posted by horseshoe3 View Post
    You obviously don't understand people who make their living with the land, especially those with ties going back several generations on the same property. Most of us would make them kill us before we would leave.
    I do understand however I had to make a choice and uproot myself and family or risk jail/prison and fines. What man would I be if I chose exorbitant fines and jail time while leaving my family to fend for themselves? I know when to fold 'em, not pretty but better than the options at the time.
    Jackie did it and you know it!

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