Bartering And Horse Trading (Part Duh)

[agnut]

Some great deals there spectrism. Please keep sharing your good fortunes. I loved your quote :

“When we lack knowledge - I am certain we miss out. If you know values and uses, you can drive the deal how it needs to go.”

And will put it in my quote collection.


Well, well, well…. So agnut is still alive and kickin’. Who’da thunk ?

It has been a very long time since my last post. Life has been greatly accelerated around here of late. Taking care of chickens, steers, family peccadilloes, tragedies, fruits and veggies by the ton, deals, competition, business slowdown, money tightness, lots of cold and rain, mud, and much more. I thought retirement was a time in which I could sit back and suck up mint juleps on the veranda. Boy was I wrong ! I may have to go back to work to slow down.

But there have also been new friendships, new opportunities, new ways of looking at things, expansion of mind (at least I like to think).

I’ve been buying books, tools, appliances, clothes, barb wire and lots of other stuff. Since it turned cold and rainy there have been only a couple of estate/garage sales locally per week. But that hasn’t stopped me. I do have to be there before opening time. In the first place, the competition is fierce with as many as 50 cars showing up. And in the second place, it is wise to be there ½ hour early because the sellers will open earlier than their posted time. If I was only on time, most of the items would be already sold.

I attribute this high activity to the economy; everybody is looking for a deal to save more of their dwindling so called discretionary money. They are wising up to what I’ve known for years. And that is that fiat dollars are best gotten rid of in favor of real three dimensional items. Remember the hyperinflation of 1922-23 Germany. They were even trading German Marks for brass doorknobs in order to have something that would rise in price as time passed. That was at the end of the hyperinflationary period, just before the new currency was issued. Well, what we have here and now is the same thing but in slow motion. Things I bought 5 years ago have risen in price beyond inflation.

“The treasury’s bare,”
“The country’s bankrupt, they won’t admit it, and that’s why there’s so much anger and frustration, because it’s hard to divvy up loot when there’s none to divvy up.”
Ron Paul in an interview on Fox news December 17, 2012.

Now I don’t know how things will play out in that we could either experience high inflation or there being too little currency around to buy things. Or, gulp, BOTH ! Having no dollars saved could be very difficult in either case. So even though I hate having dollars around with possible high inflation looming, I cannot leave myself financially naked. I guess it is a matter of where I would be most comfortable, even with all the uncertainty. Who knows, maybe having many bricks of nickels and a bathtub full of change like the story of the lady in 1922-23 Germany would ride me through safely as it did her. Ponce is a firm believer in keeping lots of change for this possibility of a dollar devaluation. It takes little to imagine coins disappearing from the public when that happens. Gresham’s Law and all that.

Okay, here are some of my purchases which I so shamelessly present for your perusal ( don’t hate me because I am beautiful because I’m not. You could envy me because I find so many great deals) :

Near new Maytag washer and propane dryer for $250. Just what I was looking for as I’m changing from an electric dryer to propane; also the oven and hot water heater. Should cut my electric bills down as well put less strain on my backup battery and inverter system. Still haven’t hooked up the Lister 12K diesel generator because still looking for a good electrician.

Chest freezer for $50. It would cost about $400 if new.

20 pounds of insulated single strand copper wire for $5. Heavy ground wire type.

4 85 pound rolls of barb wire with 4 loose partial rolls for $20 total. The store price with tax is about $440.
I need it to fence off our property. Next I need a couple of hundred metal posts. I heard that Craig’s list has them offered, since I’m not going to spend $1,400 for new fence posts (about $7 each).

12 power saw blades $2 total. I probably have about 60 spare blades now.

Lufkin 100’ tape measure for $1.

7 round files and holder for chain saw sharpening for $1.

3 near new 13 inch tires on rims for $10 total.

Electric coffee bean grinder for $2.

3 drawer secretary, dovetailed drawers and all solid wood in excellent condition for $25. I already have one but it is considerably smaller and I am selling it to a friend for her daughter‘s room for $25. Trading up to what you really need/want can sometimes be a most satisfying side benefit of bartering and horse trading.

A box with 57 dies from 1 3/8” down to 6X20 (tiny), 95 taps from ¾” down to very small, 8 tap handles all for $10. The largest die alone is $55 new. Got the whole box for $10.

Over the last several months I must have purchased a hundred smaller items that were 5 to 10 percent of their new price. Things I need or will need as well as things others will need.

Now I know that there are two types of folks reading this; the first who are also out there buying and finding deals like me and happy for me and the second who are not and thinking just who is this SOB agnut who has the audacity to throw these deals in our face. So let’s ALL get out there and kick some financial butt !



Best wishes,

Agnut

P.S. Tomorrow a couple of new friends are coming over to hang out for the day and dinner. Beefalo crock potted with carrots, onions and potatoes. Just melts in your mouth. I met them at a garage sale recently and they stood out as fascinating and especially nice people. Can’t think of a better benefit from bartering and horse trading.

"To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty, to find the best in others; to leave the world a little better; whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is the meaning of success. "
Ralph Waldo Emerson

[gunDriller]

old stuff is useful.

people throw away half-broken things like they have no use.

i got a large microwave oven with a broken dish-that-rotates.

great for heating water ... and you can do a LOT with hot water.


also the power supply in a microwave oven is the exact size/spec for a DC-to-AC inverter, great gift for do-it-yourself-ers.

AND most scrap places will pay scrap steel price for an used microwave. 5.5 to 10 cents a pound, depending.

[govcheetos]

Good to hear from you again Agnut. I hope life smooths out for you soon. I always enjoy this thread and the wife and I have become avid yard salers. I think I'll start posting up some of my finds on a weekly basis. The game has definantly changed in the last year or so. A lot more people have started to become aware of what some things are worth both monetarily and in the event of hard times. Still a lot of good deals to be had for literally pennies on the dollar.

A couple of techniques I'll share:

First off I tend to compare the price of things to the price of gas and the price of a budweiser in a bar. Both currently in the 3-4 dollar range depending. Remember though that both of these things are something that you consume and then no longer have. If i can find something for the price of a beer that is a quality tangible item that was built before everything came from china, its probably a good deal.

Secondly, wait to discuss prices until you're done shopping and have everything in a big pile. Most people having a sale are looking more to get rid of stuff than to make a lot of money. I'm sometimes bad about seeing something I like and asking the price and then paying it. My wife gets on me about it. She piles up the good stuff and when she's done asks the price. Some sales have prices marked and the seller will add everything up and expect the full price with little negotiation. Others willing negotiate with no problem. Some can't add and say "Uh,... I don't know, just give me 5 bucks and take it." The last one is where we really clean up getting stuff for 10-20 percent of what their price was not to mention how much off retail we saved.

[agnut]

old stuff is useful.

people throw away half-broken things like they have no use.

i got a large microwave oven with a broken dish-that-rotates.

great for heating water ... and you can do a LOT with hot water.


also the power supply in a microwave oven is the exact size/spec for a DC-to-AC inverter, great gift for do-it-yourself-ers.

AND most scrap places will pay scrap steel price for an used microwave. 5.5 to 10 cents a pound, depending.

Hi gunDriller, thanks for the microwave idea. A canned food or many food items can be heated in a bowl of hot water. Sounds simple but useful at times.

You mentioned the scrap value of an old microwave oven. I wonder about the scrap value of an old washer, dryer, freezer or refrigerator. I have a friend who professionally bought and sold scrap metals for years. She is really sharp on what metals are worth and where and when to get the best prices. She said that sometimes an auction for pallets of scrap truck differentials would be bid for almost nothing. She could buy them and the same day run them across the scales for a healthy profit. Quick profits.

One time she saw pallet loads of used bricks that a company was going to throw away because they still had cement on them and were judged as too laborious to clean. She got them for free and took them to another place that paid her over $1,000.

The key is that you have to know the real value of items and what to do with these items. As encouragement, I will say that the more times you do this, the easier it gets. Also, connections increase and therefore more options avail themselves.

And lastly you mentioned DC-to-AC inverters inside the microwaves. I would have to check into their specifications and if they are suitable for a small electrical system for emergencies. If they did pan out, it may be wise to get old microwaves and strip the inverters out before scrapping them. I wonder what they would be worth in a power outage system. A good friend is an electronics genius and if I think of it, I will ask him about this.

I have a 24 battery pack with two 3000 watt inverters and am still investigating how I may want to recharge them.

Yesterday I was on eBay looking at steam engines since they can be run on a wood heated boiler. Imagine being able to heat your house and recharge your batteries at the same time. And with wood too; great if fuel prices go through the roof or are scarce. We live on 10 wooded acres too. Kinda retro thinking but sometimes unusual times beget unusual solutions. I need a steam engine that puts out about 3-5 HP. At least this is what I am shooting for.

I recently purchased a 3 HP diesel engine for hooking up to an alternator for recharging. I don’t know when I may get around to it with so much to do around here. My 12K Lister diesel is for whole household use and running the well pump and recharging the batteries at the same time. But the little 3 HP diesel would use lots less fuel than the Lister and be used only for battery charging.

Yesterday a couple of friends dropped by and brought a guest who had installed solar systems. Wow ! Another connection. He said that the Solendra system generated twice the electricity at 130% of the cost of other systems. Also that the Solendra system was designed to last for 30 years against 20 years design for the other systems. I will have to check into this.

For a guy who wrote a short post, you sure said a lot. Thanks again.

Agnut

"To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty, to find the best in others; to leave the world a little better; whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is the meaning of success. "
Ralph Waldo Emerson

[agnut]

Good to hear from you again Agnut. I hope life smooths out for you soon. I always enjoy this thread and the wife and I have become avid yard salers. I think I'll start posting up some of my finds on a weekly basis. The game has definantly changed in the last year or so. A lot more people have started to become aware of what some things are worth both monetarily and in the event of hard times. Still a lot of good deals to be had for literally pennies on the dollar.

A couple of techniques I'll share:

First off I tend to compare the price of things to the price of gas and the price of a budweiser in a bar. Both currently in the 3-4 dollar range depending. Remember though that both of these things are something that you consume and then no longer have. If i can find something for the price of a beer that is a quality tangible item that was built before everything came from china, its probably a good deal.

Secondly, wait to discuss prices until you're done shopping and have everything in a big pile. Most people having a sale are looking more to get rid of stuff than to make a lot of money. I'm sometimes bad about seeing something I like and asking the price and then paying it. My wife gets on me about it. She piles up the good stuff and when she's done asks the price. Some sales have prices marked and the seller will add everything up and expect the full price with little negotiation. Others willing negotiate with no problem. Some can't add and say "Uh,... I don't know, just give me 5 bucks and take it." The last one is where we really clean up getting stuff for 10-20 percent of what their price was not to mention how much off retail we saved.

Hi govcheetos. I have finally come to the conclusion that life will never smooth out for me. Everywhere I look, there are projects to finish and people to deal with. And looking back over my life, it has mostly been extremely busy in comparison with others around me. That’s how I roll. But time is catching up with me; I’ll be 66 next week and am feeling my age. After loading a chest freezer I got at an estate sale, I slipped and fell off of the tailgate and clobbered my right leg. It is still a bit swollen and sore but getting better.

The lesson here is to pace yourself when working hard. And have your wits about you at all times. I just wasn’t thinking of where I was and preoccupied with other deals still to be finalized.

Glad to hear that you and your wife are both avid garage salers. Nothing like having a partner to share your joys with. I would greatly appreciate your posting of your deals made.

And yes, the playing field has changed in the last year or so. In the past I have written about the descending hordes of 50 buyers at a garage sale. And they arrive in late cars and well dressed. Didn’t used to be this way. Also, I recommend arriving ½ hour earlier than the opening time and patiently waiting for the seller to give the okay. This has become VERY important because most sellers are not professionals and will often let you in early. Of course, this is where you get the first grab at all the goodies.

I believe that there will be a lot of sellers this year what with the economy being so bad. All of the new money the govt created out of thin air went to the bankers, Wall street and govt spending. The only “trickle down” was on our heads and I don’t mean water. So money never got to us little guys. I would advise to keep a considerable amount of cash in case a flood of deals suddenly appear. I collect $1, $5 and $10 bills for sales. This is to back up larger sums for the really big deals. There have even been times where I traded rolled coins (bricks of nickels especially) with my son for dollar bills. Later I traded back for the coins since I believe, as Ponce does, that coins may well become much more valuable in the future.

I buy things I may need as well as some things I want as well as spare backups for things I use. At the same time I’m looking for anything that is a steal and I may be able to sell later for more. A few days ago I went to an estate sale; when I drove up the seller said that everything had been sold. Undeterred, I saw several items still out there for sale. I got a large plastic bin with about 20 gardening tools and an electric drill for a package price of $3. There were 4 large Pioneer speakers in excellent condition I got for $1 each. I don’t need them but they were so cheap that I couldn’t resist. Some young person will probably want them for their house or garage. Even if I sell them for only $20, that will be a 5x profit. Not much cash but I believe that a future garage sale I hold should have a wide variety of items. After buying and not selling for the past 6 years, I have a humongous pile of items that I can sell.

Something that Ponce always tells me is that I should hold onto everything because it will be gold in the future. His experience with Cuba and how everything is scarce is where he is coming from. Perhaps after we no longer are importing goods from around the world we will be in the same predicament as Cuba. The times they are a changin’. Gotta go with the flow.

So your $3 to $4 Budweiser and gasoline rule of thumb sounds, well….sound. The little items may not seem like much but a pile of them can also add up to a pile of money. And in this economy, the little items should sell easily. Remember, you don’t make the money selling the item; you make the money buying the item. Because no matter how hard you try, you won’t make a profit if you paid too much.

The technique I use is to gather up in a pile all of the items I want and ask the seller to give me a package price for everything. This is a bit aggressive even though it may not sound like it is. I have served my offer and expectation to the seller and it is now in his/her court. This way, they have to add up (as you say) and usually offer a healthy discount. So rather than asking the price for a pile of items, ask for a “package price”. This has almost always worked for me.

I drive to sales in an old 1990 Dodge pickup truck, unwashed. And I wear an old pair of pants and a worn out jacket. Appearances are important. Sometimes I ask the seller if they have plenty of $1 bills because I have a wad of them. This softens them up as well as relieves them; a personal touch. Doesn’t cost anything and shows you are considerate of their situation.

Glad to see you here posting; this website is made of many special people who are most willing to share their wisdom and advice. We are like a family; even better in some ways.

Best wishes,

Agnut

"To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty, to find the best in others; to leave the world a little better; whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is the meaning of success. "
Ralph Waldo Emerson

[govcheetos]

Didn't go to any sales today due to crappy weather for the weekend plus only one being advertized. The one advertised was somewhat far and didn't list anything I would be interested in. I always check craigslist the night before for advertised sales and compile a list in the order I want to go to them. The list obviously goes by start time, most at 8 am but some at 7 am. I also compile the list according to listed items that interest me. If one ad lists "lots of tools" i'm going to that one over one that lists mostly bookshelves, tv's, and baby clothes. I also go by what area of town they are in. Some areas have been built more recently and these people generally have accumulated less good stuff. If there is an estate sale in the older neighborhoods it is usually a gold mine of old stuff that was quality built a few to several decades ago. This is just what im interested in though. For example, I don't have kids, but if I did it would be great shopping for them at garage sales. Especially baby clothes and toys. Most of this stuff was bought for the kid by the moms friends at a baby shower and a lot of it still has the tags on it. No way would I pay retail for anything baby or kid related. I tell some of my friends with young children and they kind of turn up their nose at the idea. Oh well. If I'm at a sale and they don't have anything I'm interested in I always ask if they have any tools or "guy stuff". Sometimes this works to bring out something. I always keep in mind of other sales going on too. Don't waste your time chit chatting too much if there is nothing you want because somewhere at the next sale someone is buying the deal of the century.

Just to give some non garage salers an idea of whats out there I'll post up some of my more memorable recent finds:

5 hp push lawnmower--$5. Lady said it didn't run and she didn't know why. I took it home and put gas in it, runs like a brand new one!

Silver bracelet made by Tiffany Co.--25 cents! Was in with a bunch of junk costume jewelery.

(4) 1 gallon jugs of Mercury Quicksilver tcw-3 outboard oil--$2 each. This stuff retails for $20 plus and doesn't go bad.

14 foot utility/landscape trailer with wood deck, steel mesh loading ramp and 15 inch good year tires and rims includes a spare tire too--$300 This trailer would retail for $1500-$1700 and sell used for $800-$1200. Trailer wasn't even for sale, I got it because I asked about it and they said to make them an offer. Probably could have gotten it for a little less, but I'm careful not to embarrass myself or insult someone with crazy low ball offers.

(2) plastic gun cases--$1 each One holds two rifles and one holds only one.

Echo 305 chainsaw--$15 runs like a champ when you put gas in it! I had to put a new chain on it which costs more than I paid for the saw.

Deep well Husky brand socket set--$1 Was missing 1 socket.

Garden tractor with 25 hp Kohler Command engine and Hydrostatic transmission--$100. Had to put a $15 walmart battery in it and replace the seat with a $10 one out of the junk pile at the lawn mower store. If you look in the Northern Tools catalog just the engine new costs over $1800! This tractor is great around the yard and I've pulled trailers weighing a tad over 5000lbs with it.

Not every deal is as good as these, but i rarely buy anything for more than 20-30 percent of value, if not pennies on the dollar.

That's all for now good luck out there!

[govcheetos]

Not too many sales today due to cold weather. This time of year is usually slow anyway and will pick up with springtime approaching. Did find a couple deals though.

Got a pair of Motorola FR50 2 way radios--$5. Had to put some AA batteries in them. These are selling retail on the internet for up to $189.00! Used ones are going for $20-$40. These things have a 2 mile range and 14 channels.

Worked out a deal for a FREE load of scrap mahogony lumber for helping a friend move a large mechanics tool chest. I don't know anything about the price other than its expensive, but already have it going to a friend of two mutual friends who uses it on boats and high end street rods. It's good to "pay it forward" once in a while. He's driving 50+ miles to come pick it up and is tickled to death to be getting it for free, and I feel it will all come back to me eventually anyhow.

Did see a guy trying to sell circulated Morgans for $45! Spot price for silver today is $28.68 which would make Morgans worth about $22 and change. I hope he gets his price, just won't be from me!

That's all for now.

Good luck everyone!

[agnut]

Hi again govcheetos. Great post. Thanks.

After reading your post I had to laugh; it was the first time I had felt admiration bordering on envy. Now I know how some of my readers may feel at times from all of the deals I write about. Of course, the beauty of writing on the internet is that showing off with a big ego is obvious and misplaced. Often I am surprised at the deals I get and have to pinch myself. Why isn’t everyone doing this ? Well, I realize that I am merely ahead of the masses by many years. Bartering and horse trading became my way of life many years ago and I am so immersed in it that I have to sometimes catch myself when talking with others. My motivation is not bragging but rather trying to encourage others to see the light and take control of their financial lives. Besides, it is more exciting than most anything else I can imagine. Money saved is money earned.

Your qualifying and organizing the garage sales beforehand is what separates the looky loos from the pros.

Last Thursday I went to a moving sale that had many hundreds of items. Problem was that the sellers had priced most everything way too high. I did manage to get a 9’ breakdown fishing rod with a Penn reel for $20. Just what I’d been looking for. Also got a propane heater with a large full propane bottle for $35.

This morning I’m going to a moving sale that has a few items I am looking for if the price is right. It starts at 9:00 but I will be there at 8:30. I was 15 minutes early at the Thursday moving sale but the sellers had opened earlier and there were buyers walking out with items as I was going in. Not cool but we have to accept that this happens, especially in this economy. There were about 15 cars there when I arrived. Gotta change with the times.

In the past it had been sufficient to show up 15 minutes early and stand behind the ropes looking at what would be offered, licking our chops in anticipation. Nowadays we must be creative and possibly arrive as much as an hour early. In the past I have arrived early and offered to help in setting out their items and this has paid off well. Just a thought.

Someone told me that they buy an old power mower and cut the front metal out between the wheels and use it for clearing brush. Sounds potentially dangerous but I may try it.

Best wishes,

Agnut

P.S. Get ready for the months ahead as the weather changes; I expect more garage, moving and estate sales than ever. Don’t be in a hurry but calmly make a pile of items you want before anyone else has the chance. Unless the prices are outrageous, items are selling quickly. And even big ticket items if they are a steal. Many people still have money but are more discriminating than in the past. Tight money means tight buyers. A fool and his money have been parted long ago.

[freespirit]

Agnut-

"To laugh often and much; to win the respect of intelligent people and the affection of children; to earn the appreciation of honest critics and endure the betrayal of false friends; to appreciate beauty, to find the best in others; to leave the world a little better; whether by a healthy child, a garden patch or a redeemed social condition; to know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is the meaning of success. "
Ralph Waldo Emerson

...that is fantastic.

[govcheetos]

Went to pick up my free wood and it turns out it's African Sapele not mahogony. Still an awesome deal considering all I had to do is help a friend move a HEAVY tool chest. Plus as we were loading it he found another pile of smaller scraps under some junk in his garage. All together it fills an 8 ft pick up bed by about 1/3. The deals I listed above are recent deals over the last 6-8 months, definantly not all in one day of shopping. It still amazes me how so many people will pay full retail price for something just to sell it for literally pennies on the dollar to total strangers. Its borderline sinful the disrespect some of these people have for quality tools and equipment they either paid full price for with their money or their fathers or grandfathers bought and used and cared for properly. Agnut I agree about your statement about talking to others about your deals. Some smile and shake their head in amazement, others think you're outright BS-ing them.

Things work in a cycle and sometimes I think I'm so far behind the times that I'm actually ahead of the times. which reminds me of a bumper sticker I saw a while ago that said simply:

"The last human being on Earth will be a hunter gatherer."