150 Militia Take Over Makhuer National Wildlife Preserve Headquarters

[Bigjon]

BLM Destroying Ranches by Fire 002
Published on Dec 31, 2015
Days after the Hammonds were sentenced as "Arsenal Terrorists" the BLM started multiple fires that killed & injured cattle, burned homes and destroyed other property.

[7th trump]

So you have your private cattle on public land and they want you to stop grazing your private cattle on this public land.
You resist and they retaliate then you cry about it?

I wonder if the Hammonds gave a percentage of the profits to BLM for grazing on the land if this wouldnt have happened.
Seems to me the Hammonds want their cake and to eat it too!

Theres more to this story thats not being told.
What the heck did the Hammonds do to piss someone off at the BLM?
Sounds too fishy to me!
They bought other land with grazing rights and these rights are pulled as soon as the Hammonds set up shop there.
The Hammonds did or did not do something they were told to do or agreed too.

Its a shit hole desert...who gives a rats ass. I wouldnt graze any grass eater in the desert.
Mr. Hammond isnt a very smart rancher if you ask me.
Hes a cheap ass for sure.
Bet the meat tastes terrible beings its less than par of grazing quality grass.

[Bigjon]

I did not entice or encourage Ammon Bundy and his compañeros to take over a federal building. That was a huge mistake on his part part. Reading his Redress for Grievances I believe he knows and understands the federal district courts are legislative territorial courts operating on admiralty law. He should know by comandeering a federal building he is now in federal juridiction and has committed a federal crime.

Any one who falls into their US Citizen trap and does not excert his rights has no rights. A subject has no rights.

Is there any evidence that the Federal government got approval from the legislature of Oregon State and actually paid money for the property?

I doubt it.

[Bigjon]

So you have your private cattle on public land and they want you to stop grazing your private cattle on this public land.
You resist and they retaliate then you cry about it?

I wonder if the Hammonds gave a percentage of the profits to BLM for grazing on the land if this wouldnt have happened.
Seems to me the Hammonds want their cake and to eat it too!

Theres more to this story thats not being told.
What the heck did the Hammonds do to piss someone off at the BLM?
Sounds too fishy to me!
They bought other land with grazing rights and these rights are pulled as soon as the Hammonds set up shop there.
The Hammonds did or did not do something they were told to do or agreed too.

Its a shit hole desert...who gives a rats ass. I wouldnt graze any grass eater in the desert.
Mr. Hammond isnt a very smart rancher if you ask me.
Hes a cheap ass for sure.
Bet the meat tastes terrible beings its less than par of grazing quality grass.

Numbers is it really you!!
You shoot off your big mouth more than anyone I know, without making any sense.
Read here:http://gold-silver.us/forum/showthre...l=1#post809063

[Ares]

Is there any evidence that the Federal government got approval from the legislature of Oregon State and actually paid money for the property?

I doubt it.

Article 1 Section 8 Clause 17 stipulates that the Federal Government is only allowed to legislate and control land within the 10 mile square of The District of Columbia. Unless the land was sold to DC : "and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings;-" Like you said I highly doubt the Oregon legislature willingly sold off over half of the state to the Federal Government.

So under what authority or Jurisdiction does the Federal Government have? Imaginary jurisdiction if you ask me.

[monty]

Article 1 Section 8 Clause 17 stipulates that the Federal Government is only allowed to legislate and control land within the 10 mile square of The District of Columbia. Unless the land was sold to DC : "and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings;-" Like you said I highly doubt the Oregon legislature willingly sold off over half of the state to the Federal Government.

So under what authority or Jurisdiction does the Federal Government have? Imaginary jurisdiction if you ask me.

And the Property clause The Property Clause of the U.S. Constitution states that "Congress shall have Power to dispose of and make all needful Rules and Regulations respecting the Territory or other Property belonging to the United States ...." (Article IV, Section 3, Clause 2).
The Congress is to dispose of the public lands of the newly crated states, hence the Government Land Office that sold land and issued land patents signed by the president. The various homestead acts. Now the Government Land Office has been incorporated into the Bureau of Land Management and they suddenly decided thay own and can buy or steal more of the states land.

And Nevada was addmited to the Union with less than the required 60,000 people so the money grubbing Eastern bankers wanting control of our natural resourses romanced the politicians of the day into letting Nevada join the Union with less than 60,000 people if they would cede all the public land to the US. This was done before statehood without the consent of the state legislature and without purchasing it. I belive the 9th circuit court briefly addressed this in Gardner vs Nevada and agreed it was wrong, but since it was not in Gardener's original defence and was brought up on appeal the court couldn't consider it in the appeal case.

consequently the feds claim they own 87% of Nevada.

[midnight rambler]

What would Putin do?

The real question is: What's The Donald going to have to say about this when asked? You KNOW that's coming...the NYC central media control room operators are NOT going to pass up that opportunity.

[Ares]

Oregon Standoff: A Terrible Plan That We Might Be Stuck With

Well, there is whole host of things wrong with this situation, which is why I never supported or endorsed "Operation Hammond Freedom" to begin with. There is a lot of misinformation out there at this time on the debacle in Oregon, and certain alternative media outlets seem to be conveniently overlooking particular facts. I suspect that some people in the movement simply want to "kick it off" (a second American revolution), and they don't care if the circumstances of that kick-off are favorable or terrible (I realize "favorable" is relative, but starting this fight from a much stronger position is more than possible). This attitude was prevalent among some at Bundy Ranch, as certain groups refused to dig in positions for a real fight in the hopes that they would be "martyred" for the cause. This, in case you were wondering, is idiotic.

Oath Keepers including founder Stewart Rhodes was the only organization to predict how Ammon Bundy's vague calls for action on the part of the Hammond Family would actually play out. They received a lot of ignorant attacks in response, and yet, they were absolutely right.

Ammon, apparently trying to recreate what cannot be recreated, is looking for another Bundy Ranch stand-off. First, I would point out that such events can't be artificially fabricated. They have to happen in an organic way. Whenever a group of people attempt to engineer a revolutionary moment, even if their underlying motivations are righteous, it usually ends up kicking them in the ass (Fort Sumter is a good example). Ammon's wingmen appear to be Blaine Cooper aka Stanley Blaine Hicks (a convicted felon), and Ryan Payne (who claimed falsely during the Bundy Ranch standoff that he was an Army Ranger and who worked diligently to cause divisions between involved parties on the ground). This was the first sign that nothing good was going to come from the Hammond protest.

I have watched extensive video from the event in Oregon and am privy to accounts from participants. From the information at my disposal, it would appear that Ammon and team did NOT make clear their intentions to occupy the federal wildlife refuge building except to a select few, inviting protesters to "take a hard stand" without revealing what this would entail until they were already in the middle of it all. OPSEC? No, I think not. Obviously the goal was to lure as many protesters to Oregon as possible to the event in the hopes that they would jump on board with the stand-off plan once they were more personally involved. Numerous protesters were rightly enraged once they discovered the ultimate motives behind the event.

The plan is basically this - use the Hammond family as a vehicle (yes, this is what is being done) even though they did not want any kind of standoff to result and specifically refused aid. Occupy federally owned buildings which have little to do with anything of importance and have no symbolic power as did Bundy Ranch. Elicit federal response. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Bundy Ranch had many positive elements going for it, which is why it ended the way it did. This standoff has none of the same elements. I suppose one could ask, though, why do I care?

It's true, these people have every right to make positively naive strategic errors and I don't have to participate directly if I don't like it. The problem, however, is that Ammon and friends have decided they want to be the "tip of the spear" (his words, not mine). I do not think they understand what this means, or they don't care. What it means is, even though I think the entire Oregon plan is ill conceived; literally the WORST possible way to launch a fight against federal corruption, if the federal government moves in a heavy handed manner to kill these people, I and many others will have to fight as well by default when a FAR better tactical and social position could have been achieved. My conscience simply will not allow the rationalization of the deaths of liberty minded people even if their stupidity brought about the circumstances. And frankly, that pisses me off.

As a student of asymmetrics, I understand that choosing the time, place and circumstances is 95% of the battle ahead against an advanced opponent. More organization is needed. More preparedness. More training. More public awareness. The Oregon standoff could steal away what little time we had left.

The Oregon standoff potentially forces the hand of the Liberty Movement, not the hand of corrupt government - the exact reverse of what should be happening.

Mike Vanderboegh has outlined similar thoughts expertly in this article. Everything he has written is exactly what was going through my own mind when I heard of the happenings in Oregon. Ammon Bundy and companions are not the tip of the spear. Not even close. What I do fear is that they are cannon fodder beckoning a nationwide government crackdown to which I and others will then be forced to personally respond to with equal f*cking measure. And all of this on the worst possible terms and at a very inconvenient time (executive actions on gun control mere weeks from now).

And here's the best part; those of us who remain critical of the clinically retarded maneuver being executed here are going to be called cowards and "keyboard warriors"; it's a given. We are all ready to fight for the future of this country, we have been training diligently for it and helping many others along the way. But, because we do not support two dimensional planning there are those that will say - "Now we find out who the real patriots are!"

Against stupid plan = coward against freedom and action. Just watch.

If the Feds use brutality to handle the Oregon conflict, it will indeed "kick-off". There wont be any way to stop it. Just don't get too excited, folks. This is no Lexington or Concord. I really don't know what to call it...

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-0...might-be-stuck

[midnight rambler]

I really don't know what to call it...

For starters, how about stupid, moronic, and asinine*?

This is great news for the Southern Poverty Law Center, I'm quite sure they're elated with this development.

*asinine - marked by an inexcusable failure to exercise intelligence or sound judgment

[Ares]

For starters, how about stupid, moronic, and asinine*?

This is great news for the Southern Poverty Law Center, I'm quite sure they're elated with this development.

*asinine - marked by an inexcusable failure to exercise intelligence or sound judgment

It also strikes me as asinine. The Hammonds did not want this (not sure why since they have been totally and wholly screwed by the Federal Government.), and even told the Oath Keepers that they did not want any assistance with making a stand. The Oath Keepers are honoring that request. Bundy seems to be wanting to kick off another Civil War / Revolution. But doesn't have the situation in his favor like this author was discussing.

If the Feds perform another Ruby Ridge / Waco it could kick it off. Maybe that's what Bundy is wanting? To be martyred and remembered for starting it? I honestly don't know. It just strikes me as being poorly planned, and poorly executed.