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Cebu_4_2
15th June 2015, 05:11 PM
Iowa Supreme Court Says Porch Drinking Is Not a Crime (http://reason.com/blog/2015/06/15/iowa-supreme-court-says-porch-drinking-i) The ruling absolves a woman arrested for intoxication on the front steps of her own home. Jacob Sullum (http://reason.com/people/jacob-sullum/all)|Jun. 15, 2015 6:00 am



http://cloudfront-media.reason.com/mc/jsullum/2015_06/eastwood-drinking-gran-torino.jpg?h=206&w=275

Warner BrothersLate one night in June 2013, the police department in Waterloo, Iowa, received a 911 call from Patience Pye, who reported that she had been a victim of domestic violence. Upon arriving at Pye's house and conferring with her boyfriend, Kendrall Murray, two officers concluded that Pye had been the aggressor in the altercation. Murray reported that she had become enraged and punched him the eye when he refused to give her the car keys because she was drunk (and in any case did not have a driver's license). He claimed Pye often became belligerent when she was drinking. The cops arrested Pye—not for assault but for public intoxication, even though she ventured no further than the front steps of her own house.


There was no question that Pye was intoxicated. Two separate breath tests indicated that her blood alcohol concentration was above 0.26 percent, more than three times the level deemed too drunk to drive. But was she in public? On Friday the Iowa Supreme Court ruled that she was not. "Paye cannot be guilty of public intoxication because she was not intoxicated in a public place," writes Justice Daryl Hecht in the unanimous opinion (http://www.iowacourts.gov/About_the_Courts/Supreme_Court/Supreme_Court_Opinions/Recent_Opinions/20150612/14-0183.pdf). To conclude otherwise, he observes, would lead to "absurd results."


Hechr notes that "Iowa is one of few states to criminalize the mere fact of intoxication." The relevant statute (https://coolice.legis.iowa.gov/cool-ice/default.asp?category=billinfo&service=iowacode&ga=83&input=123.46) makes it a misdemeanor to "use or consume alcoholic liquor in any public place except premises covered by a liquor control license." Iowa defines a "public place" as "any place, building, or conveyance to which the public has or is permitted access." In 1991 the court ruled (https://casetext.com/case/state-v-lake-23) that a passenger in a car could not be charged with public intoxication, because the general public does not have access to a private vehicle, even one located on a public road. But 12 years later, the court concluded (https://www.courtlistener.com/opinion/1577661/state-v-booth/) that the front steps and common areas of an apartment house counted as public places, reasoning that tenants should not have to put up with the drunken antics of their neighbors in parts of the building open to all residents.


In Pye's case, the court decided that single-family homes are more like cars than apartment buildings. It rejected the government's argument that the implied permission for salesmen, postal carriers, petition circulators, and charity collectors to approach and knock was enough to render Pye's porch a public place (although it allowed that a general invitation, such as advertising for a yard sale or an open house, might make the ban on public intoxication applicable). "If the front stairs of a single-family residence are always a public place," Justice Hecht notes, "it would be a crime to sit there calmly on a breezy summer day and sip a mojito, celebrate a professional achievement with a mixed drink of choice, or even baste meat on the grill with a bourbon-infused barbeque sauce—unless one first obtained a liquor license. We do not think the legislature intended Iowa law to be so heavy-handed."


Hecht adds that reading the statute so broadly would penalize people for acting responsibly. "Holding the front steps of a single-family home are always a public place," he writes, "would mean any intoxicated person who responsibly secures a ride home from a sober designated driver could be arrested for and convicted of public intoxication because they traversed the stairs of their single-family house while intoxicated."


Aside from the definition of a public place, of course, you might wonder why mere intoxication should ever be illegal. As Hecht notes, "public intoxication statutes are not the only means of establishing consequences for unruly behavior by intoxicated persons," since "the legislature has enacted many other statutes that may apply to actions taken by rowdy and intoxicated individuals," such as laws against harassment and disturbing the peace. If someone is buzzed but not bothering anyone, why bother him?

Hitch
15th June 2015, 05:28 PM
If someone is buzzed but not bothering anyone, why bother him?

Once the cops know about public intoxication, all the responsibility falls upon the cops at that point (having the knowledge). They have to do something because you the public demand it, lawsuits...etc etc.. It's a lawyer's wet dream to have a cop on the stand and be able to say "But, Mr. Officer, you knew this person was intoxicated, and yet you did nothing."

Cops do one of two things. If you are drunk and nice, not causing a problem, they will give you a ride home. If you are drunk, and a dick to them, or other people, you get arrested for public intoxication. At least that is what we did years ago.

EDIT: Test, Palani can you read this?

palani
15th June 2015, 06:11 PM
Cops do one of two things. If you are drunk and nice, not causing a problem, they will give you a ride home.
Really? I know a guy who served time in a cell in Iowa with another fellow whose crime was passing a schoolbus while its' stop sign was deployed .... while holding a beer can and sucking on a brew.

And the rest of the story is he was on his own property behind a fence and mowing his grass at the time.

osoab
15th June 2015, 06:19 PM
Really? I know a guy who served time in a cell in Iowa with another fellow whose crime was passing a schoolbus while its' stop sign was deployed .... while holding a beer can and sucking on a brew.

And the rest of the story is he was on his own property behind a fence and mowing his grass at the time.

do you have a link to the case?

palani
15th June 2015, 06:40 PM
do you have a link to the case?
Nope. Entirely hearsay.

Cebu_4_2
15th June 2015, 06:41 PM
Nope. Entirely hearsay.

Thanks for the honesty.

mick silver
15th June 2015, 06:49 PM
cut hay today and had a few beers on my tractor

Hitch
15th June 2015, 06:50 PM
Really? I know a guy who served time in a cell in Iowa with another fellow whose crime was passing a schoolbus while its' stop sign was deployed .... while holding a beer can and sucking on a brew.

Good. Endangering kids while intoxicated is causing a problem, to me at least.

Hitch
15th June 2015, 06:50 PM
cut hay today and had a few beers on my tractor

Not causing a problem. Palani, do you see the difference?

palani
15th June 2015, 06:52 PM
Good. Endangering kids while intoxicated is causing a problem, to me at least.

Did you get the part where he wasn't on a public road? He was mowing grass with a lawn mower.

I suppose you applaud the ticket a couple got in Wisconsin for open container .... of Pepsi .. while driving? It is called 'drinking while driving'.

Hitch
15th June 2015, 06:59 PM
Did you get the part where he wasn't on a public road? He was mowing grass with a lawn mower.

You deceived us then. You said he "passed" a school bus while the bus had it's stop sign out. Definition of pass, in terms of VC, means on a public road. You can not pass another vehicle while mowing the grass.

You use words to trick folks. That's not cool, imo.

Hitch
15th June 2015, 07:01 PM
I suppose you applaud the ticket a couple got in Wisconsin for open container .... of Pepsi .. while driving? It is called 'drinking while driving'.

This thread is about alcohol, not pepsi, or any other type of soda. You "suppose" wrong. You make assumptions, get off topic, anything to prove your agenda.

Your mind is made up. The only thing you decide is how to convince others of your agenda.

Keep this thread alcohol related. If you do that, maybe I will listen to your point.

palani
15th June 2015, 07:02 PM
You deceived us then.

Or you have a reading disability. Did you not read the following sentence: "And the rest of the story is he was on his own property behind a fence and mowing his grass at the time."

palani
15th June 2015, 07:05 PM
This thread is about alcohol, not pepsi, or any other type of soda. You "suppose" wrong. You make assumptions, get off topic, anything to prove your agenda.

Your mind is made up. The only thing you decide is how to convince others of your agenda.

Keep this thread alcohol related. If you do that, maybe I will listen to your point.

Open container is generally considered to be a bottle of booze or can of beer. Not soft drink. Do you drive while drinking a soft drink? Do you consider that criminal?

My first instance was a guy mowing grass with a beer. My second instance was a couple charged with open container ... NOT alcohol but with an alcohol charge. DO YOU NOT SEE THE CONNECTION? And yes ... these are all hearsay but that is all you get from the evening news and my hearsay is at least as interesting as theirs..... and commercial free.

Hitch
15th June 2015, 07:06 PM
Or you have a reading disability. Did you not read the following sentence: "And the rest of the story is he was on his own property behind a fence and mowing his grass at the time."

No, I did not read that sentence because when you made that post...that sentence was NOT there.

You went back and added it.

You stoop to new lows Palani. Maybe I will add a few things to my old posts too. Nope, not lowering myself to your level.

palani
15th June 2015, 07:07 PM
No, I did not read that sentence because when you made that post...that sentence was NOT there.

You went back and added it.

BULL! I never edited that post at all.

Cebu_4_2
15th June 2015, 07:10 PM
No, I did not read that sentence because when you made that post...that sentence was NOT there.

You went back and added it.

You stoop to new lows Palani. Maybe I will add a few things to my old posts too. Nope, not lowering myself to your level.

Pete, grab a breath of air, I looked and he did not edit his post about this.

Hitch
15th June 2015, 07:15 PM
Pete, grab a breath of air, I looked and he did not edit his post about this.

Well, maybe I'm wrong and if I am I apologize.

He's done that before Cebu, multiple times, gone back and added to posts to make others look stupid. Palani is pretty good at manipulation. You don't discuss issues straight up with him, man to man. There's always a devious twist, tactic, involved.

osoab
15th June 2015, 07:17 PM
No, I did not read that sentence because when you made that post...that sentence was NOT there.

You went back and added it.

You stoop to new lows Palani. Maybe I will add a few things to my old posts too. Nope, not lowering myself to your level.

The last line was there solid.

mick silver
15th June 2015, 07:25 PM
on the Porch having a beer and my 1911 on the table next to me

palani
15th June 2015, 07:31 PM
He's done that before
You are entitled to an opinion ... even if it is false.

Cebu_4_2
15th June 2015, 07:38 PM
You are entitled to an opinion ... even if it is false.

With a gun on the table makes it more interesting...